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Not exactly the US, but what if a international cabal of conspirators framed the US by detonating a 100 kt nuke with a US signature during the Hajj? What would be the geopolitical ramifications, esp. in Saudi Arabia, Iran, and Pakistan? Would non-Middle Eastern oil barons profit from this or would it harm their business?

World War III, I'd have to imagine.

Originally posted by Lestov16
Not exactly the US, but what if a international cabal of conspirators framed the US by detonating a 100 kt nuke with a US signature during the Hajj? What would be the geopolitical ramifications, esp. in Saudi Arabia, Iran, and Pakistan? Would non-Middle Eastern oil barons profit from this or would it harm their business?
US signature? That sounds like science fiction.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
US signature? That sounds like science fiction.

Yeah a US signature sounds like an atomic blast screaming USA with a bunch of stars and stripes.

Pretty impressive scientifically.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
US signature? That sounds like science fiction. "Captain, sensors indicate an atomic blast from the direction of Mecca. It appears to bear an energy signature from a Klingon warship United States carrier."

Originally posted by Bat Dude
World War III, I'd have to imagine.

I don't know what power would immediately start ww3

I imagine it would be more of a situation where all major powers felt it was not acceptable to use nuclear weapons in their small skirmishes (Tibet, Chechnya, South China Sea).

MAD still holds between America and any other nation, Russia is still the only nation with the nuclear infrastructure to challenge America and they are at least a generation behind, America is the only nation with even modest missile defenses and their second strike capacity is such that even a "sneak" nuke attack that destroyed 100% of its land based nuclear capacity would still result in the offending nation being wiped out entirely.

There would be absolute chaos, but I really am at a loss to imagine who steps up to do anything about it.

Would oil companies profit?

well like, oil prices would skyrocket, but OPEC would probably stop trading with the West...

if your plot is "oil companies somehow launch a 100 megaton nuclear weapon at millions of Muslims to profit from heightened oil prices", I'd point you to the issues with science fiction mentioned above... or even about having realistically motivated antagonists as opposed to cartoonish super villainy.

I know it's cartoonish, but is it plausible? Would they profit?

And about the "signature", I thought every nuclear blast dispersed radiation or something of that nature that would allow one to trace where the bomb was manufactured

satellites and radar may be able to determine where the missile was fired from, but there is no such thing as American radiation. Depending on the type of missile there may be some characteristics about the blast, but from a single 100 kt warhead, there isn't going to be much saying one nation did it over another, especially if everyone is denying it.

is it plausible? no. would they profit? like, who are "they" specifically? just generic oil barons? no, they probably wouldn't more-so than they already do.

An international oil cabal (led by Canadian and including Caspian Sea and Russian tycoons,etc.)

The loss of Middle Eastern oil wouldn't cause the demand for the cabal's oil to go up? Wouldn't their shares skyrocket in value?

Would the same geopolitical effect occur if a nuke detonated in Tehran instead of Mecca?

well, like, oil prices would go up, but you now have a group of international terrorists who used a nuclear weapon against millions of innocent civilians.

considering "blood for oil" is already the first assumption people make when world events happen, I can't imagine this group staying secret for long.

Originally posted by Oliver North
well, like, oil prices would go up, but you now have a group of international terrorists who used a nuclear weapon against millions of innocent civilians.

considering "blood for oil" is already the first assumption people make when world events happen, I can't imagine this group staying secret for long.

We will assume the oil company covered their tracks. Would they make a substantial profit on the new demand for their oil?

This is the greatest thread on KMC.

Hiroshima outrage all over again, although I have to imagine that it'll be orders of magnitude greater this time, as the target being obliterated is of tremendous religious significance to around 1/5th of the world's population.

Likely, most of the other major countries, China, Russia, Japan etc would nuke us back.


Russia are building nuke launching pads , soon the will be the most powerful Nuclear Country

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
Likely, most of the other major countries, China, Russia, Japan etc would nuke us back.


Russia are building nuke launching pads , soon the will be the most powerful Nuclear Country Stop posting.

Stop breathing

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
Likely, most of the other major countries, China, Russia, Japan etc would nuke us back.


Russia are building nuke launching pads , soon the will be the most powerful Nuclear Country
Lmao Japan doesn't have nukes...they barely have nuclear power since Fukushima.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Lmao Japan doesn't have nukes...they barely have nuclear power since Fukushima. If you keep talking to him like he is human, he will think he is.

Don't be an enabler.

Originally posted by Lestov16
We will assume the oil company covered their tracks. Would they make a substantial profit on the new demand for their oil?

covered their tracks?

I don't think you have thought enough about how much physical infrastructure would be required to launch a nuke. There are 3 ways to deliver a 100kt warhead: Silo launch, sub launch or dropped from a plane. All of those would require hundreds of people who would be impossible to keep quiet after the effect, especially since the intelligence services of every nation on the planet would be looking for them.

But like, if you are writing a story where you are willing to create such an unrealistic scenario in the first place, it really doesn't matter what would happen to oil prices in reality. Just say it does if that works best.

It's a suitcase nuke with a fictional fissile material. They covered their tracks. Will they profit?

Step 1.) Nuke Mecca.

Step 2.) ...

Step 3.) Profit!

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Step 1.) Nuke Mecca.

Step 2.) ...

Step 3.) Profit!

I agree with your assessment. Let me revise...

Originally posted by Lestov16
It's a suitcase nuke with a fictional fissile material. They covered their tracks. Will they profit?

I dont see why you have this fixation with making this one element realistic when you are clearly willing to throw out hardcore realism on every other element.

suitcase nukes are largely a myth. "covered their tracks" could mean anything. Why not just say they profited?

Originally posted by Lestov16
Not exactly the US, but what if a international cabal of conspirators framed the US by detonating a 100 kt nuke with a US signature during the Hajj? What would be the geopolitical ramifications, esp. in Saudi Arabia, Iran, and Pakistan? Would non-Middle Eastern oil barons profit from this or would it harm their business?
Nuke or Thermonuke? Traditional or ERW (Neutron bomb)?

Nuking Mecca may be the answer.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NNcQX033V_M

The answer to what?

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
Likely, most of the other major countries, China, Russia, Japan etc would nuke us back.


Russia are building nuke launching pads , soon the will be the most powerful Nuclear Country

How about this?

What if the oil cabal attempted to frame Iranian agents for detonating a nuke in Tel Aviv (They create a message that makes it seem the bomber is connected to multiple members of the Iranian Assembly of Experts). Their aim would be to destabilize the oil trade in the region through a perpetual war, so that the oil cabal's product will increase in value. Is their goal plausible?

Originally posted by Lestov16
How about this?

What if the oil cabal attempted to frame Iranian agents for detonating a nuke in Tel Aviv (They create a message that makes it seem the bomber is connected to multiple members of the Iranian Assembly of Experts). Their aim would be to destabilize the oil trade in the region through a perpetual war, so that the oil cabal's product will increase in value. Is their goal plausible?
To destabilize the oil trade they'd want to start a war between Iran and the Arab Gulf States, not Iran and Israel.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
To destabilize the oil trade they'd want to start a war between Iran and the Arab Gulf States, not Iran and Israel.

Would it be plausible to frame the US for detonating a nuke in Tehran? What if Israel was framed for detonating a nuke in Mecca?

Originally posted by Lestov16
Would it be plausible to frame the US for detonating a nuke in Tehran? What if Israel was framed for detonating a nuke in Mecca?
I don't know if it would be plausible or not if you don't give more details.

But I think you're hung up on an idea that may not be tenable. Perhaps before you attempt writing such grandiose plots you should cut your teeth on smaller things that don't effect millions of people and don't involve nuclear detonations.

Isn't it obvious? If Mecca was nuked, then from the Ka'aba an angel would emerge and lay waste to the United States.

Originally posted by Astner
Isn't it obvious? If Mecca was nuked, then from the Ka'aba an angel would emerge and lay waste to the United States. Not with American God protecting it.

Originally posted by Mindset
Not with American God protecting it.
The show Supernatural isn't real!

Originally posted by Mindset
Not with American God protecting it. http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_vkh7ip2BXBw/TIHA2KePu8I/AAAAAAAAFro/fcIYYDM0AHw/s1600/SuperJesus.jpg

I concede defeat.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
But I think you're hung up on an idea that may not be tenable. Perhaps before you attempt writing such grandiose plots you should cut your teeth on smaller things that don't effect millions of people and don't involve nuclear detonations.

The scope is part of the story.

What if it were a defense contractor cabal, who framed Iran for attacking Israel? Is that tenable?

Originally posted by Lestov16
Would it be plausible to frame the US for detonating a nuke in Tehran? What if Israel was framed for detonating a nuke in Mecca?

That seems more like the MO of Kahanists, and considering how much harder it is to build a nuclear weapon, not to mention a pocket size one than most people think, there aren't many people you could frame. Even with the insane shit they get from their supporters in the Israeli military, I highly doubt they would get anything more than fissile material for a dirty bomb and contrary to what most people think, that would be no more destructive than a common explosive. Dirty bombs barely throw out any significant contamination, their danger is in creating panic among the ignorant. You can't really do much by strapping TNT to a piece of Uranium.

Originally posted by Lestov16
The scope is part of the story.

What if it were a defense contractor cabal, who framed Iran for attacking Israel? Is that tenable?
I don't think you're getting my point.

Plausibility is a secondary concern if you can't draw the reader in. And unless you have some human appeal and real emotion you'll never draw the reader in.

Do you have any characters yet? Starting a plot with just an idea and hoping that a story will grow around it is pretty reckless.

Originally posted by Lestov16
The scope is part of the story.

What if it were a defense contractor cabal, who framed Iran for attacking Israel? Is that tenable? That sounds like a Templar plot from Assassin's Creed.