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Anyone yet watched it? I thought the twists were pretty surprising (warning: contains spoilers)

-Mandarin(ben kingsley) was a fraud. A paid actor to serve as face for the terrorist act. Never saw that one coming and I still find it hilarious to remember Tony first seeing him face to face.

-Ironman wiped out his armory and having surgery to remove the shrapnel lodged on his heart thereby not relying on that artificial heart anymore and quiting as IM.

-The ending cutscene was bad and pointless

Watching it tomorrow. So not gonna read your spoilers. But what would you rate it out of 10?

Originally posted by Sixth_Winged
Anyone yet watched it? I thought the twists were pretty surprising (warning: contains spoilers)



-Ironman wiped out his armory and having surgery to remove the shrapnel lodged on his heart thereby not relying on that artificial heart anymore and quiting as IM.


He didn't quit as IM when it clearly says "Tony Stark will be back"

Originally posted by Kazenji
He didn't quit as IM when it clearly says "Tony Stark will be back"

yeah I assumed he'll be back to but I've read somewhere on the net even Downy jr. isn't sure of IM's future. Plus it'd be really interesting if we get an ironman that doesn't have that chest gadget on him

Oh and as far as I'd rate it, probably 8/10. Easily the most plot-intensive ironman ever. The only downside is the post credit scene.

Not like he needs that chest gadget to use a suit

he's been doing that for a while now with the current comics.

Originally posted by Kazenji
Not like he needs that chest gadget to use a suit

he's been doing that for a while now with the current comics.

You might want to put some tags one there bro. Some countries havent still got it yet. Anyway yeah I know that but the thing just seemed so appropriate for his suit's theme.

Whoops

Fixed it up.

Anyway I hope to God the avengers still retain the original cast plus the new ones. I feel the Extremis process was wasted on Pepper. Was kinda hoping the recipient would be tony to fight fire with fire, instead we got an amped one-off version of pepper. The least they could have done was let it be with pepper for longer time.

The house party protocol was awesome though

My only advice to people whos gonna watch it, dont stay up for the post ending scene. 100% chance of dissapointment or your money back guarantee.

That system Stark was using with the headset to control the armour, I remember seeing that in the Ultimate universe

also what did you think of that kid?..........i know some people dislike kids in movies because they're usually annoying, But i found the one that was in this movie was okay

Originally posted by Kazenji
That system Stark was using with the headset to control the armour, I remember seeing that in the Ultimate universe

also what did you think of that kid?..........i know some people dislike kids in movies because they're usually annoying, But i found the one that was in this movie was okay

Yeah I think he's ok. They didn't blew too much of the screen time on his interaction with Stark and he's not annoying.

The fight scenes were ok, the villain's end came a bit out of nowhere but overall it was great. They burned so much mark <insert number> here, the next future Ironman costume versions will be insane. Starting mark 42 something i think. I wish they revive some of them specially that heavy lifting unit

Just got back from seeing it and it was pretty damn awesome.

I didn't see the Mandarin being an actor thing coming, but that might be because as a comic book fan I was expecting Mandarin to be the big bad he is in the comics, and a throwdown between him and Tony. That being said, it was a pretty interesting move and made Killian an important figure rather than putting him in a similar role that Sam Rockwell played in IM2.

Other thoughts-
The non armour action scenes were really good, and I can see what they meant with all the talk of back to basics Tony in interviews and stuff.
House Party was great.
Rhodes and Pepper both had moments to shine, which was cool.

But yeah post credits scene was disappointing, was hoping for a Pym introduction

So what did you guys think of the Mandarin twist?

I've heard it was a waste of Kingsley's talents and the Mandarin character as a whole. And, while I haven't seen the movie yet, I gotta agree.

It is but he and the twist was hilarious so it's forgiven.

Originally posted by Sixth_Winged
My only advice to people whos gonna watch it, dont stay up for the post ending scene. 100% chance of dissapointment or your money back guarantee.

I.. actually liked it.. But probably because I read this comment of yours first so had Zero expectations.

But what would have made it 10 times better in my book would have been if it was Hulk sitting there and not Banner

Originally posted by ares834
So what did you guys think of the Mandarin twist?

I've heard it was a waste of Kingsley's talents and the Mandarin character as a whole. And, while I haven't seen the movie yet, I gotta agree.

Well the IM movies haven't exactly been faithful to his comic villains, so wasn't expecting the Actual comic book Mandarin tbh.

But I didn't actually mind the twist. My only complaint is that it was made too "funny." It wasn't something that should be made funny Imo.

Originally posted by AlmightyKfish


Rhodes and Pepper both had moments to shine, which was cool.



They could have given Iron Patriot some proper action. Especially while IM was out of commission for such a big portion of the movie.

Still movie was cool. My rating 7.5/10.

Originally posted by Kazenji
He didn't quit as IM when it clearly says "Tony Stark will be back"

Well what I noticed is they said Tony Stark will return. Not Iron Man will return. As far as I know Downey's contract is up. But I'm sure he and IM will be back.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER


Well the IM movies haven't exactly been faithful to his comic villains, so wasn't expecting the Actual comic book Mandarin tbh.




Well they have somewhat been faithful, More with the first movie with Iron Monger.

Originally posted by Kazenji
Well they have somewhat been faithful, More with the first movie with Iron Monger.

Yeah he was done right.

Originally posted by Sixth_Winged
My only advice to people whos gonna watch it, dont stay up for the post ending scene. 100% chance of dissapointment or your money back guarantee.

Don't know why people are saying this. It was funny. And in character.

This movie was up there with Green Lantern......the whole plot was lame..
Mandarin being fake was meh....Tony getting whooped in his own house and having malfunctions with his suit for no reasons ...lame....also why did it take him a shit load of time to realise oh wait i have like 60 armors in the basement yet I want to recharge my total crappy armor,the thermo men taking on the suits and one shoting theme was terrible,Pepper whoopin Killian was horrible......
Only positive thing about the film is that it was funny.....

Originally posted by Estacado
This movie was up there with Green Lantern......the whole plot was lame..
Mandarin being fake was meh....Tony getting whooped in his own house and having malfunctions with his suit for no reasons ...lame....also why did it take him a shit load of time to realise oh wait i have like 60 armors in the basement yet I want to recharge my total crappy armor,the thermo men taking on the suits and one shoting theme was terrible,Pepper whoopin Killian was horrible......
Only positive thing about the film is that it was funny..... This Slovakian hate monger again. sneer

haermm
Iron Man 1,2 are great but 3 was balls.....fact...uhuh

Originally posted by Estacado
This movie was up there with Green Lantern......the whole plot was lame..
Mandarin being fake was meh....Tony getting whooped in his own house and having malfunctions with his suit for no reasons ...lame....also why did it take him a shit load of time to realise oh wait i have like 60 armors in the basement yet I want to recharge my total crappy armor,the thermo men taking on the suits and one shoting theme was terrible,Pepper whoopin Killian was horrible......
Only positive thing about the film is that it was funny.....

Pepper defeats Killian?! That sounds ****in awful! How does she defeat him anyway? Is it like how she defeated the Iron Monger in IM or is she wearing armor? Because if it's the latter...

Originally posted by ares834
Pepper defeats Killian?! That sounds ****in awful! How does she defeat him anyway? Is it like how she defeated the Iron Monger in IM or is she wearing armor? Because if it's the latter...
She gets injected with extremis and right when Killian is about to finish Tony she jumps in and uses her super strenght to toss him asside and uses one of Im suits bomb and glove blast to finish him....it's awful...

Originally posted by the ninjak
Don't know why people are saying this. It was funny. And in character.

Cause it was pointless and pales in comparison with the first Avengers batch post-credit ending scenes, i don't even think it's that funny but that's just me.

Of course that doesn't make the actual movie contents lame but judging from the reaction of most people in the cinema when we waited for it, they were heavily dissapointed.

Originally posted by Sixth_Winged
Cause it was pointless and pales in comparison with the first Avengers batch post-credit ending scenes, i don't even think it's that funny but that's just me.

Of course that doesn't make the actual movie contents lame but judging from the reaction of most people in the cinema when we waited for it, they were heavily dissapointed.

I liked it. It would only be disappointing if you were expecting some kind of tease for a future movie.

It wasn't pointless like the end credit scene in the Wolverine movie.

Originally posted by ares834
Pepper defeats Killian?! That sounds ****in awful! How does she defeat him anyway? Is it like how she defeated the Iron Monger in IM or is she wearing armor? Because if it's the latter...

Don't read too many spoilers before watching the movie.

It's a cool movie. But it's no TDK or Avengers. It's not epic and it does have faults.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
It's not epic and it does have faults.


Pretty much my definition of all Batman movies.

Originally posted by Estacado
This movie was up there with Green Lantern......the whole plot was lame..
Mandarin being fake was meh....Tony getting whooped in his own house and having malfunctions with his suit for no reasons ...lame....also why did it take him a shit load of time to realise oh wait i have like 60 armors in the basement yet I want to recharge my total crappy armor,the thermo men taking on the suits and one shoting theme was terrible,Pepper whoopin Killian was horrible......
Only positive thing about the film is that it was funny.....

Up there with Green Lantern movie

more like above it

and some of points you brought up clearly you weren't paying attention such as

'Tony getting whooped in his own house and having malfunctions with his suit for no reasons'

pretty sure Jarvis said in the film that suit was only a prototype

Stupid 15 min rule....

Which is kind of moronic since Tony was wearing the armor cause he was afraid of being attacked that's why he opened the door in a suit.....it's ridicolous to asume that Stark is so phuckin dumb to wear a non functioning suit while being threatened...that's simply bad writing...

Originally posted by Estacado
Which is kind of moronic since Tony was wearing the armor cause he was afraid of being attacked that's why he opened the door in a suit.....it's ridicolous to asume that Stark is so phuckin dumb to wear a non functioning suit while being threatened...that's simply bad writing...

It wasn't dumb. He was just being arrogant and definitely not expecting an attack on that kind of level. Pepper was trying to convince him to leave before the attack remember. But he wasn't listening.

Before the attack he told pepper that after the Avengers incident he felt like he was just a man in a can and he wants to protect her at all cost.... yet he opens the door in a prototype suit?That's dumb if you ask me...

The best of the three movies IMO.

Originally posted by Estacado
Before the attack he told pepper that after the Avengers incident he felt like he was just a man in a can and he wants to protect her at all cost.... yet he opens the door in a prototype suit?That's dumb if you ask me...

Ah well to me it just seemed like he was expecting gunmen or suicide bombers at most. He clearly wasn't expecting multiple gunships to attack.

End of the day if he was properly ready for that kind of attack, it wouldn't really matter what suit he's in, as Jarvis could control the rest of them, having them all in action simultaneously.

Excellent movie, both as an action movie and as a continuation of the IM movies.

I'm guessing that this is the end of the line for the IM films. Maybe Marvel will continue with The Avengers franchise, with more emphasis on Tony & Bruce as the brains of The Avengers (like in the comics now).

Originally posted by Estacado
haermm
Iron Man 1,2 are great but 3 was balls.....fact...uhuh

Seriously? I have heard some nasty reviews and the rating is dropping on IMDB, but it looks loads better than Iron Man 2, which sucked donkey balls.

I seriously don't get the hate the second gets.

Originally posted by Estacado
This movie was up there with Green Lantern......the whole plot was lame..
Mandarin being fake was meh....Tony getting whooped in his own house and having malfunctions with his suit for no reasons ...lame....also why did it take him a shit load of time to realise oh wait i have like 60 armors in the basement yet I want to recharge my total crappy armor,the thermo men taking on the suits and one shoting theme was terrible,Pepper whoopin Killian was horrible......
Only positive thing about the film is that it was funny..... Up there with GL movie?! lolz. That movie sucked, and reviews showed it. 5.1 on IMDB. So far, Iron man 3 has an 8.1 on IMDB and a 93 on rotten tomatoes. Sure it's just the austrailan audience that has seen it so far, but still.

The post credit scene was great and funny :


I give the movie a 7/10 in general,it was quite good unlike what Other peopl are saying....

My personal rating would be 8/10 cause I did not see any problems...I got entertained and was happy..

Originally posted by Kazenji
I seriously don't get the hate the second gets.

Just not the best sequel to the Awesomeness of the first one.

Originally posted by CPT Space Bomb
Sure it's just the austrailan audience that has seen it so far, but still.

It's out around Europe as well.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Just not the best sequel to the Awesomeness of the first one.


Doesn't mean its terrible... there's far worst movies out there.

Originally posted by Estacado
This movie was up there with Green Lantern......the whole plot was lame..
Mandarin being fake was meh....Tony getting whooped in his own house and having malfunctions with his suit for no reasons ...lame....also why did it take him a shit load of time to realise oh wait i have like 60 armors in the basement yet I want to recharge my total crappy armor,the thermo men taking on the suits and one shoting theme was terrible,Pepper whoopin Killian was horrible......
Only positive thing about the film is that it was funny.....

Dude fail Mandarin twist was awesome! if he remained a hate monger the film would've been a drag. They made the right choice with him being an actor, it was hilarious.
The new suit was a prototype, it couldn't fly. Jarvis said himself it wasn't ready for combat use. And in regards to Pepper? Killian gave her an advanced version of the virus.

Originally posted by Estacado
She gets injected with extremis and right when Killian is about to finish Tony she jumps in and uses her super strenght to toss him asside and uses one of Im suits bomb and glove blast to finish him....it's awful...

No it wasn't! Killian wanted to make her PERFECT! she was obviously an advanced version of the virus! Killian ensured he was more advanced than his soldiers. He wanted her to be as good....as stated in film, a trophy. Pretty much a trophy wife. He was heavily damaged after his fight with Tony and that allowed Pepper to have a physical edge in combat.

Watch the film again you missed much.

The film was awesome and will go down in history as the best in the series

Score have already dropped on Imdb from 8.7 to 8 and it's been out for like 4 days watch it drop to 7,5 within another week...

Originally posted by Estacado
Score have already dropped on Imdb from 8.7 to 8 and it's been out for like 4 days watch it drop to 7,5 within another week...

You're relying on IMDB ratings? They have always been trash.

Regardless, time will tell. And I know this film was great.

Any unrealized points in the plot I'm happy to rationalize.

I didn't mind the twist in principal. Just didn't like how funny it was made. Such a pivotal part of the movie shouldn't have been made funny Imho.

Also they should have given Iron Patriot some damn action! Especially in the middle when the movie was getting a bit slow. IP went down wayyy too easily.

But overall I thought it was cool. The Mark 42 was cool. The combined armors fighting was all cool. And Robert Downey still made a great performance.

But it's not epic like IM1, Avengers and TDK.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
I didn't mind the twist in principal. Just didn't like how funny it was made. Such a pivotal part of the movie shouldn't have been made funny Imho.

Also they should have given Iron Patriot some damn action! Especially in the middle when the movie was getting a bit slow. IP went down wayyy too easily.

But overall I thought it was cool. The Mark 42 was cool. The combined armors fighting was all cool. And Robert Downey still made a great performance.

But it's not epic like IM1, Avengers and TDK.

- I have to disagree on the twist If it was allowed to manifest in the direction the film was leading into, then the film would've been a drag. The choice was genius. And Tony's actions in the film was similar to a Bond style of character, exposing a conspiracy that would've eventuated in an arms war between many nations.
He saved hundreds if not thousands of lives.
-In regards to the Iron Patriot It was hilarious how he mocked its existence throughout the film! We love War Machine as fans not stupid Iron Patriot. And the fact that IP existed as a decoy for AIMs purposes shows just how Tony's actions exposed such an icon.

Agree on the cool factor of the armors but disagree on the fact that IM3 wasn't as epic as IM1.

IM1 was an origin story and hard to beat. IM3 was a incredible mature advancement into Stark's story.
People will realize this in the future.

Originally posted by Estacado
Score have already dropped on Imdb from 8.7 to 8 and it's been out for like 4 days watch it drop to 7,5 within another week...
A) It will not drop to a 5, that's a garuntee.
B) You have to take multiple sources for a review. If you look at the 93% from critics and 99% from audience on rottentomatoes for instance; it looks MUCH better.
C) A lot of AMERICAN review sites are saying it could be THE BEST Iron Man yet. Iron man won't do as well critically overseas as it will domestically; so when it launches here the score will only go up.

Originally posted by the ninjak
- I have to disagree on the twist If it was allowed to manifest in the direction the film was leading into, then the film would've been a drag. The choice was genius. And Tony's actions in the film was similar to a Bond style of character, exposing a conspiracy that would've eventuated in an arms war between many nations.
He saved hundreds if not thousands of lives.
-In regards to the Iron Patriot It was hilarious how he mocked its existence throughout the film! We love War Machine as fans not stupid Iron Patriot. And the fact that IP existed as a decoy for AIMs purposes shows just how Tony's actions exposed such an icon.

Agree on the cool factor of the armors but disagree on the fact that IM3 wasn't as epic as IM1.

IM1 was an origin story and hard to beat. IM3 was a incredible mature advancement into Stark's story.
People will realize this in the future.

Oh no I wasn't against the idea of the twist. I just hated how they made it "funny." But maybe that's just me.

With IP all I'm saying is He was there to be used while Tony was out of action. I really feel like we could have used some Armour action in the middle. So why not utilize him?

Agree with the rest. Cool movie overall.

And especially good for a third movie. Historically 3rd movies arn't usually the best for superhero movies - Spiderman 3 & X-Men 3 come to mind.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Oh no I wasn't against the idea of the twist. I just hated how they made it "funny." But maybe that's just me.

With IP all I'm saying is He was there to be used while Tony was out of action. I really feel like we could have used some Armour action in the middle. So why not utilize him?

Agree with the rest. Cool movie overall.

And especially good for a third movie. Historically 3rd movies arn't usually the best for superhero movies - Spiderman 3 & X-Men 3 come to mind.

-I believe the funny factor was a win personally. And pushed the limits into what people on an international scale perceived the political message.

-IP was shown "surprisingly" on the level comic fans wanted to see it shown in. Which was a pleasant surprise. As a mockery

-Cool.

-IM3 WILL go down as the best in a possible trilogy. It's hard to beat an origin story. And this film wasn't the Extremis Arc story I expected. But it blew it out of the water in regards as standing on its own as a story.
It pushed Stark forward as a political espionage thriller style character.
Which surprised me.

Originally posted by the ninjak
You're relying on IMDB ratings? They have always been trash.

Regardless, time will tell. And I know this film was great.

Any unrealized points in the plot I'm happy to rationalize.

IMDB is one of the best places for a wide variety of reviews from a wide variety of people. Once more reviews from Rotten tomatoes comes through, there will be more rottens, but overall should have a healthy amount of positives.

Originally posted by Golgo13
IMDB is one of the best places for a wide variety of reviews from a wide variety of people. Once more reviews from Rotten tomatoes comes through, there will be more rottens, but overall should have a healthy amount of positives.

IMDB ratings are junk. Rely on your own perception of what the film was.
And that includes Rotten Tomatoes.

Believe in yourself.

I give the film a healthy 7/10.

Originally posted by the ninjak
IMDB ratings are junk. Rely on your own perception of what the film was.
And that includes Rotten Tomatoes.

Believe in yourself.

I give the film a healthy 7/10.

I never said that those sites influence me on the movies. I mean American Ninja is one of my favorite films evah! And it only has a rating of 4.9.

Bastards.

Originally posted by Golgo13
I never said that those sites influence me on the movies. I mean American Ninja is one of my favorite films evah! And it only has a rating of 4.9.

Bastards.

American Ninja is an awesome film. If you like it then you're good by me.

Originally posted by the ninjak
American Ninja is an awesome film. If you like it then you're good by me.

I do, I do. #2 is my favorite of the series, though. Stalone should use Michael Dudikoff in the Expendables.

A possible War Machine movie got brought up again

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/BatFreak/news/?a=78322

IM 3 ratings are dropping. It still has a solid score, but I hope this isn't disappointing. This is one of my most anticipated films this summer.

It's not as good as Avengers or IM1. So I wouldn't expect the rating to be as high as either of them.

But it's still a good movie. Add that to all the hype and it will continue to be a box office smash.

Originally posted by the ninjak
IMDB ratings are junk. Rely on your own perception of what the film was.
And that includes Rotten Tomatoes.

Believe in yourself.

I give the film a healthy 7/10.

Its a 7/10 at best.

As for scores.....ermm

http://www.metacritic.com/movie/iron-man-3

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
It's not as good as Avengers or IM1. So I wouldn't expect the rating to be as high as either of them.

But it's still a good movie. Add that to all the hype and it will continue to be a box office smash.

It looks better than both IM's to me.

Originally posted by Golgo13
It looks better than both IM's to me.

Nah it didn't touch IM1 for me. But I'm a huge fan of the original.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Nah it didn't touch IM1 for me. But I'm a huge fan of the original.

I guess I got a little too pumped. IM 3 continues to drop in ratings. Iron Man had a 93 and IM 3 has a 83. I think I'll like IM the best, but IM 3 better than 2.

Seems that there was some footage set in China that was cut from the U.S. release

http://io9.com/did-you-know-that-iron-man-3-takes-place-partly-in-chin-486189788

Decent but not as good as IM1 or 2 IMO. Plot was interesting and everything but the movie lacked bite. I felt I was watching a series after the first thrid of it.

6/10, yup I am hard to please.

Originally posted by Mshinu
Decent but not as good as IM1 or 2 IMO. Plot was interesting and everything but the movie lacked bite. I felt I was watching a series after the first thrid of it.

6/10, yup I am hard to please. I personally felt it was better than IM 2.

Originally posted by TheHulk
I personally felt it was better than IM 2.

You are correct.

Score keeps on dropping. At a 78 now.

Originally posted by Golgo13
Score keeps on dropping. At a 78 now.

doesn't mean anything especially since this is on pace for or close too $1 billion dollars

Originally posted by BruceSkywalker
doesn't mean anything especially since this is on pace for or close too $1 billion dollars

I could care less about how much it makes. I just want to see something different, something new. It seems it's not as good as IM 1 from regular posters. I'm still going to see it, but I should lower my expectations.

I actually felt like it was the best Iron Man film to date.

Stark's character underwent a lot of progression and development and you can see the differences between him from Iron Man, Iron Man 2, the Avengers, and Iron Man 3. To that end, it did a great job fleshing out a character we've already grown very familiar with.

As a comic book fan whose read quite a bit (a lot) of Iron Man...the whole Mandarin thing was kinda disappointing. I figured we'd get a very grounded take on the character - no power rings, no chi kung fu, no alien space dragons, etc - but the whole swerve with Killian being the main bad guy and the "real" Mandarin was unexpected. That said, divorcing myself from the comics and the knowledge I have from them, the ploy served the film well.

I'd give it an 8.5. Good development from the principal cast, best action scenes of the franchise, good pacing, etc.

Originally posted by Blair Wind
Im sitting in the theater, Iron Man 3 just finished. I legitimaly almost walked out when I saw what they did with the Mandarin. A phucking actor?! Phuck Shane Black.

Phuck them. Phuck them all.

I don't think I can objectively separate myself from the disappointment over what I said above. Besides that, it was a great film. It's just that my disappointment with that is so great it taints the rest of the movie to a really large degree.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
As a comic book fan whose read quite a bit (a lot) of Iron Man...the whole Mandarin thing was kinda disappointing. I figured we'd get a very grounded take on the character - no power rings, no chi kung fu, no alien space dragons, etc - but the whole swerve with Killian being the main bad guy and the "real" Mandarin was unexpected.

This is what I was expecting. His character is the perfect foil to Tony Stark. It's the fact that he's striving for an ideal and very serious in his goals that make him the villain he is. To throw that away for some laughs, after having the first movie point in his direction and waiting for 4 movies to get his movie appearance, really pissed me off..

Like i didn't see this coming...the hardcore Iron Man fans bitching.

Originally posted by Kazenji
Like i didn't see this coming...the hardcore Iron Man fans bitching.

Point?

I loved the first movie. I actually enjoy the second movie. I don't care when things are changed to suit the story as it's being adapted to fit the cinema - I just don't feel like that was the case here. I loved the movie before the twist. I loved the film after the twist. That twist just wasn't needed. It destroyed the character they had been building up to.

To put it an example that people might understand:

If the Dark Knight had been about the Joker being insane until you just realized that the Joker was an actor the Riddler had hired to throw people of his tail, people would get mad. Spoilers because it's exactly what happened in IM3.

If Deadpool had a movie where he was as serious as Scott Summers, people would get mad.

Meh. I'm entitled to think the movie was great besides that (major) issue.

Originally posted by Blair Wind
Point?

.

Point is it happens all the time with each of these comic book movies

i may not have read Iron Man for years, but i know noticed the changes myself but yet i'm not bitching.

Well i must say, I am VERY disappointed with the big twist.

Not because of the twist itself, but the fact that Killian said "He was" The Mandarin. That basically killed off ANY hope (along with the actor using the 10 rings) of an actual Mandarin to be in the cinematic Marvel universe.

Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not a Mandarin super fan or anything, but I know enough about him and respect his role as one of the upper villains in Marvel to feel he got disrespected.

Also, I'm also annoyed with the pepper killing Killian bit. It would have been better if he had died when Stark blew up his armor and then she walked out of the fire surprising Tony; who thought her dead. It just came off as unbelievable and cheesy (since she had never shown ANY ability to fight even remotely like that before).

All my gripes aside, I still feel this was a good movie. My initial review would probably be an 8 / 10

Did anyone else get a pseudo-Ra's al Ghul ala Batman Begins vibe from the twist?

Must. Not. Read. Spoilers! I'll be seeing it on Monday, so I can hold on.

***SPOILERS***













I liked the movie... but as a fan of comics I did not enjoy a few things.
-there could've been more action, I wanted Ironman/ Warmachine action. Not Tony with a gun.
-The Villains were kinda boring, and they were breathing fire
-They gave Pepper superpowers, and she stole the big ending from tony IMO.
And last... they wanted to do a more "grounded version" but in the Marvel Movieverse we've already seen Aliens, Magic, Gods, multiple Dimensions... so why not let The Mandarin use Magic?

Like I said, good movie, but as someone who knows the origins and actual abilities of the comic versions I was a little disappointed.

I give it a 7-8/10

Looks like most people agree with my assessment of the film. Tony was cool, IM was cool, the action was cool, but still a few big complaints. Which could have easily been corrected/adjusted. Really not sure why they were done.

Originally posted by armedforbattle

-The Villains were kinda boring, and they were breathing fire


guess you haven't read or watched Extremis going by your reaction.

Yeah from the comics Extremis actually did give the ability to breathe fire and regenerate.

But that's not really the villain that should have closed off the third installment of IM. This should have been the big one - The Real Mandarin Imo.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
I actually felt like it was the best Iron Man film to date.

Stark's character underwent a lot of progression and development and you can see the differences between him from Iron Man, Iron Man 2, the Avengers, and Iron Man 3. To that end, it did a great job fleshing out a character we've already grown very familiar with.

As a comic book fan whose read quite a bit (a lot) of Iron Man...the whole Mandarin thing was kinda disappointing. I figured we'd get a very grounded take on the character - no power rings, no chi kung fu, no alien space dragons, etc - but the whole swerve with Killian being the main bad guy and the "real" Mandarin was unexpected. That said, divorcing myself from the comics and the knowledge I have from them, the ploy served the film well.

I'd give it an 8.5. Good development from the principal cast, best action scenes of the franchise, good pacing, etc.

Couldn't of said it better.

Originally posted by Kazenji
guess you haven't read or watched Extremis going by your reaction. again, it just didn't make sense to me to cut out stuff like The Mandarin not having powers I mean that's IMs arch enemy.. they could've at least done him some on screen justice (almost like the Power rings wouldn't have been believable) then to give the Extremis users such crazy powers. just didn't seem right to me... but none the less I still enjoyed it.

Originally posted by Golgo13
I could care less about how much it makes. I just want to see something different, something new. It seems it's not as good as IM 1 from regular posters. I'm still going to see it, but I should lower my expectations.


well you really shouldn't believe what other posters say and have a mind of your own... i am seeing this on sunday so i very stoked to see it

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Looks like most people agree with my assessment of the film. Tony was cool, IM was cool, the action was cool, but still a few big complaints. Which could have easily been corrected/adjusted. Really not sure why they were done.

i can't judge until sunday but i won't be at all surprised if they done to make way for Iron Man 4

Originally posted by TheHulk
I personally felt it was better than IM 2.

To each his own, I liked IM2 better than the first but I am probably in a minority.

IM1: 7
IM2: 8
IM3: 6

Originally posted by BruceSkywalker


i can't judge until sunday but i won't be at all surprised if they done to make way for Iron Man 4

Don't read any of the IM forums until you see it. Spoilers have a way of presenting themselves even when you don't read the spoiler tags.

Originally posted by Mshinu
To each his own, I liked IM2 better than the first but I am probably in a minority.



A very very small minority Lol.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Don't read any of the IM forums until you see it. Spoilers have a way of presenting themselves even when you don't read the spoiler tags.






i don't mind some spoilers

Saw the midnight showing and I gotta say I am disappointed. It's not a bad film, rather it's merely decent and only marginally better than IM2.

I had two major problems with it:

1st: The Mandarin twist. My problem isn't that they mangled the comic character, rather they ruined a very intriguing and awesome movie villain. Throughout the 1st half of the movie the Mandarin is very intimidating and appears to have complex motivations, however they throw this away for an unintriguing villain with rather boring motivations.

2nd: Pepper Pots defeating Killian. This was utterly ridiculous and my biggest gripe. The hero is supposed to overcome the antagonist, he's not supposed to be defeated only for a secondary character to come in and do his job for him... Ugh. It reminds me of TDKR, but at least in that movie Batman was able to overcome Bane. Here, Iron Man isn't victorious but rather Pots is. Awful IMO.

Movie was originally 3+ hours

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/notyetamovie/news/?a=78791

interview starts at the 45 mins mark

Originally posted by Mshinu
To each his own, I liked IM2 better than the first but I am probably in a minority.


I personally really liked IM2, There was a lot of action.

You know with how much control Jarvis had over the suits they could totally make him Ultron. Tony accidentally creating Ultron makes more sense than Pym.

Just got back from seeing it. I wonder what SHIELD was doing througout this whole movie? Anyways I give the movie a 7 out of 10, I actually liked IM 2 better.

Based on some of the spoilers I've read, especially regarding the Mandarin, I wonder if I should go and watch this movie at all.

^ It's still a good movie. And with the spoilers you won't have your expectations too high like we did.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Based on some of the spoilers I've read, especially regarding the Mandarin, I wonder if I should go and watch this movie at all.

Cheater!

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
^ It's still a good movie. And with the spoilers you won't have your expectations too high like we did.
It's not the spoilers as much as the disappointing turn of events regarding what's supposed to be THE Ironman villain.

I've read spoilers for other movies before, and still went on to watch and enjoy said movies. I have a feeling that it won't be the same with IM3.

Originally posted by Golgo13
Cheater!
Silence.

Entertaining movie but I was disappointed by it. No Extremis Iron Man, they butchered the Mandarin the second half of the movie and no GotG after credits..

Newjak Edited incorrect Spoiler tags.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
It's not the spoilers as much as the disappointing turn of events regarding what's supposed to be THE Ironman villain.

I've read spoilers for other movies before, and still went on to watch and enjoy said movies. I have a feeling that it won't be the same with IM3. Just got back from watching it. Definitely worth going and seeing.

The bit with the Mandrain was kind of sad/disappointing but it worked within the context of the story they writing. Also I think knowing it before hand helped with it.

Iron Man 3 was good. Everyone complaining about the movie gets 3 warnings. sneer

Originally posted by Badabing
Iron Man 3 was good. Everyone complaining about the movie gets 3 warnings. sneer

Honestly probably my biggest complaint would be

The inconsistency of how the armors dealt with the Extremis Enhanced Humans. Killian and his right hand man made the armors fall to their knees with mere touches yet when the unmanned armors were fighting the Extremis Thugs they were able to take on two to three of them at a time and do pretty well. Heck based on the final fire work display and with their apparently being only 42 made it looks like the only suits Tony lost were the ones Killian and Pepper took out. Also Killian survives one of the suits exploding but then gets destroyed by random armor missile mixed with repulsor blast.

Originally posted by Newjak

The bit with the Mandrain was kind of sad/disappointing but it worked within the context of the story they writing. Also I think knowing it before hand helped with it.

I disagree there

not knowing the Mandarin twist worked for it.

IM 3 is the Superman Returns of the IM franchise.

TIE-INS WITH MARVEL MOVIE UNIVERSe:

We got few flash backs and allusions about the NY battle and a little cameo from the Hulk/Banner who is sporting white hair like he's 20 years older and a beard. That's it.

WAR MACHINE MISUSAGE:

We were told Rhodey was gonna get more action and scree-time. UNLIKELY. All he did is getting robbed of his armor and flying around without shooting down anything or fighting anybody. He got punked by an extremis enhanced woman and that's it. What he did in the rest of the movie was like him being a character out of a James Bond movie. Gunfight, hth combat. In the end he fly off with the US President. Re-dubbing him Iron Patriot? POINTLESS.

MISUSAGE OF THE STARK ARMORY:

We get to see prototypes and operative models of the IM armor just to have a Power Rangers style battle where we see em flyin' around self-destructing or fighting extremis supersoldiers. Now in THE AVENGERS IM can take down Chitauris Behemots and here he and his armors have issues taking down extremis enhanced humans? GIMME A BREAK!

MISUSAGE OF THE MANDARIN/TWIST:

WORST PORTRAYAL AND INSULT TO AN EPIC COMIC BOOK VILLAIN EVER. WHAT IS THE POINT OF CASTING A GREAT ACTOR LIKE KINGSLEY TO HAVE HIM PLAY A OPIUM ADDICT LOW LEVEL ACTOR TO PLAY A FAKE TERRORIST?
Aldrich Killian turns out to be The Mandarin who is acting just of out of jealousy for not being at Stark's level and trying to get laid with Pepper Potts. WTF IS THIS? ORANGE COUNTY? BEVERLY HILLS?

MAN OF STEEL IS GOING TO PISS ON IM3 BIG TIME. I HOPE THOR: THE DARK WORLD IS NOT AT IM3 LEVEL OR OTHERWISE THE MARVEL MOVIE FRANCHISE IS GONNA GO DOWN. WORST MOVIE WITH F4, F4: ROTSS, AND THE SYNGER X-MEN FAILURE

Originally posted by K3VIL

We were told Rhodey was gonna get more action and scree-time. UNLIKELY.


Who told us?..........i don't remember them saying War Machine was going to have more screen time



To hell with you....

Can anyone explain to me Killian's reason for wanting to kill the president? How did IM enter air force one without blowing a hole through it? How Killian remote controlled Iron Patriot to fly the president off airforce one and Rhodey got control of it later so easily?

Anybody want to tell me where in the f*ck SHIELD was during this whole movie? You'd think they'd be all over this terrorist and his attacks.

Originally posted by K3VIL
IM 3 is the Superman Returns of the IM franchise.

TIE-INS WITH MARVEL MOVIE UNIVERSe:

We got few flash backs and allusions about the NY battle and a little cameo from the Hulk/Banner who is sporting white hair like he's 20 years older and a beard. That's it.

WAR MACHINE MISUSAGE:

We were told Rhodey was gonna get more action and scree-time. UNLIKELY. All he did is getting robbed of his armor and flying around without shooting down anything or fighting anybody. He got punked by an extremis enhanced woman and that's it. What he did in the rest of the movie was like him being a character out of a James Bond movie. Gunfight, hth combat. In the end he fly off with the US President. Re-dubbing him Iron Patriot? POINTLESS.

MISUSAGE OF THE STARK ARMORY:

We get to see prototypes and operative models of the IM armor just to have a Power Rangers style battle where we see em flyin' around self-destructing or fighting extremis supersoldiers. Now in THE AVENGERS IM can take down Chitauris Behemots and here he and his armors have issues taking down extremis enhanced humans? GIMME A BREAK!

MISUSAGE OF THE MANDARIN/TWIST:

WORST PORTRAYAL AND INSULT TO AN EPIC COMIC BOOK VILLAIN EVER. WHAT IS THE POINT OF CASTING A GREAT ACTOR LIKE KINGSLEY TO HAVE HIM PLAY A OPIUM ADDICT LOW LEVEL ACTOR TO PLAY A FAKE TERRORIST?
Aldrich Killian turns out to be The Mandarin who is acting just of out of jealousy for not being at Stark's level and trying to get laid with Pepper Potts. WTF IS THIS? ORANGE COUNTY? BEVERLY HILLS?

MAN OF STEEL IS GOING TO PISS ON IM3 BIG TIME. I HOPE THOR: THE DARK WORLD IS NOT AT IM3 LEVEL OR OTHERWISE THE MARVEL MOVIE FRANCHISE IS GONNA GO DOWN. WORST MOVIE WITH F4, F4: ROTSS, AND THE SYNGER X-MEN FAILURE


Lol, I'm gonna have to agree that MOS will piss all over IM 3 in terms of story. Had it been the real Mandarin vs IM as the first part of the movie been developing towards, it would a been awesome. Instead, we get a another mad businessman that wants revenge on Tony.

The final fight made me gag really. It was like watching a Transformers movie where you can't make out most of the stuff. Things were just blowing up and the hero manages to survive numerous potential killer moment. Those armors were pretty much useless. Hulk Buster came charging in and then it became a huge car jack to hold up a container. wtf?

IM 3, while good, was also a big disappointment. I hate when director/studios pisses on characters (Mandarin, armors, and Rhodey).

Originally posted by juggernaut74
Anybody want to tell me where in the f*ck SHIELD was during this whole movie? You'd think they'd be all over this terrorist and his attacks.

Yeah, I didn't like that bit either. I could see the real Mandarin giving Shield a hard time but Killian and his hollywood set? At least with Mandarin, he can have a network of terrorist (Ten Rings) that cover his track. Killian has a little organization with some henchmen at his disposal.

I was thinking Mandarin was so badass that he had Killian and AIM under his control. Then it turned out, it was Killian, AIM, and his actor called Mandarin. FML

The president's life was in danger so they send Iron Patriot to the rescue. That must be be on SHIELDs priority list.

Too many haters on IM 3! From the scope of the story, I think I'm going to like this better than IM 2. Just a hunch.

It wasn't a bad movie by any means, I guess I just went in thinking it was going to be epic from the hype I've been hearing about, and it wasn't.

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing


IM 3, while good, was also a big disappointment.

Originally posted by juggernaut74
It wasn't a bad movie by any means, I guess I just went in thinking it was going to be epic from the hype I've been hearing about, and it wasn't.

Agree with these.

IMO Iron Man 3 is EASILY the best of the Iron Man films. Best writing. Best action set pieces. A legitimate character arc. Some actual pathos from the lead character. Surprising twists.

Some precious comic fans are grumpy because of the Mandarin twist, but I thought it was great, and I didn't see it coming, which is rare. I saw IM3 with some class mates, none of which are comics fans, when the movie was over they asked me "Is that what Mandarin is like in the comics?" I said "No, he has super kung fu and can fight Iron Man in hand to hand combat unaided and also he has ten magic rings." They all thought that was the stupidest thing they've ever heard. Those are the people this change was made for.

loved it.. As a whole IMO, Iron Man, Iron Man 3, Iron Man 2..

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
IMO Iron Man 3 is EASILY the best of the Iron Man films. Best writing. Best action set pieces. A legitimate character arc. Some actual pathos from the lead character. Surprising twists.

Some precious comic fans are grumpy because of the Mandarin twist, but I thought it was great, and I didn't see it coming, which is rare. I saw IM3 with some class mates, none of which are comics fans, when the movie was over they asked me "Is that what Mandarin is like in the comics?" I said "No, he has super kung fu and can fight Iron Man in hand to hand combat unaided and also he has ten magic rings." They all thought that was the stupidest thing they've ever heard. Those are the people this change was made for.

Eh, he doesn't need to have magic rings. The built up for Mandarin was great though. A terrorist/teacher type whole hated America. He was like a Ra's Al Ghul/Joker villain. It looked like IM was going to take on an international organization and instead we get IM fighting another pissed off businessman. Mandarin can be a terrorist on the level of Ra's Al Ghul and even then IM would have a hard time hunting down. Tony's got millions of dollars even he isn't going to track someone like say Osama Bin Laden easily. What's all the tech good for against guerrilla fighters? We saw a glimpse of that when Rhodey tried to find Mandarin and having no luck.

The Mandarin twist sucked because they built him up to be a credible threat even with his magic rings. He outright killed a guy after the president gave in. He blew up Stark's mansion after Stark gave him his address. He bombed the Man's Chinese threat and had AIM working for him. He could be a frail, old man and still work if he's manipulative bastard with a cult willing to carry out his orders. Furthermore, Kingsley played a convincing Mandarin so yeah I was bummed when they wasted the build up to give it a twist because they think the Mandarin is all about kung fu and those rings. The twist is cop out because Shane hates the Mandarin for being a caricature yet Kingsley's Mandarin was marvelous.

IM 1 - business partner wanted Stark dead to take over the company
IM 2 - mad scientist wanted Stark dead as revenge
IM 3 - mad scientist/businessman wanted revenge on Stark

Marvel seem to like to rehash stuff.

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
Eh, he doesn't need to have magic rings. The built up for Mandarin was great though. A terrorist/teacher type whole hated America. He was like a Ra's Al Ghul/Joker villain. It looked like IM was going to take on an international organization and instead we get IM fighting another pissed off businessman. Mandarin can be a terrorist on the level of Ra's Al Ghul and even then IM would have a hard time hunting down. Tony's got millions of dollars even he isn't going to track someone like say Osama Bin Laden easily. What's all the tech good for against guerrilla fighters? We saw a glimpse of that when Rhodey tried to find Mandarin and having no luck.

The Mandarin twist sucked because they built him up to be a credible threat even with his magic rings. He outright killed a guy after the president gave in. He blew up Stark's mansion after Stark gave him his address. He bombed the Man's Chinese threat and had AIM working for him. He could be a frail, old man and still work if he's manipulative bastard with a cult willing to carry out his orders. Furthermore, Kingsley played a convincing Mandarin so yeah I was bummed when they wasted the build up to give it a twist because they think the Mandarin is all about kung fu and those rings. The twist is cop out because Shane hates the Mandarin for being a caricature yet Kingsley's Mandarin was marvelous.

IM 1 - business partner wanted Stark dead to take over the company
IM 2 - mad scientist wanted Stark dead as revenge
IM 3 - mad scientist/businessman wanted revenge on Stark

Marvel seem to like to rehash stuff.

So... you missed the whole point of the movie.

I don't think he did.

Tony's story arc was great. The dialogue was great. Even the general plot coming into the mid-way point was great (AIM made Extremis, funded by Mandarin). We didn't need magic ring. The terrorist angle was good enough for me. Enhance him with a better version of Extremis and I wouldn't care that it's not his power set. Just don't punk the guy out by being an actor.

The movie itself was great - I just don't think the Mandarin's twist should have been executed. You traded a villain (as portrayed in the film) with layers for a white guy who wanted a trophy to prove he was better than Stark. The entire second half, viewed from the lens of the villain, collapses IMO. Tony's story (his arc and transformation) was perfect - I just think that same transformation could have taken place with the Mandarin as the final villain.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
So... you missed the whole point of the movie.

No, please enlighten me about the point of this movie other than another white guy pissed off at Tony and taking revenge.

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
Can anyone explain to me Killian's reason for wanting to kill the president?

Wel l rist and foremost killing the President over that oil rig or whatever would be a showcase of the Mandarin. Since the President apparently saved corporate heads it would be a fitting place of demise for the "Mandarin." I also believe the President has been against Extremis and other genetic modification stuff.

Also with the President dead the widespread panic and call for revenge will give a huge boost to Killian's funds as the demand for Extremis will be high. They are run off of military contracts and since in this scenario, War Machine failed the Pentagon would give boatloads of money to Killian.

Finally with the President dead the Vice President would obviously be the new President and in the movie the VP was in cahoots with Killian to ensure that he controls the war on terror.

Really it's just an overly complicated scheme to make Extremis work.

Originally posted by Based
Wel l rist and foremost killing the President over that oil rig or whatever would be a showcase of the Mandarin. Since the President apparently saved corporate heads it would be a fitting place of demise for the "Mandarin." I also believe the President has been against Extremis and other genetic modification stuff.

Also with the President dead the widespread panic and call for revenge will give a huge boost to Killian's funds as the demand for Extremis will be high. They are run off of military contracts and since in this scenario, War Machine failed the Pentagon would give boatloads of money to Killian.

Finally with the President dead the Vice President would obviously be the new President and in the movie the VP was in cahoots with Killian to ensure that he controls the war on terror.

Really it's just an overly complicated scheme to make Extremis work.

Yeah a bit of a stretch since the VP will only be there until another election comes up but a valid explanation.

Well that's why the VP was arrested in the movie. Because he was willing to do what Killian wanted to get in power. Also it's for his daughter or something who's missing a leg.

Originally posted by Based
Well that's why the VP was arrested in the movie. Because he was willing to do what Killian wanted to get in power. Also it's for his daughter or something who's missing a leg.

When I saw his girl, what came to mind was he was doing it for his girl more than for power. It could be power that wants but it seemed that it was more for his girl the way he put his hand on her shoulders as it's being revealed that she was an amputee.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
I said "No, he has super kung fu and can fight Iron Man in hand to hand combat unaided and also he has ten magic rings." They all thought that was the stupidest thing they've ever heard. Those are the people this change was made for.

Really?........

but yet its okay to accept an alien invasion and also Norse gods walking around

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing

IM 3 - mad scientist/businessman wanted revenge on Stark


That' only a little bit.

@slowpoke as much as I enjoyed reading your post......it really does not matter as a movie does not require that much..."dwelling inside"..or I can just say...your overlooking into this

Originally posted by Blair Wind
Point?

I loved the first movie. I actually enjoy the second movie. I don't care when things are changed to suit the story as it's being adapted to fit the cinema - I just don't feel like that was the case here. I loved the movie before the twist. I loved the film after the twist. That twist just wasn't needed. It destroyed the character they had been building up to.

To put it an example that people might understand:

If the Dark Knight had been about the Joker being insane until you just realized that the Joker was an actor the Riddler had hired to throw people of his tail, people would get mad. Spoilers because it's exactly what happened in IM3.

If Deadpool had a movie where he was as serious as Scott Summers, people would get mad.

Meh. I'm entitled to think the movie was great besides that (major) issue.

Rotten Tomatoes score has stabilized in the high 70's, after a couple of weeks. No parallel to Green Lantern here, critically or financially.

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/iron_man_3/


Well, there is a parallel with The Dark Knight Returns from last year, because we found out after all that epic buildup, Bane wasn't the real mastermind after all. I thought it weakened the movie to have him just be another soldier following Talia's orders, but that was me.

Mandarin's been a problematic villain to figure out for some time, because of his roots as a Fu Manchu caricature. I think this leaves the door open for someone else to get part of the Mandarin's power and persona in the future while bringing something new. Marvel has been adept at fusing a couple of villains together to make them and their motivations work in the greater story arc.

If people were disappointed with how Tony's narration came to an end in the post credit scene, they should watch Shane Black's directorial debut Kiss Kiss Bang Bang (also with Downey, and it's a hoot.) He pulls the same narrative tricks in there; plus being yet another movie he sets during Christmas!

Solid 8/10 from me. Most serious James Bond vibe yet and great humour.

Originally posted by juggernaut74
It wasn't a bad movie by any means,

I wish I could say as much about Nolan's overrated Batman movies...

Originally posted by TheHulk
@slowpoke as much as I enjoyed reading your post......it really does not matter as a movie does not require that much..."dwelling inside"..or I can just say...your overlooking into this

Well they ruined the Mandarin so they have to give something better, but we got shit.

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
No, please enlighten me about the point of this movie other than another white guy pissed off at Tony and taking revenge.

Originally posted by Blair Wind
I don't think he did.

Tony's story arc was great. The dialogue was great. Even the general plot coming into the mid-way point was great (AIM made Extremis, funded by Mandarin). We didn't need magic ring. The terrorist angle was good enough for me. Enhance him with a better version of Extremis and I wouldn't care that it's not his power set. Just don't punk the guy out by being an actor.

The movie itself was great - I just don't think the Mandarin's twist should have been executed. You traded a villain (as portrayed in the film) with layers for a white guy who wanted a trophy to prove he was better than Stark. The entire second half, viewed from the lens of the villain, collapses IMO. Tony's story (his arc and transformation) was perfect - I just think that same transformation could have taken place with the Mandarin as the final villain.

A villain with layers? A middle eastern mad man who hates America. Real deep. You say you would have been happy if the Mandarin was a terrorist enhanced by Extremis? Well... that's what you got. Aldrich Killian was the Mandarin, and he was a terrorist, just a corporate terrorist instead of "I live in a cave" religious zealot one. The idea of a cooperation with military weapons contracts inventing a terrorist organization and using appropriated iconography from various cultures as a means to distract the population and government from their unethical and dangerous experiments while they operate behind the scenes with impunity is scary, and much more interesting than a run of the mill terrorist, even if the guy in charge happens to be white... which is apparently an issue.

Also Killian wanted to partner with Stark Industries to get approved human trials for Extremis. He as grateful to Tony for teaching him the value of anonymity, he said as much in the movie. Killian wasn't out for revenge or to humiliate Tony, he wanted to work with Stark... but Tony calling out the Mandarin on tv, and Pepper turning down his offer forced his hand. Tony inserted himself in AIM's cross hairs, investigating what happened to Happy, but he was never the target or goal.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
A villain with layers? A middle eastern mad man who hates America. Real deep. You say you would have been happy if the Mandarin was a terrorist enhanced by Extremis? Well... that's what you got. Aldrich Killian was the Mandarin, and he was a terrorist, just a corporate terrorist instead of "I live in a cave" religious zealot one. The idea of a cooperation with military weapons contracts inventing a terrorist organization and using appropriated iconography from various cultures as a means to distract the population and government from their unethical and dangerous experiments while they operate behind the scenes with impunity is scary, and much more interesting than a run of the mill terrorist, even if the guy in charge happens to be white... which is apparently an issue.

Also Killian wanted to partner with Stark Industries to get approved human trials for Extremis. He as grateful to Tony for teaching him the value of anonymity, he said as much in the movie. Killian wasn't out for revenge or to humiliate Tony, he wanted to work with Stark... but Tony calling out the Mandarin on tv, and Pepper turning down his offer forced his hand. Tony inserted himself in AIM's cross hairs, investigating what happened to Happy, but he was never the target or goal.

Well his moves are much dumber than those corporate terrorists. His first move already could ruin his plan if the government is a bit smart.

If he wanted to work with Tony, why did he use the helicopters to attack him, which could kill both him and Maya? Why didn't he ask for Tony's help in the first one since his Ten Rings captured Tony, and the Ten Rings clearly were working with Iron Mongor?

Originally posted by Slowpoke
Well his moves are much dumber than those corporate terrorists. His first move already could ruin his plan if the government is a bit smart.


I don't know what you are a referring too...

Originally posted by Slowpoke
If he wanted to work with Tony, why did he use the helicopters to attack him, which could kill both him and Maya? Why didn't he ask for Tony's help in the first one since his Ten Rings captured Tony, and the Ten Rings clearly were working with Iron Mongor?

Because Tony forced his hand. He challenged the Mandarin on live television, so the Mandarin needed to respond or else he'd appear impotent and weak.

Because he didn't need Stark's help, he needed Stark Industries help... which he would have gotten if Stark died and Obadiah Stane assumed control of the company. He wanted Stark Industries to join the think tank and help him push Extremis for human trials and an eventual launch (that's why he went to see Pepper and not to "mess with Stark's girl," as you surmised), he didn't want Tony's help with the science, he wanted Stark Industries to legitimize AIM so he could get the ball rolling and accomplish his end game.

Originally posted by Slowpoke
Well his moves are much dumber than those corporate terrorists. His first move already could ruin his plan if the government is a bit smart.

If he wanted to work with Tony, why did he use the helicopters to attack him, which could kill both him and Maya? Why didn't he ask for Tony's help in the first one since his Ten Rings captured Tony, and the Ten Rings clearly were working with Iron Mongor?

- He wanted to work with his company to a point (that is, Stark further weaponizes Extremis and he reaps the benefits) but would just as soon have Tony out of the way.

- Tony publicly threatened the Mandarin, forcing Killian's hand and making him react in a way that was very public and violent as expected.

- Maya is the one who really wanted Tony on board, because she was worried about the longterm stability of Extremis on the body. He helped her figure some things out at the Bern conference in 1999. She went to see Tony behind Killian's back, telling him later how it was for his benefit ("One day you'll burn too hot" she warned him.)

- If he asked him for help in the first one, it would have been revealing everything about himself and what A.I.M. was doing. He was benefiting by staying in the shadows, and eventually created Ben Kingsley's character to be the public face.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
I don't know what you are a referring too...



Because Tony forced his hand. He challenged the Mandarin on live television, so the Mandarin needed to respond or else he'd appear impotent and weak.

Because he didn't need Stark's help, he needed Stark Industries help... which he would have gotten if Stark died and Obadiah Stane assumed control of the company. He wanted Stark Industries to join the think tank and help him push Extremis for human trials and an eventual launch (that's why he went to see Pepper and not to "mess with Stark's girl," as you surmised), he didn't want Tony's help with the science, he wanted Stark Industries to legitimize AIM so he could get the ball rolling and accomplish his end game.

I wrote all of them in the long post.

But he did want Tony's help, and he later tried to let him do it. And no doubt he needs Maya's help but the attack almost killed her. So to launch a respond, he almost killed his most important assistant?

I explained before, if he just wanted to talk about business, he should let someone else to visit Pepper rather than go by himself to avoid himself being exposed, he also brought the bald guy with him and let many people saw his face.

Originally posted by roughrider
- He wanted to work with his company to a point (that is, Stark further weaponizes Extremis and he reaps the benefits) but would just as soon have Tony out of the way.

- Tony publicly threatened the Mandarin, forcing Killian's hand and making him react in a way that was very public and violent as expected.

- Maya is the one who really wanted Tony on board, because she was worried about the longterm stability of Extremis on the body. He helped her figure some things out at the Bern conference in 1999. She went to see Tony behind Killian's back, telling him later how it was for his benefit ("One day you'll burn too hot" she warned him.)

- If he asked him for help in the first one, it would have been revealing everything about himself and what A.I.M. was doing. He was benefiting by staying in the shadows, and eventually created Ben Kingsley's character to be the public face.

But that attack almost killed Maya, who was very important to him. This also showed he didn't put an eye on his most important "partner", who knew almost everything about his plan.

What? Tony was captured, nobody would know it beside his minions and Tony, if he really worried about being exposed, why did he go by himself to introduce Pepper the technology? That's way more dangerous.

Originally posted by Slowpoke
I wrote all of them in the long post.

But he did want Tony's help, and he later tried to let him do it. And no doubt he needs Maya's help but the attack almost killed her. So to launch a respond, he almost killed his most important assistant?

I explained before, if he just wanted to talk about business, he should let someone else to visit Pepper rather than go by himself to avoid himself being exposed, he also brought the bald guy with him and let many people saw his face.

I don't think he knew Mia was there when he attacked Stark's mansion. AIM needed the head of Stark Industries to help them, and at that point he had the leverage he needed to get Tony to do what he wanted, and according to Mia he needed Stark's help to perfect the formula. Also... he killed Mia so she wasn't that important at the end of the day.

He was the head of the think tank and had a working relationship with Pepper. Why would he send someone else? Him going nets him the best chances of a favorable outcome. Billionaires generally travel with body guards. Stark wasn't his enemy, he didn't expect a paranoid security officer trailing his body guard on a whim.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
I don't think he knew Mia was there when he attacked Stark's mansion. AIM needed the head of Stark Industries to help them, and at that point he had the leverage he needed to get Tony to do what he wanted, and according to Mia he needed Stark's help to perfect the formula. Also... he killed Mia so she wasn't that important at the end of the day.

He was the head of the think tank and had a working relationship with Pepper. Why would he send someone else? Him going nets him the best chances of a favorable outcome. Billionaires generally travel with body guards. Stark wasn't his enemy, he didn't expect a paranoid security officer trailing his body guard on a whim.

So he didn't keep his eye on his most important assistant, who knew most of the plans of him, let her run out freely, and almost let her tell Tony he was behind it? That's extremely stupid for a guy who wanted to control US.

The core of his plan is the virus, and he killed one who invented it and could perfect the formula, and tried to kill another who could do such thing, when any of his men could explode in the future, including himself? That's quite stupid

Because it could get him exposed, just send someone who's not directly linked wit him to try it first, if they didn't like it then he would not get exposed, if they did then he could show himself up. The worst thing that could happen to him, is his plan being exposed.

No, the bald guy also did his mission at the same time, showing his power before the eyes of many people twice, without making any disguise. Many people saw him in the hall when Killian visited Pepper. If the government is a bit smart, ask the survivors to know this bald guy, get his image and release it out. Then those who saw him in the hall would be able to identify him, then GG.

Originally posted by Slowpoke
So he didn't keep his eye on his most important assistant, who knew most of the plans of him, let her run out freely, and almost let her tell Tony he was behind it? That's extremely stupid for a guy who wanted to control US.

The core of his plan is the virus, and he killed one who invented it and could perfect the formula, and tried to kill another who could do such thing, when any of his men could explode in the future, including himself? That's quite stupid

Because it could get him exposed, just send someone who's not directly linked wit him to try it first, if they didn't like it then he would not get exposed, if they did then he could show himself up. The worst thing that could happen to him, is his plan being exposed.

No, the bald guy also did his mission at the same time, showing his power before the eyes of many people twice, without making any disguise. Many people saw him in the hall when Killian visited Pepper. If the government is a bit smart, ask the survivors to know this bald guy, get his image and release it out. Then those who saw him in the hall would be able to identify him, then GG.

They were partners he didn't suspect her of treason, nor did he have any reason too. She was devoted to the cause same has he was.

I don't think he want to control the US, he wanted to get his drug into trials, and the vice president having a daughter who was missing a leg, saw the benefit of that was willing to get in bed with Killian to that end. There is no indication that Killian want to rule the world or that the Vice President would have been a pawn, merely that they had a like mind in getting the Extremis into the hands of the public.

He killed her because he had Tony, he only needed one of them, and according to Mia, Tony was of more use then she was. Killing her in front of Tony makes his point loud and clear.

The Bald guy showed powers after Killian met with Pepper, because his buddy od'ed on the drug and exploded. He wasn't running around blasting people in public until after the meeting.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
They were partners he didn't suspect her of treason, nor did he have any reason too. She was devoted to the cause same has he was.

I don't think he want to control the US, he wanted to get his drug into trials, and the vice president having a daughter who was missing a leg, saw the benefit of that was willing to get in bed with Killian to that end. There is no indication that Killian want to rule the world or that the Vice President would have been a pawn, merely that they had a like mind in getting the Extremis into the hands of the public.

He killed her because he had Tony, he only needed one of them, and according to Mia, Tony was of more use then she was. Killing her in front of Tony makes his point loud and clear.

The Bald guy showed powers after Killian met with Pepper, because his buddy od'ed on the drug and exploded. He wasn't running around blasting people in public until after the meeting.

Well as a guy who planned for such a big scheme, he has to put an eye on such a important figure who could ruin his plan easily.

He did say he wanted to control US and the terrorists at the same time, even if he didn't, he was using both sides to work for him, that means he has to be really really careful to not expose himself.

No, killing her only makes Tony further disagree to work for him, he could do that to her, then of course he would do it to Tony and possibly Pepper later. It's not like Tony is afraid of death, he is Iron Man and everyone saw what he tried to do in the end of The Avengers.

It doesn't matter, once the police and the government know his existence and get a picture of him from those who saw him showing the power, those who saw him in the hall would be able to identity him out. "Hey that's the guy we saw in the hall..""He's an AIM member" then GG Killian. That's why bad guys need to disguise themselves.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Because Tony forced his hand. He challenged the Mandarin on live television, so the Mandarin needed to respond or else he'd appear impotent and weak.

So what? The Mandarin was nothing more than a cover for Killian's schemes. Why would it matter if the Mandarin appeared weak?

Here is a poll on what people thought at CBR. Kinda mixed.

http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=poll&id=147&view=results&msg=voted

Originally posted by ares834
So what? The Mandarin was nothing more than a cover for Killian's schemes. Why would it matter if the Mandarin appeared weak?

Mandarin had to appear to be a highly competent and dangerous terrorist figure at all times in order for his scheme to work. Considering at this time, Iron Man was a bonafide superhero in leagues with legendary super soldiers, gamma monsters, and a god, Mandarin taking Stark out in his own home only further made him that much more legitimate of a threat. Plus Tony was going to go after him anyway.

Logically, it made a lot of sense for the Mandarin to accept the challenge than to ignore and wait for Stark to strike first.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Mandarin had to appear to be a highly competent and dangerous terrorist figure at all times in order for his scheme to work. Considering at this time, Iron Man was a bonafide superhero in leagues with legendary super soldiers, gamma monsters, and a god, Mandarin taking Stark out in his own home only further made him that much more legitimate of a threat. Plus Tony was going to go after him anyway.

Logically, it made a lot of sense for the Mandarin to accept the challenge than to ignore and wait for Stark to strike first.

But shouldn't he make sure Pepper and Maya were not there before he launched the attack?

Originally posted by Slowpoke
But shouldn't he make sure Pepper and Maya were not there before he launched the attack?

Assuming you're talking about Killian, the Mandarin's reputation and the possibility of Stark ruining his long term goals was more important than Pepper's well being (and as we saw later) Maya's life.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Assuming you're talking about Killian, the Mandarin's reputation and the possibility of Stark ruining his long term goals was more important than Pepper's well being (and as we saw later) Maya's life.

No, the virus is the most important thing, if both Tony and Maya are gone, then any of his men could explode and he might not be able to cover it every time, since even he has the virus inside himself.

Also if Tony is gone, Pepper would take over his business, she would be a good choice to be lured to work with AIM.

That's how mastermind do things, they don't just kill whoever taunt them, they carefully make the best way.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Logically, it made a lot of sense for the Mandarin to accept the challenge than to ignore and wait for Stark to strike first.

I'll admit that does work. If Killian suspected Stark would have been able to learn the truth he would take him out.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Mandarin had to appear to be a highly competent and dangerous terrorist figure at all times in order for his scheme to work. Considering at this time, Iron Man was a bonafide superhero in leagues with legendary super soldiers, gamma monsters, and a god, Mandarin taking Stark out in his own home only further made him that much more legitimate of a threat. Plus Tony was going to go after him anyway.

Logically, it made a lot of sense for the Mandarin to accept the challenge than to ignore and wait for Stark to strike first.

That's asking for trouble now. If Mandarin kills Stark, Killian should know the entire Avengers and SHIELD would be hunting for the Mandarin and expose Killian's lie. Having Stark searching for a fictional character is one thing, having Stark's friends seeking vengeance is another. The Mandarin wouldn't look weak if he avoided a confrontation with IM. It would mean he's highly competent not to stir things further. Accepting a challenge would be playing IM's game which is would be stupid yet Killian decided to go for it.

Originally posted by ares834
I'll admit that does work. If Killian suspected Stark would have been able to learn the truth he would take him out.

Also, since he was worried about Stark knowing the truth, why did he pay Pepper the visit by himself, along with the bald guy who does all the secret missions for him? That's asking for trouble.

Originally posted by Slowpoke
But that attack almost killed Maya, who was very important to him. This also showed he didn't put an eye on his most important "partner", who knew almost everything about his plan.



Yeah, and he eventually killed her anyway, when she made him choose. Goes to show he found her useful only to a point.

We could go on like this for pages and pages. We agree to disagree.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
A villain with layers? A middle eastern mad man who hates America. Real deep. You say you would have been happy if the Mandarin was a terrorist enhanced by Extremis? Well... that's what you got. Aldrich Killian was the Mandarin, and he was a terrorist, just a corporate terrorist instead of "I live in a cave" religious zealot one. The idea of a cooperation with military weapons contracts inventing a terrorist organization and using appropriated iconography from various cultures as a means to distract the population and government from their unethical and dangerous experiments while they operate behind the scenes with impunity is scary, and much more interesting than a run of the mill terrorist, even if the guy in charge happens to be white... which is apparently an issue.

Also Killian wanted to partner with Stark Industries to get approved human trials for Extremis. He as grateful to Tony for teaching him the value of anonymity, he said as much in the movie. Killian wasn't out for revenge or to humiliate Tony, he wanted to work with Stark... but Tony calling out the Mandarin on tv, and Pepper turning down his offer forced his hand. Tony inserted himself in AIM's cross hairs, investigating what happened to Happy, but he was never the target or goal.

Killian was a nerdy mad scientist who made up the Mandarin. They say they can't make the Mandarin without adding space rings and yet they did so. Up to the point of the big reveal, he was a layered villain/terrorist that had AIM, 10 rings, and Killian in his pocket. There was character development of the Mandarin but why he hates American ideals wasn't not yet explained. Was there more to his past and why he chose to attack America? Why he considered himself a teacher of sorts. All were intriguing stuff they could've expanded upon without the need of space rings. A shadowy figure ala Ra's Al Ghul would be enough of a challenge for Stark.

Let's put it this way, Killian story was interesting but yeah they decided to go with a cop out corporatist villain instead of developing on the Mandarin. Let's put it this way, Killian might call himself the Mandarin but in no way does he resemble or sound like the Mandarin. Kinsley's Mandarin is pretty damn white if you ask me except he had the persona of the Mandarin until the reveal. I would have gripes too if they revealed the Red Skull was actually Japanese corporatist.

Originally posted by roughrider
Yeah, and he eventually killed her anyway, when she made him choose. Goes to show he found her useful only to a point.

We could go on like this for pages and pages. We agree to disagree.

To kill her is also a bad choice when even himself has the virus inside and it would further make Tony refuse to work with him.

It actually fit his character well, he's just some nerdy scientist who got pissed by Stark, we can't expect him to have the nerve to handle all these. Thus it would be better to let him be recruited servant rather the mastermind behind all the schemes, terrorist cells and the organization. Let the Mandarin be the antagonist would be the best.