Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

This is Monarch with the powers described below in the link, against a well fed Big G, battle takes place in outer space, who wins and why?




http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Nathaniel_Adam_(New_Earth)

http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Nathaniel_Adam_(New_Earth)
fixed the link for you.

i still think galactus wins

Originally posted by yaadaveyaa
i still think galactus wins IF.. .... ....he does, he'll have to work like heck for it.

Galactus easily

well, going by monarch's high showings, he is universal, though it's a questionable feat imo, since it was a result of his death.

if we go by "well fed", galactus at his most powerful, he should take this.

SMP with amp tore his armor off, I think Galactus will end up doing the same in the midst of smacking him around. So BOOM.

How would Galactus deal with the resulting universe shockwave?

Korvac being born tore a universe asunder, and then it mended itself to a new configuration.

Galactus absorbed all his power and left him a powerless baby.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Korvac being born tore a universe asunder, and then it mended itself to a new configuration.

Galactus absorbed all his power and left him a powerless baby.
Then Galactus wins. (thanks for the info)

Bump.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Korvac being born tore a universe asunder, and then it mended itself to a new configuration.
I thought that was just flowery language for when Aleta transformed into Starhawk :
http://s2.postimg.org/obok92zxx/korvac.jpg
If you look at the panel :
a) A mother screams (Korvac's mother in labor pains)
b) A father rails (Korvac's dad fighting the GotG)
c) A universe is rent asunder and mends itself a new configuration (Aleta literally reconfiguring herself into Starhawk)
d) A child is born (Korvac's birth)

No?


Yup, after the Ancient One's (aka Dr. Strange of the year 3000) APPRENTICE, Kruegarr, owned Korvac :
http://s2.postimg.org/6zo7nn6gl/Korvac2.jpg

Horrific showing for Korvac.

Having said that, this is a double KO. Galactus WILL breach Monarch's armor then die in the resulting explosion (along with the rest of the universe/dimension they are fighting in).

I think Galactus could absorb the energy released. Once Monarch's armor is breached he'd have the tools to deal with the situation (energy absorption, time manipulation, matter/energy conversion, barrier creation). Assuming Galactus is at around 70%+ it should be his fight.

Question is can he absorb it? If not, can he take a hit from it? It does have enough energy to destroy the universe.

Regardless, though, Galactus either dies with him or survives so I say Galactus

Originally posted by zopzop

I thought that was just flowery language for when Aleta transformed into Starhawk :
http://s2.postimg.org/obok92zxx/korvac.jpg
If you look at the panel :
a) A mother screams (Korvac's mother in labor pains)
b) A father rails (Korvac's dad fighting the GotG)
c) A universe is rent asunder and mends itself a new configuration (Aleta literally reconfiguring herself into Starhawk)
d) A child is born (Korvac's birth)

No?


Yup, after the Ancient One's (aka Dr. Strange of the year 3000) APPRENTICE, Kruegarr, owned Korvac :
http://s2.postimg.org/6zo7nn6gl/Korvac2.jpg

Horrific showing for Korvac.

Having said that, this is a double KO. Galactus WILL breach Monarch's armor then die in the resulting explosion (along with the rest of the universe/dimension they are fighting in).

where are those scans from?

Originally posted by xJLxKing
Question is can he absorb it? If not, can he take a hit from it? It does have enough energy to destroy the universe.

Regardless, though, Galactus either dies with him or survives so I say Galactus

Galactus could also simply teleport himself away from the blast. He has shown that he can easily cross dimensional barriers.

Originally posted by MF DELPH
I think Galactus could absorb the energy released. Once Monarch's armor is breached he'd have the tools to deal with the situation (energy absorption, time manipulation, matter/energy conversion, barrier creation). Assuming Galactus is at around 70%+ it should be his fight.



I'm thinking the same thing here. I mean would Monarch be comparable to Hyperstorm in terms of power output? If so them we all saw how that played out. Monarch may look like a giant sandwich to Galactus LOL.

Originally posted by Oliver North
where are those scans from?
http://marvel.wikia.com/Guardians_of_the_Galaxy_Annual_Vol_1_1
http://s14.postimg.org/41ffyb6gt/Guardians_of_the_Galaxy_Annual_Vol_1_1.jpg
Originally posted by MF DELPH
I think Galactus could absorb the energy released. Once Monarch's armor is breached he'd have the tools to deal with the situation (energy absorption, time manipulation, matter/energy conversion, barrier creation). Assuming Galactus is at around 70%+ it should be his fight.
I doubt it. Not only has he never been shown to be able to handle that much energy at once, it's also been straight up stated on panel that his energy absorption is far less efficient without his world consuming machine.
http://s22.postimg.org/kusnm073x/011_Secret_Warsv10.jpg
So how much of it would he actually consume? How much would "slip" through and wreck him?
Originally posted by Stoic
I'm thinking the same thing here. I mean would Monarch be comparable to Hyperstorm in terms of power output? If so them we all saw how that played out. Monarch may look like a giant sandwich to Galactus LOL.
No way. Hyperstorm was never shown to have that kind of power output.
http://s7.postimg.org/utzctnup3/Countdown13p19_20.jpg

And to the people saying he'd just tp away, that would assume he KNOWS it's coming.

Seeing how Galactus was born in the midst of the original Big Bang, I doubt that Monarch being breached is going to be a major problem for him.

Even if that's not the case, Galactus can simply pull out an Odin from his arse and bfr all that excess energy to another dimension.

Galactus.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Seeing how Galactus was born in the midst of the original Big Bang, I doubt that Monarch being breached is going to be a major problem for him.

Even if that's not the case, Galactus can simply pull out an Odin from his arse and bfr all that excess energy to another dimension. Can you post where he takes a hit from a universal explosion?

Galactus takes this with ease, imo.

Monarch is at the lower-end of the Skyfather tier, at best. Galactus is... Significantly above that.

Originally posted by Galan007
Galactus takes this with ease, imo.

Monarch is at the lower-end of the Skyfather tier, at best. Galactus is... Significantly above that.



Odin was able to warp universal scale destructive energies with a gesture in Fraction's run of Thor.

Galactus, by all rights, should no sell it outright if not absorb it.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
Can you post where he takes a hit from a universal explosion?
His birth occurred in the midst of the Big Bang. It's right there in his respect thread:
Originally posted by Branlor Swift

http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff240/Branlactus/11-GalactusOrigin.jpg
http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff240/Branlactus/12-GalactusOrigin.jpg
http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff240/Branlactus/13-GalactusOrigin.jpg

Originally posted by JakeTheBank


Odin was able to warp universal scale destructive energies with a gesture in Fraction's run of Thor.

Galactus, by all rights, should no sell it outright if not absorb it.

My thinking as well. IIRC Galactus was depicted eating a magical realm (I want to say Agamatto's realm, but I can't remember off hand).

To zopzop's point, the machinery is more efficient but it's not Galactus's only means and when pressed he can perform the task himself. It's analogous to preparing and cooking your meal versus eating it raw. Galactus has the means to regulate the flow of energy intake and contain the blast on his own.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Seeing how Galactus was born in the midst of the original Big Bang, I doubt that Monarch being breached is going to be a major problem for him.
Oh it will be, because unlike the time he was born into the current universe, he won't have Eternity looking out for him in this fight :
http://s16.postimg.org/4t8boeg69/Galan_galactus.jpg
And I don't think that Monarch's explosion was an actual "Big Bang" creation event similar to what happened with Imperiex. It was just a universe wrecking explosion.


Assuming he knows it's coming, this is a possibility.

Originally posted by zopzop

I thought that was just flowery language for when Aleta transformed into Starhawk :
http://s2.postimg.org/obok92zxx/korvac.jpg
If you look at the panel :
a) A mother screams (Korvac's mother in labor pains)
b) A father rails (Korvac's dad fighting the GotG)
c) A universe is rent asunder and mends itself a new configuration (Aleta literally reconfiguring herself into Starhawk)
d) A child is born (Korvac's birth)

No?


Yup, after the Ancient One's (aka Dr. Strange of the year 3000) APPRENTICE, Kruegarr, owned Korvac :
http://s2.postimg.org/6zo7nn6gl/Korvac2.jpg

Horrific showing for Korvac.

Having said that, this is a double KO. Galactus WILL breach Monarch's armor then die in the resulting explosion (along with the rest of the universe/dimension they are fighting in). While possible, it never to my knowledge said this before. Hell, they changed a couple pages before after a while and nothing was stated:
http://i40.tinypic.com/35b8ebl.jpg

Plus with all the talk of Korvac wiping out the universe in that arc:
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/comic/14.jpg

http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/comic/19.jpg

http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/comic/26.jpg

Plus, that's a terrible choice of words for transforming when a universe was a stake...

He put him a dimension where his powers didn't work. He didn't overpower him or anything, just put him in a dimension. Same theory as Mad Jim Jaspers' weakness with unspace. That shouldn't diminish his power, especially with Korvac' power decimating the GOTG in that arc.

And the Monarch explosion was a chain reaction that the Monitor's personal shields withstood, along with at least a plant and mountain (?), and Superboy Prime. And the Monitors were written as complete fodder getting decimated by herald level armies in that arc.
http://imageshack.us/f/98/ca4or1.jpg/

Galactus can either teleport to another dimension like he's done against the UN. Put his shields up. Probably just warp it around him. It just seemed like it was big in scope tbh since he didn't actually destroy the universe, just almost everything in it. Which doesn't include anything more durable than Galactus, and even less durable characters survived (Prime, Monitor, Plant, Rocks).

I think it is rather foolish to assume that the only way to defeat Monarch is by ripping open his armor and releasing all of his 'universe-busting energies'.

What's stopping Galactus from containing Monarch and perpetually feasting on his energies, like he did with Hyperstorm? What's stopping Galactus from preforming mind-phuckery? What's stopping Galactus from breaching Monarch's armor and immediately teleporting him to another dimension before he completely detonates? What's stopping Galactus from simply tanking said energies like the Monitor's shields and base-level Prime did?

Originally posted by zopzop
http://marvel.wikia.com/Guardians_of_the_Galaxy_Annual_Vol_1_1
http://s14.postimg.org/41ffyb6gt/Guardians_of_the_Galaxy_Annual_Vol_1_1.jpg

During that period Aleta and Starhawk shared the same body, switching back and forth frequently depending which powerset was needed at the time. I don't think it was ever referred to as a universe reforming itself, as they were two entities in the same body.

I'm not specifically sure what the scan you posted was talking about, but almost certainly not about Aleta transforming back into Starhawk, imo

QFT @ Galan.

Even a drastically weakened Galactus should beat Monarch as he'd be able to feed on his energies and restore some of his vitality during the fight.

Originally posted by zopzop

Oh it will be, because unlike the time he was born into the current universe, he won't have Eternity looking out for him in this fight :
http://s16.postimg.org/4t8boeg69/Galan_galactus.jpg
And I don't think that Monarch's explosion was an actual "Big Bang" creation event similar to what happened with Imperiex. It was just a universe wrecking explosion.

He was mortal then, and that dying Eternity merging with him is what birthed Galactus. So yeah, him being born is a fair argument for him being able to tank Monarch self-destructing.
Originally posted by zopzop
And I don't think that Monarch's explosion was an actual "Big Bang" creation event similar to what happened with Imperiex. It was just a universe wrecking explosion.

It is a big bang. Pretty sure that's how Captain Atom's powers work.
Originally posted by zopzop

Assuming he knows it's coming, this is a possibility.
You go out of your way to cast as many doubts over Galactus' ability as there are atoms in the sun.

Originally posted by MF DELPH
My thinking as well. IIRC Galactus was depicted eating a magical realm (I want to say Agamatto's realm, but I can't remember off hand).

Mephisto's dimension.

@TGK

Typically, big bangs create. Monarch's detonation only destroyed. That's why universe-51 had to be recreated by the Monitors at the end of Final Crisis. That said, I personally wouldn't refer to the aforementioned detonation as a 'big bang'. The sum total of Atom's quantum powers were released in unison, which caused a massive explosion that ultimately destroyed universe-51.

Doesn't change the outcome in the slightest, though. Galactus wins.

Originally posted by Galan007
@TGK

Typically, big bangs create. Monarch's detonation only destroyed. That's why universe-51 had to be recreated by the Monitors at the end of Final Crisis. That said, I personally wouldn't refer to the aforementioned detonation as a 'big bang'. The sum total of Atom's quantum powers were released in unison, which caused a massive explosion that ultimately destroyed universe-51.
Big Bangs create when there is nothing else in existence to destroy. The power of a big bang is such that if such an event were to be successfully replicated in the modern age, it would literally tear the whole universe asunder.

Going by your logic, Michael's Dunamis Demiurgos isn't a Big Bang either(its multiversal scale notwithstanding).

Originally posted by Galan007
@TGK

Typically, big bangs create. Monarch's detonation only destroyed. That's why universe-51 had to be recreated by the Monitors at the end of Final Crisis. That said, I personally wouldn't refer to the aforementioned detonation as a 'big bang'. The sum total of Atom's quantum powers were released in unison, which caused a massive explosion that ultimately destroyed universe-51.

Doesn't change the outcome in the slightest, though. Galactus wins. Did it actually destroy the universe?

I thought it was just everything in it

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Did it actually destroy the universe?

I thought it was just everything in it
Can you destroy space ?

@Galan:

In fact take the most recent instance of the Big Bang being used an instrument of destruction in Fantastic Four #6, where Blastaar was condemned to die at the dawn of creation.

There is absolutely no evidence that Monarch's self-destruction produced energies aren't logically a Big Bang, while there is evidence for the opposing point of view.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
Can you destroy space ?
If we go into the real-life technicalities involving the complete destruction of a universe, then no fictional character ever has destroyed a universe.

But hypothetically, you can contract space into nothingness. Because it's logical that if space can expand, then it can also contract. It's simply beyond the scope of humans to do so.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
Can you destroy space ? Happens all the time.

For example, when Hyperion tanked a double universal explosion.

It's either a "Big Bang" or it isn't.

In Monarch's case it's Not imo.

A/The "Big-Bang" only creates! (from nothingness)

Existing Spacial-Temporal implosion is known as the/a "Big-Crunch."

If all Monarch did was release energies that destroyed most (or all) of
the contents within that universe, (excluding space-time)
then it's neither.

That's just a powerful blast wrecking most of the Galaxies and so on of a reality.

---------------------------------------

* Galactus didn't tank the original Big Bang btw.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Did it actually destroy the universe?

I thought it was just everything in it The universal space was still there, but everything within it was destroyed.

...Except the Monitor... And Prime... And a little tree... And a tiny plot of land that the tree was growing on.

Originally posted by Mr Master
It's either a "Big Bang" or it isn't.

In Monarch's case it's Not imo.

A/The "Big-Bang" only creates! (from nothingness)

Existing Spacial-Temporal implosion is known as the/a "Big-Crunch."

If all Monarch did was release energies that destroyed most (or all) of
the contents within that universe, (excluding space-time)
then it's neither.

That's just a powerful blast wrecking most of the Galaxies and so on of a reality.

---------------------------------------

* Galactus didn't tank the original Big Bang btw.

That makes 2 agreements in a week. We are on a roll.

Originally posted by Galan007
That makes 2 agreements in a week. We are on a roll.
The Demiurgos. Fractions F4#6. Etc. I rest my case.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
Can you destroy space ? In comics?

Yes.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
The Demiurgos. Fractions F4#6. Etc. I rest my case. Big bangs create, dood. They do not destroy-- this is should be a very simple concept to grasp. Once more: Monarch's detonation created absolutely nothing(it only destroyed), therefore it was obviously not a big bang in the typical sense.

Aside from that, unless I missed something said detonation was never referred to as a big bang, so I'm not sure where your opinion that it was such even stems from..? Please don't argue just to argue. It's irritating and accomplishes absolutely nothing.

Galactus pretty conclusively imo.

Originally posted by Galan007
Big bangs create, dood. They do not destroy-- this is should be a very simple concept to grasp. Once more: Monarch's detonation created absolutely nothing(it only destroyed), therefore it was obviously not a big bang in the typical sense.
I presume that I have your permission to PM quanchi112 this cloaked concession that Lucifer standing at ground zero during Michael's death isn't a proof of a durability feat, since it was after all, a "creation event".
Originally posted by Galan007
Please don't argue just to argue. It's irritating and accomplishes absolutely nothing.

galactus. assuming he's at the odin battle level, he takes monarch easily. with his ability to absorb so many types of energy, i'd think g would be monarch's worst nightmare tbh.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
I presume that I have your permission to PM quanchi112 this cloaked concession that Lucifer standing at ground zero during Michael's death isn't a proof of a durability feat, since it was after all, a "creation event".
The energy released from Michael detonating would have destroyed the prime universe-- this was outright stated. When Lucifer took Mike to un-space and skewered him to release said energies, he even referred to it as "a controlled detonation."

Furthermore, the raw energy released from Michael was not sufficient to create ANYTHING by itself. It took Lucifer's WILL to mold it into a tangible creation. Aside from that, the demiurgic power was explicitly referred to as "the power that builds and breaks." It goes both ways.

Having said that, comparing Monarch's quantum energies to the demiurgic power(God's power) is one of the more faulty argumentations I've seen in some time.

Funny how threads stray off topic a lot of times.
I think that everyone is pretty much in agreement that G wins. By a plethora of methods.

Originally posted by Galan007
The energy released from Michael detonating would have destroyed the prime universe-- this was outright stated.

Which is pretty much what the uncontrolled release of Monarch's power did: destroy an already existing universe.
Originally posted by Galan007

When Lucifer took Mike to un-space and skewered him to release said energies, he even referred to it as "a controlled detonation."

Wholly irrelevant. If there was someone like Lucifer to guide/manipulate/weave those energies into a new creation, then no doubt Monarch's death would have rebooted the universe. As it so happens, there wasn't, so this is a useless non-sequiter.
Originally posted by Galan007

Furthermore, the raw energy released from Michael was not sufficient to create ANYTHING by itself. It took Lucifer's WILL to mold it into a tangible creation. Aside from that, the demiurgic power was explicitly referred to as "the power that builds and breaks." It goes both ways.

I feel like posting the scans in which Captain Atom utilizes the link of his energies with the Quantum Field to spawn a universe and then subsequently destroy said universe.

Here they are:
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/Red_Atom/Captain%20Atom/Cap%20scans/captainatom54163ui.jpg
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/Red_Atom/Captain%20Atom/Cap%20scans/captainatom54182hn.jpg
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/Red_Atom/Captain%20Atom/Cap%20scans/captainatom54195mk.jpg
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/Red_Atom/Captain%20Atom/Cap%20scans/captainatom54207wq.jpg
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/Red_Atom/Captain%20Atom/Cap%20scans/captainatom056199yp.jpg


Quantum power goes both ways as well.
Originally posted by Galan007

Having said that, comparing Monarch's quantum energies to the demiurgic power(God's power) is one of the more faulty argumentations I've seen in some time.
Having read your points, claiming that the energies contained within Monarch's armor are completely unlike the Demiurgic power(especially in light of the highest-end stuff that Captain Atom has done with similar/identical energies) is one of the stupidest argumentations I've read in quite some time.

@Galan:

Btw, I hate your new sig. Everytime I reply to you, or read a post of yours, it feels like a bug is crawling about on my screen. For zop's sake, get rid of it.

I was just about to say how Galan's sig has made me slap my screen atleast twice

Lol Galant sig,is the first troll sig I ever seen...but it's cool!

Originally posted by TheHulk
Lol Galant sig,is the first troll sig I ever seen...but it's cool! Nope.

Originally posted by Mindset
Nope. Your sig is old,so shut up.

Originally posted by Mindset
Nope.

you're old now, played out, the kidz don't get you. time to shut it down old-timer.

Lol

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Which is pretty much what the uncontrolled release of Monarch's power did: destroy an already existing universe.

Wholly irrelevant. If there was someone like Lucifer to guide/manipulate/weave those energies into a new creation, then no doubt Monarch's death would have rebooted the universe. As it so happens, there wasn't, so this is a useless non-sequiter.

I feel like posting the scans in which Captain Atom utilizes the link of his energies with the Quantum Field to spawn a universe and then subsequently destroy said universe.

Here they are:
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/Red_Atom/Captain%20Atom/Cap%20scans/captainatom54163ui.jpg
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/Red_Atom/Captain%20Atom/Cap%20scans/captainatom54182hn.jpg
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/Red_Atom/Captain%20Atom/Cap%20scans/captainatom54195mk.jpg
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/Red_Atom/Captain%20Atom/Cap%20scans/captainatom54207wq.jpg
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/Red_Atom/Captain%20Atom/Cap%20scans/captainatom056199yp.jpg


Quantum power goes both ways as well.

Having read your points, claiming that the energies contained within Monarch's armor are completely unlike the Demiurgic power(especially in light of the highest-end stuff that Captain Atom has done with similar/identical energies) is one of the stupidest argumentations I've read in quite some time. In comics, big bangs create, they do not destroy. Monarch's blast destroyed. Had Lucifer not taken Michael out of the prime creation, his subsequent release of energy would have destroyed said creation as well. Had Lucifer not been present in the void to shape Michael's raw energy into a physical creation, then it have equated to little more than a massive release of raw energy. Nothing more.

By your line of logic, any huge explosion with universe-busting potential equates to a big bang. I find that horrendously faulty, given that creating a universe is much more difficult, and requires much more energy input, than destroying a universe.

...And btw, the CA feat you likely copied/pasted from his respect thread was only possible because he was in the Quantum Field at the time. Had he not been in the QF, that creation feat wouldn't have been possible. So yeah, epic fail, etc.

Big G munches on Monarch like a tasty kebob.

Originally posted by Galan007
In comics, big bangs create, they do not destroy. Monarch's blast destroyed. Had Lucifer not taken Michael out of the prime creation, his subsequent release of energy would have destroyed said creation as well. Had Lucifer not been present in the void to shape Michael's raw energy into a physical creation, then it have equated to little more than a massive release of raw energy. Nothing more.

By your line of logic, any huge explosion with universe-busting potential equates to a big bang. I find that horrendously faulty, given that creating a universe is much more difficult, and requires much more energy input, than destroying a universe.

...And btw, the CA feat you likely copied/pasted from his respect thread was only possible because he was in the Quantum Field at the time. Had he not been in the QF, that creation feat wouldn't have been possible. So yeah, epic fail, etc.
So, to summarize, in one paragraph alone you contradict yourself by claiming that Michael's energies both were and weren't a Big Bang. I intend to catalogue this post before I PM quan, telling him your cloaked concession that Lucifer didn't tank a destructive blast since at the time it was a Creation Event.

Hardly. I've provided proof with Captain Atom's energies spawning a universe, which is indicative of what Monarch's energies are capable of achieving since they have virtually identical powersets. I mean you would have a point if we were discussing something like the Null Bomb, or Mistress Death's explosion of the Cancerverse, but we're not, unfortunately for you.

I am not sure what relevance about where I got those scans from has on this discussion. And learn to read: I clearly mention Captain Atom's link to the Quantum Field in my post. Conversely speaking, Captain Atom's energies on their own aren't capable of destroying a universe as well. So that's that.

Not sure if this settle the dispute but..
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/Superman/Countdown13p08.jpg

^Thanks. I was searching for that scan. It's not definitive, but still a substantial part of the overall proof of my position.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
So, to summarize, in one paragraph alone you contradict yourself by claiming that Michael's energies both were and weren't a Big Bang. I intend to catalogue this post before I PM quan, telling him your cloaked concession that Lucifer didn't tank a destructive blast since at the time it was a Creation Event.

Hardly. I've provided proof with Captain Atom's energies spawning a universe, which is indicative of what Monarch's energies are capable of achieving since they have virtually identical powersets. I mean you would have a point if we were discussing something like the Null Bomb, or Mistress Death's explosion of the Cancerverse, but we're not, unfortunately for you.

I am not sure what relevance about where I got those scans from has on this discussion. And learn to read: I clearly mention Captain Atom's link to the Quantum Field in my post. Conversely speaking, Captain Atom's energies on their own aren't capable of destroying a universe as well. So that's that. You're basically arguing that any large/universal explosion should be quantified as a big bang, whether is destroys or creates... And the funniest part is that you're still failing to see the 'dur-ness' in that assertion. Bottom line: Monarch's detonation was never referred to as a big bang, nor did it create anything in it's wake. To the contrary, the universe he inadvertently destroyed had to be rebuilt by the Monitors afterward. Simply put: it wasn't a big bang by comic book standards.

And btw: The Quantum Field is a metaphysical realm that CA has/had complete control over. The QF is to Atom, what the Train Station is to the Trainman from The Matrix films. Outside the QF, Atom is much, MUCH less powerful, and hasn't preformed a feat remotely close to the one you're incessantly rambling about.

Originally posted by Galan007
You're basically arguing that any large/universal explosion should be quantified as a big bang, whether is destroys or creates... And the funniest part is that you're still failing to see the 'dur-ness' in that assertion. Bottom line: Monarch's detonation was never referred to as a big bang, nor did it create anything in it's wake. To the contrary, the universe he inadvertently destroyed had to be rebuilt by the Monitors afterward. Simply put: it wasn't a big bang by comic book standards.

And btw: The Quantum Field is a metaphysical realm that CA has/had complete control over. The QF is to Atom, what the Train Station is to the Trainman from The Matrix films. Outside the QF, Atom is much, MUCH less powerful, and hasn't preformed a feat remotely close to the one you're incessantly rambling about.
I am not sure whether you're actually trying to make a point here, or just incoherently rambling, seeing as this repeated claim has already been addressed by me multiple times before, but for your sake, let's try again. Your spinaroonies on Michael's blast both being and not being a destructive blast, coupled with this ridiculous assertion that Monarch's blast only destroyed thee universe, hence it couldn't possibly be a Big Bang(since Big Bangs only create in your mindset) represents a faulty line of logic on your part not mine. Not to mention that Monarch boasting that his quantum power is akin to the Big Bang itself doesn't help your case either.

Again, not sure what you're trying to prove here either. I clearly admit that Captain Atom doesn't operate on this level in standard portrayal, and I mention the Quantum Field as well, all in my previous posts, yet you still point these out as if I am deliberately hiding or missing the context of that feat, which in itself is a fail attempt at trying to showcase to the world my supposed ignorance on this matter. The point of my citation of this instance is quite obvious though: the nature of Quantum Power can be both destructive and creative depending upon the circumstances under which it is utilized in such a grandiose scale. A point so simple, yet it continues to evade you for some strange reason.

Quantum energy, much like the demiurgic power, CAN be both destructive AND creative, depending on the situation-- I've never argued that much. You're just so dead-set on throwing out childish insults that you're no longer comprehending my posts. Once more: comic book big bangs CREATE, they do not destroy. Example:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_medium/10/104794/2036467-x.jpeg

That said, Monarch's blast ONLY destroyed, and left nothing but the blackness of space in its wake-- therefore, it was NOT a big bang in the typical sense. Simple. Additionally, the blast itself was NEVER referred to as a big bang, so I don't know where your opinion on the matter even stems from..? Monarch comparing his quantum power to a big bang doesn't mean his final detonation WAS a big bang(in the typical sense.) Why? Because like I said: it didn't create-- it ONLY destroyed.

I'm not going to follow your line of thought that ANY large-scale/universal explosion equates to a big bang by proxy. Frankly, I find that assertion.... Funny, really.

Smh...

Monarch's explosion wasn't a big bang, but it was a universe killer. It wiped out nearly everything that existed inside of the reality.

Can we please just agree to disagree and move on?

Originally posted by MF DELPH
Smh...

Monarch's explosion wasn't a big bang, but it was a universe killer. It wiped out nearly everything that existed inside of the reality.

Can we please just agree to disagree and move on? As long as no further unwarranted insults are delivered on his end, I'm perfectly fine with that.

Originally posted by Galan007
Quantum energy, much like the demiurgic power, CAN be both destructive AND creative, depending on the situation-- I've never argued that much.You're just so dead-set on throwing out childish insults that you're no longer comprehending my posts. Once more: comic book big bangs CREATE, they do not destroy. Example:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_medium/10/104794/2036467-x.jpeg

That is the only part of this portion of your post which is worth addressing, as the rest is just a pointless non-sequiter rehashing the same points for the umpteenth time, points that I have already countered/addressed in the last page or 2 of this thread.
Originally posted by Galan007

That said, Monarch's blast ONLY destroyed, and left nothing but the blackness of space in its wake-- therefore, it was NOT a big bang in the typical sense. Simple. Additionally, the blast itself was NEVER referred to as a big bang, so I don't know where your opinion on the matter even stems from..? Monarch comparing his quantum power to a big bang doesn't mean his final detonation WAS a big bang(in the typical sense.) Why? Because like I said: it didn't create-- it ONLY destroyed.

Which is the same thing that the Demiurgos would have done had it imploded in the mainstream universe/multiverse(or whatever the hell Yahweh's creation was). That's the simple point: if a high-end reality manipulator had detonated Monarch in a controlled fashion in the void of space, a new reality would have been created, but it wasn't a high-end reality manipulator, instead it was Superbitch Prime, and hence the end result of this incident is the destruction of the universe.
Originally posted by Galan007

I'm not going to follow your line of thought that ANY large-scale/universal explosion equates to a big bang by proxy. Frankly, I find that assertion.... Funny, really.
The truly funny thing though is that my argument so far has only pertained to the Monarch/Captain Atom Quantum Power and its similarities to the Dunamis Demiurgos. I very clearly specified this stance by citing examples like the Null Bomb and Mistress Death's destruction of the Cancerverse... points that again escaped you somehow.

Originally posted by MF DELPH
Smh...

Monarch's explosion wasn't a big bang, but it was a universe killer. It wiped out nearly everything that existed inside of the reality.

Can we please just agree to disagree and move on?
It was akin to the Big Bang. Monarch even says so much himself in the scan provided on the previous page.

And based on Galan's scan in which he equates an explosion very similar to the Big Bang as a Big Bang itself("the unimaginable energy burst into the endlessness of the Beyond in an explosive torrent not unlike the cataclysmic explosion said to have begun our universe", we can safely conclude that the power in Monarch's suit was a Big Bang.

I disagree. It's semantics.

I'm moving on.

^Kthanxbye.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
That's the simple point: if a high-end reality manipulator had detonated Monarch in a controlled fashion in the void of space, a new reality would have been created, but it wasn't a high-end reality manipulator, instead it was Superbitch Prime, and hence the end result of this incident is the destruction of the universe. Wow. So you're basing your opinion that it was a big bang on what might have been possible, if Monarch would have been detonated in a void, and if a high-end reality manipulator would have been present?

...And I'm supposed to take you seriously? Lol, moving on...

^The same thing would've happened as in the case of Lucifer and the Demiurgos, or better still, Captain Atom with the Quantum Power(which is a much better example for the Monarch case).

Since you don't take me seriously enough, I presume you won't return to this discussion anytime soon, if at all.

Let me explain something. Think of the qp as a battery's power cell. How you use that energy or transform it to either become a big bang or what in this case monarch did, is the difference.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
I presume you won't return to this discussion anytime soon, if at all. Right you are. My interest took quite a nosedive recently.

So... Galactus wins easily

Pretty much.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
So... Galactus wins easily Affirmative.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
So... Galactus wins easily
Not if our pal zopzop has anything to say about it.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Not if our pal zopzop has anything to say about it.

Monarch's universe killer blasts Galactus into pieces.

zopped

Bump.

Oh and Monarch stomps Galactus into a paste.

Also as far as Galactus durability goes.

And two colliding planets which almost killed Galactus BTW.

http://s6d1.turboimg.net/t1/30061687_t-06-07.jpg http://s6d1.turboimg.net/t1/30061688_t-06-08.jpg http://s6d1.turboimg.net/t1/30061689_t-06-09.jpg http://s6d1.turboimg.net/t1/30061690_t-06-10.jpg

He was disintegrated by a solar system destroying attack.

http://s6d2.turboimg.net/t1/30061692_INFINTY_WARS03-16.jpg http://s6d2.turboimg.net/t1/30061693_INFINTY_WARS03-17.jpg http://s5d1.turboimagehost.com/t1/23346610_INFINTY_WARS04-07.jpg

Before anyone doubts it.

http://i.imgur.com/9uWPw7w.jpg

Flat out said that he was disintegrated.

Universal level durability, Heh.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Also as far as Galactus durability goes.

And two colliding planets which almost killed Galactus BTW.

http://s6d1.turboimg.net/t1/30061687_t-06-07.jpg http://s6d1.turboimg.net/t1/30061688_t-06-08.jpg http://s6d1.turboimg.net/t1/30061689_t-06-09.jpg http://s6d1.turboimg.net/t1/30061690_t-06-10.jpg

He was disintegrated by a solar system destroying attack.

http://s6d2.turboimg.net/t1/30061692_INFINTY_WARS03-16.jpg http://s6d2.turboimg.net/t1/30061693_INFINTY_WARS03-17.jpg http://s5d1.turboimagehost.com/t1/23346610_INFINTY_WARS04-07.jpg

Before anyone doubts it.

http://i.imgur.com/9uWPw7w.jpg

Flat out said that he was disintegrated.

Universal level durability, Heh.

Some durability.

http://i1149.photobucket.com/albums/o589/lupinw45/KyIU51m%20-%20Imgur_zpspgd9diry.gif

Ouch!

galactus takes him out for the reasons mentioned by...several others. lifebringer crushes him.

Galactus decimates him. Based off abhi's debating style Monarch was defeated by a guy beaten down by the teen titans.

Originally posted by leonidas
galactus takes him out for the reasons mentioned by...several others. lifebringer crushes him. Originally posted by quanchi112
Galactus decimates him. Based off abhi's debating style Monarch was defeated by a guy beaten down by the teen titans.

This !

Galactus gets oneshotted. Easily.

Monarch wins.

Originally posted by panthergod
Galactus gets oneshotted. Easily. Based on ?

Monarch easily.

Originally posted by One Big Mob
So... Galactus wins easily

He doesn't wins much less easily.

Originally posted by abhilegend
He doesn't wins much less easily. He doesn't wins, eh ? Your English is abysmal. Galactus rips him apart, easily.

Galactus takes this one easily.

A full well fed Galactus is still the bearer of Power Cosmic. Simply the most powerful form of energy.

If monarch is enough threat, Galactus is still in possession of the Ultimate Nullifier, which means Monarch is dead for sure.

Galactus feeds on him. This is an easy win.

Monarch absorbs Galactus' life force.

Originally posted by Badabing
Monarch absorbs Galactus' life force.
At first I was skeptical but you are a great leader of the house of DC.

Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
At first I was skeptical but you are a great leader of the house of DC.

Bump

Galactus

Originally posted by xJLxKing
Galactus
Why? When Galactus died and exploded, his energy created a star. Second time it was stated he would destroy 42 lightyears.

Monarch's energies destroyed an entire universe. There's no comparison at all.

Galactus stomps tbh.

Reason?

Galactus easily

Originally posted by Genii96
Galactus easily
How does he do it rather than easily?

Originally posted by abhilegend
How does he do it rather than easily? Absorbs his energy. Galactus is also on another level.

Originally posted by abhilegend
How does he do it rather than easily?

He loses easily, maybe.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Absorbs his energy. Galactus is also on another level.

Quantum field > Power Cosmic.

For one thing, it makes him immune to magic. Big G has been magically overpowered by Doctor Strange and the Vishanti, while Atom was invulnerable to Gemworlds Mordru level magics.

Originally posted by cdtm
Quantum field > Power Cosmic.

For one thing, it makes him immune to magic. Big G has been magically overpowered by Doctor Strange and the Vishanti, while Atom was invulnerable to Gemworlds Mordru level magics. Prive it but he absorbs not just exclusively cosmic energy so irrelevant. Context. Prime ripped open his containement suit and magic is irrelevant to this thread. Try to focus on this matchup not some other type of absurd logic which has no basis for this specific matchup, k.