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Jim Hammond

vs.

Aquaman

Fight takes places in Hawaii, can progress from there.

I think Jim holds an advantage due to flight. Is this DCnU Aquaman?

Yes.

I know very little about Hammond, tbh.

Bullets leave superficial wounds on him. I question his level of durability. Im wondering just how much of hammond's flame Aquaman can take. I'm assuming he can be dehydrated.

This is a lot closer than people realize.

Hammond should be immune to TP (being an android and all) and his flames are no joke.

But...........AM is pretty fast and if he lands one good hit with that Trident....

Split 50/50.

Originally posted by namorsubby
Bullets leave superficial wounds on him. I question his level of durability. Im wondering just how much of hammond's flame Aquaman can take. I'm assuming he can be dehydrated.

His durability against temperatures and blunt trauma is fine. He's had a lava vent explode on him and only suffered minor burns.

He might be able to be dehydrated eventually, but it won't be quickly.

Taking AM.
I like Zop's trident point (no pun intended).
One solid hit from that could end things fairly quick. I'm betting AM's durability can withstand initial attacks from Hammond.

I think Aquaman has the greater potential to end the fight with a solid blow with his weapon, but Jim's got the mobility and range.

I think it would be a great fight, considering all the scuffles Jim's given Namor over the years.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
I think Aquaman has the greater potential to end the fight with a solid blow with his weapon, but Jim's got the mobility and range.

I think it would be a great fight, considering all the scuffles Jim's given Namor over the years.

The fight setting is also to AM's advantage me thinks. He's only a stone's throw away from bodies of water...

Hammonds flame is pretty strong. I doubt with aquaman level of durability can withstand much of it. Just being near him may start to have a dehydrating effect. Idk how powerful aquamans trident is but hell have to hit him with it first. Hammonds flight makes it easier for him to evade and attack.

This is like jim vs namor. Except that namor flies, is stronger, and more durable.

Originally posted by namorsubby
This is like jim vs namor. Except that namor flies, is stronger, and more durable.
No.

AM would school Namor. And that Trident drew blood/blinded Darkseid, if he lands a clean hit, the fight's over.

But like you said, Hammond's flame is nothing to sneeze at.

Dcnu aquaman gets hurt by bullets. Namor would knock him flat out.

I didn't even know the trident was apart of this fight. I know for a fact he didn't use it all the time. He didn't use it in any of the new issues I've read. Either way hammonds flame has subdued many more durable characters. Like people that are completely bulletproof.

hammond

DCnU Aquaman used the trident in plenty of issues of Justice League. And his skin being damaged by bullets doesn't equate into Namor being able to knocking him flat out with any sort of ease or anything. Wonder Woman's not bullet proof, and she'd handle Namor just fine. Anyone who can take punches from Superman and other top tier super strong beings should no sell bullets anyway, but that's comics for you.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
DCnU Aquaman used the trident in plenty of issues of Justice League. And his skin being damaged by bullets doesn't equate into Namor being able to knocking him flat out with any sort of ease or anything. Wonder Woman's not bullet proof, and she'd handle Namor just fine. Anyone who can take punches from Superman and other top tier super strong beings should no sell bullets anyway, but that's comics for you.

He almost always had the trident with him in the first 12 issues of Aquaman.

Originally posted by Zack Fair
He almost always had the trident with him in the first 12 issues of Aquaman.

I figured he did, but I haven't read much of his solo series outside of the first couple of issues. I'll probably get back issues of Aquaman and Wonder Woman here in a few weeks.

I read most of his new series. Idk if the trident can really be considered standard equipment.

And for the record, I do think that Namor would physically outperform Aquaman. But the margin between them has certainly seemed to close somewhat as far as that aspect goes.

I think aquaman durability is questionable as compared to other high class metas. Not only that, but I think he is even more susceptible to being overwhelmed by Jims flame due to his water based physiology.

I thought we were done lowballing Aquaman... ermm

The trident is standard equipment since the reboot (he has it with him in almost every issue)

Piercing durability =/= blunt force durability

His physiology isn't "water based". He grew up on the surface. water just amps him.

Aquaman summons a tidal wave then stabs Jim lifts him up then a great white eats him.biscuits

I wish they'd give him a form of overt hydrokinesis, even if that diminishes Mera somewhat.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
I wish they'd give him a form of overt hydrokinesis, even if that diminishes Mera somewhat.
IMHO, they should give him a form of low level/short range telekinesis. Not for lifting or moving objects but for shielding himself only. It wouldn't be overpowering and it would actually fit with his whole "theme".

Or a water shield....biscuits

If they focus on his strength and durability, i.e. make him "tough", and give him back his insane preboot telepathy, I think he'll be more than powerful enough, personally.

Shut up....Aquaman needs hydrokinesis...uhuh

Originally posted by Estacado
Aquaman summons a tidal wave then stabs Jim lifts him up then a great white eats him.biscuits

Reminds me of Fizz.

IMO aquaman should have some kind of control over fish. that'd be awesome.

No "lowballing" intended. Id still go with hammond.

Jim Hammond is a lot more powerful than he's given credit for. For some reason or another, he can trade punches with superbricks, unlike Johnny Storm. He definitely has super-strength and super-durability. And his flame power operates at surprising (sometimes ridiculous) levels. Originally posted by -Pr-
His durability against temperatures and blunt trauma is fine. He's had a lava vent explode on him and only suffered minor burns.

He might be able to be dehydrated eventually, but it won't be quickly. Err... Aquaman was pretty much dying from exposure in the desert though.

Yea, the only time I've seen Aquaman go up against heat off the top of my head was in a desert, and IIRC he was going to die from dehydration. Hammond would roast him alive sooner rather later if that's the case imo. Not being able to fly is a major disadvantage here too, Aquaman needs some more telepathy highlights because without it he's at a disadvantage against these types of opponents.

I think Johnny Storm would be a lot better fight tbh (Before Negative Zone amp and he gained the Cosmic Rod that is). He also definitely has superhuman durability but a solid punch from Aquaman could end it so it'd be an excellent fight.

Hammond is pretty boss, more so than regular Storm.

Originally posted by Estacado
Shut up....Aquaman needs hydrokinesis...uhuh



Originally posted by 753
IMO aquaman should have some kind of control over fish. that'd be awesome.

given his shoddy telepathy feats since the reboot, you're actually right.

Originally posted by ODG
Jim Hammond is a lot more powerful than he's given credit for. For some reason or another, he can trade punches with superbricks, unlike Johnny Storm. He definitely has super-strength and super-durability. And his flame power operates at surprising (sometimes ridiculous) levels. Err... Aquaman was pretty much dying from exposure in the desert though.

he was out there for hours, and that was after the atlantean ship had exploded right on top of him and injured him. I don't even know if he was going to die from dehydration tbh. I'm not saying Hammond can't beat him, just that he won't magically dehydrate him with a couple of flame blasts.

He also took a dive head first into the desert if I'm not mistaken.

I also think Aquaman should have some sort of hydrokinesis. I mean...Aquaman is his fkn name n' all. Would add to his arsenal too, giving him more versatility and range options

Wonder if Aquaman will ever display something as being literally as powerful as the ocean (or all of them). I could only imagine if Aquaman was able to hit with the force of the entire globe's worth of water.

mmm

Would be an interesting wtf level feat for him.

Shit that would be OP

Honestly, I'd laugh and applaud if Johns was secretly planning on making Aquaman rivaled and succeeded only by Superman in terms of physical power. Why the phuck not.

I thought that was already the case with Throne of Atlantis 131

Honestly, if they ever confirmed or alluded to Aquaman directly matching Diana in strength, I wouldn't be surprised nor would I have any problem with it.

I think Johns has been alluding to making Arthur Diana's equal for a while now. Starting in Flashpoint, and continuing on.

I got it! His trident should be able to do some low level water stuffs a la Mjolnir. Emphasis on low level because he'd be too opw'd if he were to create planetary level tidal waves with a wave of that thing.
Maybe a small shield, some water gun action, and like a water surfboard to increase his mobility on land. lol.. wutevers...

I wouldn't want them to make Aquaman drastically much more powerful than normal at the sake of his character (well, okay, maybe just a bit because it'd piss off people who are stuck in the Superfriends/Family Guy/SNL mindset of Aquaman), but there's no reason why Aquaman can't consistently be a top tier being like Wonder Woman or Green Lantern.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
I wouldn't want them to make Aquaman drastically much more powerful than normal at the sake of his character (well, okay, maybe just a bit because it'd piss off people who are stuck in the Superfriends/Family Guy/SNL mindset of Aquaman), but there's no reason why Aquaman can't consistently be a top tier being like Wonder Woman or Green Lantern.

Even pre crisis, Aquaman was written as being close to or at the kind of level where he could hurt guys like J'onn or Diana.

It wouldn't be much of a leap, imo, to put him on the same level as Diana.

Originally posted by -Pr-
he was out there for hours, and that was after the atlantean ship had exploded right on top of him and injured him. I don't even know if he was going to die from dehydration tbh. I'm not saying Hammond can't beat him, just that he won't magically dehydrate him with a couple of flame blasts. Well he was fainting and hallucinating and was basically wetting his pants over it all. Based on his bare strength, stamina and durability, several hours of exposure in the sun after getting roughed up a bit should not have done anything. Someone like Thing would be fine. I doubt even think someone like Luke Cage would have such issues... not after only a couple of hours. In fact, the only superbrick I can think of with comparable strength who would even begin to react like that would be Namor.

I'm not denying that he was hallucinating or that he was dehydrated; he said as much in the issue. There was still his injury and the explosion to consider though; it's not like he was completely fresh when he was dropped in the desert, is all.

And he was still walking around when he was found.

Originally posted by -Pr-
I'm not denying that he was hallucinating or that he was dehydrated; he said as much in the issue. There was still his injury and the explosion to consider though; it's not like he was completely fresh when he was dropped in the desert, is all.

And he was still walking around when he was found. I'm well aware that he was roughed up. I said as much in my post. But I also said that I can't see Thing or Luke Cage being roughed up by a plane explosion and a skydive and go through what Aquaman went through in the desert after only a few hours. Wonder Woman wouldn't, Grey Hulk wouldn't, Warpath wouldn't... maybe classic Rhino or Bane??? But then you're diving deep into jobber/lesser character territory. Which kinda speaks for itself.

Yes, he did wake up after fainting and hallucinating and wetting his pants. Anyway, it seemed pretty clear that being stranded in a desert for a few hours was a serious issue for Aquaman. Which, in all honesty, stands in stark contrast to his other exploits.

I love the fact Luke Cage is used as a measuring stick for the likes of Aquaman.

Bendis is powerful.

Originally posted by ODG
I'm well aware that he was roughed up. I said as much in my post. But I also said that I can't see Thing or Luke Cage being roughed up by a plane explosion and a skydive and go through what Aquaman went through in the desert after only a few hours. Wonder Woman wouldn't, Grey Hulk wouldn't, Warpath wouldn't... maybe classic Rhino or Bane??? But then you're diving deep into jobber/lesser character territory. Which kinda speaks for itself.

Yes, he did wake up after fainting and hallucinating and wetting his pants. Anyway, it seemed pretty clear that being stranded in a desert for a few hours was a serious issue for Aquaman. Which, in all honesty, stands in stark contrast to his other exploits.

I agree that it was a definite contradiction. I still don't think he would have died, though, is all I'm saying.

At the same time, though, I can't help but feel like pre-reboot, no writer would have dared do the same thing with him.

Originally posted by Bentley
I love the fact Luke Cage is used as a measuring stick for the likes of Aquaman.

Bendis is powerful.

**** Bendis.

Originally posted by Bentley
I love the fact Luke Cage is used as a measuring stick for the likes of Aquaman.

Bendis is powerful.

Under Bendis (and Jeff Parker to a limited extent) Cage is a solid class 100.

He was shaking buildings and shit when he knocked out She-Hulk in Age of Ultron.

Bendis-Power<Loeb Force.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Wonder if Aquaman will ever display something as being literally as powerful as the ocean (or all of them). I could only imagine if Aquaman was able to hit with the force of the entire globe's worth of water.

mmm

Would be an interesting wtf level feat for him. It would have been an interestin counterpoint to Diana for him to have the strength of the oceans, at least as far as the pre-Flashpoint version is concerned , with her being granted the strength of Gaea 'the Earth itself'. Of course, the mass of the oceans is a ridiculous small number compared to the mass of Earth itself, but thematically, that would have been nice if they wanted to push Aquaman and Wonder Woman as somewhat close in strength.

I'd say Johns doesn't think Aquaman is as strong as Wonder Woman, but he's certainly close enough that he won't go down without her feeling it.

Originally posted by -Pr-
I agree that it was a definite contradiction. I still don't think he would have died, though, is all I'm saying.

At the same time, though, I can't help but feel like pre-reboot, no writer would have dared do the same thing with him. I see where you're coming from. I agree with all of this. Originally posted by -Pr-
**** Bendis. And this. Age of Ultron is terribad.

Would anyone care to discuss the specifics of this match up?

What kind of damage could Jim do to the ocean assuming he attempts to boil the surface?

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
What kind of damage could Jim do to the ocean assuming he attempts to boil the surface?

Originally posted by namorsubby
From the page of Captain America: Sentinel of Liberty #2.



Steve Rogers narrates, telling of a time when jim hammond went apparently insane. he had been altered through brainwashing by the nazis. his flame was so hot that he was able to dwell in the bottom of the ocean without it being quenched. he was so hot he was causing elemental changes in the water.
http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa197/namorsubby/original%20human%20torch/th_CaptainAmerica-SentinelofLiberty-4.jpg
http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa197/namorsubby/original%20human%20torch/th_CaptainAmerica-SentinelofLiberty-3.jpg
http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa197/namorsubby/original%20human%20torch/th_CaptainAmerica-SentinelofLiberty-2.jpg
http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa197/namorsubby/original%20human%20torch/th_CaptainAmerica-SentinelofLiberty-1.jpg



He can burn hot enough to stay inflamed under water. Here's another example.

http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa197/namorsubby/original%20human%20torch/th_The_Torch_003_013.jpg
http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa197/namorsubby/original%20human%20torch/th_The_Torch_003_014.jpg
http://s202.photobucket.com/user/namorsubby/media/original%20human%20torch/The_Torch_003_015.jpg.html


Torch believes he has the ability to "cauterize" the world in flame
http://s202.photobucket.com/user/namorsubby/media/original%20human%20torch/The_Torch_005_020.jpg.html