Savage Hulk vs Nova Prime

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Nihilist
No bfr and Hulk starts at his base strength lvl.

Who wins?

abhilegend
What's hulk's base level? I forgot how much he could lift in calm state according to handbooks. Is it 70 tons?

Nihilist
Originally posted by abhilegend
What's hulk's base level? I forgot how much he could lift in calm state according to handbooks. Is it 70 tons? Varies between 70-80 range i think, not sure tbh.

abhilegend
Hulk wins btw but only a small majority.

CosmicComet
Nova wrecks his shit.

Enzeru
This is pure spite. Nova Prime destroys him.

Savage Hulk starts at 100 tons, but he won't have the time to reach the needed amount of durability to take out Nova, who could fly around and attack him from a good distance. Additionally to that I don't see Savage Hulk getting past Nova Prime's shields.

guy222
hulk

carver9
Base Savage Hulk is in the millions or tons range strength wise. He has the fts proving this. As far as this fight goes, Nova is losing this, he doesn't have a way of stopping Hulk minus bfring.

dmills
^^^ lulz.

http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc513/dmills31/Nova%20CQB%20protocols/picsay-1325809570.jpg


Rider could fix himself a dry Martini before Hulk connects with a single punch.

TheHulk
^^^^ HULK SMASH LITTLE MAN!!! 7/10

JakeTheBank
TBH, handbooks mean jack shit when it comes to power levels generally. Most of the time they contradict stuff that's happened in actual comics (which should be the primary source for things such as power levels).

That being said, Rider should win this unless Hulk amps pretty rapidly (which is possible) and manages to connect with him.

dmills
Rider can take Hulk's punches as well as anyone at the herald level can. Pissed or not. Him getting up close with savage is not some insurmountable challenge.

dmills
Since these two only have had a couple of brief scuffles in their histories, let's look at some things that may give us better insight as to how this fight could go. First let's establish that Rider can stand up to Hulk's power.

Sphinx no sells the Things punch, and then humiliates him in such a way that leaves no doubt as to who the superior of the two is physically.

You're like a hunnert Hulk's, only worse!

http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc513/dmills31/Nova%20CQB%20protocols/picsay-1325923426.jpg

It doesn't get much clearer then that. Even at his base classic levels the sphinx if far stronger then Grimm, and I would argue savage hulk as well. Unless someone is going to sell me that Savage Hulk in a calm state would stand there, catch the Thing's punch like a child and then proceed to casually crush it while monologuing. So now that we know the kind of strength he has, let's see how Rider holds up...

http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc513/dmills31/Nova%20CQB%20protocols/picsay-1325907896.jpg
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc513/dmills31/Nova%20CQB%20protocols/picsay-1325906808.jpg
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc513/dmills31/Nova%20CQB%20protocols/picsay-1325906870.jpg

Ok so not bad. He takes it on the chin, he's just fine and even manages to return the favor a little bit.

Korg is considered by many here to have Savage Hulk level strength. Not sure how accurately that is but we do know that he's pretty damn strong. He koed Wonderman for example.

http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc513/dmills31/2011-06-05130001-1.jpg

Rider no sells him. Dude has a pretty good chin I'd say. If anyone needs more, I got em.

As for this fight, Nova and Savage actually have a few common foes. Blastaar, Tyrannus, Quintronic Man, Bi-Beast etc.

Savage vs Quintronic Man round 1...

http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc513/dmills31/Nova%20CQB%20protocols/picsay-1325904676.jpg
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc513/dmills31/Nova%20CQB%20protocols/picsay-1325904730.jpg
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc513/dmills31/Nova%20CQB%20protocols/picsay-1325904781.jpg
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc513/dmills31/Nova%20CQB%20protocols/picsay-1325904876.jpg
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc513/dmills31/Nova%20CQB%20protocols/picsay-1325904937.jpg

Round 2

http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc513/dmills31/Nova%20CQB%20protocols/picsay-1325905030.jpg
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc513/dmills31/Nova%20CQB%20protocols/picsay-1325905158.jpg
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc513/dmills31/Nova%20CQB%20protocols/picsay-1325905208.jpg

Nova vs Quintronic man

http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc513/dmills31/Nova%20CQB%20protocols/picsay-1325917265.jpg
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc513/dmills31/Nova%20CQB%20protocols/picsay-1325917460.jpg
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc513/dmills31/Nova%20CQB%20protocols/picsay-1325917509.jpg
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc513/dmills31/Nova%20CQB%20protocols/picsay-1325917544.jpg

Rage.Of.Olympus
Nova isn't taking this easily by any means. And if he sleeps on Hulk, his going to be in trouble. If the comic calls for it, Hulk can start out with Thor/Superman level strength or reach it in moments.

Imo, he'd use his superior speed, and more versatile power set to dispose of the Hulk some distance away. He could try an all or nothing type tactic for a knock out. If that doesn't work, or he starts a pissing contest, he'd be in trouble. But I think Nova's too experienced at this point to try something like that, it'd mean underestimating his opponent.

janus77
Savage Hulk wins via ThunderClap and smash.

The Sorrow
There is no such thing as baseline Savage Hulk.

As for the fight Savage Hulks level is usually dependant on his opponent as he lacks the mental capacity of the current Hulk to outright dominate his opponents from the get-go unless there is motivation for him becoming enraged i.e. his friends being hurt.

By "baseline" Hulk I assume the thread starter means Hulk isn't enraged any more than he normally is, in this scenario I would favour Nova but Savage Hulk can certainly win here also.

janus77
The second Nova Prime attacks, "baseline" Savage Hulk ceases to be "baseline" any more, so that's a pretty pointless stipulation.

Savage Hulk will just do what he normally does, smash and smash again.

dmills
Ok now hold up. I just posted a good number of scans here making -in my eyes at least- a pretty decent case, and I get a guy saying Nova loses via thunderclap? Seriously? That's either straight up lowballing or a lack of basic knowledge of the character.

Raptor22
Originally posted by dmills
Ok now hold up. I just posted a good number of scans here making -in my eyes at least- a pretty decent case, and I get a guy saying Nova loses via thunderclap? Seriously? That's either straight up lowballing or a lack of basic knowledge of the character. it's kind of sad and kind of funny

iceman24567
Originally posted by janus77
The second Nova Prime attacks, "baseline" Savage Hulk ceases to be "baseline" any more, so that's a pretty pointless stipulation.

Savage Hulk will just do what he normally does, smash and smash again. lol typical

Raptor22
I think it depends on how Nova decides to fight. If he stays away and uses his ranged attacks and fights smart he should win the majority. If he gets in close his chances go way down. Personaly I think he would fight smart.

dmills
Originally posted by Raptor22
it's kind of sad and kind of funny Originally posted by iceman24567
lol typical

It's phucking absurd. Not a knock on the Hulk's thunder clap because we know how powerful that they can be, but I mean come on.

I could make the case that Nova has the power to one shot blast savage, but it would be stupid of me to make that claim because a) Rider on average doesn't unleash that type of power haphazardly and b) I respect the Hulk's history too much to go around saying shit like that.

Bouboumaster
Originally posted by Nihilist
Varies between 70-80 range i think, not sure tbh.

Hulk start at 100 tons, at the very least.

70 / 80 tons range would be when he's in calm state.

Bouboumaster
Also, for the thread, I say that Nova Prime wins, if he's not moron and don't go h2h with the Hulk.

abhilegend
Originally posted by Bouboumaster
Also, for the thread, I say that Nova Prime wins, if he's not moron and don't go h2h with the Hulk.
thumb up

leonidas
i wish this fight would happen. i think nova would have hell ko'ing hulk, specially as he has been portrayed recently. base strength=myth. hulk being below a high cl100 level would be an anomaly, his fights with ben not witchstanding. he has RARELY been ko'd at the outset of a fight, i don't see it happening here either. nova is obviously more versatile but it would take much for hulk to be able to even things up. just one solid shot. might not ko nova, but it would put them on a level playing field. and hulk isn't an idiot either in a fight. it would be a great fight imo. i think there are many ways this could turn out. not sure who'd win in the end for a majority.

armedforbattle
Nova Prime is top tier high herald,
He is in the same league as guys like silver surfer and Thor. NP is stronger than Savage hulk, equal or better durability, insane energy projection and flight.
Even in a slugfest I would give nova the majority.

dmills
Originally posted by armedforbattle
Nova Prime is top tier high herald,
He is in the same league as guys like silver surfer and Thor. NP is stronger than Savage hulk, equal or better durability, insane energy projection and flight.
Even in a slugfest I would give nova the majority.

Whoa nelly! Easy there fella. Let's not piss on Savage Hulk's feats and history here lol. Nothing indicates that Nova would straight up take Savage in h2h lol. He'd win by mixing up speed based attacks with blasts etc. But not by standing and banging.

CosmicComet
You can stand and bang with a statue.

thanos-prime
Hulk

dmills
Originally posted by CosmicComet
You can stand and bang with a statue.

I'm not as mean as you CC laughing out loud

cdtm
Compressed gravimetric pulse should knock him right out.

DarkSaint85
How did Doom take him out? I think that was a good example of a Savage Hulk, and an example of how Nova could win...

celeyhyga17
Nova Prime if he fights mostly at range. He ain't taking Hulk out with straight up fisticuffs. If Iron Man can take him out with a punch, I'm sure Richie can do the same with a well placed highly concentrated grav pulse.

carver9
Hulk wins.

Golgo13
Nova.

golem370
Banner controlled Hulk stop that mountain from caving in on the downed team thats 150 billion tons.

carver9
A calm Hulk is far above class 100 at his base.

DarkSaint85
Doom still owned him.

carver9
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Doom still owned him.

And before that, Hulk owned Doom.

golem370
Doom owned alot of people

The Sorrow
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Doom still owned him.
IIRC it was a Doombot.

iceman24567
Split imo

JakeTheBank
Originally posted by carver9
A calm Hulk is far above class 100 at his base.

A calm Hulk can lift way more than 100 tons, yes.

A calm Hulk isn't far above the overall "Class 100" designation he's been given, if at all.

carver9
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
A calm Hulk can lift way more than 100 tons, yes.

A calm Hulk isn't far above the overall "Class 100" designation he's been given, if at all.

Him lifting 150 billion tons goes against what you are saying.

-Pr-
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
A calm Hulk can lift way more than 100 tons, yes.

A calm Hulk isn't far above the overall "Class 100" designation he's been given, if at all.

carver likes to pretend that calm hulk is = to an angry thor or a cutting loose superman.

carver9
Depends on what Calm Hulk we are talking about. A calm WWH, yes, I agree 100% with you.

-Pr-
I see you've started taking the crazy pills this morning.

JakeTheBank
Originally posted by carver9
Him lifting 150 billion tons goes against what you are saying.

Which doesn't make him beyond Class 100 as Class 100 beings generally lift far in excess of 100 tons.

DarkSaint85
According to my handbook, Galactus is Class 100....

JakeTheBank
And to be perfectly fair and honest, Marvel's "power grid" and "Class 100" designations are complete shit.

dmills
Does Marvel even still utilize the "class 100" status? I mean even those not classified as class 100 have lifted far in excess of 100 tons.

DarkSaint85
I thought Class 100 just meant they could lift 100 and above. So 100 tons was their minimum. Which, as 150 billion is higher than 100 (I checked on Wiki), means that yes, the Hulk can be both Class 100 and lift 150 billion.

Even though he wasn't calm at all....

carver9
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Which doesn't make him beyond Class 100 as Class 100 beings generally lift far in excess of 100 tons.

I agree with you. I never said anything against this.

JakeTheBank
Originally posted by carver9
I agree with you. I never said anything against this.

Originally posted by carver9
A calm Hulk is far above class 100 at his base.

lol

JakeTheBank
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I thought Class 100 just meant they could lift 100 and above. So 100 tons was their minimum. Which, as 150 billion is higher than 100 (I checked on Wiki), means that yes, the Hulk can be both Class 100 and lift 150 billion.

Even though he wasn't calm at all....

Correct.

-Pr-
"Calm WWH" is a misnomer, considering that the point of the arc was to show that at his new, incredible level of anger, he was more powerful than ever.

dmills
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I thought Class 100 just meant they could lift 100 and above. So 100 tons was their minimum. Which, as 150 billion is higher than 100 (I checked on Wiki), means that yes, the Hulk can be both Class 100 and lift 150 billion.

Even though he wasn't calm at all....

Even Grimm has lifted far more than 100 tons as has Namor. Yet they're officially listed as "6" in the Marvel system which is I guess cut off at 100 tons. Yet Nova is listed as a "7" even though he's never been depicted lifting objects like Namor has.

So I guess "7" just means "however strong the story calls for".

carver9
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
lol

I didn't mean it like that. My initial comment was towards the person that said Hulk was a class 70.

JakeTheBank
Their ranking system doesn't even begin to make sense.

DarkSaint85
It means Rider is in a class of his own in_love

dmills
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
It means Rider is in a class of his own in_love

Or Sam Alexander. Loeb will have him hurling mountains into deep base eek!

quanchi112
Hulk wins.

janus77
Hulk wins.

Also, apparently Banner's convinced Hulk is indestructible. So that's a bit of a tilt-er.

The Sorrow
Nova would struggle to beat current Hulk. He's a feat machine these days, and can apparently run/dash faster than Iron Man can fly now.

janus77
True, they're doing the Rulk think of blurred motion with him now.

Think it's about time. It was stupid to make him the strongest one in Marvel but put a cap on his speed - insane perversion of logic.

With his muscles, the force he outputs, he'd easily propel himself at FTL speeds.

Anyway, yes feat machine Hulk is indestructible but even Savage Hulk of yesteryear was insanely durable and fast enough to react to QS and Jack of Hearts... I can't see Nova Prime winning against either. Both versions are just hilariously, ridiculously strong.

dmills
Waid is going to do good things with that book. I wonder if he'll attempt one of his "deconstructions" of the Hulk's abilities. Should be interesting.


And no, neither of them would beat Nova Prime.

janus77
I'm not convinced, I don't like the dumping of Banner's development over the last ... 6-7 years.

He'd really become a fantastic character in his own right, mostly due to Pak but even prior to him with M-Day there was great amounts of development happening.

This Banner with a superiority complex and a latent desire to humiliate everyone he considers his competition, is just Doom-lite.

Banner long ago learned to live with Hulk, then he learned to appreciate Hulk and, over Aaron's run, he accepted that he wasn't himself without Hulk. That he couldn't survive on his own (psychologically speaking)... So this new "reset" is very disappointing.

On the plus side, I'm sure it will still reach back to where Pak's Banner had been, without the tired old Banner vs Hulk bs.

janus77
Originally posted by dmills
Waid is going to do good things with that book. I wonder if he'll attempt one of his "deconstructions" of the Hulk's abilities. Should be interesting.


And no, neither of them would beat Nova Prime.
They're both exponentially more powerful and fast enough to cope with Nova's speed and are far too durable for Nova to offensively harm them.

Hulk (either iteration of Savage Hulk) wins.

dmills
Originally posted by janus77
I'm not convinced, I don't like the dumping of Banner's development over the last ... 6-7 years.

He'd really become a fantastic character in his own right, mostly due to Pak but even prior to him with M-Day there was great amounts of development happening.

This Banner with a superiority complex and a latent desire to humiliate everyone he considers his competition, is just Doom-lite.

Banner long ago learned to live with Hulk, then he learned to appreciate Hulk and, over Aaron's run, he accepted that he wasn't himself without Hulk. That he couldn't survive on his own (psychologically speaking)... So this new "reset" is very disappointing.

On the plus side, I'm sure it will still reach back to where Pak's Banner had been, without the tired old Banner vs Hulk bs.

Really? That's weird that that's what you got from it. I kinda saw Pak's run as Banner embracing the monster so to speak. I thought Aaron's run actually reintroduced the Banner vs Hulk concept to a silly degree. For all of the shyt Pak got for the feat fest the book became during his last few arcs, the man did more to develope the character and his world then anyone sense Peter David IMO.

Regardless though I can understand a fan not liking a jolting change of pace. But you should be grateful. At least Banner is still Banner...

Give Waid a shot bro. He'll work in some quirky little angles and nuances that you'll grow to appreciate. The only thing I'd be worried about is if his head is in it all of the way. The digital format seems to be his baby right now so I'm not sure if Hulk is going to get his foremost effort or not. He admitted in an interview not too long ago that he was essentially taking on as many writing projects as possible so he could fund his digital endeavors.

janus77
Originally posted by dmills
Really? That's weird that that's what you got from it. I kinda saw Pak's run as Banner embracing the monster so to speak. I thought Aaron's run actually reintroduced the Banner vs Hulk concept to a silly degree. For all of the shyt Pak got for the feat fest the book became during his last few arcs, the man did more to develope the character and his world then anyone sense Peter David IMO.

Regardless though I can understand a fan not liking a jolting change of pace. But you should be grateful. At least Banner is still Banner...

Give Waid a shot bro. He'll work in some quirky little angles and nuances that you'll grow to appreciate. The only thing I'd be worried about is if his head is in it all of the way. The digital format seems to be his baby right now so I'm not sure if Hulk is going to get his foremost effort or not. He admitted in an interview not too long ago that he was essentially taking on as many writing projects as possible so he could fund his digital endeavors.
Don't get me wrong, I'm still reading them. They're good stories and Banner's doing some bits and pieces I find entertaining... Just 2 stories in, so my 'judgement' is maybe just initial disappointment speaking...

This has great potential. Even if it's a little jarring accepting that, after all those years of having easy working relationships with Reed and the other brains, he now feels a desperate need to make his mark and on top of that, he needs to assert his intellectual superiority over Stark.

You're right about Aaron's initial Banner vs Hulk (well, actually, Hulk + Doom vs Banner) thing, I actually forgot that shit... I guess I concentrated on the strong finish, with Banner being an utter nutter without the resolve and confidence and power that Hulk imbues him with.

It was a divergent track from Pak's stories, but it built up further on the Banner and Hulk need each other thing from the angle of Banner.

Rage.Of.Olympus
If Nova wins, it won't be through straight up power but with some clever use of his abilities. Hulk would probably be portrayed as an overwhelming force that he has to overcome. I guess he could get lucky with an all or nothing attack against the Hulk but nowadays, that's not the smartest option unless it's a guaranteed win.

dmills
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
If Nova wins, it won't be through straight up power but with some clever use of his abilities. Hulk would probably be portrayed as an overwhelming force that he has to overcome. I guess he could get lucky with an all or nothing attack against the Hulk but nowadays, that's not the smartest option unless it's a guaranteed win.

All respect due to Savage, but if I were reading the last few years of Nova, all of the proxy events, with all of the stuff he's faced, to only turn around and have the writers then have the phucking savage Hulk be an insurmountable challenge I'd drop the book immediately lol. That's how down they'd have to write the character for Savage to get a believable win. He'd have to essentially fight like a complete tool.

Rider can deal with the Hulk's strength advantage, Hulk can't say the same about dealing with Nova's speed, durability and energy output advantages.

dmills
Originally posted by janus77
Don't get me wrong, I'm still reading them. They're good stories and Banner's doing some bits and pieces I find entertaining... Just 2 stories in, so my 'judgement' is maybe just initial disappointment speaking...

This has great potential. Even if it's a little jarring accepting that, after all those years of having easy working relationships with Reed and the other brains, he now feels a desperate need to make his mark and on top of that, he needs to assert his intellectual superiority over Stark.

You're right about Aaron's initial Banner vs Hulk (well, actually, Hulk + Doom vs Banner) thing, I actually forgot that shit... I guess I concentrated on the strong finish, with Banner being an utter nutter without the resolve and confidence and power that Hulk imbues him with.

It was a divergent track from Pak's stories, but it built up further on the Banner and Hulk need each other thing from the angle of Banner.

I'll keep an eye on it. I haven't actually bought any Marvel comics in a good 2 years I think. But when the Gotg reboot drops I'll probably start looking at some other Marvel stuff in addition to that.

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