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Who wins? BFR off.

Masterson Thor Goes down.

Why and what showings are you basing this off of?

Carver, I honestly think that you are lowballing superman by putting him in vs weaklings. Like this guy stands a chance.

Superman could probably split with Thor, he doesn't need help

Originally posted by Diesldude
Carver, I honestly think that you are lowballing superman by putting him in vs weaklings. Like this guy stands a chance.

Lol...

Superman.

Originally posted by carver9
Why and what showings are you basing this off of? what high showings does masterson have that surpass SM's?

Superman wins.

Superman wins after a good fight.

Superman 70-85% FTW

Originally posted by 753
what high showings does masterson have that surpass SM's?

Stalemating Thor, beating Gladiator, knocking an amped Thanos some miles with a hammer toss, having the advantage against Quasar. Not naming everything but he does have some good showings. That's why I am asking for fts from this Superman.

Supes

Originally posted by carver9
Who wins? BFR off. Originally posted by carver9
Why and what showings are you basing this off of? Originally posted by carver9
Lol... Okay Carver, let's settle this thread. I'll be Superman, and you'll be Materson Thor.

Now tell me, who wins? sneer

M. Thor would not have any problem beating superman to death with thors hammer. The real thor would fight with honor, not this thor, he will use that hammer and its powers to wreck superman.

facepalm

Originally posted by carver9
Stalemating Thor, beating Gladiator, knocking an amped Thanos some miles with a hammer toss, having the advantage against Quasar. Not naming everything but he does have some good showings. That's why I am asking for fts from this Superman. those are his highs? cause they might as well be superman's average.

Originally posted by abhilegend
facepalm

Originally posted by 753
those are his highs? cause they might as well be superman's average. You do know that superman could barely stand after fighting thor and got gang raped by a small team of Avengers right? Thanos, gladiator and the real thor would each stomp superman if it came down to it.

Carver, the Thor Corps doesn't need the kind of "support" you give the Gamma Nation.

Cease and desist.

Originally posted by 753
those are his highs? cause they might as well be superman's average.

That's why I am asking you what is DCNU Superman fts.

Originally posted by JBL
You do know that superman could barely stand after fighting thor and got gang raped by a small team of Avengers right? Thanos, gladiator and the real thor would each stomp superman if it came down to it.
You are using a fight where superman beat thor to support the stance that thor would stomp superman? Way to go kid.

Thor wins.

Originally posted by abhilegend
You are using a fight where superman beat thor to support the stance that thor would stomp superman? Way to go kid. Dont get all happy go lucky about that fight kid, thor used none of his powers on superman and still nearly beat him. Superman got lucky and caught thor by surprise, notice how thor was looking at his hammer when superman stole him. Thats why thor ( the writers ) made it clear that if they fought again, thor would surprise his behind. M. thor and the real thor have completely different fighting styles. But as always, you see just what you want to see and say what you want to happen when it comes to superman. You are well known for your bias statements by many on here, even other hardcore superman fans scorn you for your BS. KID.

Originally posted by JBL
Dont get all happy go lucky about that fight kid, thor used none of his powers on superman and still nearly beat him. Point me to the scan where Thor nearly beat superman. He was looking directly at superman who caught his hammer. Since when is Thor making apologies for his ass beaten is writer stating something? Thor always boasts that he would beat someone in second round after getting his ass handed to him. Yeah, masterson is a buffon. Sounds like a lot of apologies for your hatred. Go back to CBR kid. This isn't a place for you.

Superman.

In one of the harder matchups for Thor, we are going with the weaker Thor? Sure....

Originally posted by Golgo13
Superman. Based on ?

Superman stomps.

Clark takes this.

Originally posted by Magnon
Superman stomps. What makes you think so ?

Isn't there a scan where Masterson Thor is being speedblitzed by Spider-Man, and M-Thor realizes that if he doesn't do something (other than trying to hit back), he'd be worn down...by Spider-Man?

Originally posted by quanchi112
What makes you think so ?

Comics.

LOL@Blatant Superman hate and lowballing

I would like someone, anyone to try and actually prove MASTERSON Thor can do better than normal Thor and actually beat superman.
Mainstream Thor 'fighting stupid' is On par with Masterson thors best aside from maybe a few showings, so saying he can pull the majority over Superman when a really good argument can be made against mainstream Thor getting the majority 'fighting smart' is a tad much to take without some sort of proof.

@Seven...

Why are you giving this version of Supes the majority?

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Cease and desist.

So no one can answer my question. Gotcha.

Superman has already racked up feats that would make him a match for regular Thor, Carv.

Based on his Earth bench pressing feat - which is obviously an extremely high end strength/endurance feat - he's (debatably) stronger than pre-Flashpoint Superman.

Masterson Thor has his redeeming moments here and there but the real deal is clearly well above him when it comes to feats and when he cuts loose.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Superman has already racked up feats that would make him a match for regular Thor, Carv.

Based on his Earth bench pressing feat - which is obviously an extremely high end strength/endurance feat - he's (debatably) stronger than pre-Flashpoint Superman.

Masterson Thor has his redeeming moments here and there but the real deal is clearly well above him when it comes to feats and when he cuts loose.

Name the fts Jake. Dang. The bench pressing ft isn't enough (even though its one of the best ft I've seen in a long time).

Originally posted by carver9
Name the fts Jake. Dang. The bench pressing ft isn't enough (even though its one of the best ft I've seen in a long time). Why should people have to educate you? Don't you know the characters?

Superman has slapped around Hal, taken it to Orion, beaten down a Doomsday from an alternate universe brought in by a rogue D Imp while under a red sun, beaten a creature made by Luther using Superman's genes. It was stated the creature had speed and strength which was equal or better than Superman. And beat Luther in his war suit while weakened from red sunlight. That's just off the top of my head.

I'm okay with letting this thread run its course for a bit. But I will close it if I see any more low balling or feigned ignorance/stupidity.

Punching H'el into space. Lifting chunk of a frozen city while being weakened from red sun radiation--very similar to his stunt in Returns. Legit FTL traveling speed(Red Hood n' the outlaws) Increased mind capabilities and processing(reading every medical textbook in history to perform Lois's surgery) Blitzing Orion. Flicking major force with a finger. Lifting Earth for 5 days straight without access to his power source. Surviving in the sun while being weakened from red sun radiation. Tagging Barry Allen and effortlesly breaking Hal's constructs. Punching with mountain level strength. These are what first came to mind. There are many others.

It is very clear New 52 Superman is in the same ballpark as his pre-flashpoint counterpart. He obviously lacks the quantity of feats, but the quality is there.

@Bada...

Yeah, I know Supes can give Masterson a fight and could probably pull the majority but fts on both ends would be amazing. The fts you've named are amazing but Masterson have some good showings as well.

Originally posted by Zack Fair
Punching H'el into space. Lifting chunk of a frozen city while being weakened from red sun radiation--very similar to his stunt in Returns. Legit FTL traveling speed(Red Hood n' the outlaws) Increased mind capabilities and processing(reading every medical textbook in history to perform Lois's surgery) Blitzing Orion. Flicking major force with a finger. Lifting Earth for 5 days straight without access to his power source. Surviving in the sun while being weakned from red sun radiation. Tagging Barry Allen and effortlesly breaking Hal's constructs. Punching with mountain level strength. These are what first came to mind. There are many others.

It is very clear New 52 Superman is in the same ballpark as his pre-flashpoint counterpart. He obviously lacks the quantity of feats, but the quality is there.

I agree. How many wins would you give him over Masterson.?

Originally posted by Badabing
Why should people have to educate you? Don't you know the characters?

Superman has slapped around Hal, taken it to Orion, beaten down a Doomsday from an alternate universe brought in by a rogue D Imp while under a red sun, beaten a creature made by Luther using Superman's genes. It was stated the creature had speed and strength which was equal or better than Superman. And beat Luther in his war suit while weakened from red sunlight. That's just off the top of my head.

I'm okay with letting this thread run its course for a bit. But I will close it if I see any more low balling or feigned ignorance/stupidity.

Originally posted by abhilegend
While on the other hand Superman is fighting and defeating an evil 5-d imp.

http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t1/15576121_2013-03-20_07-29-30_-_Action_Comics_18-004.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t1/15576123_2013-03-20_07-29-32_-_Action_Comics_18-005.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t1/15576126_2013-03-20_07-29-35_-_Action_Comics_18-006.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t1/15576128_2013-03-20_07-29-48_-_Action_Comics_18-011.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t1/15576130_2013-03-20_07-29-50_-_Action_Comics_18-012.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t1/15576132_2013-03-20_07-30-00_-_Action_Comics_18-016.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t1/15576133_2013-03-20_07-30-02_-_Action_Comics_18-017.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t1/15576136_2013-03-20_07-30-03_-_Action_Comics_18-018.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t1/15576137_2013-03-20_07-30-05_-_Action_Comics_18-019.jpg

Superman once again took the combined emotions of everyone in the creation. You would like that Dambo.

Originally posted by Zack Fair
Punching H'el into space. Lifting chunk of a frozen city while being weakened from red sun radiation--very similar to his stunt in Returns. Legit FTL traveling speed(Red Hood n' the outlaws) Increased mind capabilities and processing(reading every medical textbook in history to perform Lois's surgery) Blitzing Orion. Flicking major force with a finger. Lifting Earth for 5 days straight without access to his power source. Surviving in the sun while being weakened from red sun radiation. Tagging Barry Allen and effortlesly breaking Hal's constructs. Punching with mountain level strength. These are what first came to mind. There are many others.

It is very clear New 52 Superman is in the same ballpark as his pre-flashpoint counterpart. He obviously lacks the quantity of feats, but the quality is there. Jake, which Red Hood was Superman in? I'm a bit behind on the comic. And do you remember/know why H'el was so powerful?Originally posted by carver9
@Bada...

Yeah, I know Supes can give Masterson a fight and could probably pull the majority but fts on both ends would be amazing. The fts you've named are amazing but Masterson have some good showings as well. I've always considered Masterson to be Thor-lite. While he possesses all the powers, they weren't at Thor or BRB levels imo. Sort of like Gray Hulk to Green Hulk.

Originally posted by Badabing
Jake, which Red Hood was Superman in? I'm a bit behind on the comic. And do you remember/know why H'el was so powerful? I've always considered Masterson to be Thor-lite. While he possesses all the powers, they weren't at Thor or BRB levels imo. Sort of like Gray Hulk to Green Hulk.
Red hood and the outlaws 14. Its not revealed yet why H'el is so powerful.

Here is the speed feat Zack was talking about

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Superman/th_speedfeat1y3uc7.jpg http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Superman/th_speedfeat2xjuyq.jpg http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Superman/th_speedfeat3x3u20.jpg

superman vs M thor= superman 6/10 mabey 7/10

superman vs regular thor= 50/50


as far as comicbook crossovers go they are unreliable and thor will never win vs superman in a comic D.C. wont alow it. Even though he should

Supes vs m Thor 8-9/10

Supes vs Regular Thor: Supes 6/10 Sometimes lean towards 50/50

Originally posted by JBL
You do know that superman could barely stand after fighting thor and got gang raped by a small team of Avengers right? Thanos, gladiator and the real thor would each stomp superman if it came down to it.
1 - Non-canon
2 - Thanos, sure. Thor could split. Gladiator would be crushed.

Gladiator wouldn't get crushed.

Originally posted by 753
1 - Non-canon
2 - Thanos, sure. Thor could split. Gladiator would be crushed. Superman would get crushed by gladiator,thanos and thor in a forum fight. In a DC controlled comic, he would put up a fight because hes DCs flagboy and mr save the day plot aided hero man. This is not the comics.

Originally posted by JBL
Superman would get crushed by gladiator,thanos and thor in a forum fight. In a DC controlled comic, he would put up a fight because hes DCs flagboy and mr save the day plot aided hero man. This is not the comics. No he would not get crushed by Gladiator or Thor.

Thanos yes. Thanos would **** him up.

Originally posted by zeel
superman vs M thor= superman 6/10 mabey 7/10

superman vs regular thor= 50/50


as far as comicbook crossovers go they are unreliable and thor will never win vs superman in a comic D.C. wont alow it. Even though he should Oh they are going to meet again in a marvel storyline, but this time marvels hero will win a short scuffle. Count on it.

Originally posted by Zack Fair
No he would not get crushed by Gladiator or Thor.

Thanos yes. Thanos would **** him up. Superman would never over power gladiator, nor would he out fight him, and damn sho wont outrun him, he would get crushed. Thor could kill superman ( and a lot others ) with his hammer if it came to it. You already know what thanos would do to him.

Originally posted by JBL
Superman would never over power gladiator, nor would he out fight him, and damn sho wont outrun him, he would get crushed. Thor could kill superman ( and a lot others ) with his hammer if it came to it. You already know what thanos would do to him. Superman will always over power Gladiator and he will out fight him. Superman can kill Thor(and a lot of others) with his fists if it came to it.

Don't be jelly.

Originally posted by JBL
Superman would never over power gladiator, nor would he out fight him, and damn sho wont outrun him, he would get crushed. Thor could kill superman ( and a lot others ) with his hammer if it came to it. You already know what thanos would do to him.

Strong enough to wrest planets in orbit, powerful enough to collapse stars with his bare hands.

http://s289.photobucket.com/user/CapztehLumby/media/SheHulk70076.jpg.html

Originally posted by carver9
Strong enough to wrest planets in orbit, powerful enough to collapse stars with his bare hands.

http://s289.photobucket.com/user/CapztehLumby/media/SheHulk70076.jpg.html Carver, you will kneel before liZod. sneer

Originally posted by Badabing
Carver, you will kneel before liZod. sneer

Originally posted by Badabing
Carver, you will kneel before liZod. sneer

Lol...posted that scan out of fun...its hyperbole. Can't wait to see that Superman movie. Seems different than any other Superman movie created thus far.

Originally posted by carver9
Lol...posted that scan out of fun...its hyperbole. Can't wait to see that Superman movie. Seems different than any other Superman movie created thus far. I didn't even look at the scan.


Now, less talking and more kneeling before liZod! sneer

Originally posted by Zack Fair
Superman will always over power Gladiator and he will out fight him. Superman can kill Thor(and a lot of others) with his fists if it came to it.

Don't be jelly. Says you but people disagree.

JBL ain't people.

Also...STFU.

Originally posted by Zack Fair
JBL ain't people.

Also...STFU. Yes, he is. Quit acting like you speak for everyone. Calm down.

I'm not speaking for everyone. Don't see how you even come to this conclusion, but then again this is you.

Again

Originally posted by Zack Fair
STFU.

Originally posted by carver9
Strong enough to wrest planets in orbit, powerful enough to collapse stars with his bare hands.

http://s289.photobucket.com/user/CapztehLumby/media/SheHulk70076.jpg.html
So, nearly as powerful as smart drax?

Originally posted by Zack Fair
I'm not speaking for everyone. Don't see how you even come to this conclusion, but then again this is you.

Again You said he will always overpower him but Thats your opinion and yours alone. Jbl disagreed. As do I.

Originally posted by carver9
@Seven...

Why are you giving this version of Supes the majority?
Sorry for the late reply but pretty much others have touched on anything I was going to say. The whole arc with H'el with what superman did and had did to him was beyond masterson's ability to replicate for the most part anyway.
Superman has done things beyond his over stated lifting feat to put his strength and other stats over masterson's average.

Masterson will make him work for it but gets no wins.

Originally posted by SevenShackles
Sorry for the late reply but pretty much others have touched on anything I was going to say. The whole arc with H'el with what superman did and had did to him was beyond masterson's ability to replicate for the most part anyway.
Superman has done things beyond his over stated lifting feat to put his strength and other stats over masterson's average.

Masterson will make him work for it but gets no wins.

Nothing against what Bada or Zack said but I don't think thats enough to warrant a majority against Masterson...he didn't even affect H'el with his punches.

Then you keep bringing up pre reboot Superman...this isn't him in this battle.

DCNU Superman would beat Masterson. He'd even give Thor a fight.

He'd beat Gladiator too.

Carver, I've forgotten more about Thor than you'll ever know. sneer

Masterson loses this.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Carver, I've forgotten more about Thor than you'll ever know. sneer

Masterson loses this.




@Pr...

No he wouldn't.

Originally posted by carver9


@Pr...

No he wouldn't.

Yes he would.

Don't be mad just because DC gave Superman more love in less than two years than Gladiator and Masterson combined.

Originally posted by carver9
Nothing against what Bada or Zack said but I don't think thats enough to warrant a majority against Masterson...he didn't even affect H'el with his punches.

Then you keep bringing up pre reboot Superman...this isn't him in this battle. Except when he had H'el down on his knees (kneel before liZod) and bleeding. I'm just waiting for Pr to handle things. biscuits

lol @ the H'el downplaying. I see not a lot has changed in my absence.

Originally posted by quanchi112
You said he will always overpower him but Thats your opinion and yours alone. Jbl disagreed. As do I. I like how you're missing the whole point of my post back then. No surprise there.

Also

STFU.

Originally posted by Zack Fair
I like how you're missing the whole point of my post back then. No surprise there.

Also

STFU. I disagree with he will always overpower and beat him.

Originally posted by carver9
Nothing against what Bada or Zack said but I don't think thats enough to warrant a majority against Masterson...he didn't even affect H'el with his punches.

Then you keep bringing up pre reboot Superman...this isn't him in this battle.
Wait what did I say about Pre reboot? Maybe I didn't say something clear cuz i was trying to stay to reboot superman.

Originally posted by SevenShackles
Wait what did I say about Pre reboot? Maybe I didn't say something clear cuz i was trying to stay to reboot superman.

He's trying to deflect, don't worry about it.

Looks like someone needs to make a separate Glads vs DCnU Superman and do a "feat" war!

Dooo Eeeeet!

Originally posted by JBL
Superman would get crushed by gladiator,thanos and thor in a forum fight. In a DC controlled comic, he would put up a fight because hes DCs flagboy and mr save the day plot aided hero man. This is not the comics. he would not. SM and gladiator have identical powersets, but SM has better feats in every single one of their powers. His high feats are much higher and his average is roughly the same as gladiator's highs. He does have worse low showings IMO, but he has a lot more appearence too.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
Looks like someone needs to make a separate Glads vs DCnU Superman and do a "feat" war!

Dooo Eeeeet!


You evil, evil man.

Originally posted by 753
he would not. SM and gladiator have identical powersets, but SM has better feats in every single one of their powers. His high feats are much higher and his average is roughly the same as gladiator's highs. He does have worse low showings IMO, but he has a lot more appearence too. Well of course he has better feats because he is a hero and one of DCs top plot device. He will defeat threats in a comic book that would rape him in a forum battle. Thats the reason batman, captain america, spiderman, and a whole lot others are still around. Firelord would maul spiderman in a forum battle, did he maul him in the comics? no. juggernaut would maul spiderman in a forum battle, did he maul him in the comics? no. hulk would maul captain america in a forum battle, did he maul or kill him in the comics? no. You know why? comics dont do that to main heros, they will win no matter what, thats why Galactus fails to destroy earth, but destroys FAR more powerful races and their planets. You think DC or Marvel earth is going to get taken over by the likes of prime, galactus, anti-moniter, tyrant or even the beyonder? OH they would in a forum battle but not in the comics.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
Looks like someone needs to make a separate Glads vs DCnU Superman and do a "feat" war!

Dooo Eeeeet!


Lol, there are far far too many superman fans to put him up against anyone, and they dont want him to lose, thus they vote superman, even giving him a chance against Thanos and others that would beat him into the ground 27/10.

Originally posted by JBL
Well of course he has better feats because he is a hero and one of DCs top plot device. He will defeat threats in a comic book that would rape him in a forum battle. Thats the reason batman, captain america, spiderman, and a whole lot others are still around. Firelord would maul spiderman in a forum battle, did he maul him in the comics? no. juggernaut would maul spiderman in a forum battle, did he maul him in the comics? no. hulk would maul captain america in a forum battle, did he maul or kill him in the comics? no. You know why? comics dont do that to main heros, they will win no matter what, thats why Galactus fails to destroy earth, but destroys FAR more powerful races and their planets. You think DC or Marvel earth is going to get taken over by the likes of prime, galactus, anti-moniter, tyrant or even the beyonder? OH they would in a forum battle but not in the comics.
Gladiator would get crushed by any version of comics superman. Let it go kid.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Gladiator would get crushed by any version of comics superman. Let it go kid. He could not even beat wonder woman and he was bloodlusted and trying to kill her. Gladiator would maul superman. But i know about you, superman beats silver surfer in your world.lol. Waste of time debating you, OH, he can beat thanos too huh? lol

Wonder Woman only beats Superman when she is riding his junk.

Originally posted by JBL
Well of course he has better feats because he is a hero and one of DCs top plot device. He will defeat threats in a comic book that would rape him in a forum battle. Thats the reason batman, captain america, spiderman, and a whole lot others are still around. Firelord would maul spiderman in a forum battle, did he maul him in the comics? no. juggernaut would maul spiderman in a forum battle, did he maul him in the comics? no. hulk would maul captain america in a forum battle, did he maul or kill him in the comics? no. You know why? comics dont do that to main heros, they will win no matter what, thats why Galactus fails to destroy earth, but destroys FAR more powerful races and their planets. You think DC or Marvel earth is going to get taken over by the likes of prime, galactus, anti-moniter, tyrant or even the beyonder? OH they would in a forum battle but not in the comics.

That kind of logic is flawed when it comes to this forum.

Originally posted by JBL
Well of course he has better feats because he is a hero and one of DCs top plot device. He will defeat threats in a comic book that would rape him in a forum battle. Thats the reason batman, captain america, spiderman, and a whole lot others are still around. Firelord would maul spiderman in a forum battle, did he maul him in the comics? no. juggernaut would maul spiderman in a forum battle, did he maul him in the comics? no. hulk would maul captain america in a forum battle, did he maul or kill him in the comics? no. You know why? comics dont do that to main heros, they will win no matter what, thats why Galactus fails to destroy earth, but destroys FAR more powerful races and their planets. You think DC or Marvel earth is going to get taken over by the likes of prime, galactus, anti-moniter, tyrant or even the beyonder? OH they would in a forum battle but not in the comics. wtf is this argument?

feat for feat SM is more powerful than gladiator, whereas by the same standard, spiderman isn't even close to firelord. since we know that, we can conclude spidey beating FL is PIS because that feat is the odd one out. on the other hand, it would take dismissing SM's career to conclude he doesn't beat Gladiator.

this is undeniable.

Originally posted by -Pr-
That kind of logic is flawed when it comes to this forum. So you mean that characters like spiderman, batman, captain america, black cat, green arrow and wasp would survive against characters like firelord, hulk, juggernaut, grundy, doomsday and darkside in a forum battle like they survive in a comic?

Originally posted by 753
wtf is this argument?

feat for feat SM is more powerful than gladiator, whereas by the same standard, spiderman isn't even close to firelord. since we know that, we can conclude spidey beating FL is PIS because that feat is the odd one out. on the other hand, it would take dismissing SM's career to conclude he doesn't beat Gladiator.

this is undeniable.

Originally posted by 753
wtf is this argument?

feat for feat SM is more powerful than gladiator, whereas by the same standard, spiderman isn't even close to firelord. since we know that, we can conclude spidey beating FL is PIS because that feat is the odd one out. on the other hand, it would take dismissing SM's career to conclude he doesn't beat Gladiator.

this is undeniable. Feats from a hero vs feats from a rarely used character determines nothing. Superman has better feats that most characters that would destroy him.

Flawed argument is flawed.

Originally posted by Zack Fair
Flawed argument is flawed. Thats a good excuse though. Every time superman is put up against someone, we will just run to his billion feats to say he wins. Im now scared to put him against Odin now.

Makes more sense than your childish logic.

Try pitting him against Odin. Lets see what happens and what the consensus is.

Originally posted by Zack Fair
Makes more sense than your childish logic.

Try pitting him against Odin. Lets see what happens. Childish logic? This debate is over. I stand by my " theres far too many superman fans to put him against anyone "

Childish indeed.

So you've given up on Superman Vs threads? Good.

Originally posted by Zack Fair
Childish indeed.

So you've given up on Superman threads? Good. No. just his fans that think he can beat anyone and everyone.

Some might think so, not all.

So...yeah.

Originally posted by carver9
Nothing against what Bada or Zack said but I don't think thats enough to warrant a majority against Masterson...he didn't even affect H'el with his punches.

Then you keep bringing up pre reboot Superman...this isn't him in this battle.
You understand that in the same topic you have posted that

...Originally posted by carver9
@Bada...

Yeah, I know Supes can give Masterson a fight and could probably pull the majority but fts on both ends would be amazing. The fts you've named are amazing but Masterson have some good showings as well.

Only to contradict yourself. Seriously, am I missing something here? Are you arguing just for the sake of arguing? Are you hoping someone here just tells you OKAY carver Superman will lose? Seriously, like hope of the hate on Superman dude

Carver is not hating. Maybe lowballing, but I think he just wishes a good debate would start. Unfortunately people don't see it that way.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
You understand that in the same topic you have posted that

...

Only to contradict yourself. Seriously, am I missing something here? Are you arguing just for the sake of arguing? Are you hoping someone here just tells you OKAY carver Superman will lose? Seriously, like hope of the hate on Superman dude

No, I made this hoping arguments could be made on both end...Superman and Masterson. I don't care who gets the majority or not. Where in this thread did I give Masterson the majority over Superman.

Originally posted by carver9
No, I made this hoping arguments could be made on both end...Superman and Masterson. I don't care who gets the majority or not. Where in this thread did I give Masterson the majority over Superman. You are clearly trying to instigate any kind of debate by lowballing. You say that Superman can probably get a majority. Then, you change stance and say you don't think that those feats or whatever was posted warrants a majority.

Not as familiar with Masterson Thor (hated the character tbh). What "feats" does the guy have besides who he's fought?

IMO, Gladiator and DCnU would be a good fight. Someone should make a thread....

Originally posted by xJLxKing
You are clearly trying to instigate any kind of debate by lowballing. You say that Superman can probably get a majority. Then, you change stance and say you don't think that those feats or whatever was posted warrants a majority.

I never said he would pull a majority, I said he could PROBABLY pull one. I also said those fts are not outside of something Masterson has done which is the reason I think this fight is competitive. I know of every ft Bada and Zack named, that's the reason I made this thread; not because I thought Masterson was featless, I made this thread because I knew Masterson had potential, enough potential to make this fight "debatable" imo. I didn't discredit anyone in here on their judgment but I did ask them why they came to the conclusion that lead them to Superman winning since again, I know what Masterson is capable of. Can we get back on topic? Who are you voting for?

Originally posted by xJLxKing
You are clearly trying to instigate any kind of debate by lowballing. You say that Superman can probably get a majority. Then, you change stance and say you don't think that those feats or whatever was posted warrants a majority.

To be fair, he didn't really "change stance".

One statement mentions him feeling that Superman can get the majority and the other states that he doesn't feel like the "feats" mentioned are sufficient to prove the point of Superman taking the majority. One does not contradict the other, IMO as one CAN believe a certain character can win even though he doesn't have the "feat" evidence in front of him (such as when he bases his conclusion on perceived "power levels".

Originally posted by Nibedicus
To be fair, he didn't really "change stance".

One statement mentions him feeling that Superman can get the majority and the other states that he doesn't feel like the "feats" mentioned are sufficient to prove the point of Superman taking the majority. One does not contradict the other, IMO as one CAN believe a certain character can win even though he doesn't have the "feat" evidence in front of him (such as when he bases his conclusion on perceived "power levels".

Pretty much.

Originally posted by JBL
Feats from a hero vs feats from a rarely used character determines nothing. Superman has better feats that most characters that would destroy him. I see. How do you know said character would destroy SM, if he doesn't have feats to support said claim?

SM's feats don't suggest he'd beat odin either. they're nowhere near his level.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
Not as familiar with Masterson Thor (hated the character tbh). What "feats" does the guy have besides who he's fought?

IMO, Gladiator and DCnU would be a good fight. Someone should make a thread....

Basically a lesser Thor with some good feats.

He's got a terrible track history against certain characters, but all in all he's basically a slightly less consistent Thor.

Masterson took a shot from Gladiator and survived; in carver's mind that makes him trans.

==

Originally posted by JBL
So you mean that characters like spiderman, batman, captain america, black cat, green arrow and wasp would survive against characters like firelord, hulk, juggernaut, grundy, doomsday and darkside in a forum battle like they survive in a comic?

No.

Just that "he only succeeds cos he's the hero" isn't a valid debating tactic.

Originally posted by JBL
He could not even beat wonder woman and he was bloodlusted and trying to kill her. Gladiator would maul superman. But i know about you, superman beats silver surfer in your world.lol. Waste of time debating you, OH, he can beat thanos too huh? lol
When he was mindcontrolled. A mindcontrolled gladiator was KTFO by Gambit. I'll let you decide which is worse.

Superman wins. Anybody saying different gets a 3 warning to a ban combo. sneer








Unless they kneel before liZod. biscuits

Originally posted by 753
he would not. SM and gladiator have identical powersets, but SM has better feats in every single one of their powers. His high feats are much higher and his average is roughly the same as gladiator's highs. He does have worse low showings IMO, but he has a lot more appearence too.

I disagree. Current Superman has displayed Planetary strength but so has Gladiator. I don't see Current Superman swimming around in gas giants. I also don't see Current Supes tanking a blast with the power to destroy half of a solar system. I don't see Superman containing said blast to the point where it created an entire star. His flight speed has been impressive...don't know if it 100 times the speed of light impressive but its impressive. Hyperbole...if we are going by statements, Gladiator still wins (most powerful being in the Universe, powerful In the Galaxy, etc, etc...).

I see alot of superman VS Thor debates on here and it always goes toward Superman. I actually liked thunderstrike But as both thunderstrike and Thor Masterson is below beta ray bill who is arguably below the real Thor so I don't see how anyone can try and make a valid argument in Masterson's favor without being written off.
Even with feats it's hard. He got beaten up by Loki while wielding both thors and betas hammers while normal Thor beats Loki up. His showings are just below normal Thor who is arguably at the disadvantage against superman and with all this lifting the planets weight business DCnU supes is being seen as stronger than his Pre-flashpoint self. It's not a good time to be Masterson.

Going all out he gets 1/10

Originally posted by carver9
I disagree. Current Superman has displayed Planetary strength but so has Gladiator. I don't see Current Superman swimming around in gas giants. I also don't see Current Supes tanking a blast with the power to destroy half of a solar system. I don't see Superman containing said blast to the point where it created an entire star. His flight speed has been impressive...don't know if it 100 times the speed of light impressive but its impressive. Hyperbole...if we are going by statements, Gladiator still wins (most powerful being in the Universe, powerful In the Galaxy, etc, etc...).
facepalm

Originally posted by abhilegend
When he was mindcontrolled. A mindcontrolled gladiator was KTFO by Gambit. I'll let you decide which is worse. WW was holding back. She could have killed him. Stop trying to use that mindcontrolled crap, he was going all-out, not holding back and got punches in and WW still could have killed him. I recall you stating that if superman goes out of his mind, he would be this unstoppable force???? Now you use it as a excuse to say thats the reason WW could have killed him?? You have no idea how you trap yourself with your own words.

When was Gladiator knocked out by Gambit?

Originally posted by carver9
I disagree. Current Superman has displayed Planetary strength but so has Gladiator. I don't see Current Superman swimming around in gas giants. I also don't see Current Supes tanking a blast with the power to destroy half of a solar system. I don't see Superman containing said blast to the point where it created an entire star. His flight speed has been impressive...don't know if it 100 times the speed of light impressive but its impressive. Hyperbole...if we are going by statements, Gladiator still wins (most powerful being in the Universe, powerful In the Galaxy, etc, etc...).

lol.

Originally posted by JBL
WW was holding back. She could have killed him. Stop trying to use that mindcontrolled crap, he was going all-out, not holding back and got punches in and WW still could have killed him. I recall you stating that if superman goes out of his mind, he would be this unstoppable force???? Now you use it as a excuse to say thats the reason WW could have killed him?? You have no idea how you trap yourself with your own words.

People who are mentally compromised, and Superman WAS mentally compromised, aren't considered fighting at their best.

Originally posted by -Pr-
People who are mentally compromised, and Superman WAS mentally compromised, aren't considered fighting at their best.
How exactly does being tricked into going into bloodlust mode supposed to handicap Superman? Unless you think that going all-out with his full arsenal of powers is supposed to weaken him?

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
How exactly does being tricked into going into bloodlust mode supposed to handicap Superman? Unless you think that going all-out with his full arsenal of powers is supposed to weaken him?

When a character can't think clearly, and their combat effectiveness actually relies to an extent on that clear thinking, they are mentally compromised and can't be considered to be operating at full effectiveness.

Superman being half out of his mind with grief and rage doesn't put him at OWAW levels, etc.

He was dangerous, sure, and Wonder Woman did do well, but anyone trying to portray that Superman as being Superman at his most dangerous, either doesn't read the character, or is just lowballing tbh.

Originally posted by -Pr-
When a character can't think clearly, and their combat effectiveness actually relies to an extent on that clear thinking, they are mentally compromised and can't be considered to be operating at full effectiveness.

Superman being half out of his mind with grief and rage doesn't put him at OWAW levels, etc.

He was dangerous, sure, and Wonder Woman did do well, but anyone trying to portray that Superman as being Superman at his most dangerous, either doesn't read the character, or is just lowballing tbh.
You might as well start saying that every bloodlusted character isn't operating at full effectiveness then. Because by that logic, that is exactly what being bloodlusted does to the psyche of a character: it causes them to stop thinking clearly., and just acting on primal murderous animal instincts.

Sure, because his most uber feats(pushing back Imperiex-powered warworld etc.) were performed in large part thanks to the considerable amp he got from his sundive. This showing with Wonderwoman does put him at DoS levels though, because that is pretty much what the showing is, both literally and figuratively, what with him seeing Diana as Doomsday and all.

It could very well be called "one of his" most dangerous iterations, otherwise anyone saying that DoS Superman isn't one of the most dangerous and stopped-holding-back-versions of Superman is either not reading clearly or just lowballing. /shrug

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
You might as well start saying that every bloodlusted character isn't operating at full effectiveness then. Because by that logic, that is exactly what being bloodlusted does to the psyche of a character: it causes them to stop thinking clearly., and just acting on primal murderous animal instincts.

Sure, because his most uber feats(pushing back Imperiex-powered warworld etc.) were performed in large part thanks to the considerable amp he got from his sundive. This showing with Wonderwoman does put him at DoS levels though, because that is pretty much what the showing is, both literally and figuratively, what with him seeing Diana as Doomsday and all.

It could very well be called "one of his" most dangerous iterations, otherwise anyone saying that DoS Superman isn't one of the most dangerous and stopped-holding-back-versions of Superman is either not reading clearly or just lowballing. /shrug

DoS?

Originally posted by -Pr-
DoS?
Death of Superman.

You didn't know that?

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Death of Superman.

You didn't know that?

I did, I just don't know how DoS at all applies to this thread. Unless I misread the OP or something.

Originally posted by -Pr-
I did, I just don't know how DoS at all applies to this thread. Unless I misread the OP or something.
It applies to our conversation regarding that fight with Diana. Unless you want to drop the whole discussion(which is fine by me), it holds.

How does it? Maybe I'm not understanding you in some way.

Originally posted by -Pr-
How does it? Maybe I'm not understanding you in some way.
How does it not? Because Clark genuinely believing that a person(Diana) standing before him is Doomsday, and then unloading everything he has on said faux Doomsday, in the same mindset he had during DoS, is him being at DoS levels.

Fighting Doomsday is not the same as fighting Diana though.

Originally posted by Zack Fair
Fighting Doomsday is not the same as fighting Diana though.
Going all out against his opponent in both cases is the same though.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Going all out against his opponent in both cases is the same though. Yes, but thinking Diana is Doomsday is more of a handicap IMO. Diana fights different and is a different league altogether.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Of course he's not fighting smart, because he's bloodlusted. That doesn't mean however that his fighting capability has been reduced, because if it is, then we might as well start saying that the Silver Surfer that got one-shotted by Thor in Blood and Thunder wasn't fighting to the best of his ability, which takes away from Thor's feat, which is exactly what you are doing when you talk about Superman's encounter with Diana in that way.

Seeing how his mindset against Diana was more or less the same as when he fought Doomsday, I don't see why you'd say that he was fighting smart against Doomsday, trying to distinguish the 2 scenarios as if Superman was handicapped in one instance(Diana fight) and operating at full capacity in the other(DoS). When the only real difference here is that in one case Superman fought the real Doomsday, while in the other case he fought someone he truly believed was Doomsday. Which is what I have issue with.

Correct me if I am wrong, but didn't the final fight with the Elite turn out to be staged? With all his robots having been secretly helping him out during the fight itself? As far as OWAW goes, already addressed that.

That's not what I'm doing, and I don't regard it as the same thing. Being bloodlusted isn't the same thing, in my mind, because Superman wasn't just out for blood, he was being actively telepathically deceived. Not to mention that "bloodlust" is more of a detriment to Superman than it would be to say, Hulk or Wolverine.

I don't think the mindset was the same at all, and I think the comics support that. Like Rucka said, Superman was half out of his mind with grief. That didn't happen in DOS.

Are you thinking of the animated version?

Are we implying his power was lower or that he was just fighting not as skillful as he usually does against WW?

Because his power should have been at its height. He was just fighting like a brute. Not so far out of the way of his average, but definitely not as skillful as his "best"

Originally posted by -Pr-
That's not what I'm doing, and I don't regard it as the same thing. Being bloodlusted isn't the same thing, in my mind, because Superman wasn't just out for blood, he was being actively telepathically deceived. Not to mention that "bloodlust" is more of a detriment to Superman than it would be to say, Hulk or Wolverine.

I don't think the mindset was the same at all, and I think the comics support that. Like Rucka said, Superman was half out of his mind with grief. That didn't happen in DOS.

Are you thinking of the animated version?
Thor was also actively telepathically compromised by that Valkyrie phantom, yet it is commonly held consensus on this board that Blood and Thunder Thor was a bloodlusted Thor. Ergo, that means Superman, under somewhat similar scenarios, was also bloodlusted.

He was, in his mind, fighting Doomsday in both cases. Knowing the kind of destruction the monster has caused, and what it takes to stop him, and then not holding back his punches in both cases to beat down his opponnent, why would that imply that one case was him fighting "intelligently" and the other was him "mentally compromised"?

A friend of mine on cbr told me that the animated film was pretty much a rip-off of the comic. Did that staging bit get revealed in the end in the comic?

I went back to check the Superman/DD vs the Probes, and I realized for the first time after many viewings, that Doomsday was biting a Probes' leg.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Are we implying his power was lower or that he was just fighting not as skillful as he usually does against WW?

Because his power should have been at its height. He was just fighting like a brute. Not so far out of the way of his average, but definitely not as skillful as his "best"
I am not sure of the skillful part, but I agree with the "power" portion of his fight.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Are we implying his power was lower or that he was just fighting not as skillful as he usually does against WW?

Because his power should have been at its height. He was just fighting like a brute. Not so far out of the way of his average, but definitely not as skillful as his "best"

Skill wise. Power comes in to it too, though, as a well placed punch can do more damage than a wild swing. He was still a fair bit more powerful than his average though.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Thor was also actively telepathically compromised by that Valkyrie phantom, yet it is commonly held consensus on this board that Blood and Thunder Thor was a bloodlusted Thor. Ergo, that means Superman, under somewhat similar scenarios, was also bloodlusted.

He was, in his mind, fighting Doomsday in both cases. Knowing the kind of destruction the monster has caused, and what it takes to stop him, and then not holding back his punches in both cases to beat down his opponnent, why would that imply that one case was him fighting "intelligently" and the other was him "mentally compromised"?

A friend of mine on cbr told me that the animated film was pretty much a rip-off of the comic. Did that staging bit get revealed in the end in the comic?

That makes it right? Rucka himself said Superman was compromised and wasn't operating at his best, but we're still arguing that this is a really high showing for Superman?

Because it was flat out stated that he was compromised due to his grief and rage.

In the comic it was just Superman. The animated version was quite faithful, though with some small changes.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
I went back to check the Superman/DD vs the Probes, and I realized for the first time after many viewings, that Doomsday was biting a Probes' leg.

http://i40.tinypic.com/2vj1m2p.jpg

Also, one can forgive supes for being a bit surprised when Doomsday threw a MAGICAL TIARA at him. Unless Doomsday has a princess complex, not sure how supes was supposed to defend against attacks that he had no reason to think would be coming at him. Also, wondy fought smart, and how often does doomsday fight smart? i think people are seriously underestimating what a disadvantage it is to be fighting someone completely different than who you think you are fighting.

There is a reason mma, boxers, etc. study the person they are about to fight and see how they fight. If one person thought they were fighting someone totally different than who they were actually fighting, they'd be at a huge disadvantage.

Originally posted by carver9
Stalemating Thor, beating Gladiator, knocking an amped Thanos some miles with a hammer toss, having the advantage against Quasar. Not naming everything but he does have some good showings. That's why I am asking for fts from this Superman.

Oh come now, let's stop being disingenuous, shall we? Gladiator whooped that ass until he started monologuing over a fallen Masterson who had to resort to calling upon Living Lightning to interfere.

Originally posted by batdude123
Oh come now, let's stop being disingenuous, shall we? Gladiator whooped that ass until he started monologuing over a fallen Masterson who had to resort to calling upon Living Lightning to interfere.

I know Gladiator destroyed him but I'm still bringing it up because Gladiator ego got in the way which caused him the loss.

Originally posted by carver9
I know Gladiator destroyed him but I'm still bringing it up because Gladiator ego got in the way which caused him the loss.

Do you think Superman's ego would get in the way of him beating Masterson?

Originally posted by batdude123
Do you think Superman's ego would get in the way of him beating Masterson?

Gladiator and Superman fighting style is different. Gladiator was fighting Masterson with the intent to kill. Don't see Superman fighting Masterson in that fashion.

Originally posted by carver9
Gladiator and Superman fighting style is different. Gladiator was fighting Masterson with the intent to kill. Don't see Superman fighting Masterson in that fashion.

He couldn't have been fighting to end him quickly if he gave Masterson time to call upon Living Lightning... and that's obvious. Superman is infinitely smarter than Gladiator. In battle, and in everything else.

Thor would lay his hammer down to call down his lightning, and Superman would fly right into it knocking himself out cold.

Carv lay down some funky scans backing me up