You Vs Villains II

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Placidity
Same Scenario:

You live in a world where there are NO heroes, only villains (all high herald and below). Suffering and chaos has become the norm. You really wish you could have some superpowers to even things out.

Luckily, Bat-Mite is bored and decides to play a game with you. He is going to let you face a number of characters, and if you win, you will get a reward each time, if you lose, well, you die.



He starts you off with peak human stats, and a few combat knives and a gun. You have NO skills.


Round 1

Black Widow. This is not a "fight". She is going about her normal life, and is unaware you are wanting to kill her. You know her whereabouts - hunt her down and take her out.

You have 7 days (prep included) to do it.

Reward: Batman's Stealth Skills, Superman's Night Vision, $500 Million.

Round 2

You've located Harley Quinn's hide out - an abandoned warehouse. You know the only people staying there are Harley and a few of her goons. You must sneak in and plant a listening device under her bed.


Reward: 33% of Wolverine's healing factor, Superman's X-ray Vision, Daredevil's Sonar Sense, 1 use 10-second invisibility (each day).

Round 3

You have planted the bug at Harley's place and find out there is a major villain meeting. It takes place in the sewers many levels underground. In attendance will be The Joker, Killer Croc, Penguin, Two Face and some thugs. While they are having a meeting you must sneak in within 5 meters of them, shout "I AM VENGEANCE, I AM THE NIGHT, I AM BATMAN", and then make your get away. You are safe once out of the sewers.

Reward: Batman's skills, knowledge and intelligence, Spiderman's speed and reflexes.

Round 4

You are locked in large dining hall with Victor Creed. He is trying to kill you. Survive for 5 minutes.

Reward: Full Wolverine Healing Factor, Superman's courage and confidence, Spider-man stats, Captain America's Shield.

Round 5

There is a hit contract on you. People who will come after you: Lady Shiva, Deadpool, Hawkeye, and Bullseye. You must survive for 24 hours.

Reward: All previous rewards are reset, you will now get:

- Batman's Intellect
- Captain America's Skills, Abilities, Base Stats
- Superman's Courage
- Hulk's Healing Factor
- Colossus' Ability
- Magneto's Ability


Round 6

You must defeat, Black Adam, and Abomination.

Reward:

- Hulk Durability
- Nightcrawler's Teleportation
- All of Martian Manhunter's stats/abilities.
- Black Bolt's stats/abilities
- Wonder Woman's stats/abilities
- Adamantium Skeleton + Claws

Round 7 - Final Round

Defeat Superman, Thor, Silver Surfer, and Hal Jordan. They cannot BFR you.

Reward: All powers reset. You will get:

- Power Cosmic (Surfer's Peak Showings)
- Power Ring (Hal's Peak Showings)
- Captain Marvel Stats x 100
- Lobo, Hulk and Doomsday's Regen Abilities Combined
- Speed Force
- Doom and Reed's Intellect


...........................

The game is all about risk and reward, you can stop at any round you like, if you think the odds are too great to overcome.

You get to keep your rewards (including previously earned ones) even if you quit.

All rewards stack even skills.

Remember, if you lose, you die. In a real life scenario, when would you call it quits?

Newjak
I don't think anyone would make it past 1 to be honest.

Black Widow is a trained killer, agent, assassin in pure comic booky fashion. The first time any of us tried to do any intel work on her she would know and kick our butts. Since you said this is a world of villains and no heroes I'm assuming Black Widow is the merciless killer version of herself in which case she kills everyone of us.

curryman
6 is too hard, can't handle Black Adam.

SevenShackles
Wish I could say I get past 1 but I'm not going to lie to myself, peak human and a couple of weapons give me nothing to beat her and the 'prep' time I can't do much with as Newjack said. Any attempt at doing anything meaningful with that time would result in alerting her to my presence.
Unless I can hire goons in a world of villains to go in and set fire to her home and then catch her by surprise but even that is a crap plan with dealing with the black widow even if it's the blonde one.

Oliver North
I clear it 8-9/10

Placidity
Originally posted by Newjak
I don't think anyone would make it past 1 to be honest.

Black Widow is a trained killer, agent, assassin in pure comic booky fashion. The first time any of us tried to do any intel work on her she would know and kick our butts. Since you said this is a world of villains and no heroes I'm assuming Black Widow is the merciless killer version of herself in which case she kills everyone of us.

You already have basic intel on her, where she goes every day, her routine etc.

While it is the same version of her, it is in a more realistic setting. I doubt she is aware of every single person around her, and has some magic senses that warn her.

But again, its everyone's choice. I would attempt it.

Oliver North
if guns are treated realistically, stage one is almost trivial

SevenShackles
If I skip 1 or attack her on the toilet I'll clear. Creed can be kept at bay and given a good thrashing with batman skill & intelligence +supermans speed & reflexes + peak human strength. Nevermind all that sensory power so he can't play peak a boo.
Make it to 6 I'll tear abomination apart and black Adam will be difficult but magnetos ability + colossus strength +hulk healing factor and batmans intellect gives me a good shot.

With the rewarded powers ontop of the previous rounds I'll clear.

Newjak
Originally posted by Placidity
You already have basic intel on her, where she goes every day, her routine etc.

While it is the same version of her, it is in a more realistic setting. I doubt she is aware of every single person around her, and has some magic senses that warn her.

But again, its everyone's choice. I would attempt it. So in comic books named people like Black Widow with Spy Training almost do have a magic warning system for everyone around them.


I'm being realistic here. If we allow the Black Widow's feats no one on this board would have the skills or resources to get the drop on her even with one-sided prep.

Now I do agree with SevenShackles in that once you get past one you could make it pretty far and have a chance to clear.

But no one this board has the skills to match the BW no matter how much grand standing they want to do or say.

Blair Wind
Originally posted by Newjak
But no one this board has the skills to match the BW no matter how much grand standing they want to do or say.

I always knew you were a fan! smile

Newjak
laughing out loud

MF DELPH
I think I could clear it, actually. Black Widow has no idea who I am and no reason whatsoever to suspect I want to kill her. I'm just some random civilian as far as she knows. I could just shoot her in the back of the head while she sips her Starbucks or grocery shops since she's going about her normal life. Once you get past #4 it becomes a downhill jog if you're smart.

Blair Wind
Originally posted by MF DELPH
I think I could clear it, actually. Black Widow has no idea who I am and no reason whatsoever to suspect I want to kill her. I'm just some random civilian as far as she knows. I could just shoot her in the back of the head while she sips her Starbucks or grocery shops since she's going about her normal life. Once you get past #4 it becomes a downhill jog if you're smart.

I don't know why you'd need to even get in close contact with her. Rent the apartment under her and blow it up when you know she's on the toilet.

Yamcha
I've been trying to think of some way to overcome 1 but all the choices aren't in my favor lol. Like since it's a villian world I doubt she would care if I stabbed myself in an alley then stumbled out and collapsed in front of her xD.

Round 5 is easily my favorite though, I use the money I got from the first match to buy explosives just in case and each assassin that gets too close (or with Spiderman stats I could probably hold them at least for maybe a second which would be long enough) then I could just detonate myself, with Wolverine regen I could just rinse and repeat probably x3. Except for Deadpool >_>...but with caps sheild and spideys stats I feel it would be possible to play keep away long enough to pass.

753
does black widow command an organization or is she flying solo? does she keep guards around her? if she's all by herself and has a routine that involves walking in public areas, shooting her in the back of the head wouldn't be a hassle in world without pis.

I'd clear this.

Blair Wind
You shoot, you miss. She's alerted to your presence and kicks all your asses.

Oliver North
Originally posted by 753
shooting her in the back of the head wouldn't be a hassle in world without pis.

753
if I missed sure, but I like my odds

Oliver North
you have days to literally learn how to shoot at point blank range.

Silent Master
I'd use a sniper rifle for round 1, I'm a decent shot, so it's got the best chance for success.

Oliver North
2 in the back, low enough to miss a vest, from close range. Keep firing as she falls, hit her in the head twice to make sure she dies.

As long as we are treating guns and bullets seriously, she is dead.

MF DELPH
Originally posted by Blair Wind
I don't know why you'd need to even get in close contact with her. Rent the apartment under her and blow it up when you know she's on the toilet.

You only have a week of prep for #1, and it didn't say how much money or resources you were given beyond knives, gun, and peak human stats. Plus renting an apartment isn't usually a quick process. In real life it'd take at least 2-4 days (credit check, lease signing, etc), and Widow would likely take up residence in a safehouse. On top of that gathering the components for the explosives and making sure Widow was in her unit at the point you had everything in order would be a task. Shooting her when she's not expecting an attempt on her life is more realistic. If she's in her civilian cover mode trying to blend in and appear normal a hit is much more possible.

JakeTheBank
It really depends on which factor takes more precedence: How guns and bullets and the like work in a "real world setting" or the feats/abilities/skills of the characters involved.

MF DELPH
Originally posted by Oliver North
2 in the back, low enough to miss a vest, from close range. Keep firing as she falls, hit her in the head twice to make sure she dies.

As long as we are treating guns and bullets seriously, she is dead.

Pretty much. OP said Widow was unsuspecting and going about her normal life. Assuming her normal life has a part where she uses her civilian cover on a day to day basis to stay off the radar that would be the best time to take her out.

MF DELPH
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
It really depends on which factor takes more precedence: How guns and bullets and the like work in a "real world setting" or the feats/abilities/skills of the characters involved.

Her comic feats/abilities/skills still don't make her bulletproof or infallible, and aren't we assuming PIS is off in this scenario? It's us in an alternate reality, not us in a comic book script. Widow's catching a hot one to the dome while doing her laundry.

JakeTheBank
Originally posted by MF DELPH
Her comic feats/abilities/skills still don't make her bulletproof or infallible, and aren't we assuming PIS is off in this scenario? It's us in an alternate reality, not us in a comic book script. Widow's catching a hot one to the dome while doing her laundry.

Even with PIS off, she's still a highly trained, peak human assassin/spy, with tremendous physical attributes by real world standards and peak human by comic book standards. She's survived plenty of assassination attempts and run ins with legitimate superhumans. Don't think it's going to be as simple as point 'n shoot even with prep time.

Oliver North
sure, BW has feats that suggest it might not be easy, but she is heavily at a disadvantage in the scenario.

JakeTheBank
With seven days prep, peak human stats, a gun and knives, getting the drop on Nat and successfully killing her is a colossal task for any person from "the real world" to take. You can't really do anything too extravagant with your prep time, less you blow the fact that she starts off unaware. I'm assuming you don't have infinite ammo and most of us are probably going to want to get some firearm practice in. And the every day status quo in the OP is chaos and madness due to villains running the world with no heroes. It's likely you could get offed or be in the wrong place at the wrong time and wind up an unlucky victim.

If you get past one, the rest falls neatly more or less into place, but really, it will be more luck than anything that enables people to walk away from her alive.

Newjak
Does everyone here honestly believe a highly trained spy/assassin who has killed and made tons of enemies is just going to you know not look at every situation as a trap?

Her feats are basically just that.

Renting a room beneath her, she probably has that placed tapped and wired and screens all new people before the landlord has a chance to.

Sneaking up behind her unaware, yeah cause no on in comics thought of that before. She probably had you pegged as the guy wanting something with her the moment you set eyes on her. Sneaking up behind her to shoot her? Yeah she already knew you coming and even what type of fire arm you had whether you are an expert or some lame schmuck she's debating about killing or just seriously maiming.

And all the resources you get are a gun and combat knife and some peak human abilities.

Wow you're still less physically capable and armed than all the people who get sent after her with none of the skills.

PIS off is even worse cause she is a superspy in a world of supervillains she isn't just going to walk to the store in a routine that makes it easy for would be killers to get the drop on her. She probably has all her food delivered where the person is scanned and background checked before they even get to ring the doorbell.

My point is you wouldn't be the first person to try and kill her you would be the worst and least capable person. You're not getting the drop on her especially not in 7 days.

She is smarter, faster, better skilled, and probably stronger based on feats, and probably better protected and armed as well.

-Pr-
So is this taking place in the Marvel world, or our world?

JakeTheBank
Originally posted by Newjak
Does everyone here honestly believe a highly trained spy/assassin who has killed and made tons of enemies is just going to you know not look at every situation as a trap?

Her feats are basically just that.

Renting a room beneath her, she probably has that placed tapped and wired and screens all new people before the landlord has a chance to.

Sneaking up behind her unaware, yeah cause no on in comics thought of that before. She probably had you pegged as the guy wanting something with her the moment you set eyes on her. Sneaking up behind her to shoot her? Yeah she already knew you coming and even what type of fire arm you had whether you are an expert or some lame schmuck she's debating about killing or just seriously maiming.

And all the resources you get are a gun and combat knife and some peak human abilities.

Wow you're still less physically capable and armed than all the people who get sent after her with none of the skills.

PIS off is even worse cause she is a superspy in a world of supervillains she isn't just going to walk to the store in a routine that makes it easy for would be killers to get the drop on her. She probably has all her food delivered where the person is scanned and background checked before they even get to ring the doorbell.

My point is you wouldn't be the first person to try and kill her you would be the worst and least capable person. You're not getting the drop on her especially not in 7 days.

She is smarter, faster, better skilled, and probably stronger based on feats, and probably better protected and armed as well.

This, all of it.

Oliver North
Does anyone have actual feats on this?

You would hardly need prep on her, just knowledge that she left whatever building she was in.

EDIT: it also depends significantly on what kind of gun you have. I was thinking handgun, rifle makes it far easier, shotgun probably less so.

753
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m8s10q9bu11ry7bgyo1_500.jpg

Newjak
Originally posted by Oliver North
Does anyone have actual feats on this?

You would hardly need prep on her, just knowledge that she left whatever building she was in.

EDIT: it also depends significantly on what kind of gun you have. I was thinking handgun, rifle makes it far easier, shotgun probably less so. Did you not read anything I just wrote.

She isn't just gonna leave a building where someone can sneak up on her from behind and shoot her.

Assuming you could do that at all. If it were that easy she would have been dead a long time ago.

And it doesn't matter what type of gun you're gonna use. I know what you're getting at with the rifle longer range equals better doesn't matter. She already knew you were there before she would even go out in public. She would sneak up behind you and disarm you.

Assuming she is even staying at the place you think she.

Let me put it to you this way if you can think of a way to take her out then she has already thought of it and a way to counter it.

Oliver North
Originally posted by Newjak
Did you not read anything I just wrote.

She isn't just gonna leave a building where someone can sneak up on her from behind and shoot her.

Assuming you could do that at all. If it were that easy she would have been dead a long time ago.

And it doesn't matter what type of gun you're gonna use. I know what you're getting at with the rifle longer range equals better doesn't matter. She already knew you were there before she would even go out in public. She would sneak up behind you and disarm you.

Assuming she is even staying at the place you think she.

Let me put it to you this way if you can think of a way to take her out then she has already thought of it and a way to counter it.

well, we can agree to disagree on most of that, do you have feats though?

some random stranger has attacked her on a street when she had no reason to suspect it? I'm genuinely interested in how she handles that type of attack.

Considering a rifle can be accurate up to hundreds of meters, I'm sort of interested in how someone with no powers counters that, again, scans?

MF DELPH
She's completely unaware that you're planning to kill her, and you're essentially a civilian. She has no reason whatsoever to suspect that a civilian would just shoot her, and OP states she's going about her "normal life". Assuming said "normal life" routine contains doing normal stuff in her civilian cover (which has been depicted in the comics, so I'm 100% sure it does), there's an opening to kill her cleanly. You guys are really over-complicating scenario #1. The hit isn't going to be some splash page exchange of gunfire where she's ducking behind wooden tables which miraculously deflect bullets. She doesn't see it coming at all and is going about her day to day routine which we're made privy of and get a week of prep.

Natasha's getting shot in the head.

753
op establishes we know where she goes and says nothing about her having backup. her main preventive defense is anonimity and that is already gone. she has no precog, no special senses no standard surveilance gear monitoring her suroundings.

and no, she wouldn't have been killed already, if it were that easy, because characters are kept alive so the plot moves forward and the company makes money regardless of how realistic it is. still, even folks like batman have been suprised by some pretty common and retarded stuff.

MF DELPH
Originally posted by Placidity
Same Scenario:

You live in a world where there are NO heroes, only villains (all high herald and below). Suffering and chaos has become the norm. You really wish you could have some superpowers to even things out.

Luckily, Bat-Mite is bored and decides to play a game with you. He is going to let you face a number of characters, and if you win, you will get a reward each time, if you lose, well, you die.



He starts you off with peak human stats, and a few combat knives and a gun. You have NO skills.


Round 1

Black Widow. This is not a "fight". She is going about her normal life, and is unaware you are wanting to kill her. You know her whereabouts - hunt her down and take her out.

You have 7 days (prep included) to do it.

She's dead.

Newjak
Originally posted by Oliver North
well, we can agree to disagree on most of that, do you have feats though?

some random stranger has attacked her on a street when she had no reason to suspect it? I'm genuinely interested in how she handles that type of attack.

Considering a rifle can be accurate up to hundreds of meters, I'm sort of interested in how someone with no powers counters that, again, scans? I won't agree to disagree.

What I'm saying is she is a super-spy with comic book feats and skills and smarts. She is above you.

And she suspects everyone. Do you honestly believe that one of the world's best assassins who has enemies out the wahzoo doesn't look at everyone with suspicion? Even random strangers?

You honestly believe she would stick to a routine that would make it so easy for some regular guy to kill her when she faces superpowered beings thousands of times deadlier and more skilled than you will ever be?

I don't have any scans with me but she can give Nick Fury trouble in the spy game, take down legions of armed goons with H2H skills. You honestly believe you stand a chance against her because you have a gun?

You're dreaming if you think you stood a chance.

She already knew you were on the roof with the rifle and goes around to sneak up behind you and disarm you.

753
op says she has a routine and we know it. how would she know I'd be coming exactly?

Newjak
Originally posted by MF DELPH
She's dead. Just because she doesn't know you are coming doesn't mean she isn't on alert for possible dangers.

Her normal routine doesn't have to be normal. Her making her sound like an idiot. Like she is just going to walk down to starbucks like any other joe going into the office not worried about someone attacking her.

She's the freaking Black Widow she suspects everyone.

Just because she doesn't know who you are doesn't mean she doesn't have her head on the swivel everyday.

Oliver North
more importantly, what part of her super spy training is going to tell her I'm in a window 600m away?

Newjak
Originally posted by 753
op says she has a routine and we know it. how would she know I'd be coming exactly? All it says is she follows her normal routine? She doesn't have a normal routine really. She has a civilian cover but that doesn't mean she isn't always prepared for some trying to take her down or that you can plan her leaving her house at exactly 1:00 PM everyday.

She doesn't have to know YOU are coming. She is a super secret spy with some od the deadliest enemies on the planet you honestly believe her guard is ever down?

MF DELPH
You're giving Black Widow way too much credit and yourself zero. You have complete anonymity, she's completely oblivious to the fact you're a threat, and you are YOU, which means you know everything about her as it's you, the comic book reader, in this scenario, meaning you know everything she is capable of, and to her you're just a random civilian. I don't know why you're giving her this cosmic battlefield awareness where the scenario already states she's oblivious to your threat. Assuming you don't blow the cover of being completely anonymous and unknown it shouldn't be that hard.

I could walk up and shoot Bruce Wayne on the street as he'd assume I'm just some random civilian and not a comic book reading would be assassin acting out a comic book site hypothetical snuff scenario.

Raisen
Originally posted by Newjak
All it says is she follows her normal routine? She doesn't have a normal routine really. She has a civilian cover but that doesn't mean she isn't always prepared for some trying to take her down or that you can plan her leaving her house at exactly 1:00 PM everyday.

She doesn't have to know YOU are coming. She is a super secret spy with some od the deadliest enemies on the planet you honestly believe her guard is ever down?

This is supposed to be real world conditions right? Even if she goes through all the measures you speak of, it is in the OP that we know her routine and she is oblivious to us. It really seems that you're the only one arguing hard for BW. I say she gets blown away.

carver9
Don't know if anyone can make it past 1 unless you are a good sniper and learning how to snipe (being good at it) doesn't take a week to learn.

Newjak
Originally posted by Oliver North
more importantly, what part of her super spy training is going to tell her I'm in a window 600m away? Assuming her building is in site of a window that is 600 meters away she probably knows all the locations someone could try such a stunt.

Originally posted by MF DELPH
You're giving Black Widow way too much credit and yourself zero. You have complete anonymity, she's completely oblivious to the fact you're a threat, and you are YOU, which means you know everything about her as it's you, the comic book reader, in this scenario, meaning you know everything she is capable of, and to her you're just a random civilian. I don't know why you're giving her this cosmic battlefield awareness where the scenario already states she's oblivious to your threat. Assuming you don't blow the cover of being completely anonymous and unknown it shouldn't be that hard.

I could walk up and shoot Bruce Wayne on the street as he'd assume I'm just some random civilian and not a comic book reading would be assassin acting out a comic book site hypothetical snuff scenario. You assume you could get to Bruce Wayne without him knowing you already have a gun. It being Batman means he would know you already have a gun. It's the way those types of comic book characters operate they just know because they are that skilled that they can pick up any minor detail.

Originally posted by Raisen
This is supposed to be real world conditions right? Even if she goes through all the measures you speak of, it is in the OP that we know her routine and she is oblivious to us. It really seems that you're the only one arguing hard for BW. I say she gets blown away. If that's the case you aren't going against Black Widow you are going against a dumb redhead in real life you calls herself a spy.

If we are using Black Widow from the comicbooks it doesn't matter if she doesn't know who you are, she is constantly on the lookout for threats. If she recognizes you as a threat it doesn't matter if she doesn't know who you are.

And just because you know her 'routine' doesn't mean you know what that routine consists of. It could mean she has all her stuff delivered to her or that she is gone 7 days out of the week. Or that her routine is basically something different everyday.

If the OP designs a scenario where Black Widow is forced to do stupid stuff that will get her killed then yes you can win. If this the actual Black Widow no one is getting past Scenario 1 no matter how good they think they are.

MF DELPH
Originally posted by Newjak
You assume you could get to Bruce Wayne without him knowing you already have a gun. It being Batman means he would know you already have a gun. It's the way those types of comic book characters operate they just know because they are that skilled that they can pick up any minor detail.

And this right here is why your opinion on this thread is severely flawed. You're granting these characters clairvoyance and complete almost supernatural battlefield awareness despite the OP explicitly stating the opposite, and despite the fact that this is NOT a plot driven comic book scenario. Batman would not know that any random civilian were armed, particularly in a scenario where it is specifically stated he (or in this case, Black Widow) is unaware of your threat.

SevenShackles
Originally posted by Silent Master
I'd use a sniper rifle for round 1, I'm a decent shot, so it's got the best chance for success.

But your given no money just a knife and a gun. Unless you don't use your prep time to learn her route and whore yourself out to gather enough money to buy the rifle and ammo. Then if your crap shooting doesn't take her down (sniper rifles aren't easy to use successfully and being a decent shot isn't worth risking your life on) she is alerted and proceeds to push your shit in despite your peak stats thanks to her vicious training. Your dead.

Also did the OP say no PIS or CIS?

SevenShackles
I quoted myself instead of editing and didn't even notice.. Geez.

Newjak
Originally posted by MF DELPH
And this right here is why your opinion on this thread is severely flawed. You're granting these characters clairvoyance and complete almost supernatural battlefield awareness despite the OP explicitly stating the opposite, and despite the fact that this is NOT a plot driven comic book scenario. Batman would not know that any random civilian were armed, particularly in a scenario where it is specifically stated he (or in this case, Black Widow) is unaware of your threat. It's not a flaw it's how they operate.

They know because they have comic book intelligence.

Black Widow knew you were carrying a gun simply by the slight bulge you had somewhere.

She knew you were up to something by they way you glanced at her without even knowing you did. The way you were breathing. The cloths you were wearing.

It's what they do that's their feats.

If you take that way you're taking away her feats in which case you are no longer fighting Black Widow but a dumb downed version of her to make yourselves feel better.

The truth is no here possess the skill, knowledge, or know how to begin to take a on well trained comic book character like Black Widow. Anyone saying otherwise is deluding themselves.

Like I said in the comics they have been trained to know all these things that even if she doesn't know you they instantly know if you are a threat whether you want them to or not.

MF DELPH
In a plotted scenario I'd grant you that. The OP says she's unaware, which means she's unaware, not she's aware in spite of what the OP states because she's Black Widow, which is your position. I highly doubt a random black guy in a Coogi polo drinking a chai tea frappe is going to cause her spider-sense to tingle. These characters walk around in public around faceless anonymous comic civilians all the time. She's oblivious, and she'd be dead.

Silent Master
With her being unaware that someone is trying to kill her, I'd say a sniper has a 50/50 chance of killing her.

Wei Phoenix
What I think Newjak is trying to say is that once you're in her vicinity, in the area walking around that she'll see you and give you an ocular pat down. Like if she was in a donut shop and you walk through the door then her training will alert her to the door opening and just quickly seeing who's there and whatnot.

What I believe Delph is saying that it's unlikely for her to pinpoint him out when there's tons of civilians around and he's got the appearance and demeanor of just another ordinary guy. She doesn't know he wants to kill her, she doesn't know he's after her because there is no information on an immediate threat to her life.

Newjak
Originally posted by MF DELPH
In a plotted scenario I'd grant you that. The OP says she's unaware, which means she's unaware, not she's aware in spite of what the OP states because she's Black Widow, which is your position. I highly doubt a random black guy in a Coogi polo drinking a chai tea frappe is going to cause her spider-sense to tingle. These characters walk around in public around faceless anonymous comic civilians all the time. She's oblivious, and she'd be dead.

Once again the OP says that she is unaware of you. Not that she all of sudden became stupid or loses her feats.

She is always on the look out just because she doesn't know you're coming doesn't mean her guard isn't normally up.

And you might not think you're giving anything away but she would take one look at the random black guy in a Coogi polo drinking a chai tea frappe and know you're up to something. It's what she does. It's what comic book characters with her kind of training do.

Now if the OP is saying she is just oblivious to all potential danger and she's not on the look out for it, then she's not Black Widow, then you have the chance of actually killing her if you are going to ignore what she is trained to do.

Newjak
Originally posted by Wei Phoenix
What I think Newjak is trying to say is that once you're in her vicinity, in the area walking around that she'll see you and give you an ocular pat down. Like if she was in a donut shop and you walk through the door then her training will alert her to the door opening and just quickly seeing who's there and whatnot.

What I believe Delph is saying that it's unlikely for her to pinpoint him out when there's tons of civilians around and he's got the appearance and demeanor of just another ordinary guy. She doesn't know he wants to kill her, she doesn't know he's after her because there is no information on an immediate threat to her life. What I'm saying is despite what Delph wants to believe picking out threats any situation despite the fact you think they shouldn't is what Black Widow does. She is constantly on hte lookout for trouble. Just because she doesn't know who you are doesn't mean she doesn't know whether you or not you a re potential threat. If you plan on harming her and don't have comic book skills she knows you;re threat, unless the OP throws a magic invisibility cloak over you that keeps her from seeing or thinking about you at all.

That's the only way you win in this scenario is if the OP is forcing the Black Widow not think and do what she does with everyone.

MF DELPH
It's all 50:50. You're only going to get one shot. If you don't take her out she's going to know there' a threat, and if she sees you at multiple locations she's going to know you're tailing her. That kind of awareness is reasonable. To think that if she were standing in line at a grocery store or waiting on a street light to cross an intersection or any other typical action and I'm 7-10 feet away and essentially one of those faceless anoymous filler civilians drawn in a comic that she'd know my intentions before I acted is just ridiculous.

Newjak
Originally posted by MF DELPH
To think that if she were standing in line at a grocery store or waiting on a street light to cross an intersection or any other typical action and I'm 7-10 feet away and essentially one of those faceless anonymous filler civilians drawn in a comic that she'd know my intentions before I acted is just ridiculous. Except that's what comic book characters like Black Widow do, they pick out threats from a faceless crowd like no one's business. As soon as you get 7-10 feet close to her she already knows you have a gun and plan on using it on her.

SevenShackles
I like the idea of bombing the apartment under hers when she is on the toilet and picking her off with a high powered sniper rifle from some ways away but the scenario doesn't really give us that.
It says "here are some knives and a gun, watch the black widow and figure out how to kill her with this" later on money is even given for us to spend on god knows what so I assuming that we arent really given the means to get our hands on explosives and rifles and such. Just the knives and lint in our pockets and the gun oddly tucked into the back of our pants like some disposable thug because at this point that's all we are until we take out the Black Widow.

Same ppl who are arguing the OP says she is unaware and remain as such are also saying they can reach outside the given scenario and take her out as they please.

Am I missing something here?

Silent Master
Originally posted by MF DELPH
It's all 50:50. You're only going to get one shot. If you don't take her out she's going to know there' a threat, and if she sees you at multiple locations she's going to know you're tailing her. That kind of awareness is reasonable. To think that if she were standing in line at a grocery store or waiting on a street light to cross an intersection or any other typical action and I'm 7-10 feet away and essentially one of those faceless anoymous filler civilians drawn in a comic that she'd know my intentions before I acted is just ridiculous.

Or you could be in a building 600 yards away, waiting for her to walk into your range.

MF DELPH
Originally posted by Wei Phoenix
What I think Newjak is trying to say is that once you're in her vicinity, in the area walking around that she'll see you and give you an ocular pat down. Like if she was in a donut shop and you walk through the door then her training will alert her to the door opening and just quickly seeing who's there and whatnot.

What I believe Delph is saying that it's unlikely for her to pinpoint him out when there's tons of civilians around and he's got the appearance and demeanor of just another ordinary guy. She doesn't know he wants to kill her, she doesn't know he's after her because there is no information on an immediate threat to her life.

Pretty much. I'm random Marvel civilian #5713 as far she is concerned. I just need to catch her slipping once and it's curtains. Particularly if this is a major city setting like New York, which is the likely location (most things Marvel being based in New York for some odd reason).

MF DELPH
Originally posted by Newjak
Except that's what comic book characters like Black Widow do, they pick out threats from a faceless crowd like no one's business. As soon as you get 7-10 feet close to her she already knows you have a gun and plan on using it on her.

Not in this scenario. She's unaware per the OP.

That's the disconnect we're having here.

Wei Phoenix
Originally posted by Newjak
What I'm saying is despite what Delph wants to believe picking out threats any situation despite the fact you think they shouldn't is what Black Widow does. She is constantly on hte lookout for trouble. Just because she doesn't know who you are doesn't mean she doesn't know whether you or not you a re potential threat. If you plan on harming her and don't have comic book skills she knows you;re threat, unless the OP throws a magic invisibility cloak over you that keeps her from seeing or thinking about you at all.

That's the only way you win in this scenario is if the OP is forcing the Black Widow not think and do what she does with everyone.

So I was right with what I believe you were saying? I'm not saying she's not going to notice the assailant I was just trying to clarify what you both were saying so I understood better. So if I'm right, by your logic and using the donut shop scenario again and she's there eating or net surfing. Door opens, couple walks in, young and in love, she watches the door and the customers through peripherals or something and deems them an average couple and goes back to her usual routine. Five minutes later, door opens again it's a single guy, he has a gun, so she notices the bulge, then pays more attention to his demeanor. He's not shaking or looking around nervously so it's not for protection and then it's to wonder if he's here to hold the place up, kill someone in here or if he's hiding etc? Like she does things like that?

Mshinu
The OP states NO SKILLS so I wouldn`t have a prayer at taking BW out with a gun or knife.

I think my best odds would be making a simple trap.. dropping a crate on someome tends to work in comics for some reason. Crates are not jobbers like bullets. Do it somewhere noisy and it miiight work. big grin

Silent Master
As he says that while he's listing what Bat-Mite starts you out with, I took it to mean you're not given any exta skills, not that your current skills are removed.

Mshinu
Originally posted by Placidity
You have NO skills.

Doesn`t get any clearer than this.

Silent Master
Like I said, As he says that while he's listing what Bat-Mite starts you out with, I took it to mean you're not given any exta skills, not that your current skills are removed.

Mshinu
And like I said, it really can`t get any clearer. "You have NO skills."

-Pr-
Originally posted by carver9
Don't know if anyone can make it past 1 unless you are a good sniper and learning how to snipe (being good at it) doesn't take a week to learn.

shrug I am...

Silent Master
Originally posted by -Pr-
shrug I am...

Hopefully he meant that it would take longer than a weak to become a good sniper.

However, this is carter we're talking about

Silent Master

Mshinu

Silent Master

Mshinu

Silent Master
Originally posted by Mshinu
And like I said it is quite obvious what "You have NO skills" means and I am starting to think you are less than serious in your posts.

Sorry, but I disagree with your stance that the OP meant for us to use the 7 days of prep to relearn how to walk and not sh!t ourselves.

Mshinu
Originally posted by Silent Master
Sorry, but I disagree with your stance that the OP meant for us to use the 7 days of prep to relearn how to walk and not sh!t ourselves.

Your words (3 times over), not mine.

-Pr-
Originally posted by Silent Master
Hopefully he meant that it would take longer than a weak to become a good sniper.

However, this is carter we're talking about

Oh, I know that. I just remember it taking me longer too, is all.

MF DELPH
Smh...

"No skills" as in not a skilled marksman or martial artist, you're just regular you with a gun, knives, and peak human physical attributes (granted by Batmite). A "peak human" Average Joe.

Silent Master
Originally posted by Mshinu
Your words (3 times over), not mine.

Your stance is that he meant to remove our already existing skills, so yes. Your stance is that the OP meant for us to use the 7 days of prep to relearn how to walk and not sh!t ourselves.

Oliver North
that "no skills" thing is actually a really weird stipulation...

I have a degree in psych, would I not be allowed to use whatever insight that might give me into BW's behaviour then?

not that it would change much, just wondering what the limit to "no skills" is

Estacado
Everyone fails....except for Brucey......he is an expert on taking down people like Black Adam...

Newjak
Originally posted by MF DELPH
Not in this scenario. She's unaware per the OP.

That's the disconnect we're having here. This is what the opening post says regarding her

"Black Widow. This is not a "fight". She is going about her normal life, and is unaware you are wanting to kill her. You know her whereabouts - hunt her down and take her out."


All that means is she doesn't know YOU want to kill her. It doesn't mean she doesn't know how to pick out a threat from the crowd, that she somehow has magically lost her abilities and is going along singing songs.

She is a, once again, highly successful spy/assassin one of the reasons being she is always on high alert for threats.


So unless the OP meant that somehow she magically ignores you at all turns she is gonna know what you are doing.

Which is stupid, if she notices a threat the kind she is always on the lookout she is going to deal with it.

Originally posted by Wei Phoenix
So I was right with what I believe you were saying? I'm not saying she's not going to notice the assailant I was just trying to clarify what you both were saying so I understood better. So if I'm right, by your logic and using the donut shop scenario again and she's there eating or net surfing. Door opens, couple walks in, young and in love, she watches the door and the customers through peripherals or something and deems them an average couple and goes back to her usual routine. Five minutes later, door opens again it's a single guy, he has a gun, so she notices the bulge, then pays more attention to his demeanor. He's not shaking or looking around nervously so it's not for protection and then it's to wonder if he's here to hold the place up, kill someone in here or if he's hiding etc? Like she does things like that? More like she knows who went into the donut shop with her, what everyone in the shop looks like and whether or not any of them are off. It's not just people coming into her view that makes her aware of them she is always actively scanning for threats and knows what her situation is. The only people who can get around this are similarly trained comic book people and none of us are.

Mshinu
Originally posted by Silent Master
Your stance is that he meant to remove our already existing skills, so yes. Your stance is that the OP meant for us to use the 7 days of prep to relearn how to walk and not sh!t ourselves.

Stop putting words in my mouth you little shit!

What I am saying is that the meaning of "NO skills" is pretty clear.

Silent Master
Originally posted by Mshinu
Stop putting words in my mouth you little shit!

What I am saying is that the meaning of "NO skills" is pretty clear.

The things I listed are skills, so if he meant to remove all our skills(as you claim) than the things I listed would also be removed.

Mshinu
Originally posted by Silent Master
The things I listed are skills, so if he meant to remove all our skills(as you claim) than the things I listed would also be removed.

Do you really think that is what "You have NO skills" means? Honestly?

Silent Master
Originally posted by Mshinu
Do you really think that is what "You have NO skills" means? Honestly?

According to you, that is exactly what he means.

Blair Wind
Guys, stop bitching. Seeing you two bicker is getting annoying.

That said, I'm inclined to agree with Silent Master.

Mshinu
Originally posted by Silent Master
According to you, that is exactly what he means.

Not at all, I just say that "You have NO skills" means you don`t have any skills.

Silent Master
Originally posted by Mshinu
Not at all, I just say that "You have NO skills" means you don`t have any skills.

The things I listed are skills.


Edit: Sorry Blair, just saw your post; I'll drop the tangent.

MF DELPH
Originally posted by Newjak
This is what the opening post says regarding her

"Black Widow. This is not a "fight". She is going about her normal life, and is unaware you are wanting to kill her. You know her whereabouts - hunt her down and take her out."


All that means is she doesn't know YOU want to kill her. It doesn't mean she doesn't know how to pick out a threat from the crowd, that she somehow has magically lost her abilities and is going along singing songs.

She is a, once again, highly successful spy/assassin one of the reasons being she is always on high alert for threats.


So unless the OP meant that somehow she magically ignores you at all turns she is gonna know what you are doing.

Which is stupid, if she notices a threat the kind she is always on the lookout she is going to deal with it.

Semantics now?

She's going through her day to day life and unaware that you want to kill her. That means she doesn't know you're a threat, per the OP, which you contradict in the second sentence of your explanation. She can't both be unaware that you want to kill her and immediately know you're out to kill her on sight simply because she's Black Widow.

C'mon son.

Oliver North
Originally posted by Mshinu
Not at all, I just say that "You have NO skills" means you don`t have any skills.

but then what about my example, would I be allowed to use the knowledge about human behaviour I've acquired?

Mshinu
Originally posted by Silent Master
The things I listed are skills.

So if I told you I have NO skills you would assume I am pooping my pants? laughing out loud

Again, the meaning of "You have NO skills" is very clear. You can try to muddy the water by being a smartass ar an-hole but it doesn`t change anything.

MF DELPH
After I finish round 4 I'm going back to Newjak stuck on round 1 and giving him a super wedgie.

MF DELPH
Btw, just wanted to add that there's no animosity or 'flame' in my tone here. Connotation can't be conveyed in text.

Wei Phoenix
Originally posted by MF DELPH
Btw, just wanted to add that there's no animosity or 'flame' in my tone here. Connotation can't be conveyed in text.

Sad part is that we as Black men have to state things like that or everyone's going to think we're being all volatile and unruly. Lord knows how many times I've been "tattled" on by my co-workers because they see me as aggressive when I don't agree.

Originally posted by Newjak
This is what the opening post says regarding her

"Black Widow. This is not a "fight". She is going about her normal life, and is unaware you are wanting to kill her. You know her whereabouts - hunt her down and take her out."


All that means is she doesn't know YOU want to kill her. It doesn't mean she doesn't know how to pick out a threat from the crowd, that she somehow has magically lost her abilities and is going along singing songs.

She is a, once again, highly successful spy/assassin one of the reasons being she is always on high alert for threats.


So unless the OP meant that somehow she magically ignores you at all turns she is gonna know what you are doing.

Which is stupid, if she notices a threat the kind she is always on the lookout she is going to deal with it.

More like she knows who went into the donut shop with her, what everyone in the shop looks like and whether or not any of them are off. It's not just people coming into her view that makes her aware of them she is always actively scanning for threats and knows what her situation is. The only people who can get around this are similarly trained comic book people and none of us are.

Alright thanks, just wanted to make sure I understand everything you were saying.

Newjak
Originally posted by MF DELPH
Semantics now?

She's going through her day to day life and unaware that you want to kill her. That means she doesn't know you're a threat, per the OP, which you contradict in the second sentence of your explanation. She can't both be unaware that you want to kill her and immediately know you're out to kill her on sight simply because she's Black Widow.

C'mon son. No I didn't.


Let me ask is Black Widow allowed to act once she realizes you are a threat?

Because honestly and we've been over this comic book characters can pick out someone in a crowd like no ones business. She will be able to know you have a gun and probably have been eyeballing her. That's what Black Widow does.

What I'm saying is she will realize you are a threat long before you ever get the chance to act. She may not know you're out to kill her but you're not gonna fool her. She will know you're after her and quickly cause that's what spies in comics do.

It's not cause she's black widow it's because she is a comic book assassin and they are always on high alert.

-Pr-
I'm pretty sure I'm keeping any actual skills I have as myself. I just don't get any extras without beating each level.

753
thats what I thought, OP should clarify. you dont actually need to get within 3 meters from someone to gun her down with a common handgun.

MF DELPH
Originally posted by Newjak
No I didn't.


Let me ask is Black Widow allowed to act once she realizes you are a threat?

Because honestly and we've been over this comic book characters can pick out someone in a crowd like no ones business. She will be able to know you have a gun and probably have been eyeballing her. That's what Black Widow does.

What I'm saying is she will realize you are a threat long before you ever get the chance to act. She may not know you're out to kill her but you're not gonna fool her. She will know you're after her and quickly cause that's what spies in comics do.

It's not cause she's black widow it's because she is a comic book assassin and they are always on high alert.


Can you be both unaware and aware at the same time, Newjak?

Of course if you make your move and fail your anonymity is blown. However, until you make a move you're just Random Civilian X and Black Widow is not going to just magically know that you're an armed would be assassin by simply being in your presence which seems to be the case you're attempting to make (in spite of the OP).

Flyattractor
Have we decided how much Comic Book Logic is being put into play here?

Cause when it comes to the task of taking out Black Widow and I have several days of Prep. I think I can come up with a better solution then "I is Gonna Shoots her in der Face!" ****. I will nuke the whole damn block to take her out if I have to.. Fuhh the innocent bystanders.

MF DELPH
Originally posted by 753
thats what I thought, OP should clarify. you dont actually need to get within 3 meters from someone to gun her down with a common handgun.

If you had a Desert Eagle or Colt you could probably hit her from at least 20-30 feet without much issue. Unless we're also assuming that she gets to dodge the bullet after it's been fired and do a splash screen somersault too.

Oliver North
Originally posted by Flyattractor
Have we decided how much Comic Book Logic is being put into play here?

Cause when it comes to the task of taking out Black Widow and I have several days of Prep. I think I can come up with a better solution then "I is Gonna Shoots her in der Face!" ****. I will nuke the whole damn block to take her out if I have to.. Fuhh the innocent bystanders.

I'd actually think there would be less of a chance in killing her with some elaborate trap. It would have to be a random encounter when she is exiting a building or walking down a street. Somewhere that you could legitimately get close enough before she notices, and a cityscape gives plenty of those.

EDIT: with an elaborate trap, there are going to be too many signs that she would pick up on.

Mindset
I walk up to BW and break her neck.

MF DELPH
Originally posted by Flyattractor
Have we decided how much Comic Book Logic is being put into play here?

Cause when it comes to the task of taking out Black Widow and I have several days of Prep. I think I can come up with a better solution then "I is Gonna Shoots her in der Face!" ****. I will nuke the whole damn block to take her out if I have to.. Fuhh the innocent bystanders.

Resources. You only get knives, gun, and peak human physical attributes to start without 'skills' (Average You). Though I suppose you could use a day or two of that prep robbing a gun shop and improving your arsenal (though that would likely get you on someone's radar). Assuming the stipulation of prep being included with the week and Black Widow is still oblivious if you were to do something like that, that actually would put a lot of other options on the table. Particularly sniping.

MF DELPH
Also, what is considered "peak human" physical attributes? Would we all be assumed Batman/Daredevil level physically in round one?

Mindset
Originally posted by MF DELPH
Also, what is considered "peak human" physical attributes? Would we all be assumed Batman/Daredevil level physically in round one? Brucey level.

Silent Master
Originally posted by MF DELPH
Resources. You only get knives, gun, and peak human physical attributes to start without 'skills' (Average You). Though I suppose you could use a day or two of that prep robbing a gun shop and improving your arsenal (though that would likely get you on someone's radar). Assuming the stipulation of prep being included with the week and Black Widow is still oblivious if you were to do something like that, that actually would put a lot of other options on the table. Particularly sniping.

It'd be rather easy to swing by a gun show and legally pick up a rifle.

Mindset
Originally posted by Silent Master
It'd be rather easy to swing by a gun show and legally pick up a rifle. Yea, this is america, I could get a tank if I wanted to.

thumb up

Silent Master
Originally posted by Mindset
Yea, this is america, I could get a tank if I wanted to.

thumb up

Hell, my state has mutliple gun shows every month. upgrading your starting equipment wouldn't be hard.

-Pr-
Originally posted by Silent Master
It'd be rather easy to swing by a gun show and legally pick up a rifle.

Yup.

armedforbattle
I would walk up to black widow. Tell her I've been sent to kill her. And then I'd beat the shit out of her.

Because Guys are better fighters then girls.
That's not an opinion, that's fact.

Nibedicus
1 would be a big problem as I'm assuming that BW (who is no doubt a successful spy/assassin in a world full of supervillains) would no doubt have safeguards against would-be assassins herself. Knowing her location wouldn't be enough. For all you know, she would use doubles, use disguises as she exits her home, have alternative exits/entrances, keep hidden surveillance equipment and checks it daily, etc. She would also always be alert to her surroundings, she would always check her locations for suspicious characters/actions, she would never have an established routine, etc. The minute she suspects that someone is even scoping her, she liable to take that person out no problem. And, me, being someone who has little to no surveillance/espionage skills don't fancy my chances against a master spy/assassin who (even w/ the absence of superpowers) can stay alive, let alone successful, in a world full of supervillains, even with the advantage of surprise.

Silent Master
That's why the sniper plan is your best bet.

Nibedicus
Originally posted by Silent Master
That's why the sniper plan is your best bet.

So, what you're saying is that, BW, a master spy/assassin who's survived and (possibly) flourished in a world full of Superpowered villains (some of who can easily track her down if they want to) could be easily killed by any noob with a sniper rifle?

I mean, where do you even know where to find your perch? Are you gonna wait in an adjacent building for days on end with the hope of being able to position yourself perfectly? Do you think that you'd be able to easily identify her amidst crowds, thru her possible disguises and have the timing necessary to spot her just in time as she exits her home? Don't you think she'd be able to notice some dude with a telescope or some car outside her home that doesn't seem to be moving anywhere (or however you plan to wait her out with a rifle)?

Edit. Hell, I've handled a hunting rifle before while out in the jungle (my dad used to take us hunting) and in the shooting range, it's not as easy as some people are making it sound, especially at the range you need it to be in order to catch some1 unawares.

Silent Master
The OP says that we know her whereabouts, all it would take is a hotel/building with a good vantage point and then waiting until she shows up.

Nibedicus
Originally posted by Silent Master
The OP says that we know her whereabouts, all it would take is a hotel/building with a good vantage point and then waiting until she shows up.

You know her whereabouts but not her routines, you don't know what she looks like whenever she exits her home, you don't know if she even exits her home. You'll have to scope her out and wait it out and play espionage with someone who is a master of it in a world of super powered beings.

I don't fancy your chances.

Silent Master
So, your argument is that people wouldn't be able to find her and not that she can't be shot with sniper rifle?

Nibedicus
Originally posted by Silent Master
So, your argument is that people wouldn't be able to find her and not that she can't be shot with sniper rifle?

?

Not my argument at all.

Oliver North
are there scans of BW having such a complex routine in her daily life?

Nibedicus
Originally posted by Oliver North
are there scans of BW having such a complex routine in her daily life?

This would be like me asking if there are any scans of the daily life of a BW with the listed envirnomental (world full of Supervillains, no superheroes) stips?

Oliver North
no... it is like asking if there is evidence BW does these types of things at all...

Silent Master
Originally posted by Oliver North
are there scans of BW having such a complex routine in her daily life?

Not that I'm aware of. then again whereabouts could mean anything from what city she's in to what house.....so I suppose the argument has some merit.

Even though not being able to even find BW seems to defeat the entire purpose of the thread.

Oliver North
Originally posted by Silent Master
Not that I'm aware of. then again whereabouts could mean anything from what city she's in to what house.....so I suppose the argument has some merit.

I agree, I'm just saying, people are suggesting she has a complex system of cameras and security systems that would prevent even watching her with a telescopic lens.

On the street, sure, it wont be easy to get her unawares, I just think the OP disadvantages her enough that it is ours to lose.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Even though not being able to even find BW seems to defeat the entire purpose of the thread.

ya, I certainly interpreted the OP as saying you knew her exact location and the 7 days prep was to try and find her routines.

Nibedicus
Originally posted by Oliver North
no... it is like asking if there is evidence BW does these types of things at all...

I'm not as well read with BW as other people but the ones wherein I've read about her has her either in the Helicarrier or in deep cover missions or in Avengers mansion.

One has to provide scans of her even having a "normal" type routine/life.

But even then, we're talking about a different Black Widow who is living and (possibly) thriving in a different environment. As this BW has never existed in comics, no scans can ever be provided. Thus, it would have come down to making a few assumptions.

That or the OP has to clarify exactly how this BW has been able to survive/thrive in said environment.

Oliver North
Originally posted by Nibedicus
I'm not as well read with BW as other people but the ones wherein I've read about her has her either in the Helicarrier or in deep cover missions or in Avengers mansion.

One has to provide scans of her even having a "normal" type routine/life.

But even then, we're talking about a different Black Widow who is living and (possibly) thriving in a different environment. As this BW has never existed in comics, no scans can ever be provided. Thus, it would have come down to making a few assumptions.

That or the OP has to clarify exactly how this BW has been able to survive/thrive in said environment.

those are a number of interesting reasons why you shouldn't have to provide evidence to support your point.

Nibedicus
Originally posted by Silent Master
Not that I'm aware of. then again whereabouts could mean anything from what city she's in to what house.....so I suppose the argument has some merit.

Even though not being able to even find BW seems to defeat the entire purpose of the thread.

OP wasn't very clear about how detailed "knowing her whereabouts" would be.

Are you assuming that you'd be in the perfect spot to shoot someone at just the right time? Or are you assuming to shoot her thru a window or something. Please clarify exactly how you plan to accomplish this sniping plan of yours.

Nibedicus
Originally posted by Oliver North
those are a number of interesting reasons why you shouldn't have to provide evidence to support your point.

This BW never existed in comics. You're asking for evidence that can't ever be provided?

Oliver North
Originally posted by Nibedicus
This BW never existed in comics. You're asking for evidence that can't ever be provided?

by your definition, then, all of these scenarios are entirely unanswerable because we can't know anything about the characters, them being from an alternate reality existing only in this thread.

/thread I guess?

Silent Master
Well, I took the knowing her whereabouts to mean that I was given her location, at that point I'd use the 7 days for surveillance and then set-up shop in a hotel room/building close to one of the places she visits and then wait.

Mindset
I'd use 6 days to bang some broads.

On the 7th day I'd bang BW, then Black Widow.

Nibedicus
Originally posted by Oliver North
by your definition, then, all of these scenarios are entirely unanswerable because we can't know anything about the characters, them being from an alternate reality existing only in this thread.

/thread I guess?

We know powersets/skillsets of the target and we know the environment and we are given stipulations on what to do and a few info that'll help us out (such as location).

Everything else has to come down to making assumptions on what we might encounter.

"Knowing someone's whereabouts" was never mentioned as to be as detailed as a complete dossier of the person, pictures, routines, etc. A lot of times, it could be as simple as being given a name and address.

One can assume that a superspy living in a rather dangerous world would be vulnerable to any noob with a sniper rifle who gets her address. But I just happen to disagree.

Edit. Messed up on my typing, came out funny.

Nibedicus
Originally posted by Silent Master
Well, I took the knowing her whereabouts to mean that I was given her location, at that point I'd use the 7 days for survalence and then set-up shop in a hotel room/building close to one of the places she visits and then wait.

And like I said, you'd be playing espionage against possibly one of the best spies in the business who's survived (and possibly thrive) in a world full of supervillains. Where you have no surveillance/espionage skills of your own and where your only advantage is surprise.

Again, I don't fancy your chances.

Damborgson
yeah well, no one is killing Black Widow if she's operating the same as in a comic book. If it's a tad more realistic then someone can just be waiting on a rooftop with a sniper and end it.

Oliver North
Originally posted by Nibedicus
We know powersets/skillsets of the target and we know the environment and we are given stipulations on what to do and a few info that'll help us out (such as location).

Everything else has to come down to making assumptions on what we might encounter.

"Knowing someone's whereabouts" was never mentioned as to be as detailed as a complete dossier of the person, pictures, routines, etc. A lot of times, it could be as simple as being given a name and address.

One can assume that a superspy living in a rather dangerous world would be vulnerable to any noob with a sniper rifle who gets her address. But I just happen to disagree.

Edit. Messed up on my typing, came out funny.

or, we could follow standard forum procedure and use scans to determine how characters would behave, rather than our imaginations

Originally posted by Nibedicus
and where your only advantage is surprise.

you have to admit, that is a huge advantage though

Mindset
Originally posted by Nibedicus
Where you have no surveillance/espionage skills of your own
How do you know?

Nibedicus
Originally posted by Damborgson
yeah well, no one is killing Black Widow if she's operating the same as in a comic book. If it's a tad more realistic then someone can just be waiting on a rooftop with a sniper and end it.

Sniping someone isn't really that simple. You have to be at the perfect time/place to do it (know the target's routine, if any). You have to remain unseen else people might be calling the cops on you. You have to KNOW that you're shooting the right target (hard to do, especially in a crowd and most spies don'ty exactly paint a big bullseye on their hat) and you have to be shooting at a range where you'll know you'll hit cuz you'll most likely only have one shot.

I've never used a sniper rifle before, but handling an M-16 with a sniper scope, I gotta say it's hard to hit a stationary target with a big bullseye at about 50-60 yards (Granted, I'm a noob with a gun, but that's exactly what the OP stated we were.). We're talking about a moving target that you would possibly have to pick out in a crowd.

Raisen
Originally posted by Blair Wind
Guys, stop bitching. Seeing you two bicker is getting annoying.

That said, I'm inclined to agree with Silent Master.

No BACKSEAT MODDING

Nibedicus
Originally posted by Mindset
How do you know?

OP says no skills, unless he means no ADDITIONAL skills other than what you currently posses, in w/c case, I'll say that anyone with any sort of espionage/military training WOULD have better chances here.

Damborgson
Originally posted by Nibedicus
Sniping someone isn't really that simple. You have to be at the perfect time/place to do it (know the target's routine, if any). You have to remain unseen else people might be calling the cops on you. You have to KNOW that you're shooting the right target (hard to do, especially in a crowd and most spies don'ty exactly paint a big bullseye on their hat) and you have to be shooting at a range where you'll know you'll hit cuz you'll most likely only have one shot.

I've never used a sniper rifle before, but handling an M-16 with a sniper scope, I gotta say it's hard to hit a stationary target with a big bullseye at about 50-60 yards (Granted, I'm a noob with a gun, but that's exactly what the OP stated we were.). We're talking about a moving target that you would possibly have to pick out in a crowd.

I do know her routine as stated in the OP I guess. Guess I'm just a stalker like that. It's a world of villains, I wouldn't think there are cops.

I'd have to pick a time when she's solo. She's not going to be in a crowd all the time. I'm a decent shot, but nothing special. I can hit 40+ yard stationary targets with my arisaka type 30 though lol. That's something I guess. I'd have to practice up that's for sure.

-Pr-
Originally posted by Raisen
No BACKSEAT MODDING

Irony?

Mindset
Ironing.

Raisen
Originally posted by -Pr-
Irony?

In that I was backseat modding by telling him not to backseat mod?

If you warn me, you have to warn him also. cool

Silent Master
Originally posted by Nibedicus
And like I said, you'd be playing espionage against possibly one of the best spies in the business who's survived (and possibly thrive) in a world full of supervillains. Where you have no surveillance/espionage skills of your own and where your only advantage is surprise.

Again, I don't fancy your chances.

I'd being using my prep time for the surveillance, which means per the OP she doesn't notice. and as I'd be in position before the match starts, BW wouldn't ever have a chance to see me...unless I missed something and current Black Widow has x-ray vision.

Mindset
Originally posted by Raisen
In that I was backseat modding by telling him not to backseat mod?

If you warn me, you have to warn him also. cool You aren't his boss!

Raisen
Originally posted by Mindset
You aren't his boss!

What if I told you that I'm a member of the Canadian Immigration Force?

Silent Master
What is this about 30-60 yards? I was hitting targets at over 100 yards when I was around 12. I'm no where near as good as a trained sniper, but I'd have a decent chance of hitting a target at around 400 yards.

Nibedicus
Originally posted by Silent Master
I'd being using my prep time for the surveillance, which means per the OP she doesn't notice. and as I'd be in position before the match starts, BW wouldn't ever have a chance to see me...unless I missed something and current Black Widow has x-ray vision.

Disagree.

This is the EXACT OP as written:

Originally posted by Placidity
Black Widow. This is not a "fight". She is going about her normal life, and is unaware you are wanting to kill her. You know her whereabouts - hunt her down and take her out.

You have 7 days (prep included) to do it.

Unless I'm interpreting it wrong, it means that she doesn't know you want to kill her and you are given her whereabouts. THEN you hunt her down and take her out. Means that other than some info on her location and her being unaware of you at the start, you have to gather the rest of the info yourself (such as routines) w/in a 7 day period.

There is no "magic period" of prep wherein you are allowed to spy on her w/o her ever finding out that you are.

Silent Master
In that case, I just set-up shop on the first day within range of her location and take the best shot I can.

Nibedicus
Originally posted by Silent Master
In that case, I just set-up shop on the first day within range of her location and take the best shot I can.

In w/c case, I'll reiterate, I don't fancy your chances.

Nibedicus
Originally posted by Damborgson
I do know her routine as stated in the OP I guess. Guess I'm just a stalker like that. It's a world of villains, I wouldn't think there are cops.

I'd have to pick a time when she's solo. She's not going to be in a crowd all the time. I'm a decent shot, but nothing special. I can hit 40+ yard stationary targets with my arisaka type 30 though lol. That's something I guess. I'd have to practice up that's for sure.

There need not be any cops in a world full of villains, they could just be all corrupt or just be working for the villains or are just too cowed to do anything against said villains (but would just LOVE to take down some guy with a sniper rifle shooting at random civilians).

OP actually simply states "whereabouts". My assumptions would be an address and name. Even mentions that you have to "hunt her down".

These are huge assumptions to make when dealing with a super spy tho. Any spy (especially some1 who doesn't wear a mask all the time like BW does) would no doubt change their appearance at the very least (that is unless we're talking about a VERY inept super spy here).

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