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Clark is going all out/bloodlusted etc
Pre reboot Superman

No bfr

Who wins

Spite.

Why is it spite

Originally posted by Mistress-Death
Why is it spite

It would only be spite if you realized how overwhelmed Superman would be in this fight. Most of Mangog's silver age appearances had him toting the strength of a billion billion beings, now besides the implications of how strong that would make him, he could add to his strength if his opponents actually hated him. Superman would be murdered. However there was one version of Mangog that Superman would have a decent chance against. Mangog of The Mighty Thor v1 #250.

Prior to this issue, Odin reduced Mangog's strength with a spell causing the creature to to lose power to the point that he shrank and eventually disappeared altogether. He then has a spell cast on him by (forgot the jerks name) anywho, a spell was cast on him that tapped into the life forces of all Asgardians, and powered Mangog up once again, except for this time he was vastly less powerful than his previous form. This Mangog, I believe could lose to Superman.

Just in case you wanted to know.

All that is well and good but its not as if Superman hasn't faced foes on that lvl before and held hid own when not going all out .

After all these years away KMC still hasn't changed

Originally posted by Mistress-Death
All that is well and good but its not as if Superman hasn't faced foes on that lvl before and held hid own when not going all out .

After all these years away KMC still hasn't changed

Mangog is two solid tiers above Superman when you consider the guys that give Superman a hard time on average.

lol

Originally posted by Mistress-Death
All that is well and good but its not as if Superman hasn't faced foes on that lvl before and held hid own when not going all out .

After all these years away KMC still hasn't changed


Ahh... a returner of sorts, and after all this years your as stupid as ever. tsk tsk tsk, time has not been kind to you my friend.

May I suggest that you leave for another 2 years, maybe 5 to make sure that you have at least gained the knowledge and understanding capacity of a 6 year old.

Originally posted by Stoic
Mangog is two solid tiers above Superman when you consider the guys that give Superman a hard time on average. but this isn't average Superman though its all out Superman it also helps if you read the OP

Originally posted by Mistress-Death
All that is well and good but its not as if Superman hasn't faced foes on that lvl before and held hid own when not going all out .

After all these years away KMC still hasn't changed So in all these years absent from the board you still refuse to pick up a comic. For shame.

Originally posted by gogogadgetgo
Ahh... a returner of sorts, and after all this years your as stupid as ever. tsk tsk tsk, time has not been kind to you my friend.

May I suggest that you leave for another 2 years, maybe 5 to make sure that you have at least gained the knowledge and understanding capacity of a 6 year old. who are you again? Also reported

Originally posted by Mistress-Death
but this isn't average Superman though its all out Superman it also helps if you read the OP Why does Superman win ? Please elaborate.

Originally posted by quanchi112
So in all these years absent from the board you still refuse to pick up a comic. For shame. Ah you must be the troll that Nvr destroyed in a battlezone and you call yourself a Thanos fan bwhahaha

Originally posted by Mistress-Death
Ah you must be the troll that Nvr destroyed in a battlezone and you call yourself a Thanos fan bwhahaha Hahahaha, I was 3 months into comics after a 12 year plus hiatus. One judge admitted Darkseid would win no matter what argument was brought forth anyway. I won that battlezone but besides all my notoriety who are you ?

Do you even have a recognizable name ? Or are you just a formerly banned poster who still has salt in his wounds.

Originally posted by gogogadgetgo
Ahh... a returner of sorts, and after all this years your as stupid as ever. tsk tsk tsk, time has not been kind to you my friend.

May I suggest that you leave for another 2 years, maybe 5 to make sure that you have at least gained the knowledge and understanding capacity of a 6 year old.

Superman can't lose to bricks (except all the times he has). Superman wins.

In a closed area. Superman loses and I am afraid , he will die.

Silver Age Mangog turns Superman into a goat.

Few people know that besides being ridiculously powerful physically, he also has a whole other array of abilities. Same goes for the Destroyer.

Anyways, Superman's more likely to hurt his hands than Mangog. He gets torn apart.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Few people know that besides being ridiculously powerful physically, he also has a whole other array of abilities.

Superman's more likely to hurt his hands than Mangog. He gets torn apart. Like trapping Loki in amber.

Everyone is a brick to Superman though. Look how fast he is. Zoom zoom

Originally posted by abhilegend
Spite.

If abhilegend can admit this about Kal then case closed.

Unless Mangog swallows Supes whole.
Then Supes kills him from inside.

Hey, he almost ate Thor.

Superman could win via bfring.

Originally posted by Mistress-Death
but this isn't average Superman though its all out Superman it also helps if you read the OP

Oh yeah I read the OP. Do you remember Superman going all out on Doomsday? Well Mangog is much more powerful than Doomsday. Just because someone doesn't agree with your stance does not mean that they are unaware of certain stipulations. I suggest that you weigh both sides before throwing sh1t at people.

Originally posted by Stoic
Oh yeah I read the OP. Do you remember Superman going all out on Doomsday? Well Mangog is much more powerful than Doomsday. Just because someone doesn't agree with your stance does not mean that they are unaware of certain stipulations. I suggest that you weigh both sides before throwing sh1t at people. you do know Superman had several upgades since DOS so your point is worthless

Originally posted by Mistress-Death
you do know Superman had several upgades since DOS so your point is worthless


Actually what I know is that Superman has been rebooted, and for all anyone knows, when he meets Doomsday again, he may be visiting the morgue once again, just like this thread should be.

Originally posted by Stoic
Actually what I know is that Superman has been rebooted, and for all anyone knows, when he meets Doomsday again, he may be visiting the morgue once again, just like this thread should be. what is your point using post reboot Clark as we are using pre reboot, don't act all hurt because you don't understand the difference

Not sure how he beats Silver Age Mangog when the only times he was beaten was through Odin either reviving the race he was made up of or giving up his life force to undo his spell.

I never said anything about a all out Superman beating SA Mangog, just find I laughable that Clark not holding back can't even hold his own for a extended period of time

Originally posted by Mistress-Death
I never said anything about a all out Superman beating SA Mangog, just find I laughable that Clark not holding back can't even hold his own for a extended period of time

If Superman fight Mangog straight upn..face to face for any length of time, he will go down FAST...extremely fast. If he starts this fight out trying to bfr his opponent at the beginning of the fight, he has a chance. Outside of bfring, this is a slaughter. The first punch Mangog connect upon Superman body turns the tide right then.

Superman all out using many multiples of planetary power and speed could win at least few.

Originally posted by Mistress-Death
I never said anything about a all out Superman beating SA Mangog, just find I laughable that Clark not holding back can't even hold his own for a extended period of time


Perhaps you are suggesting that when Superman is bloodlusted that no one can defeat him?

Yeah and I'm really not hurt about anything, I'm just wondering where the animosity is coming from. My first post on the subject was meant to help educate you, and then you went on the attack. No one but you believes that Superman can win. This isn't some PIS filled comic where Superman is completely dominated one moment, and turns around in the next meeting and wins. Superman loses here.

Originally posted by Sundipped
If abhilegend can admit this about Kal then case closed.
What are you trying to suggest here?

Originally posted by abhilegend
What are you trying to suggest here? That if a Strange fanboy says that a Superman fanboy says that Superman loses in a Superman thread, then Superman loses.

Also Mangog

Something like that

Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
That if a Strange fanboy says that a Superman fanboy says that Superman loses in a Superman thread, then Superman loses.

Also Mangog

Something like that
Says surfer and thanos fanboy. I'm not a fanboy though.

Yea, Bran is the biggest SS and Thanos fanboy I know...wait, what?

Originally posted by abhilegend
Says surfer and thanos fanboy. I'm not a fanboy though. I barely argue for either...

Now if you called me a Fist, Batman, or Adam fanboy realist, you'd have a point

Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
I barely argue for either...

Now if you called me a Fist, Batman, or Adam fanboy realist, you'd have a point
Wait, aren't you fearsome, deadly, sock-killer VERYBIGBRAN? My bad then. You're as much of a realist as mindset hates kyle and doom or quan hates thanos.ermm

Originally posted by abhilegend
Wait, aren't you fearsome, deadly, sock-killer VERYBIGBRAN? My bad then. I'm sensing some homoerotic undertones here

Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
I'm sensing some homoerotic undertones here
Really, I'm on my hospital bed you sicko.innocent

Originally posted by abhilegend
Really, I'm on my hospital bed you sicko.innocent Probably shouldn't be trying to fuse sticks with your legs then, you silly billy

Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
Probably shouldn't be trying to fuse sticks with your legs then, you silly billy
You hurt me O angel goddess.cryoh

Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
That if a Strange fanboy says that a Superman fanboy says that Superman loses in a Superman thread, then Superman loses.

Also Mangog

Something like that

Except for the fanboy part. I hate that label.

Originally posted by Sundipped
Except for the fanboy part. I hate that label.
So you still think that I'm a fanboy over that Lobo debate, huh?

Originally posted by abhilegend
So you still think that I'm a fanboy over that Lobo debate, huh?

That and the 100's of other threads with yo boy in em.

Originally posted by Sundipped
That and the 100's of other threads with yo boy in em.
Really, point one where I gave superman unfair advantage without scans or issue number to back up my case.

Originally posted by Mistress-Death
I never said anything about a all out Superman beating SA Mangog, just find I laughable that Clark not holding back can't even hold his own for a extended period of time Thor going all-out couldn't hold his own for an extended period of time. He kinda got roflstomped repeatedly by Silver Age Mangog. /shrug

Originally posted by abhilegend
Really, point one where I gave superman unfair advantage without scans or issue number to back up my case.

I didn't say you didn't support him. It's really the opposite.

snap

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Thor going all-out couldn't hold his own for an extended period of time. He kinda got roflstomped repeatedly by Silver Age Mangog. /shrug Thor didn't go all out or even close to it, Superman is stronger and faster than Thor by a good margin.

In not saying speedblitz Mangog constantly but he does use his speed which allows him to stay in the fight longer than what Thor did due to him being stronger than Thor

Originally posted by Mistress-Death
Thor didn't go all out or even close to it, Superman is stronger and faster than Thor by a good margin.

In not saying speedblitz Mangog constantly but he does use his speed which allows him to stay in the fight longer than what Thor did due to him being stronger than Thor Thor getting roflstomped doesn't mean he's not going all-out. Even granting your premise that Superman is stronger than Thor, Thor is arguably more powerful than Superman as a whole. And he got roflstomped repeatedly as far as I remember.

Superman dancing around and/or running away fromSilver Age Mangog seems unlikely. Dude mostly engages in straight-up fighting even if he's outclassed like most heroes of his class.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Thor getting roflstomped doesn't mean he's not going all-out. Even granting your premise that Superman is stronger than Thor, Thor is arguably more powerful than Superman as a whole. And he got roflstomped repeatedly as far as I remember.

Superman dancing around and/or running away fromSilver Age Mangog seems unlikely. Dude mostly engages in straight-up fighting even if he's outclassed like most heroes of his class.

http://fc09.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2010/216/9/1/Superman_vs_Mangog_by_adey01.jpg

Originally posted by Horrificus
http://fc09.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2010/216/9/1/Superman_vs_Mangog_by_adey01.jpg Seems about right.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Thor getting roflstomped doesn't mean he's not going all-out. Even granting your premise that Superman is stronger than Thor, Thor is arguably more powerful than Superman as a whole. And he got roflstomped repeatedly as far as I remember.

Superman dancing around and/or running away fromSilver Age Mangog seems unlikely. Dude mostly engages in straight-up fighting even if he's outclassed like most heroes of his class.


Thor is not more powerful than Superman at all as a whole. More versatile doesn't mean more powerful. That's irrelevant though since ABC logic doesn't work most of the time. It's more like rock, paper, scissors at times. Bottom line:

Superman is faster, can hit harder than Thor's normal swings when using full strength, can withstand more punishment to physical blows, etc.

Superman's speed will allow him to hit Mangog far more times and get hit less times than what Thor can achieve. Character's fight at their best as shown before. Superman may take a hit or two but will eventually and consistently become evasive (as shown before) and attack from all angles.

Thus Superman lasts either much longer than Thor or he wins some. My take on the fight is that a Superman fighting at his absolute best will beat Mangog.

Originally posted by h1a8
Thor is not more powerful than Superman at all as a whole. More versatile doesn't mean more powerful. That's irrelevant though since ABC logic doesn't work most of the time. It's more like rock, paper, scissors at times. Bottom line:

Superman is faster, can hit harder than Thor's normal swings when using full strength, can withstand more punishment to physical blows, etc.

Superman's speed will allow him to hit Mangog far more times and get hit less times than what Thor can achieve. Character's fight at their best as shown before. Superman may take a hit or two but will eventually and consistently become evasive (as shown before) and attack from all angles.

Thus Superman lasts either much longer than Thor or he wins some. My take on the fight is that a Superman fighting at his absolute best will beat Mangog. Aside from various forms of BFR, Mangog has never been beaten, unconscious, etc. The only time he has ever even been shown to be wounded, was from a God-blast down his throat.

Even then he was only brought to his knees.

One injury, out of all appearances.

Originally posted by h1a8
Thor is not more powerful than Superman at all as a whole. More versatile doesn't mean more powerful. That's irrelevant though since ABC logic doesn't work most of the time. It's more like rock, paper, scissors at times. Bottom line:

Superman is faster, can hit harder than Thor's normal swings when using full strength, can withstand more punishment to physical blows, etc.

Superman's speed will allow him to hit Mangog far more times and get hit less times than what Thor can achieve. Character's fight at their best as shown before. Superman may take a hit or two but will eventually and consistently become evasive (as shown before) and attack from all angles.

Thus Superman lasts either much longer than Thor or he wins some. My take on the fight is that a Superman fighting at his absolute best will beat Mangog.

Dude stfu really, you put your foot in your mouth, I think you say stupid sh** on purpose.

Thor is more powerful than Superman dont be a stupid Jack a$$, Thor powers are greater than Superman its a fact, Superman speed wont mean sh** against a SA Mangog at his peak was Sky Father level in brute power it took Odins death, if PC Superboy, PCUltra Boy, Mone El couldn't phase PC Validus what makes you think Superman can beat his counter part in SA Mangog who feeds on hatred and physical contact, SA Mangog reflexes was good enough to deflect Thor hammer which travels at light speed, your ignorance is becoming a pain the a$$, read comics instead respect threads, you might learned something!!

Mangog wins this.

He's in another weight class compared to guys like Thor and Superman.

Originally posted by h1a8
Thor is not more powerful than Superman at all as a whole. More versatile doesn't mean more powerful. That's irrelevant though since ABC logic doesn't work most of the time. It's more like rock, paper, scissors at times. Bottom line:

Superman is faster, can hit harder than Thor's normal swings when using full strength, can withstand more punishment to physical blows, etc.

Superman's speed will allow him to hit Mangog far more times and get hit less times than what Thor can achieve. Character's fight at their best as shown before. Superman may take a hit or two but will eventually and consistently become evasive (as shown before) and attack from all angles.

Thus Superman lasts either much longer than Thor or he wins some. My take on the fight is that a Superman fighting at his absolute best will beat Mangog.
And, don't feel bad about Mangog being able to beat Supes. Guys like Superman and Thor NEED guys like Mangog, who are far above them. Otherwise, things would get pretty boring, pretty quickly.

I think this is something a lot of writers forget these days. By making the most popular characters too powerful, they take away from the story.

Many of the most popular characters are just bullies anymore, strolling through other characters and dangers without a care.

Boooriiing.

Cough-Hulk-Cough-Logan-Cough-Superman-Cough-Thanos-Cough.

Originally posted by the Darkone
Dude stfu really, you put your foot in your mouth, I think you say stupid sh** on purpose.

Thor is more powerful than Superman dont be a stupid Jack a$$, Thor powers are greater than Superman its a fact, Superman speed wont mean sh** against a SA Mangog at his peak was Sky Father level in brute power it took Odins death, if PC Superboy, PCUltra Boy, Mone El couldn't phase PC Validus what makes you think Superman can beat his counter part in SA Mangog who feeds on hatred and physical contact, SA Mangog reflexes was good enough to deflect Thor hammer which travels at light speed, your ignorance is becoming a pain the a$$, read comics instead respect threads, you might learned something!!

Thor is not more powerful. More powers doesn't mean more powerful, especially if you have no time to use them. If Superman really wanted to he could beat the sh!t out of Thor within seconds. It's Superman's character that kinda evens it up with Thor.

If Superman wanted then he couldn't get touched by Mangog. He would hit Mangog far more times than Thor could do. And if he unleashed his top strength as shown before he could beat down Mangog a few times.

Originally posted by Horrificus
Aside from various forms of BFR, Mangog has never been beaten, unconscious, etc. The only time he has ever even been shown to be wounded, was from a God-blast down his throat.

Even then he was only brought to his knees.

One injury, out of all appearances.

I understand that. But that doesn't make someone indestructible. Can Galactus or LT physically harm Mangog? Why? But a billion billion beings is not an infinite amount of beings. And Superman is stronger than a billion billion class 100 beings.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Thor getting roflstomped doesn't mean he's not going all-out. Even granting your premise that Superman is stronger than Thor, Thor is arguably more powerful than Superman as a whole. And he got roflstomped repeatedly as far as I remember.

Superman dancing around and/or running away fromSilver Age Mangog seems unlikely. Dude mostly engages in straight-up fighting even if he's outclassed like most heroes of his class.

Originally posted by h1a8
Thor is not more powerful. More powers doesn't mean more powerful, especially if you have no time to use them. If Superman really wanted to he could beat the sh!t out of Thor within seconds. It's Superman's character that kinda evens it up with Thor.

If Superman wanted then he couldn't get touched by Mangog. He would hit Mangog far more times than Thor could do. And if he unleashed his top strength as shown before he could beat down Mangog a few times.



I understand that. But that doesn't make someone indestructible. Can Galactus or LT physically harm Mangog? Why? But a billion billion beings is not an infinite amount of beings. And Superman is stronger than a billion billion class 100 beings.
I'm sure Galactus or LT could wipe Mangog out. We aren't talking about them.

Mangog is made up of a billion billion beings. But, that isn't his power.
His base power comes from the hate of a billion billion beings.
Then, he gros stronger from absorbing hate, violence and other negative emotions from different sources.

Mangog took repeated strikes from Thor's hammer, in the same exact spot, over and over, while holding Thor in one hand.
It did nothing. He just held him and kept talking.
I don't ever even remember SEEING anything like that, with Thor in Marvel comics.

And, regardless of what you think the outcome between Thor and Supes would be, the fact is that they are treated almost exactly the same by their comic companies. Both characters are written to be able to do ANYTHING they need to do at the time, somehow. Period.
Speed feats, strength feats. Energy, time, blah, blah, blah.

It's a stupid argument.

Originally posted by h1a8
If Superman wanted then he couldn't get touched by Mangog. He would hit Mangog far more times than Thor could do. And if he unleashed his top strength as shown before he could beat down Mangog a few times.

Could you post proof of Silver Age Mangog being knocked out by physical means?I could post a scan of Superman getting his ass handed by Solomon Grundy.That is proof enough speed isn't always instant win.

Originally posted by h1a8
I understand that. But that doesn't make someone indestructible. Can Galactus or LT physically harm Mangog? Why? But a billion billion beings is not an infinite amount of beings. And Superman is stronger than a billion billion class 100 beings.

And this post suggest Superman is in Living Tribunal's or Galactus's level according to h1a8.That's why he believes Superman will beat Silver Age Mangog.Again, like my post above, post a scan as proof that Silver Age Mangog can be knocked out through physical means.

Originally posted by Igniz
Could you post proof of Silver Age Mangog being knocked out by physical means?I could post a scan of Superman getting his ass handed by Solomon Grundy.That is proof enough speed isn't always instant win.



And this post suggest Superman is in Living Tribunal's or Galactus's level according to h1a8.That's why he believes Superman will beat Silver Age Mangog.Again, like my post above, post a scan as proof that Silver Age Mangog can be knocked out through physical means.

Speed is always an instant win if it is sufficient enough. Superman doesn't always uses his speed in comics or just because he gets knocked doesn't mean speed wasn't the answer.

If a nuclear bomb can kill a human then why does someone have to prove that a bullet has to be on that level to kill a human?

My point was that Mangog wasn't indestructible. The writer's intention was that Mangog had the power of a billion billion beings. That means if someone fought Mangog with more power than a billion billion beings then he/she could win.

Superman has more power than that and thus at his best he could harm Mangog.

Originally posted by Horrificus
I'm sure Galactus or LT could wipe Mangog out. We aren't talking about them.

Mangog is made up of a billion billion beings. But, that isn't his power.
His base power comes from the hate of a billion billion beings.
Then, he gros stronger from absorbing hate, violence and other negative emotions from different sources.

Mangog took repeated strikes from Thor's hammer, in the same exact spot, over and over, while holding Thor in one hand.
It did nothing. He just held him and kept talking.
I don't ever even remember SEEING anything like that, with Thor in Marvel comics.

And, regardless of what you think the outcome between Thor and Supes would be, the fact is that they are treated almost exactly the same by their comic companies. Both characters are written to be able to do ANYTHING they need to do at the time, somehow. Period.
Speed feats, strength feats. Energy, time, blah, blah, blah.

It's a stupid argument.

No it was the writer's intention that a billion billion beings is beyond Thor. We must go by writer's intentions. I know he gets stronger from negative emotions. But clearly, the billion billion beings thing was literally meant as a gauge of his power.

Thor was written very inconsistently in his classic days. He got feats from Midgard Serpent to being challenged by Mongoose.

The fact that you agree that Mangog can be physically harmed by Galactus or LT shows that you know that he's not indestructible. With enough force, you can harm him. Well I think over 50 Earth weights of force is sufficient.

Originally posted by h1a8


No it was the writer's intention that a billion billion beings is beyond Thor. We must go by writer's intentions. You told me just the other day the writer doesn't matter. Now all of a sudden he does. You are so hypocritical you can't keep yourself consistent within the same week.

Originally posted by h1a8
Speed is always an instant win if it is sufficient enough. Superman doesn't always uses his speed in comics or just because he gets knocked doesn't mean speed wasn't the answer.

If a nuclear bomb can kill a human then why does someone have to prove that a bullet has to be on that level to kill a human?

My point was that Mangog wasn't indestructible. The writer's intention was that Mangog had the power of a billion billion beings. That means if someone fought Mangog with more power than a billion billion beings then he/she could win.

Superman has more power than that and thus at his best he could harm Mangog.

And my answer to this post is

Originally posted by Igniz
Could you post proof of Silver Age Mangog being knocked out by physical means?I could post a scan of Superman getting his ass handed by Solomon Grundy.That is proof enough speed isn't always instant win.


Or just admit you don't have any proof or scans of SA Mangog being knocked out by physical means.Otherwise you're getting no where making your claims and opinions without proof from the comics.Hence your opinion/claim isn't facts without the backing of evidence.

Hence your opinion/claim is = to "H-E-A-R-S-A-Y" without the backing of evidence from the comics.

Originally posted by h1a8
Speed is always an instant win if it is sufficient enough. Superman doesn't always uses his speed in comics or just because he gets knocked doesn't mean speed wasn't the answer.

If a nuclear bomb can kill a human then why does someone have to prove that a bullet has to be on that level to kill a human?

My point was that Mangog wasn't indestructible. The writer's intention was that Mangog had the power of a billion billion beings. That means if someone fought Mangog with more power than a billion billion beings then he/she could win.

Superman has more power than that and thus at his best he could harm Mangog.



No it was the writer's intention that a billion billion beings is beyond Thor. We must go by writer's intentions. I know he gets stronger from negative emotions. But clearly, the billion billion beings thing was literally meant as a gauge of his power.

Thor was written very inconsistently in his classic days. He got feats from Midgard Serpent to being challenged by Mongoose.

The fact that you agree that Mangog can be physically harmed by Galactus or LT shows that you know that he's not indestructible. With enough force, you can harm him. Well I think over 50 Earth weights of force is sufficient. LT controls "reality" itself. And, Galactus is a cornerstone of the 616 universe. Them being able to harm Mangog does nothing for your argument.

And, you are wrong about the "writer's intentions". It was the writer that stated where his power comes from.

Odin combined the billion billion beings as a prison for that race. But, the initial fuel and drive and abilities came from the hate and pain of that race.

Odin combined them as a method of imprisonment. Then, he shut them away. It was the only way to get the entire, galaxies-spanning race in one place.

It was a physical prison. Obviously, he didn't intend on them turning the hate and pain into almost-infinite destructive power, along with matter manipulation, energy manipulation and other powers I am probably forgetting.

As Odin (the writer) said, Mangog is unbeatable.

Originally posted by Horrificus
LT controls "reality" itself. And, Galactus is a cornerstone of the 616 universe. Them being able to harm Mangog does nothing for your argument.

And, you are wrong about the "writer's intentions". It was the writer that stated where his power comes from.

Odin combined the billion billion beings as a prison for that race. But, the initial fuel and drive and abilities came from the hate and pain of that race.

Odin combined them as a method of imprisonment. Then, he shut them away. It was the only way to get the entire, galaxies-spanning race in one place.

It was a physical prison. Obviously, he didn't intend on them turning the hate and pain into almost-infinite destructive power, along with matter manipulation, energy manipulation and other powers I am probably forgetting.

As Odin (the writer) said, Mangog is unbeatable.

you either didn't read the comics or you didn't understand. Mangog boasted several times that he has the power of a billion billion beings when facing Thor's attacks as to the reason Thor can't win. This is clear by the writer's intention that his power is proportional to a billion billion beings.

As for LT and Big G I said physically harm Mangog. Reality warping is not allowed. This along with the billion billion beings concept proves that Mangog can be physically harmed, especially on the inside of him.

h1, what are you even trying to get at?

That Superman can physically merc, SA Mangog, and triumph where Odin couldn't? Because SA Mangog obviously isn't completely immune to harm so if the Living Tribunal and Galactus can physically damage him with physical strength alone, Superman would be able to?

You do realize that Mangog wasn't just a brute who relied primarily on physical prowess, right?

Originally posted by h1a8
you either didn't read the comics or you didn't understand. Mangog boasted several times that he has the power of a billion billion beings when facing Thor's attacks as to the reason Thor can't win. This is clear by the writer's intention that his power is proportional to a billion billion beings.

As for LT and Big G I said physically harm Mangog. Reality warping is not allowed. This along with the billion billion beings concept proves that Mangog can be physically harmed, especially on the inside of him.

FYI..."beings" doesn't always have to mean "humans".

Originally posted by h1a8
you either didn't read the comics or you didn't understand. Mangog boasted several times that he has the power of a billion billion beings when facing Thor's attacks as to the reason Thor can't win. This is clear by the writer's intention that his power is proportional to a billion billion beings.

As for LT and Big G I said physically harm Mangog. Reality warping is not allowed. This along with the billion billion beings concept proves that Mangog can be physically harmed, especially on the inside of him. I'm sorry.

That's pretty silly.

And, as far as "reading the books" is concerned, you might want to try searching for some of the MANY posts I have thrown up here, complete with more scans than is actually even reasonable.

YOU can probably learn something from reading these posts, because I have practically listed the books, collectively, on here.

Now:
Are you honestly basing your entire argument on the fact that there were instances of Mangog stating he has the power of a "billion billion beings", and left out the rest?

What about ALL of the other times where Mangog, the narrator and other characters have all stated the other sources of Mangog's power?

They just don't count? YOU have decided that they don't count?

That's insane!

Originally posted by Horrificus
I'm sorry.

That's pretty silly.

And, as far as "reading the books" is concerned, you might want to try searching for some of the MANY posts I have thrown up here, complete with more scans than is actually even reasonable.

YOU can probably learn something from reading these posts, because I have practically listed the books, collectively, on here.

Now:
Are you honestly basing your entire argument on the fact that there were instances of Mangog stating he has the power of a "billion billion beings", and left out the rest?

What about ALL of the other times where Mangog, the narrator and other characters have all stated the other sources of Mangog's power?

They just don't count? YOU have decided that they don't count?

That's insane!

It all goes together. The hate emotion of one being equated to the strength of one being. Thus the hate emotion of a billion billion beings equates to the strength of a billion billion beings.

Originally posted by carver9
FYI..."beings" doesn't always have to mean "humans".

According to writer's intent it does.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
h1, what are you even trying to get at?

That Superman can physically merc, SA Mangog, and triumph where Odin couldn't? Because SA Mangog obviously isn't completely immune to harm so if the Living Tribunal and Galactus can physically damage him with physical strength alone, Superman would be able to?

You do realize that Mangog wasn't just a brute who relied primarily on physical prowess, right?

My argument is much more than that. The fact that Mangog boasts that he has the power of a billion billion beings implies the writer's intent. Meaning, that if a being with greater power than a billion billion beings attacked Mangog then he will be harmed.

How do you know the writer meant a billion billion humans? What proof is there of this?

Originally posted by JayDaDon
How do you know the writer meant a billion billion humans? What proof is there of this? It's called common sense. No proof required. The obvious>>>>>made up stuff that isn't shown or hinted to (forgot the word for this lol).


If each being supplied the power of a 100 tons then Superman is still stronger.

There's alot of beings in the marvel Universe, humans is just one kind of being. Again any concrete proof? Cuz even if it's a billion billion asgardians, supes is still screwed.

Superman beats Mangog because Mangog is only a billion billion beings. Sounds reasonable...













I think I'm going to put h1 on ignore

Originally posted by JayDaDon
There's alot of beings in the marvel Universe, humans is just one kind of being. Again any concrete proof? Cuz even if it's a billion billion asgardians, supes is still screwed.

h1a8 only knows how to spout opinions/claims/hearsays.But when asked to provide scans and evidence, he can't provide any.I asked him to post a scan or scans of SA Mangog being defeated through physical means.And up until now he can't provide even a single scan of SA Mangog being harmed physically.

Originally posted by h1a8
It's called common sense. No proof required. The obvious>>>>>made up stuff that isn't shown or hinted to (forgot the word for this lol).

If each being supplied the power of a 100 tons then Superman is still stronger.

And now you claim those Billion billion beings are humans?

http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc412/igniz6/Thor_157-18.jpg
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc412/igniz6/Thor_157-19.jpg

Note:Those two scans shows how SA Mangog's first rampage was stopped through Odin's power.Now the next scans shows SA Mangog's second rampage and the reason why Superman will never defeat SA Mangog through physical means.

http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc412/igniz6/Thor198-13.jpg
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc412/igniz6/Thor198-14.jpg
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc412/igniz6/Thor198-15.jpg
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc412/igniz6/Thor198-16.jpg
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc412/igniz6/Thor198-17.jpg
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc412/igniz6/Thor198-18.jpg

So my statements are facts and not claims/opinions/hearsays because I show evidence to what I claim.

H1 is a bigger moron then quanchi.estahuh

Originally posted by Estacado
H1 is a bigger moron then quanchi.estahuh You're still upset after all these years.

Originally posted by JayDaDon
There's alot of beings in the marvel Universe, humans is just one kind of being. Again any concrete proof? Cuz even if it's a billion billion asgardians, supes is still screwed.

Exactly.

I think H1 sits on the side line laughing at everyone because he gets people so riled up. I don't think he believes anything he say.

Originally posted by Igniz
h1a8 only knows how to spout opinions/claims/hearsays.But when asked to provide scans and evidence, he can't provide any.I asked him to post a scan or scans of SA Mangog being defeated through physical means.And up until now he can't provide even a single scan of SA Mangog being harmed physically.



And now you claim those Billion billion beings are humans?

http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc412/igniz6/Thor_157-18.jpg
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc412/igniz6/Thor_157-19.jpg

Note:Those two scans shows how SA Mangog's first rampage was stopped through Odin's power.Now the next scans shows SA Mangog's second rampage and the reason why Superman will never defeat SA Mangog through physical means.

http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc412/igniz6/Thor198-13.jpg
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc412/igniz6/Thor198-14.jpg
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc412/igniz6/Thor198-15.jpg
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc412/igniz6/Thor198-16.jpg
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc412/igniz6/Thor198-17.jpg
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc412/igniz6/Thor198-18.jpg

So my statements are facts and not claims/opinions/hearsays because I show evidence to what I claim.
Energy blasts and blunt force trauma aren't the same thing.


I didn't claim they were human but rather about human level. The writer purposely brought up the term billion billion beings in a boast to convince the reader that mangog had the power of a billion billion human level beings. If the beings were far superior to humans then the writer would have told us so. Even if he had the power of a billion billion average Asgardians then Superman is still stronger.

Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
Superman beats Mangog because Mangog is only a billion billion beings. Sounds reasonable...



It was the writer's intent. Don't argue with me, argue with him.

Originally posted by JayDaDon
There's alot of beings in the marvel Universe, humans is just one kind of being. Again any concrete proof? Cuz even if it's a billion billion asgardians, supes is still screwed. If the billion billion beings wasn't about human level then the writer would have said so. The fact that he's trying to appeal to the reader without deception says that the beings are human level.

Even with the average Asgardian's strength (class 40 I think) then Superman is still stronger than a billion billion of them.

@H1 no one takes you seriously. I mean when they ask you to back up a claim you even admit you've only seen one scan about the said character. You don't know enough about anyone and just make stuff up and act like that's debating. It isn't.

Originally posted by h1a8




Even with the average Asgardian's strength (class 40 I think) then Superman is still stronger than a billion billion of them.

Lol what a load of horses#it! I just had to let this statement stand out on its own.

Originally posted by quanchi112
@H1 no one takes you seriously. I mean when they ask you to back up a claim you even admit you've only seen one scan about the said character. You don't know enough about anyone and just make stuff up and act like that's debating. It isn't.



And he still can't provide a single measly scan of SA Mangog being knocked out physically.While I provided scans of why Superman doesn't stand a chance in hell defeating SA Mangog.

Originally posted by JayDaDon
Lol what a load of horses#it! I just had to let this statement stand out on its own. What's 40 tons times a billion billion? The answer is 4 x 10^19 tons. Guess how much an Earth weight is. It is 6.6 x 10^21 tons. This 164 times more. Guess how many Earth weights Superman can exert? More than 80. This is more than 13000 times more.

Originally posted by Igniz


And he still can't provide a single measly scan of SA Mangog being knocked out physically.While I provided scans of why Superman doesn't stand a chance in hell defeating SA Mangog.

Mangog has the power of a billion billion beings. Even if these are average asgardian beings then Superman has the power to still hurt Mangog.

Originally posted by h1a8
What's 40 tons times a billion billion? The answer is 4 x 10^19 tons. Guess how much an Earth weight is. It is 6.6 x 10^21 tons. This 164 times more. Guess how many Earth weights Superman can exert? More than 80. This is more than 13000 times more.

Originally posted by h1a8
What's 40 tons times a billion billion? The answer is 4 x 10^19 tons. Guess how much an Earth weight is. It is 6.6 x 10^21 tons. This 164 times more. Guess how many Earth weights Superman can exert? More than 80. This is more than 13000 times more.



Mangog has the power of a billion billion beings. Even if these are average asgardian beings then Superman has the power to still hurt Mangog.

Your computation concerning the weight of the Earth, compared to the hypothetical strength of the previous race of Mangog is meaningless.

Even if we had any other number besides a billion billion, your deduction means nothing, since Superman has been defeated by opponents that didn't have, or need the kind of strength you are talking about.

Regardless of Superman's strength, you are only proving that he can be felled by lesser opponents.

You are shooting yourself in the foot. Cease and desist.

Concerning Mangog's race:
They were beyond the Asgardians. They were, most probably superior to the Asgardians Physically, Technologically and possibly Magically, since the ploy of combining them all into one being was the only chance Asgard had. (as per Odin)

Whoever they were, Odin felt that this was his only chance and if they got past Asgard, it would have continued with no stopping them.

They had "brought death to thousands of galaxies". (Canonical)

Originally posted by h1a8
Mangog has the power of a billion billion beings. Even if these are average asgardian beings then Superman has the power to still hurt Mangog.

I asked you to post proof or scan to prove your opinion/claim that SA Mangog can be defeated by physical means.Otherwise it becomes nothing more then hearsay.Hearsay aren't accepted in debates as facts.You can say "Superman will beat SA Mangog etc,etc, and etc" but trying to prove this sentence is another.If you don't have any proof whatsoever, then just concede to the fact that Superman doesn't have any means of defeating SA Mangog.

Grundy=160 Earth weights.




http://img25.imagevenue.com/loc124/th_06507_Superman676001_122_124lo.jpghttp://img46.imagevenue.com/loc125/th_06513_Superman676016_122_125lo.jpghttp://img168.imagevenue.com/loc73/th_06516_Superman676017_122_73lo.jpghttp://img258.imagevenue.com/loc80/th_06518_Superman676018_122_80lo.jpg
http://img251.imagevenue.com/loc64/th_06520_Superman676019_122_64lo.jpg

Originally posted by Horrificus
Your computation concerning the weight of the Earth, compared to the hypothetical strength of the previous race of Mangog is meaningless.

Even if we had any other number besides a billion billion, your deduction means nothing, since Superman has been defeated by opponents that didn't have, or need the kind of strength you are talking about.

Regardless of Superman's strength, you are only proving that he can be felled by lesser opponents.

You are shooting yourself in the foot. Cease and desist.

Concerning Mangog's race:
They were beyond the Asgardians. They were, most probably superior to the Asgardians Physically, Technologically and possibly Magically, since the ploy of combining them all into one being was the only chance Asgard had. (as per Odin)

Whoever they were, Odin felt that this was his only chance and if they got past Asgard, it would have continued with no stopping them.

They had "brought death to thousands of galaxies". (Canonical)



The fact Odin was the key to stopping SA Mangog's first rampage.And in SA Mangog's second rampage, Odin died just to cut off SA Mangog's power source in order for Thor to finally beat Mangog.Superman doesn't have the power to do what Odin did.Hence SA Mangog=Death Of Superman again.

Originally posted by carver9
Grundy=160 Earth weights.




http://img25.imagevenue.com/loc124/th_06507_Superman676001_122_124lo.jpghttp://img46.imagevenue.com/loc125/th_06513_Superman676016_122_125lo.jpghttp://img168.imagevenue.com/loc73/th_06516_Superman676017_122_73lo.jpghttp://img258.imagevenue.com/loc80/th_06518_Superman676018_122_80lo.jpg
http://img251.imagevenue.com/loc64/th_06520_Superman676019_122_64lo.jpg



Nice one!

Originally posted by carver9
Grundy=160 Earth weights.




http://img25.imagevenue.com/loc124/th_06507_Superman676001_122_124lo.jpghttp://img46.imagevenue.com/loc125/th_06513_Superman676016_122_125lo.jpghttp://img168.imagevenue.com/loc73/th_06516_Superman676017_122_73lo.jpghttp://img258.imagevenue.com/loc80/th_06518_Superman676018_122_80lo.jpg
http://img251.imagevenue.com/loc64/th_06520_Superman676019_122_64lo.jpg

Joking aside, context much?

Originally posted by carver9
Grundy=160 Earth weights.




http://img25.imagevenue.com/loc124/th_06507_Superman676001_122_124lo.jpghttp://img46.imagevenue.com/loc125/th_06513_Superman676016_122_125lo.jpghttp://img168.imagevenue.com/loc73/th_06516_Superman676017_122_73lo.jpghttp://img258.imagevenue.com/loc80/th_06518_Superman676018_122_80lo.jpg
http://img251.imagevenue.com/loc64/th_06520_Superman676019_122_64lo.jpg
You've been corrected on this instance how many times before?
It was year one superman who killed the undead grundy in one hit when he was serious.

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Superman/th_Superman676002.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Superman/th_Superman676003.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Superman/th_Superman676020.jpg

^ more proof that fanboyism blinds one from obvious humor

Originally posted by psycho gundam
^ more proof that fanboyism blinds one from obvious humor

It's Carver.

Originally posted by abhilegend
You've been corrected on this instance how many times before?
It was year one superman who killed the undead grundy in one hit when he was serious.

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Superman/th_Superman676020.jpg

...Did Allan Scott just physically restrain Superman?

Originally posted by psycho gundam
^ more proof that fanboyism blinds one from obvious humor
Oh I know humor when I seen it, has it been anyone else I would've just laugh it off like gogo's theory that thor is thousands of time stronger than superman. The problem is that carver has been corrected on this topic several times by me alone in my short time here. There was no humor in it, its typical carver lowballing.

Originally posted by Fifthchild
...Did Allan Scott just physically restrain Superman?
He's alan scott aka "written the book on willpower". He can do anything he likes.greenlandurn

Originally posted by Igniz
I asked you to post proof or scan to prove your opinion/claim that SA Mangog can be defeated by physical means.Otherwise it becomes nothing more then hearsay.Hearsay aren't accepted in debates as facts.You can say "Superman will beat SA Mangog etc,etc, and etc" but trying to prove this sentence is another.If you don't have any proof whatsoever, then just concede to the fact that Superman doesn't have any means of defeating SA Mangog.

I gave proof. The proof is that the writer gave the limit of a billion billion beings.
You even said yourself that Galactus could physically harm Mangog. Where's your proof?

Originally posted by Horrificus
Your computation concerning the weight of the Earth, compared to the hypothetical strength of the previous race of Mangog is meaningless.

Even if we had any other number besides a billion billion, your deduction means nothing, since Superman has been defeated by opponents that didn't have, or need the kind of strength you are talking about.

Regardless of Superman's strength, you are only proving that he can be felled by lesser opponents.

You are shooting yourself in the foot. Cease and desist.

Concerning Mangog's race:
They were beyond the Asgardians. They were, most probably superior to the Asgardians Physically, Technologically and possibly Magically, since the ploy of combining them all into one being was the only chance Asgard had. (as per Odin)

Whoever they were, Odin felt that this was his only chance and if they got past Asgard, it would have continued with no stopping them.

They had "brought death to thousands of galaxies". (Canonical)

This is Superman's strength at his best and at his worst.
No, the writer's intention was that the billion billion beings were billion billion human level beings. Otherwise, the writer would have stated differently.

Out of context, but going to reply to this comment anyway:

Originally posted by Horrificus
Even if we had any other number besides a billion billion, your deduction means nothing, since Superman has been defeated by opponents that didn't have, or need the kind of strength you are talking about.

Regardless of Superman's strength, you are only proving that he can be felled by lesser opponents.

You are shooting yourself in the foot. Cease and desist.

Not necessarily. Superman's strength has, on many occasions, been shown to be > his durability. Yes, it doesn't make sense, but he flies without wings, so it doesn't really have to.

Superman's rogues gallery, in terms of physical strength, do possess the ability to cause damage on a planetery level for the most part, so do have the ability to hurt him.

Every hero gets felled by lesser opponents; it's called PIS.

Originally posted by h1a8
I gave proof. The proof is that the writer gave the limit of a billion billion beings.
You even said yourself that Galactus could physically harm Mangog. Where's your proof?



This is Superman's strength at his best and at his worst.
No, the writer's intention was that the billion billion beings were billion billion human level beings. Otherwise, the writer would have stated differently. No, that was NOT the writer's intention.
Because, the writer's constantly stated how the race was a threat to Asgard and the entire universe.

That does not sound like a "human"-level threat.

Even a billion billion Earth-Humans could not bring death to thousands of galaxies, threaten the universe and pose a threat to Asgard.

Think of what it would REALLY mean for an empire to span thousands of galaxies, threaten the universe and threaten Asgard. Think of the distances, time, strength, intelligence and power those things would involve.

They were not anything like "Human".

Originally posted by -Pr-
Out of context, but going to reply to this comment anyway:



Not necessarily. Superman's strength has, on many occasions, been shown to be > his durability. Yes, it doesn't make sense, but he flies without wings, so it doesn't really have to.

Superman's rogues gallery, in terms of physical strength, do possess the ability to cause damage on a planetery level for the most part, so do have the ability to hurt him.

Every hero gets felled by lesser opponents; it's called PIS. That was my point. I know Superman has huge strength feats.

My point is that they do not always keep him from losing to foes that do not have the same level of strength as he does.

Originally posted by h1a8
I gave proof. The proof is that the writer gave the limit of a billion billion beings.
You even said yourself that Galactus could physically harm Mangog. Where's your proof?

And where did I say Galactus could harm SA Mangog physically?I responded to your comment of using Living Tribunal and Galactus as a reason for why you think Superman could beat SA Mangog.Here's the flaw in your argument.Basically your putting Superman on a level = to Living Tribunal and Galactus.Both LT and Galactus are abstracts.Superman isn't.

FYI Using math or calculation is futile concerning SA Mangog since he's a magical being.In his OHOTMU Profile, it was hinted that Mangog might be an avatar of the conceptual entity hate or could be a minor abstract.

http://s980.photobucket.com/albums/ae289/ankur2292/?action=view&current=MangogB.jpg

Hence why Superman will never beat SA Mangog.

BTW Post proof SA Mangog can be knocked out physically.Or just concede if you don't have any proof whatsoever.

Originally posted by Igniz
And where did I say Galactus could harm SA Mangog physically?I responded to your comment of using Living Tribunal and Galactus as a reason for why you think Superman could beat SA Mangog.Here's the flaw in your argument.Basically your putting Superman on a level = to Living Tribunal and Galactus.Both LT and Galactus are abstracts.Superman isn't.

FYI Using math or calculation is futile concerning SA Mangog since he's a magical being.In his OHOTMU Profile, it was hinted that Mangog might be an avatar of the conceptual entity hate or could be a minor abstract.

http://s980.photobucket.com/albums/ae289/ankur2292/?action=view&current=MangogB.jpg

Hence why Superman will never beat SA Mangog.

BTW Post proof SA Mangog can be knocked out physically.Or just concede if you don't have any proof whatsoever.

Ok, you have a small point. But you cannot deny the writer's intention. Remember a billion billion humans back in those days was incomprehension by young comic readers. If each human can lift 100lbs. then guess how much a billion billion humans can lift? The answer is 50 quadrillion tons (5 x10^16 tons). It makes perfect since for a being having the power of 50 quadrillion tons to outclass classic Thor. On average, classic Thor was probably in the mid hundreds to thousands of tons range. So in reality he would be lesser than an insect to a 50 quadrillion ton being. The fact that Thor seemed a little more than an insect to Mangog means that the billion billion human power is more realistic than a billion billion higher level beings.


Lastly, the fact that Mangog was more susceptible to damage from the inside proves that he wasn't immune to physical damage or an abstract being incapable of taking physical damage. His outside being more durable than his inside doesn't mean his outside is indestructible to physical force. Either he is indestructible everywhere or he isn't indestructible anywhere.

Originally posted by Horrificus
That was my point. I know Superman has huge strength feats.

My point is that they do not always keep him from losing to foes that do not have the same level of strength as he does.

That's why they generally use methods other than physical strength, though.

Originally posted by h1a8
Ok, you have a small point. But you cannot deny the writer's intention. Remember a billion billion humans back in those days was incomprehension by young comic readers. If each human can lift 100lbs. then guess how much a billion billion humans can lift? The answer is 50 quadrillion tons (5 x10^16 tons). It makes perfect since for a being having the power of 50 quadrillion tons to outclass classic Thor. On average, classic Thor was probably in the mid hundreds to thousands of tons range. So in reality he would be lesser than an insect to a 50 quadrillion ton being. The fact that Thor seemed a little more than an insect to Mangog means that the billion billion human power is more realistic than a billion billion higher level beings.


Lastly, the fact that Mangog was more susceptible to damage from the inside proves that he wasn't immune to physical damage or an abstract being incapable of taking physical damage. His outside being more durable than his inside doesn't mean his outside is indestructible to physical force. Either he is indestructible everywhere or he isn't indestructible anywhere.

Where are you getting these billions of billions beings are humans. Scans please.

how is this not spite? no way in hell superman can win this

Originally posted by h1a8
Ok, you have a small point. But you cannot deny the writer's intention. Remember a billion billion humans back in those days was incomprehension by young comic readers. If each human can lift 100lbs. then guess how much a billion billion humans can lift? The answer is 50 quadrillion tons (5 x10^16 tons). It makes perfect since for a being having the power of 50 quadrillion tons to outclass classic Thor. On average, classic Thor was probably in the mid hundreds to thousands of tons range. So in reality he would be lesser than an insect to a 50 quadrillion ton being. The fact that Thor seemed a little more than an insect to Mangog means that the billion billion human power is more realistic than a billion billion higher level beings.


Lastly, the fact that Mangog was more susceptible to damage from the inside proves that he wasn't immune to physical damage or an abstract being incapable of taking physical damage. His outside being more durable than his inside doesn't mean his outside is indestructible to physical force. Either he is indestructible everywhere or he isn't indestructible anywhere. No physical damage was ever shown. Then he was knocked off of a cliff.
Anything else you say is just guesswork.

And, your entire argument about the billion billion humans, is ridiculous. It doesn't make sense.

Originally posted by bbrem123
how is this not spite? no way in hell superman can win this

H1a8

Originally posted by h1a8
Ok, you have a small point. But you cannot deny the writer's intention. Remember a billion billion humans back in those days was incomprehension by young comic readers. If each human can lift 100lbs. then guess how much a billion billion humans can lift? The answer is 50 quadrillion tons (5 x10^16 tons). It makes perfect since for a being having the power of 50 quadrillion tons to outclass classic Thor. On average, classic Thor was probably in the mid hundreds to thousands of tons range. So in reality he would be lesser than an insect to a 50 quadrillion ton being. The fact that Thor seemed a little more than an insect to Mangog means that the billion billion human power is more realistic than a billion billion higher level beings.


Lastly, the fact that Mangog was more susceptible to damage from the inside proves that he wasn't immune to physical damage or an abstract being incapable of taking physical damage. His outside being more durable than his inside doesn't mean his outside is indestructible to physical force. Either he is indestructible everywhere or he isn't indestructible anywhere.





By this statement you have no clue on Mangog race hell the whole damn subject, like Horricfic said, there were a threat to Asgard and the rest of the universe they were Asgard dark rival, they are God like beings like Asgard, they were equals or more!!!


You really Believe your Bullsh!t dont you, Classic Thor and Superman are peers, you trying demised Thor and up lift Superman where feats say other wise,if anything they are pretty damn close in strength. If everybody who like DC and Marvel and all agree that Superman will lose and lose badly based on feats and characters abilities, why are you so hell bent trying too prove something that you cant!?

You really try to act like you know you are talking about, but you dont, you are looking like complete jack a$$ which is not to hard for you. You are trying too say Superman is = or greater than Classic Odin, that is what you are trying too say. Superman would be fighting somebody who is so damn powerful, that you can add H/P Doomsday and they will still lose hard.

Originally posted by the Darkone
By this statement you have no clue on Mangog race hell the whole damn subject, like Horricfic said, there were a threat to Asgard and the rest of the universe they were Asgard dark rival, they are God like beings like Asgard, they were equals or more!!!


You really Believe your Bullsh!t dont you, Classic Thor and Superman are peers, you trying demised Thor and up lift Superman where feats say other wise,if anything they are pretty damn close in strength. If everybody who like DC and Marvel and all agree that Superman will lose and lose badly based on feats and characters abilities, why are you so hell bent trying too prove something that you cant!?

You really try to act like you know you are talking about, but you dont, you are looking like complete jack a$$ which is not to hard for you. You are trying too say Superman is = or greater than Classic Odin, that is what you are trying too say. Superman would be fighting somebody who is so damn powerful, that you can add H/P Doomsday and they will still lose hard.


No! The writer made no mention that the billion billion beings was from a race higher than human strength. Even if the race were as strong as the average 40 ton Asgardian then I already showed that Superman at his best is still stronger.

Superman and Classic Thor ARE NOT PEERS IN STRENGTH. Superman, according to quantifiable feats, is much stronger. Give me a quantifiable feat by Thor that is even above 1 Earth weight of force and then we can talk. Otherwise, you are spouting nothing but bias claims without any proof.

Originally posted by h1a8
No! The writer made no mention that the billion billion beings was from a race higher than human strength. Even if the race were as strong as the average 40 ton Asgardian then I already showed that Superman at his best is still stronger.

Superman and Classic Thor ARE NOT PEERS IN STRENGTH. Superman, according to quantifiable feats, is much stronger. Give me a quantifiable feat by Thor that is even above 1 Earth weight of force and then we can talk. Otherwise, you are spouting nothing but bias claims without any proof.



Are you f**king stupid or what, the writers stated that they were a threat to Asgard existence period, they were destroyers of worlds, you haven shown us jack sh**, but bullsh** logic that isn't backed up by comic feats.

So you are still saying Superman is on the same level of power of Classic Odin, because thats what going to take, High level sky father not a herald level. at your ignorance of characters.

Originally posted by h1a8
No! The writer made no mention that the billion billion beings was from a race higher than human strength. Even if the race were as strong as the average 40 ton Asgardian then I already showed that Superman at his best is still stronger.

Superman and Classic Thor ARE NOT PEERS IN STRENGTH. Superman, according to quantifiable feats, is much stronger. Give me a quantifiable feat by Thor that is even above 1 Earth weight of force and then we can talk. Otherwise, you are spouting nothing but bias claims without any proof. Now, just stop that!

Originally posted by h1a8
No! The writer made no mention that the billion billion beings was from a race higher than human strength. Even if the race were as strong as the average 40 ton Asgardian then I already showed that Superman at his best is still stronger.

And up until now you're not posting any proof that SA Mangog can be knocked out physically.And you tried to pass off the Mangog commanded by a Thanosi as proof SA Mangog can be knocked out?First off, Thor has a hammer known as Mjolnir.Second, he shoved his hammer down Mangog(Commanded by a Thanosi) and shot an Anti-Force Blast from inside.This 2 facts is what Superman doesn't have.So even the Mangog commanded by a Thanosi isn't losing to Superman.But that is irrelevant since the thread starter said Silver Age Mangog.So is Superman>>>Than Odin?

Originally posted by h1a8
Superman and Classic Thor ARE NOT PEERS IN STRENGTH. Superman, according to quantifiable feats, is much stronger. Give me a quantifiable feat by Thor that is even above 1 Earth weight of force and then we can talk. Otherwise, you are spouting nothing but bias claims without any proof.

Oh the irony of this post

Before you call someone bias, aren't you the one spouting bias claims saying Superman can knock out SA Mangog Physically?And this is despite the fact that you haven't shown any proof of SA Mangog being knocked out physically.

^I'm not saying that superman wins here or something like that, but the above reasoning is faulty at best. Case in point, Black adam has never been koed in his entire publishing history except by a tesserect the size of a football field inside his head. So now only tesserect wielding characters can ko him, right?

Originally posted by abhilegend
^I'm not saying that superman wins here or something like that, but the above reasoning is faulty at best. Case in point, Black adam has never been koed in his entire publishing history except by a tesserect the size of a football field inside his head. So now only tesserect wielding characters can ko him, right?

h1a8 stated Superman can KO SA Mangog through physical means.This would put Superman >To Odin.Odin was the one who robbed SA Mangog of his power source twice.This is how SA Mangog was defeated.I've already shown this in a scan of how SA Mangog was defeated.It shows Odin is > to SA Mangog.This means Skyfathers and Abstract levels have a shot of defeating SA Mangog.So if we allow h1a8's way of thinking, this is what will appear.

Superman>Odin>SA Mangog

Superman isn't Skyfather level.He's herald level at least.

Originally posted by abhilegend
^I'm not saying that superman wins here or something like that, but the above reasoning is faulty at best. Case in point, Black adam has never been koed in his entire publishing history except by a tesserect the size of a football field inside his head. So now only tesserect wielding characters can ko him, right? Um... possibly?
It sounds like that might be the case for BA.

If this is true, it is quite a claim to fame for Adam.

There should be more to the stats of a character, than just the strength level.

Maybe Black Adam has one of the best "jaws" in comic books.

Originally posted by Igniz
h1a8 stated Superman can KO SA Mangog through physical means.This would put Superman >To Odin.Odin was the one who robbed SA Mangog of his power source twice.This is how SA Mangog was defeated.I've already shown this in a scan of how SA Mangog was defeated.It shows Odin is > to SA Mangog.This means Skyfathers and Abstract levels have a shot of defeating SA Mangog.So if we allow h1a8's way of thinking, this is what will appear.

Superman>Odin>SA Mangog

Superman isn't Skyfather level.He's herald level at least.
This was the first reply in this thread
Originally posted by abhilegend
Spite.
I was just questioning the notion that since thor used his random-force energy (Mjolnir has so many of them its not even funny), nothing else would work on mangog. I advise you to put h1 on ignore.
Originally posted by Horrificus
Um... possibly?
It sounds like that might be the case for BA.

If this is true, it is quite a claim to fame for Adam.

There should be more to the stats of a character, than just the strength level.

Maybe Black Adam has one of the best "jaws" in comic books.
Good, now every BA thread is spite.srug

Originally posted by Igniz
And up until now you're not posting any proof that SA Mangog can be knocked out physically.And you tried to pass off the Mangog commanded by a Thanosi as proof SA Mangog can be knocked out?First off, Thor has a hammer known as Mjolnir.Second, he shoved his hammer down Mangog(Commanded by a Thanosi) and shot an Anti-Force Blast from inside.This 2 facts is what Superman doesn't have.So even the Mangog commanded by a Thanosi isn't losing to Superman.But that is irrelevant since the thread starter said Silver Age Mangog.So is Superman>>>Than Odin?



Oh the irony of this post

Before you call someone bias, aren't you the one spouting bias claims saying Superman can knock out SA Mangog Physically?And this is despite the fact that you haven't shown any proof of SA Mangog being knocked out physically.


The reasoning of why Mangog can be knocked out by physical means without him showing it is because of the finite limit the writer gave to him (a billion billion beings). In other words, a billion billion beings isn't an infinite amount of beings, even if those beings had ANY assignable strength.

Originally posted by the Darkone
Are you f**king stupid or what, the writers stated that they were a threat to Asgard existence period, they were destroyers of worlds, you haven shown us jack sh**, but bullsh** logic that isn't backed up by comic feats.

So you are still saying Superman is on the same level of power of Classic Odin, because thats what going to take, High level sky father not a herald level. at your ignorance of characters.

A billion billion humans can destroy worlds in the comic world easily. Nothing wrong with this in comics. Mangog had magic powers as well to help him. He wanted the Odin sword too to help him. Also, what ordinary worlds could stop someone with both 40 quadrillion ton strength and magical powers?

So you think someone being a threat to Asgard or worlds automatically means they have more than 40 quadrillion ton strength?

Superman at his best is physically stronger than Odin. And energy blasts are not the same as blunt force trauma.

Originally posted by h1a8
The reasoning of why Mangog can be knocked out by physical means without him showing it is because of the finite limit the writer gave to him (a billion billion beings). In other words, a billion billion beings isn't an infinite amount of beings, even if those beings had ANY assignable strength.



A billion billion humans can destroy worlds in the comic world easily. Nothing wrong with this in comics. Mangog had magic powers as well to help him. He wanted the Odin sword too to help him. Also, what ordinary worlds could stop someone with both 40 quadrillion ton strength and magical powers?

So you think someone being a threat to Asgard or worlds automatically means they have more than 40 quadrillion ton strength?

Superman at his best is physically stronger than Odin. And energy blasts are not the same as blunt force trauma.

Originally posted by h1a8
The reasoning of why Mangog can be knocked out by physical means without him showing it is because of the finite limit the writer gave to him (a billion billion beings). In other words, a billion billion beings isn't an infinite amount of beings, even if those beings had ANY assignable strength.



A billion billion humans can destroy worlds in the comic world easily. Nothing wrong with this in comics. Mangog had magic powers as well to help him. He wanted the Odin sword too to help him. Also, what ordinary worlds could stop someone with both 40 quadrillion ton strength and magical powers?

So you think someone being a threat to Asgard or worlds automatically means they have more than 40 quadrillion ton strength?

Superman at his best is physically stronger than Odin. And energy blasts are not the same as blunt force trauma.

How do you know that some of those "billion billion" beings aren't stronger than Superman?

Originally posted by h1a8
The reasoning of why Mangog can be knocked out by physical means without him showing it is because of the finite limit the writer gave to him (a billion billion beings). In other words, a billion billion beings isn't an infinite amount of beings, even if those beings had ANY assignable strength.



A billion billion humans can destroy worlds in the comic world easily. Nothing wrong with this in comics. Mangog had magic powers as well to help him. He wanted the Odin sword too to help him. Also, what ordinary worlds could stop someone with both 40 quadrillion ton strength and magical powers?

So you think someone being a threat to Asgard or worlds automatically means they have more than 40 quadrillion ton strength?

Superman at his best is physically stronger than Odin. And energy blasts are not the same as blunt force trauma.

SA Mangog has not been KO my physical means he feeds on it, you dont understand, damn you are stupid muthaf**ker period arent you!? You come on here with this hersay BS but cant prove it on panel, your ignorant is legendary .

The beings that made Mangog were greater than Asgard, even Odin feared that they would cause Asgard and the universe destruction, where do you get this quadrillion ton BS strength from, you are speculating on the highest order with no panel feats too back you!?

Odin is stronger than Superman period, Odin has one shot more class 100+ with ease than Superman, for goodness sake he is Top Sky Father, not only Odin is stronger he is vastly more powerful, Strength can't beat SA Mangog for he is Strength incarnate, for he feeds on physical, hatred from Asgardians and hatred through out the universe.

Originally posted by the Darkone
SA Mangog has not been KO my physical means he feeds on it, you dont understand, damn you are stupid muthaf**ker period arent you!? You come on here with this hersay BS but cant prove it on panel, your ignorant is legendary .

Originally posted by Silent Master
How do you know that some of those "billion billion" beings aren't stronger than Superman?

Because the writer never said so. Thus we can't add what has not been given and must go on writer's intentions.

Originally posted by h1a8
Because the writer never said so. Thus we can't add what has not been given and must go on writer's intentions.

Writer's intentions?

Like how it was the writer's intention for Silver Age Mangog to be a good fight for skyfathers, which would make this a spite thread?

Originally posted by the Darkone
SA Mangog has not been KO my physical means he feeds on it, you dont understand, damn you are stupid muthaf**ker period arent you!? You come on here with this hersay BS but cant prove it on panel, your ignorant is legendary .

The beings that made Mangog were greater than Asgard, even Odin feared that they would cause Asgard and the universe destruction, where do you get this quadrillion ton BS strength from, you are speculating on the highest order with no panel feats too back you!?

Odin is stronger than Superman period, Odin has one shot more class 100+ with ease than Superman, for goodness sake he is Top Sky Father, not only Odin is stronger he is vastly more powerful, Strength can't beat SA Mangog for he is Strength incarnate, for he feeds on physical, hatred from Asgardians and hatred through out the universe.

What does this have to do with strength? Dr. Strange is not strong but he at his best can give Odin a match. The writer clearly emphasized the billion billion beings to tell how much physical strength Mangog had. Odin didn't try to hit him with physical blows. Only Thor did.

Where you get the feed from? Mangog didn't feed off attacks (or absorb them) he just was durable enough to not get hurt.

Show me Odin exerting more than 1 Earth weight of force then we can talk about him being stronger than Superman. Because one-shotting low level class 100s isn't cutting it.

Originally posted by h1a8
What does this have to do with strength? Dr. Strange is not strong but he at his best can give Odin a match. The writer clearly emphasized the billion billion beings to tell how much physical strength Mangog had. Odin didn't try to hit him with physical blows. Only Thor did.

Where you get the feed from? Mangog didn't feed off attacks (or absorb them) he just was durable enough to not get hurt.

Show me Odin exerting more than 1 Earth weight of force then we can talk about him being stronger than Superman. Because one-shotting low level class 100s isn't cutting it. Dude, seriously. Is there something wrong with you?
Nobody agrees with your stupid billion billion beings perspective, or you silly strength/superman/earth-weight formulas.

And, you need to look for some of my recent Mangog posts, with scans.
If that is the only way that you will really read one of these pertinent comic books.
Maybe you will finally see that you have no idea what you are talking about, and you are wrong about a lot of stuff.

Mangog might win but still Superman had greater enemies and won, it's his job to win against all odd^^. So it's not spite.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Mangog might win but still Superman had greater enemies and won, it's his job to win against all odd^^. So it's not spite.

So what would be spite against Superman, iyo?

^ cheetah, obviously

silver-age mangog can't compete with such a beast

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
So what would be spite against Superman, iyo?

Squirrel Girl or Batman.

May as well add Doom to that list, too.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
May as well add Doom to that list, too.

Nah, he's just another Luthor. But Wolverine has a good chance .

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Nah, he's just another Luthor. But Wolverine has a good chance .

Doom is what Luthor aspires to be and fails terribly at.

Yeah, Wolverine's "Best There Is" aura might be too much for Superman.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Nah, he's just another Luthor.

http://gifsoup.com/view4/3397612/nope-o.gif

Originally posted by h1a8
What does this have to do with strength? Dr. Strange is not strong but he at his best can give Odin a match. The writer clearly emphasized the billion billion beings to tell how much physical strength Mangog had. Odin didn't try to hit him with physical blows. Only Thor did.

Where you get the feed from? Mangog didn't feed off attacks (or absorb them) he just was durable enough to not get hurt.

Show me Odin exerting more than 1 Earth weight of force then we can talk about him being stronger than Superman. Because one-shotting low level class 100s isn't cutting it.

Prove too us with panel feats of Superman quadrillion strength bullsh**, You show us Superman having enough power on Classic Odin level too stop Silver Age MAngog, prove to us which we all doubt, that you know you are talking about, which you dont. You so quick to call somebody bias, of all people you are the most bias jack a$$ on this site beside quan, you make look reasonable compare too your ignorance!

and this is still a spite thread

Originally posted by the Darkone
Prove too us with panel feats of Superman quadrillion strength bullsh**, You show us Superman having enough power on Classic Odin level too stop Silver Age MAngog, prove to us which we all doubt, that you know you are talking about, which you dont. You so quick to call somebody bias, of all people you are the most bias jack a$$ on this site beside quan, you make look reasonable compare too your ignorance!

I'm loving it.

Originally posted by h1a8
Because the writer never said so. Thus we can't add what has not been given and must go on writer's intentions.

What was the writers intention? When you answer this, provide a scan please "since you are not the writer".

I've been wondering what 1 billion billion would look like as a number. Is that 1 with 16 zeros behind it? Something like 10,000,000,000,000,000?

Originally posted by Stoic
I've been wondering what 1 billion billion would look like as a number. Is that 1 with 16 zeros behind it? Something like 10,000,000,000,000,000? if each being that compose him can lift only a milligram max, he'd be able to lift 1,023,113 tons

Originally posted by carver9
What was the writers intention? When you answer this, provide a scan please "since you are not the writer".


Originally posted by Silent Master
Writer's intentions?

Like how it was the writer's intention for Silver Age Mangog to be a good fight for skyfathers, which would make this a spite thread?

If you created a villain to have the power of a billion billion god like beings (average Asgardian strength each or more) then you wouldn't have the villain boast "A billion billion beings" knowing most comic readers (kids usually) would construe it to mean human like beings since this amount is still astronomical. Rather you would say "A billion billion gods" or something to that effect.

Clearly a billion billion human level beings is beyond imagination (over 40 quadrillion tons of strength) and can outclass ANY herald level being on their average day (even Superman). But Superman is at his best here. Otherwise he would not win a majority.

Originally posted by the Darkone
Prove too us with panel feats of Superman quadrillion strength bullsh**, You show us Superman having enough power on Classic Odin level too stop Silver Age MAngog, prove to us which we all doubt, that you know you are talking about, which you dont. You so quick to call somebody bias, of all people you are the most bias jack a$$ on this site beside quan, you make look reasonable compare too your ignorance!

Superman has feats far beyond the quadrillion range. Try Mageddon or the Starbreaker feat. Energy blasts and blunt force trauma are two different things.


Skyfathers aren't as strong as Superman physically is and thus they need to rely on magical energy based powers to beat beings that outclass them physically. Energy blasts and blunt force trauma aren't the same thing.

Your arguments are getting dumber by the post.

Originally posted by h1a8
If you created a villain to have the power of a billion billion god like beings (average Asgardian strength each or more) then you wouldn't have the villain boast "A billion billion beings" knowing most comic readers (kids usually) would construe it to mean human like beings since this amount is still astronomical. Rather you would say "A billion billion gods" or something to that effect.

Clearly a billion billion human level beings is beyond imagination (over 40 quadrillion tons of strength) and can outclass ANY herald level being on their average day (even Superman). But Superman is at his best here. Otherwise he would not win a majority.



Superman has feats far beyond the quadrillion range. Try Mageddon or the Starbreaker feat. Energy blasts and blunt force trauma are two different things.


Skyfathers aren't as strong as Superman physically is and thus they need to rely on magical energy based powers to beat beings that outclass them physically. Energy blasts and blunt force trauma aren't the same thing. Everything you are saying is still incorrect.

Originally posted by h1a8
If you created a villain to have the power of a billion billion god like beings (average Asgardian strength each or more) then you wouldn't have the villain boast "A billion billion beings" knowing most comic readers (kids usually) would construe it to mean human like beings since this amount is still astronomical. Rather you would say "A billion billion gods" or something to that effect.

Clearly a billion billion human level beings is beyond imagination (over 40 quadrillion tons of strength) and can outclass ANY herald level being on their average day (even Superman). But Superman is at his best here. Otherwise he would not win a majority.



Superman has feats far beyond the quadrillion range. Try Mageddon or the Starbreaker feat. Energy blasts and blunt force trauma are two different things.


Skyfathers aren't as strong as Superman physically is and thus they need to rely on magical energy based powers to beat beings that outclass them physically. Energy blasts and blunt force trauma aren't the same thing.

This statement shows that you don't you are talking about as usual, you trying so hard but failing at every turn, you just showing us that you are troll with nothing bullsh** logic

Originally posted by h1a8
If you created a villain to have the power of a billion billion god like beings (average Asgardian strength each or more) then you wouldn't have the villain boast "A billion billion beings" knowing most comic readers (kids usually) would construe it to mean human like beings since this amount is still astronomical. Rather you would say "A billion billion gods" or something to that effect.

Clearly a billion billion human level beings is beyond imagination (over 40 quadrillion tons of strength) and can outclass ANY herald level being on their average day (even Superman). But Superman is at his best here. Otherwise he would not win a majority.



Superman has feats far beyond the quadrillion range. Try Mageddon or the Starbreaker feat. Energy blasts and blunt force trauma are two different things.


Skyfathers aren't as strong as Superman physically is and thus they need to rely on magical energy based powers to beat beings that outclass them physically. Energy blasts and blunt force trauma aren't the same thing. None of this makes any sense.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Your arguments are getting dumber by the post.

I disagree. I think they are getting better. I'm making them more clear. It's just the bias in people refuse to see the obvious truth.

Originally posted by h1a8
I disagree. I think they are getting better. I'm making them more clear. It's just the bias in people refuse to see the obvious truth.

The obvious truth is that your arguments are getting dumber.

Originally posted by Silent Master
The obvious truth is that your arguments are getting dumber.

Arguing the writers intention about the billion billion beings as why Thor had no chance physically

is not a dumber argument.

Obviously if a being is physically above a billion billion beings then they can physically harm Mangog.

Let me ask you something. On average what strength level do you think classic Thor was written on (100-1000ton range, 1000-10000ton range,...) especially around that time he fought Mangog.

IMO, classic Thor was written on average at the 200-2000 ton range just by looking at how he was hitting things, throwing things, etc.

Stop trying to use handbook numbers, Classic Thor had strength feats as high as lifting the Midgard Serpent off the Earth and then IIRC wrapping it around the World Tree.