Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

We know that GL established levels in saber battles.
CANON:
Level 9:
Mace Windu
Sidious
Yoda
Anakin

Level 8:
ROTS Kenobi

Level 7:
TPM Kenobi (probably DS)

Level 6:
TPM Kenobi (probably LS)


So how do others stack up to this. Rank your favorite characters/ anyone you want and discuss.


I'd say

PT

Level 9:
Sidious
Mace
Yoda
Dooku
Anakin

Level 8:
Kenobi
Shaak Ti
Cin Draalig
Maul (low 8)

Level 7:
Asajj Ventress
Kit Fisto
General Grievous
Plo Koon
Savage Oppress

ect. ect.

WTF is Shaak Ti above Maul? She got her ass handed to her by Grievous. Twice.

Pretty accurate rankings Mizukage Yoda.

Considering how well Grievous did against Mace in LoE, I wouldn't rank him as seven. Did GL say these levels are canon? I thought Gillard did, and his word isn't necessarily canon.

Given that GG was skillful enough to do okay against Mace in sabers for a short while, and begin to overwhelm Kenobi's defenses with his '20 strikes/second' feat, I think he may warrant a low level 8 ranking, while Kenobi/Fisto would warrant a peak level 8 ranking..?

Anyway, I agree with MY's rankings for the most part.

Originally posted by Galan007
Given that GG was skillful enough to do okay against Mace in sabers for a short while, and begin to overwhelm Kenobi's defenses with his '20 strikes/second' feat, I think he may warrant a low level 8 ranking, while Kenobi/Fisto would warrant a peak level 8 ranking..?

Anyway, I agree with MY's rankings for the most part.
Agree, he deserves level 8. He was, also, driving back Adi Galia. And Fisto I would rank 7. In the same episode he was unable to do anything to Grievous, despite his apprentice helping from opposite side, until troopers joined in.
LSsoyjhnKw4

Originally posted by ares834
WTF is Shaak Ti above Maul? She got her ass handed to her by Grievous. Twice.

Both times she was exhausted and scared as nuts.
Shaak Ti is a top tier blademaster I assure you.

"I pity you should you have to face off against any of the Council members. Must I demonstrate what would happen should you fight Obi-Wan Kenobi or Shaak Ti, Mace Windu, or stars help you, Yoda?"-LOE

"He lacks entirely the flash, the pure bold elan of an Anakin Skywalker; there is no- where in him the penumbral ferocity of a Mace Windu or a Depa Billaba nor the stylish grace of a Shaak Ti or a Dooku, and he is nothing resembling the whirlwind of destruction that Yoda can become."-ROTS Novel

That's twice in a row she is mentioned in the same breath as people like Yoda, Kenobi, Mace, and Dooku. She is either an 8 or a 9 undoubtedly.

The first quote is false, Cin Drallig is mentioned instead of Shaak Ti.

Originally posted by ares834
WTF is Shaak Ti above Maul? She got her ass handed to her by Grievous. Twice.

Twice?

I know the first time, but it was after she fought about 20 Magnadroids, killed a dozen, and was tired and wounded.


Also according to The Force Unleashed, when Anakin/Vader was clearing the temple and killing everyone, she clashed with him and managed to survive and escape.

TOR:
Level 9:
Hero of Tython
The Emperor's Second Wrath


Level 8:
Satele Shan
Darth Malgus
Revan
Darth Nyriss
Darth Baras

Level 7:
The Exile
Lord Scourge

Second Wrath is the player Sith Warrior, I'm guessing?

Originally posted by -Pr-
Second Wrath is the player Sith Warrior, I'm guessing?

Correct, I figured I'd throw him a bone afterall he did defeat Baras and is a certified badass.

Originally posted by Mizukage Yoda
Correct, I figured I'd throw him a bone afterall he did defeat Baras and is a certified badass.

I haven't gotten that far yet.

Don't worry, I assumed it would happen anyway.

Originally posted by Mizukage Yoda

I'd say

PT

Level 9:
Sidious
Mace
Yoda
Dooku
Anakin

Level 8:
Kenobi
Shaak Ti
Cin Draalig
Maul (low 8)

Level 7:
Asajj Ventress
Kit Fisto
General Grievous
Plo Koon
Savage Oppress

ect. ect.

I completly agree with You about tier 9.
About 8... a bit less, I guess.
I agree, that Drallig is tier 8 fighter. But I would say, he is low top 8, not Maul. He was smashed by Anakin who - at the same time - was choking a padawan (it was Bene? I didn't temeber that). Maul on the other hand smashed Opress, and fought Kenobi on equal terms aytime he met him.
I'm not sure about Shaak Ti. For me, she's more like top7 then 8.
I would like to add Sora Bulq to tier 8. He fought very wel against Mace, and lost to Vos because his overconfidence.

About 7... hm. Maybe Grievous is "low 7". In that clip, that Arhael gave us, it looks ike Fisto is trying to take Grievous alive. For me, both Ventress and Fisto are better then Grievous.
And - are You sure about Plo? Coz I'm not. I heard, that he forced Ventress to retreat, while he has his arm broken. Also, Maul put him along order's greatest duelists. Isn't he"low top 8"?

And some guys, that I have a probem with:
Plagueis - low tier 9, or high tier 8?
Agen - considered by Mace as one of the order's greatest duelists. He was cleary better then Vos. Low 8 or high 7?
Depa - well, Depa is Depa.
Qui-Gon - i heard, that he was almost on par with TPM Mace. Can anyone of you guys give me a quote?
Anoon - top 7, right?
Saesee - low 7?

Originally posted by Mizukage Yoda


So how do others stack up to this. Rank your favorite characters/ anyone you want and discuss.


I'd say

PT

Level 9:
Sidious
Mace
Yoda
Dooku
Anakin

Level 8:
Kenobi
Shaak Ti
Cin Draalig
Maul (low 8)

Level 7:
Asajj Ventress
Kit Fisto
General Grievous
Plo Koon
Savage Oppress



I would change level 8's to:

Kenobi
Depa Billapa
Maul
Shaak Ti
Bulq (maybe)

Apart from that- good list.

But I personally don't think the levels should be attributed to the other characters in SW that were not mentioned by Gillard. I just think they're a frame of reference for those mentioned.

I think things are a bit crowded/the tiers are a bit wide, personally. So many 8s!

If I was to do legacy, I'd have to put almost everyone in the same tier, since most of the legacy saber fights fall into one of two categories: The same 8~ people, 2-3 per side, clashing with each other, or those 8 people carving a bloody wake through other saber wielders.



Dralliq was smashed by Anakin while Shaak Ti survived him and escaped.

Personally I'd put him at a high-7.

Tier 9:

-Mace Windu
-Yoda
-Darth Sidious

Tier 8:

-Anakin Skywalker
-Obi-Wan Kenobi
-Darth Tyranus
-Darth Vader

Tier 7:

-General Grievous
-Darth Maul
-Kit Fisto
-Plo Koon

ETC. ETC.

^Add Anakin and Dooku to 9 then I'd say it's a good list.

It's not perfect but...

Tier 9:
-Exar Kun
-Mace Windu
-Yoda
-Darth Sidious

Tier 8:
-Revan
-Anakin Skywalker
-Obi-Wan Kenobi
-Darth Tyranus

Tier (Low) 8:
-Darth Vader
-General Grievous
-Darth Maul

Tier 7:
-Qui-Gon Jinn
-Kit Fisto
-Plo Koon

Revan?

Originally posted by Jedi Mom
^Add Anakin and Dooku to 9 then I'd say it's a good list.

I kinda like NewGuy's version. I mean, while those two can fight with the ones higher up in great match, I'd still say the ones he lists as 9s are a bit better.

Originally posted by Mizukage Yoda
TOR:
Level 9:
Hero of Tython
The Emperor's Second Wrath


Level 8:
Satele Shan
Darth Malgus
Revan
Darth Nyriss
Darth Baras

Level 7:
The Exile
Lord Scourge

May I ask, why Revan is level 8 (along with Nyriss or Malgus? ; C)? I would say, that he's level 9.

Originally posted by Q99
Twice?

I know the first time, but it was after she fought about 20 Magnadroids, killed a dozen, and was tired and wounded.\

The first was when she fought him with Mundi and the other Jedi. Yet, despite the aid from the other Jedi she still got her ass kicked.

Originally posted by Mizukage Yoda
That's twice in a row she is mentioned in the same breath as people like Yoda, Kenobi, Mace, and Dooku. She is either an 8 or a 9 undoubtedly.

Not sure how that puts her on any of their level. And she has certainly done nothing to suggest she is on a level with Yoda and Mace.

Originally posted by Q99
Also according to The Force Unleashed, when Anakin/Vader was clearing the temple and killing everyone, she clashed with him and managed to survive and escape.

Quote?

I saw no mention of it in the Xbox version of TFU's databank.

Oh yea, I forgot she was there.

Still, as we all know he was, like, twice over as dangerous in the miniseries as outside it.



I am honestly going by Wookiepedia, which says it's in the databank. I don't have the game myself, just the comic version.


She does have her performance against Starkiller too, so not relying *just* on that or anything.

Btw - is Depa level 10 duelist?

Originally posted by Zett
Btw - is Depa level 10 duelist?

Depa is up there with prime Anakin Skywalker.

Tier 9

Sidious
Yoda
Windu
Dooku
Anakin

Tier 8

Kenobi
OT Vader
Shaak Ti
Drallig(Low 8)
Maul(low 8)

Tier 7

Koon(high 7)
Fisto
Ventress
Opress
Grievous

Opinions of my list?.

Tier 1

Yoda
Mace
Anakin
Dooku
Sidious

Tier 2
Kenobi
Vader
Maul

Tier 3
Savage
Ventress
Koon
Fisto
Ti
Grievous
Drallig

According to Lucas, Vader is one tier below ROTS Kenobi and Maul.

Source^?

Originally posted by Zett
According to Lucas, Vader is one tier below ROTS Kenobi and Maul.

Proof?. Vader took out 5 Jedi at once with ease. Maul lost to a Padawan.

Originally posted by Jedi Mom
The first quote is false, Cin Drallig is mentioned instead of Shaak Ti.

There are two releases of the book. The most recent has Shaak Ti the original has Cin Drallig.

I was looking for a kind of sword fighting, that was reminiscing of what was in the movies that we already done. But a more energized version of it, because we actually never seen a real jedi at work, we only seen old men, crippled half droid half man, and young boys that learn from these people. So to see a jedi fighting in the prime of the jedi, I wanted to be a much more energetic and faster version of it - George Lucas.

What he says there is that Vader or ANH are in their prime, not Maul>Vader

Originally posted by Jedi Mom
What he says there is that Vader or ANH are in their prime, not Maul>Vader

He was referencing the difference between OT dueling and TPM duels...the only people who fought in TPM are Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan and Darth Maul.

But faster isn't always better.

I was looking for a kind of sword fighting, that was reminiscing of what was in the movies that we already done. But a more energized version of it, because we actually never seen a real jedi at work, we only seen old men, crippled half droid half man, and young boys that learn from these people. So to see a jedi fighting in the prime of the jedi, I wanted to be a much more energetic and faster version of it - George Lucas.

For me it's obvious, that Maul > Vader in term of sabers.

Originally posted by Zett
I was looking for a kind of sword fighting, that was reminiscing of what was in the movies that we already done. But a more energized version of it, because we actually never seen a real jedi at work, we only seen old men, crippled half droid half man, and young boys that learn from these people. So to see a jedi fighting in the prime of the jedi, I wanted to be a much more energetic and faster version of it - George Lucas.

For me it's obvious, that Maul > Vader in term of sabers.

I've heard this quote 100 times. And it means nothing lol. Vader is still far above Maul in sabers.

This quote clearly says, that PT era is jedi's prime era. It means, that people like Kenobi, Anakin are in their prime during Clone Wars. In OT Kenobi is just old man, and Vader is just half machine.
Vader fought old Kenobi, and it looks equal.
Maul fought this prime Kenobi (TCW, if You disagree with TPM), and it also looks equal.
Also, there is a comic, when Maul was resurrected and Vader fought him (as I remeber it's not canon, right? - but still, it's more then nothing, I guess). And in pure saber fight, Maul was better. In al-out duel, I bet Vader as a winner, but he have to aid himsef with his force powers.

Alright, here's a question- What tier would you place someone who's a generic, background Jedi Guardian or Sith Warrior?

How about someone who takes on three of the above at once?

Very very low. As for taking three at once, it's hard to tell but that alone wouldn't bring them up to the top. After all, Jango took down several Jedi with his bare hands.

Originally posted by ares834
Very very low. As for taking three at once, it's hard to tell but that alone wouldn't bring them up to the top. After all, Jango took down several Jedi with his bare hands.

Like what, level 3 for the no-names, level 5-6 for the ones who take on a trio at once?



I'll note the force against the Mandos were mentioned to be Jedi unprepared for combat/had a number of padawans in there. Still if we were to rate Jango, 6 seems fair.

Originally posted by Zett
This quote clearly says, that PT era is jedi's prime era. It means, that people like Kenobi, Anakin are in their prime during Clone Wars. In OT Kenobi is just old man, and Vader is just half machine.
Vader fought old Kenobi, and it looks equal.
Maul fought this prime Kenobi (TCW, if You disagree with TPM), and it also looks equal.
Also, there is a comic, when Maul was resurrected and Vader fought him (as I remeber it's not canon, right? - but still, it's more then nothing, I guess). And in pure saber fight, Maul was better. In al-out duel, I bet Vader as a winner, but he have to aid himsef with his force powers.

No. In a pure saber duel Vader is much better then Maul.

According to that quote all PT Jedi are above Vader in sabers. When Vader took out 5 jedi at once and was barley even at his strongest. Makes no sense. Also in the comic Vader owned Maul in sabers.

Also that quote was given out when tpm was relased. so obviousy its gona be hyped up. The quotemeans nothing.

If its Clone Was Maul Vs Vader in a saber duel and you say Maul then I can respect that even though I say Vader wins

But no way TPM Maul is near Vader in a saber duel.

To go non-Jedi/Sith, Pre Vizsla seems like a 6 to maybe low 7.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
Tier 9:

-Mace Windu
-Yoda
-Darth Sidious

Tier 8:

-Anakin Skywalker
-Obi-Wan Kenobi
-Darth Tyranus
-Darth Vader

Tier 7:

-General Grievous
-Darth Maul
-Kit Fisto
-Plo Koon

ETC. ETC.

agrees with this

Originally posted by ROTJ Vader
If its Clone Was Maul Vs Vader in a saber duel and you say Maul then I can respect that even though I say Vader wins

But no way TPM Maul is near Vader in a saber duel.

Who said there's some huge difference between TPM and CW Maul's combat prowess?

I think the biggest difference between TPM/CW Maul is in their command of the Force, even though CW Maul's stomp of Savage puts him above TPM Maul even in the sabers regard imo.

Btw, didn't Maul have a broken ankle in TPM?

Originally posted by Jedi Mom
I think the biggest difference between TPM/CW Maul is in their command of the Force, even though CW Maul's stomp of Savage puts him above TPM Maul even in the sabers regard imo.

Btw, didn't Maul have a broken ankle in TPM?

Huh? Where did that come from?

Originally posted by Jedi Mom
I think the biggest difference between TPM/CW Maul is in their command of the Force,

It won't be command of the force, because where we he have suddenly increased his knowledge from. It more likely would have been his raw power in the force due to his rage consuming him over the years.

But the other difference would be that TPM Maul would have been at the peak of his training and combat skill. TCW Maul won't be at that peak level of skill after being in a straight jacket for over a decade.

Originally posted by Jedi Mom
even though CW Maul's stomp of Savage puts him above TPM Maul even in the sabers regard imo.

Not necessarily.

Originally posted by Jedi Mom


Btw, didn't Maul have a broken ankle in TPM?

Originally posted by Mizukage Yoda
Huh? Where did that come from?

Comes from Darth Maul's journal. He was injured by either Tusken Raiders or Pirates. Can't remember now. His ship was ambushed and he had to fight off a load of "whoever they were." And injured his leg or ankle or something.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Comes from Darth Maul's journal. He was injured by either Tusken Raiders or Pirates. Can't remember now. His ship was ambushed and he had to fight off a load of "whoever they were." And injured his leg or ankle or something.
Thanks. Do you think it was still broken by the time of TPM?

^ It was at the time of TPM. The whole Journal is leading up to those events. Can't remember though if it was before or after his first fight with Qui-Gon. Been such a long time since I read it and don't have it anymore.

I doubt it had a huge impact on his performance. But that's not to say it had zero impact.

I believe it has been referenced in a source book as well.

Legacy, using NewGuy01's as a guide:

Tier 9:

Darth Krayt

Tier 8:

Cade Skywalker (late series)
Darth Wyyrlok
Celeste Morne (w/ Muur)

Tier 7:

Darth Nihl
Darth Talon
Ganner Krieg
Antares Draco
Wolf Sazen
Shado Vao
Darth Havok
Tries Sinde

Etc..

A couple of the 7s might be better off in low-8s, but it's hard to say where to draw the line, that group has skill differences but between the lot of them there's a lot of overlap.

Originally posted by Zett
I was looking for a kind of sword fighting, that was reminiscing of what was in the movies that we already done. But a more energized version of it, because we actually never seen a real jedi at work, we only seen old men, crippled half droid half man, and young boys that learn from these people. So to see a jedi fighting in the prime of the jedi, I wanted to be a much more energetic and faster version of it - George Lucas.

For me it's obvious, that Maul > Vader in term of sabers.
This quote was invalidated by Lucas bringing Dooku into equation, who was 26 year older than ANH Kenobi and Yoda who apart from being generations older than any other Jedi couldn't even walk properly. This quote completely lost weight, when Maul was reintroduced with higher combat prowess despite being crippled.

Any opinions on my Legacy list?

Originally posted by Q99
Any opinions on my Legacy list?

I don't know much of this series, but i don't think, that Krayt ever reached Yoda's or Palpatine's level in sabers. So for me is more like:

Tier 8:

Darth Krayt

Tier 7:

Cade Skywalker (late series)
Darth Wyyrlok
Celeste Morne (w/ Muur)

Tier 6:

Darth Nihl
Darth Talon
Ganner Krieg
Antares Draco
Wolf Sazen
Shado Vao
Darth Havok
Tries Sinde

Etc..

Tier 500: Barris, Depa
Tier 9: Bandon

Originally posted by Zett
I don't know much of this series, but i don't think, that Krayt ever reached Yoda's or Palpatine's level in sabers. So for me is more like:


Except there's like, zero reason to put the big group as low as 6.


The people on that level have done plenty of impressive things. Like, when Sazen and Shado and another knight and master were ambushed by 5 sith who killed the knight and master, then Sazen and Shado weren't even challenged by taking down the five. Or when Draco takes out 6 Sith warriors to allow him comrades time to escape on Korriban. Or so on- there's tons of instances of the people on that level cutting a swath though Jedi/Sith/etc..


Basically, the ones like Shado and Draco have the feats to prove themselves at 7 just fine. There's no reason to bump them down except wanting Krayt to be lower... but that doesn't really make sense, y'know? How you want to place Krayt doesn't affect them, and it doesn't make sense for all the major saber masters of one era to just be mysteriously one tier lower than all the major saber masters of prior eras, even though they've got some rather good saber feats on them.

Oh yea, and I'll comment Draco, Shado, etc. has more feats than Plo Koon, Ki-Adi-Mundi, Qui-Gon, etc.. Some of the big CW era fighters have more, but only the ones with a good amount of focus.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
We know that GL established levels in saber battles.
CANON:
Level 9:
Mace Windu
Sidious
Yoda
Anakin

Level 8:
ROTS Kenobi

Level 7:
TPM Kenobi (probably DS)

Level 6:
TPM Kenobi (probably LS)
Gillard responded to me via email today and declared Maul and Dooku are 8s.

No one gives a **** what he says Ant...

Some do, actually.

Ant, you put far too much stock in non canon information. I'm just looking at your Malak respect thread and there's so many author opinions posted that have ZERO relevance to the overall continuity.

Official Star Wars blokes can say what they want but it means little. Everyone can pick and choose if they want to believe it or not, some might believe it to a lesser extent, greater extent than others etc.
Some people go by quotes to form opinions on a character, some go by feats and others could go by a mixture. If you whole heartedly believe he's correct then good for you, but feats might contradict what Mr Gillard is saying and the many who use feats only to form arguments will disagree with you. Then it just becomes a back and forth "But he did this against him" "But Nick Gilard said this..." "He's defeated 1,000 enemies in 1v1 combat" "Nick Gillard said he's only tier 7"

It's pointless :/

Ant, screenshot the email and send it to me.

Nick Gillard does not own the rights to Star Wars, so unless he becomes an author and conveys his interpretations within a piece of literature, then they are not official. It is merely his view on certain characters and nothing more.

Originally posted by Ziggystardust
Nick Gillard does not own the rights to Star Wars, so unless he becomes an author and conveys his interpretations within a piece of literature, then they are not official. It is merely his view on certain characters and nothing more.


Well his power levels were based on his conversations with Lucas. So there may be some credibility to them, but only within the realm of the films. You can't start mixing TCW/Rebels and characters from other mediums to reinterpret Gillard's rankings.

But you're right, his statements are not Canon.


Originally posted by DarthAnt66

Gillard responded to me via email today and declared Maul and Dooku are 8s.


TPM Maul? That's interesting.


I always thought (as did ILS) that there wasn't a big power gap between TPM and TCW Maul.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Well his power levels were based on his conversations with Lucas.

There is zero evidence that his infamous tier system has anything to do with Lucas. George simply tells Gillard who's fighting who, with some general ideas about the action (who will win said fight), and from there the Gillard dictates the choreography. You can often see in Lucas' original scripts that there are sections left blank for the fights themselves. Otherwise there is nothing to say that Gillard's interpretation of the characters themselves, comes from anything other than his own head. Unless you can prove that his mind is interlinked to Lucas' via telepathy.

Ant is fingering himself over matters of unimportance.

He often does.

Gillard is more important than Lucas in regards to versus, Ziggy.

Originally posted by Ziggystardust
Nick Gillard does not own the rights to Star Wars, so unless he becomes an author and conveys his interpretations within a piece of literature, then they are not official. It is merely his view on certain characters and nothing more.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
We know that GL established levels in saber battles.
CANON:
Level 9:
Mace Windu
Sidious
Yoda
Anakin

Level 8:
ROTS Kenobi

Level 7:
TPM Kenobi (probably DS)

Level 6:
TPM Kenobi (probably LS)


So how do others stack up to this. Rank your favorite characters/ anyone you want and discuss.


I'd say

PT

Level 9:
Sidious
Mace
Yoda
Dooku
Anakin

Level 8:
Kenobi
Shaak Ti
Cin Draalig
Maul (low 8)

Level 7:
Asajj Ventress
Kit Fisto
General Grievous
Plo Koon
Savage Oppress

ect. ect.

In terms of pure sabers with augmentation:

Level 9:
Sidious (high 9)
Mace (mid 9)
Yoda (high 9)
Dooku (mid 9)

Level 8:
Anakin (higher 8)
Kenobi (mid-high 8)
Maul (high 8)
Kit Fisto (low-mid 8)
Plo Koon (mid 8)
Ki Adi Mundi (mid 8)
TPM Qui Gon (lower 8)

Level 7:
Rebels Tano (mid-high 7)
Luminara (mid 7)
Adi Gallia (mid 7)
Savage Opress non-bloodlusted (mid-high 7)
Shaak Ti (mid-high 7)
Cin Dralig (low-mid 7)
Asajj Ventress in her prime (mid-high 7)
General Grievous canon (mid 7)
Aayla Secura (low 7)

Level 6:
TPM Kenobi (mid-high 6)


Level 5:
Late TCW Ahsoka (mid 5)

Level 4:
Pre-Vizsla (low 4)
Early TCW Tano (low-mid 4)

Level 3:
Zett Jukassa (mid-high 3)
Avg 10 year old jedi padawan (low-mid 3)

Level 2:
avg 6 year old jedi padawan (mid 2)

Level 1:
Dave Filoni

ect. ect.

LMFAO

Ahsoka would eviscerate half of tier 8.

Originally posted by Ziggystardust
There is zero evidence that his infamous tier system has anything to do with Lucas. George simply tells Gillard who's fighting who, with some general ideas about the action (who will win said fight), and from there the Gillard dictates the choreography. You can often see in Lucas' original scripts that there are sections left blank for the fights themselves. Otherwise there is nothing to say that Gillard's interpretation of the characters themselves, comes from anything other than his own head. Unless you can prove that his mind is interlinked to Lucas' via telepathy.

Ant is fingering himself over matters of unimportance.


Unfortunately I don't have the quote, but Arhael who used to post here gave a quote from Gillard where he said the tier system all came from his conversations with Lucas. And I think his rankings being in the Making of ROTS, both the book and the video, make it pretty relevant to a lot of people anyway.

Plus I doubt Gillard's just some insane guy who makes up his own shit. He said that Anakin and Kenobi can't get past each other's defenses because they know each others moves so well. The ROTS novel implies the same thing, but goes into it further.

Gillard says Mace is 2nd in combat to Yoda, as Jackson says himself. I wouldn't think these different guys working on the Star Wars films under Lucas and novels viewed over by Lucas, who are all saying the same thing just all happen to make up all the same things. It's likely all stuff they've all been told by Mr. Lucas.


In any case, Canon or not, I find it interesting to know what the choreographer of the movie fights had in mind.

Level 9:
Sidious (High)
Mace Amped (High)
Yoda (High
Dooku (Mid-High)
Mace (Mid-High)

Level 8:
Anakin (Just under level 9)
Maul (Mid-Sort of High)
Kenobi (Mid-Sort of High)
Rebels Ashoka (Mid)
Kit Fisto (Mid)
Asajj Ventress (mid)
TPM Qui-Gon (Mid)
Ki-Adi Mundi (Benchmark)

Level 7:
Plo Koon (meh)
Shaak Ti (meh)
Adi Gallia (meh)
Canon Grievous (meh-shitty)
Cin Drallig (meh-shitty)
Luminara Unduli (meh-shitty)
Savage Opress (Shitty ~ But strength means he can compete with tiers up)
Aayla Secura (Shitty)

Level 6:
TPM Kenobi (shitty)
Late TCW Ashoka (shitty)

Level 5:
Pre Viszla (great for non-force sensitive)
Early TCW Ashoka (really shitty)

Level 4 and downward = Trash

Don't think there is a mid 9, or a low 9 as Gillard says Saber fights between 9's can go either way.

Also how is Anakin not making into the 9's when the guy who made these tiers already put him there?

Just my opinion, I don't think he could take any nines for a majority

@DT

Originally posted by chingchangwalla
Level 9:
Sidious (High)
Mace Amped (High)
Yoda (High
Dooku (Mid-High)
Mace (Mid-High)

Level 8:
Anakin (Just under level 9)
Maul (Mid-Sort of High)
Kenobi (Mid-Sort of High)
Rebels Ashoka (Mid)
Kit Fisto (Mid)
Asajj Ventress (mid)
TPM Qui-Gon (Mid)
Ki-Adi Mundi (Benchmark)

Level 7:
Plo Koon (meh)
Shaak Ti (meh)
Adi Gallia (meh)
Canon Grievous (meh-shitty)
Cin Drallig (meh-shitty)
Luminara Unduli (meh-shitty)
Savage Opress (Shitty ~ But strength means he can compete with tiers up)
Aayla Secura (Shitty)

Level 6:
TPM Kenobi (shitty)
Late TCW Ashoka (shitty)

Level 5:
Pre Viszla (great for non-force sensitive)
Early TCW Ashoka (really shitty)

Level 4 and downward = Trash

If you raise Savage, Anakin and Shaak this may be a perfect list, tbh.

I just dislike Shaak Ti so my personal bias will always get in the way but yeah I would ordinarily raise her.

Why Shaak, huh?

WHY SHAAK

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Gillard is more important than Lucas in regards to versus, Ziggy.

http://static9.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_large/11128/111285064/5189344-5759107019-littl.jpg

You're literally giving me a hernia.

Are Gillard's statements a source viewed as canon by LFL - like Lucas' are - or is it merely his personal thoughts which - at the end of the day - don't mean anything under the laws of LFL canon (legends)? I believe The latter is correct.

Now you might want to understand why Lucas' opinion - was at the time - considered the indisputable word of god. Star Wars stories does not have a single writer, and the collaborators may not actually agree with interpretations of their story that weren't made explicit in the work - i.e canon. In this case, there are multiple creators giving potentially contradictory explanations, so whose word is to be considered correct? Nick Gillard was not the copyright holder, meaning that he was not the highest authority. Lucas was - at the time - the chief copyright holder. Everything in Star Wars was his intellectual property. All characters, concepts, planets and stories belonged in his name, up until Disney's renovation in 2014. Now that's just from a legal perspective. From an intellectual perspective, all continuity created outside of the films stemmed from Lucas' vision of Star Wars. The Force, midi-chrlorians a Galaxy far far away, are all ideas that a taken into consideration when creating characters like Revan.

Lucas is the only creator, and he is certainly more important than someone involved in an ancillary role for the production.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Why Shaak, huh?

WHY SHAAK

Why do I hate her?
Jensaarai, Reti and Evan wank her so hard it's turned me against her. Saying her Makashi is as good as Dooku's, saying her force defense is enough for her to contend with Palpatine, Shaak and Plo > Anakin etc.
It's all too much and driven me insane, I ****ing hate her with a passion

Originally posted by chingchangwalla
Why do I hate her?
Jensaarai, Reti and Evan wank her so hard it's turned me against her. Saying her Makashi is as good as Dooku's, saying her force defense is enough for her to contend with Palpatine, Shaak and Plo > Anakin etc.
It's all too much and driven me insane, I ****ing hate her with a passion

You should hate the debater in question, not the character. I personally don't agree with some of Sel's arguments, so does that mean I have to hate Surik or Ti? Nah, I still love'em.

Originally posted by Ziggystardust
http://static9.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_large/11128/111285064/5189344-5759107019-littl.jpg

That image gives me a strange feeling of Deja Vu for some reason...

True that, but every time I think of Ti I can hear Reti's voice, from now on I'll make an effort to appreciate her :/

Originally posted by MythLord


That image gives me a strange feeling of Deja Vu for some reason...

Yes, I was that guy debating you here click me.

I legit thought that was a random Jensaarai troll, lol. Turns out it's not quite as worthless a debater.

Originally posted by chingchangwalla
True that, but every time I think of Ti I can hear Reti's voice, from now on I'll make an effort to appreciate her :/

Same for me and Plo... Ugh... Or Warb Null.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Gillard is more important than Lucas in regards to versus, Ziggy.

https://media.giphy.com/media/KJHINXxzWX7A4/giphy.gif