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i think the timing is just right for such a poll.

for the sake of the nonspoiled, i will list ramsey snow/bolton, theon's torturer and castrator as "reek's master"

additions to the list may or may not express my opinion on the matter, but if i left anyone out, let me know.

so who do you hate most?

How the **** could you omit Ser Gregor Clegane?

because i didnt think he had a fair shot considering the tv-only crowd.

i could petition to have him added

**** the TV-only crowd though.

Within the books, there is no more morally repugnant and evil character.

Roose Bolton, Reek's master, Joffrey? He surpasses them all.

Eh, I'd say the Boltons are worse. Yes, Gregor goes around raping and killing but so too do the Boltons. The difference is they are clever about it, which makes them all the worse. Furthermore, the Boltons take a sick pleasure in torture and the breaking of people as seen with Theon.

No, the difference is that there is a humanity in them that Ser Gregor lacks.

Roose? Has goals, ambitions, interests and coolshit beyond being a sick ****.

Ramsay? The child of rape, forced to squat in squalor for his childhood. He has the human quality of fear, despite what Roose believes. Ramsay's fear of Roose is a humanizing quality, as is his queer, twisted affection for his Reek. He also has some form of pride in his name, the reminder that he is, in fact, a bastard drives him to rage, and he does want to inherit his father's name.

What of the Mountain? Ser Gregor wants for nothing, he has no grand ambition, he just sits in his keep save for a tournament or wartime. And how does he pass the time there? Systematically serial killing the populace, solely because he can. He disfigured his younger brother in an attempt to kill him over a toy he never cared for. He killed his sister... I dunno, just cause? Same for his father. There was no motive there, his dad treated him very well, and Gregor was going to gain daddy's mantle when he became a man-grown. He's killed something like three wives. He takes sick pleasure in the torture and rape of the innocent.

However, those actions are not really enough to raise the Mountain above the Boltons in depravity. What is, however, is the inhumanity inherent in how he goes about doing it. The Boltons? They have fears, wants, prides, and even things they care about. Roose even doesn't believe in kinslaying IIRC (And we know how Ser Gregor feels about that).

The Mountain? He fears nothing. He will charge a pike-line of men by himself, and he will break it. He will attempt to murder Ser Loras after unhorsing him, in full view of the king himself, and then turn on his brother for defending him.

What of wants, of interests beyond the atrocities committed? Gregor has none. Think back. When he isn't pillaging, raping, or murdering, he is so quiet, so unmoving, as to only be part of the scenery. Indeed, evil comes naturally to him, more than any other character in the series. Think back to Arya's observations in Clash of Kings. The Mountain swats people dead like flies, but half the time, he barely seems to notice the people he kills, or that he does it. Then think of Storm of Swords, before his fight with Oberyn Martell. "You killed Elia of Dorne." "Who?" That's right. Gregor Clegane crushing of the infant prince's skull between his fingers, then raping and murdering its mother, with the child's brain matter and blood still lathering his hands, the act that made Ser Gregor Clegane the most feared knight in Westeros, was so mundane and meaningless to him that he can't actually recall doing it. It was Tuesday for him.

Ser Gregor Clegane is unbound by any inhibitions, moral, practical, or emotional. He does what he wants, when he wants, and you never know what he is going to do. Only that it will be as abhorrent as possible.

So where's the vs?

Originally posted by ares834
Furthermore, the Boltons take a sick pleasure in torture and the breaking of people as seen with Theon.

very true. what happened to theon was the equivalent of just another day on the job for roose.

Originally posted by ArtificialGlory
So where's the vs?

call it a scumbag-battle if you must. *shrug*

Originally posted by NemeBro

Within the books, there is no more morally repugnant and evil character.

i dont know if i agree that he's THE worst, but i do agree enough to see if i can have him added.

you sold me with:

Originally posted by NemeBro
Then think of Storm of Swords, before his fight with Oberyn Martell. "You killed Elia of Dorne." "Who?" That's right. Gregor Clegane crushing of the infant prince's skull between his fingers, then raping and murdering its mother, with the child's brain matter and blood still lathering his hands, the act that made Ser Gregor Clegane the most feared knight in Westeros, was so mundane and meaningless to him that he can't actually recall doing it. It was Tuesday for him.

Originally posted by NemeBro
No, the difference is that there is a humanity in them that Ser Gregor lacks.

Roose? Has goals, ambitions, interests and coolshit beyond being a sick ****.

Ironically, that's why I find Roose and Ramsey to be even worse than Gregor. The fact that they can perform these kind of twisted actions (some of which are the worst we see in the series) just for the pleasure of it while still retaining a shred of humanity is what truly chills me. Yes, Gregor is the bigger monster, but I find the Boltons to be all the more twisted and evil because they are not just savage animals.

That said... I don't think Ser Gregor will really win most of the "most hated" competitions, despite his horrible and monstrous behavior, for a couple reasons.

1. Exposure. He simply doesn't show up as much as guys like Roose, Reek's Master, Joffrey, or Tywin. He's an antagonist, but no big bad.

2. Joffrey from my experience tends to top most hated polls, in lieu of funny guys like the Mountain. I think the reason for that is because, as horrible and depraved as Ser Gregor is, he is not pathetic, weak, or cowardly. He doesn't have the subtlety for backstabbing or going against his word (Indeed, he'd never give you it), so he doesn't get the same hate Theon and Joffrey do for that. He is completely fearless, one thing you certainly can not call the Mountain is a coward, entirely unlike Joffrey. He isn't smug, he barely speaks and never actually talks about how cool and smart and awesome he is, his reputation speaks for itself, unlike characters like Cersei or Joffrey who think they are way better than they are.

I can't hate Ser Gregor Clegane. He's my favorite character, lol.

I ****ing despise Joffrey though, he's such a spineless little shit. I acknowledge that he isn't really as horrible a person as the Mountain or the Boltons, but he's such a ****ing douchebag. Also he killed mah nigga Ned.

Can Gregor even be considered anymore since after his death, he became an entirely different person?

Originally posted by KingD19
Can Gregor even be considered anymore since after his death, he became an entirely different person?

Why does that even matter? He hasn't done anything since he became Frankenstein.

Because...I'm high right now and it seemed important at the time.

The poll has been edited per request.

Gregor gets my vote. With Barry getting a close second. That dude is so ****ed up.

Actually it could go either way to me, thinking back on all the stuff Ramsay gets up to. He really might be more monstrous than Gregor. But then again, Gregor is the guy who raped an inn keepers daughter and killed the son when he tried to help, in full view of the dad, flipped him a coin and then asked for change.

Originally posted by Impediment
The poll has been edited per request.

thank you

i vote for cersei. i'll do my best to try to explain why


she's a fraud as well as a scumbag, which imho greatly enhances her scumbagginess.

her whole legacy seems to be triumphing vicariously through her father's victories and convincing herself that she is every bit the brilliant tactician he is. on and on about how she should have been born with a penis and that she was the only worthy child, when in fact she was the family idiot and always threatening to destroy the lannisters with her every single ridiculous bumbling. she has not done a single thing to advance her family besides procreating with the king, and she managed to botch all that too. and why did she f*** her brother? for love? well turns out she never gave much of a shit about jamie, so she cant even claim that bastardized virtue. well doesnt matter since she managed to rob tywin of an heir, jamie of his birthright, and even robbed herself of jamie when she talked him into being a kings guard. she ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS fails at whatever she does, and every time manages to convince herself that it was everyone elses fault and not hers.

she also created the c**tboy joffrey. not just by giving birth, but by ruining and corrupting him, as lord tywin well knew and tried to prevent for her other son by removing him from kings landing. so really imho a vote for joff is just an extended vote for cercei.

as for the other scumbags, they all have one thing in common:
they're cunning, driven by purpose and are excellent at the brutality they do.
cersei has no purpose other than to stroke her own ego and take petty delight in tormenting others.

I went with Reek's Master, 'cos he's one sick bastard.

Joffrey.

Guy has never gone without yet enjoys having whores assrape each other with massive candle holders, shoots cats and whores for fun with a crossbow, has an idiot woman-child routinely beaten for fun, threatens an idiot woman-child with assisted rape on her wedding night, tried to have a child in a coma killed and ordered his men to slaughter crowds of starving women and children; all this before his 18th birthday.

Dude, spoiler the child in a coma part.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Dude, spoiler the child in a coma part.

Ah, thanks. Edited it.

Originally posted by NemeBro
That said... I don't think Ser Gregor will really win most of the "most hated" competitions, despite his horrible and monstrous behavior, for a couple reasons.

1. Exposure. He simply doesn't show up as much as guys like Roose, Reek's Master, Joffrey, or Tywin. He's an antagonist, but no big bad.

2. Joffrey from my experience tends to top most hated polls, in lieu of funny guys like the Mountain. I think the reason for that is because, as horrible and depraved as Ser Gregor is, he is not pathetic, weak, or cowardly. He doesn't have the subtlety for backstabbing or going against his word (Indeed, he'd never give you it), so he doesn't get the same hate Theon and Joffrey do for that. He is completely fearless, one thing you certainly can not call the Mountain is a coward, entirely unlike Joffrey. He isn't smug, he barely speaks and never actually talks about how cool and smart and awesome he is, his reputation speaks for itself, unlike characters like Cersei or Joffrey who think they are way better than they are.

I can't hate Ser Gregor Clegane. He's my favorite character, lol.

I ****ing despise Joffrey though, he's such a spineless little shit. I acknowledge that he isn't really as horrible a person as the Mountain or the Boltons, but he's such a ****ing douchebag. Also he killed mah nigga Ned.

They also made Joffrey much worse on the show--an appropriate change since he is only about 13 in the books.

He's a bit more overt in the show, but only a little worse maybe. In the books theres a great scene where people are starving outside the red keep, so he shoots them with his stupid crossbow and yells that they can eat their dead. Kids messed up.

The show really plays him up as a budding serial killer though.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Dude, spoiler the child in a coma part.

typical robtard.

Originally posted by asdf83
They also made Joffrey much worse on the show--an appropriate change since he is only about 13 in the books.

No they didn't.

People like to forget this part, but there is a small, but notable difference between show and book Joffrey: Show Joffrey cried like a little girl when daddy died, and book Joffrey didn't give a shit.

Joffrey in the show seems to have legitimately loved his father, which is more than the little psychopath in the novels can say.

Eh, I thought it was implied that he thought more highly of his father than it seemed. As evidenced by him spoilers spoilers.

He wanted to emulate Robert's former manliness, but at one point someone basically points out that his father recently died for some shit (I really forget why, but it was in Clash of Kings), and his response was basically. "What? Oh, him."

i think nemebro has it right. even in the scene with robert's deathbed he seems to be dry eyed fake-crying, likely kissing his ass to assure that he remain the heir to the kingdom.

Still Joffry, imo. Final of Season 3 just cements it further.

**** the show, fatass b!tch sucking momma's dick.

Originally posted by NemeBro
No they didn't.


In the books, his mother is actually responsible for his worst atrocities, like slaughtering all of Robert's bastards.

As I've said, he's just a kid in the books so despite being king he simply doesn't have the authority to pull off some of the things he's done on the show. His mother has power over him in the books, and she definitely doesn't fear him as she does on the show.

Joffrey hands down. No need for a poll over such a silly question.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Joffrey hands down. No need for a poll over such a silly question.

you forgot to post a wiki link which proves that the topic is not subjective.

lol


Anyway, how the **** is Cersei winning?

Well it is heavily implied that she murdered her best friend when she was like 10 or something. Cersei isn't the biggest scumbag, but she does belong on the list at least.

No idea how she's beating Joff though. Guess people were really pissed that she had Lady killed.

i forgot to add her killing of robert's bastards.