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EJ
http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/2/27775/637516-emperor_joker_1_large.jpg
ZH Parallax
http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/5/57606/1857106-it_has_a_name003_large.jpg
Hourman 1M
http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/8/83104/1574728-hourman_and_worlogog_large.jpg

vs

Franklin
http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/5/57606/2243166-float007_large.jpg
MJJ
http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/0/77/256192-110299-mad-jim-jaspers_large.jpg
The Marquis Of Death
http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/2/27967/833737-impossible017_large.jpg

Is this H1M with the Worlogog? I ask because of the picture you chooses to post.

Anyway, with the Worlogog in his hand he can take this fight by himself.

Marquis,Jaspers and Franklin win this .

Team Franklin isn't winning against Hourman + Worlogog.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Marquis,Jaspers and Franklin win this .

Go and read what Extant with an incomplete Worlogog was able to do, then you'll realize how badly team Marvel loses.

Is the worlogog here?

It's "standard gear" for Hourman 1 Million, so I don't know why it wouldn't be.

Originally posted by SquallX
Go and read what Extant with an incomplete Worlogog was able to do, then you'll realize how badly team Marvel loses.

I know what he did with the Worlogog+Mobius Chair .

And my opinion still remains unchanged .

Edit : IIRC , the Worlogog is now in Metron's possession , and he no longer trusts Hourman with it . If we are using the latest incarnations of the characters , then the Worlogog can't be presumed to be part of Hourman's standard gear here .

Usually in these types of threads where you have one cosmic entity against a team of other cosmic entities there's someone in the team which would win singlehandedly. In this case Jim Jaspers.

2 + 2 = Fish.

That is all.

Team 1.

Originally posted by Galan007
Team 1. Easily.

Based on what ?

^ Imo, team 1 has better feats (assuming Hourman has the 'gog here.)

Originally posted by Galan007
^ Imo, team 1 has better feats (assuming Hourman has the 'gog here.)

Last I heard , Metron had removed the Worlogog from Hourman , because he no longer trusted him with it .

But still , even if he has the 'Gog , what makes you think it can overwhelm a team of a universal , an above-Abstract and an omniversal reality warper ?

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Last I heard , Metron had removed the Worlogog from Hourman , because he no longer trusted him with it .

But still , even if he has the 'Gog , what makes you think it can overwhelm a team of a universal , an above-Abstract and an omniversal reality warper ? MJJ's omniversal potential is irrelevant. His top feat was warping a universe--and he was also powerless without reality to warp (a 'weakness' none of the DC team share)--so that's how I judge him.

Anyway, Extant used an incomplete Worlogog to created his own universe--and everything in it--from scratch. Feat-wise, that is more than enough to contend with anyone on team 2.

Originally posted by Galan007
MJJ's omniversal potential is irrelevant. His top feat was warping a universe--and he was also powerless without reality to warp (a 'weakness' none of the DC team share)--so that's how I judge him.

Anyway, Extant used an incomplete Worlogog to created his own universe--and everything in it--from scratch. Feat-wise, that is more than enough to contend with anyone on team 2.

MJJ also overcame Matrix-Merlyn , who was an omniversal power . What makes you think that any of the team would be able to capitalize on his UnSpace weakness , the way Fury did ?

Also , Extant used the incomplete Worlogog in conjunction with the Mobius Chair . Not saying that he couldn't have done it without that , just that its what the on-panel evidence shows us .

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
MJJ also overcame Matrix-Merlyn , who was an omniversal power . What makes you think that any of the team would be able to capitalize on his UnSpace weakness , the way Fury did ?

Also , Extant used the incomplete Worlogog in conjunction with the Mobius Chair . Not saying that he couldn't have done it without that , just that its what the on-panel evidence shows us . Omniversal, lol. Anyway a user of the 'gog gains literal omniscience. He would absolutely know about the unspace thing.

Nope, extant only used the chair to gather the pieces of the 'gog that hourman had previously scattered across the multiverse. The construction of a universe was accomplished with the 'gog alone.

Originally posted by Galan007
Omniversal, lol. Anyway a user of the 'gog gains literal omniscience. He would absolutely know about the unspace thing.

Nope, extant only used the chair to gather the pieces of the 'gog that hourman had previously scattered across the multiverse. The construction of a universe was accomplished with the 'gog alone.

Matrix-Merlyn was an omniversal power .
I am not saying that team 1 won't know his weakness , I am saying how will they capitalize on it the way Fury did ?

That is precisely what I mean by "using in conjunction" . It seems that you also didn't read the very next sentence .

^^^

Originally posted by Galan007

Omniversal, lol.

Anyway a user of the 'gog gains literal omniscience.
... literal omniscience, lol.

Originally posted by Galan007

He would absolutely know about the unspace thing.
Which means less than nothing if one doesn't have the power to force him there.

Fury had a plot on his side (immune to Jaspers' warp)
plus durability > Eternity/Infinity ...
plus the inherit power to adapt and figure the win.

Since "literal omniscience" works for DC in this neutral zone,
MJJ's overwhelming nothing stop it Reality Warp is just as viable.

Therefore, he solos the field.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Matrix-Merlyn was an omniversal power .
I am not saying that team 1 won't know his weakness , I am saying how will they capitalize on it the way Fury did ?

That is precisely what I mean by "using in conjunction" . It seems that you also didn't read the very next sentence . by having the power to do so?

This leads me to believe that you may not know what you're talking about. The chair was not used to help construct the universe. It literally had nothing to do with it.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
That is precisely what I mean by "using in conjunction" . It seems that you also didn't read the very next sentence . Unless in this thread the Worlogog is scattered across the Omniverse, and Extant needs to jump around to find it mid-fight, you have no idea what you're talking about.

Originally posted by Galan007
by having the power to do so?

This leads me to believe that you may not know what you're talking about. The chair was not used to help construct the universe. It literally had nothing to do with it.

Prove that they have the power to do so . Otherwise this becomes an NFL fallacy .

Also , most of my knowledge about Extant w/ Worlogog feats is based off the Respect Thread you yourself made :
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f98/t443316.html

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Prove that they have the power to do so . Otherwise this becomes an NFL fallacy .

Also , most of my knowledge about Extant w/ Worlogog feats is based off the Respect Thread you yourself made :
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f98/t443316.html their feats speak for themselves.

Funny that in my thread I flat out stated that extant used the 'gog alone to create the universe. the chair, again, had nothing to do with that.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
If the latest incarnations of the characters are being used here , then the team probably doesn't even have the Worlogog here . if its the latest versions, then mjj is dead.

Originally posted by Galan007
their feats speak for themselves.

Funny that in my thread I flat out stated that extant used the 'gog alone to create the universe. the chair, again, had nothing to do with that.

I doubt that any of them has the power to capitalize on MJJ's weakness .

Also , in your thread :
Originally posted by Galan007
Extant comes back in time, and the heroes find that he has already taken possession of the Mobius chair, and that he is assembling the Worlogog at the end of existence:
http://img63.imageshack.us/img63/3168/extant8yn2.th.jpg

http://img235.imageshack.us/img235/9738/extant9xe3.th.jpg


Extant reappears with the Worlogog/Mobius chair infused with his being...

Extant then erases the moment in time where The Flash (Jay) gained his super-speed, (Extant also pwns Dr. Fate as well):
http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/7044/extant10yb4.th.jpg

http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/6466/extant11rh9.th.jpg


Extant pwns the entire JSA at once, and destroys Hourman's time vessel:
http://img244.imageshack.us/img244/7128/extant12tj4.th.jpg

http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/1012/extant13iu4.th.jpg


Metron was then helpless to watch, as Extant creates his own Universe:
http://img244.imageshack.us/img244/7301/extant14iy8.th.jpg


If left unchecked, this Universe would destroy the rest of existence:
http://img244.imageshack.us/img244/851/extant15is6.th.jpg


Continued....

Originally posted by Galan007
if its the latest versions, then mjj is dead.

If you got confused , then I'll re-specify : the LATEST LIVING INCARNATIONS , WITH THEIR LATEST POWERSETS .

Got it ?

Did you actually read those scans?

Extant never fused with the chair. Dunno why I said that.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller

I doubt that any of them has the power to capitalize on MJJ's weakness .
I agree.

If Matrix/Merlyn could not, neither can anyone else.

It was noted in the arc, that without doubt,
had the Fury not been able to stop Jaspers,
the Omniverse would have been his and not a damn thing anyone could do about it.

To strengthen the Omniversal guardians all powerful Merlyn's words,
we have Cobweb who literally witnessed a future where Jaspers was
not stopped by the Fury.

Of course, exactly what Merlyn said would happen, happened.

In Marvel comics, nothing but the Fury could stop Jaspers,
that's the character, that's the story, that's what it is.

Heck, even in the last arc (Die by the Sword) the stories the same.

MJJ solos.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
If you got confused , then I'll re-specify : the LATEST LIVING INCARNATIONS , WITH THEIR LATEST POWERSETS .

Got it ? so its the mjj/fury amalgam?

Got it.

Originally posted by Galan007
so its the mjj/fury amalgam?

Got it.

Yes . That makes him even more powerful .

Originally posted by TheGodKiller

Yes . That makes him even more powerful .
I'd love to say yep to that but there's no proof.

In the Die by the Sword arc,
MJJ didn't display any of Fury's abilities that MJJ didn't have already:

Trans-dimensional teleportation

Adaptation

Uber Physical durability

(then again, he doesn't need Teleportation
since his warp expands to eventually reach other universes,
he doesn't need uber Adaptation since in his warp he's "God" so all adapt to his will,
he doesn't need Physical durability
since he can reform/restructure himself instantly for lulz) ... he enjoys this actually.

Anyway ...

The only meaning the Fury had in MJJ's character was sub-conscious influence.

This compelled Jaspers to create facsimiles of the Fury, (Die by Sword)
and alter his arm into Fury's blaster canon in HOM which he never used. (years prior)

*** note ***

Don't get me wrong, I'm a realist, it's possible he had these Fury abilities,
but didn't get a chance to display them.

Team 2 wins.

MJJ (especially if it's 616), is pretty much the most powerful one here.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Yes . That makes him even more powerful . Heavens no.

EJ destroyed and rebuilt a universe almost instantly.

ZH Parallax could do the same given time.

Team 1 wins handily.

Originally posted by Galan007
Heavens no.

Maybe . It doesn't reduce his powers though .

Let's be honest, the amalgam wasn't really that impressive at all--certainly not as impressive as Jaspers 'proper' at least.

Originally posted by Galan007
Let's be honest, the amalgam wasn't really that impressive at all--certainly not as impressive as Jaspers 'proper' at least.

I don't see how he was unimpressive in the least bit . He retained his original powerset , and there was no indication that his powers had been diluted or reduced .

I'd say he was at the very least just as powerful , as he had been portrayed in his original appearance in 616 continuity . In fact , w/ the Fury(the only plot-device that could have withstood his power) having been melded with him , he was possibly even more powerful than before .

^^^

The whole story (concerning MJJ)
revolved around the end of the Omniverse once again, (on panel)
and bios confirm that's the cake JJ was going to eat.

Grant it, plot (Fury) stopped Jaspers once again.

But it seemed he was headed in the same direction.

Although I agree, pertaining to cosmic scale feats,
Claremont didn't have JJ doing to much,
unlike Moore who had JJ becoming the universe.

But that's beside the point when Roma and even narration panels,
clearly stated that the Omniverse was about to get wrecked.

Well, at-least he showed us that JJ can take a ridiculous beating,
even getting his soul blown out of his body (disintegrating his brain)
and still keep laughing, and cracking sarcastic pokes of fun.

That aside, like I said,
I never felt JJ got an upgrade from the amalgamation,
if he did,
he didn't show it.

To me, it's the same 616 JJ as before. (God withIN his warp)

** Edit ** Although again, it's quite possible that JJ had Fury's abilities,
and simply was not given a chance to display them.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
I don't see how he was unimpressive in the least bit . He retained his original powerset , and there was no indication that his powers had been diluted or reduced .

I'd say he was at the very least just as powerful , as he had been portrayed in his original appearance in 616 continuity . In fact , w/ the Fury(the only plot-device that could have withstood his power) having been melded with him , he was possibly even more powerful than before . how powerful you think he was intended to be is inconsequential. I'm talking about on panel feats--and the amalgam certainly lacked in that department.

Either way, this debate is already off track. I'm still siding with team 1-- my opinion there won't change.

YES, Hourman 1M gets the FULL power of the Worlogog. Do you think he has a chance without it? lol!

Don't know why the MoD is getting no respect here.

Originally posted by Galan007
how powerful you think he was intended to be is inconsequential. I'm talking about on panel feats--and the amalgam certainly lacked in that department.

Either way, this debate is already off track. I'm still siding with team 1-- my opinion there won't change.

Your opinion is much respected . However , mine won't change either .

^ Yeah, I figured as much. That's why I decided to break the circle right away.

Originally posted by Galan007
^ Yeah, I figured as much. That's why I decided to break the circle right away.
Good man .

Team 2.

Originally posted by Uriel005
Don't know why the MoD is getting no respect here.

I think he's under EJ, TBH.

Originally posted by Golgo13
I think he's under EJ, TBH. meh. could be. Hard to tell when both characters limits really aren't seen. EJ for self herpa derps and MoD getting beaten... by himself/ Reed PIS cannon i.e. taking the collective energy in his fight with himself to beat him... + a super powered Doom to finish the job. would have liked to see him explored more.