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Blow For Blow who goes down first?

1. No Hammer
2. Hammer

It is my belief that Thor is slightly tougher than Adam, and stronger, but Adam can throw more punches than Thor per second, and this is what will decide the match up in the first scenario. In the second one Thor should win barely.

Originally posted by Stoic
It is my belief that Thor is slightly tougher than Adam, and stronger, but Adam can throw more punches than Thor per second, and this is what will decide the match up in the first scenario. In the second one Thor should win barely.

Who has better durability?

Adam wrecks thor. LOL @ thor being stronger.

1. Adam
2. Thor

1. Split on physical stats but I may give Adam the edge on average due to his ruthlessness and willing to go all out from the get go. But this is Thor, and compared to some of the guys he's faced, Adam's about as ruthless as Minny Mouse. He's also arguably one of the few guys tougher than Black Adam. If they both cut loose, split.

2. Thor.

Adam is undeniably stronger and more durable than thor. How's thor tougher than adam? Also Adam gets at least a split in round 2.

Adam
Thor

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
Blow For Blow who goes down first?

1. No Hammer
2. Hammer

1. Adam every single time
2. Split or Thor for the slight majority

Adam
Split.

1. Black
2. Adam

Originally posted by Placidity
1. Black
2. Adam
1. God
2. of Thunder

Doesn't work nearly as well.

Originally posted by Placidity
Doesn't work nearly as well.
How about...

1. Mighty
2. Thor





Anyways..
1. Bladam
2. Thor

Adam on first scenario
split

Originally posted by abhilegend
Adam is undeniably stronger and more durable than thor. How's thor tougher than adam? Also Adam gets at least a split in round 2.

Adam's not either of those things. I said arguably; I think the two are pretty close, both are as tough as they come.

At least a split? Wow, so you believe Adam would on his worst day split with Thor/Mjolnir in hand to hand? And what, get the majority at his best? Listen, I get that Thor didn't have a great few months in 2012 but the rest of his feats don't magically cease to exist. There's no need to be this ridiculous.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Listen, I get that Thor didn't have a great few months in 2012 but the rest of his feats don't magically cease to exist.

And really, that's without factoring in the absurd bullshit Fraction had Thor doing in his ongoing.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
1. Adam
2. Thor

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Adam's not either of those things. I said arguably; I think the two are pretty close, both are as tough as they come.

At least a split? Wow, so you believe Adam would on his worst day split with Thor/Mjolnir in hand to hand? And what, get the majority at his best? Listen, I get that Thor didn't have a great few months in 2012 but the rest of his feats don't magically cease to exist. There's no need to be this ridiculous.
He is. When Thor at 1/3 of his strength knocks out someone like PG by a thunderclap, talk to me. Thor isn't as strong as people like Captain Marvel, Black Adam and Superman. You need to let it go. I'm talking about his whole history. Remind me the last time adam lost a fight in h2h. Adam is more durable than thor and hits as hard as thor does with mjolnir. He would get at least a split in second round.

Shots fired.

Thor wrecks his black a@@

Adam hits harder Than Captain Marvel according to superman

Captain Marvel Has knocked Superman The F out with a magic charged punch before.

Adam is no joke

1. Adam
2. Adam is not weak to magic so I would give him the slight edge here.

1. Adam for a majority

2. Thor for a definite majority

1) Thor
2) Adam

Adam and Thor strength is equal in my book but Adam is more durable and way way faster so in the first fight he wins. Round two the hammer will give Thor the edge.

I reread the forums rules what consists of a slugfest because honestly BA >> thor speed and comparable strength too, unless slugfest means one punch then your turn Thor should get rocked.

Adam

How does Thor engage in a "punch fest" with Mjolnir in the second round?

Originally posted by Placidity
1. Black
2. Adam

Originally posted by Nibedicus
1) Thor
2) Adam I dont get this

1. split
2. Thor

Originally posted by mighty adam
Adam and Thor strength is equal in my book but Adam is more durable and way way faster so in the first fight he wins. Round two the hammer will give Thor the edge.

No
Both Superman and Adam are much stronger than Thor.
His hammer is what kinda equals things out.

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
I dont get this

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
Blow For Blow who goes down first?

Originally posted by Nibedicus
1) Thor
2) Adam

Originally posted by h1a8
No
Both Superman and Adam are much stronger than Thor.
His hammer is what kinda equals things out. Thor has strength feats lifting that world serpent etc

Originally posted by abhilegend
He is. When Thor at 1/3 of his strength knocks out someone like PG by a thunderclap, talk to me. Thor isn't as strong as people like Captain Marvel, Black Adam and Superman. You need to let it go. I'm talking about his whole history. Remind me the last time adam lost a fight in h2h. Adam is more durable than thor and hits as hard as thor does with mjolnir. He would get at least a split in second round.
I'll give you this. Ure a relentless smear campaigner, but to make it seem as if Thor does not belong with that group when it comes to strength and durability is just asinine.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
I'll give you this. Ure a relentless smear campaigner, but to make it seem as if Thor does not belong with that group when it comes to strength and durability is just asinine. Doesn't matter, Hulk oneshots all of them.

1. Adam.
2. Split.

1.Thor
2.Odinson

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
I'll give you this. Ure a relentless smear campaigner, but to make it seem as if Thor does not belong with that group when it comes to strength and durability is just asinine.
No, it isn't asinine. Thor is in the strength class of wonder woman, not superman. He doesn't have feats to support your stance.

1.Thor
2.Bladam

Originally posted by abhilegend
No, it isn't asinine. Thor is in the strength class of wonder woman, not superman. He doesn't have feats to support your stance.
So which is it? Are we talking about strength only, durability only, or strength and durability? Come now, make up ure mind.

I would think he is talking about strength only.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
So which is it? Are we talking about strength only, durability only, or strength and durability? Come now, make up ure mind.
Both strength and durability.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Both strength and durability.
Fine, lets do it ure way. Let us take CM and Bladam for a sec. What strength feats do they have that puts them clearly above?

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Fine, lets do it ure way. Let us take CM and Bladam for a sec. What strength feats do they have that puts them clearly above?
Black Adam wrecking PG at 1/3 strength, cap matching superman in strength.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Black Adam wrecking PG at 1/3 strength, cap matching superman in strength.
I'm gonna laugh if that's really all uve got.

Power Girl is as strong as Woman Woman, based on Wonder Womans own words

So if you believe Thor is as strong as Wonder Woman, Then Black Adam even at 1/3 strength would still be much stronger than Thor.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Black Adam wrecking PG at 1/3 strength, cap matching superman in strength.

Thor's matched an enraged savage Hulk for an hour. Matching someone who's strength increases exponentially like Hulk's for that long is ridiculous.

Hulks strength varies alot

Originally posted by Damborgson
Thor's matched an enraged savage Hulk for an hour. Matching someone who's strength increases exponentially like Hulk's for that long is ridiculous. Apparently Hulk doesn't count when matching him strength since he's from Marvel.

@Big-C Yep, it increases dramatically when he's angered

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
I'm gonna laugh if that's really all uve got.
Concession accepted. Oh and cap at 1/3 of his strength helped to restore an expanded moon's orbit.
Originally posted by Damborgson
Thor's matched an enraged savage Hulk for an hour. Matching someone who's strength increases exponentially like Hulk's for that long is ridiculous.
Englehart didn't write hulk with that kind of dynamic strength. His hulk got barely stronger even at majorly pissed level. Heck wonder man was stronger than thor under Englehart.

Originally posted by abhilegend

Englehart didn't write hulk with that kind of dynamic strength. His hulk got barely stronger even at majorly pissed level. Heck wonder man was stronger than thor under Englehart.

It's part of the Hulk's powerset. The angrier the you know what. No conditions about it. There was a time Wonderman was supposed to be on that level of strength. Doesn't mean much anymore. Thor's feat is still about as good as it gets when it comes to matching someones strength.

Originally posted by Damborgson
It's part of the Hulk's powerset. The angrier the you know what. No conditions about it. There was a time Wonderman was supposed to be on that level of strength. Doesn't mean much anymore. Thor's feat is still about as good as it gets when it comes to matching someones strength.
You have to go case by case basis on hulk's dynamic strength. Bill Mantlo wrote hulk getting exponentially stronger and nobody else did. Wonder Man overpowered Thor in the same position when Thor matched his arms with him under Englehart. Simon> an angry hulk? Wrecker oneshotted an angry hulk just a few issues later.

Originally posted by Damborgson
Thor's matched an enraged savage Hulk for an hour. Matching someone who's strength increases exponentially like Hulk's for that long is ridiculous.

Honestly how is that even possible?

We can all agree that Thor started out stronger than Savage Hulk but why doesn't Thor win the fight every time if savage hulk is unable to pass him even after an hour of growing exponentially stronger?

Originally posted by abhilegend
You have to go case by case basis on hulk's dynamic strength. Bill Mantlo wrote hulk getting exponentially stronger and nobody else did. Wonder Man overpowered Thor in the same position when Thor matched his arms with him under Englehart. Simon> an angry hulk? Wrecker oneshotted an angry hulk just a few issues later.

Not really. Of course Hulk isn't always operating at a super intense level, but let's study the scene. The Hulk has one full hour to get angry. He was held in place. Fact is, Hulk's powerset is to get stronger over time, and he did. And seeing as how he's already class 100+ it's a hell of a strength feat.

Scan? It's when he was still in that gay costume right?

So? It was a cheap shot. Worse has happened with cheap shots.

To me it's more ridiculous to consider that Bladam at 1/3 his strength could wreck powergirl. But that's how it goes.

Originally posted by Diesldude
Honestly how is that even possible?

We can all agree that Thor started out stronger than Savage Hulk but why doesn't Thor win the fight every time if savage hulk is unable to pass him even after an hour of growing exponentially stronger?

Because of Hulk's powerset. Thor doesn't hit him hard enough to KO him, and while Thor loses stamina with every punch he gets, Hulk doesn't unless Thor really pours the power on.

Originally posted by abhilegend
You have to go case by case basis on hulk's dynamic strength. Bill Mantlo wrote hulk getting exponentially stronger and nobody else did. Wonder Man overpowered Thor in the same position when Thor matched his arms with him under Englehart. Simon> an angry hulk? Wrecker oneshotted an angry hulk just a few issues later. Funny how lowballing is so ingrained in u. Everyone has a less than stellar showing every now and then. Not CM, not Thor, not Surfer, not even Supes are free from them. There will always be inconsistencies.

Originally posted by Damborgson
@Big-C Yep, it increases dramatically when he's angered No. The speed at which it increases varies, we have seen hulk immediately become 10x stronger ,were as sometimes it takes him MUCH longer.

We have also seen him do crazy sh*t at base level strength.

It varies ALOT

Originally posted by abhilegend
You have to go case by case basis on hulk's dynamic strength. Bill Mantlo wrote hulk getting exponentially stronger and nobody else did. Wonder Man overpowered Thor in the same position when Thor matched his arms with him under Englehart. Simon> an angry hulk? Wrecker oneshotted an angry hulk just a few issues later.

This should speak for itself

This isn't just lowballing but rather you denying reality.

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
No. The speed at which it increases varies, we have seen hulk immediately become 10x stronger ,were as sometimes it takes him MUCH longer.

It varies ALOT

You've seen savage Hulk immediately become 10X stronger? On the spot? I'd like to see that proven.

When he fought an amped up abomination that was 5x stronger than him iirc, after getting rocked with a few blows hulk beat the living sh*t out of him.

That doesn't prove a 10X amp. Thor after getting rocked by Kurse proceeded to slap him around after. He must've increased his strength 8x over.

Thor wins with the hammer, loses without.

1. Without hammer- Adam
2. With hammer- Thor

Originally posted by Damborgson
Not really. Of course Hulk isn't always operating at a super intense level, but let's study the scene. The Hulk has one full hour to get angry. He was held in place. Fact is, Hulk's powerset is to get stronger over time, and he did. Not the way you describe it. Hulk didn't get very strong when he was angry under Englehart. Hulk was class 90 at calm state in those days. Only an angry hulk was class 100.

It wasn't a cheap shot. Simon directly overpowered thor.
http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/745/thor229cd5qs.jpg

http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/3295/thor235ni5oo.jpg

That's what define characters in superman class. Wait till you see superman twoshotting a creature with the powers of superman, captain marvel, j'onn, aquaman and elongated man.


Not true either.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Funny how lowballing is so ingrained in u. Everyone has a less than stellar showing every now and then. Not CM, not Thor, not Surfer, not even Supes are free from them. There will always be inconsistencies.
Do you have ANYTHING of value to said or just randomly shout lowballing?

Originally posted by curryman
This should speak for itself

This isn't just lowballing but rather you denying reality.
Nobody else has wrote hulk getting exponentially stronger with anger, not even pak.

Englehart also wrote an insanely angry hulk nearly choked to death by Sandman while hulk was unable to break his grip. Sandman>Wonder Man>Thor=Hulk?

Originally posted by abhilegend
Nobody else has wrote hulk getting exponentially stronger with anger, not even pak.

...what?

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
...what?
Holding back, dood.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Nobody else has wrote hulk getting exponentially stronger with anger, not even pak.

This is a lie.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Englehart also wrote an insanely angry hulk nearly choked to death by Sandman while hulk was unable to break his grip. Sandman>Wonder Man>Thor=Hulk?

Not only did Thor win against Wonder Man, and would be considered stronger than him when you look at their other feats, but that took place in 1987. At which time Thor was suffering from Hel's curse.

Originally posted by curryman
This is a lie.



Not only did Thor win against Wonder Man, and would be considered stronger than him when you look at their other feats, but that took place in 1987. At which time Thor was suffering from Hel's curse.
Name any other writer who did that.

Thanks to mjolnir. Thor IS stronger than simon just not under Englehart.

I don't remember that. Hela's curse didn't reduce Thor's strength though.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Name any other writer who did that.

Bruce Jones.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Thanks to mjolnir. Thor IS stronger than simon just not under Englehart.

I don't remember that. Hela's curse didn't reduce Thor's strength though.

None of his injuries would heal though, he couldn't recover from anything. He was wearing that beard because his face was hideously scarred.

Originally posted by curryman
Bruce Jones. When did he wrote anything like Mantlo? Anyhow PAD retconned all of that shitty run.



His strength wasn't reduced. That's all that matters here.

Originally posted by abhilegend
When did he wrote anything like Mantlo? Anyhow PAD retconned all of that shitty run.
When? His Incredible Hulk run.
Originally posted by abhilegend
His strength wasn't reduced. That's all that matters here.
Why wouldn't broken bones affect his strength?

Why is Wonder Man stronger? Thor was laying on top of him with both hands on Mjolnir and Simon punched him back. He doesn't need to be stronger than Thor to knock him on his ass. He just needs to be strong enough to knock Thor back.

Originally posted by curryman
When? His Incredible Hulk run.

Why wouldn't broken bones affect his strength?

Why is Wonder Man stronger? Thor was laying on top of him with both hands on Mjolnir and Simon punched him back. He doesn't need to be stronger than Thor to knock him on his ass. He just needs to be strong enough to knock Thor back.
I don't remember any such instance. Scans or issue number?

Because it didn't. Also simon overpowered thor in a direct contest of strength. Thor was actively pressing simon down and got thrown off of simon. Its a blatant nod to simon being stronger.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Because it didn't. Also simon overpowered thor in a direct contest of strength. Thor was actively pressing simon down and got thrown off of simon. Its a blatant nod to simon being stronger.

It's a very good showing for Simon.

What direct contest of strength?

Originally posted by abhilegend
I don't remember any such instance. Scans or issue number?

#54 and #59?

Originally posted by curryman
It's a very good showing for Simon.

What direct contest of strength?



#54 and #59?
Grappling like that is a direct contest of strength.

Thanks. I'll check them out.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Grappling like that is a direct contest of strength.
He won a grapple against someone wielding a hammer
Originally posted by abhilegend
Thanks. I'll check them out.
It's the ending of the arc with Abomination's wife.

Originally posted by curryman
He won a grapple against someone wielding a hammer

It's the ending of the arc with Abomination's wife.
Who was actively pressing down on him. Englehart also had Aarkon say that Wondy hits harder than thor.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Who was actively pressing down on him. Englehart also had Aarkon say that Wondy hits harder than thor.

That's great.

Glad we're only following one writer's 3-4 year run and letting that determine just about everything in regards to Thor's 50 years.

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e139/RageOfTheGod/Thor/ThorAboveWonderManMissMarvel1.jpg

http://s38.photobucket.com/user/RageOfTheGod/media/Thor/ThorAboveWonderManMissMarvel2.jpg.html

Thor is stronger than Wonder man.

Simon isn't stronger than Thor. Simon pushing Thor away from him doesn't equate to him "overpowering" Thor.

Originally posted by Damborgson
That doesn't prove a 10X amp. Thor after getting rocked by Kurse proceeded to slap him around after. He must've increased his strength 8x over. thor has exotic powers were as hulk uses pure strength.

Also it was stated by hulk that he became 10x stronger, not just something i thought happened

Originally posted by deathlife
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e139/RageOfTheGod/Thor/ThorAboveWonderManMissMarvel1.jpg

http://s38.photobucket.com/user/RageOfTheGod/media/Thor/ThorAboveWonderManMissMarvel2.jpg.html

Thor is stronger than Wonder man. In other news, the sky is blue.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Not the way you describe it. Hulk didn't get very strong when he was angry under Englehart. Hulk was class 90 at calm state in those days. Only an angry hulk was class 100.

It wasn't a cheap shot. Simon directly overpowered thor.
http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/745/thor229cd5qs.jpg

http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/3295/thor235ni5oo.jpg

That's what define characters in superman class. Wait till you see superman twoshotting a creature with the powers of superman, captain marvel, j'onn, aquaman and elongated man.


Not true either.

In a handbook. Lol. Did you know Odin is class 65?

The wrecker most certainly did cheap shot Hulk. That was the point.

That Thor was weakened anyway. The beard was to hide the scar he had on his face that wouldn't heal from Hela's curse iirc.

Even if that weren't the case, so what? It was a good showing for Simon who was then one shot. Yipee.

That feat defines Thor well also. It goes both ways.

Yes it is. That's not something someone can sanely disagree with lol.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Do you have ANYTHING of value to said or just randomly shout lowballing?
da fuk? u've been known to pick and choose what suits ure argument. Pretty sure ure quite aware of those scans from Deathlife since I know how u love to scour for scans over the internet (for lowballing purposes of course).

And..
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Simon isn't stronger than Thor. Simon pushing Thor away from him doesn't equate to him "overpowering" Thor. ...anyway

Originally posted by curryman
That's great.

Glad we're only following one writer's 3-4 year run and letting that determine just about everything in regards to Thor's 50 years.
I've already said thor IS stronger than simon just not under Englehart. Why is that so hard to understand.Originally posted by deathlife
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e139/RageOfTheGod/Thor/ThorAboveWonderManMissMarvel1.jpg

http://s38.photobucket.com/user/RageOfTheGod/media/Thor/ThorAboveWonderManMissMarvel2.jpg.html

Thor is stronger than Wonder man.
That was before Englehart.Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Simon isn't stronger than Thor. Simon pushing Thor away from him doesn't equate to him "overpowering" Thor.
He isn't. Under Englehart, he was though. Simon pushed Thor from a bad leverage in a direct contest of strength. That's overpowering.

Originally posted by Damborgson
In a handbook. Lol. Did you know Odin is class 65?

The wrecker most certainly did cheap shot Hulk. That was the point.

That Thor was weakened anyway. The beard was to hide the scar he had on his face that wouldn't heal from Hela's curse iirc.

Even if that weren't the case, so what? It was a good showing for Simon who was then one shot. Yipee.

That feat defines Thor well also. It goes both ways.

Yes it is. That's not something someone can sanely disagree with lol. Not from a handbook. Hulk was given a drug that made him unable to get angry and he stalemated a class 90 being.

Wrecker most certainly didn't cheapshot hulk. Gimme a minute.

Excuses, excuses and more excuses. Thor wasn't weakened, his bones were brittle. Also Thor using mjolnir to oneshot simon means nothing in comparison to strength level.
Ok.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
da fuk? u've been known to pick and choose what suits ure argument. Pretty sure ure quite aware of those scans from Deathlife since I know how u love to scour for scans over the internet (for lowballing purposes of course).

And..
...anyway This is like accusing somebody of lowballing superman if he says Alex Ross portrayed Cap as more powerful than him. Shut up.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Not from a handbook. Hulk was given a drug that made him unable to get angry and he stalemated a class 90 being.

Wrecker most certainly didn't cheapshot hulk. Gimme a minute.

Excuses, excuses and more excuses. Thor wasn't weakened, his bones were brittle. Also Thor using mjolnir to oneshot simon means nothing in comparison to strength level.
Ok.

That classification is handbook. And even then, he was plenty angry against Thor.

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/Defenders_019_04.jpg

That's a cheap shot. He got slammed before he even had any idea a fight was going to happen, which makes a tremendous difference in a fight.

It's context really, not excuses. That's a form weakness. Brittle bones don't give the same strength and he couldn't heal in addition to that iirc. I might be getting my arcs mixed up.

Originally posted by Damborgson
That classification is handbook. And even then, he was plenty angry against Thor.

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/Defenders_019_04.jpg

That's a cheap shot. He got slammed before he even had any idea a fight was going to happen, which makes a tremendous difference in a fight.

It's context really, not excuses. That's a form weakness. Brittle bones don't give the same strength and he couldn't heal in addition to that iirc. I might be getting my arcs mixed up.
Actually savage hulk is class 70 by handbooks in calm state. I'm talking from an on panel description.

That's nnt a cheap shot dambo.

Thor's strength was intact. There was no mention of him being weaker than usual.

I hope you guys aren't using handbooks to contradict panel showings.

No sir.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Actually savage hulk is class 70 by handbooks in calm state. I'm talking from an on panel description.

That's nnt a cheap shot dambo.

Thor's strength was intact. There was no mention of him being weaker than usual.

In some. Handbooks have always been all over the place.

Abhi, yes it is. Facing the Wrecker still qualifies as a cheap shot under the circumstances..

There doesn't have to be though really. It's part of the weakness afflicting him.

So do we agree that Thor got a hell of a strength feat by matching Hulk's increasing strength for an hour, or shall we go our separate ways with the subject?

Doesn't Abby call the Thor/Abom one shot a cheapshot?

Anyway...

Black Adam one punches Thor's head off.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Doesn't Abby call the Thor/Abom one shot a cheapshot?



https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-gHqEGqghPNA/UP9pTMwoVEI/AAAAAAAAHow/Vn2oYpX_twk/sigh.gif

Originally posted by Damborgson
In some. Handbooks have always been all over the place.

Abhi, yes it is. Facing the Wrecker still qualifies as a cheap shot under the circumstances..

There doesn't have to be though really. It's part of the weakness afflicting him.

So do we agree that Thor got a hell of a strength feat by matching Hulk's increasing strength for an hour, or shall we go our separate ways with the subject? I'm sure no handbook listed hulk as 90 tonner.

No, it isn't. Wrecker announced he was attacking defenders and attacks in front of hulk.

Not really. Thor's bones were brittle, his strength was intact.

Its a hell of a strength feat but as per Englehart's writing there is little evidence that hulk was past Thor when they were seperated. Englehart recently stated that when he wrote that scene, he didn't have the dynamic nature of hulk's strength in mind or something like that.

@bran, that was indeed a cheapshot.

Originally posted by abhilegend
I'm sure no handbook listed hulk as 90 tonner.

No, it isn't. Wrecker announced he was attacking defenders and attacks in front of hulk.

Not really. Thor's bones were brittle, his strength was intact.

Its a hell of a strength feat but as per Englehart's writing there is little evidence that hulk was past Thor when they were seperated. Englehart recently stated that when he wrote that scene, he didn't have the dynamic nature of hulk's strength in mind or something like that.

@bran, that was indeed a cheapshot.

Ever? Bold. Wish I had the scans on hand to show you in a calm state he was in the 90ish range back in the day.

so? If someone says to you "Time to kick your ass!" while you were previously being helped by them, you're still off guard and still not ready for combat. Just like Hulk was.

Brittle bones =/= intact strength. They go along with each other.

sure was

Link?

It's hulk's powerset though. The madder he gets, the stronger he gets. That doesn't get to go away.

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/8/81429/1707046-1559667_thorstrength17178_super_super.jpg

That's no cheap shot if Hulk's scene wasn't a cheap shot.

Originally posted by Damborgson
Ever? Bold. Wish I had the scans on hand to show you in a calm state he was in the 90ish range back in the day.

so? If someone says to you "Time to kick your ass!" while you were previously being helped by them, you're still off guard and still not ready for combat. Just like Hulk was.

Brittle bones =/= intact strength. They go along with each other.

sure was

Link?

It's hulk's powerset though. The madder he gets, the stronger he gets. That doesn't get to go away.

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/8/81429/1707046-1559667_thorstrength17178_super_super.jpg

That's no cheap shot if Hulk's scene wasn't a cheap shot. Ok. I'll wait.

Hulk had time to adjust. 10 seconds is quite a large gape in a fight. Thor snuck up on abom IIRC.

Not quite. Thor's strength was intact as noted against Blockbuster.

All that scene suggest that hulk started weaker than thor and even after an hour of amping didn't got past thor in strength if we take your stance. Its not that uncommon for hulk to amp extremly slowly. Rhino stalemated him for days in a fist fight while hulk was getting angry. Doc Samson fought Mindless Hulk for six hours straight while hulk was getting stronger.
I would look for Englehart interview.

Originally posted by abhilegend
I've already said thor IS stronger than simon just not under Englehart. Why is that so hard to understand.
That was before Englehart.
He isn't. Under Englehart, he was though. Simon pushed Thor from a bad leverage in a direct contest of strength. That's overpowering.

What's with "Englehart" in these posts?

He didn't create nor define these characters power levels, so why is his POV suddenly so important here?

Surely it can't supersede on-panel depictions of power levels for more than 50 years?

Originally posted by abhilegend
Ok. I'll wait.

Hulk had time to adjust. 10 seconds is quite a large gape in a fight. Thor snuck up on abom IIRC.

Not quite. Thor's strength was intact as noted against Blockbuster.

All that scene suggest that hulk started weaker than thor and even after an hour of amping didn't got past thor in strength if we take your stance. Its not that uncommon for hulk to amp extremly slowly. Rhino stalemated him for days in a fist fight while hulk was getting angry. Doc Samson fought Mindless Hulk for six hours straight while hulk was getting stronger.
I would look for Englehart interview.

10 seconds is the amount of time the fight lasted before everyone was out and done. Hulk was struck from the get go.

You can't have one without the other. Thor's strength wasn't directly affected by the curse, but it was affected none the less due to the nature of the curse. Brittle bones like the ones Thor had can only reduce strength.

Taking into consideration Hulk's powerset and how he's defined, it suggests that despite amping, Thor was able to hold Hulk in place. Espeically considering the circumstances where the Hulk's just been called the weaker of two and is itching to prove he's stronger is what makes the feat what it is.

IIRC, Thor had to wear special armor to protect him during his days with the curse.

If that didn't reduce his strength, it should at least mean reduced damage soak; and damage soak is typically one of Thor's best fight attributes.

Anyway BA and Thor are capable of winning both rounds but...

1) BA for the majority
2) Thor for the majority

Originally posted by Eel O'Brien
IIRC, Thor had to wear special armor to protect him during his days with the curse.

If that didn't reduce his strength, it should at least mean reduced damage soak; and damage soak is typically one of Thor's best fight attributes.

Anyway BA and Thor are capable of winning both rounds but...

1) BA for the majority
2) Thor for the majority

It doesn't have any real bearing on this fight but the armour cursed Thor worn was the golden one, which he did not have against Simon. And it was pretty much the only thing keeping him from just completely crumbling together near the end

I agree with your outcome, tho I think the fights might be a bit more uneven.

Originally posted by curryman
I agree with your outcome, tho I think the fights might be a bit more uneven.

Uneven in what way?

Originally posted by abhilegend
Thor's strength was intact. There was no mention of him being weaker than usual.

Not true. For example right before his fight with the Midgard Serpent, it was stated he was weaker than ever. His diminished might due to brittle bones was also noted in that Olympus arc IIRC.

Was this around the same time that Thor went through the whole mutant massacre thing? I remember him being weakened during that.

Originally posted by deathlife
What's with "Englehart" in these posts?

He didn't create nor define these characters power levels, so why is his POV suddenly so important here?

Surely it can't supersede on-panel depictions of power levels for more than 50 years? Simon has always been considered one of the strongest beings on Earth. There was never really any showings to suggest that Thor was stronger in direct confrontation. Sure Thor has greater strength feats outside their confrontations but those feats are small in density of Thor's career. Normally Simon should be a peer of Thor physically if not slightly greater.

I could use the argument that Superman is a lot stronger than CM because of outside feats.

IMO, I always viewed Simon as stronger since I was a little kid. Thor has him hammer to offset that advantage though.

Just stop.

Wonder Man isn't stronger than Thor.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Wonder Man isn't stronger than Thor. WM in direct confrontation is at least equal. In outside feats he isn't.

It depends on which do you value most. Direct confrontations or outside feats or both. Superman's outside feats are greater than CM's but they are considered near equals in the physical department because of direct confrontations.

I take both in to account. Simon's good, but it's like comparing Wonder Woman and Superman at times, imo.

Originally posted by Eel O'Brien
Uneven in what way?

That BA wins 1 pretty hard and Thor the 2nd.

Still think Black Adam hits harder than Thor, Even with the hammer.

I dont see thor even budging SBP, or survive getting punched across the universe back to his dimension by SBP either

I dont see thor wrecking a wonder woman level being at 1/3 strength either

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
Still think Black Adam hits harder than Thor, Even with the hammer.

I dont see thor even budging SBP, or survive getting punched across the universe back to his dimension by SBP either SBP didn't actually punch him across the universe. He just punched him away from Alexander Luthor's Anti-Monitor tower. If you weren't in close enough proximity to it, you were forced back to your home universe.

Oh

Originally posted by Damborgson
10 seconds is the amount of time the fight lasted before everyone was out and done. Hulk was struck from the get go.

You can't have one without the other. Thor's strength wasn't directly affected by the curse, but it was affected none the less due to the nature of the curse. Brittle bones like the ones Thor had can only reduce strength.

Taking into consideration Hulk's powerset and how he's defined, it suggests that despite amping, Thor was able to hold Hulk in place. Espeically considering the circumstances where the Hulk's just been called the weaker of two and is itching to prove he's stronger is what makes the feat what it is.
He was struck after Strange was out. Read the page again.

It was affected when the injuries were too severe but not initially.

So, either hulk was amping too slowly or thor has a dynamic strength too. Or do you think that hulk was already thor's level and was getting vastly stronger but thor could stalemate with his original strength while being vastly weaker? You can't have it both ways.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Not true. For example right before his fight with the Midgard Serpent, it was stated he was weaker than ever. His diminished might due to brittle bones was also noted in that Olympus arc IIRC.
That was way later and the injuries were taking its toll. It was never mentioned in WCA annual though.

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
Still think Black Adam hits harder than Thor, Even with the hammer.

I dont see thor even budging SBP, or survive getting punched across the universe back to his dimension by SBP either

I dont see thor wrecking a wonder woman level being at 1/3 strength either

Considering the people he's budged, he'd definitely budge Prime, magic "immunity" or no.

Originally posted by abhilegend
He was struck after Strange was out. Read the page again.

It was affected when the injuries were too severe but not initially.

So, either hulk was amping too slowly or thor has a dynamic strength too. Or do you think that hulk was already thor's level and was getting vastly stronger but thor could stalemate with his original strength while being vastly weaker? You can't have it both ways.

Doesn't mean much to be honest. Strange was struck first, but everyone there got shots they were simply not expecting.

Brittle bones guarantees weakness though. They go hand in hand.

I think Hulk was amping, and Thor managed to hold him. /shrug the fact that he was amping is what makes the feat.

Originally posted by Damborgson
Doesn't mean much to be honest. Strange was struck first, but everyone there got shots they were simply not expecting.

Brittle bones guarantees weakness though. They go hand in hand.

I think Hulk was amping, and Thor managed to hold him. /shrug the fact that he was amping is what makes the feat.
Not really. Hulk saw it coming.

Not in this case. Thor wasn't said to be weakened.

That only proves hulk was amping very slowly and was still just as strong as thor. Thor stalemated a thor level hulk, awesome!

Originally posted by abhilegend
Not really. Hulk saw it coming.

Not in this case. Thor wasn't said to be weakened.

That only proves hulk was amping very slowly and was still just as strong as thor. Thor stalemated a thor level hulk, awesome!

Prove it. Because the scan is fairly obvious in its intention, it was a sudden unexpected attack that the team wasn't ready to handle. Before any sign that would suggest the crew was going to attack no less.

He doesn't have to be. When his bones are brittle, he doesn't possess the same amount of strength. That's just how it goes.

Thor stalemated an already class 100 hulk amping his strength. It's ridiculous and doesn't have to make the most sense in the world.

Originally posted by Damborgson
Prove it. Because the scan is fairly obvious in its intention, it was a sudden unexpected attack that the team wasn't ready to handle. Before any sign that would suggest the crew was going to attack no less.

He doesn't have to be. When his bones are brittle, he doesn't possess the same amount of strength. That's just how it goes.

Thor stalemated an already class 100 hulk amping his strength. It's ridiculous and doesn't have to make the most sense in the world.
Prove that hulk saw it coming? Lawl. Nowhere was it said, you're reading between lines.

Thor was indeed as strong as usual as noted against blockbuster.

Thor stalemated Hulk at his level of strength, just like Rhino did. That's just the nature of hulk's strength. Adam oneshotted a high class 100 being by a thunderclap at 1/3 of strength and ripped amazo's head off. I don't see thor doing either.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Prove that hulk saw it coming? Lawl. Nowhere was it said, you're reading between lines.

Thor was indeed as strong as usual as noted against blockbuster.

Thor stalemated Hulk at his level of strength, just like Rhino did. That's just the nature of hulk's strength. Adam oneshotted a high class 100 being by a thunderclap at 1/3 of strength and ripped amazo's head off. I don't see thor doing either.

So he didn't see it coming then. Works for me There's just more to go with for him being caught off guard than him not being.

Brittle bones guarantee a loss of strength though.

Rhino stalemated him in a fight. One of the highest feats of his entire career.

Thor locked arms for an hour against a guy who's strength increases with his anger. That's something I don't personally see Adam doing either. It's something I wouldn't have seen Thor doing either had he not done so anyway. Just like I wouldn't have seen Adam take powergirl out by clapping his hands at 1/3 strength till he did it. It's the things go I guess.

Amazo's durability isn't anything to write home about.

That amazo had at least WW and a GL's power. You think Thor can rip the head off of WW with GL ring?

Amazos have been damaged by phucking Batarangs, man.

And for the record, I don't think Black Adam could rip off Wonder Woman's head, either, let alone Diana with a power ring.

Black Adam tears Thor's head off and then eats it

Originally posted by abhilegend
No, it isn't asinine. Thor is in the strength class of wonder woman, not superman. He doesn't have feats to support your stance.

This nonsense should stop. Thor IS in the same strength class as Superman/CM/BA/Hulk etc.

I see it from a scale of 1 to 10, Wonderwoman is a 9 while Thor/Superman/Hulk/BA/CM are 10s.

But then again, there's low 10, low mid 10, mid 10, high mid 10, low high 10 etc...

Thor would be low to mid mid 10 while Superman would be high high 10.

Or I could put it in terms of guns, wonderwoman is a MP3, Thor/Superman would be rifles but Thor would be an assault rifle like an M16 or AK47 while Superman would be one of those massive sniper rifles that can bust through walls.

Originally posted by Damborgson
So he didn't see it coming then. Works for me There's just more to go with for him being caught off guard than him not being.

Brittle bones guarantee a loss of strength though.

Rhino stalemated him in a fight. One of the highest feats of his entire career.

Thor locked arms for an hour against a guy who's strength increases with his anger. That's something I don't personally see Adam doing either. It's something I wouldn't have seen Thor doing either had he not done so anyway. Just like I wouldn't have seen Adam take powergirl out by clapping his hands at 1/3 strength till he did it. It's the things go I guess.
Wrecker attacked hulk in his face. Hulk not seeing it is laughable.

I would've to go on scan hunting now, it seems.

Just like stalemating hulk is the best strength feat thor has. Its an outlier which he has never repeated, current thor can dream about it.

I see Adam doing it on sheer badassery. The guy fought nearly every superhero on DCU and never lost. Not even WWH has done that.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Amazos have been damaged by phucking Batarangs, man.

And for the record, I don't think Black Adam could rip off Wonder Woman's head, either, let alone Diana with a power ring. That Amazo one shotted hyper durable Firestorm... with a cheapshot but still

With the absolute ease on which he treats WW's equal in strength PG and also Alan, it's not out of the realm of possibility.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Amazos have been damaged by phucking Batarangs, man.

And for the record, I don't think Black Adam could rip off Wonder Woman's head, either, let alone Diana with a power ring.
A prototype and damaged Amazo. Amazo duplicates powers, its asinine to think he doesn't duplicates durability.

Originally posted by abhilegend
A prototype and damaged Amazo. Amazo duplicates powers, its asinine to think he doesn't duplicates durability.

It's asinine to think Teth could literally decapitate Diana.

Originally posted by gogogadgetgo
This nonsense should stop. Thor IS in the same strength class as Superman/CM/BA/Hulk etc.

I see it from a scale of 1 to 10, Wonderwoman is a 9 while Thor/Superman/Hulk/BA/CM are 10s.

But then again, there's low 10, low mid 10, mid 10, high mid 10, low high 10 etc...

Thor would be low to mid mid 10 while Superman would be high high 10.

Or I could put it in terms of guns, wonderwoman is a MP3, Thor/Superman would be rifles but Thor would be an assault rifle like an M16 or AK47 while Superman would be one of those massive sniper rifles that can bust through walls.
Superman utterly stomps Thor in strength feats. Its not even close.

It's painfully obvious the writer/artist intent on that scene. Strange's group was taken by surprise. It's just stooped to accept otherwise.

Originally posted by deathlife
What's with "Englehart" in these posts?

He didn't create nor define these characters power levels, so why is his POV suddenly so important here?

Surely it can't supersede on-panel depictions of power levels for more than 50 years? Truth.
There will always be ups and downs through different writers, but characters generally remain intact unless specifically stated otherwise(ie. clear upgrade or amp).

I don't know where all these other extrapolations are coming from. Hulk even savage is top tier strength. He was stalemated (for an hour) by another top tier strength. Simple as that.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Amazo's durability isn't anything to write home about.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
It's asinine to think Teth could literally decapitate Diana.
He's already done to a more powerful being with diana's powers. Mongul decapitated Mongal with a backhand and she was stronger than PG. I don't think adam is weaker than mongul.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Truth.
There will always be ups and downs through different writers, but characters generally remain intact unless specifically stated otherwise(ie. clear upgrade or amp).

I don't know where all these other extrapolations are coming from, Hulk even savage is top tier strength. He was stalemated (for an hour) by another top tier strength. Simple as that.



Exactly.

A lot of mental gymnastics at play here.

Thor stalemated an enraged Hulk whose strength was increasing.

End of.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
It's asinine to think Teth could literally decapitate Diana. He tore apart Spectre's face, tore apart the 4 Horsemen

Among other things. He would tear her head off so clean, it'd look like Wolverine sliced her head off.

Jesus guys, no one thinks Diana is more of a **** then I do but decapitate her? What the f*ck?

Even when she gets beat up by Superman, she's still taking hits from an-all out version of Kal-El and lives.

For all this talk how comics work and shit, people seem to have the inability to understand how Amazo being a random robot differentiates from Black Adam fighting Wonder Woman.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
He tore apart Spectre's face, tore apart the 4 Horsemen

Among other things. He would tear her head off so clean, it'd look like Wolverine sliced her head off.

Spectre's made out of ectoplasmic jizz. Not exactly the most durable material in the universe. The Four Horsemen don't have nearly the catalogue of feats Diana has, either.

I don't doubt Teth could beat up Diana something fierce and even break some bones, but ripping her head off is out of the question.

Btw, Thor tossing Kurse like he did takes a dumb on Black Adam knocking out Power Girl, even a 1/3 as strong.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
He tore apart Spectre's face, tore apart the 4 Horsemen

Among other things. He would tear her head off so clean, it'd look like Wolverine sliced her head off.


That's comics though.

I remember Thor pulverizing the World Serpent (and his own body) will a mjolnir strike. That doesn't necessarily mean that a fully charged mjolnir strike will pulverize other high heralds in comics like The Hulk.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Jesus guys, no one thinks Diana is more of a **** then I do but decapitate her? What the f*ck?

Even when she gets beat up by Superman, she's still taking hits from an-all out version of Kal-El and lives.

For all this talk how comics work and shit, people seem to have the inability to understand how Amazo being a random robot differentiates from Black Adam fighting Wonder Woman. Black Adam isn't Superman broski.

Black Adam:
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/Black%20Adam/BlackAdam08.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/Black%20Adam/BlackAdam09.jpg


PC Superman:
http://s160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Precrisis/?action=view&current=supermanvsspectre.jpg
http://s160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Precrisis/?action=view&current=supermanvsspectre1.jpg
http://s160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Precrisis/?action=view&current=supermanvsspectre2.jpg
http://s160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Precrisis/?action=view&current=supermanvsspectre3.jpg

Threads needs more Batkick.

Originally posted by abhilegend
That was way later and the injuries were taking its toll. It was never mentioned in WCA annual though.

Just to be clear. You argued the curse had no effect on Thor's might and yet when I reference a seen where it was explicitly stated he was weakened, it doesn't count because he had deteriorated too much from the curse?

I should read the entire thread, probably more lol worthy arguments.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Black Adam isn't Superman broski.

Black Adam:
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/Black%20Adam/BlackAdam08.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/Black%20Adam/BlackAdam09.jpg


PC Superman:
http://s160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Precrisis/?action=view&current=supermanvsspectre.jpg
http://s160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Precrisis/?action=view&current=supermanvsspectre1.jpg
http://s160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Precrisis/?action=view&current=supermanvsspectre2.jpg
http://s160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Precrisis/?action=view&current=supermanvsspectre3.jpg

I never noticed but did Hawkman draw blood from Spectre with that spear? I know it was a "spiritual, physical damage doesn't do anything" type of portrayal, but kind of weak.

He started bleeding because he sensed impending Adam coming

Spectre allowed it because Black Adam needs a glimmer of hope in his life

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
He started bleeding because he sensed impending Adam coming

Nah, that was his vagina. Hawkman or whatever weird bird f*ck that is drew blood there.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Just to be clear. You argued the curse had no effect on Thor's might and yet when I reference a seen where it was explicitly stated he was weakened, it doesn't count because he had deteriorated too much from the curse?

I should read the entire thread, probably more lol worthy arguments.
The curse hadn't reduced his strength but the accumulated injuries did. Surely not even you are this dumb. Also that was northwind who drew blood from spectre.