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In an all out war between the Avatar's of the Phoenix Force (taking place in the White-Hot Room), who will be the last Phoenix standing?

*Phoenix Rachel Grey
*Dark Phoenix Cyclops
*Phoenix 5 Emma Frost
*Phoenix 5 Namor
*Phoenix 5 Magik
*Phoenix 5 Colossus
*"AoA" Phoenix Jean Grey
*"Ultimate" Phoenix Jean Grey
*"Zombieverse" Phoenix Jean Grey
*Phoenix Cassandra Nova (X-Men: The End)
*White Phoenix Hope Summers
*Phoenix Giraud
*Phoenix Celeste Cukoo
*Phoenix Captain Marvel
*Goblin Queen Madelyne Pryor-Summers
*Phoenix Vulcun

Phoenix Vulcan.

Phoenix Giruad or Phoenix Vulcan (we talking about the one from What If : Rise and Fall of the Shi'ar Empire). The other Phoenixs are weaksauce or have no real showings.

Rachel Summers Phoenix COULD have been something but she sucked a$$. Mastermind tapping into her power had universe level cosmic awareness and during the end of the Days of Future Present storyline Dr. Strange compared her 'astral disturbance" to Jean Grey Dark Phoenix. Plus technically ANYTHING DoFP Franklin did during that entire arc could have been applied to Rachel since he was using HER power to do it.

But like I said, she's fail.

Phoenix Vulcan.

He stripped every other avatar of its power. Only White Phoenix Jean, seems to have humbled him.

Galactus.
Deal with it!

Originally posted by zopzop
Phoenix Giruad or Phoenix Vulcan (we talking about the one from What If : Rise and Fall of the Shi'ar Empire). The other Phoenixs are weaksauce or have no real showings.

Rachel Summers Phoenix COULD have been something but she sucked a$$. Mastermind tapping into her power had universe level cosmic awareness and during the end of the Days of Future Present storyline Dr. Strange compared her 'astral disturbance" to Jean Grey Dark Phoenix. Plus technically ANYTHING DoFP Franklin did during that entire arc could have been applied to Rachel since he was using HER power to do it.

But like I said, she's fail.

What if Vulcan and What if Jean top the list being that they have both destroyed whole solar systems with mere flare ups.

Not hating on Giraud but what has he done besides heal himself and Eternity from Bubonicus' plague staff? He needed help vs Ubiquitor & Dormammu. I won't single out Dormy tho cause he was amped and drained to the point that GOTG basically beat him up afterwards but Giraud is pressed for feats to be considered the top of the Phoenix hosts. Costume was the coolest tho.

I hear Doon and GK coming to dismiss what they would call a crappy Franklin from that DOFP arc.

Originally posted by Sundipped
What if Vulcan and What if Jean top the list being that they have both destroyed whole solar systems with mere flare ups.
What If Vulcan was casually destroying GALAXIES and putting the fear of God into Watchers But that's neither here nor there. What "What If" Jean are you talking about though? I don't see her on the list the OP provided.


Well, not only did Giruad deal with Bubonicus and heal himself, he also healed the infected Galactic Guardians and Eternity (something Eternity himself couldn't do). He beat the Korvac amalgam that was said to be made up of equal parts : Korvac, Michael the Enemy, AND Mainframe. He devoured a planet (Haven). He did need help with Ubiquitor BUT you got to keep in mind, he himself admitted that he was feeling drained keeping up Mainframe's world because it's systems were deceptively complicated.

Against Dormammu sure he needed help but it was TWO Dormammu's combined into one. There was also a lot of PIS/CIS in that story arc.


Well DoFP Franklin was casually warping reality, annihilating Sentinels, and playing around with the FF/X-Men/X-Factor like toys. He may not have displayed "Hickman level" power but he was an Omega for sure and Ahab took notice once his power flared up (this story retconned DoFP Franklin as growing up with no powers), even in the past! This was interesting because it wasn't really his power, it was Rachel Phoenix's.

Originally posted by Sundipped
I hear Doon and GK coming to dismiss what they would call a crappy Franklin from that DOFP arc.
He was a crappy incarnation as far as power-levels are concerned . Although that arc reinforced the idea that Franklin's a pimp as far as the psycho-redhead Jean Grey rip-offs are concerned .

Also , iirc , the feats he displayed were a result of tapping into both Rachel and the younger 616-Franklin's powers . Been a while since I read that arc . I'll check again .

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Also , iirc , the feats he displayed were a result of tapping into both Rachel and the younger 616-Franklin's powers . Been a while since I read that arc . I'll check again .
The only thing he was accessing from 616 Franklin was his "dream self" ability. The power to do what he was doing was all Rachel.

^I know about the Dream Self bit . But as I said before, I'll check again .

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
^I know about the Dream Self bit . But as I said before, I'll check again .
He was siphoning power from her, while using 616 Franklin's dream self ability.
http://imageshack.us/a/img19/5041/rachelsiphon.th.jpg http://imageshack.us/a/img189/5812/rachelsiphon2.th.jpg

The reason why he was siphoning power from her instead of his kid self :
http://imageshack.us/a/img834/4746/blockedtd.th.jpg

Originally posted by zopzop

What If Vulcan was casually destroying GALAXIES and putting the fear of God into Watchers But that's neither here nor there. What "What If" Jean are you talking about though? I don't see her on the list the OP provided.

I just glanced over the list and you're right, that Jean isn't on there. Anyway I was talking about the What if Phoenix hadn't died. The one who destroyed that entire alternate universe.

http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/13614319_246383-phoenix9_super.png

Originally posted by zopzop
Well, not only did Giruad deal with Bubonicus and heal himself, he also healed the infected Galactic Guardians and Eternity (something Eternity himself couldn't do). He beat the Korvac amalgam that was said to be made up of equal parts : Korvac, Michael the Enemy, AND Mainframe. He devoured a planet (Haven). He did need help with Ubiquitor BUT you got to keep in mind, he himself admitted that he was feeling drained keeping up Mainframe's world because it's systems were deceptively complicated.

The healing of Eternity was cool but that's just a typical power that the force can exhibit. Along the same lines of essence spreading throughout 616 to ensure all living things exist after the destruction of the previous universe/jump starting the mutant gene etc. It was only a cauterization involved with Eternity anyway.

As for Korvac, that version was smacked around by the GOTG. It wasn't even really a fight when Giraud showed up. He flared up then bfr'ed him to another reality

http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/13614320_phoenixflare.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/13614321_dimensiondumpskorvac.jpg

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
He was a crappy incarnation as far as power-levels are concerned . Although that arc reinforced the idea that Franklin's a pimp as far as the psycho-redhead Jean Grey rip-offs are concerned .

That's what I meant. Power level wise.
He's far from a pimp tho. Pimps take everything. If he would've left Rachel completely powerless, only then would it apply.

Originally posted by Sundipped
I just glanced over the list and you're right, that Jean isn't on there. Anyway I was talking about the What if Phoenix hadn't died. The one who destroyed that entire alternate universe.

http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/13614319_246383-phoenix9_super.png
That wasn't the only universe where Jean/Phoenix went berserk and destroyed. What If Conan fought Wolverine, it happened there too :
http://imageshack.us/a/img42/9282/cromp.th.jpg
"Nothing prevents Jean Grey from transforming utterly and completely into her dark persona before she can destroy herself, thus the full fury of the Phoenix is unleashed on an unsuspecting populace, one final interjection reflects the statement of an entire universe..........CROM!"



I don't think you're giving Giruad/Phoenix enough credit Sundipped, when Mainframe asked Eternity who he wanted him to summon for help, the Celestials/the Living Tribunal, Eternity replied "No, our only hope lies in the power of the Phoenix"
http://imageshack.us/a/img21/1521/onlygiruad.th.jpg

With "What If" Jean/Phoenix not on the list, it really comes down to Giruad vs What If Vulcan Phoenix as the most powerful host, with Rachel Summers coming in at number two. Believe it or not, I just remembered that in her fight with Necrom, she was indeed holding back. She told him she didn't want to engage him at his level or they would have destroyed the universe.
http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/8331/050p29gp6.jpg

Originally posted by Sundipped
He's far from a pimp tho. Pimps take everything. If he would've left Rachel completely powerless, only then would it apply.
That was in reference to something else .

Originally posted by zopzop


I don't think you're giving Giruad/Phoenix enough credit Sundipped, when Mainframe asked Eternity who he wanted him to summon for help, the Celestials/the Living Tribunal, Eternity replied "No, our only hope lies in the power of the Phoenix"
Hey there friend.

In all fairness, the LT and Celestials are not spatial/temporal healers.
They basically act on protocol and set specific duties.

That aside ...

Giraud never "healed" Eternity. Giraud only "cauterized" Eternity's wound.

(akin to a hot knife placed on an open wound to avoid infection)


Eternity healed himself:

http://s3d4.turboimagehost.com/t/13623674_ET_heal1.jpg http://s3d4.turboimagehost.com/t/13623676_ET_heal2.jpg http://s3d4.turboimagehost.com/t/13623678_ET_heal3.jpg http://s3d4.turboimagehost.com/t/13623679_ET_heal4.jpg http://s3d4.turboimagehost.com/t/13623680_ET_heal5.jpg



That also aside ...

Giraud, with the rest of the GOTG, plus G-Rider, Strange and an alternate,
got wtf stomped by an amped Alternate Dormy.

The "amp?" ... (merged with another alternate Dormy)













Originally posted by zopzop

Believe it or not, I just remembered that in her fight with Necrom, she
was indeed holding back. She told him she didn't want to engage him
at his level or they would have destroyed the universe.
http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/8331/050p29gp6.jpg
... She must've been drunk from the amount she was already using.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Hey there friend.

In all fairness, the LT and Celestials are not spatial/temporal healers.
They basically act on protocol and set specific duties.
But that reality was about to bite it though, even if the LT wouldn't concern himself with one universe in the greater scheme of things, the Celestials for sure wouldn't want the universe to crumble around them.


The greater point is, Eternity himself couldn't stop the consumption from spreading and needed the PF (unlike the PF which cured itself and it's teammates and bfred Bubonicus).




In all fairness Dual Dormammu did nothing to Giraud except knock him back. That entire fight was funny though as Dual Dormammu wound up getting beaten by Dr. Strange's apprentice.


She's a 'tard

Originally posted by zopzop

But that reality was about to bite it though, even if the LT wouldn't
concern himself with one universe in the greater scheme of things,
the Celestials for sure wouldn't want the universe to crumble around them.
I think we both know that was a hyperbolic statement on the writer's part.

To suggest that Giraud can do anything that the Celestials could not, is really funny.

Imo, the writer adding the LT reference there tells me
he's not in the loop concerning said types.
Originally posted by zopzop

The greater point is, Eternity himself couldn't stop the consumption
from spreading and needed the PF (unlike the PF which cured itself
and it's teammates and bfred Bubonicus).
The only thing Giraud did was burn the area of the infected tear in Eternity.

Why Eternity could not do this himself is ridiculous,
especially when 10 issues later Eternity is meticulously repairing Space-Time,
as in Reality itself,
yet, cauterizing (via fire) a wounded is beyond him.

Then again, to be fair, it is a "GOTG" book,
so the writer is going to have one of the members saving the day.
Originally posted by zopzop

In all fairness Dual Dormammu did nothing to Giraud except knock
him back. That entire fight was funny though as Dual Dormammu
wound up getting beaten by Dr. Strange's apprentice.
Zop, G got blasted back, then encased in tentacles,
then all his power was combined with the rest of the team
plus the apprentice and Strange, and still ... stomped again.

Dormy's defeat was piss-fully priceless as always.
Originally posted by zopzop

She's a 'tard
laugh

White Phoenix Hope

Dark Phoenix Wolverine wolverine

Dark Phoenix Cyclops

So what would be the PF hierarchy (including *White Crown Phoenix Jean Grey, *What-If Phoenix Jean Grey, *Phoenix-piece Necrom, *Dark Phoenix Wolverine *The Dark Phoenix from the original "dark phoenix saga" and any other Phoenix's I've forgot... ?????

Originally posted by "Id"
Phoenix Vulcan.

He stripped every other avatar of its power. Only White Phoenix Jean, seems to have humbled him.

Alternate reality Jean?

That entire What If issue was strange, one of the few that 616 Uatu didn't narrate.

Jaff, within the M'krann Crystal, is the narrator. He claims the Crystal is multiversal and it's called the Nexus of All Realities on panel. He says since he's within the Crystal he sees across the multiverse.
http://imageshack.us/a/img94/1158/multiversal.th.jpg

At the end of the issue Jean within the WHR takes the PF back from Vulcan :
http://imageshack.us/a/img195/609/multi2c.th.jpg

If that Crystal is indeed Multiversal and unique across all realities (stated on panel) and since the WHR is at the heart of the Crystal/located within the Crystal (stated on panel), wouldn't take make the events that took place WITHIN the WHR canon?

Jean would be, hands down, the most powerful PF host. That alt reality Vulcan would be the second most powerful canon host (since he depowered the PF corps WITHIN the Crystal.

Isn't nexus of all realities a different place?

Originally posted by zopzop

If that Crystal is indeed Multiversal and unique across all realities
(stated on panel) and since the WHR is at the heart of the
Crystal/located within the Crystal (stated on panel), wouldn't take
make the events that took place WITHIN the WHR canon?
That makes sense ... but nah.

The Mkraan Crystal itself already exploded in an alternate universe,
and it only took out that single diverged reality, and Jean, Jahf, WHR were included.

All What If's are parallel realities that diverged from an occurrence within 616.

^ Sounds right.

Originally posted by Mr Master
That makes sense ... but nah.

The Mkraan Crystal itself already exploded in an alternate universe,
and it only took out that single diverged reality, and Jean, Jahf, WHR were included.

All What If's are parallel realities that diverged from an occurrence within 616.

Incorrect.

X-men Adventures was written approximately in 93/94 a point in time when the M'kraan crystal was a universal artifact.

Following the Age Of Apocalypse Saga it was retconned into a multiversal object-

http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/848/comicgambitandthexternau.th.jpg

http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/9373/comicgambitandthexternaz.th.jpg

Once this retcon became acknowledged company wide this had the effect of making that one time universal story, turn multiversal and then Marvel went ahead and made X-men Adventures Galactus' origin and the end of the previous marvel multiverse


http://img25.imageshack.us/img25/6489/novacorpsfilespage16.th.jpg

The M'kraan crystals most recent bio states clearly that as per current continuity it is a multiversal object and that if destroyed or its power fully unleashed it will destroy and then recreate the multiverse

http://imageshack.us/a/img16/7517/allnewofficialhandbooko.th.jpg

Further to that point the bio confirms X-men Adventures by saying that the crystals destruction in the previous multiverse was what destroyed the previous multiverse and subsequently the multiverse was reborn anew-

http://imageshack.us/a/img25/8759/42532854.th.jpg

http://imageshack.us/a/img26/9254/88143606.th.jpg

http://imageshack.us/a/img514/157/40874068.th.jpg

That is the current origin of Marvel reality, that is the current origin of Galactus and the event is also referenced in LTs bio where he shapes The Brothers with The Spectre-

http://imageshack.us/a/img90/8349/56132412.th.jpg

http://imageshack.us/a/img692/7517/allnewofficialhandbooko.th.jpg

Dont wanna see you posting scans of Uatu talking about X-men Adventures as if its a What If within the issue.

I have already established that at the time of writing it was, however the retcon which followed a couple years later meant that the destruction of the M'kraan crystal equated to the destruction of the entire multiverse which is why this story was then made Galactus' current origin and the current origin of Marvel reality.

Again. That last sentence does not call for a barrage of scans of other recreations that have happened since or old outdated Galactus origins as is your predictable nature to do.

This is current. This is official. We'll leave it at that

^ What Ifs? and X-Men Adventures line from the animated universe are not canon to 616.

Originally posted by ODG
^ What Ifs? and X-Men Adventures line from the animated universe are not canon to 616.

Unless Marvel the owner of said properties deems them so. I have shown that they have. Your opinion that they should not be is irrelevant.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Unless Marvel the owner of said properties deems them so. I have shown that they have. Your opinion that they should not be is irrelevant. X-Men Adventures is from the animated universe line. It's not canon to 616.

You haven't done anything but fail to obfuscate the blatantly obvious. You've also ignored all the most current Marvel Universe/Multiverse origins published on-panel. On-Panel > handbooks. Alternate universes are not canon to the 616 universe. You do have a basis for your interpretation, but it's tenuous and paper-thin at best.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Dont wanna see you posting scans of Uatu talking about X-men Adventures as if its a What If within the issue.

I have already established that at the time of writing it was, however the retcon which followed a couple years later meant that the destruction of the M'kraan crystal equated to the destruction of the entire multiverse which is why this story was then made Galactus' current origin and the current origin of Marvel reality.

Again. That last sentence does not call for a barrage of scans of other recreations that have happened since or old outdated Galactus origins as is your predictable nature to do.

This is current. This is official. We'll leave it at that
Nobody is better at owning you than your own self, GS . You're indeed a fine example of a true master of self-pwnage .

Originally posted by ODG
X-Men Adventures is from the animated universe line. It's not canon to 616.

You haven't done anything but fail to obfuscate the blatantly obvious. You've also ignored all the most current Marvel Universe/Multiverse origins published on-panel. On-Panel > handbooks. Alternate universes are not canon to the 616 universe. You do have a basis for your interpretation, but it's tenuous and paper-thin at best.

Dont give me this rubbish.

X-men Adventures is not canon to Marvel because its now a non existent reality thanks to the M'kraan crystal.

What is canon is the the fact that the outcome of the crystals destruction played a part in Galactus' origin and the creation of current Marvel reality.

This is a point accepted on panel by F4 writers within the past half a decade, Journey into Mystery Writers during Fear Itself referencing Dweller in the Darkness stemming from that defunct multiverse and current bios of Galactus, the Phoenix Force, LT and the M'kraan crystal verifying what we as readers should accept as current continuity.

Your opinion to the contrary is irrelevant. I am ignoring nothing. The current Marvel realities original creation and Galactus' origin have been clarified and confirmed by Marvel as being tied to the M'kraan crystal. Subsequent multiversal resets such as the Ultimate Nullifier for example does not change the true origin.

Your opinion on how things should be does not equate to fact.

The arrogance of you.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Dont give me this rubbish.

X-men Adventures is not canon to Marvel because its now a non existent reality thanks to the M'kraan crystal.

What is canon is the the fact that the outcome of the crystals destruction played a part in Galactus' origin possibly in an alternate universe and the creation of current an alternate Marvel reality . Fixed for accuracy. Originally posted by GalacticStorm
This is a point accepted on panel by F4 writers within the past half a decade, Journey into Mystery Writers during Fear Itself referencing Dweller in the Darkness stemming from that defunct multiverse and current bios of Galactus, the Phoenix Force, LT and the M'kraan crystal verifying what we as readers should accept as current continuity. Character statements (allusions really) do not override published on-panel showings of the birth of the Marvel Universe/Multiverse. Neither do handbooks that end up contradicting themselves (that's the forum rules).Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Your opinion to the contrary is irrelevant. I am ignoring nothing. The current Marvel realities original creation and Galactus' origin have been clarified and confirmed by Marvel as being tied to the M'kraan crystal. Subsequent multiversal resets such as the Ultimate Nullifier for example does not change the true origin.

Your opinion on how things should be does not equate to fact.

The arrogance of you. You are willfully ignoring more current published comics because they undercut and (in other occasions outright disprove) your theories which are based on alternate universes and conflicting handbook entries.

Your opinion on how things should be does not equate to fact.

The absurdity of you. kinda

Originally posted by ODG
Fixed for accuracy. Character statements (allusions really) do not override published on-panel showings of the birth of the Marvel Universe/Multiverse. Neither do handbooks that end up contradicting themselves (that's the forum rules). You are willfully ignoring more current published comics because they undercut and (in other occasions outright disprove) your theories which are based on alternate universes and conflicting handbook entries.

Your opinion on how things should be does not equate to fact.

The absurdity of you. kinda

Laughable

Your attempts at a counter make no sense whatsoever when the M'kraan crystal is a multiversal object. So its destruction meant the destruction of the previous multiverse entire.

Originally posted by ODG
What is canon is the the fact that the outcome of the crystals destruction played a part in Galactus' origin possibly in an alternate universe and the creation of current an alternate Marvel reality .

So please explain your attempt at a correction?

I would love to hear this.

^ You can say it a hundred different times or repost the same scans ad nauseam.

Adventures of X-Men is not canon. More current on-panel events override older character statements. Handbook entries never override on-panel feats. When you're able to construct a theory that isn't held together by the thinnest of strings and cheapest of scotch tape, let us know.

In the meantime, your theory is your's and you're entitled to it. You're entitled to believe in it wholeheartedly. You're even entitled to repeatedly attempt to convince KMC for years and insult anybody who disagrees with it. Just don't act like you're above being deconstructed or ridiculed over it.

Originally posted by ODG
^ You can say it a hundred different times or repost the same scans ad nauseam.

Adventures of X-Men is not canon. More current on-panel events override older character statements. Handbook entries never override on-panel feats. When you're able to construct a theory that isn't held together by the thinnest of strings and cheapest of scotch tape, let us know.

In the meantime, your theory is your's and you're entitled to it. You're entitled to believe in it wholeheartedly. You're even entitled to repeatedly attempt to convince KMC for years and insult anybody who disagrees with it. Just don't act like you're above being deconstructed or ridiculed over it.

You can state more current on panel events override the instance but without referring to some your opinion has no weight.

It has even less weight when Marvels official sources do not verify your opinion to the contrary. There is a reason why my theory is stated on panel and is also stated in the most recent official sources and yours lacks that credibility.

Your verbose and pretentious retorts may shroud your empty arguments to the eyes of the kids on here, but with me they just dont cut it.

Please do state what recent multiversal origins we've had verified in sources as current as mine. This will make for some interesting reading

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
You can state more current on panel events override the instance but without referring to some your opinion has no weight.

It has even less weight when Marvels official sources do not verify your opinion to the contrary. There is a reason why my theory is stated on panel and is also stated in the most recent official sources and yours lacks that credibility.

Your verbose and pretentious retorts may shroud your empty arguments to the eyes of the kids on here, but with me they just dont cut it.

Please do state what recent multiversal origins we've had verified in sources as current as mine. This will make for some interesting reading You've been reminded continually about them all. Your continued and willful ignorance of same doesn't arm you with the capacity to plead from ignorance.

Your surreptitious attempt to manufacture a pretense of a challenge that you hope I will walk away from with exasperation because that challenge has been met in the past multiple times by multiple posters isn't transparent though.

Not my first rodeo, pal. doped

Originally posted by ODG
You've been reminded continually about them all. Your continued and willful ignorance of same doesn't arm you with the capacity to plead from ignorance.

Your surreptitious attempt to manufacture a pretense of a challenge that you hope I will walk away from with exasperation because that challenge has been met in the past multiple times by multiple posters isn't transparent though.

Not my first rodeo, pal. doped

So to put it in laymans terms, youre going to continue to argue your point with a complete lack of evidence merely falling back on the claim that ive supposedly been told before, but not by you?

Lets do this instance for instance.

You name one single instance and i'll tell you how its not what you smugly think it is

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
So to put it in laymans terms, youre going to continue to argue your point with a complete lack of evidence merely falling back on the claim that ive supposedly been told before, but not by you?

Lets do this instance for instance.

You name one single instance and i'll tell you how its not what you smugly think it is To put it in internet terms, you've been told all this before, so the troll act is unnecessary and wasted. Don't worry though, you'll be told all this again. There's always someone willing to ram your theory back down your throat.

I don't have the propensity for copy-pasting spammed drivel like you.

When you're able to overturn forum rules and have alternate universes and outdated handbook entries override more current, on-panel evidence, let us know. I invite you to request a mod ruling.

Originally posted by ODG
To put it in internet terms, you've been told all this before, so the troll act is unnecessary and wasted. Don't worry though, you'll be told all this again. There's always someone willing to ram your theory back down your throat.

I don't have the propensity for copy-pasting spammed drivel like you.

When you're able to overturn forum rules and have alternate universes and outdated handbook entries override more current, on-panel evidence, let us know. I invite you to request a mod ruling.

Im guilty of none of that.

What you are guilty of is of making false accusations, riding on the coat tails of others to compensate for laziness and a lack of anything of real substance to contribute

If youre going to disagree or attempt to counter then come up with the goods sir. Right now youre all mouth and no trousers.

Name me one modern officially referenced origin story for the multiverse.

I dare ya!

^ Your cries for attention are wasted here. I'm not going to indulge your wretched bids to once again willfully and blatantly ignore all of the evidence posted throughout all the conversations you and others have had with you on this topic.

You're a running joke that shadows the forums every once in a blue moon and when you sense your favorite character (and her myth) losing favor precipitously, you blunder back in with diatribe-laced spam and predictions of published vindication that backfire spectacularly. But the entire point of your act is to either bore or frustrate naysayers in a rather vain hope to effect damage control on a character nobody really cares about and never has.

I've stated it as dryly as I can, but let me repeat myself: I've got no interest in re-engaging your feigned attempts at a constructive discussion. You've never truly cared for it because they've always led to your arguments being busted and ridiculed. But you pretend to and that's your prerogative. But the act is tired and rather futile considering the state of the character today and the established story of the Marvel Universe/Multiverse.

In the end though, here in this thread, all that's required is to point out that what you presented in your initial post was an alternate universe story that is outdated and tangentially supported by conflicting handbook entries. And you can hug that for dear life all you want. But acting like that actually merits another repeated deconstruction is delusional.

Originally posted by ODG
^ Your cries for attention are wasted here. I'm not going to indulge your wretched bids to once again willfully and blatantly ignore all of the evidence posted throughout all the conversations you and others have had with you on this topic.

You're a running joke that shadows the forums every once in a blue moon and when you sense your favorite character (and her myth) losing favor precipitously, you blunder back in with diatribe-laced spam and predictions of published vindication that backfire spectacularly. But the entire point of your act is to either bore or frustrate naysayers in a rather vain hope to effect damage control on a character nobody really cares about and never has.

I've stated it as dryly as I can, but let me repeat myself: I've got no interest in re-engaging your feigned attempts at a constructive discussion. You've never truly cared for it because they've always led to your arguments being busted and ridiculed. But you pretend to and that's your prerogative. But the act is tired and rather futile considering the state of the character today and the established story of the Marvel Universe/Multiverse.

In the end though, here in this thread, all that's required is to point out that what you presented in your initial post was an alternate universe story that is outdated and tangentially supported by conflicting handbook entries. And you can hug that for dear life all you want. But acting like that actually merits another repeated deconstruction is delusional.

So in other words you dont have shit

In no capacity whatsoever have you ever busted any of my arguments.

You come in here with your verbose pretentious waffle, telling me my theory is wrong merely because alternatives are presented that you like the sound of better whilst ignoring the fact that marvel tells us through additional official sources like handbooks which on panel theory is officially endorsed. You are the height of arrogance.

End your life.

Swiftly

Originally posted by RyanAutumns
In an all out war between the Avatar's of the Phoenix Force (taking place in the White-Hot Room), who will be the last Phoenix standing?

*Phoenix Rachel Grey
*Dark Phoenix Cyclops
*Phoenix 5 Emma Frost
*Phoenix 5 Namor
*Phoenix 5 Magik
*Phoenix 5 Colossus
*"AoA" Phoenix Jean Grey
*"Ultimate" Phoenix Jean Grey
*"Zombieverse" Phoenix Jean Grey
*Phoenix Cassandra Nova (X-Men: The End)
*White Phoenix Hope Summers
*Phoenix Giraud
*Phoenix Celeste Cukoo
*Phoenix Captain Marvel
*Goblin Queen Madelyne Pryor-Summers
*Phoenix Vulcun

After defeating Apocalypse Ultimate Phoenix Jean Grey showed an ability to rewrite timelines with a thought without causing the creation of a divergent reality.

Phoenix Vulcan can absorb the Force from other avatars

Hope Phoenix was able to dispel the force over reality to undo Wandas No More Mutants spell that Dr Strange said was so interwoven across the multiverse any attempt to undo it could destroy all reality.

Rachel Phoenix is the longest wielder and has a strong bond with the power and many great feats, but many low ones due to her being a mainstay on a team.

All the others are non factors.

Originally posted by GalacticStorm
Incorrect.

X-men Adventures was written approximately in 93/94 a point in time when the M'kraan crystal was a universal artifact.

Following the Age Of Apocalypse Saga it was retconned into a multiversal object-

http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/848/comicgambitandthexternau.th.jpg

http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/9373/comicgambitandthexternaz.th.jpg

Once this retcon became acknowledged company wide this had the effect of making that one time universal story, turn multiversal and then Marvel went ahead and made X-men Adventures Galactus' origin and the end of the previous marvel multiverse


http://img25.imageshack.us/img25/6489/novacorpsfilespage16.th.jpg

The M'kraan crystals most recent bio states clearly that as per current continuity it is a multiversal object and that if destroyed or its power fully unleashed it will destroy and then recreate the multiverse

http://imageshack.us/a/img16/7517/allnewofficialhandbooko.th.jpg


Good find on the crystal being retconned.

I always believed this to be the orgin of the current MU.
No bio (tmk) states these events being relative to an alternate universe as of this present time. Even before now I could never fathom the possibility of Galactus being born from an alternate universe that existed billions of years before current 616.