Elderly Japanese man suing Broadcaster over "excessive use of English"

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Omega Vision

Ushgarak
His view is inept for two reasons. First, study of language evolution shows that adoption of other terms is a sign of cultural strength, not weakness. Second, from the point of view of someone wanting to freeze their culture into a prior form- a ridiculous notion in any case- trying to do this by language manipulation will fail, as all previous attempts have failed. Language reflects the culture, it does not create it (not in that sense anyway). If the Japanese are using more Americanisms and the like, that's a reflection of how the culture is changing. Trying to stamp out the symptoms of that will not deal with the underlying cause- and it's like trying to hold back the tide anyway.

Omega Vision
Originally posted by Ushgarak
His view is inept for two reasons. First, study of language evolution shows that adoption of other terms is a sign of cultural strength, not weakness. Second, from the point of view of someone wanting to freeze their culture into a prior form- a ridiculous notion in any case- trying to do this by language manipulation will fail, as all previous attempts have failed. Language reflects the culture, it does not create it (not in that sense anyway). If the Japanese are using more Americanisms and the like, that's a reflection of how the culture is changing. Trying to stamp out the symptoms of that will not deal with the underlying cause- and it's like trying to hold back the tide anyway.
It's not even that they're using actual English words, it seems as if they're using Japanizations of English words, something similar to what happened in Middle English with French and Norman. It's not even as bad as what's happening in Europe where French people will say "bon shopping" or in Germany where mothers give their children "time out"

But I think the fact that the man is asking for such a small sum shows that this is a symbolic protest more than anything.

Ushgarak
That's the normal pattern outside of Europe, particularly in languages with a different writing system where just taking the word entire is not so straightforward.

English and French have been nicking words whole off each other for many centuries.

Archaeopteryx
I guess America isn't the only place that's sue happy

ArtificialGlory
These borrowed words just sound phony as all hell. Why don't they use native Japanese variants? Don't tell me they don't have Japanese words for "risk" and "trouble", etc.

Lord Lucien
Originally posted by ArtificialGlory
These borrowed words just sound phony as all hell. Why don't they use native Japanese variants? Don't tell me they don't have Japanese words for "risk" and "trouble", etc. No cuz they'll just come off as "wisk" and twubbwe."

Omega Vision
Originally posted by ArtificialGlory
These borrowed words just sound phony as all hell. Why don't they use native Japanese variants? Don't tell me they don't have Japanese words for "risk" and "trouble", etc.
They do, but there's probably a certain exoticism at work, perhaps a sense that these words by virtue of their foreignness have greater impact.

For instance, there are words in English to express "bon appetit," but because bon appetit sounds better than "good appetite" or "good eating" we use bon appetit.

You also can't forget that English is a status language in most of the world. It's the language of diplomacy and pop culture. For lack of a better word, English is "cool"

Archaeopteryx
I held the door for a Japanese guy the other day. He said "Sank you" to which I replied "No need to brag about pearl harbor".

Robtard
Originally posted by Omega Vision
But I think the fact that the man is asking for such a small sum shows that this is a symbolic protest more than anything.

He probably has some level of senility and believes $14,000 is a lot of money, like it was back in the 40's.

Darth Jello
How is this surprising? Does anyone need to be reminded about what the Japanese did the very first time they got sick of Western Culture "invading" their shores? Hideyoshi and his successors put their contemporary, Ivan The Terrible and Vlad Dracula one hundred years earlier to shame.

Lord Lucien
They also had samurai, who were the noblest of all people to walk the Earth since Jesus killed Judas with a katana. Samurai negate anything bad about Japan.

Omega Vision
Originally posted by Darth Jello
their contemporary, Ivan The Terrible and Vlad Dracula one hundred years earlier to shame.
If there's a century's difference, then they're not contemporaries.

That's like saying we're contemporaries of Rasputin.

Darth Jello
Originally posted by Omega Vision
If there's a century's difference, then they're not contemporaries.

That's like saying we're contemporaries of Rasputin. There's a century difference with Dracula. Ivan the Terrible was a contemporary.

As for Samurai, I feel like rather than blind admiration, people should read history and what happened as opposed to admiring Bushido blindly and giving too much credence to the popular view, which is essentially the view of the Japanese nobility. Romanticize the concept if you'd like, but don't forget that when you get right down to it, the Samurai were just a bunch of mafia-style thugs fighting out petty disputes between lords in high castles while keeping the peasantry oppressed. They're guilty of as much pillaging, rape, and genocide as their European counterparts.

Bardock42
I don't get what that has to do with this frail, old Japanese man not understanding English so good though...

Darth Jello
I'm saying that this isn't surprising because the Japanese culture has a long history of Xenophobia related to a supposed corruption of their traditions, especially against Europeans.

This old man's lawsuit isn't logical but it isn't necessarily out of place either.

Bardock42
Originally posted by Darth Jello
I'm saying that this isn't surprising because the Japanese culture has a long history of Xenophobia related to a supposed corruption of their traditions, especially against Europeans.

This old man's lawsuit isn't logical but it isn't necessarily out of place either.

It's also not surprising cause the exact same (and somewhat fringe) tendencies of "protecting the language" can be found all over Europe (France being one of the most extreme examples), we have these tendencies in Germany as well and a disdain for what is called "Denglish", as well as in the US (especially towards Spanish) and probably absolutely everywhere else.

Hardly evidence of Japan's xenophobia, if anything it is a sign of the opposite, as there is a lot of inclusion and assimilation of foreign words in Japanese and the broadcast media embraces it. (although there is immense xenophobia in Japan, not denying that, your argument just isn't sound).

siriuswriter
I recently read a book about this subject - Japanese wanting to stay pure, but having to deal with the popularity of some American things... fictional, but pretty true to life.
"American Fuji."

Well and then there's that movie with Sean Connery where he knows all the ins and outs of courtesy.

I know they're entertainment, but art usually imitates life.

Bardock42
Like "Birth of a Nation" and "Triumph of the Will"

siriuswriter
Oh please. Birth of a Nation was just trying to show us how people used to be really creative with their sheets.

dadudemon
Originally posted by Archaeopteryx
I held the door for a Japanese guy the other day. He said "Sank you" to which I replied "No need to brag about pearl harbor".

lulz


You crotchety old man.

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