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Which villains are more feared in their native universe. This has nothing to do with overall formidability.


1. Voldemort (movies)
2. Palpatine (movies)
3. Ganondorf (Twilight Princess)
4. Sauron (Lord of the Rings movies)
5. Thulsa Doom (Conan movie )

Voldemort or sauron probably.

Sauron.

People were scared of Voldemort's name. Sauron is pretty tame in the fear department(he kinda looks like a vagjayjay on a stick...)

Originally posted by Nephthys
Sauron. What makes you think so ?

Voldemort got talked back at by Neville. Sauron had most people believing that his return was basically the end of the world.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Voldemort got talked back at by Neville. Sauron had most people believing that his return was basically the end of the world. Neville was the only one and he got put on his ass. Sauron was opposed as well on the battlefield. The only reason Neville had the chance to talk back was because Voldemort let them join him but once the combat started everyone was fighting for their lives.

Voldemorts just a man. Sauron is a godlike entity who made the planet quiver in fear of him.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Voldemorts just a man. Sauron is a godlike entity who made the planet quiver in fear of him. He is not just a man. He was a wizard who had an entire world of wizards shitting their pants at the mere mention of his name.

Sauron had to trick the world of Middle Earth to create the rings which was his master plan to seize the world in his grips. We're people scared to say Sauron's name ?

Everyone was scared shittless of people/beings like Sauron and Voldemort. The galaxy was out to kill Palpatine, Ganon's tough but not terrifying, Thulsa Doom is lulz.

Originally posted by COG Veteran
Everyone was scared shittless of people/beings like Sauron and Voldemort. The galaxy was out to kill Palpatine, Ganon's tough but not terrifying, Thulsa Doom is lulz. People were scared of Thulsa Doom.

Originally posted by quanchi112
People were scared of Thulsa Doom.

Yeah but personally, Voldemort and Sauron seem like bigger threats. Magic beyond belief, giant rampaging armies. Just an IMO.

It's pretty damn hard to quantify such things. I believe the reason why people were afraid of saying Voldemort's name was because it had an actual, literal curse attached to it.

Nah, that was only during the seventh book. Otherwise it was just due to fear.

I find it odd that Palpy wasn't feared throughout the galaxy.

Dorf's out as only about nine people knew about him. OoT would have been feared though.

If not Palpy than Sauron followed closely by Voldy. Could be a toss up.

Originally posted by COG Veteran
Yeah but personally, Voldemort and Sauron seem like bigger threats. Magic beyond belief, giant rampaging armies. Just an IMO. I agree but I just wanted to point out Thulsa was widely feared in Conan.

Originally posted by ArtificialGlory
It's pretty damn hard to quantify such things. I believe the reason why people were afraid of saying Voldemort's name was because it had an actual, literal curse attached to it. When was this stated in the films ?

Originally posted by BloodRain
I find it odd that Palpy wasn't feared throughout the galaxy.

Dorf's out as only about nine people knew about him. OoT would have been feared though.

If not Palpy than Sauron followed closely by Voldy. Could be a toss up. What makes you think Voldemort is so low on your list ?

Low? I said he's a close second..

2>4>=1>2>5>3. Palpy being there twice cause im not too sure.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Low? I said he's a close second..

2>4>=1>2>5>3. Palpy being there twice cause im not too sure. If you said not Palpatine then Sauron then Voldemort he is third on your list.

I see galactic fear to be a greater feat.

Originally posted by BloodRain
I see galactic fear to be a greater feat. Thats just greater in scope. People Didnt seem to have the same general fear of him like they did with someone like Voldemort or Sauron.

Palpatine was too distant a threat to be feared as much. He left you alone for the most part if you paid your taxes and did not question his rule. Also, by the time of the Original Trilogy, belief in the Force was at an all-time low, so the frail-looking old man was seen as just that. A weak old man.

Ganondorf doesn't get top billing because honestly, most people don't actually know who the **** he is. Those that do are afraid of him, but TP Ganondorf was basically an unknown. Zant was more feared.

Thulsa Doom I can't say.

It is between Sauron and Voldemort. From here it becomes very difficult to quantify. Voldemort tends to have fanciful shit like people being so scared they don't even say his name, but Sauron? Even legitimate Demigods like Gandalf, Radhagast, Saruman, or Galadriel quiver at the thought of Sauron returning, as seen in the Hobbit.

It depends on which you find more impressive.

Interesting thread.. It's between Voldemort and Sauron as everyone seems to agree on. I think Hagrid said in the first film that the wizarding world believed Vold's name to be cursed(even tho it really wasn't until DH) so that would explain them fearing it. In that world you can curse a word and it seemed likely he would do so i guess.

What does the word demigod do for anyone ? It is just a title and by power alone a competent HP wizard shits all over these demi gods in terms of power.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Palpatine was too distant a threat to be feared as much. He left you alone for the most part if you paid your taxes and did not question his rule. Also, by the time of the Original Trilogy, belief in the Force was at an all-time low, so the frail-looking old man was seen as just that. A weak old man.

Ganondorf doesn't get top billing because honestly, most people don't actually know who the **** he is. Those that do are afraid of him, but TP Ganondorf was basically an unknown. Zant was more feared.

Thulsa Doom I can't say.

It is between Sauron and Voldemort. From here it becomes very difficult to quantify. Voldemort tends to have fanciful shit like people being so scared they don't even say his name, but Sauron? Even legitimate Demigods like Gandalf, Radhagast, Saruman, or Galadriel quiver at the thought of Sauron returning, as seen in the Hobbit.

It depends on which you find more impressive.

Originally posted by Nephthys
So you're endorsing the usage of the word demi god like it carries weight of some kind ?

Yes.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Yes. It is just a title a dnnothing more. We need proof or evidence to add "real" weight.

im more scared of vader than i am Palpatine

Originally posted by quanchi112
Thats just greater in scope. People Didnt seem to have the same general fear of him like they did with someone like Voldemort or Sauron.
Been a while since watching, just pictured him as the powerful Sith lord, figured the fear would be obvious. With what everyones said I'd put him back to third on the list.

Originally posted by iscaremonkeys
im more scared of vader than i am Palpatine That is an interesting point. Vader due to being his enforcer probably was more feared than Palpatine.

Palpatine had an extensive cult of personality and was beloved as a patron of the arts. Tarkin and Vader were the feared ones.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Been a while since watching, just pictured him as the powerful Sith lord, figured the fear would be obvious. With what everyones said I'd put him back to third on the list. But there was not a. General seams of fear attached to his name. As just stated it seemed Vader was more feared. Palpatine was the cunning politician who was too smart to let the general public know what a evil bastard he was. I put Palpatine in there to see who would bite.

Makes sense.

Shoulda replaced them with Vader and Zant.

Originally posted by quanchi112
When was this stated in the films ?

I really don't know. I haven't read the books or saw the movies, but I know that Voldemort had literally cursed his name. That may not have been stated in the movies though.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Makes sense.

Shoulda replaced them with Vader and Zant. Do you think either of these two rival Voldemort or Sauron here ?

Originally posted by ArtificialGlory
I really don't know. I haven't read the books or saw the movies, but I know that Voldemort had literally cursed his name. That may not have been stated in the movies though. Its clear in Deathly Hallows part two they are just fearful of saying his name.

Vader more so than Zant

His name was cursed in DH1. That's how the Death Eaters found Harry and company after the wedding

Originally posted by quanchi112
Do you think either of these two rival Voldemort or Sauron here ?
Vader could possibly contend with those two. Zant, while being the Vader to Dorfs Palpatine, is still not well known. Only his people and a few in Hyrule castle knew about him, as everyone else was just soul ****ed without knowing of him. Sure those that did greatly feared him, but great fear among a hundred people is below great fear among thousands.

Originally posted by quanchi112
What does the word demigod do for anyone ? It is just a title and by power alone a competent HP wizard shits all over these demi gods in terms of power.

Originally posted by quanchi112
This has nothing to do with overall formidability.

Follow your own rules.

In LotR, said demigods are more powerful than the majority of LotR beings, like Men and the majority of Elves, who at best can hover just a little bit above peak human in formidability.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Follow your own rules.

In LotR, said demigods are more powerful than the majority of LotR beings, like Men and the majority of Elves, who at best can hover just a little bit above peak human in formidability. Yes, but that doesn't extend over into Harry Pottwr verse. We see wizards are more powerful than their demi gods.

Originally posted by juggerman
Vader more so than Zant

His name was cursed in DH1. That's how the Death Eaters found Harry and company after the wedding I just meant in terms of the name being afraid to be spoken despite Voldemort coming for everyone at Hogwarts.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Vader could possibly contend with those two. Zant, while being the Vader to Dorfs Palpatine, is still not well known. Only his people and a few in Hyrule castle knew about him, as everyone else was just soul ****ed without knowing of him. Sure those that did greatly feared him, but great fear among a hundred people is below great fear among thousands. Ok, if Vader is among them give me your top three.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Yes, but that doesn't extend over into Harry Pottwr verse. We see wizards are more powerful than their demi gods. What are you even talking about?

Do you even know?

Is English your first language?

Originally posted by NemeBro
What are you even talking about?

Do you even know?

Is English your first language? That the word demi god doesn't define power especially when comparing it to another fictional universe.


It's like saying Ares the marvel god of war is more powerful than Superman since Hes just an alien.

You made this thread with the caveat that personal power is not to factor into decisions, and stipulated that we are going by who is more feared in their "native" universe.

I wasn't comparing how the demigods would compare to Harry Potter because your OP outright dictated that I shouldn't, how they stack up to Harry Potter doesn't mean a goddamn thing, because we are going by who is more feared in their own universe, not who would be most feared in each other's universe.

Keep the **** up. You made the thread, you should not know less about its point than I do.

Originally posted by NemeBro
You made this thread with the caveat that personal power is not to factor into decisions, and stipulated that we are going by who is more feared in their "native" universe.

I wasn't comparing how the demigods would compare to Harry Potter because your OP outright dictated that I shouldn't, how they stack up to Harry Potter doesn't mean a goddamn thing, because we are going by who is more feared in their own universe, not who would be most feared in each other's universe.

Keep the **** up. You made the thread, you should not know less about its point than I do. Even in their own universe we see a human capable of defeating Sauron despite your demi gods quaking in fear. What made Sauron such a prick to deal with was the power the ring had over this duped world. People weren't afraid to say Sauron's name in the same vein as Voldemort's.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Even in their own universe we see a human capable of defeating Sauron despite your demi gods quaking in fear. Originally posted by quanchi112
This has nothing to do with overall formidability.

Originally posted by NemeBro
We see a human overcoming fear to take him on. We see the Minister of Magic shit his pants at the sight of Lord Voldemort.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Ok, if Vader is among them give me your top three.
Like with Palpy I'm unsure if the fear of Vader matches his reach. Iirc even his followers routinely feared him.

Originally posted by quanchi112
We see a human overcoming fear to take him on. We see the Minister of Magic shit his pants at the sight of Lord Voldemort.

Fudge was an utter tool though. So who cares? Harry openly mocks Voldemort half a dozen times throught the series. Meanwhile Frodo was crapping his pants about being seen by Sauron.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Like with Palpy I'm unsure if the fear of Vader matches his reach. Iirc even his followers routinely feared him. You did not give me your top three.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Fudge was an utter tool though. So who cares? Harry openly mocks Voldemort half a dozen times throught the series. Meanwhile Frodo was crapping his pants about being seen by Sauron. Harry towards the end did so but was still terrified of him despite all this. He also knew the Elder Wand did not answer to Voldemort. Yes, if he was seen by Sauron he was screwed as his henchment would converge on him.

Fudge wielded much power and was not scared of confronting Albus.

Originally posted by quanchi112
You did not give me your top three.
I said Sauron and Voldermort were at the top, then said Vader would likely hang with them.. so..

Originally posted by BloodRain
I said Sauron and Voldermort were at the top, then said Vader would likely hang with them.. so.. Both can't be at the top. Rank them 1-3.

Still waiting.

I like to make them wait

And geez man, I've practically spelt it out: Sauron is slightly above Voldermort, and Vader's like Palpatine for being either above or below them.

Originally posted by BloodRain
I like to make them wait

And geez man, I've practically spelt it out: Sauron is slightly above Voldermort, and Vader's like Palpatine for being either above or below them. Why is Sauron above Voldemort ? I'd like to hear an explanation.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Why is Sauron above Voldemort ? I'd like to hear an explanation.
Threat level, reach, general reaction to him. The only thing thats impressive from Tom is the name thing, which most thought was cursed. Until HP5 everyone who didnt speak his name thought he was dead, so not so much a fear of him especially the students. Post HP5 you had Demontors stopping people from saying it (was told this), so less to do with fear of him. People feared Sauraon on the level at which Harry feared the dememors, and I dont believe anyone feared Tom this much(?).

Originally posted by BloodRain
Threat level, reach, general reaction to him. The only thing thats impressive from Tom is the name thing, which most thought was cursed. Until HP5 everyone who didnt speak his name thought he was dead, so not so much a fear of him especially the students. Post HP5 you had Demontors stopping people from saying it (was told this), so less to do with fear of him. People feared Sauraon on the level at which Harry feared the dememors, and I dont believe anyone feared Tom this much(?). We see McGonagall saying you might as well say his name Hes going o kill you either way. We see even his own Deatheaters were scared shitless of him in Malfoy Manor. What movies were you watching ? They wouldn't even make eye contact they were scared shitless. We see Sauron enter the battlefield and start knocking people back. Sure, they are scared but they do meet him head on. His own men were never terrified of him to the extent Voldemorts own men were.

People feared Voldemort far worse than Harry initially feared the Dementors. Harry had to face Voldemort but he was scared as well.

Originally posted by quanchi112
We see a human overcoming fear to take him on. We see the Minister of Magic shit his pants at the sight of Lord Voldemort. We also see Neville pull a sword out on him.

Originally posted by NemeBro
We also see Neville pull a sword out on him. He got wtf ko'd. We see the human kill Sauron after about 30 or so seconds.

Voldemort is on another level of fear.

All versus forum, let's take a look at the books too guys.


Books Sauron: Sauron almost single handedly turned the tide of battle just by showing up. He had everybody pissing their pants. He hung with Balrogs.

Voldemort: People pissed their pants if they knew about him . I personally view him as lesser, because he was unknown to muggles. Sauron was known to even the most secluded people, if jsut as, "The Enemy".

Vader follows just up. THe whole galaxy was scared of him, but not nearly as much, since a lot weren't rebels.

Originally posted by quanchi112
He got wtf ko'd. We see the human kill Sauron after about 30 or so seconds.

Voldemort is on another level of fear. Originally posted by quanchi112
This has nothing to do with overall formidability.

Originally posted by NemeBro
We see both characters oppose the guy they feared. One won one did not.

Voldemort was more feared than Sauron was.

Originally posted by quanchi112
We see both characters oppose the guy they feared. One won one did not. Originally posted by quanchi112
This has nothing to do with overall formidability.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Voldemort was more feared. His own men were scared shitless of him.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Voldemort was more feared. His own men were scared shitless of him. So were Sauron's.

Originally posted by NemeBro
So were Sauron's. Based on ?

Actually, the orcs serving Sauron out of fear might have been book-only.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Actually, the orcs serving Sauron out of fear might have been book-only. So you agree Voldemort now takes this then.

Not really.

It is the sort of thing that can't be quantified, as I said in my first post.

I'd say it is comfortably between Sauron and Voldemort though.

Although, Palpatine as a contender is interesting. The public don't really fear him, they barely know him at all. But among those that work for him? There does seem to be an atmosphere of dread surrounding his name. Remember, in the words of Vader: "The Emperor is not as forgiving as I am."

Sauron wins. As brought up the entire world feared Sauron and only a small number(wizards and magical creatures) feared Voldemort. Plus many children chose to stand up to Vold regardless of the consequences.

Voldemort is balls.

Is that good or bad?

He was fighting against children and he lost.
You decide.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Not really.

It is the sort of thing that can't be quantified, as I said in my first post.

I'd say it is comfortably between Sauron and Voldemort though.

Although, Palpatine as a contender is interesting. The public don't really fear him, they barely know him at all. But among those that work for him? There does seem to be an atmosphere of dread surrounding his name. Remember, in the words of Vader: "The Emperor is not as forgiving as I am." You can't pinpoint an edge for Sauron though. That's why you should acknowledge Voldemort wins.

Vader knows the truth but the general public does not. He's a politician.

Originally posted by juggerman
Sauron wins. As brought up the entire world feared Sauron and only a small number(wizards and magical creatures) feared Voldemort. Plus many children chose to stand up to Vold regardless of the consequences. Who in Harry Potters world did not fear him ?

People stood up against Sauron despite the consequences. Sauron was also beaten fair and square in combat.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Who in Harry Potters world did not fear him ?

People stood up against Sauron despite the consequences. Sauron was also beaten fair and square in combat.

Muggles

Does affect the fear. Those same guys wouldn't be able to beat Doc Manhattan fair and square but they wouldn't fear him like they did Sauron

Originally posted by juggerman
Muggles

Does affect the fear. Those same guys wouldn't be able to beat Doc Manhattan fair and square but they wouldn't fear him like they did Sauron Due to him being an unknown to muggles. They were going to get to know him had he prevailed.

That's because Manhattan wasn't a bad guy. Throw Voldemort into the Lotr universe and people's heads would be down avoiding eye contact.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Due to him being an unknown to muggles. They were going to get to know him had he prevailed.

That's because Manhattan wasn't a bad guy. Throw Voldemort into the Lotr universe and people's heads would be down avoiding eye contact.

Exactly. Vold is less feared due to being less known in his verse

And that's my point. You saying he was beaten fair and square really didn't affect the fact that he was wildly feared

Originally posted by juggerman
Exactly. Vold is less feared due to being less known in his verse

And that's my point. You saying he was beaten fair and square really didn't affect the fact that he was wildly feared I disagree entirely. That's just scope. By your logic Vader or Palpatne would win by being feared throughout the galaxy.


He wasn't feared to the extent Voldemort was. His own men wouldn't even look him in the eye.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I disagree entirely. That's just scope. By your logic Vader or Palpatne would win by being feared throughout the galaxy.


He wasn't feared to the extent Voldemort was. His own men wouldn't even look him in the eye.

Well no because as you pointed out earlier they were mostly viewed and politicians. They weren't outright feared like most others on this list

Same can be said for the Mandarin. Would you now say he was feared as much as Voldemort?

Originally posted by juggerman
Well no because as you pointed out earlier they were mostly viewed and politicians. They weren't outright feared like most others on this list

Same can be said for the Mandarin. Would you now say he was feared as much as Voldemort? Palpatine was feared by the Rebel Alliance. Vader was feared throughout the galaxy even by his own men.

You are arguing a greater population equals more feared. I disagree.

We're Sauron's men as scared of him as Voldemort's Deatheaters were of him ?

Originally posted by quanchi112
Palpatine was feared by the Rebel Alliance. Vader was feared throughout the galaxy even by his own men.

You are arguing a greater population equals more feared. I disagree.

We're Sauron's men as scared of him as Voldemort's Deatheaters were of him ?

Vader and Palp didn't seem to be feared by everyone as you claim. No one seemed overly fearful to me besides maybe Lando.

Well to be fair we never really see Sauron interact with his men iirc. Voldemort was mostly followed by cowards anyway so it doesn't really say much that they feared him. Wormtail for example was just as scared of Sirius Black and Lupin as he was of Vold.

Besides he would kill his own men so of course they had reason to be afraid of upsetting him. That guy in DH2 clearly was too afraid of Vold that he couldn't talk shit and get killed.

Originally posted by juggerman
Vader and Palp didn't seem to be feared by everyone as you claim. No one seemed overly fearful to me besides maybe Lando.

Well to be fair we never really see Sauron interact with his men iirc. Voldemort was mostly followed by cowards anyway so it doesn't really say much that they feared him. Wormtail for example was just as scared of Sirius Black and Lupin as he was of Vold.

Besides he would kill his own men so of course they had reason to be afraid of upsetting him. That guy in DH2 clearly was too afraid of Vold that he couldn't talk shit and get killed. They were feared by more people which you argued for. Now you backpedal.

Snape was not a coward at all. No, he was far more scared of Voldemort but was a coward at heart.

That's right. Voldemort will kill you on a whim whereas we never see Sauron do so making it completely justified to fear him more.

Originally posted by quanchi112
They were feared by more people which you argued for. Now you backpedal.

Snape was not a coward at all. No, he was far more scared of Voldemort but was a coward at heart.

That's right. Voldemort will kill you on a whim whereas we never see Sauron do so making it completely justified to fear him more.

Not at all. I said most didn't seem to fear them as they were mostly viewed as politicians/government officals.

Snape looked Vold in the eye which you claimed his people are too scared to do. Lestrange also was no too scared to do so. Nor was the amry that attacked Hogwartz at his side.

Not really. At least in my opinion. If they actually tried to defend themselves they would probably be able to do well against Vold. Not win mind you but no one in LotR Verse would even come close to Sauron's power.

Muggles would have just shot Voldemort like the chump he is....there would have been no lameass magic stick challenge there...

Uh... actually you're right. Rowling did say guns/bullets would kill wizards the same as muggles

Originally posted by juggerman
Uh... actually you're right. Rowling did say guns/bullets would kill wizards the same as muggles
Should have kept some m16 in Hogwarts just in case if fishface returns....biscuits

Originally posted by Estacado
Should have kept some m16 in Hogwarts just in case if fishface returns....biscuits

You would think with all the Mud Bloods at Hogwartz that someone would figure out that guns could seriously help at times. Or cell phones lol

Originally posted by juggerman
You would think with all the Mud Bloods at Hogwartz that someone would figure out that guns could seriously help at times. Or cell phones lol
They were probably too young to buy arms so they resorted to their crappy magic stick...

Originally posted by Estacado
They were probably too young to buy arms so they resorted to their crappy magic stick...

No i get that but how many Mud Bloods are adults now? And even if it was just Harry's age group they would still know about guns and could tell the older people about them. "Hey Dumbledore, stop by a Walmart on your way to fight Voldemort and accio a shottie for me"

It would be like this...

1a6WO1g0yGk

Originally posted by quanchi112
You can't pinpoint an edge for Sauron though. That's why you should acknowledge Voldemort wins.

Beings of higher status in LotR fear Sauron, beings of high status like Dumbledore in HP don't fear him at all. There, that is an edge.

You're so desperate.



Vader and those that work for the Empire know, yes.

Originally posted by quanchi112
We see McGonagall saying you might as well say his name Hes going o kill you either way. We see even his own Deatheaters were scared shitless of him in Malfoy Manor. What movies were you watching ? They wouldn't even make eye contact they were scared shitless. We see Sauron enter the battlefield and start knocking people back. Sure, they are scared but they do meet him head on. His own men were never terrified of him to the extent Voldemorts own men were.

People feared Voldemort far worse than Harry initially feared the Dementors. Harry had to face Voldemort but he was scared as well.
Speak of the Devil and he shall appear? Fear was a part of it but it wasn't fear alone, it was partly not to jinx or curse yourself and have him or the Dementors appear, both which could happen. Its like comparing a mob boss to a war tyrant. One can be feared for sadistically killing those that bug him, when the other would be feared for burning your town down.

This is what my first point was about. Their baseline fear is similar and can be argued that ones above the other, its just the main difference is how far that fear spreads. Sauron held his global fear for hundreds of years. Tom held his Britain-span fear from Wizards only for 30 years, 13 of which was basically as the bogeyman myth as 99% of people 'knew' he was dead and gone.

Originally posted by juggerman
Not at all. I said most didn't seem to fear them as they were mostly viewed as politicians/government officals.

Snape looked Vold in the eye which you claimed his people are too scared to do. Lestrange also was no too scared to do so. Nor was the amry that attacked Hogwartz at his side.

Not really. At least in my opinion. If they actually tried to defend themselves they would probably be able to do well against Vold. Not win mind you but no one in LotR Verse would even come close to Sauron's power. Vader was an enforcer but now you distance yourself.

Snape was scared of him and not all were scared to look him in the eye but we scare nonetheless. Voldemort killed Snape so he was actually wrong not to fear him more. Le Strange looked down often. She was scared of him.


They were scared of him. We see him kill one of their own.

A man defeated Sauron one on one. There were no tricks or sabotaged maces just a victory.


Voldemort scared wizards who all had the same basic abilities. That's far more impressive.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Beings of higher status in LotR fear Sauron, beings of high status like Dumbledore in HP don't fear him at all. There, that is an edge.

You're so desperate.



Vader and those that work for the Empire know, yes. Dumbledore feared Voldemort. They all went nuts trying to outplan him and feared him. Heroes faced him but they still feared him. Gandalf and the heroes still defied Sauron all the same.


I'm winning.


Ok and ?

Originally posted by quanchi112
Dumbledore feared Voldemort. Prove it.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Vader was an enforcer but now you distance yourself.

Snape was scared of him and not all were scared to look him in the eye but we scare nonetheless. Voldemort killed Snape so he was actually wrong not to fear him more. Le Strange looked down often. She was scared of him.


They were scared of him. We see him kill one of their own.

A man defeated Sauron one on one. There were no tricks or sabotaged maces just a victory.


Voldemort scared wizards who all had the same basic abilities. That's far more impressive.

Vader is not in this. You should stay on topic. But since it's out there I'll play. No one was seen to fear Vader like these others were feared. Even in his presence people talked shit right to his face err mask. I only remember Lando being actually afraid of him. The title "enforcer" doesn't really mean anything here

Snape was working against him. Fear didn't stop him. Lestrange was in love with him. She was afraid yes but not to the point you seem to think

He wasn't too scared to not speak out. You give him too much credit. Mob bosses hold that level of fear

Didn't really affect them fearing him tho. Besides context is everything. No one would have been able to replicate that since it only occured due to him letting down his guard and reaching for something and a lucky shot. everyone else was scared shitless. No one even attacked him and he was mere feet away.

Voldemort did, but again not everyone was scared of him. Kids had the nerve to stand against him. Openly i might add. Weak kids....

Originally posted by quanchi112
Dumbledore feared Voldemort.

Negative

Originally posted by NemeBro
Prove it. It is rather obvious they all feared him. They'd be stupid not too.

Originally posted by juggerman
Vader is not in this. You should stay on topic. But since it's out there I'll play. No one was seen to fear Vader like these others were feared. Even in his presence people talked shit right to his face err mask. I only remember Lando being actually afraid of him. The title "enforcer" doesn't really mean anything here

Snape was working against him. Fear didn't stop him. Lestrange was in love with him. She was afraid yes but not to the point you seem to think

He wasn't too scared to not speak out. You give him too much credit. Mob bosses hold that level of fear

Didn't really affect them fearing him tho. Besides context is everything. No one would have been able to replicate that since it only occured due to him letting down his guard and reaching for something and a lucky shot. everyone else was scared shitless. No one even attacked him and he was mere feet away.

Voldemort did, but again not everyone was scared of him. Kids had the nerve to stand against him. Openly i might add. Weak kids.... I gave an example to show you the error of your ways. His own men feared him as did the rebels. Vader was feared but the only reason I bring it up is because he was feared in a universe which now as bigger that that doesn't mean anything.

Yes, secretly working against him. He died. He shoved her down when she tried to help him up.

He was scared of Voldemort before he attacked him.


Just like heroes attacking Voldemort were scared too. I did not say it was something which could occur again I just said your while Hes on another level is shit since a human far less powerful still beat him.

Kids has no choice. They were also aided by adults. Harry was marked so he had no choice but to resist as he was not going to stop.

You can't change the fact that Voldemort was more feared by his own men than Sauron.

Originally posted by juggerman
Negative Why wouldn't he fear him. ?

Originally posted by quanchi112
I gave an example to show you the error of your ways. His own men feared him as did the rebels. Vader was feared but the only reason I bring it up is because he was feared in a universe which now as bigger that that doesn't mean anything.

Yes, secretly working against him. He died. He shoved her down when she tried to help him up.

He was scared of Voldemort before he attacked him.


Just like heroes attacking Voldemort were scared too. I did not say it was something which could occur again I just said your while Hes on another level is shit since a human far less powerful still beat him.

Kids has no choice. They were also aided by adults. Harry was marked so he had no choice but to resist as he was not going to stop.

You can't change the fact that Voldemort was more feared by his own men than Sauron.

He still wasn't feared by more people which was your arguement. If you believe he was then i assume you'll be providing some actual evidence besides simply saying "enforcer" and "bigger universe'

And lying to his face on a daily. Not too afraid to work successfully against the man. And her being shoved shows her fear now?

Not too scared that he didn't speak out. You're tring to make it seem like everyone was acting like Wormtail when they clearly were not. they feared him no more than a druglord is feared by his men

Vold's entire army was being attacked while he was right there with them. But as soon as Sauron showed up everyone stopped dead in their tracks. Speaks volumes.

Ron had no choice? Or Hermione? Neville? They all had choices and they chose to stand against him.

We don't know that for sure as Sauron was not shon around his men. But Sauron was clearly feared by his enemies more.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Why wouldn't he fear him. ?

Nothing shows him fearing Voldemort. Just cuz most others did does not mean he automatically did as well

Originally posted by juggerman
He still wasn't feared by more people which was your arguement. If you believe he was then i assume you'll be providing some actual evidence besides simply saying "enforcer" and "bigger universe'

And lying to his face on a daily. Not too afraid to work successfully against the man. And her being shoved shows her fear now?

Not too scared that he didn't speak out. You're tring to make it seem like everyone was acting like Wormtail when they clearly were not. they feared him no more than a druglord is feared by his men

Vold's entire army was being attacked while he was right there with them. But as soon as Sauron showed up everyone stopped dead in their tracks. Speaks volumes.

Ron had no choice? Or Hermione? Neville? They all had choices and they chose to stand against him.

We don't know that for sure as Sauron was not shon around his men. But Sauron was clearly feared by his enemies more.



Nothing shows him fearing Voldemort. Just cuz most others did does not mean he automatically did as well It's pretty obvious since Vader was generally known throughout the galaxy. Galaxy>>planets in terms of populations.

He worked against him in secret. That's what cowards do. Yes, she wouldn't look up and say anything. Voldemort ruled his troops mercilessly.

Feared him far more than a drug lord as they wouldn't even back talk him, ever.

They were in awe of the ring. It holds dominion over them. Got over their fear in 15 seconds. Hogwarts stood in attention and allowed Voldemort to speak and tell them he'd kill those who did not join. Neville back talked as Voldemort laughed at him. Harry jumped up causing a sea of panic and confusion since they all thought he was dead.

Yes, as did the armies who stood against Sauron. Sauron feared Aragorn for crying out loud. He feared someone far less powerful than himself.

No, he was not. Completely false. They weren't afraid to speak his name.

We see the fear on him and the fear on him in his memories with Snape trying to plan against Voldemort.

Like a drug lord?

Originally posted by BloodRain
Like a drug lord? People backstab and rat out drug lords all the time. Drug lords don't overtake the governments they oppose. Voldemort was the baddest wizard in existence.

Originally posted by quanchi112
It's pretty obvious since Vader was generally known throughout the galaxy. Galaxy>>planets in terms of populations.

He worked against him in secret. That's what cowards do. Yes, she wouldn't look up and say anything. Voldemort ruled his troops mercilessly.

Feared him far more than a drug lord as they wouldn't even back talk him, ever.

They were in awe of the ring. It holds dominion over them. Got over their fear in 15 seconds. Hogwarts stood in attention and allowed Voldemort to speak and tell them he'd kill those who did not join. Neville back talked as Voldemort laughed at him. Harry jumped up causing a sea of panic and confusion since they all thought he was dead.

Yes, as did the armies who stood against Sauron. Sauron feared Aragorn for crying out loud. He feared someone far less powerful than himself.

No, he was not. Completely false. They weren't afraid to speak his name.

We see the fear on him and the fear on him in his memories with Snape trying to plan against Voldemort.

Known=/=feared. Try again

Ruled doesn't automatically prove he was feared to the extent you claim. And clearly he didn't since Snape and Black betrayed him which led to his downfall

Same with drug lords buddy. Hell the Mandarin held that kind of power and he was just a pawn

Sauron was swinging and killing unmolested. Not one person as much as tried to attack him even tho they were being cut down like grass. Of course they stunned that Harry(their one believed hope) was dead. Neville walked right up to Voldemort and told him what's what. He was not scared of Vold at all

Armies stood against his armies. Once he showed up they all froze even while being slaughtered. Who/what they fear has no bearing on the fear they instill in others so moot point

He was, you know it. They were only afraid to speak Vold's name cuz they believed it to be cursed which is highly possible in that world. Not impressive as KIDS were not scared.

In the memories he feared for Lily, James and Harry. He was never shown to fear him and we even see him stroll right up to Vold and shit talk him. He was not scared

Originally posted by BloodRain
Like a drug lord?

Pretty much

Originally posted by quanchi112
People backstab and rat out drug lords all the time. Drug lords don't overtake the governments they oppose. Voldemort was the baddest wizard in existence.

You mean exactly like Vold was back stabbed and ratted out by Snape and Black?

EDIT: And even Malfoy's mom? And i believe Wormtail even ended up helping the kids get out of the Malfoy's house

Originally posted by juggerman
Known=/=feared. Try again

Ruled doesn't automatically prove he was feared to the extent you claim. And clearly he didn't since Snape and Black betrayed him which led to his downfall

Same with drug lords buddy. Hell the Mandarin held that kind of power and he was just a pawn

Sauron was swinging and killing unmolested. Not one person as much as tried to attack him even tho they were being cut down like grass. Of course they stunned that Harry(their one believed hope) was dead. Neville walked right up to Voldemort and told him what's what. He was not scared of Vold at all

Armies stood against his armies. Once he showed up they all froze even while being slaughtered. Who/what they fear has no bearing on the fear they instill in others so moot point

He was, you know it. They were only afraid to speak Vold's name cuz they believed it to be cursed which is highly possible in that world. Not impressive as KIDS were not scared.

In the memories he feared for Lily, James and Harry. He was never shown to fear him and we even see him stroll right up to Vold and shit talk him. He was not scared He was feared through his actions. His reputation spoke for itself.

You can fear someone and still betray them. Case in point.

Difference is Voldemort was not all smoke and mirrors. Everyone held the same abilities and they all still feared him making him even more impressive.

Sauron was defeated quickly by someone who held far less powerful. People weren't giving speeches and this was a speech allowed by Voldemort. The other was an example of a battlefield type scenario. Neville still feared him but defied him.

People were afraid of Voldemort in the same manner. Like I said not comparable entirely due to the ring being in play there.

False as McGonagall clearly says speak his name Hes going to kill you either way.

When did he ever talk shit to Voldemort ? He was calling him my lord right before he attacked and had him killed.

Originally posted by juggerman
Pretty much



You mean exactly like Vold was back stabbed and ratted out by Snape and Black?

EDIT: And even Malfoy's mom? And i believe Wormtail even ended up helping the kids get out of the Malfoy's house Snape was killed and people still opposed him.


She lied for her son. She was scared to death of Voldemort.

Sauron feared Aragorn.

Lackeys don't talk back to the boss which I assume is the point here.. this would make Snape the undercover cop, and Dumbledore the Chief. Sweet.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Lackeys don't talk back to the boss which I assume is the point here.. this would make Snape the undercover cop, and Dumbledore the Chief. Sweet. Snape sat there as Voldemort had him killed. Voldemort owned the wizarding world.

Snape got killed, point?

Originally posted by BloodRain
Snape got killed, point? He didn't even object to try to defend himself.

Why would he? Seemed quite proud in setting up Tom's downfall.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Why would he? Seemed quite proud in setting up Tom's downfall. The downfall was not a sure thing. He obviously did not want to die. Voldemort was just that scary.

A major wrench in the works. Thing is there weren't objections at this point. Tom knew about the wands function and logically who the master would be. Nothing to say and at wandpoint nothing to do. Snape danced with the devil, deceived him and showed no fear in doing so. Even with Tom saying he's going die this second.

Originally posted by BloodRain
A major wrench in the works. Thing is there weren't objections at this point. Tom knew about the wands function and logically who the master would be. Nothing to say and at wandpoint nothing to do. Snape danced with the devil, deceived him and showed no fear in doing so. Even with Tom saying he's going die this second. Him saying my Lord irrc right at the point of his awareness clearly displaying a panicked look on his face at the point of death.

As per his character as Tom's underling. His expression and tone stayed constant whilst saying that line.

Originally posted by BloodRain
As per his character as Tom's underling. His expression and tone stayed constant whilst saying that line. No, he looked scared and even more terrified when he was about to die.

Just watched it, I'd go as low a 99% consistent.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Just watched it, I'd go as low a 99% consistent. So you are saying he was not scared ? Lol.

At best we can reach and say he was afraid of dying, as all mortals are. To a notable degree? Not at all.

Originally posted by BloodRain
At best we can reach and say he was afraid of dying, as all mortals are. To a notable degree? Not at all. So you admit he feared Voldemort since he orchestrated his death.

Originally posted by quanchi112
He was feared through his actions. His reputation spoke for itself.

You can fear someone and still betray them. Case in point.

Difference is Voldemort was not all smoke and mirrors. Everyone held the same abilities and they all still feared him making him even more impressive.

Sauron was defeated quickly by someone who held far less powerful. People weren't giving speeches and this was a speech allowed by Voldemort. The other was an example of a battlefield type scenario. Neville still feared him but defied him.

People were afraid of Voldemort in the same manner. Like I said not comparable entirely due to the ring being in play there.

False as McGonagall clearly says speak his name Hes going to kill you either way.

When did he ever talk shit to Voldemort ? He was calling him my lord right before he attacked and had him killed.

Sauron more so

True but you made it seem like the fear made them almost immobile. clearly it did not

Same as humans right? A guy with a gun can pretty much kill you the same as another guy with a gun yet drug lords are still feared greatly by their men who could kill them at any time but don't

Voldemort was destroyed by a baby(popular belief). No one beaten by a warrior in battle could be held to a lower standard

Not at all. People stood against Vold and fought. They froze for Sauron and allowed themselves to be slaughtered

They clearly believed his name to be cursed as stated in the very 1st movie. No need to keep from saying it if you're about to die regardless. Kinda like someone having lung cancer, no need to say away from cigerettes now

We were talking about Dumbledore

Originally posted by quanchi112
So you admit he feared Voldemort since he orchestrated his death.
I said death, not Tom. Whatever you think, Snape showed no fear in the face of Tom and his own death.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Snape was killed and people still opposed him.


She lied for her son. She was scared to death of Voldemort.

Sauron feared Aragorn.

Huh?

And people that back stab drug lord often do so for the sake of their family. She could have easily taken harry's answer and them shouted "Thanks, he's still alive"

Means nothing here

Originally posted by BloodRain
I said death, not Tom. Whatever you think, Snape showed no fear in the face of Tom and his own death. You said he feared death which Tom provided. You can't have it both ways.

Originally posted by juggerman
Huh?

And people that back stab drug lord often do so for the sake of their family. She could have easily taken harry's answer and them shouted "Thanks, he's still alive"

Means nothing here She was scared of Voldemort and did not agree with what he was doing but was too scared to act against him. He used her sons life as leverage to manipulate him into killing Albus.

You are wrong.

Originally posted by juggerman
Sauron more so

True but you made it seem like the fear made them almost immobile. clearly it did not

Same as humans right? A guy with a gun can pretty much kill you the same as another guy with a gun yet drug lords are still feared greatly by their men who could kill them at any time but don't

Voldemort was destroyed by a baby(popular belief). No one beaten by a warrior in battle could be held to a lower standard

Not at all. People stood against Vold and fought. They froze for Sauron and allowed themselves to be slaughtered

They clearly believed his name to be cursed as stated in the very 1st movie. No need to keep from saying it if you're about to die regardless. Kinda like someone having lung cancer, no need to say away from cigerettes now

We were talking about Dumbledore Wrong.

I explained myself just nicely.

Different as they are all capable of superhuman things and on even ground. Sauron had the ring which granted him greater power than everyone else.

Due to his wife's involvement. She offered him protection.

Just like stood against Sauron and fought. The ting had power over them and they quickly got over it.

We see McGonagall tell a fellow teacher he can say the name as he is going to try to kill you either way.

People weren't scared to say Sauron.

He was fearful of Voldemort as you can plainly see the look on his face.

Originally posted by quanchi112
You said he feared death which Tom provided. You can't have it both ways.
I said if we reach to say there was fear. Nothing was shown though.

Originally posted by BloodRain
I said if we reach to say there was fear. Nothing was shown though. If you want to deny the obvious don't expect me to do the same.

Who's the one denying the very scene? Watch it and witness the lack of fear.

Originally posted by quanchi112
She was scared of Voldemort and did not agree with what he was doing but was too scared to act against him. He used her sons life as leverage to manipulate him into killing Albus.

You are wrong.

And she acted against him which helped lead to his down fall.

Whom they feared doesn't alter anything here

Originally posted by quanchi112
Wrong.

I explained myself just nicely.

Different as they are all capable of superhuman things and on even ground. Sauron had the ring which granted him greater power than everyone else.

Due to his wife's involvement. She offered him protection.

Just like stood against Sauron and fought. The ting had power over them and they quickly got over it.

We see McGonagall tell a fellow teacher he can say the name as he is going to try to kill you either way.

People weren't scared to say Sauron.

He was fearful of Voldemort as you can plainly see the look on his face.

Disagree. Let's move on

And i explained how you were wrong

As humans with guns are on the same level. You seem to think Vold was overly impressive cuz he kept his men in fear as a drug lord might. Not that impressive imo

People did not know that so your point is moot. Popular belief was that a baby Potter defeated the most powerful dark wizard in history. Defeated on the battlefield is much more impressive than that

Wrong watch the scene again. They just stood there. No one attacked him except that one man that cut the ring off. That's far more fear than was ever shown to Tom

Again they believed the word to be cursed as can happen in that verse. No need to fear a curse if you believe you're going to die regardless

See above

Negative. He never showed fear of Tom.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Who's the one denying the very scene? Watch it and witness the lack of fear. When he says my Lord again you can plainly see the fear and again at the point of death.

Originally posted by juggerman
And she acted against him which helped lead to his down fall.

Whom they feared doesn't alter anything here She still feared him and did not try to stop him from threatening her own son.

She feared him. She betrayed him but greatly feared him so irrelevant.

Originally posted by juggerman
Disagree. Let's move on

And i explained how you were wrong

As humans with guns are on the same level. You seem to think Vold was overly impressive cuz he kept his men in fear as a drug lord might. Not that impressive imo

People did not know that so your point is moot. Popular belief was that a baby Potter defeated the most powerful dark wizard in history. Defeated on the battlefield is much more impressive than that

Wrong watch the scene again. They just stood there. No one attacked him except that one man that cut the ring off. That's far more fear than was ever shown to Tom

Again they believed the word to be cursed as can happen in that verse. No need to fear a curse if you believe you're going to die regardless

See above

Negative. He never showed fear of Tom. Fine.

You were incorrect.

He was more formidable than a drug lord with a gun. He assured his own immortality which is another reason people feared him.

We see the truth and despite this people still greatly feared him. The Minister of Magic shit his pants at the mere sight of him.

They were in awe of the ring and he was taken down pretty quickly. He stabbed the ring off his hand. Tom's voice had people shitting their pants far more than Sauron ever did even while on the battlefield.

She did not tell he he'd die but that he'd try to kill him either way.

During their fight, in preparation of trying to outplan him, etc.


To not fear him is downright stupid. He will kill you.

Originally posted by quanchi112
When he says my Lord again you can plainly see the fear and again at the point of death. Cant compare him actually dying to just the potential of it. And think about it from what you said; Snape is alone with the Tom talking to him about the EW situation calmly. And when is this fear shown? When Tom's about to pull the trigger. If someone's about to shoot you, who it is doesn't change the fact that you're dead in half a second. Fearing death doesn't mean he's fearing Tom, right?

Originally posted by BloodRain
Cant compare him actually dying to just the potential of it. And think about it from what you said; Snape is alone with the Tom talking to him about the EW situation calmly. And when is this fear shown? When Tom's about to pull the trigger. If someone's about to shoot you, who it is doesn't change the fact that you're dead in half a second. Fearing death doesn't mean he's fearing Tom, right? Yes, we can as he clearly fears death. When he says my lord that is where he shows fear.

You fear someone killing you so you fear the guy with the power to do so.

Except the fear your talking about didn't appear until the trigger was to be pulled. Point if if he showed fear it was minuscule and mostly related to the idea of dying. Snape did not fear Tom for Tom.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Except the fear your talking about didn't appear until the trigger was to be pulled. Point if if he showed fear it was minuscule and mostly related to the idea of dying. Snape did not fear Tom for Tom. Yes, he did. If he did not fear Tom he wouldn't allow him to order him around and would take vengeance for killing his love.


He was scared of him. Obvious.

He was playing his part. Disobeying him and going on his own offensive would have gotten him killed

If you can show me the times he was..

Originally posted by BloodRain
He was playing his part. Disobeying him and going on his own offensive would have gotten him killed

If you can show me the times he was.. He was still killed.


At least go out with some dignity not like some submissive chump.

I already have you are pretending now people don't fear other people for hurting or killing them. That's why people feared Voldemort.

Yes, after putting a wrench in the works. Playing his part did more than attacking ever would.


So they feared him like a druglord or mob boss?

Originally posted by BloodRain
Yes, after putting a wrench in the works. Playing his part did more than attacking ever would.


So they feared him like a druglord or mob boss? He sat there as Voldemort attacked and had him killed.


In a sense but the point is people have a high fear of drug lords but I see Voldemort as the one and only true threat.

When someone points a gun at you, what do you do? Tom hit him before Snape had time to act.


Never denied nearly everyone fearing him (the Snape thing is that not every single person did), thats why I feel he's a close second in this thread matchup. And the main reason I put Sauron above is as its like comparing a mob boss to a war tyrant. Similar fear on two different scales.