Iceman vs Starhawk

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Oliver North
http://images.wikia.com/powerlisting/images/b/b3/Iceman.jpg

VS

http://images.hitfix.com/photos/1950936/Starhawk_gallery_primary.jpg

So, this comes out of the GotG vs X-Men thread. For those who are unfamiliar with the character, Starhawk's powerset includes instantaneous FTL speed, reflexes, extremely powerful energy manipulation and limited precog abilities.

I think on paper, SH has Bobby's number, but in a forum battle, Iceman is a beast who, imho, tends to punch well above his weight class.

My honest opinion is that it is a real mismatch in powers, ie: I'm not sure Bobby could reasonably deal with SH's speed and energy manip (he went toe-to-toe with Korvac for a while), while at the same time, IM's ability to survive the death of his body would be very difficult for SH to overcome.

so, PIS/CIS off (if it changes anything, let me know your thoughts with CIS on), and for the sake of simplicity, this is SH without being combined with Aleta, meaning he can't make light constructs and has reduced durability/strength (though he was able to fight with Thor hand-to-hand for a brief period).

I want to give the solid majority to Starhawk, I'd say at least 7-8/10, but was genuinely interested in how other people thought this would pan out. It might be spite, but I know Iceman gets major props 'round these parts.

Horrificus
sh

zopzop
Classic Starhawk was cool as hell, easily mid Herald level. He wins.

Mindset
Iceman wins.

Oliver North
any reason why?

Mindset
Ice.

Oliver North
ice ice baby

Mindset
thumb up

Horrificus
How would Ice Man beat Star Hawk?

Mindset
Originally posted by Mindset
Ice.

Horrificus
it's very cold in space, but SH seems to be ok

Mindset
Good thing Iceman can go colder than space.

Horrificus
Originally posted by Mindset
Good thing Iceman can go colder than space. Can he hit stuff that moves at the speed of light?

Mindset
He'll be inside SH, so it wont matter.

Bentley
Is Bobby inmune to mind-rape, because Starhawk mind-controlled Moondragon during the GotG run.

Mindset
Originally posted by Bentley
Is Bobby inmune to mind-rape, because Starhawk mind-controlled Moondragon during the GotG run. Iceman freezes his brain.

guy222
Starhawk

Golgo13
Feats for Starhawk? I always wanted to know more about this guy. Seems pretty formidable.

zopzop
Originally posted by Golgo13
Feats for Starhawk? I always wanted to know more about this guy. Seems pretty formidable.
Well he's gone up against the likes of Thor and held his own. He went toe to toe with Korvac (after he had gained power from Galactus' ship) till he was eventually overwhelmed.

He's had other fights but I'm drawing a blank now. He should handily win this.

Mindset
How can he defend against Iceman being inside him?

zopzop
Originally posted by Mindset
How can he defend against Iceman being inside him?
How would he get inside a guy that can move at light speed, assuming PIS and CIS are off?

Mindset
SH wouldn't be constantly flying around at lightspeed.

Oliver North
Originally posted by Mindset
SH wouldn't be constantly flying around at lightspeed.

actually, even with CIS on that tends to be his MO.

I'll post some scans up in a bit, they are mostly on my other pc, but this is sort of why I made the thread in the first place: on paper, SH should win, but Bobby has some tricks that allow him to hang with much more powerful characters. I can legit see why Bobby could win.

My thinking would be, aside from one-time feats like going intangible which would make any attempt to freeze him moot, Starhawk's reaction speed and control of light/heat should let him counter anything Bobby throws at him in terms of freezing him from the inside, and if it gets into a battle of energy manip, I don't think Iceman has the same level of feats as Starhawk does.

Horrificus
And, depending on which version of SH this is, he also has the whole "One Who Knows" thing, that allows him to know what is going to happen, before it ever even does. Due to reliving his life over and over and over.

Oliver North
lol, that is all versions of Starhawk. It doesn't give him a moment-to-moment "precog" like Spider-Man has, though, so unless we are saying he has had this forum fight against Iceman in all of his previous lives, it wouldn't be much extra information.

Like, it is conceivable that in his past lives he has learned of who Iceman is and the extent of his powers, it won't let him know "Iceman will attack me now with X attack".

Though, as an aside, if we did accept that the "One who Knows" thing applies to forum fights, Starhawk would win 10/10 against anyone who there is even the slightest possibility for him to win against. Even if it is a 1 in 1000000 chance, that one millionth version of Starhawk would inform the current one about how to win, and thus, Starhawk would win every match.

The whole thing was generally PIS, though, and Gerber had to go to pains sometimes to explain why Starhawk isn't telling his allies the future or why Starhawk didn't know something. However, biggest point is that it was never like a "spider sense", more a type of cosmic/temporal awareness.

Oliver North

Oliver North
So, it isn’t that clear. It is possible to for psychics to read Starhawk’s mind:

http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/15238680_cosmo.jpg

And in fact, psychic attacks may be a particular weakness for Starhawk:

http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/15238683_psy1.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/15238686_psy1b.jpg

I suppose one could argue that, given his infinite lifetimes and memories, it may overwhelm a telepath to try and get into Starhawk’s head, it has never been demonstrated (and in fact, there are very few instances of him fighting against psychic opponents).

Originally posted by Mindset
Good thing Iceman can go colder than space.

I did find these scans, where Starhawk is fighting a cosmic monster that drains the energy out of everything on both a molecular and spiritual level:

http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/15238689_cold1.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/15238691_cold1b.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/15238692_cold1c.jpg

So, in theory, it isn’t impossible for Iceman to win, though, I’d hesitate to say Iceman is on the level of this creature, who is shown to devour worlds:

http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/15238693_cold1d.jpg

However, being frozen does seem to be something that has beaten Starhawk in the past, though, he was frozen to his soul rather than just body.

Oliver North
-- my bad

Oliver North
-- my bad

Oliver North
Originally posted by Golgo13
Feats for Starhawk? I always wanted to know more about this guy. Seems pretty formidable.

So I just put together some really basic stuff. In terms of fights, here he punks Mantis, showing off his reflexes:

http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/15238722_vsmantis1a.jpg http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/15238723_vsmantis1b.jpg

Matches the energy output of Surfer powered with the Quantum Bands:

http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/15238724_surferwithqbands1a.jpg http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/15238725_surferwithqbands1b.jpg http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/15238749_surferwithqbands1c.jpghttp://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/15238726_surferwithqbands1d.jpg

Or of Her, the female counterpart of Adam Warlock:

http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/15238727_matches_Her.jpg

Going toe-to-toe with Thor:

http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/15238728_vsthor1a.jpg http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/15238730_vsthor1b.jpg

Oliver North

Oliver North
He is able to make his body intangible:

http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/15238758_intangible2.jpg

This ability also allows him to physically harm other intangible beings:

http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/15238759_intangible1a.jpg http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/15238760_intangible1b.jpg

These powers, used together with his speed (below) allow him to defeat or evade most space-based defenses, as seen here where he penetrates a shield and destroys a number of defensive drones:

http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/15238761_ships1a.jpg http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/15238762_ships1b.jpg

His light powers also allow him to heal others, be it from the brink of death:

http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/15238773_healing3.jpg

Or healing a group of people at the same time:

http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/15238772_healing2.jpg

Or healing someone with an incredibly complex physiology:

http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/15238771_healing.jpg

Additionally, his energy manipulation allows him to survive within a sun:

http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/15238774_sun.jpg

Oliver North

abhilegend
You should've made a respect thread for him instead.

Golgo13
Nice.

Omega Vision
Originally posted by Horrificus
it's very cold in space, but SH seems to be ok
That's actually a myth. Space isn't all that cold. In some parts (near suns for instance) it's fairly hot.

Oliver North
Originally posted by abhilegend
You should've made a respect thread for him instead.

back in the day I had all his feats organized for a battlezone tournament. At the time I had totally intended to, but didn't have the time. There is a lot more if I wanted a proper respect thread, but ya, I still might. Hell, anything to give Gerber characters more exposure smile

that was initially supposed to be two posts at the most, I didn't realize there were restrictions on number of images per post though no expression

curryman
Sick scannage, old comics were great.

Female Starhawk looked terrible...

Iceman doesn't stand a chance imo.

abhilegend
Originally posted by Oliver North
back in the day I had all his feats organized for a battlezone tournament. At the time I had totally intended to, but didn't have the time. There is a lot more if I wanted a proper respect thread, but ya, I still might. Hell, anything to give Gerber characters more exposure smile

that was initially supposed to be two posts at the most, I didn't realize there were restrictions on number of images per post though no expression
thumb up
I'm not complaining BTW.

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