Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

1.Regular Sentry vs Regular WW

2.The most powerfull versions of both vs each other

Who wins in each of the above how and why?

Sentry wins both unless he wants to lose, and then he loses but, I guess he wins cause he wanted to lose, right?

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f77/t470247.html

Seriously man do you ever check to see if these threads that you make have already been made? Do you believe that you would be the only one to think of this match?

Originally posted by Stoic
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f77/t470247.html

Seriously man do you ever check to see if these threads that you make have already been made? Do you believe that you would be the only one to think of this match?

Oh no darn it, but honestly i googleed it and also used the search function twice and nothing showed up ....

Diana's lasso is her best (and only) chance against Bob at his higher levels.

Diana beats Sentry straight up.

Question: would her lasso be able to work on something like The Void?

Originally posted by Harbinger
Diana beats Sentry straight up.

Question: would her lasso be able to work on something like The Void?

I think it would, personally. If it worked on FC Darkseid, Ares, Hecate amped Circe, I see no reason why it wouldn't work on the Void.

It would be her only chance, though.

Couldn't he just impaled her with void tentacles

Yes, he could.

Or just pull some plot device power out of his ass ala his fight with Owen.

Would the lasso even work?

As I said, based on who it has worked on, should Diana manage to hog tie Sentry/Void and actively used its power of compulsion/soul searing on him, it should work.

She just has to be willing to go for such a method quickly or wind up getting decimated.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
As I said, based on who it has worked on, should Diana manage to hog tie Sentry/Void and actively used its power of compulsion/soul searing on him, it should work.

She just has to be willing to go for such a method quickly or wind up getting decimated.


Or it could backfire, and make him even more dangerous. Messing around in Bob's mind is never the best thing to do, as your boy Victor nearly found out.

Doom wasn't even trying when he made Bob had a breakdown. If he did, Siege never would have happened.

The lasso is much more potent than merely messing around with his mind. It's a conduit of truth itself and extends beyond the mental and goes into the realm of the soul. So unless Void has no soul to speak of, which is unlikely, should Diana lasso him and use its powers, it's likely to work. Of course, I can see there being backlash ala Ares.

Originally posted by ozz81


1.Regular Sentry vs Regular WW

2.The most powerfull versions of both vs each other

Who wins in each of the above how and why?


1a. Assuming present, DCnU Wonder Woman, Sentry wins.

1b. Assuming "Regular" Wonder Woman 2003-2010, Wonder Woman wins.



2a. Sentry in solid, more or less conventional hero form was described as "the most powerful human being in the universe" by Tony Stark. He's the one who was described as having the power of an exploding sun or some such. But he lost to World War Hulk in a slugfest that burned out his power (World War Hulk #5). THAT version of Sentry would lose to the most powerful versions of Diana, too.

2b. Sentry as The Void. Makes this matchup very confusing. Sentry supposedly disposed of The Void in the sun at some point. Yet Sentry IS The Void. How does that work exactly? I have no idea.

2c. Sentry as "Voidtry". This is the colloquial name given to the Sentry that faced the Molecule Man. THIS version of Sentry, I don't see pure conventional power putting down...

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Doom wasn't even trying when he made Bob had a breakdown. If he did, Siege never would have happened.

The lasso is much more potent than merely messing around with his mind. It's a conduit of truth itself and extends beyond the mental and goes into the realm of the soul. So unless Void has no soul to speak of, which is unlikely, should Diana lasso him and use its powers, it's likely to work. Of course, I can see there being backlash ala Ares.


I believe that when the Sentry became Void, that his Void persona sent Bob into his hidey hole. You know the one that Emma went to when the Void was out of control? I really have my doubts about the lasso working on the Void, because the Void IMO was a living figment of Bob's imagination as strange as that may be to fathom. Wonder Woman would never win, because the Sentry was a cosmic retard on bath salts.

Originally posted by Stoic
I believe that when the Sentry became Void, that his Void persona sent Bob into his hidey hole. You know the one that Emma went to when the Void was out of control? I really have my doubts about the lasso working on the Void, because the Void IMO was a living figment of Bob's imagination as strange as that may be to fathom. Wonder Woman would never win, because the Sentry was a cosmic retard on bath salts.

I don't think the Void would pose a greater challenge to the power of the lasso than the likes of Ares or FC Darkseid. He's not a reality warper like Queen of Fables and really, the only argument for him against the lasso is the possibility he molecularly messes with it, which is something of a stretch.

Couldn't he hit her with a tentacle while in the lasso

Yes.

Diana does use the lasso often, but usually for restraining purposes or as an attempt to drag someone close for melee attacks. She doesn't always actively use its power of persuasion and soul manipulation, which is why people can and have fought her while in the lasso's grasp.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
I don't think the Void would pose a greater challenge to the power of the lasso than the likes of Ares or FC Darkseid. He's not a reality warper like Queen of Fables and really, the only argument for him against the lasso is the possibility he molecularly messes with it, which is something of a stretch.

You may be putting too many eggs in one basket. What happens if she is unable to lasso him because of the beating that he gives her from the jump? You realize that that could possibly happen. The Sentry was not slow by any stretch of the imagination. In actuality the Sentry, and his wild powers make Diana look like a one trick pony in terms of versatility. I mean how would she counter being eradicated on the molecular level?

Originally posted by pym-ftw
Couldn't he hit her with a tentacle while in the lasso

You're really striving for the tentacle rape scene aren't you?

I don't think Jake's argued that Diana can auto-lasso Sentry, only that if she's able to, it probably won't be something he could overcome given the characters that the lasso has restrained in the past.

"As I said, based on who it has worked on, should Diana manage to hog tie Sentry/Void and actively used its power of compulsion/soul searing on him, it should work.

She just has to be willing to go for such a method quickly or wind up getting decimated."

IOW, Void could very well kill Diana via molecular dispersion, or by tentacle rape (since we're going there, it seems) before she lassos him. However, he's screwed if she manages to do so.

Originally posted by Stoic
You may be putting too many eggs in one basket. What happens if she is unable to lasso him because of the beating that he gives her from the jump? You realize that that could possibly happen. The Sentry was not slow by any stretch of the imagination. In actuality the Sentry, and his wild powers make Diana look like a one trick pony in terms of versatility. I mean how would she counter being eradicated on the molecular level?

It's possible to happen, sure. But given Diana's showing against a bloodlusted albeit crazed Superman, I don't see Sentry faring much better than Kal did. If he goes full Void mode, then Diana is pretty much a goner barring a lucky lasso attempt, which is literally the only way she could beat Bob in that form.

In any case, I feel Diana vs. a competent normalish Sentry is a toss up, but Void wins the overwhelming majority against her.

Originally posted by Harbinger
I don't think Jake's argued that Diana can auto-lasso Sentry, only that if she's able to, it probably won't be something he could overcome given the characters that the lasso has restrained in the past.

"As I said, based on who it has worked on, should Diana manage to hog tie Sentry/Void and actively used its power of compulsion/soul searing on him, it should work.

She just has to be willing to go for such a method quickly or wind up getting decimated."

Exactly.

Barring lasso tricks, Diana can't beat Bob at his most powerful.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
It's possible to happen, sure. But given Diana's showing against a bloodlusted albeit crazed Superman, I don't see Sentry faring much better than Kal did. If he goes full Void mode, then Diana is pretty much a goner barring a lucky lasso attempt, which is literally the only way she could beat Bob in that form.

In any case, I feel Diana vs. a competent normalish Sentry is a toss up, but Void wins the overwhelming majority against her.

I can dig it.

I'm thinking over what the most powerful version or versions of Wonder Woman would be.

Coming to mind presently are

1) Wonder Woman, under John Byrne, with the Gauntlets of Atlas, where she shattered a specialized, continually-increasing-in-power Doomsday clone with one punch.

2) Wonder Woman, empowered by the Godwave, as she fought against Rama, who, if memory serves correctly, had the power of the Hindu Pantheon flowing through him. I believe that was the run of Phil Jimenez, but I'd have to check.

3) Wonder Woman, during and after Gail Simone's WW#39.
Not necessarily any more powerful than her normal portrayal of HERSELF during that time, this issue apparently introduced her ability to create or channel Zeus' lightning from her bracelets.

I'd be interested to know how Sentry, even Voidtry, would fare against THAT particular weapon in her arsenal. If indeed that is Zeus' lightning, and it certainly is magic regardless of whether it truly is Zeus' actual bolt or not, it should theoretically have the same top-tier leveling effect as Zeus' Marvel counterpart.

This has some discussion-worthy implications.
For instance, Maestro, an incarnation of the Hulk that had gone insane, was blasted to pieces by a special atom bomb. He eventually reformed from that. World Breaker Hulk, a current form of Hulk, and theoretically one powerful enough to endure that blast and remain whole, was nonetheless struck down when he went against Greg Pak's Zeus.
Skyfather weapons, I have been told relatively recently, outrank even molecule-rearrangers ability to lightly overcome.

So I could see Diana's lightning attack as a 2nd method beside her conventional lasso of taking Voidtry down. She already did so to a being who echoes the overall meme of Void in Cottus, after all...

At his highest levels of power, Void/Voidtry was all but uneffected by physical damage. Yes, he could be damaged and have his flesh and muscles burned off of him, but he would simply regenerate the damage done to him or function regardless of his wounds. Physical trauma/force in of itself I can't see putting Bob down.

The aegis bracelets with Zeus' lightning, I see having a greater effect, but ultimately failing. The collective might of the Avengers + Norn Stones were hurting the Void and presumably were dealing significant damage, but I can't see Diana mustering firepower greater than or equal to the likes of Thor and company or being able to deal enough damage to Void to trigger his transformation back to powerless Bob on her own.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
At his highest levels of power, Void/Voidtry was all but uneffected by physical damage. Yes, he could be damaged and have his flesh and muscles burned off of him, but he would simply regenerate the damage done to him or function regardless of his wounds. Physical trauma/force in of itself I can't see putting Bob down.

The aegis bracelets with Zeus' lightning, I see having a greater effect, but ultimately failing. The collective might of the Avengers + Norn Stones were hurting the Void and presumably were dealing significant damage, but I can't see Diana mustering firepower greater than or equal to the likes of Thor and company or being able to deal enough damage to Void to trigger his transformation back to powerless Bob on her own.

Yeah, you're nearly EXACTLY describing the case of Cottus.
Physical damage, even extensive physical damage from someone stronger than Cottus (Wonder Woman) proved absolutely ineffective, fight was raging even with numerous allies possessing a host of magic weapons, Wondy slinging him around after lassoing him and STILL having little or no effect ...

Zeus' lightning took the thing down, though, even as I imagine Odin himself could probably take down solo a group The Avengers, including even Thor, could not contend with together.


Like I said, though, I really don't know DC Zeus' standing on these forums and thus how his weapons would fare against The Void.

I'll post the following images all the same, though.

Most people don't actually know that Simone gave Diana this power before the end of her run ...

Image 2 of 7.

Notice that, even struggling for breath underwater, Diana has more than enough strength to rip Cottus apart ...

... but that it does almost no discernible lasting damage to the monster.

If anything, it makes the battle harder ...

... until Diana not only employs her lasso ...

(Image 4 of 7)

... and slams Cottus around a bit ...

... but also takes the time to retrieve her bracelets and employ the aforementioned magic lightning.

THAT finally takes Cottus out --

Yeah, Simone's run was pretty cool.

There's nothing that Diana displayed with that power up that leads me to believe her lightning would be significantly more powerful than that of Thor's, which was ineffective until the Norn Stones came into play. Once Void had been through the ringer, he was able to BFR him forcibly and wound up killing him, but that was due to Loki running interference and the aid of the other present Avengers (and a helicarrier to boot).

Diana's Aegis apparently held the Power of Zeus in them, but that's completely different than Zeus himself throwing his power behind his attacks, imo. Captain Marvel's lightning is the direct byproduct of Zeus (the "Z" in SHAZAM!) but I don't think his amped fists or repeated Shazam bolts would do much more than Thor's lightning, either.

And while intimidating, Cottus doesn't really have the feats to put it on the same level as Void.

... and Zeus himself explains why this is so.


(Image 7 of 7.)



Diana versus Cottus
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Source: Wonder Woman #39, Volume 3
Writer: Gail Simone
Penciller: Aaron Lopresti
Date: February 2010
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Wonder_Woman_Vol_3_39

Originally posted by JakeTheBank

Diana's Aegis apparently held the Power of Zeus in them, but that's completely different than Zeus himself throwing his power behind his attacks, imo. Captain Marvel's lightning is the direct byproduct of Zeus (the "Z" in SHAZAM!) but I don't think his amped fists or repeated Shazam bolts would do much more than Thor's lightning, either.

And while intimidating, Cottus doesn't really have the feats to put it on the same level as Void.

Don't know if you're right or not, Cottus I thought of because of his outward physical resemblance to Void, his ability to render physical damage against him virtually useless, and the necessity of special tools or strategy to beat him. For that matter, Diana's Pantheon has indeed lent their own power to her, or the source of it (it's called the Godwave, as mentioned before, and it was loaned to her, by, of ALL people, Ares, Master of War), and her equipment has proven able to contend with their power, such as when she deflects the combined might of ALL of them shooting her at once, back in Perez's run.

Glad you mentioned Captain Marvel.
Think I've seen it mentioned that he actually has a different DC Pantheon back of him, the Roman version of the set, as opposed to Diana's own.
But I was thinking of him as a remarkable illustration of the Lasso's power, perhaps none more striking than the following:

Captain Marvel versus The WonderLasso.


(Green Arrow versus William Batson Jr.)

Image 2 of 3.

Captain Marvel versus WonderLasso.

(Green Harrow versus Billy Batson)


Image 3 of 3.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Source: JLA/JSA Virtue and Vice
Writer: Geoff Johns
Penciller: Carlos Pacheco
Date: December 2002
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/JLA/JSA:_Virtue_and_Vice

Originally posted by JakeTheBank


Simone's run was pretty cool.




Simone wasn't bad; she certainly tried to foster a relationship with her fans. She also upped the ante on Diana's durability.

I don't have the comic where Wondy seems surprised that an arrow was able to hurt her, and realizes it was only able to do so because it was treated with powerful magic, a complete contrast of her durability versus specifically edged weapons to that point but I DO have an ep of her enduring a collision on the point of some mystical, multi-ton beasts TEETH as it slams her into an oncoming subway train ...


http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=13965394


QuetzlotlCollision
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Source: Wonder Woman #40, Volume 3
Writer: Gail Simone
Penciller: Aaron Lopresti
Date: March 2010
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Wonder_Woman_Vol_3_40

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
Simone wasn't bad; she certainly tried to foster a relationship with her fans. She also upped the ante on Diana's durability.

I don't have the comic where Wondy seems surprised that an arrow was able to hurt her, and realizes it was only able to do so because it was treated with powerful magic, a complete contrast of her durability versus specifically edged weapons to that point but I DO have an ep of her enduring a collision on the point of some mystical, multi-ton beasts TEETH as it slams her into an oncoming subway train ...


http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=13965394

It wouldn't happen to be Amazon's Attack would it? The arrows in that were taking out fighter jets.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Yeah, Simone's run was pretty cool.

There's nothing that Diana displayed with that power up that leads me to believe her lightning would be significantly more powerful than that of Thor's, which was ineffective until the Norn Stones came into play. Once Void had been through the ringer, he was able to BFR him forcibly and wound up killing him, but that was due to Loki running interference and the aid of the other present Avengers (and a helicarrier to boot).


Plus - you know - by the writers own account it only worked because Sentry allowed it too...

Okay, Simone was "not bad" by comic book story writing standards, not the real world version ...

Sentry is inconsistent as heck and has a jobber aura that won't quit.

Diana beats him both times, using lasso probably.

Diana 7/10 in the first.

Void 10/10 in the second unless the lasso does its bs

Originally posted by ozz81
1.Regular Sentry vs Regular WW

2.The most powerfull versions of both vs each other

Who wins in each of the above how and why?

1. Regular Sentry will go down.....that's all I'm gonna say with KMC rules!

2. Diana is destroyed.

In either sceneroSentry destroys WW. IMO he is the top of the food chain of the high heralds.

Diana
Sentry/Void

Sentry in both.

Sentry in both.

sentry in both

Originally posted by bluewaterrider


Okay, Simone was "not bad" by comic book story writing standards, not the real world version ...

Both writers before her (*Not* counting AA in that) were popular novelists and a fair bit inferior to hers, and her run's on a similar quality level to Rucka's, and Rucka is also a best-selling novelist. Rucka's a good point of comparison, because he's really good at both novels and comics.

Comic book standards have gotten pretty high over the years, comparable to novel or TV standards (i.e. some great, some not-so-great).



Originally posted by Nephthys
It wouldn't happen to be Amazon's Attack would it? The arrows in that were taking out fighter jets.

Nah, during The Circle when a group of Hippolyta's ex-bodyguards tries to off her.



Also, no idea why AA didn't use purple rays instead of arrows.

Heck, one of the previews had them riding dragons and such rather than just using spears and arrows which, while enchanted, were not the Amazon's heavy weapons when they were doing stuff like fighting OMACs.

Originally posted by Tony Stark
In either sceneroSentry destroys WW. IMO he is the top of the food chain of the high heralds.

He's not getting past her lasso, speed, and skill. She can lasso him everytime if she wants to.

Originally posted by h1a8
He's not getting past her lasso, speed, and skill. She can lasso him everytime if she wants to.


Sorry I don't see that happening... Sentry is as fast or faster than WW

Originally posted by bluewaterrider


Glad you mentioned Captain Marvel.
Think I've seen it mentioned that he actually has a different DC Pantheon back of him, the Roman version of the set, as opposed to Diana's own.
But I was thinking of him as a remarkable illustration of the Lasso's power, perhaps none more striking than the following:

I could be wrong, but wasn't that only the case until after WAR OF THE GODS and the separated Greek and Roman pantheons merged back?

Originally posted by Tony Stark
Sorry I don't see that happening... Sentry is as fast or faster than WW Wonder Womans combat speed is greater

Think I've seen it mentioned that Captain Marvel actually has a different DC Pantheon back of him, the Roman version of the set, as opposed to Diana's own.


Originally posted by Delta1938
I could be wrong, but wasn't that only the case until after WAR OF THE GODS and the separated Greek and Roman pantheons merged back?


Haven't the foggiest. Not a Captain Marvel or Shazam reader.
Also, never read War of the Gods, not the full story at any rate.
Remember searching for it before and discovering it had never been reprinted, at least at that point in time.

You might want to ask over at Comic Book Resources forums.
Some of the people there are amazingly knowledgeable.



P.S.
I'd appreciate knowing your opinion on the matches in the following thread and/or having some of your input there.

Agree with the response I was given? Disagree?

Thanks for your time.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f71/t565671.html

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
Think I've seen it mentioned that Captain Marvel actually has a different DC Pantheon back of him, the Roman version of the set, as opposed to Diana's own.





Haven't the foggiest. Not a Captain Marvel or Shazam reader.
Also, never read War of the Gods, not the full story at any rate.
Remember searching for it before and discovering it had never been reprinted, at least at that point in time.

You might want to ask over at Comic Book Resources forums.
Some of the people there are amazingly knowledgeable.



P.S.
I'd appreciate knowing your opinion on the matches in the following thread and/or having some of your input there.

Agree with the response I was given? Disagree?

Thanks for your time.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f71/t565671.html

I heard Darkseid was responsible for the pantheon splitting into the Greek and Roman counter-parts(to weaken their potential threat), and at the end of WAR OF THE GODS they merged back together. I have WAR OF THE GODS but haven't read it yet. Right now reading UP, UP AND AWAY, will read WOTG next and tell you when I finish.

And I'll check that tread later tonight.

Captain marvel is powered by Lords of order not any pantheon after the retcon in Trials of Shazam.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Captain marvel is powered by Lords of order not any pantheon after the retcon in Trials of Shazam.

So the Lords Of Order were the power source, but mimicking the gods in "SHAZAM" or what?

Originally posted by Zack Fair
Diana 7/10 in the first.

Void 10/10 in the second unless the lasso does its bs

I like Diana as a character but I can't picture any Herald defeating Sentry. Sorry.

Originally posted by carver9
I like Diana as a character but I can't picture any Herald defeating Sentry. Sorry. The implication being that Hulk > Herald level, right?

That is the reason you worded your post like that, correct?

Basically with CM and WW- starting out, they had different gods. Then, after Gods War, they had the same gods for awhile, at least as far as the writers were concerned. Then most recently, there was a retcon with the LoO approximations of gods for CM.

Sentry murders her. And he would, cold psycho.

Originally posted by NemeBro
The implication being that Hulk > Herald level, right?

That is the reason you worded your post like that, correct?

Are you kidding me? He's claimed WBH is on skyfather levels.

Originally posted by PillarofOsiris
Are you kidding me? He's claimed WBH is on skyfather levels.


Prime example. And I NEVER stated WBH is on Skyfather levels since he doesn't have the versatility to put him there. What I DID say is that "putting this in cap lock since I think you are blind"....I said WBH IS PHYSICALLY A SKYFATHER and he is since he have fts of doing something no skyfather would be able to repeat with a single punch and he did something EASILY that a skyfather on panel stated she was unable to do WITH ALL OF HER POWER. Cant get any clearer than this. Dork.

Originally posted by carver9

And I NEVER stated WBH is on Skyfather levels


Originally posted by carver9

WBH .... have fts of doing something no skyfather would be able to repeat with a single punch and he did something EASILY that a skyfather on panel stated she was unable to do WITH ALL OF HER POWER. .

Originally posted by PillarofOsiris



You keep missing the physically part and the part where I said he is "physically a skyfather but doesn't have the versatility to put him in that tier". This statement is as plain as day. I'm tired of retyping the same thing when this is pretty much understandable. Now convince me and show me some punching power fts from some people. If not, you already know what you can do...

By saying he can do something a skyfather can't do WITH ALL HER POWER you're clearly implying he's beyond a skyfather.

Sentry beats Wonder Woman.

And all the Hulks combined, at the same time.

Originally posted by PillarofOsiris
By saying he can do something a skyfather can't do WITH ALL HER POWER you're clearly implying he's beyond a skyfather.
Greg Pak implied it when he wrote Heart of the Monster, now can you two stop spamming the thread?

Originally posted by PillarofOsiris
By saying he can do something a skyfather can't do WITH ALL HER POWER you're clearly implying he's beyond a skyfather.

She needed Hulks help to do something she was incapable of. Like I said, nice ft for Hulk but he isn't versatile enough to be in the league of a skyfather. In a fist fight, Zeus would beat him but Zeus would be in bad shape imo, baaaaaad shape. Zeus using all of his power would wreck Hulk. Zeus is an elite skyfather.

Originally posted by The Sorrow
Greg Pak implied it when he wrote Heart of the Monster, now can you two stop spamming the thread?


I'm done.

OK I'm just curious, what is KMC's idea of regular Sentry?



Because my idea of "regular" got owned by Punisher a bunch of times.
"regular" isn't him pwning Molecule Man.

Originally posted by carver9
And I NEVER stated WBH is on Skyfather levels

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=13917258& amp;highlight=low+skyfather+forumid%3A77+userid%3A
28664#post13917258

lolz.

Originally posted by NemeBro
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=13917258& amp;highlight=low+skyfather+forumid%3A77+userid%3A
28664#post13917258