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Slade Gauntlet.
Grip Strength Challenge.

No strikes or tripping allowed.
Contestants must maintain handholds on each other at all time.
Ring is 10 feet in diameter.

Win is accrued by any proof of pure physical strength superiority,
i.e. forcing a ring out, forcing opponents hands behind their back despite their active resistance, breaking the bones of the opponents hand, submission, etcetera.


Contest inspired by someone recently posting the following:

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105023
(This is Slade breaking Kyle's fingers in hand-to-hand combat.
I don't know what comic it's from.)


How far can Slade progress against the following line-up?
Can he clear this?


01. Grifter

02. Nightwing (Richard Grayson)

03. Superboy Prime (depowered; under full red sunlight)

04. Deadpool

05. Batman (Bruce Wayne)
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105053

06. Bane (non-juiced)

07. Wally West (no speed allowed, just West's natural strength)
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105059

08. Harley Quinn
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14090226

09. Captain America

10. Kingpin (Wilson Fisk)
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=13948936


Bonus Round:

Slade gets to use a set of power gloves to TRIPLE his strength to tackle the following people. Can he clear these 4 opponents?


11. Bane (fully juiced)

12. Killer Croc

13. Cable

14. Norman Osborn (Green Goblin)
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14073549

Slade versus Green Lantern (Kyle Rayner),
a picture with better resolution.

This is basically wrestling and no powers?

Originally posted by Lord Feron
This is basically wrestling and no powers?

I suppose that's a reasonably good way of putting it, save I'm not even the least bit interested in the skill level involved, just how Slade's physical strength stacks up to the competition here.

Initially, I was especially interested in how Slade stacks up to #7 through #10. Now, having perused through some of the feats in his respect thread, however, I'm thinking he may not even need gloves to compete with #s 11 through 14 -- Slade's a LOT stronger than I realized before today ...

Did Slade get a power-up recently or is he still around Cap's level?

Do you think Slade is stronger than Steve, blue?

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
I suppose that's a reasonably good way of putting it, save I'm not even the least bit interested in the skill level involved, just how Slade's physical strength stacks up to the competition here.

Initially, I was especially interested in how Slade stacks up to #7 through #10. Now, having perused through some of the feats in his respect thread, however, I'm thinking he may not even need gloves to compete with #s 11 through 14 -- Slade's a LOT stronger than I realized before today ...

Well just strength with no skill needed for either contestant.
Wins
1, 2, 4, 8, maybe 13

Lose
9 (or stalemate), 10, 11, 12,

IDK
3, 7, 14

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Do you think Slade is stronger than Steve, blue?


Don't rightly know.

Suspect I haven't seen enough Captain America strength feats to make an accurate determination.

But I've seen Deathstoke kick a thick metal door off its hinges, something that seems the province of, say, 1938 Superman, and I've seen him win an impromptu tug-of-war with Donna Troy.

Donna Troy.

As in "sister of Wonder Woman".

Donna Troy, who was strong enough to do the following even in her earliest Teen Titans days:


http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105483

... but Slade lightly accomplishes the following:

According to her thought bubbles. she lost her footing...sounds more like he surprised her by pulling on the lasso.

As for the door, I've seen Cap take down one of the type Slade faces only with the help of Wolverine in Secret Wars (when, after tremors and upheaval, Cap must work with him to free prisoners trapped in their cells).

Cap needs his shield or the aid of Wolverine's claws to do the work.

Slade only needs a sturdy pair of boots ...

Cap has feats of strength beyond that of ripping off steel doors.

Originally posted by bluewaterrider

Contest inspired by someone recently posting the following:

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105023
(This is Slade breaking Kyle's fingers in hand-to-hand combat.
I don't know what comic it's from.)


Identity Crisis, they were after Dr Light whom they suspected of killing Sue Dibny, and Light had just hired Deathstroke as a bodyguard.

(This is Slade breaking Kyle's fingers in hand-to-hand combat.
I don't know what comic it's from.)

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105236


Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Identity Crisis, they were after Dr Light whom they suspected of killing Sue Dibny, and Light had just hired Deathstroke as a bodyguard.


Thank you kindly, sir.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Cap has feats of strength beyond that of ripping off steel doors.

Do they top the following?

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
Do they top the following?

Yes.

That's just some thin scaffolding.

Steve has ripped off the arms of large robots.

He has uprooted multi-ton statues from the ground while being chained to them.

Stops at cap.

Gets to Bane.

(non-venom)

Originally posted by CosmicComet

Steve ... has uprooted multi-ton statues from the ground


hmm

This must be relatively recent, for everything I've seen of Cap to date, save for a double-team retcon effort where he and Spider-man managed to knock out the Hulk with shield strikes, etcetera,

has had Cap stronger than the average person, but far weaker than classic Kingpin or classic Luke Cage, both of the latter being merely 300+ pound guys of solid muscle.


Let's quantify this a bit better, then.

Does Cap have anything to match or top Kingpin's shoving match here ... ?




http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106391

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106393

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106398

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
hmm

This must be relatively recent (...)

It's not.

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/0/7604/1269114-captainamericav305061cs8_super.jpg

props to Cosmic

Cap's been around since the 1940s.

I started to clarify: "relatively recent" as in

"not 1940s, not 1950s, not 1960s, not 1970s, and not 1980s,

but outside of his classic era, perhaps 1990s on ..."


But, I didn't clarify that, so...



Most impressive, either way, that statue showing.

I presume he escaped those chains by flexing out or something similar, besides?


If Cap has a solid history in the past 15 years or so of doing stuff like THAT, he may well have eclipsed Kingpin in the strength department.

Just shows what the training, the prayers, and the vitamins can do for a bloke ...

No, the statue showing isn't his most impressive strength feat.

Cap's not bad, man. Show me a few more feats on the level of that statue lift, and you might convince me that Cap'll be where Slade stops. Still haven't seen anything to place Cap FIRMLY in the Kingpin bracket, though.

1. Too few feats.
2. Too many showings of Kingpin matching or exceeding Spider-man.
3. Cap bearhugged nearly into submission by Kingpin himself
(Cap was saved in the last instance, as you saw yourself, by his pet eagle, Redwing.)


Here, let me give you a better idea of the level of power the Kingpin operated on, the kind of level Slade himself implies HE might be truly on if that door kick is any indication, let alone the fact that he threw down with Wonder Woman or is described as having the strength of 20 men, as I've read in Slade's respect thread:

King hook classic. Spiderman versus Kingpin versus ... Richard Fisk.

Much like Slade, though he was supposed to be an ordinary man, just a very BIG man, with a lot of very solid muscles, Kingpin frequently translated as Hulk-lite. Panel or two ago you saw him punching Spider-man across a room, then a missed punch from the Kingpin go right through a wall. Here, he demonstrates the grip strength this thread concerns itself with, and makes himself seem a larger-than-life figure.
He merely grabs the carpeting in the room they are in and firmly tugs and it seems for a moment as if Spider-man's entire world is closing in, everything about him being helplessly tossed about ...

Kingpin was also wont to throw about heavy weights. The kind that were just outsized enough to make a person double take without destroying suspension of disbelief.

Made you wonder: "If there really WERE a man that size, like some 400 or 500 pounds or so, and he trained his body a lifetime to develop massive strength, is it possible that he really could ...?"

(As it is, the weights appearing in the Strongman competitions shown on TV, where they lift cars and 500 pound refrigerators in PAIRS and pull trucks and even trains and airliners around are pretty close to this level ...)

Classic Fisk was a beast.

.

Originally posted by Lord Feron
Classic Fisk was a beast.

Agreed.

I'm only sorry I can't show the scans I want yet from the "Mission: Crush the Kingpin!" storyline. There, Kingpin is so dominant that he nearly makes Spider-man pass out (presumably due to pain and loss of blood flow) by merely powerfully squeezing his wrist. Spider-man fakes unconsciousness for a moment in the hopes of catching Kingy offguard, knowing that he really WILL succumb if King keeps applying pressure like that. He manages to do so, but has to massage his wrist afterward to keep it from going completely numb.

Rare to see anyone just use pure physical strength like that at the street level to just tap people out. Perhaps part of the reason I'm thinking Slade is superior to Cap is that I've simply never seen Cap just forcefully dominate other people that way.

Kingpin himself doesn't have much to top something like the following for instance. This is just pure, muscular domination ...

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/0/7604/1269110-captainamericav302605ab5_super.jpg
http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/0/7604/1269099-captainamericastrenfma0_super.jpg

breaking chains.


http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/0/7604/1269108-capiii13p1448fa0365vx8_super.jpg

breaks a robot's arm

http://comicsmedia.ign.com/comics/image/article/810/810592/captain-america-the-chosen-20070803070713618.jpg

chucks a big block of concrete a couple of stories upward, hard enough for the block to fugging EXPLOOOODE.

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/3/37849/1463569-640294_captainamericav302709vk0_super_super.jpg
Can throw his shield with enough strength that it catches up to a fugging ICBM.


http://img108.imageshack.us/img108/9389/capiii09p17ah7.jpg
Hurts Rhino, right after the latter shows an obviously good durability feat in the very first panel, so its not a jobbing sequence, it's simply a demonstration of contrast.


I'm trying to find the one where Cap punches Iron Man hard enough for the latter to go crashing into asphalt and make a decent sized crater.

Herald level starts with Steve. 'Lee Dat.

Originally posted by CosmicComet

Hurts Rhino, right after the latter shows an obviously good durability feat in the very first panel, so its not a jobbing sequence, it's simply a demonstration of contrast...



I can't give you THAT particular one.

Rhino is so jokingly maltreated by Marvel that he has his own disrespect thread on this forum.

If Cap had made him do all that with shield strikes I wouldn't give you an argument.
Without that, though ... you're telling me a guy that runs through brick walls, tanks Spider-man's best punches and got hit with a ROCKET launcher unfazed is going to reel from Cap's punches and kicks?!?

Nevertheless, you have proven to me MODERN Cap contends with Fisk this last series, despite his classic incarnation not doing so.

Even if the other showings can be written off, the debris toss can't.

Couple hundred pounds of granite tossed 2 or 3 stories up to destroy a machine gun nest?
Yeah, that's Kingpin level, and very firmly so.

Classic Fisk himself could not do much better.

And the combination of that feat with the others you showed protects it from being called an outlier.

Good job.

Some people may wonder at the inclusion of Harley Quinn.

She IS stronger than Batman and the other members of his family, however, perhaps even stronger than the members of his group combined, IF we're simply measuring pure physical strength and not skill in battle.
(She obviously can't contend with the batpeople in a fight except under the best circumstances.)

Here's one such proof of Harley's comical might, found in the pages of Harley Quinn #12:

Note in the previous post that Harley not only drags Batman from under a group of her henchmen with such sudden force that one of them is scattered all the way up to her, she also sends Batman himself airborne and then slams him clear through the floor.

That's merely the continuation of an odd tradition of Harley showing off her muscles ... how the meme was created I don't really know.

Somebody suggested Poison Ivy created the DC equivalent of a Captain America serum for Quinn. Ivy has a lot of experience with mixing herbs and elixirs and the like so there might be some truth to that.

At any rate, here's the first time I ever saw Harley in the pages of a DC comic (as opposed to the popular Batman Animated Series cartoon that spawned her), Superman/Batman #19, aka Supergirl #0 ...

All that super strength courtesy of Poison Ivy and Harley still lets the Joker beat up on her. She must really like being abused.

Harley's no Captain America, but she is superhuman.

Her fight with croc was pretty impressive too.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Harley's no Captain America, but she is superhuman.

Her fight with croc was pretty impressive too.

Everyone but Selina owns poor Waylon

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Everyone but Selina owns poor Waylon

Originally posted by -Pr-
Harley's no Captain America, but she is superhuman.

Her fight with croc was pretty impressive too.



Actually, it's because of that fight with Killer Croc that I didn't rate Harley higher than Cap, for, until today, I had no reason to think Cap himself was truly at that level, just had his acrobatic and martial arts skill and really dense shield to provide him with the hitting power missing between the two. Until today I felt Harley would probably win a tug of war or armwrestling match between the two.

But I'd only seen classic Cap to this point, the one that Kingpin was bearhugging into submission, with Cap wondering how he'd make it through the encounter; not the one that could do something like this:

.

Now that I think of it, this kinda raises the question of how Kyle's avoided running in to any OTHER strongwilled physically strong people in all this time. He'd have been LONG out of this world if Black Adam had decided to go this route ...

Or, that scene was pure PIS.

To reflect some of the new information I've come across in this thread,
I'll give this slightly revised edition of the original. Note that this is the URL edition, the post with actual click-able links immediately follows.


Slade Gauntlet.
Grip Strength Challenge.

No strikes or tripping allowed.
Contestants must maintain handholds on each other at all times.
Ring is 10 feet in diameter.

Win is accrued by any proof of pure physical strength superiority,
i.e. forcing a ring out, forcing opponents hands behind their back despite their active resistance, breaking the bones of the opponents hand, submission, etcetera.


Contest inspired by the following:

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105504
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105497
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105483

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105236
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14107037





How far can Slade progress against the following line-up?
Can he clear?


01. Grifter

02. Nightwing (Richard Grayson)

03. Superboy Prime (depowered; under full red sunlight)

04. Deadpool

05. Batman (Bruce Wayne)
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105053

06. Bane (non-juiced)

07. Wally West (no speed allowed, just West's natural strength)
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105059

08. Harley Quinn
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14090226
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106977
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106989

09. Captain America
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106941
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14107026


10. Kingpin (Wilson Fisk)
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106318
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106786
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106788
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106794

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106816
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106821
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=13948936


Bonus Round:

Slade gets to use a set of power gloves to TRIPLE his strength to tackle the following people.

Can he clear these 5 opponents?


11. Bane (fully juiced)

12. Killer Croc

13. Cable

14. Norman Osborn (Green Goblin)
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14073549

15. Kingpin (enraged)
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106391
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106393
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106398

Slade Gauntlet.
Grip Strength Challenge.

Click-able link version.


No strikes or tripping allowed.
Contestants must maintain handholds on each other at all times.
Ring is 10 feet in diameter.

Win is accrued by any proof of pure physical strength superiority,
i.e. forcing a ring out, forcing opponents hands behind their back despite their active resistance, breaking the bones of the opponents hand, submission, etcetera.


Contest inspired by the following:

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105504
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105497
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105483

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105236
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14107037





How far can Slade progress against the following line-up?
Can he clear?


01. Grifter

02. Nightwing (Richard Grayson)

03. Superboy Prime (depowered; under full red sunlight)

04. Deadpool

05. Batman (Bruce Wayne)

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105053

06. Bane (non-juiced)

07. Wally West (no speed allowed, just West's natural strength)

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105059

08. Harley Quinn

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14090226
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106977
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106989

09. Captain America

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106941
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14107026


10. Kingpin (Wilson Fisk)

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106318
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106786
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106788
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106794

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106816
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106821
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=13948936


Bonus Round:

Slade gets to use a set of power gloves to TRIPLE his strength to tackle the following people.

Can he clear these 5 opponents?


11. Bane (fully juiced)

12. Killer Croc

13. Cable

14. Norman Osborn (Green Goblin)

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14073549

15. Kingpin (enraged)

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106391
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106393
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106398

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
hmm



Does Cap have anything to match or top Kingpin's shoving match here ... ?



I don't think Steve can exactly match that one. But he has some impressive ones.

Cap while disguised as Crossbones holds off superhuman Maddog.
http://img487.imageshack.us/img487/551/captainamerica41116cp1.jpg
http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/751/captainamerica41117fa5.jpg

Here he holds off the arms of Octowoman
http://img362.imageshack.us/my.php?image=secretwar41314zh0.jpg

Here he catches USAgents punch. Agent is around 10 ton strength.
http://imageshack.us/a/img59/3679/usagentpunch.th.jpg

http://imageshack.us/a/img341/2663/usagentpunch2.th.jpg

Lady Octopus.

Cracking Crimson Dynamo's armor without using his shield is nice, too.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Yes.

That's just some thin scaffolding.

Steve has ripped off the arms of large robots.

He has uprooted multi-ton statues from the ground while being chained to them. Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
It's not.

A lot a cap feats are amped by "calculations" and random assertions of posters around here. Statue feat, car dragging broken axle, "helicopter pull", etc. I've also heard frequently that slade has no "real" strength feats because they dont meet some fashioned criteria, but thats just kmc...

That same logic applies to when you calculate for Slade. At least Cap is consistent.

Dcnu slade has been pretty consistant as of late. His nth armir also boosts his stats.

Stops at Deadpool. Come at me.

HFless DP would be weaker.

Supposed to, but he wasnt. Also his HF is back already.

Originally posted by SamZED
Supposed to, but he wasnt. Also his HF is back already.

Got it from Wolverine, same rules apply. But it probably takes time/maybe outside factors for the amped strength to fade away.

Blocking Moonstone's punch is more impressive than breaking Gay Lantern's hand.

Originally posted by SamZED
Stops at Deadpool. Come at me.

Alright ...

Participation has been fairly active here; let's see where an elimination-style format leads...


Win is accrued by any proof of pure physical strength superiority,
i.e. forcing a ring out, forcing opponents hands behind their back despite their active resistance, breaking the bones of the opponents hand, submission, etcetera.




Contest inspired by the following:

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105504
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105497
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105483

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105236
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14107037





How far can Slade progress against the following line-up?
Can he clear?


01. Grifter

02. Nightwing (Richard Grayson)

03. Superboy Prime (depowered; under full red sunlight)

-- lost to de-powered Superman in Infinite Crisis in fist fight

04. Deadpool

-- Wikipedia suggests that, at his debut, Wade may have had some measure of superhuman strength; retconned soon afterward

05. Batman (Bruce Wayne)

-- normal human, albeit peak human
-- has lost to Slade in physical combat; several times if memory serves

06. Bane (non-juiced)


07. Wally West (no speed allowed, just West's natural strength)

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105059

-- jury's still out here; based on the feat above, Wally MAY have the lower body strength to force a ring out ...

08. Harley Quinn

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14090226
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106977
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106989

-- regarded Killer Croc as her superior; seem to remember a juiced Bane taking out Killer Croc ... looking to see something that objectively places Killer Croc's strength in this chart before doing anything with Harley
-- also, looking for specs on the "whammer" (giant hammer) device
If only ordinary object of great size, weight, and durability, safe-breaking swing easily ranks on or above Slade's heavy metal door kick-down feat.

09. Captain America

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106941
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14107026

-- seen enough on this guy to feel comfortable having placed him as one of the final 3 regular "gates" for Slade ... Not sure if he actually outranks Harley or not, again, need to see either more feats from him, or something that places where Killer Croc would rate in this thread and against Cap, and thus a reasonably good estimate of where Harley really rates.

10. Kingpin (Wilson Fisk)

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106318
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106786
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106788
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106794

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106816
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106821
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=13948936

-- still the top regular choice. Seems to have proportionally more strength feats to # of appearances than Cap and consistently higher ones as well. Even Cap supporters admit Cap has nothing to match the wall push he demonstrated in an active shoving match with Spider-man, and Kingpin, unlike Cap, REGULARLY used to match Spidey in such grappling contests


Bonus Round:

Slade gets to use a set of power gloves to TRIPLE his strength to tackle the following people.

Can he clear these 5 opponents?


11. Bane (fully juiced)

12. Killer Croc

13. Cable

-- heard this guy could actually lift 10 tons??
where?? why??

14. Norman Osborn (Green Goblin)
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14073549

-- placed here because I seem to remember Osborn actually beating Kingpin in a physical altercation.
Think that was the TV series, though ... and writers played fast and loose with the strength levels of characters there (Black CAT with might enough to bend 3-inch thick steel doors??)
Goblin is rated high, though, not only for his showing here, but because Spider-man remarked on the heightened strength of his successor, Hobglobin.
Spider-man also commented on the LACK of strength of his son, Harry Osborn, as Green Goblin, who had not, at the point of that particular story, taken the Goblin physique-enhancing serum.


15. Kingpin (enraged)

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106391
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106393
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14106398

Originally posted by SamZED
Stops at Deadpool. Come at me.

Current elimination list.
Starred selections will be next to go unless someone presents defense or good argument against Slade taking them.

Single asterisk (*) = to be struck from list on next posting
Double asterisk (*) = to be struck from list after people have had at least 48 hours to contest


01. Grifter

02. Nightwing (Richard Grayson)

03. Superboy Prime (depowered; under full red sunlight)*

Reason(s) will be struck:

-- lost to de-powered Superman in Infinite Crisis in fist fight
Based on how he's done in physical re-training drills with Bruce in various comics, Superman, de-powered, is below the strength level of Batman, whom Slade has easily physically taken

04. Deadpool**

-- Wikipedia suggests that, at his debut, Wade may have had some measure of superhuman strength; retconned soon afterward

05. Batman (Bruce Wayne)

06. Bane (non-juiced)**


07. Wally West (no speed allowed, just West's natural strength)**


08. Harley Quinn

09. Captain America

10. Kingpin (Wilson Fisk)



Bonus Round:

Slade has the option to use a set of power gloves to TRIPLE his strength to tackle the following people.

Does he need them?

If he uses said gloves, does he fully clear?


11. Bane (fully juiced)

12. Killer Croc

13. Cable

14. Norman Osborn (Green Goblin)

15. Kingpin (enraged)

Your Wally's feat has him using his super speed ermm

Originally posted by Daredevil1
That same logic applies to when you calculate for Slade. At least Cap is consistent. never do.

Consistent is the opposite of what cap highest strength feats are. They are his only feats consistently cited as if they are the norm though.

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
Current elimination list.
Starred selections will be next to go unless someone presents defense or good argument against Slade taking them.

Single asterisk (*) = to be struck from list on next posting
Double asterisk (*) = to be struck from list after people have had at least 48 hours to contest


01. Grifter

02. Nightwing (Richard Grayson)

03. Superboy Prime (depowered; under full red sunlight)*

Reason(s) will be struck:

-- lost to de-powered Superman in Infinite Crisis in fist fight
Based on how he's done in physical re-training drills with Bruce in various comics, Superman, de-powered, is below the strength level of Batman, whom Slade has easily physically taken

04. Deadpool**

-- Wikipedia suggests that, at his debut, Wade may have had some measure of superhuman strength; retconned soon afterward

05. Batman (Bruce Wayne)

06. Bane (non-juiced)**


07. Wally West (no speed allowed, just West's natural strength)**


08. Harley Quinn

09. Captain America

10. Kingpin (Wilson Fisk)



Bonus Round:

Slade has the option to use a set of power gloves to TRIPLE his strength to tackle the following people.

Does he need them?

If he uses said gloves, does he fully clear?


11. Bane (fully juiced)

12. Killer Croc

13. Cable

14. Norman Osborn (Green Goblin)

15. Kingpin (enraged)
Fair enough.

Deadpool's strength is generally understimated. But there are other factors to be taken into concideration here. It's a gauntlet so Slade will be somewhat tired by the time he gets to DP. Another factor is skill. As long as we're talking about grabbing/pushing etc.. Deadpool was trained by one of worlds greatest sumo fighter. Eventually Deadpool got so good he started treating his former master like an annoying stepchild.

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/29/2205464deadpoolteamuppa.jpg/

Now for strength. Deadpool might not be superhuman like Spider-man or Sabertooth but he's got some superhuman strength feats and was referred to as superhuman.

Here he throws Peter Parker many feet through the air using one hand:
http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/3056/cdp242006streetsamuraid.png

Another shot at Spider-man, not bad concidering he's trying to resist the mindcontrol:
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/32/avengingspiderman13theg.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/707/avengingspiderman13theg.jpg/

Not the only time he displayed impressive level of strength. Here he leaps on top of a very tall building. Does it with ease and only two leaps:
http://s55.radikal.ru/i148/0905/8d/cf665faad759.jpg
Notice that the tower on the background is now well below him.

Now for that "breaking GL fingers" thing. Deadpool is strong enough to snap some guy's neck using only two fingers:
http://s58.radikal.ru/i159/0905/77/f570e4f8001f.jpg
Its stated on-panel that it takes superhuman level of strength.

Just worming up.
Here we see Deadpool effortlessly catch Captain America's shield, a feat only few were able to perform:
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/835/cap6v.jpg/
Cap is shocked for a moment.

Speaking of Cap, here we see one of DP's latest fights with Captain America. This is one royally pissed off Deadpool but he's still holding back willingly taking all the punches and asking for more. Grabs Steve by the throat, lifts him above the ground and strangles him using only one hand:
http://img831.imageshack.us/img831/7188/dpcap8.jpg

Deadpool's locked up in an asylum. Poor inmates...
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/36/dp42oroboroscps014.jpg/

4 MI6 agents try to pin him down:
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/849/agents1.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/502/agents2.jpg/
Good luck with that.

Wade is strong enough to punch Moon Knight through a wall:
http://s980.beta.photobucket.com/user/ankur2292/media/VengeanceofMoonKnight07pg11copy.jpg.html#/user/ankur2292/media/VengeanceofMoonKnight07pg11copy.jpg.html?&_suid=13543011365110857494471942704
He did it twice actually second time sending MK flying many feet through the air and then through a wall. Sadly don't have the second scan on me.

There's more. Drops Goliath with a kick:
http://img691.imageshack.us/img691/9979/scan0006.png
Although it can be argued its more of a skill feat.

Catches a punch thrown by Wolverine:
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/813/deadpool51thegroup013.jpg/

Nearly breaks Taskmaster's jaw with a hit.. while handcuffed and leggcuffed:
http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/4845/tm6u.png
http://img43.imageshack.us/img43/1377/tm7.png
Taskmaster comments on how strong Wade hits. And that's coming from a guy who's taken hits from Captain America, Elektra, Spider-man etc..

Kicks Colossus off balance apparently knocking him off the roof:
http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/2594/deadpool180018.png

vs Daredevil and Silver Sable:
http://img380.imageshack.us/img380/6268/silversable2315.jpg

B!tchslaps Wild Child sending him flying through the air:
http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/5044/wildchildx.png

Pins down Warpath (the guy's superhuman):
http://s5.beta.photobucket.com/user/CATMANEXE/media/DPOOL/hulk15/Hulk15018.jpg.html#/user/CATMANEXE/media/DPOOL/hulk15/Hulk15018.jpg.html?&_suid=135430216523503540194284237007

Kicks Cable's head through a wall:
http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/934/xforce01509.jpg
He's done a simillar thing with a class 100 Doc Samson, dont have that scan on me.

Breaks Madcap's neck with a punch. 180.
http://img519.imageshack.us/img519/729/madcap.jpg

And that's excluding somewhat PISy feats he has like catching a punch thrown by Moonstone (she's Ms. Marvel strong) and almost breaking her hand:
http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/3015/msmarvel041page016.jpg

...or carrying a hugeass bomb over a hill:
http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/6571/dptu889legioncps016.jpg

Summing up.. Deadpool is pretty damn strong. Im not going to get into the whole "who's stronger? Him or Slade" argument but I think I made it somewhat believable that it's a good fight. And concidering Slade will be already tired.. that brings me back to my original post:

Originally posted by SamZED
Stops at Deadpool.

Originally posted by SamZED
(she's Ms. Marvel strong)

Not really. But she's pretty strong, true. Overall, good post.

Also nice to see Spidey's web dome in comics.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Not really. But she's pretty strong, true. Overall, good post.

Also nice to see Spidey's web dome in comics. My bad. But she's still way out of his league. Heck she's way out of Spider-man's league physically. Also im not sure if Doc Samson is class 100 or 80-90?

Depends. We need to consider the length of his hair during that time, for example. Marvel database has him at 70 tons, but we all know those internet bios and handbooks are not as reliable as the actual comic book panels.

Vision was wanking Samson when he offered him to join the Avengers.

Not bad, Sam.

Although I'd dismiss the big bomb as a scene played for comic effect and the struggle with Warpath as story-driven, or, at best, an outlier, not reflecting Wade's average strength, your feats and the style of art lend that Moonknight Kick credence and that toss of Pete out of a car and over a bridge rail is something either matching or just shy of what Harlequinn did to Batman and errant members of her gang.
Actually the wall kick might top that; I'll have to think about this a bit ...


At any rate, because of what you showed, not only does Wade get a stay of elimination, but he gets bumped up from the #4 to the #7 slot.

Wade might get the nod over Harley if you either come with better showings or prove this most recent list, well, recent, countering the Wiki charge that Wade's strength was only a feature of his earliest years.

As for the gauntlet theme, do note that the purpose was to determine where people would place Slade based on physical strength in the purest sense possible, not skill.

Wally, for instance, is given a chance based on the supposition that all his legwork might have given him greater than normal ability to push a grappling opponent around to where he wants them to go,
the fact that his son, Jai, apparently has some degree of metahuman strength (implying that Wally might have the genes for this as well?) and, again, the fact he was lightly able to pick up and run with an 800 pound rod with apparent ease, whereas the greatest feat I'd seen him perform before this was picking up 1 or 2 people and running with them.

I intended Slade to be going fresh against fresh opponents,
just wanted to see who TRULY matches him in strength under standard conditions.
I wasn't designing a gauntlet to wear him down.

Besides, Slade has enhanced endurance and stamina compared to the average person.
He'd be essentially at his normal standard for every subsequent opponent by simple power of this fact.


Other:

Superboy Prime got struck as promised.




Current contention list:

Starred selections will be next to go unless someone presents defense or good argument against Slade taking them.

Single asterisk (*) = to be struck from list on next posting
Double asterisk (**) = to be struck from list after people have had at least 48 hours to contest


01. Grifter

02. Nightwing (Richard Grayson)

03. Superboy Prime (depowered; under full red sunlight)

04. Batman (Bruce Wayne)


05. Wally West (no speed allowed, just West's natural strength)**

06. Bane (non-juiced)**

-- (known feats? any?)

07. Deadpool

-- Wikipedia suggests that, at his debut, Wade may have had some measure of superhuman strength; retconned soon afterward

08. Harley Quinn

09. Captain America

10. Kingpin (Wilson Fisk)


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bonus Round:

Slade has the option to use a set of power gloves to TRIPLE his strength to tackle the following people.

Does he need them?

If he uses said gloves, does he fully clear?
------------------------------------------------------------------------------


11. Bane (fully juiced)

12. Killer Croc

13. Cable

14. Norman Osborn (Green Goblin)

15. Kingpin (enraged)

Agreed about the bomb, thats why i said its PISy. The thing about Warpath, its pretty consistent. Deadpool fought him in the past too and barehanded. only an interference prevented Wade from kicking his ass. And its not the only superhuman he fought/beat. There's Tigershark, Walrus (i know lol but still that guy was tossing cars around and Deadpool blitzed him to ko), Shatterstar, held his own in a wrestling match vs the same monster that wrestled the Thing before him. Id definitely place Wade above Harley and ill gladly post more feats to prove it. But tomorrow. Just keep him on the list untill then.

Ps: if i had to compare Wade's strength to someone itd be Cap. Imo theyre roughly on the same level, that much was clear from their encounters.

More feats as promised.


Breaks some armored hero's neck. Again 180:
http://img34.imageshack.us/img34/5933/dpglisfs010048.png

Kicks a zombie's head off its shoulders:
http://img704.imageshack.us/img704/5846/cd48dcp0005.png

While underwater immobilises Ajax (superhuman) and kills him. Judging by the blood he did more than just snap his neck.
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c357/geshien/dp3.jpg

KOs Shatterstar with a guttpunch. SS is also superhuman.
http://s51.radikal.ru/i134/0905/c3/8916f01be013.jpg
http://i068.radikal.ru/0905/83/18fad84b9320.jpg

Beats on Tigershark:
http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/614/deadpool0616.jpg

Speedblitzes and KOs Wallrus (who was shown tossing cars in the same issue)
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/820/fidp2oroboroscps030.jpg/

Vs Cable. Nate has to resort to TK in order to win.
http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/3338/img014.png

Once again punches Moon Knight through a wall. Only this time sends him flying with the hit:
http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l107/A_Flight11/VengeanceofMoonKnight08pg15copy.jpg

One last feat. Same fight with Captain America. Guess this counts as strength/durability feat.

http://img823.imageshack.us/img823/3787/2212015dpcap6super.jpg

Originally posted by SamZED
More feats as promised.



Will you think me awful if I admit that my first thought was not anything concerning Wade, but instead:

"My, but Squirrel Girl is strong for a non-powered lady...
Look at the DISTANCE she gets on that kick ...!"



?

You're looking for non-Venom Bane feats?

Well, he's ripped peoples arms clean out of their socket before. Has ridiculous damage soak (not that that matters here, but it shows his pain tolerance and stamina).

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
You're looking for non-Venom Bane feats?

Well, he's ripped peoples arms clean out of their socket before. Has ridiculous damage soak ...

Bane is presenting some problems.

Namely:

1) What do you decide if Character B has greater feats than Character A, and greater by far, but Character A easily beats Character B in actual confrontations, even when Character A is not at full power and should NOT be able, "objectively", to beat Character B even at max potential?

2) How do you decide what "clean" means to a character who has essentially had super serum treatments a la Captain America to PERMANENTLY boost his stats? Is there such thing as a true "base" level for him anymore? Does taking away addictive strength-enhancing drugs reduce the character to average base, something lower, or something higher by inducing mania ("lunatic" strength)?



For, in regards to the first, I've found Killer Croc perform a greater strength feat than anyone in this thread:

... yet Croc is easily beaten by Bane after Bane venoms up ...

Croc is a joke. Was getting his ass handed to him when Bane wasn't on venom, too.

Non-venom Bane beat Azrael and his sidekick, both on venom... now that's badass

http://img190.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=74354_Bane_vs_Croc_3_122_1191lo.jpg (props to Supermutant)

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Croc ... a joke.
...when Bane wasn't on venom, too.



Yeah, I was just about to post that.

But it doesn't really make sense how Bane, with no feats on that level even when powered up, can break Croc with OR without his "juice" ...


Going by feats, Croc should win ... but that's obviously not the "reality" of the funny books ...

Croc is the Rhino of DC and he mutated further much later, becoming stronger...

Ah, I see, then ...

The bank vault tear must be a more recent showing ...


Thanks for clarifying.

Yes, that's what I think. It looks fairly recent, at least in comparison to his fight with Bane, I mean.

Modern Croc took a hit from Osiris and gave him a bloody lip with a punch.

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
Bane is presenting some problems.

Namely:

1) What do you decide if Character B has greater feats than Character A, and greater by far, but Character A easily beats Character B in actual confrontations, even when Character A is not at full power and should NOT be able, "objectively", to beat Character B even at max potential?

2) How do you decide what "clean" means to a character who has essentially had super serum treatments a la Captain America to PERMANENTLY boost his stats? Is there such thing as a true "base" level for him anymore? Does taking away addictive strength-enhancing drugs reduce the character to average base, something lower, or something higher by inducing mania ("lunatic" strength)?



For, in regards to the first, I've found Killer Croc perform a greater strength feat than anyone in this thread: He goes back down to normal. He's not permanently stronger because of his venom.
Venom is a highly addictive liquid form of Miraclo, the same thing that Hourman uses for his Hour of Power.

Even if it were the case his stats were boosted permanently, which it isn't, being off Venom would still be the weakest and thus his base.

IMHO DS beats the first 9.
I don't know much about classic Kingpin, but if he is simply peak human then Slade should beat him 2.

As for the bonus round, no idea as they all have some degree of metahuman stats.

Classic Kingpin was way above peak human.

So is Captain America.

It's a little more complex than that. Classic Captain America seems to be what you guys are calling "peak human". Modern Cap seems to be, on average, like a peak human or Olympian having an "adrenaline" moment. You know, the kind where, say a 125 pound mom can lift a car off her son? I'm not sure if Modern Cap actually exceeds that level by leaps and pounds -- Cap would have at least 2 to 3 times more size and muscle mass than said adrenalized mom. He weighs, what ... 250 pounds or so?

Kingpin would weigh considerably more than that. The old Marvel lines about him being 300 pounds are off. A man his size would be more like 5 or even 600 pounds, like some of the sumo wrestlers we've seen make their way into MMA and the like. He wouldn't really have to be above peak human to do what he does, you would just have to consider the average person you NORMALLY look at in the comics and call "peak human" is in the 150 to 200 pound range. Kingpin, is 3 or 4 times that heavy, and so should be (and apparently is) 3 or 4 times that strong.

For a fun exercise, stop and consider how strong even a woman like Poison Ivy would have to be in real life to do what she's doing here -- supporting the weight of herself and another athletic woman on a rope using nothing but her flexed arm strength. Simulation of a 200+ pound curl in one sense. That would be pretty d--- strong, but there ARE actually people in real life who are that strong, even women, and you will find them as your top parkour (city-running) specialists and high-level performance acrobats. If you have a moment, I'd even suggest checking out on YouTube, the DSW series video(s) boy and girl motivation. You can see a young guy hold himself on a bar and hold a woman, and either curl the woman or curl them both (he's wearing glasses and a Superman T-shirt, looking like Action Comics Clark, it's VERY cool ...)

Continuation of the scene posted a moment ago, image 2 of 3...

Image 3 of 3.

Note that Poison Ivy's parkour level stunt was slightly above the average of DC's famous "street" characters, who, as a matter of course, must do similar bodyweight and twice bodyweight arm "exercises" to go about their weekly city explorations, patrols, and crime fighting routines.

Ivy has a pretty strong physique is what that tells us; there's no getting around it. Note now, however, that a simple, genuine hug of thanks from Harley Quinn, not intended in the least for harm, intimidation, warning or anything else, nearly takes Ivy's breath away.

Heavy implication that Harley could deal out some damage if she ever wanted to, and a suggestion, combined with the other instances of her throwing around members of the batfamily, that Harley is on a level of strength well above theirs.


Taken from Harley Quinn #12.

I'm figuring the best way to show what Classic Kingpin was like is to show what he WASN'T quite like. Gonna take up this page for it, because it highlights some of everything mentioned. Real big strong guy. Strength feats. Smashing feats. Durability soak. Brawling/grappling contest with superhuman opposition, etcetera.

It should highlight why I don't quite feel comfortable giving Wade a nod over anyone with serum-based super-ability, striking feats, etcetera, why I think size REALLY matters when you're talking about very DIFFERENTLY sized "peak humans", and so on.

Anyway, this is going to take up the entirety of this page; you can skip this page and refer tomorrow if I get a chance to post to the URL and/or link version.

At any rate, without further ado, from Amazing Spider-man #73 and #75 ... Man Mountain Marko:

low level strength feat. ripping a couch apart barehanded

superhuman opponent-leveling punch

50. spidey counters

60 wall thrown marko

70. damage soak ability. normal peak human.

80. marko couch counter

90. Note in the actual comic that a few moments is spent on the Maggia getting Wilson out of jail, complete with bail bondsman scenes etcetera. Not worth showing here due to the subject matter of this thread, then ...

100. 'nother strength feat. Marko, normal "peak" human, is able to rip out a wall safe. Apparently with one hand, just as his dialogue says.
The wall is presumably plaster, so not QUITE as impressive as the mere typing of that sentence makes it look, mind you ...

110. more damage soak, marko endures the strikes of Spider-Man and remains standing ...

120. partial wall-smashing. marko cracks the room by bodyslamming spider-man.

130. wall slam stunned spidey. note rubble on floor now from damage of marko's slamming force

140. spidey counters after marko threatens shocker's girlfriend

150. There is an interlude with Joe Robertson counseling his son. They are interrupted by J. Jonah Jameson unreasonably demanding things of Robbie, and Robbie standing his ground, and his son noting his father doing so, impressed. Jonah decides to back down, and the action phase then progresses with the following panel ...


Note that Marko, again, just a normal peak human, managed to hold his own against Spider-man in the interim and AGAIN reverse the momentum of their skirmish ...

160. Marko ends his 1st see-saw scuffle with Spider-man by playing the hostage card ...

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
It's a little more complex than that. Classic Captain America seems to be what you guys are calling "peak human". Modern Cap seems to be, on average, like a peak human or Olympian having an "adrenaline" moment. m

Cap peak human has been expanded on. Statements of strength of 10 another time half a platoon. Other times his strength has been called preternatural. Which means beyond man.

I don't know if he was the first but mark gruenwald called Cap the peak of human potential. Later to even the next step in human evolution by another writer.

170. spidey save ... pete bails out the window for shocker's girlfriend , end spidey versus man mountain , round 1

200
Originally posted by Daredevil1
Cap peak human has been expanded on. Statements of strength of 10 ... another time half a platoon ...


Exploring what "peak human" means, is, again, why this thread, and, again, why this particular interlude. How many times has Spider-man been called "stronger than a dozen men", for instance? Yet, does that mean it takes someone with the strength of 12 people to defeat him?
Are those 12 people "peak humans" or just average? Does the size of the person matter? If Spidey has the strength of 12, how does just one normal, if very big and strong, man give him as much trouble as was shown in the last few panels displayed?


With this particular case of Marko, though, I'm trying to show that the impressivenss of Character A is often due not only to them being legitimately impressive on an absolute scale, but ALSO due to Character B not giving 110% to take them down.

It is also due to size and weight.

At some point, size and weight truly, truly matter.

Marko is genuinely impressive, for instance. Human and all, he damage soaks and delivers the way Classic Cap on his best days was probably wont to do.

However, quite UNLIKE Classic Kingpin, who I plan to show tomorrow on the next page, Marko is not "truly" in Spider-man's class.

This point is made apparent when he and Pete rematch 2 issues later:

210. Spider-man versus Marko. Round 2.

220. 'Nother strength feat. This illustrates one reason I HAVE to call striking feats by Wade and company into question. ARE they indeed legitimately superhuman showings? Note that Marko here is able to break up a brick or tiled floor with a single punch or two.

Note that Marko does this despite being only a normal human and, apparently likewise WITHOUT formal martial arts training, which Slade, Captain America, and even Wade have in abundance, which would allow these last 3 to break lots of durable items and impressively smash things even WITHOUT possessing strength beyond peak human level.

Deathstroke has also been stated strength of ten. Both him and Steve have also been called "almost" superhuman. Don't get caught up in the calculation of the men. I don't see 12 men together performing a current Spiderman strength feat.

Spider-man versus Man Mountain Marko. Round 2. End fight scene.

The use of his wall-crawling ability and resultant advantage in leverage, manuever-ability, etcetera, gives Spider-man an easy win this second time around. Weaponless, in a straight-up no skills brawl, could Wade or Cap do what Spidey so easily does in this re-match?

Somehow, I can't see Classic Cap dropping a guy like Marko before 2 pages was up; Wade only if he cheated. Because of seeing Slade crush Kyle's hand by simply squeezing, though, I CAN see Slade humbling Marko in a direct no-skills "macho-rules" match-up.

Again, though, the real point of showing this is to illustrate how simply making your normal "peak human" a little larger than average makes a significant difference to strength ratings.
Marko might give a Nightwing or even Batman some difficulty. First time around he even does so for Spider-man, until Spider-man makes fuller actual USE of true meta-power.

Key here is size, not superhuman-ness.
Marko is normal human but BIG enough to matter.

Kingpin is bigger and heavier still.
He'll matter even more, as I'll prove tomorrow if I get the chance, even as you've seen that in a few of the pages before now.

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
Spider-man versus Man Mountain Marko. Round 2. End fight scene.

The use of his wall-crawling ability and resultant advantage in leverage, manuever-ability, etcetera, gives Spider-man an easy win this second time around. Weaponless, in a straight-up no skills brawl, could Wade or Cap do what Spidey so easily does in this re-match?

Somehow, I can't see Classic Cap dropping a guy like Marko before 2 pages was up; Wade only if he cheated. Because of seeing Slade crush Kyle's hand by simply squeezing, though, I CAN see Slade humbling Marko in a direct no-skills "macho-rules" match-up.



Slade isn't all that stronger then Cap or Wade.

I still say slade>cap across the board physically. Even strengh. At least DCnU slade seeing as how his strengh is heightened by his nth metal armor

His feats sure don't show it. Maybe if your lucky Nudc Slade will.

DCnU Slade has already shown some impressive stuff, along with his already enhanced stats boosted by Nth Metal.

Current Cap is showing some crazy durability feats. Nudc opening the plane with his armor doesn't really impress me. Anything else? Hopefully they give him something better.

Survived an explosion point blank, surviving against Lobo (even lobo said he wouldn't stand a chance if it weren't his armor), withstanding Legacy's attacks (mini Superman), and he just defeated Hawkman, who has enhanced stats as well.

Originally posted by Daredevil1
His feats sure don't show it. Maybe if your lucky Nudc Slade will. His general feats for sure make him comparable. Caps highest feats are taken as the norm AND exaggerated by posters "estimations", at least here.

Originally posted by namorsubby
His general feats for sure make him comparable. Caps highest feats are taken as the norm AND exaggerated by posters "estimations", at least here.


Cap average feats put him at a level equal to Slave or even better to be hones. Slade fans just like to hype Slade with bias statements of being greater across the board including strength. At least by certain fans.

Originally posted by Golgo13
Survived an explosion point blank, surviving against Lobo (even lobo said he wouldn't stand a chance if it weren't his armor), withstanding Legacy's attacks (mini Superman), and he just defeated Hawkman, who has enhanced stats as well.


Most of those feats have really been duplicated by classic Slade. To be honest Slade has impressive fight feats. I was more asking towards a strength feat of lifting.

Nah, Slade is a fighting character, not a strength guy like Supes. So there aren't (m?)any examples of him lifting weights.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Nah, Slade is a fighting character, not a strength guy like Supes. So there aren't (m?)any examples of him lifting weights.


That is true but neither is Cap yet his feats of strength are better then Slades. Not just his high ends but his consistent strength feats on a whole.

Despite a great increase in participation, no one presented anything for Wally, who had his promised 48 hours and so now gets eliminated ...

Grifter
Superboy Prime (depowered)
Poison Ivy
Nightwing
Batman (Bruce Wayne)
Flash (Walter West)

I decided to amend the list a bit to account for the fact that some of the characters change so much in terms of physical capability that they are not really the same character. Captain America is one such case; scarcely more than a stripling teenager to the Kingpin in their way-back-when battle, possibly the superior of Kingpin's classic form now.
Meanwhile, of course, Kingpin seems to have gotten a downgrade.
At the least, few can think of any significant strength feats coming from him since the 1990s.

At any rate, the list now reflects the power changes that occurred over time.

Note the list is still elimination format.
These will be the next 3 people to go ...


Captain America (Classic)*
-- no one has yet come with a feat for Cap pre90s worth considering.

Man Mountain Marko*
-- included here as a guide for what I'm looking for objectively to determine these rankings.
-- note that Marko demonstrates the ability to grapple and brawl with a superhuman noted for being higher than anyone on the original list of 10, including Modern Captain America, or Slade himself, i.e. Spider-man.
(Marko is also included here, because, years later, in a turn strikingly similar to Bane, he essentially got "super juiced" to become a bigger contender. He actually became a truly difficult challenge for 90s Spider-man to put down. Gives a semi-plausible indication of where Bane himself might rank when roided out, as a result)

Killer Croc (Classic)*
-- beaten by Bane, as someone previously mentioned, even at Bane's non pumped level, suffering a 2nd armbreak at Bane's hands


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Note that the remaining list has a cluster of 5 people contending to break that #5 spot up.
These 5 seem to be close enough in feats, concepts, and overall performance as to be NEARLY interchange-able; I'll see if fans present anything solid enough to contradict how I decided they rate against each other to determine their final ranking.


06 Bane (clean)

05-5 Deadpool
05-4 Harley Quinn
05-3 Classic Kingpin (Calm)
05-2 Captain America (Modern, high end)
05-1 Slade

04 Green Goblin
03 Bane (fully juiced)
02 Classic Kingpin (enraged)
01 Killer Croc (Modern)

Originally posted by Daredevil1
That is true but neither is Cap yet his feats of strength are better then Slades. Not just his high ends but his consistent strength feats on a whole. completely disagree, seeing as his high end and his norm are two different levels. Even pre-DCnU slade is obviously more superhuman overall, and at least comparable strengh wise. DCnU slade Being enhanced by nth metal clearly places him ahead.

Dont have scans right now but GG is def stronger than Fisk or juiced Bane. Norman is a legitimate superhuman with class 10+ strength. I know youre i terested in scans and ill gladly provide them later, just wanted to point that out.

Originally posted by namorsubby
completely disagree, seeing as his high end and his norm are two different levels. Even pre-DCnU slade is obviously more superhuman overall, and at least comparable strengh wise. DCnU slade Being enhanced by nth metal clearly places him ahead.


DCnU Slade if he's stronger in the armor so be it, they just sure are not giving him the strength feats to show this to well then. I mean for all the prop that Slade fans give this armor he hasn't done any Spiderman level feats in regards to strength only.

But anyways classic Slade its kind of to late to save him as being stronger then Steve. He just can't compete with the consistent strength feats is all. Like hearing a old violin play namor. You and me have done this talk before and were are just not going to see eye to eye on this.


Now despite all this I actually view Cap/Slade as very equal in powerlevel despite the scan feat separation. Despite Cap's strength feats being better by comics, I actually view Cap/Slade equals in many of there stats or very close to one another with small differences separating them.

Originally posted by SamZED
is stronger than Fisk or juiced Bane.
Norman is a legitimate superhuman with class 10+ strength.
I know you're interested in scans ...


To say the least ...


Conceptually, I'm willing to grant you this, Sam.


If you're going to try to prove this with scans, though, I think you'll have an uphill battle. I'm more convinced than ever that people have not been exposed to Classic Kingpin seeing a response like this.

Unfortunately, with probably half or more of the scans in Digi's respect thread non-working links now, there's only one way to demonstrate why I've got Kingy as the gold standard for this list ...

10 Kingpin was one of the rare characters who proved himself formidable in his debut and also remained a noteworthy contender over the course of many years.

There was no immediate fading for this guy like for Mountain Marko, and he started off good, too ...

20

Kingpin versus Big Turk

30 Fisk versus Turk. The Kingpin "disciplines" a mob captain.

40 Big Turk versus Kingpin

50 Kingpin versus Turk

Grifter
Superboy Prime (depowered)
Poison Ivy
Nightwing
Batman (Bruce Wayne)
Flash (Walter West)

Captain America (Classic)
Man Mountain Marko
Killer Croc (Classic)


06 Bane (clean)

05-5 Deadpool
05-4 Harley Quinn
05-3 Classic Kingpin (Calm)
05-2 Captain America (Modern, high end)
05-1 Slade

04 Green Goblin
03 Bane (fully juiced)
02 Classic Kingpin (enraged)
01 Killer Croc (Modern)

3000

It's important to rate feats and people against each other in a thread like this. We've seen how Kingpin fared against Big Turk, let's see how Spider-Man fares ...

3010

Quite well. The 1960s and 70s were a time where the new "art" of karate was becoming all the rage. It was held in much higher regard, even in the comics, than it is today ...

Yet Spider-Man, owing to his meta gifts, was able to shrug off a normal guy giving such blows easily enough.

Note the reputation Spider-Man had, alluded to earlier, the comment "stronger than a dozen ORDINARY guys ..."

3020

Spider-Man completes the task at hand as Turk and the others head back to Kingpin's headquarters. No lasting effects apparent from Big Turk unloading on him ...

Before very long Spider-Man is facing off against the Kingpin himself.

Spider-man's trashed every man to this point ...


The battle opens with a bang. Kingpin has a walking cane that is essentially a ray blaster, which Spider-man must destroy, and the battle now begins in earnest ...

Note the effect of Kingpin's first landed blow.

Spider-man, previously able to shrug off Turk's strongest blow, is not only folded on impact, but is light headed and getting dizzy ...

Kingpin now moves to grab Spider-man.

Recall that Spider-man, wall-bound in his rematch with Man Marko a page or so ago, was lightly able to lift Marko up and throw him back down in a heap from that position.

What's the result of wall-bound Spider-man against Fisk here?

Spider-Man is grabbed and slammed against the wall himself.

He's dizzied again; stars can be seen swimming around his head.

He tries to make a fight of it ...

... but Kingpin's already won.

End Round 1.

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
Contest inspired by someone recently posting the following:

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=14105023
(This is Slade breaking Kyle's fingers in hand-to-hand combat.
I don't know what comic it's from.)




sorry guys

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=572894&highlight=userid%3A109921


200

Spiderman gets a rematch against the Kingpin in the following issue.

Note that when he did so against Man Mountain Marko, Marko, though seeming a genuine challenge the first time around, was little more than a victim when Pete got more serious.

Little bit different the case of Wilson Fisk ...

Originally posted by Damborgson
sorry guys

If anything, it was I who tempted you in the first place.

You are the Eve to my Serpent.

210

Note that Spider-man, a bonafide superhuman character, is shown struggling against Kingpin in this direct hand-to-hand matchup. He, like Turk before him, describes the Kingpin's grip as vise-like. In the image shown just a moment ago, he is shaking from the exertion while Kingpin seems a nearly immobile statue. Here, despite Spider-man's strength and clinging ability, he is shown finally LOSING that hand-to-hand grapple ...

220

... even as Spider-man's physical counterstrike is more or less no-sold ...


Note that Kingpin's missed punch shatters part of the floor underneath them.

230

Blue, I hate the way you post pics.

I imagine it's an acquired taste for some; conversely, I had someone just this week private message and say they absolutely love my posts.

Recommend just skipping this particular page.
If you haven't recognized, the pattern is scan heavy page, discussion page. Scan heavy page, discussion page.

Skip the scan heavy pages, which are necessary to create the links you know and love later on.



In the meantime, taking time to answer posts like this only delays the time until I can present these as more conventional links, so ...

240

250

Note Kingpin's quick recovery time.
He actually recovers and gets up faster than Spider-Man, despite being on the receiving end of a double-fisted strike from Pete and taking the brunt of the fall.

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
I imagine it's an acquired taste for some; conversely, I had someone just this week private message and say they absolutely love my posts.

Recommend just skipping this particular page.
If you haven't recognized, the pattern is scan heavy page, discussion page. Scan heavy page, discussion page.

Skip the scan heavy pages, which are necessary to create the links you know and love later on.



In the meantime, taking time to answer posts like this only delays the time until I can present these as more conventional links, so ...

240 tl;dr

What's particularly ironic is that, without yourself, Damborgson, and DarkSaint, all the attachments would have been neatly confined to the previous page, leaving this one entirely free for discussion.

At any rate, ending image of Round 2 and Spider-man's first story arc encounter with the Kingpin.

260

Updated List. Note that Classic Captain America, Man Mountain Marko, and Classic Killer Croc have been struck.


Grifter
Superboy Prime (depowered)
Poison Ivy
Nightwing
Batman (Bruce Wayne)
Flash (Walter West)

Captain America (Classic)
Man Mountain Marko
Killer Croc (Classic)


06 Bane (clean)

05-5 Deadpool
05-4 Harley Quinn
05-3 Classic Kingpin (Calm)
05-2 Captain America (Modern, high end)
05-1 Slade

04 Green Goblin
03 Bane (fully juiced)
02 Classic Kingpin (enraged)
01 Killer Croc (Modern)

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
I imagine it's an acquired taste for some; conversely, I had someone just this week private message and say they absolutely love my posts.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-up1CQNDRc88/TbCUmKGGSbI/AAAAAAAACPw/DCMHzZYsO7k/s1600/smells+like+bullshit.jpg

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
I imagine it's an acquired taste for some; conversely, I had someone just this week private message and say they absolutely love my posts.

Recommend just skipping this particular page.
If you haven't recognized, the pattern is scan heavy page, discussion page. Scan heavy page, discussion page.

Skip the scan heavy pages, which are necessary to create the links you know and love later on.



In the meantime, taking time to answer posts like this only delays the time until I can present these as more conventional links, so ...

240 Use a photo sharing site. Several posts in a row could be considered spam. Using photo sharing would condense the posts and make it easier for everybody to read.