Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

Chaos King (from Chaos Way)

vs

Sundipped Superman (OWAW)
Superboy Prime (Sinestro Wars)
Sodam Yat Ion
PC Captain Marvel
Dr. Fate (Kent Nelson)

Firestorm
Captain Atom
Highfather
Hal Jordan (Parallax)
Darkseid with ALE

Doomsday (DOS)
Zatanna
Ganthet
Ares (DC)
Steel (Entropy Aegis Armor)

Martian Manhunter
The Flash
Maxima
Wonder Woman
Dr. Manhattan

Chaos King.

ALE ftw.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
ALE ftw.

That would do what to a being that represents the void before the creation event?

CK slaughters Team.

Originally posted by zopzop
That would do what to a being that represents the void before the creation event?

CK slaughters Team.

Him being representative of the void has pretty much no bearing on whether the ALE and it's wielder will hurt him.

Control him.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Him being representative of the void has pretty much no bearing on whether the ALE and it's wielder will hurt him.
How do you "hurt" the Void? A para-cosmic being, awakened Super God Herc, couldn't hurt him and had enough power to restore 98.76% of the MULTIVERSE (multiverse in the Marvel universe is a series of infinite universes).
Originally posted by Prep-Man
Control him.
Good luck with that.

Originally posted by zopzop
How do you "hurt" the Void? A para-cosmic being, awakened Super God Herc, couldn't hurt him and had enough power to restore 98.76% of the MULTIVERSE (multiverse in the Marvel universe is a series of infinite universes).

Good luck with that.

Ask Nekron the same question.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Ask Nekron the same question.

Not the same thing. Being "Lord of the Unliving" and being the ACTUAL VOID before the creation event are two completely different things.
CK >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Nekron.

EDIT :
Sentence.

Originally posted by zopzop
Not the same thing. Being "Lord of the Unliving" and being the ACTUAL VOID before the creation event are two completely different things.
CK >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Nekron.

EDIT :
Sentence.

Nekron is the void before creation. He is oblivion given form. How is that not the same thing?

Nekron is more than lord of the unliving, he is also the void between space or something to that. He also represents death.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Nekron is the void before creation. He is oblivion given form. How is that not the same thing?
Where was it stated that Nekron is the Void before creation? Being Oblivion given form is nice but still < CK.
Originally posted by Prep-Man
Nekron is more than lord of the unliving, he is also the void between space or something to that. He also represents death.
Still not comparable to the CK.

I never said he was comparable to CK, but more to Oblivion.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
I never said he was comparable to CK, but more to Oblivion.
Then he's less powerful than CK.

ale ftw

Originally posted by zopzop
Then he's less powerful than CK.


Not necessarily. It wasn't clear how powerful he was.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Not necessarily. It wasn't clear how powerful he was.

From the reviews of the Blackest Night series I've read, he didn't' seem to do much of anything. At least Marvel's Oblivion had that epic showdown with Infinity.

lol ok.

Originally posted by zopzop
Where was it stated that Nekron is the Void before creation? Being Oblivion given form is nice but still < CK.

Still not comparable to the CK.

During Blackest Night he was retconned to be the void that existed "before light". As in, before god created stuff.

He also took White Lantern Sinestro's attack. Sinestro was the only real threat to him and the DC heroes needed plot device to beat him, IIRC.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
ALE ftw.

We're arguing semantics.

ALE takes it.

what is the team going to do to CK to weaken him for the ALE to work? I seriously doubt the ALE would effect a full-powered CK, IF it is to work against him at all. I do not think you can just show up to the battle and chant the ALE, and think you're walking away with a victory against CK...when more times than not he's stronger than the ALE user.

CK and Nekron are not the same or interchangeable. I'd even rank CK above Nekron in terms of significance. Nekron has a weakness, where CK could not mathematically be beaten.

Only because there is possibility of BFR for this fight does the team stand even the slightest chance from my perspective.

Originally posted by zopzop
From the reviews of the Blackest Night series I've read,.

Originally posted by Juntai
you get my mountain of a response pm?

CK takes this.LOL at the Chaos King and Nekron comparison.Even if we went for a CK Vs Nekron w/ their respective armies, CK will still dominate him.

CK's amy of 10,000 Gods and Monster that would consist of skyfathers or skyfather level beings Vs Nekron's Black Lantern Corps=CK's army dominates this.

As for capabilities.CK already scared Death away because of absorption.If a cosmic being like Death is not imuune to CK's absorption, then Nekron himself will suffer the same fate.And not to mention the Watcher now backs up CK's absorption of 98.76% of the Multiverse.BFR is the only thing that can beat CK.

Originally posted by Igniz
CK takes this.LOL at the Chaos King and Nekron comparison.Even if we went for a CK Vs Nekron w/ their respective armies, CK will still dominate him.

CK's amy of 10,000 Gods and Monster that would consist of skyfathers or skyfather level beings Vs Nekron's Black Lantern Corps=CK's army dominates this.

As for capabilities.CK already scared Death away because of absorption.If a cosmic being like Death is not imuune to CK's absorption, then Nekron himself will suffer the same fate.And not to mention the Watcher now backs up CK's absorption of 98.76% of the Multiverse.BFR is the only thing that can beat CK.

Nobody said they were the same thing.

Originally posted by -Pr-
During Blackest Night he was retconned to be the void that existed "before light". As in, before god created stuff.

Yes but UNLIKE Chaos King, he needs an anchor (this last time it was Black Hand?) to exist outside his realm no? Not to mention he needed the AM to power his battery and hence his troops.

The Chaos King has no such limitation. Chaos King is so far beyond Nekron it isn't even funny. So just because the ALE worked on Nekron, it doesn't mean it would on Chaos King.

I don't get the Nekron hype.

Originally posted by zopzop
Not the same thing. Being "Lord of the Unliving" and being the ACTUAL VOID before the creation event are two completely different things.
CK >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Nekron.

EDIT :
Sentence. Originally posted by -Pr-
Nekron is the void before creation. He is oblivion given form. How is that not the same thing?
Originally posted by Igniz
CK takes this.LOL at the Chaos King and Nekron comparison.Even if we went for a CK Vs Nekron w/ their respective armies, CK will still dominate him.

CK's amy of 10,000 Gods and Monster that would consist of skyfathers or skyfather level beings Vs Nekron's Black Lantern Corps=CK's army dominates this.

As for capabilities.CK already scared Death away because of absorption.If a cosmic being like Death is not imuune to CK's absorption, then Nekron himself will suffer the same fate.And not to mention the Watcher now backs up CK's absorption of 98.76% of the Multiverse.BFR is the only thing that can beat CK.
Originally posted by -Pr-
Nobody said they were the same thing.

Originally posted by zopzop
Yes but UNLIKE Chaos King, he needs an anchor (this last time it was Black Hand?) to exist outside his realm no? Not to mention he needed the AM to power his battery and hence his troops.

The Chaos King has no such limitation. Chaos King is so far beyond Nekron it isn't even funny. So just because the ALE worked on Nekron, it doesn't mean it would on Chaos King.

I don't get the Nekron hype.

I don't care about any of that; my point was simply that being the "void before creation" means jack shit in a forum setting, that's all.

Also, he didn't need the AM to power the battery, just a power source in general, which all batteries need.

He's hyped because he's mega powerful, and because the Black Lanterns almost took Earth; the most powerful planet in the multiverse.

And getting the hype would generally require the reading of the comic.

Originally posted by zopzop


You're misquoting me. Same thing as in voids, not power levels.

Originally posted by -Pr-
I don't care about any of that; my point was simply that being the "void before creation" means jack shit in a forum setting, that's all.

Also, he didn't need the AM to power the battery, just a power source in general, which all batteries need.

He's hyped because he's mega powerful, and because the Black Lanterns almost took Earth; the most powerful planet in the multiverse.

The Chaos King took out 98.75% of the MULTIVERSE, not just a planet. Even if you accept the "low" interpretation and go with universe, that's still more than Nekron ever did on panel. This is further bolstered by the fact that he took out the godly and infernal realms in addition to physical reality.



Since Team DC can't really mount any kind of defense for the character aside from "read the comic" it seems like I'm not missing much and the summaries online are accurate enough.



Ok, but power level means a lot in this fight. And we've seen that Chaos King doesn't have any of the limitations that DC's "void before creation" character Nekron does.

Originally posted by zopzop


The Chaos King took out 98.75% of the MULTIVERSE, not just a planet. Even if you accept the "low" interpretation and go with universe, that's still more than Nekron ever did on panel. This is further bolstered by the fact that he took out the godly and infernal realms in addition to physical reality.



Since Team DC can't really mount any kind of defense for the character aside from "read the comic" it seems like I'm not missing much and the summaries online are accurate enough.



Ok, but power level means a lot in this fight. And we've seen that Chaos King doesn't have any of the limitations that DC's "void before creation" character Nekron does.

So?

I was talking about Nekron. If you don't get why he's so hyped, reading the comic might help.

Yes, but Nekron isn't in this fight, so comparing his power level to that of the Chaos King means very little.

Originally posted by -Pr-
I was talking about Nekron. If you don't get why he's so hyped, reading the comic might help.

The online summaries seem accurate enough so I'll pass.



It helps because just because the ALE worked on a Nekron doesn't mean it will work on CK. We've already seen that despite being "the void before creation" of their respective companies, the CK IS more powerful AND he lacks the limitations Nekron has.

Originally posted by zopzop


The online summaries seem accurate enough so I'll pass.



It helps because just because the ALE worked on a Nekron doesn't mean it will work on CK. We've already seen that despite being "the void before creation" of their respective companies, the CK IS more powerful AND he lacks the limitations Nekron has.

They weren't accurate though, which led to this discussion going longer than it really needed to.

The ALE didn't work on Nekron. It wasn't used on him. Not during Blackest Night anyway.

Originally posted by -Pr-
They weren't accurate though, which led to this discussion going longer than it really needed to.

But they are though. True or False, Nekron needs an anchor to exist in the universe (outside his realm)? True or False, Nekron needed a power source to power his battery (and hence his army)?



Why why did you introduce him into this thread?

Originally posted by zopzop


But they are though. True or False, Nekron needs an anchor to exist in the universe (outside his realm)? True or False, Nekron needed a power source to power his battery (and hence his army)?



Why why did you introduce him into this thread?

He does need an anchor, yes.

Yes, he needed a power source, because he wasn't going to power it himself. It's a limitation that all batteries have. Plus the whole symbolism thing.

I brought him up to respond to the assertion that being the void before creation actually means something, when it doesn't outside of plot points.

Originally posted by -Pr-
He does need an anchor, yes.

Yes, he needed a power source, because he wasn't going to power it himself. It's a limitation that all batteries have. Plus the whole symbolism thing.


Excellent. And proves my point. The online summaries were accurate enough.



In Marvel it sure does. It means he preexisted before the Abstracts themselves (and the Concepts they represent) and what would the ALE do to a being that existed BEFORE there was life/death/time/space/etc... He existed BEFORE it came into being (in Marvel terms). Apparently it's not the same in DC.

Originally posted by zopzop


Excellent. And proves my point. The online summaries were accurate enough.



In Marvel it sure does. It means he preexisted before the Abstracts themselves (and the Concepts they represent) and what would the ALE do to a being that existed BEFORE there was life/death/time/space/etc... He existed BEFORE it came into being (in Marvel terms). Apparently it's not the same in DC.

Huh?

Yes, it was. Nekron existed before creation. I don't see how this has any bearing on anything in this match.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Huh?

Yes, it was. Nekron existed before creation. I don't see how this has any bearing on anything in this match.

The point being, with Chaos King not Nekron because he has limitations that the Chaos King doesn't, how would the ALE work on a being (Chaos King) that PREDATES the concepts the ALE represents? He existed BEFORE life/death/time/matter/etc... How would it even work on him?

Originally posted by zopzop
The point being, with Chaos King not Nekron because he has limitations that the Chaos King doesn't, how would the ALE work on a being (Chaos King) that PREDATES the concepts the ALE represents? He existed BEFORE life/death/time/matter/etc... How would it even work on him?

Does the Chaos King have free will?

Also, what do said limitations have to do with the ALE?

Originally posted by -Pr-
Does the Chaos King have free will?

Also, what do said limitations have to do with the ALE?

How do you define "free will" in the case of a being that 'existed' as the Void before creation. He was around before sentient beings came into existence (this would include abstract and conceptual beings). He seemed obsessed with undoing creation and only stopped when it seemed like he got his wish. I wouldn't call that free will because he couldn't stop himself and didn't stop himself until he thought he succeeded in absorbing/erasing/destroying everything. So no, I wouldn't say he has free will.

ZopZop, by your reasoning, that CK was the void before creation, does it put him above TOAA? You are making it sound like CK is unbeatable.

I mean Hercules almost reached his level by the use of common "God Artifacts"right?

CK ultimately has free will.

i think representing anti-everything > ALE

but if the team somehow hurts CK i don't see why it wouldn't work on him, IF it's able to work (a big if). but they're not going to just get close and start talking to gain victory here. CK being the abstract that he is, may be able to shrug off ALE because when you add it up...the literal aspect of nothing outweighs anti-life. for all we know CK should shrug off ALE like it's jibberish or nonsense.

Originally posted by Diesldude
ZopZop, by your reasoning, that CK was the void before creation, does it put him above TOAA? You are making it sound like CK is unbeatable.

Wrong? Where did you get that idea from? The LT, Protege, Scathan, Classic Infinity Gauntlet, the Infinites (possibly), tHotU, and more I'm probably missing are all more powerful than Chaos King.

TOAA doesn't even factor into this because nothing in Marvel can challenge it's power.



Yup, thanks to sh|t-tastic "writing" it seems Marvel's Earth pantheons apparently have items lying around their realms that if combined allows one to ascend into high abstract territory (Super God Herc was powerful enough to undo the damage to 98.76% of the universe/multiverse, sure it burned out his power, but that's a damn impressive feat). Don't blame me, blame the writer.

And the beauty of this was, CK was STILL more powerful than Super God Herc.

Originally posted by Diesldude
ZopZop, by your reasoning, that CK was the void before creation, does it put him above TOAA? You are making it sound like CK is unbeatable.

I mean Hercules almost reached his level by the use of common "God Artifacts"right?

You can tell someone hasn't read tie-ins and follow ups to the story.As for CK being above TOAA, answer is no.I wouldn't put CK above LT.But zop's point is clear that it took a lot of team effort for CK to be beaten through BFR.As for the tie-ins, here's where destiny stated what was needed to beat CK.

http://i1081.photobucket.com/albums/j351/igniz5/TOAAinvolvedinstoppingCK.jpg?t=1303206697

The ancient entities of creation are awakened by the dead X-men.

http://i1081.photobucket.com/albums/j351/igniz5/AncientEntitiesofCreation.jpg?t=1303261666

Now you can make your conclusions between this options on what the Primordial Gods of creation did in Chaos War Issue 5.

A.They weakened the Chaos King or
B.They super-amped SuperGod Hercules or
C.Both option A and B

ALE ftw!

Originally posted by Igniz
You can tell someone hasn't read tie-ins and follow ups to the story.As for CK being above TOAA, answer is no.I wouldn't put CK above LT.But zop's point is clear that it took a lot of team effort for CK to be beaten through BFR.As for the tie-ins, here's where destiny stated what was needed to beat CK.

http://i1081.photobucket.com/albums/j351/igniz5/TOAAinvolvedinstoppingCK.jpg?t=1303206697

The ancient entities of creation are awakened by the dead X-men.

http://i1081.photobucket.com/albums/j351/igniz5/AncientEntitiesofCreation.jpg?t=1303261666

Now you can make your conclusions between this options on what the Primordial Gods of creation did in Chaos War Issue 5.

A.They weakened the Chaos King or
B.They super-amped SuperGod Hercules or
C.Both option A and B

There is nothing wrong with that. Who readys every comic in print, I know i don't and couldn't even if I tried. I read choas war but wasn't going to waste my time trying to tie every loose end. If they ran into comics i don't read, I don't consider it a loss (especially for a crappy arc like CW); but thanks for the info, that's one reason i hang out here, good source of info without having to read every comic.

CK treats DS like Zeus

Originally posted by Jynocidus
CK treats DS like Zeus

http://i1081.photobucket.com/albums/j351/igniz5/CKAttacksPlutosDomain5.jpg
http://i1081.photobucket.com/albums/j351/igniz5/AresrecognizesMikaboshi2.jpg

As crappy as the Chaos War was, i think CK was really a multiversal beast.

I have to go with him here.