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The Hawkeye Initiative is a tumblr-project where artists take all those ridiculous poses of female characters and redraw them... with Hawkeye

lol...

Scroll down to Liefeld's Cable and Starfire, cracked me up:

http://thehawkeyeinitiative.tumblr.com/page/4

Simply amazing.

And this:
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_meex353BHK1qdtls8o1_400.png

Well the results are humorous, the issue itself is pretty stupid. Men and females have different ideal features and proportions. An artist draws a male form, they emphasizes the chest, shoulders, and biceps. An artist draws a female form, they emphasis the hips, breasts and buttock. Is one more absurd then the other? Would it be better if we treated the female form the same, and give them massive throbbing bis and tris and throbbing veins exploding through the skin? I don't think so.

Also it's much more fun to draw a female than it is a male. You can really work the contraposto to get some dynamic poses that emphasis all the ideal features... you start doing that when a male and you end up with feminine pose.

Personally I think you're dismissing the concept a bit too hastly, the representations of male and female body in comics are pretty codified, but some of those codes have no leg to stand. Obviously there are different representations you can draw upon, and there are tons of examples other than showing derriere and boobs in unfeasibly bended positions vs having a veiny muscular frame.

The poses themselves are actually fun to see, but the fact that they are codified as "female poses" is part of what makes the argument absurd. Dynamic poses and movement is part of what make certain comics visually appealing -Spider-man being a prime example-, and should actually be used in disregards of the poses being "femalish".

Again, most of the reasoning behind this comes from a kind of representation that is a few decades old on mainstream comicbooks, and the trend itself it's as absurd and senseless as it's depicted in that site.

Originally posted by Bentley

Again, most of the reasoning behind this comes from a kind of representation that is a few decades old on mainstream comicbooks, and the trend itself it's as absurd and senseless as it's depicted in that site.

Yea. The absurd part isn't that it's female characters looking sexy. It's that no-one would pose that way in most cases! It'd either be odd, uncomfortable or actively painful, female or male


(The one Branlor posted being one of the rare few that I'd say passes 'the Hawkeye test'!)

Originally posted by Bentley
Personally I think you're dismissing the concept a bit too hastly, the representations of male and female body in comics are pretty codified, but some of those codes have no leg to stand. Obviously there are different representations you can draw upon, and there are tons of examples other than showing derriere and boobs in unfeasibly bended positions vs having a veiny muscular frame.

The poses themselves are actually fun to see, but the fact that they are codified as "female poses" is part of what makes the argument absurd. Dynamic poses and movement is part of what make certain comics visually appealing -Spider-man being a prime example-, and should actually be used in disregards of the poses being "femalish".

Again, most of the reasoning behind this comes from a kind of representation that is a few decades old on mainstream comicbooks, and the trend itself it's as absurd and senseless as it's depicted in that site.

You can draw a character anyway you please, but when you start drawing you learn a set of "ideal" proportions of the human body, and that's typically what comic artists work from. Male or female they are drawn like statuesque figures from the Renaissance. Men and women have different features to be accentuated... that's just the reality of the situation. The female body is curvy, ideally you want to emphasis that.

I don't think many would classify Spider-man's poses as "feminine." It comes down to the features that are being emphasized. Here is what it largely comes down too form an art perspective. The male form is (typically) widest at the shoulders, while the female form is (again - typically) widest at the hips. So an artist wants to emphasis different portions of the anatomy depending on the gender of the character. The tilt of shoulders and chest for a man, and the tilt of the pelvis and hips for a female (at least that's how I do it)... which means Spider-man doesn't typically get drawn with his ass in our face.

Originally posted by Q99
Yea. The absurd part isn't that it's female characters looking sexy. It's that no-one would pose that way in most cases! It'd either be odd, uncomfortable or actively painful, female or male


Clearly you've never browsed the pictures on a hot girls facebook page...

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Clearly you've never browsed the pictures on a hot girls facebook page...

Originally posted by srankmissingnin

Clearly you've never browsed the pictures on a hot girls facebook page...

That's deliberate posing, though

Try walking around all day (or fighting!) where you constantly stand in one of those poses or others whenever you pause.

When do female characters constantly stand in one of those poses or other poses in their comics?

Anyway, funny shit. American comics have always bored me with their rendition of women (though manga isn't significantly better with their fan-service).

Originally posted by Tzeentch._
When do female characters constantly stand in one of those poses or other poses in their comics?

Try looking at a Greg Land comic book (he draws off reference, and it's often from porn mags or the like. So literally porn poses), or something from Liefeld, for the most obvious examples. Aside from them it really isn't hard to find others artists who regularly do stuff like have female characters stand so their boobs and butts are both visible as often as possible, and you'll see, like, 3-4 woman in a group shot next to some perfectly normal-standing male characters all standing with their torsos half-twisted as well.



One of the other common jokes is "My hips won't unsway!" where you'll see the female characters constantly standing with their hips out in what's supposed to be a casual pose. Less blatantly obvious than the Land Porn Poses or the regularly Ass-Boob pose, but it's another silliness for the pile.

I'm aware that female characters pose in unnatural stances that emphasize their femininity. What I'm saying is, I've never seen a female character be in one of those poses for an entire comic.

'Feminity' is just a polite way of saying 'sexiness' in this case imo.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
You can draw a character anyway you please, but when you start drawing you learn a set of "ideal" proportions of the human body, and that's typically what comic artists work from. Male or female they are drawn like statuesque figures from the Renaissance. Men and women have different features to be accentuated... that's just the reality of the situation. The female body is curvy, ideally you want to emphasis that.

I don't think many would classify Spider-man's poses as "feminine." It comes down to the features that are being emphasized. Here is what it largely comes down too form an art perspective. The male form is (typically) widest at the shoulders, while the female form is (again - typically) widest at the hips. So an artist wants to emphasis different portions of the anatomy depending on the gender of the character. The tilt of shoulders and chest for a man, and the tilt of the pelvis and hips for a female (at least that's how I do it)... which means Spider-man doesn't typically get drawn with his ass in our face.

I don't think it has as much to do with proportions and more to do with the poses that these characters are put in. While male superheroes are always drawn to emphasise their badassery or heroism, female superheroes are drawn to emphasise their sex appeal. Lets face it, the women in that link were drawn to titillate the male readers, not to appeal to women as idealised females. This is why their so frequently drawn twisting their bodies around so you can see their butts and boobs at the same time. The reason this is a bit of a problem is the way that this is so pervasive. Despite the fact that these are supposed to be superheroes, how many of them are being portrayed as heroes?

Originally posted by Tzeentch._
I'm aware that female characters pose in unnatural stances that emphasize their femininity. What I'm saying is, I've never seen a female character be in one of those poses for an entire comic. Greg Land

Originally posted by Q99
That's deliberate posing, though

Try walking around all day (or fighting!) where you constantly stand in one of those poses or others whenever you pause.

It's how Jermey Renner walks around.

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m08jowlWwx1qeqx7ko1_r1_500.jpg

This is gold.

Also, the hell is everyone trying to do turning this into a gender discussion? This is the interwebs. Point and laugh with the rest of us like the sheep we all are.

Agreed with Digi

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mef75anP8h1qggncoo1_1280.jpg



Can't wait for Spidey team to see this. The one with Wolverine is hilarious, too.

hysterical crylaugh hysterical2

Bumping this. There have been some wonderful additions to the Initiative:

http://thehawkeyeinitiative.com/