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This is a nod to an old thread by Darthgoober:

The Grandmaster decides to make his current bet with the Spectre more interesting (this bet: http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=563916 ). So he decides that he will send 8 KMCer's to DC Earth to see if they can conquer it. He sticks them into a machine that gives them the powers/abilities of some of the characters from the Marvel universe.

Consider them an amalgam complete in every way just the KMCer is in control.

He then gives them a challenge: the 8 of them have 3 years to completely conquer DC Earth (in addition, all 4 human Green Lanterns on Earth with Kilowog who came to visit, and Endless Mike is controlling Swamp Thing) using whatever means are necessary. DC Earth is completely unaware of the invaders until they make their presence known.

Team KMC

Tony Stark- Extremis Iron Man
Badabing - Hulk
Id - God-Like Cable
RageOfOlympus - Thor with Belt of Strength
Parmaniac - Sentry (without void)
Dmills - Nova
Leonidas - Sersi
King Mungi - Talisman

Also, to help offset the in-depth knowledge the KMCers have of DC's heroes and such, the Spectre puts the equivalent of the "Mark of Cain" on the team that labels them as "villains" to any Marvel hero they encounter.

Can these 8 KMCers do it?

*sidenote: All KMCers that are part of the KMC DC Team have taken the abilities of the heroes they are representing, but those heroes are still on DC Earth.

Is someone going to be a DC hero defending that Earth like you did in the other thread?

(if so, I call Swamp Thing)

Bada smash teh puny earth!!!
durhulk

h1 Superman combo ko.

Honestly, I think the KMC DC Team has a better shot than the KMC Marvel Team, and not just because I'm on it.

Though, if I was on KMC Marvel as Dr. Doom, this would be colossal spite. biscuits

I grow trees inside your guts, send your souls to the afterlife, and then make 3 billion bodies to have simultaneously freaky plant-sex with every woman on DC Earth

Originally posted by Endless Mike
I grow trees inside your guts, send your souls to the afterlife, and then make 3 billion bodies to have simultaneously freaky plant-sex with every woman on DC Earth
So what's new?

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Honestly, I think the KMC DC Team has a better shot than the KMC Marvel Team, and not just because I'm on it.

Why?

Originally posted by Blair Wind
Why?

I think overall, Team KMC DC packs a lot more open ended abilities and power levels. Plus there's the fact that, generally, DC Earth is stronger than Marvel Earth.

Of course, that's off set with the number of prep gods on Marvel Earth as opposed to DC.

^ Assuming we are using pre-Flashpoint DC earth, I agree.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Bada smash teh puny earth!!!
durhulk ^^This.

I'm Thor? DC Earth is fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck*d.

First thing I'm doing is killing Superman and raping Wonder Woman. Is that weird?

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I'm Thor?
You aren't? And here I thought that you're really a thunder god.

Originally posted by Badabing
^^This.
Of course, but pr says that "Bada has puny arms".

Why did you give Bada a downgrade?

Originally posted by Digi
Why did you give Bada a downgrade?

I see I did not merit an invitation to this team uhuh

Originally posted by Newjak
I see I did not merit an invitation to this team uhuh



You almost did. But I had already told Badabing I'd give him Hulk. Couldn't justify having both Hulk AND Juggernaut.

Id (X-man) almost made it too.

Originally posted by Blair Wind


You almost did. But I had already told Badabing I'd give him Hulk. Couldn't justify having both Hulk AND Juggernaut.

Id (X-man) almost made it too. I could have been FP Kuurth and provided Magical aid, and muscle

But I understand.

I don't think the team has much a chance really.

I think the DC Team had more characters equipped for this type of thing.

This team will have to be really cautious if they even have a chance.

Originally posted by Digi
Why did you give Bada a downgrade? like xgrinw00t

I'm a lady? Interesting sex education is full of crap then.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I'm Thor? DC Earth is fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck*d.

First thing I'm doing is killing Superman and raping Wonder Woman. Is that weird?

Before or after I sprout a tree in your brain?

Originally posted by Blair Wind
This is a nod to an old thread by Darthgoober:

The Grandmaster decides to make his current bet with the Spectre more interesting (this bet: http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=563916 ). So he decides that he will send 8 KMCer's to DC Earth to see if they can conquer it. He sticks them into a machine that gives them the powers/abilities of some of the characters from the Marvel universe.

Consider them an amalgam complete in every way just the KMCer is in control.

He then gives them a challenge: the 8 of them have 3 years to completely conquer DC Earth (in addition, all 4 human Green Lanterns on Earth with Kilowog who came to visit, and Endless Mike is controlling Swamp Thing) using whatever means are necessary. DC Earth is completely unaware of the invaders until they make their presence known.

Team KMC

Tony Stark- Extremis Iron Man
Badabing - Hulk
Id - God-Like Cable
RageOfOlympus - Thor with Belt of Strength
Parmaniac - Sentry (without void)
Dmills - Nova
Leonidas - Sersi
King Mungi - Talisman

Also, to help offset the in-depth knowledge the KMCers have of DC's heroes and such, the Spectre puts the equivalent of the "Mark of Cain" on the team that labels them as "villains" to any Marvel hero they encounter.

Can these 8 KMCers do it?

*sidenote: All KMCers that are part of the KMC DC Team have taken the abilities of the heroes they are representing, but those heroes are still on DC Earth. New line up.

This lineup is a little more powerful I think. Can they do it?

Originally posted by Blair Wind


This lineup is a little more powerful I think. Can they do it?

Phase 1) Tony and I (WM) start a series of discreet hacks into their defenses. Omac, Lex corp, etc. The WM gathers the appropriate Intel on the biggest hitters most likely to cause a problem.

Phase 2) Run a series of diversionary tactics designed to keep the potential opposition from noticing what we're up to. A page right out of Stormwatch's playbook.

Phase 3) Start precision tactical strikes. I want Luthor, Mister Terrific and Batman dead. They're the most dangerous to our plans, so they go first. Since I'm the fastest on my team, I do the dirty work myself via a series of snatch and grab speed blitzes from high orbit. Meanwhile, we send out Rage/Thor, Leo/Sersi and Talisman to take out Supes, and ID/god like Cable and Parmaniac/Sentry kill Diana to death. No need for grandiose tough guy one on one battles, this is a damn military op, and all is fair in war. I want the DC Trinity dead.

Phase 4) Activate Omac's. Tony and WM have taken over all of that shyte, now its time to put it to use.

Phase 5) Get some sleep, I'm too tired to think of anything else right now lol.

Originally posted by dmills
Phase 1) Tony and I (WM) start a series of discreet hacks into their defenses. Omac, Lex corp, etc. The WM gathers the appropriate Intel on the biggest hitters most likely to cause a problem.

Phase 2) Run a series of diversionary tactics designed to keep the potential opposition from noticing what we're up to. A page right out of Stormwatch's playbook.

Phase 3) Start precision tactical strikes. I want Luthor, Mister Terrific and Batman dead. They're the most dangerous to our plans, so they go first. Since I'm the fastest on my team, I do the dirty work myself via a series of snatch and grab speed blitzes from high orbit. Meanwhile, we send out Rage/Thor, Leo/Sersi and Talisman to take out Supes, and ID/god like Cable and Parmaniac/Sentry kill Diana to death. No need for grandiose tough guy one on one battles, this is a damn military op, and all is fair in war. I want the DC Trinity dead.

Phase 4) Activate Omac's. Tony and WM have taken over all of that shyte, now its time to put it to use.

Phase 5) Get some sleep, I'm too tired to think of anything else right now lol.

Tree/brain. You dead.

Originally posted by dmills
Phase 3) Start precision tactical strikes. I want Luthor, Mister Terrific and Batman dead. They're the most dangerous to our plans, so they go first. Since I'm the fastest on my team, I do the dirty work myself via a series of snatch and grab speed blitzes from high orbit.

Terrific usually hangs out in the Brownstone with the JSA, who have more than enough firepower to take you out if you tried.

No Naija Boy as Silver Surfer= Fail

It's pretty hard to use Sentry without Void a lot of good/exotic feats were under the void influence plus of course the whole mental instability thing.

Trees in the brain for all

Originally posted by dmills
Phase 1) Tony and I (WM) start a series of discreet hacks into their defenses. Omac, Lex corp, etc. The WM gathers the appropriate Intel on the biggest hitters most likely to cause a problem.

Phase 2) Run a series of diversionary tactics designed to keep the potential opposition from noticing what we're up to. A page right out of Stormwatch's playbook.

Phase 3) Start precision tactical strikes. I want Luthor, Mister Terrific and Batman dead. They're the most dangerous to our plans, so they go first. Since I'm the fastest on my team, I do the dirty work myself via a series of snatch and grab speed blitzes from high orbit. Meanwhile, we send out Rage/Thor, Leo/Sersi and Talisman to take out Supes, and ID/god like Cable and Parmaniac/Sentry kill Diana to death. No need for grandiose tough guy one on one battles, this is a damn military op, and all is fair in war. I want the DC Trinity dead.

Phase 4) Activate Omac's. Tony and WM have taken over all of that shyte, now its time to put it to use.

Phase 5) Get some sleep, I'm too tired to think of anything else right now lol. Someone's been watching Sherlock Holmes...

Originally posted by Cogito
Terrific usually hangs out in the Brownstone with the JSA, who have more than enough firepower to take you out if you tried.

You think I'm going after him while he's with the jla? Hahahahaha!

I am not sure how to play this game but here goes.

Originally posted by dmills
Phase 1) Tony and I (WM) start a series of discreet hacks into their defenses. Omac, Lex corp, etc. The WM gathers the appropriate Intel on the biggest hitters most likely to cause a problem.


Yeah, we need a list of who the heavy hitters are on DC Earth. Our starting base of operation should be Cables Space station. Providence/Graymalkin gives Tony & Richard, plenty of future/celestial tech to play with.

I would also suggest we let Cable, and Tony create a Cerebra unit to amplify his psionic powers.


Originally posted by dmills
Phase 2) Run a series of diversionary tactics designed to keep the potential opposition from noticing what we're up to. A page right out of Stormwatch's playbook.
I have a better one. Prep to create two global scale crisis. Have Tony, and Cable weaponize the Facade Virus, and Transmode Virus.
Once programed, and weaponized. Tony with the help of Sersi, can easily recreate a deliverance device for the Facade Virus. And set up towers to unleash the Transmode Virus.

Originally posted by dmills

Phase 3) Start precision tactical strikes. I want Luthor, Mister Terrific and Batman dead. They're the most dangerous to our plans, so they go first. Since I'm the fastest on my team, I do the dirty work myself via a series of snatch and grab speed blitzes from high orbit. Meanwhile, we send out Rage/Thor, Leo/Sersi and Talisman to take out Supes, and ID/god like Cable and Parmaniac/Sentry kill Diana to death. No need for grandiose tough guy one on one battles, this is a damn military op, and all is fair in war. I want the DC Trinity dead.

If we can replicate the feat done by Cable, and infect the world via the Facade Virus. It will allow us to have complete control of every being down to its cellular structure. We can shut off any meta humans super ability, or turn them into jelly mosh.

Taking notes from Annihilation: Conquest. The Transmode Virus can infect via physical touch, or via the network. Everything infected can be easily overturned to our command. Its extremely viral, and can consume entire solar systems within days (?).

Both tactical crisis easily play into your game plan. I would suggest outfitting Cable's "Dominus Objective". The purpose of the this tech is to, lay open any network disregarding what kind of security measures they have up. Cutting down the time to hack important. That, and the threat of the Transmode Virus will severely hinder the Networks resources. Richard, and Worldmind know this first hand.
Originally posted by dmills

Phase 4) Activate Omac's. Tony and WM have taken over all of that shyte, now its time to put it to use

If the Facde Virus is a successes. It will reduce the threat of Meta Humans to single digits. Cable can easily ionize the planet with its telepathic waves. Therefore connect to every-mind on the planet. And just as easily overtake all the DC heavy hitters, and place them under his control.
Not only would you know have Transmode Viral Omacs on the loose, but an army of Meta Humans under our control.

Originally posted by dmills

Phase 5) Get some sleep, I'm too tired to think of anything else right now lol.
God Like Cable doesn't rest. And with that said, we still have a long list of unknown variables. And there is some strong magical forces/items to be dealt with. We need to identify who they are, and who tackle them with Talsiman and Hulk.

IIRC, the female Talisman sports magical immunity to a degree, or is a magic sponge (?) (K-M would know). And that is a huge asset, if you want to tackle the DC Earth, who are heavy on magic.

That and some pending business. After the Trio. We still have 4 Lanterns, Plus Swamp Thing to deal with.

Yeah with all that said and done. When ready, going with a surprise global crisis, and weaponizing Facde/Transmode virus. Allows us to hold DC Earth by the balls.

Originally posted by "Id"
I am not sure how to play this game but here goes.



Yeah, we need a list of who the heavy hitters are on DC Earth. Our starting base of operation should be Cables Space station. Providence/Graymalkin gives Tony & Richard, plenty of future/celestial tech to play with.

I would also suggest we let Cable, and Tony create a Cerebra unit to amplify his psionic powers.



I have a better one. Prep to create two global scale crisis. Have Tony, and Cable weaponize the Facade Virus, and Transmode Virus.
Once programed, and weaponized. Tony with the help of Sersi, can easily recreate a deliverance device for the Facade Virus. And a Tower to unleash the Transmode Virus.


If we can replicate the feat done by Cable, and infect the world via the Facade Virus. It will allow us to have complete control of every being down to its cellular structure. We can shut off any meta humans super ability, or turn them into jelly mosh.

Taking notes from Annihilation: Conquest. The Transmode Virus can infect via physical touch, or via the network. Everything infected can be easily overturned to our command. Its extremely viral, and can consume entire solar systems within days (?).

Both tactical crisis easily play into your game plan. I would suggest outfitting Cable's "Dominus Objective". The purpose of the this tech is to, lay open any network disregarding what kind of security measures they have up. Cutting down the time to hack important. That, and the threat of the Transmode Virus will severely hinder the Networks resources. Richard, and Worldmind know this first hand.

If the Facde Virus is a successes. It will reduce the threat of Meta Humans to single digits. Cable can easily ionize the planet with its telepathic waves. Therefore connect to everymind on the planet. And just as easily overtake all the DC heavy hitters, and place them under his control.
Not only would you know have Trnasmode Viral Omacs on the loose, but an army of Meta Humans under our control.


God Like Cable doesn't rest. And with that said, we still have a long list of unknown variables. And there is some strong magical forces/items to be dealt with. We need to identify who they are, and who tackle them with Talsiman and Hulk.

IIRC, the female Talisman sports magical immunity to a degree, or is a magic sponge (?) (K-M would know). And that is a huge asset, if you want to tackle the DC Earth, who are heavy on magic.

That and some pending business. After the Trio. We still have 4 Lanterns, Plus Swamp Thing to deal with.

Yeah with all that said and done. When ready, going with a surprise global crisis, and weaponizing Facde/Transmode virus. Allows us to hold DC Earth by the balls.

I think Endless Mike has a response to this.

Originally posted by "Id"
I am not sure how to play this game but here goes.



Yeah, we need a list of who the heavy hitters are on DC Earth. Our starting base of operation should be Cables Space station. Providence/Graymalkin gives Tony & Richard, plenty of future/celestial tech to play with.

I would also suggest we let Cable, and Tony create a Cerebra unit to amplify his psionic powers.



I have a better one. Prep to create two global scale crisis. Have Tony, and Cable weaponize the Facade Virus, and Transmode Virus.
Once programed, and weaponized. Tony with the help of Sersi, can easily recreate a deliverance device for the Facade Virus. And set up towers to unleash the Transmode Virus.


If we can replicate the feat done by Cable, and infect the world via the Facade Virus. It will allow us to have complete control of every being down to its cellular structure. We can shut off any meta humans super ability, or turn them into jelly mosh.

Taking notes from Annihilation: Conquest. The Transmode Virus can infect via physical touch, or via the network. Everything infected can be easily overturned to our command. Its extremely viral, and can consume entire solar systems within days (?).

Both tactical crisis easily play into your game plan. I would suggest outfitting Cable's "Dominus Objective". The purpose of the this tech is to, lay open any network disregarding what kind of security measures they have up. Cutting down the time to hack important. That, and the threat of the Transmode Virus will severely hinder the Networks resources. Richard, and Worldmind know this first hand.

If the Facde Virus is a successes. It will reduce the threat of Meta Humans to single digits. Cable can easily ionize the planet with its telepathic waves. Therefore connect to every-mind on the planet. And just as easily overtake all the DC heavy hitters, and place them under his control.
Not only would you know have Transmode Viral Omacs on the loose, but an army of Meta Humans under our control.


God Like Cable doesn't rest. And with that said, we still have a long list of unknown variables. And there is some strong magical forces/items to be dealt with. We need to identify who they are, and who tackle them with Talsiman and Hulk.

IIRC, the female Talisman sports magical immunity to a degree, or is a magic sponge (?) (K-M would know). And that is a huge asset, if you want to tackle the DC Earth, who are heavy on magic.

That and some pending business. After the Trio. We still have 4 Lanterns, Plus Swamp Thing to deal with.

Yeah with all that said and done. When ready, going with a surprise global crisis, and weaponizing Facde/Transmode virus. Allows us to hold DC Earth by the balls.

The swamp thing is a big problem. I'm not even sure bfr is an option. Talisman will have to cook something up. And it needs to be implemented as soon as we initiate the tactical strikes. I don't want them having a chance to regroup. The strike teams will all hit simultaneously. Taking out Supes, Bats and Diana is just as much about symbolism then anything else because of what they represent. Especially Superman, who they look to when all else fails. Notice the team I picked to take him out?

Originally posted by Blight
I think Endless Mike has a response to this.

mmm I wonder....

Trees.

Brain.

What part of this don't you get?

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Trees.

Brain.

What part of this don't you get? You probably have already smoked certain plants because you keep repeating this like a mantra.

That's because it works. What are you gonna do when your brain rips open from the inside because there's a tree growing in it? You gonna do nothin - you gonna die!

Originally posted by Endless Mike
That's because it works. What are you gonna do when your brain rips open from the inside because there's a tree growing in it? You gonna do nothin - you gonna die! Tell that Sentry after he visited Molecule Man or Morgana LeFray or whatever her name is.

For him and everyone else it doesn't take out immediately, I'll just rip their souls out and send them to Hell

Originally posted by Endless Mike
For him and everyone else it doesn't take out immediately, I'll just rip their souls out and send them to Hell

I'd blast you into ashes and trap your psionic essence inside of a node so that you couldn't reform elsewhere.

I don't believe in hell, argument defeated.

Kudos to Dmills and Id for strategizing.

Wonder what other ideas your team can come up with. I personally think it can be done and I have some ideas of my own (especially concerning Iron Man), but I'll stay out of it for now.

Originally posted by dmills
I'd blast you into ashes and trap your psionic essence inside of a node so that you couldn't reform elsewhere.

Better than you have tried. I shift out of phase with space-time and lock you inside a Twilight novel. (Yes, ST can enter and exit fictional realities and manipulate them).

Originally posted by Blair Wind
Kudos to Dmills and Id for strategizing.

Wonder what other ideas your team can come up with. I personally think it can be done and I have some ideas of my own (especially concerning Iron Man), but I'll stay out of it for now. Honestly, using Sentry without Void is kinda iffy, because after defeating MM he said now he knows how his powers work but he had black void eyes though before that he was subconciously using these powers to manifest other powers (heat vision, ressurrect people) those powers were crippled by his mental state which wouldn't be the case in my case.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Better than you have tried. I shift out of phase with space-time and lock you inside a Twilight novel. (Yes, ST can enter and exit fictional realities and manipulate them).

But before you phase shift, you realize that you're powerless because I've sent cable back in time to make sure the man that you believe yourself to be, Alex Holland, never gets to die in that chemical explosion. Then you know the truth; I'm Nova Prime. There is no one better then me sneer.




Yes I just pulled that out of my buttocks.

Originally posted by Parmaniac
Honestly, using Sentry without Void is kinda iffy, because after defeating MM he said now he knows how his powers work but he had black void eyes though before that he was subconciously using these powers to manifest other powers (heat vision, ressurrect people) those powers were crippled by his mental state which wouldn't be the case in my case.

I said no Void because I didn't want his more haxx abilities to come up. Use what you think are average-good showings for Sentry and go from there.

Originally posted by dmills
But before you phase shift, you realize that you're powerless because I've sent cable back in time to make sure the man that you believe yourself to be, Alex Holland, never gets to die in that chemical explosion. Then you know the truth; I'm Nova Prime. There is no one better then me sneer.



That might work...

if it wasn't for the fact that Alec Holland/Swamp Thing exists in a stable time loop, after being sent back in time by the Dominators during the Invasion crossover, and eventually created the first member of the Parliament of Trees, who created all of the other plant elementals and transformed Alec into Swamp Thing in the first place. So I'm immune to time****ery.

http://www.internationalhero.co.uk/s/swampthing4.jpg

Try again

@Parmaniac,

Why not just roll with his depiction in the first couple of minies?

Originally posted by Endless Mike
That might work...

if it wasn't for the fact that Alec Holland/Swamp Thing exists in a stable time loop, after being sent back in time by the Dominators during the Invasion crossover, and eventually created the first member of the Parliament of Trees, who created all of the other plant elementals and transformed Alec into Swamp Thing in the first place. So I'm immune to time****ery.

http://www.internationalhero.co.uk/s/swampthing4.jpg

Try again

Then we bribe you with the promise to give you a lifetimes supply of top flight fertilizer. You wouldn't be able to resist


Where the hell is Km? I need that Talisman talent ASAP.

Throw in Gamora's home planet and you have a deal

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Throw in Gamora's home planet and you have a deal

Fine. And we'll make sure not to harm too much plant life during our takeover.

Originally posted by dmills
Fine. And we'll make sure not to harm too much plant life during our takeover.

That's all I ask

Originally posted by Endless Mike
That's all I ask

Nice doing business with you

Originally posted by dmills
The swamp thing is a big problem. I'm not even sure bfr is an option. Talisman will have to cook something up. And it needs to be implemented as soon as we initiate the tactical strikes. I don't want them having a chance to regroup. The strike teams will all hit simultaneously. Taking out Supes, Bats and Diana is just as much about symbolism then anything else because of what they represent. Especially Superman, who they look to when all else fails. Notice the team I picked to take him out?
We've been brain storming. But I really like the idea of using the Facade, and transmode Virus as a tactical divergence.

My character has poor interactions with with paranormal/mystic side. Thats cut out for K-M, and Rage to deal with Swamp Thing, and the likes. Though I do wonder what would happen if Swamp Thing gets infected by the T.O.?

You know what, phuck you, BW.

Haven't included me in any of your threads.

Originally posted by Mindset
You know what, phuck you, BW.

Haven't included me in any of your threads.

Your Doom would make it a spite thread. You have to understand, I wanted it to be a challenge.

Originally posted by "Id"
We've been brain storming. But I really like the idea of using the Facade, and transmode Virus as a tactical divergence.

My character has poor interactions with with paranormal/mystic side. Thats cut out for K-M, and Rage to deal with Swamp Thing, and the likes. Though I do wonder what would happen if Swamp Thing gets infected by the T.O.?

Sure. That'll work

Mines has some decent showings, though nothing on the level of what a DC elemental brings to the table. Thor does offer some exotic tricks, but talisman is probably the key here. Unfortunately I know very little about her. KM?

I just make a new body that's not infected

Originally posted by Endless Mike
I just make a new body that's not infected

We already made a deal lol.

@ID,

I've pulled up some Swamp thing stuff on my computer. I'll be reading it tonight. I'm also re-reading War of the Supermen and Reign of Tangent Superman.

Sersi, Stark and Cable can do a lot under the radar given the prep time. Hulk could help too if reverting back to Banner is allowed. Otherwise I just smash! Not sure if we could take over DC Earth though. I'm sure Bats, Luther, Mr. Terrific, mystics, etc would be aware of our presence within the 3 years.

... I don't exist in Blair Wind's mind.

K-M

DA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA MEEEEEE!
------
Alright folks, since Swamp Thing is magical he is the worst person to go up against Talisman. Any kind of magic she can absorb or simply cancel it out.

Here even before she gained the Talisman of Power she shows she can absorb the mystical energies even from the Elder God, Ranaq and send it right back at him stronger then before

1. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight18-19.jpg
2. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight18-20.jpg
3. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight18-21.jpg

Now gaining the Talisman of Power and wearing it for the first time, she repeats the same trick on Ranaq again

1. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight19-18.jpg
2. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight19-19.jpg

Even here an inexperienced Talisman easily cancels Loki's spell that altered humans into gods.Loki's spell was destroying the magic in the land nearly killing Snowbird and Shaman, but his spell never worked on Talisman

1. http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l107/A_Flight11/X-Men_Alpha_Flight_002-08.jpg
2. http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l107/A_Flight11/X-Men_Alpha_Flight_002-09.jpg

I can go on further with her magic cancellation skills, but another little habit she has is she is the Spirtbinder. What is that? Well that means she is the outright master of ALL spirits. She could summon all the undead souls as an army. For instance here is the spirit of time and space

1. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight81-01.jpg
2. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight81-02.jpg
3. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight81-03.jpg
4. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight81-06.jpg
5. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight81-14.jpg
6. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight81-18.jpg
7. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight81-19.jpg
8. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight81-21.jpg
9. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight81-22.jpg
10. http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e54/A_Flight6/AlphaFlight81-23.jpg

Now is Swamp Thing from the spirit realm? some could argue that. That's another weakness as here is the inferior Talisman II controlling and outright commanding the Great Beast avatars merely because they were from the spirit realm. She could summon them to fight for her, or potentially just take over Swamp Thing.

1. http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g159/A_Flight9/AlphaFlight38-17.jpg
2. http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g159/A_Flight9/AlphaFlight38-18.jpg
3. http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g159/A_Flight9/AlphaFlight38-19.jpg
4. http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g159/A_Flight9/AlphaFlight38-20.jpg

Swamp Thing....meet Tundra
1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/AlphaFlight01-22.jpg

So with three years prep Talisman could absorb a great deal of magic making her (I guess me) stronger and the ability to summon a powerful undead army.

I'll make a bit of research on Sentry's powers without void and bump this when I'm finished.

But I already see a few obstacles like Spectre and 1 or 2 others that are pretty much impossible to overcome.

One could argue Talisman could manipulate the human host (Spectre) with her abilities

Originally posted by Parmaniac
I'll make a bit of research on Sentry's powers without void and bump this when I'm finished.

But I already see a few obstacles like Spectre and 1 or 2 others that are pretty much impossible to overcome.

Idk if Blair has him involved. I hope not. Bad enough we have to deal with Swamp thing.

Originally posted by -K-M-
One could argue Talisman could manipulate the human host (Spectre) with her abilities

Hopefully it won't even come to that. Let's wait on Blair's take on if the specter is in this.

Originally posted by dmills
We already made a deal lol.

That was before Id started plotting against me again

Also, trying to use magic against Swamp Thing is not likely to work, unless you're at least Spectre level:

http://i272.photobucket.com/albums/jj172/galan007_pics/abilities_magic1.jpg

And even that is no guarantee:

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv95/galanphotos/st_arcane16.jpg
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv95/galanphotos/st_arcane4.jpg
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv95/galanphotos/st_arcane5.jpg

ST's elemental powers are of divine nature, they are beyond what is normally thought of as magic...

Talisman from 20,000 years ago is responsible for beating Llan. She can be....
http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/MysticArcana_TheBookofMagic2007_23.jpg

Meh! Don't see why Swamp Thing would beyond Talisman, especially since she is divine herself. She is actually the Native-American messiah

Talisman is a mortal channel that the gods can fight the evil ones:
1. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight72-20.jpg

She's important to the Rules of Engagement created by Eternity
1. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight72-15.jpg
2. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight72-16.jpg
3. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight72-21.jpg

Dr.Strange calls the Talisman "a primal force of nature"
1. http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l107/A_Flight11/AlphaFlight78-10.jpg

Snowbird and Shaman telling Talisman she is the chosen one, coined the Native American messiah
1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/AlphaFlight020Pg.jpg

Talisman finally fulfills her destiny and dons the Talisman of power, even Snowbird a goddess bows before her
1. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight19-03.jpg
2. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight19-04.jpg
3. http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c120/A_Flight2/AlphaFlight19-05.jpg


She has beaten skyfathers, and can outright control them. Plus with three years prep? Not looking good for Swamp Thing

Originally posted by Endless Mike
That was before Id started plotting against me again



Don't mind ID, think about what pleasures await you...

http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc513/dmills31/gifs/picsay-1335031299.jpg

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Better than you have tried. I shift out of phase with space-time and lock you inside a Twilight novel. (Yes, ST can enter and exit fictional realities and manipulate them).

Talisman can do that too (spirit of time and space) or I just cast a temporal spell of alignment to return everything back to normal
1. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/alphaflightv1087-16.jpg

She is also shown capable of teleporting hundreds of thousands of people into an empty dimension at once. Plus with all that delcious magic I have been soaking up during my prep, all my spells and abilities would be drastically amplified.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
For him and everyone else it doesn't take out immediately, I'll just rip their souls out and send them to Hell

and as the Spirit-Binder I return them back

Elaine Belloc (before she became God but still had control over an entire universe) has trouble with a BABY Swamp Thing:

http://i553.photobucket.com/albums/jj364/galanphotobook/st_baby1.jpg
http://i553.photobucket.com/albums/jj364/galanphotobook/st_baby2.jpg
http://i553.photobucket.com/albums/jj364/galanphotobook/st_baby4.jpg
http://i553.photobucket.com/albums/jj364/galanphotobook/st_baby5.jpg
http://i553.photobucket.com/albums/jj364/galanphotobook/st_baby6.jpg
http://i553.photobucket.com/albums/jj364/galanphotobook/st_baby7.jpg

It also shows that ST can die and still be fine after death

Talisman has absorbed an entire universe (the Void) in seconds into her head. It caused her damage, but that was because she did it so quick. Not seeing anything yet that is beyond Talisman with prep.

Also I strongly disagree she had any serious trouble there

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Elaine Belloc (before she became God but still had control over an entire universe) has trouble with a BABY Swamp Thing:

http://i553.photobucket.com/albums/jj364/galanphotobook/st_baby1.jpg
http://i553.photobucket.com/albums/jj364/galanphotobook/st_baby2.jpg
http://i553.photobucket.com/albums/jj364/galanphotobook/st_baby4.jpg
http://i553.photobucket.com/albums/jj364/galanphotobook/st_baby5.jpg
http://i553.photobucket.com/albums/jj364/galanphotobook/st_baby6.jpg
http://i553.photobucket.com/albums/jj364/galanphotobook/st_baby7.jpg

It also shows that ST can die and still be fine after death
Damn.
Originally posted by -K-M-
Talisman has absorbed an entire universe (the Void) in seconds into her head. It caused her damage, but that was because she did it so quick. Not seeing anything yet that is beyond Talisman with prep.

Also I strongly disagree she had any serious trouble there
Rucking fetarded. How overpowered was alpha flight?

K-M,

Aside from the swamp thing issue, part of the initial plan was to have you as part of a strike team consisting of Yourself, Thor and Sersi to bag Superman. I picked you all due to his magic vulnerability. What's the nastiest thing you could cook up to help kill him to death? Because if Sersi isn't needed here I'd like to put her on the wonder woman imperative.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Damn.

Rucking fetarded. How overpowered was alpha flight?

I was thinking the same thing. Crazy shyte! And to think at one point she was a candidate for the role of sorceress supreme Smh.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Damn.

Rucking fetarded. How overpowered was alpha flight?

Pretty overpowered, Snowbird took on thousands of gods at once in one of her Great Beasts forms. The gods she were fighting even so powerful they were even hurting Demogorge

Then you have Guardian when he was a cyborg built to fight Galactus and actually one-shotted a weakened Galactus.

Shaman is a rival to Dr.Strange

Purple Girl is Purple Man's daughter and is nearly as skilled

Marrina in her ultimate form shrugged off attacks from Thor and the Avengers

Witchfire easily defeated Magik and took over Limbo, and way back when Belsaco (her father) wanted to use her to take over the multi-verse

etc

Etc.

But does she have anything that can stop a tree in her brain?

Not to mention absorbing a universe is easier than taking on a being that can completely control a universe. It's the difference between smashing a huge rock with a hammer and fighting a living rock creature that fights back against you.

He could also take her consciousness and that of her teammates and stick them into the Source Wall (he's been through it and past it before - even Skyfathers can't do that normally).

He can use wood from the Garden of Eden which makes him immune to magic.

And if he wants to use non-magical means to beat her, he can just create a lot of oxygen so she gets hypoxia and then set it on fire (he can manipulate fire as well).

Originally posted by dmills
K-M,

Aside from the swamp thing issue, part of the initial plan was to have you as part of a strike team consisting of Yourself, Thor and Sersi to bag Superman. I picked you all due to his magic vulnerability. What's the nastiest thing you could cook up to help kill him to death? Because if Sersi isn't needed here I'd like to put her on the wonder woman imperative.
You would need some nasty magic to kill him. The guy while weakened has tanked magical blasts which shredded a skyfather to bits and has tanked shazam's magical lightning. You would also need to do it with stealth or you know about his senses, able to see to the end of universe, hear things from space, faster than pretty much anyone not named flash etc. Never underestimate superman.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
But does she have anything that can stop a tree in her brain?

Not to mention absorbing a universe is easier than taking on a being that can completely control a universe. It's the difference between smashing a huge rock with a hammer and fighting a living rock creature that fights back against you.

He could also take her consciousness and that of her teammates and stick them into the Source Wall (he's been through it and past it before - even Skyfathers can't do that normally).

He can use wood from the Garden of Eden which makes him immune to magic.

And if he wants to use non-magical means to beat her, he can just create a lot of oxygen so she gets hypoxia and then set it on fire (he can manipulate fire as well).

The "Spirit of growing things" wouldn't allow it ...plus magical sheilds. She even took a punch from a being that said could destroy a planet and laughed as she absorbed it as he was magical and made her stronger

She had control, she absorbed trillions of spells and artifacts into herself.

Would love to see him try that. Once again using magic only makes her stronger, plus her teleportation skills are one of the best in the Marvel U. In addition with the spirit of time and space and her other spirit minions wouldn't allow that.

So he has prep now too? Also not convinced your previous tactics would even work and as mentioned with all the magic I have been asbrobing and or cancelling makes any attack you do not very effective.

Once again nope, not when she can control the wind spirits, Spirit of the Northwind, fire spirits, oh hell any elemental thing you try to send my way she has a spirit for it. She can manipulate ALL elements, plus you still have to do with the Great Beasts avatar army I summoned.

Originally posted by dmills
K-M,

Aside from the swamp thing issue, part of the initial plan was to have you as part of a strike team consisting of Yourself, Thor and Sersi to bag Superman. I picked you all due to his magic vulnerability. What's the nastiest thing you could cook up to help kill him to death? Because if Sersi isn't needed here I'd like to put her on the wonder woman imperative.

Three words....

Great Beasts summon

Originally posted by abhilegend
You would need some nasty magic to kill him. The guy while weakened has tanked magical blasts which shredded a skyfather to bits and has tanked shazam's magical lightning. You would also need to do it with stealth or you know about his senses, able to see to the end of universe, hear things from space, faster than pretty much anyone not named flash etc. Never underestimate superman.

She has it, and any magic present only makes her stronger. Once again she has beaten skyfathers and outright controlled them. These are the same skyfathers that were taking on the Chaos King and his God Army....and were winning

Originally posted by -K-M-
The "Spirit of growing things" wouldn't allow it

Swampy takes control of that spirit and beats it into submission like he did to Spectre-level Arcane



I mean the universe itself - fighting against someone who controls it like Elaine did.



When Superman was caught in the Source Wall Highfather explained that the normal rules of time and space didn't apply, getting out is more complex than just teleporting and such.



He doesn't need prep, he can go through time to get it, and also go to dimensions like Abaton which are impossible to find if you are consciously looking for them (unless you are Swamp Thing). If his power was able to overcome a Trigon/Spectre level being and smack around Elaine, I don't see your magic resistance being that effective.



Swampy puts them unconscious and dumps them in a fictional reality...

Originally posted by -K-M-
Three words....

Great Beasts summon



She has it, and any magic present only makes her stronger. Once again she has beaten skyfathers and outright controlled them. These are the same skyfathers that were taking on the Chaos King and his God Army....and were winning

So a Thor teamed up with say, a summoned Tanaraq strike team?

Originally posted by -K-M-
Three words....

Great Beasts summon



She has it, and any magic present only makes her stronger. Once again she has beaten skyfathers and outright controlled them. These are the same skyfathers that were taking on the Chaos King and his God Army....and were winning
You know this is superman we're talking about. Beating universal baddies and skyfathers are one thing, beating superman is another. I know talisman is very overpowered but speed kills. How are her stealth powers?

Oh, and I found something else, when Arcane possessed ST's daughter Tefe, he said that Cable's powers (which had boosted him to Spectre level) were "mere parlor tricks in comparison", ST beat Arcane/Tefe as well.

Also I think I might have been underestimating Elaine in that encounter, her powers were compared to Lucifer (like a slightly lesser Lucifer). And keep in mind that was a baby ST, and he only lost because he agreed to it.

The Lords of Hell itself are scared of ST and the Green (this was after Lucifer left, but they've still got multiple Skyfather+ guys):

http://i43.tinypic.com/2wd6d21.jpg

And to top it all off, even the Goddamn Batman himself considers Swamp Thing to beat unbeatable:

http://i43.tinypic.com/11tlogj.jpg

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Swampy takes control of that spirit and beats it into submission like he did to Spectre-level Arcane

Strrrrrrretch! Your going to over-take spirit control from the Spirit-Binder and who can control skyfathers? Not likely.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
I mean the universe itself - fighting against someone who controls it like Elaine did.

Dreamqueen and the Great Beasts. Also your scans you posted was not even a fight nor did Elaine struggle.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
When Superman was caught in the Source Wall Highfather explained that the normal rules of time and space didn't apply, getting out is more complex than just teleporting and such.

I meant you wouldn't even be able to get them into the Source Wall, with prep easily Talisman could prevent that. Also many people have escaped the Source Wall. Even Hank Henshaw tool control over a section of the Source Wall. It's a far cry to what it once was.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
He doesn't need prep, he can go through time to get it, and also go to dimensions like Abaton which are impossible to find if you are consciously looking for them (unless you are Swamp Thing). If his power was able to overcome a Trigon/Spectre level being and smack around Elaine, I don't see your magic resistance being that effective.

So can Talisman, and she actually is the one with prep. So no I don't see that as a viable tactic. Your Elaine feat isn't anything special, nor was it even a serious fight. Once she got serious she easily put him in his place. This is a being that once again has shown on several times to be able to control and overide magic from skyfathers.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Swampy puts them unconscious and dumps them in a fictional reality...

Strrrrrrretch. Try again.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Also I think I might have been underestimating Elaine in that encounter, her powers were compared to Lucifer (like a slightly lesser Lucifer). And keep in mind that was a baby ST, and he only lost because he agreed to it.

and once again, Elaine quickly put Swamp Thing in his place. Not sure why your even bringing it up as it is not as impressive as your trying to make it out to be.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
The Lords of Hell itself are scared of ST and the Green (this was after Lucifer left, but they've still got multiple Skyfather+ guys):

http://i43.tinypic.com/2wd6d21.jpg

as I mentioned many skyfathers are afraid of Talisman too. Next.

Originally posted by dmills
So a Thor teamed up with say, a summoned Tanaraq strike team?

Naaaaa go with Neooqtoq the Ravager

......

Originally posted by -K-M-
Snowbird
(Post-Resurrection)
--------------------------------------------
Battles
---------------------------------------------
---------------------------------------------
Pantheon of Gods
----------------------------------------------
Incredible Hercules #119 (Vol.1) :
Here the God Squad get to the Skrull Gods palace, but it is being guarded by pantheons of Gods from 978 past and present Imperial Worlds that the Skrulls have took over. The team is completely outnumbered and outgunned as even Demorgorge the God Eater was struggling fighting them. It was Snowbird taking the form of Neooqtoq a Great Beast and was taking them all on by herself

1. http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii315/darkseidres2/IncredibleHercules119Zone-Meganpg14.jpg
2. http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii315/darkseidres2/IncredibleHercules119Zone-Meganpg15.jpg
3. http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii315/darkseidres2/IncredibleHercules119Zone-Meganpg16.jpg
4. http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii315/darkseidres2/IncredibleHercules119Zone-Meganpg18.jpg
5. http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii315/darkseidres2/IncredibleHercules119Zone-Meganpg19.jpg
6. http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii315/darkseidres2/IncredibleHercules119Zone-Meganpg20.jpg
7. http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii315/darkseidres2/IncredibleHercules119Zone-Meganpg21.jpg
8. http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii315/darkseidres2/IncredibleHercules119Zone-Meganpg22.jpg

This ST vs Talisman match is turning out to be the most pivotal match in the whole scenario lol.

Originally posted by abhilegend
You know this is superman we're talking about. Beating universal baddies and skyfathers are one thing, beating superman is another. I know talisman is very overpowered but speed kills. How are her stealth powers?

Dude, Supes isn't beating a prepped strike team consisting of Thor, Sersi and a summoned Tanaraq that ambushes him

On the Tanaraq note...

Tanaraq summon's a demon army that actually used to serve Surtur and was responsible for Beta Ray Bill's race being in such demise. Wether or not they truly serve Tanaraq or Surtur is to be determined.

1. http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/OmegaFLight3_15.jpg

Tanraq grants the Wrecking Crew a power boost so they became planet busters and Wrecker showed he was equal to Beta Ray Bill.
1. http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/OmegaFLight3_13.jpg
2. http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/OmegaFLight3_14.jpg
3. http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/OmegaFLight3_15.jpg
4. http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/OmegaFLight3_16.jpg
5. http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/OmegaFLight3_17.jpg
6. http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/OmegaFLight3_18.jpg
7. http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/OmegaFLight3_19.jpg
8. http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/OmegaFLight3_20.jpg
9. http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/OmegaFLight3_21.jpg
10. http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/OmegaFLight3_22.jpg
11. http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/OmegaFLight3_23.jpg


and we have seen Talisman control Tanaraq....TWICE

Originally posted by dmills
This ST vs Talisman match is turning out to be the most pivotal match in the whole scenario lol.



Dude, Supes isn't beating a prepped strike team consisting of Thor, Sersi and a summoned Tanaraq that ambushes him
How are they going to ambush him? By knocking on his apartment door?

So in summary, Talisman with prep is going to be gobbling up magic adding to her own might and with all her summoned minions (even skyfather beings) really doesn't give Swamp Thing much of a chance.

Plus any magic thrown at her she can outright cancel it or use it to make her stronger so any attacks would be faulty as your only adding to the problem ie. making Talisman more powerful.

EDIT: Another thing about the Source Wall, even though Darkseid was trapped in it he was still able to summon avatars to do his bidding. Could I see Talisman do something like that? You betcha! Would post the scans, but seems photobucket has disabled basically majority of my scans from the Darkseid respect thread....lovely.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Oh, and I found something else, when Arcane possessed ST's daughter Tefe, he said that Cable's powers (which had boosted him to Spectre level) were "mere parlor tricks in comparison", ST beat Arcane/Tefe as well.

Also I think I might have been underestimating Elaine in that encounter, her powers were compared to Lucifer (like a slightly lesser Lucifer). And keep in mind that was a baby ST, and he only lost because he agreed to it.

I'm p.sure at that instance Elaine was the guardian spirit of Lucifer's earth, prior to her absorbing Michael's power, and thus is just incarnated in a human body.

She was connected to that planet, but wasn't anywhere near her later power levels...

Originally posted by -K-M-
Strrrrrrretch! Your going to over-take spirit control from the Spirit-Binder and who can control skyfathers? Not likely.

Spectre > Skyfathers



Yeah she did. He snuck up on her, started smacking her around, and only agreed to "die" because she said it was necessary.



Prep but not necessarily knowledge - does she know about the Source Wall? How can she prepare for something she has no knowledge of?



But ST penetrated it back when it was what it once was



He only stopped fighting because he agreed to. She never actually beat him. And ST has shown himself to be above Skyfathers and beyond many times.



He showed the ability to render other elementals and beings like Superman unconscious easily, and in the "River Run" storyline he showed the ability to enter, travel between, and manipulate fictional realities. He could turn the Great Beasts into nothing more than a story.



She detected him and talked things out with him, convincing him he needed to leave. She didn't actually overwhelm him with her power.



Spectre = Cable Arcane <<<<<<< Tefe < ST

Originally posted by abhilegend
How are they going to ambush him? By knocking on his apartment door?

We've prepped for three years brah. We've got Cable, Iron man and Me with the WM. You think we can't cook up a plan to take out phucking superman? Hell some of the peeps on our team could outright beat him straight up or give him hell even without prep. I'm only going this route for efficiency lol.

Originally posted by AlmightyKfish
I'm p.sure at that instance Elaine was the guardian spirit of Lucifer's earth, prior to her absorbing Michael's power, and thus is just incarnated in a human body.

She was connected to that planet, but wasn't anywhere near her later power levels...

That creation was in an entire universe, we saw Lucifer creating it earlier

Originally posted by dmills
We've prepped for three years brah. We've got Cable, Iron man and Me with the WM. You think we can't cook up a plan to take out phucking superman? Hell some of the peeps on our team could outright beat him straight up or give him hell even without prep. I'm only going this route for efficiency lol.
That overconfidence would cost you your victory.uhuh

Originally posted by abhilegend
That overconfidence would cost you your victory.uhuh

Touche.

BTW, the guy I posted earlier who was trying to use magic against ST, he had conquered an entire universe - and he got owned. His plan was also to try to control ST, since apparently ST's power >>>>>>>>>> his universe-conquering power:

http://i41.tinypic.com/2livbcg.jpg

And you know the Black Lantern Swamp Thing? That was just part of the Green that was corrupted and believed itself to be Nekron, and was compared in power to the real thing. The true ST owned him.

So I have no fewer than five examples of universe level beings being challenged/overcome by ST:

1. Arcane/Cable
2. Tefe
3. Elaine
4. Broichan the Druid
5. Nekron/ST

Skyfathers are all fine and good, but can you show me Talisman taking on universe-level (cosmic cube scale) beings?

Also regarding the God Squad, that was kind of jobbing as Hercules managed to kill the head Skrull God. I'm pretty sure ST could beat Herc.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
BTW, the guy I posted earlier who was trying to use magic against ST, he had conquered an entire universe - and he got owned. His plan was also to try to control ST, since apparently ST's power >>>>>>>>>> his universe-conquering power:

http://i41.tinypic.com/2livbcg.jpg

Is he the Spirit-Binder? No. Is he a messiah? No. Has he shown to control skyfather beings? No. Did he have at least three years of prep to take on ST? No. Does he have nearly the feats of say the Beasts (who have taken over a universe themselves) or Talisman? No. Is his powers specfically controlling spirits? No. Is his powers based on strictly controlling magic and is a magical sponge? No.

Originally posted by dmills
Touche.
Just don't give him time to sing, all these would be useless.ahuh

Originally posted by -K-M-
Is he the Spirit-Binder? No. Is he a messiah? No. Has he shown to control skyfather beings? No. Did he have at least three years of prep to take on ST? No. Does he have nearly the feats of say the Beasts (who have taken over a universe themselves) or Talisman? No. Is his powers specfically controlling spirits? No. Is his powers based on strictly controlling magic and is a magical sponge? No.
Just trying to point it out that you are giving skyfather level too much credit.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
And you know the Black Lantern Swamp Thing? That was just part of the Green that was corrupted and believed itself to be Nekron, and was compared in power to the real thing. The true ST owned him.

So I have no fewer than five examples of universe level beings being challenged/overcome by ST:

1. Arcane/Cable
2. Tefe
3. Elaine
4. Broichan the Druid
5. Nekron/ST

Skyfathers are all fine and good, but can you show me Talisman taking on universe-level (cosmic cube scale) beings?

Also regarding the God Squad, that was kind of jobbing as Hercules managed to kill the head Skrull God. I'm pretty sure ST could beat Herc.

FYI, Nekron has been defeated by Captain Atom in the past. Also what specific feats did Nekron have in battle? What unciversal feats did Nekron have? and once again your using the Elaine incident...don't. The others I have not heard, which doesn't give them terribly much credibility as they seem like one-off characters.

I did, Great Beasts, Dreamqueen and Llan.

He didn't beat the Skrull God. It was Snowbird using a bone from Demogorge stabbed him and utlimately killed him. Hercules DID NOT beat him.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Just trying to point it out that you are giving skyfather level too much credit.

These skyfathers were taking on the Chaos King and the God Army and were beating them. They have taken over a universe, and actually have a lot more feats. They get credit, because as shown they have deserved it.

Even Mauvais a being that fought the Ancient One, and in modern times Dr.Strange was terrified he returned from his prison and mentioned he was unsure he could beat him (Mauvais). While Mauvais on the other hand was TERRIFIED of the Great Beasts.

1. http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d187/A_Flight/Wolverine172-20.jpg
2. http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d187/A_Flight/Wolverine172-21.jpg

Dr.Strange on Mauvais
1. http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l107/A_Flight11/Wolverine_165_01.jpg
2. http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l107/A_Flight11/Wolverine_165_02.jpg

Originally posted by -K-M-
Definetly not in the last few years. You would be hard pressed to find a good feat for him.

All this stuff happened way before the last few years.



It was only over because baby ST agreed for it to be. Who knows what might have happened if they had decided to actually fight. And keep in mind this was a far weaker ST.



Is that even allowed? Is she going to summon the spirits of everyone in the multiverse to find out any possible danger that could be put against her?





Many people - such as? Metron and Darkseid considered it incredible that he could.



I'm not using God ST - this was a baby ST. He and Elaine talked it out and he agreed to leave. I don't see how that qualifies as being owned.



What about elemental form Captain Atom and Red Tornado?



So Talisman can solo Chaos King and all of those guys? Why didn't she then?



She did have trouble, he managed to avoid her detection and sneak up on her, knock her down and hurt her, while taking on her companions as well.



Arcane Cable = Spectre:

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv95/galanphotos/st_arcane16.jpg

Arcane Cable falls to Swamp Thing:

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv95/galanphotos/st_arcane4.jpg
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv95/galanphotos/st_arcane5.jpg

Tefe > Arcane Cable:

http://i43.tinypic.com/13za4o1.jpg

As further confirmation, the Lords of Hell believe that with Tefe's power, they cold challenge even Lucifer himself:

http://i39.tinypic.com/vmwu2e.jpg

But, what's this? ST's powers > Tefe's:

http://i39.tinypic.com/112g4td.jpg

Originally posted by -K-M-
These skyfathers were taking on the Chaos King and the God Army and were beating them. They have taken over a universe, and actually have a lot more feats. They get credit, because as shown they have deserved it.

Even Mauvais a being that fought the Ancient One, and in modern times Dr.Strange was terrified he returned from his prison and mentioned he was unsure he could beat him (Mauvais). While Mauvais on the other hand was TERRIFIED of the Great Beasts.

1. http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d187/A_Flight/Wolverine172-20.jpg
2. http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d187/A_Flight/Wolverine172-21.jpg

Dr.Strange on Mauvais
1. http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l107/A_Flight11/Wolverine_165_01.jpg
2. http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l107/A_Flight11/Wolverine_165_02.jpg
Then they aren't skyfathers. I was saying "skyfather level".Originally posted by -K-M-
FYI, Nekron has been defeated by Captain Atom in the past. Also what specific feats did Nekron have in battle? What unciversal feats did Nekron have? and once again your using the Elaine incident...don't. The others I have not heard, which doesn't give them terribly much credibility as they seem like one-off characters.

I did, Great Beasts, Dreamqueen and Llan.

He didn't beat the Skrull God. It was Snowbird using a bone from Demogorge stabbed him and utlimately killed him. Hercules DID NOT beat him.
Wasn't that by some plot device? Tanking shots from the white entity of life and bfring anti-monitor by a gesture. Don't lowball, alpha flight has much more embarassing showings I suppose.

Originally posted by -K-M-
Is he the Spirit-Binder? No. Is he a messiah? No. Has he shown to control skyfather beings? No. Did he have at least three years of prep to take on ST? No. Does he have nearly the feats of say the Beasts (who have taken over a universe themselves) or Talisman? No. Is his powers specfically controlling spirits? No. Is his powers based on strictly controlling magic and is a magical sponge? No.

He can control spirits. I don't see what being a messiah has anything to do with it. He had many years of prep. He can control and absorb magic too.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
He can control spirits. I don't see what being a messiah has anything to do with it. He had many years of prep. He can control and absorb magic too.

Like what? and the messiah goes back to your comment about her powers wouldn't work on Swamp Thing as he is divine

Did he know? Lets see it.

Now show me doing it on the level of Talisman.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Then they aren't skyfathers. I was saying "skyfather level".
Wasn't that by some plot device? Tanking shots from the white entity of life and bfring anti-monitor by a gesture. Don't lowball, alpha flight has much more embarassing showings I suppose.

Yes they are, they are actually Elder Gods if you want to be specific. Anti-Monitor was drastically weakened and during the Sinestro Wars wasn't even on a universal power level before he got mortally damaged by Superboy Prime.

Originally posted by -K-M-
Yes they are, they are actually Elder Gods if you want to be specific. Anti-Monitor was drastically weakened and during the Sinestro Wars wasn't even on a universal power level before he got mortally damaged by Superboy Prime.
That would be right term. He wasn't fully powered and took multiple guardians at once. He was only bfred after getting caught in a galaxy busting concentrated attack and cheapshotted by a PC kryptonian. White entity restored him to full power. Again you are better than lowballing characters.

Originally posted by -K-M-
FYI, Nekron has been defeated by Captain Atom in the past.

With the Quantum Field, IIRC. And ST beat down Captain Atom too.



Nekron is Death, emptiness, darkness:

http://i40.tinypic.com/288pg1j.jpg

He defeated the Anti-Monitor and enslaved the Spectre. He pwned the Guardians of the Universe. The Blackest Night was a multiversal event, Nekron's aim was to extinguish all life in the multiverse. Confirmed by Brainiac 5:

http://i41.tinypic.com/21ca8ig.jpg

And when the Black Lanterns reached Earth-Prime to fight SBP.



I posted them before.



Great Beasts conquered a universe over an unknown period of time - the druids ST fought did it in a few decades at most. Great Beasts are Skyfather level. Need more info on Dreamqueen and Llan.



Really, I recall Hercules winning, but it's been a long time since I read it.

Originally posted by -K-M-
Like what? and the messiah goes back to your comment about her powers wouldn't work on Swamp Thing as he is divine

Did he know? Lets see it.

Now show me doing it on the level of Talisman.

Let's see what? I was just saying that trying to absorb ST's magic isn't going to work because I don't recall his powers being stated to be magic in nature.

ST has also showed the power to distort probability on a quantum level - he can make it so the chances of her powers working are negated.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
All this stuff happened way before the last few years.

I'm well aware, but Spectre in the past even decade hasn't been that impressive. Even Hal Spectre wasn't on the level as his predessor.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
It was only over because baby ST agreed for it to be. Who knows what might have happened if they had decided to actually fight. And keep in mind this was a far weaker ST.

and keep in mind as I mentioned wasn't a fight, nor was Elaine serious until the talk. It's really a non-feat for ST.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Is that even allowed? Is she going to summon the spirits of everyone in the multiverse to find out any possible danger that could be put against her?





Wonders of prep and having the spirit of time and space on your side.

She could use the glass oracle a spell and ritual can see events that transpire in different dimensions. Talisman sits in a Circle of Power and in front of her a large piece of glass shows her events of her wishing.

1. http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g159/A_Flight9/AlphaFlight82-06.jpg
2. http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g159/A_Flight9/AlphaFlight82-09.jpg

or looks into the future

Here the Canadian government storms in on Alpha Flight while their having an important discussion about their future as a team. Talisman knows who is attacking and when they were about to attack, unlike everyone else
1. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-03.jpg
2. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-04.jpg
3. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-05.jpg
4. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-09.jpg

Talisman foreseeing that Alpha Flight would use this building as their base months ago. As she needs to stop the Sweeping Dark
1. http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l107/A_Flight11/AlphaFlight78-07.jpg
2. http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l107/A_Flight11/AlphaFlight78-08.jpg
3. http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l107/A_Flight11/AlphaFlight78-09.jpg


Originally posted by Endless Mike
Many people - such as? Metron and Darkseid considered it incredible that he could.

Yeah in the past, as I mentioned when trapped in the wall Darkseid was still summoning avatars in his image to do his bidding. Others who have crossed or escaped: Yuga Khan, Cyborg Superman, Darkseid, Metron, Barry Allen, Highfather/Zeus/Jove/Ares/Odin. Both of them have escaped the wall, plus Superman. Also didn't ST cross the wall with the help of Metron?

Originally posted by Endless Mike
I'm not using God ST - this was a baby ST. He and Elaine talked it out and he agreed to leave. I don't see how that qualifies as being owned.

No nor do I, but I'm also the one that thinks it's a non-fight nor really impressive. Elaine was not serious nor did she really struggle as you claimed.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
What about elemental form Captain Atom and Red Tornado?

Definetly still above them.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
So Talisman can solo Chaos King and all of those guys? Why didn't she then?

She didn't even appear during Chaos War, she hasn't appeared since Omega Flight.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
She did have trouble, he managed to avoid her detection and sneak up on her, knock her down and hurt her, while taking on her companions as well.

So what? Wolverine has avoided detection from Dr.Strange, but do I think Wolverine is on the same level as him? Definetly not. The sneak attack knocked her down and then she got serious and had the talk and that was it. Non-fight and not as impressive as your claiming.


Originally posted by Endless Mike

Arcane Cable = Spectre:

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv95/galanphotos/st_arcane16.jpg

Arcane Cable falls to Swamp Thing:

http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv95/galanphotos/st_arcane4.jpg
http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv95/galanphotos/st_arcane5.jpg

Tefe > Arcane Cable:

http://i43.tinypic.com/13za4o1.jpg

As further confirmation, the Lords of Hell believe that with Tefe's power, they cold challenge even Lucifer himself:

http://i39.tinypic.com/vmwu2e.jpg

But, what's this? ST's powers > Tefe's:

http://i39.tinypic.com/112g4td.jpg

WOw look at that ABC logic and so you think ST is more powerful then Spectre following your logic then? If so.....think this conversation is done.

Originally posted by abhilegend
That would be right term. He wasn't fully powered and took multiple guardians at once. He was only bfred after getting caught in a galaxy busting concentrated attack and cheapshotted by a PC kryptonian. White entity restored him to full power. Again you are better than lowballing characters.

I'm aware, hell that's what I was saying. He was NOT at his full power, nor was he at his Crisis levels. That's my point. He was drastically weakened and near death when Nekron did what he did so it makes it less impressive. That's not lowballing that's fact.

Originally posted by -K-M-
I'm well aware, but Spectre in the past even decade hasn't been that impressive. Even Hal Spectre wasn't on the level as his predessor.

He still has multiversal feats.



Surviving when she had purged all of the other elementals and spirits, remaining outside of her perception, attacking and hurting her, and having her decide to negotiate with him instead of attempting to force him out like the others are feats.



Has she actually used all of these spirits you're mentioning, or are you just assuming something like "her power is to control spirits so therefore she can just use the spirit of (whatever) to control that thing"?



That says it can only show her some things.



She also says knowledge without power is not enough to win - and ST can distort time and probability so being able to anticipate his actions will be more difficult than she thinks.



Metron took him on his chair but it was ST's power that allowed him to cross it. And ST hadn't nearly realized his full powers yet at that point.



She got knocked on her ass, cursed herself for letting it happen, and then decided to try to talk it out instead of trying to force the issue like she did with the other spirits and elementals.



I wouldn't be sure about that - Captain Atom can recreate the entire universe in the Quantum Field, and the elementals are considered some of the most powerful mystical beings in the DCU. ST was able to own the other elementals at once, effortlessly.



But presumably she's still around, right, so why didn't she stop them if she could?



The fact she decided to talk instead of fight says something.



Not FP Spectre of course, but ST is certainly up there. Besides, you're the only implying Talisman > Chaos King and such.

Originally posted by -K-M-
Sure did, now doesn't that hurt your case that makes him a universal power?

He beat a near death Anti-Monitor hardly as impressive, and Spectre couldn't fight him. That scan is hardly conclusive
Captain atom in quantum field has created and destroyed a universe on panel. Again white entity restored him at full power and then he was bfred by nekron with a gesture. C'mon man.

Originally posted by -K-M-
Sure did, now doesn't that hurt your case that makes him a universal power?

Nekron wasn't as strong back then.



Key words are Earth and mankind. Nekron is part of Death of the entire multiverse.



Okay, can I see some feats from him and Talisman beating him?



He made Spectre into a BL. Brainiac 5 said his power penetrated the multiverse.



Elaborate please.



ST has beaten beings that dwarf Nightmare in power.



Guess I'll take your word for it, but IIRC Herc was getting in some good hits too.

Originally posted by -K-M-
I'm aware, hell that's what I was saying. He was NOT at his full power, nor was he at his Crisis levels. That's my point. He was drastically weakened and near death when Nekron did what he did so it makes it less impressive. That's not lowballing that's fact.

I didn't say he beat COIE level antimonitor

I'm loving this. I think I'll mosy on over to our DC counterparts thread to see if they're carrying on such riveting discussions...

Well either way I'm glad to have an interesting and challenging debate, thank you K M

Originally posted by dmills
I'm loving this. I think I'll mosy on over to our DC counterparts thread to see if they're carrying on such riveting discussions...
Two words, miracle machine.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Well either way I'm glad to have an interesting and challenging debate, thank you K M

Agreed.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Two words, miracle machine.

Good lord.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
He still has multiversal feats.

Who Hal?

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Surviving when she had purged all of the other elementals and spirits, remaining outside of her perception, attacking and hurting her, and having her decide to negotiate with him instead of attempting to force him out like the others are feats.

Except not once here did she have intent to fight and why would she when she sees it's a "baby" as you called him. Not once was she serious about fighting and the talk alone was enough to end it. Not convinced.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Has she actually used all of these spirits you're mentioning, or are you just assuming something like "her power is to control spirits so therefore she can just use the spirit of (whatever) to control that thing"?

Yep, everyone she and Shaman (Talisman II) have used to do their bidding. Also on that note everything that exists has a spirit

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d187/A_Flight/AlphaFlight35-22.jpg

Originally posted by Endless Mike
That says it can only show her some things.

With that particular spell, but with the spirit of time and space she could see everything.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
She also says knowledge without power is not enough to win - and ST can distort time and probability so being able to anticipate his actions will be more difficult than she thinks.

Yeah against Llan who is drastically above Swamp Thing nor does she have three years of prep which she has here. If you didn't give her such a huge amount of prep I would give the nod to Swamp Thing to win, but with her powers and her abilities to prep for three years? Way to much time.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Metron took him on his chair but it was ST's power that allowed him to cross it. And ST hadn't nearly realized his full powers yet at that point.

So he still had help regardless. I believe he could cross on his own, but as I said the Source Wall isn't what it once was.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
She got knocked on her ass, cursed herself for letting it happen, and then decided to try to talk it out instead of trying to force the issue like she did with the other spirits and elementals.

From a sneak attack which didn't cause her serious pain nor did it even cause her rage to even make her want to fight a "baby" as you call him. Not once was Elaine serious, not even during the talk.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
I wouldn't be sure about that - Captain Atom can recreate the entire universe in the Quantum Field, and the elementals are considered some of the most powerful mystical beings in the DCU. ST was able to own the other elementals at once, effortlessly.

Are you talking when CA when to the Wildstorm universe? He was upgraded then. They sure are, but they really didn't have much feats especially elemental Firestorm and even Galan a huge supporter of Firestorm can attest to.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
But presumably she's still around, right, so why didn't she stop them if she could?

Because the writers didn't use her, why didn't the Celestials, Eternity, abstracts etc. fight CK?....because the writer didn't write that

Originally posted by Endless Mike
The fact she decided to talk instead of fight says something.

Not really, was she looking for a fight in the first place? No. She also saw he was a baby a term you coined so why fight a baby?

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Not FP Spectre of course, but ST is certainly up there. Besides, you're the only implying Talisman > Chaos King and such.

Sure is, but from your ABC logic you stated he was and I quote "Spectre = Cable Arcane <<<<<<< Tefe < ST." Wanna retract that statement then?

No I didn't, not once. I said the Great Beasts were fighting and beating the Choas King and his army...which they did until Snowbird stopped them. Talisman wasn't even present during the Choas War.

Originally posted by dmills
Good lord.
That's why I said don't give superman time to sing in this thread.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Nekron wasn't as strong back then.

and where did it say he was drastically amped?


Originally posted by Endless Mike
Key words are Earth and mankind. Nekron is part of Death of the entire multiverse.

Except many people claim to be death that's my point. Did we see any multiversal dealing in Blackest Night? Nope.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Okay, can I see some feats from him and Talisman beating him?

We didn't see the fight with the Talisman from 20,000 beat him face to face. the Talisman from 10,000 tricked him using the spell that the Talisman 20,000 years ago beat him (we saw that fight though) with and the CURRENT Talisman did not beat him face to face. He was defeated when her and Dr.Strange opened up the Gates of Light ultimately cancelling his Army of Darkness and due to the rules placed by Eternity he had to leave and wait another 10,000 years to return. Current Talisman at that time was still very inexperienced and didn;t know she could further tap into the memories of the previous Talisman;s.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
He made Spectre into a BL. Brainiac 5 said his power penetrated the multiverse.

and? As I said Spectre has had incredible low feats, especially during that time. You can agree with that. To what extent though, they never say hence why I said it's inconclusive. People traveling to different universes causes a mutliverse anaomly as noted by Barry Allen when he used to hop around.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Elaborate please.

One beat was taking on thousands of Gods in Secret Invasion, and just 5 (not even all of them) were taking on the Chaos King and his army and were winning.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
ST has beaten beings that dwarf Nightmare in power.

Absolutely, I'm not saying Dreamqueen is on that level but that she has reality warping abilities as she can control her dimension and you mentioned you wanted an example of something doing that.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Guess I'll take your word for it, but IIRC Herc was getting in some good hits too.

He was, but then was starting to lose it and then Snowbird stabbed the Skrull King in the back with Demogorge's spine.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Captain atom in quantum field has created and destroyed a universe on panel. Again white entity restored him at full power and then he was bfred by nekron with a gesture. C'mon man.

he has, but he was also upgraded then.

What multi-verse feat has the white entity done?

Yeah and? What happened when the Spectre tried to fight the King of Tears? Some things he literally can't fight due to the rules. Don't c'mon me, this is in fact stated.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
I didn't say he beat COIE level antimonitor

but as I said he was weakened and near death so what Nekron did was hardly that impressive.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Well either way I'm glad to have an interesting and challenging debate, thank you K M

same to you

Originally posted by abhilegend
Two words, miracle machine.

, which I always wondered what happened to the duplicate Superman created on Earth? It was never mentioned again as far as I recall

Originally posted by -K-M-
Who Hal?

Spectre in general, host or not, over the past decade.



Well if you read the scans all of the spirits and elementals would have been babies too since this universe was rather young, having been recently created by Lucifer, but she had no qualms about forcing the others out. It seems to me that she realized Swampy would be a bigger problem so she tried the negotiation route.



That doesn't mean you can just assume she can pull a spirit out of her ass to do anything she can think of. Could she summon "the spirit of beating the Living Tribunal" and lay the smack-down on ol' three-faces?



Do you have a scan of this? Also in Abaton it would be impossible to find ST if she was looking for him.



I still remain to be convinced of this



As I mentioned, ST can distort time so he could give himself prep in a short time, he can also expand his mind to comprehend all reality.



You think Talisman could escape from it? Or what if all of her teammates get trees in the brain or their souls crushed and then she's fighting alone against Swampy and the rest of DC Earth? (as a side note I'm still not convinced tree in the brain wouldn't work here - even if she can summon the native american spirit of growing or plants or whatever, I'd think ST would be way above that spirit and able to overrule it).



See above



No, he used the Quantum Field to beat Nekron the first time. Elemental Firestorm actually had some pretty amazing feats, like holding the entire universe in his hand:

http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff191/Galan_photos/fs_elemental6.jpg



All those guys weren't on Earth. Talisman was. Cho even asked Hercules if he wanted to summon those guys and he said no... nothing about Talisman. But let me just get something straight: Do you think she could beat CK in a straight-up fight?



Same reason she fought and banished all of the other "baby" spirits and elementals.



But you seemed to be implying that Talisman > Great Beasts > CK. If so I don't see why Swamp Thing > Tefe > Arcane Cable/Spectre isn't just as valid.

There was talk about how would Talisman know all these attacks? Well....the Gods would tell her. Think of it as a mystical wikipedia.

The Talisman feeds the user information and details such as the re-emergence of Alpha Flight's most powerful foe, Llan.
1. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-07.jpg
2. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-11.jpg
3. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-14.jpg
4. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-15.jpg
5. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-18.jpg
6. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-19.jpg
7. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-20.jpg
8. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-21.jpg
9. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-22.jpg
10. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-23.jpg
11. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-24.jpg

Talisman feeding the user information about Llan and the location he teleports them to
1. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight72-03.jpg
2. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight72-07.jpg
3. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight72-09.jpg
4. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight72-15.jpg
5. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight72-20.jpg
6. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight72-21.jpg

Once again Talisman feeds the user information
1. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight73-04.jpg
2. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight73-05.jpg
------
Anywyas I'm gone for the rest of the night and possibly most of tommorow due to work. Not sure when I will be able to reply back. I enjoyed that Mike

Originally posted by -K-M-
and where did it say he was drastically amped?




Except many people claim to be death that's my point. Did we see any multiversal dealing in Blackest Night? Nope.



We didn't see the fight with the Talisman from 20,000 beat him face to face. the Talisman from 10,000 tricked him using the spell that the Talisman 20,000 years ago beat him (we saw that fight though) with and the CURRENT Talisman did not beat him face to face. He was defeated when her and Dr.Strange opened up the Gates of Light ultimately cancelling his Army of Darkness and due to the rules placed by Eternity he had to leave and wait another 10,000 years to return. Current Talisman at that time was still very inexperienced and didn;t know she could further tap into the memories of the previous Talisman;s.



and? As I said Spectre has had incredible low feats, especially during that time. You can agree with that. To what extent though, they never say hence why I said it's inconclusive. People traveling to different universes causes a mutliverse anaomly as noted by Barry Allen when he used to hop around.



One beat was taking on thousands of Gods in Secret Invasion, and just 5 (not even all of them) were taking on the Chaos King and his army and were winning.



Absolutely, I'm not saying Dreamqueen is on that level but that she has reality warping abilities as she can control her dimension and you mentioned you wanted an example of something doing that.



He was, but then was starting to lose it and then Snowbird stabbed the Skrull King in the back with Demogorge's spine.



he has, but he was also upgraded then.

What multi-verse feat has the white entity done?

Yeah and? What happened when the Spectre tried to fight the King of Tears? Some things he literally can't fight due to the rules. Don't c'mon me, this is in fact stated.



but as I said he was weakened and near death so what Nekron did was hardly that impressive.



same to you
I am not talking about wildstorm atom though. Let me check that up. I was talking about what you said that AM was near dead when nekron beat him, he wasn't. Except being the light that created everything in DCU, not much.
I can c'mon you any time I want, you're canadian.sneer

Originally posted by -K-M-
and where did it say he was drastically amped?

The whole Blackest Night thing, threatening the multiverse was putting him on a scale he had never accomplished before.



Brainiac 5's instruments read that Blackest Night affected the multiverse, and the Black Lanterns reached alternate universes such as Earth Prime where they fought SBP.



So she didn't defeat him in direct combat or overpower him, she had to trick him, and had help. ST downright overpowered the druids and Arcane Cable, and BL ST.



In comics, everyone has "incredibly low feats". Trying to bring them up every time you want to discredit a character is bad form.



The Black Lanterns entered every universe, such as Earth-Prime:

http://i39.tinypic.com/xvww5.jpg



Those gods were of unknown power... and if they obviously didn't beat CK so what happened to cause them to lose then?

Besides, the fact remains that the druid conquered that universe in a matter of decades, because it wasn't conquered in the earlier Nightmaster stories.



Yeah but I mean Talisman managing to overpower a universe controller



So the Skrull Gods probably are around high Herald level at best then



Yes but there's also the fact Spectre was made into a BL



Was he really? He seemed to be regaining power and believed he could take on Nekron where so many others had failed.





Thanks

Originally posted by abhilegend
I am not talking about wildstorm atom though. Let me check that up. I was talking about what you said that AM was near dead when nekron beat him, he wasn't. Except being the light that created everything in DCU, not much.
I can c'mon you any time I want, you're canadian.sneer

Please do, be interested

He was near death when he was impriosned in the Black Lantern which was mentioned earlier. When Nekron beat him when he was escaping the Black Lantern he was DRASTICALLY weakened and not at full power as I said.

In the specific universe, didn't say multiverse

and damn proud of it.
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but that's my last post for awhile. Sorry guys.

Originally posted by -K-M-
, which I always wondered what happened to the duplicate Superman created on Earth? It was never mentioned again as far as I recall
Superman is enough powerful without it.

Originally posted by -K-M-
There was talk about how would Talisman know all these attacks? Well....the Gods would tell her. Think of it as a mystical wikipedia.

The Talisman feeds the user information and details such as the re-emergence of Alpha Flight's most powerful foe, Llan.
1. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-07.jpg
2. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-11.jpg
3. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-14.jpg
4. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-15.jpg
5. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-18.jpg
6. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-19.jpg
7. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-20.jpg
8. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-21.jpg
9. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-22.jpg
10. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-23.jpg
11. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight71-24.jpg

Talisman feeding the user information about Llan and the location he teleports them to
1. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight72-03.jpg
2. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight72-07.jpg
3. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight72-09.jpg
4. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight72-15.jpg
5. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight72-20.jpg
6. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight72-21.jpg

Once again Talisman feeds the user information
1. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight73-04.jpg
2. http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/A_Flight4/AlphaFlight73-05.jpg
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Anywyas I'm gone for the rest of the night and possibly most of tommorow due to work. Not sure when I will be able to reply back. I enjoyed that Mike

Yeah but it's stated he comes once every 10,000 years so the gods would know his pattern, and also it said he was causing all of that evil stuff to happen beforehand but Talisman didn't realize he was behind it until much later. I doubt she'd be able to predict every action of ST.

So at the very least, we know that we can keep ST occupied with waves of great beasts and stuff lol.

Now for the GL's... Wonder if the Transmode can infect them?

It's a bit hard to keep someone occupied who can exist in as many bodies as he wants at the same time and fight everyone at once...

Not when you have the Facade, and Transmode Virus rampantly running across the globe.

Green Lanterns have shown the ability to purge nanotech. We've got 5 of them.

ST can also enter and control electrical systems and technology, so I could use your own virus against you.

Transmode is faaaaar more then nanotech though.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Green Lanterns have shown the ability to purge nanotech. We've got 5 of them.

ST can also enter and control electrical systems and technology, so I could use your own virus against you.
Is there anything swamp thing can't do?

Originally posted by dmills
Transmode is faaaaar more then nanotech though.
Fanboy.uhuh

You sure about that? Nova said nanotech was rare in the galaxy, and dangerous.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Is there anything swamp thing can't do?

Inseminate a woman.

That's why he had to possess John Constantine to do it for him.