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Current Atrocitus.

http://i1245.photobucket.com/albums/gg587/golgi7777/HELs_zps2bb5ffc5.jpeg

vs

http://i1245.photobucket.com/albums/gg587/golgi7777/ATRO_zpsf7bb3e5a.jpg

Helspont. He was able to beat Superman in a few occasions. I don't see Atrocitus doing it like that

I agree, but I still think it would be a good fight.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
Helspont. He was able to beat Superman in a few occasions. I don't see Atrocitus doing it like that


Uhmmm, hmmmm. You realize that one guy does not equate to the other. Superman really isn't the benchmark for every character out there under the sun. Majestic is a match for Helspont, so I think Atrocitus would be able to do as good or better against Helspont.

Atrocitus gets my vote for the win.

Atro.. for now.

Current Helspont definitely.

He casually beat the shit out of Superman. Atros definitely can't do that.

Originally posted by Cogito
Current Helspont definitely.

He casually beat the shit out of Superman. Atros definitely can't do that.


Superman and Atrocitus have different power sets. What worked on Superman won't necessarily work on Atrocitus. We don't even know what type of attack it was that Helspont hit Superman with, and as far as we know it could have been a concentrated TP assault that Superman was hit with. This type of attack may not be as effective on Atrocitus.

Originally posted by Stoic
Superman and Atrocitus have different power sets. What worked on Superman won't necessarily work on Atrocitus. We don't even know what type of attack it was that Helspont hit Superman with, and as far as we know it could have been a concentrated TP assault that Superman was hit with. This type of attack may not be as effective on Atrocitus.

Helspont owned Superman with even a casual backhand.

Originally posted by Cogito
Helspont owned Superman with even a casual backhand.


How does this equate to him doing the same to Atrocitus? Once again, these are two different characters, and this also happened before Superman's biggest feat, or before he fully settled into his powers.

Originally posted by Stoic
How does this equate to him doing the same to Atrocitus? Once again, these are two different characters, and this also happened before Superman's biggest feat, or before he fully settled into his powers.

The better question is why wouldn't it work on Atrocitus?

I've probably read every comic Atrocitus has ever appeared in, and I don't see any reason why he'd fare better against Helspont's casual backhand than Superman. Even if he did, how would he do against an actual punch?

Originally posted by Cogito
The better question is why wouldn't it work on Atrocitus?

I've probably read every comic Atrocitus has ever appeared in, and I don't see any reason why he'd fare better against Helspont's casual backhand than Superman. Even if he did, how would he do against an actual punch?


A weakened Atrocitus was beating the hell out of Apollo and J'onn. He physically tore a hole through a hyperspace tunnel. What proof do you have that a fully powered Atrocitus wouldn't defeat Helspont? It seems to me that Atrocitus has more feats than Helspont, and the one time that he KO'd Superman is not enough proof to say or define him as being a true Herald stomper. First we need to find out what type of attack it was that he hit Superman with, because it appeared to be more than just a physical assault, and more of a TP one, which will not affect Atrocitus on the same level. There are those that are more resilieint to certain attacks, so perhaps you shouldn't use Superman's defeat as some kind of indicator that he'd do the same to a character that is more resistant to these types of attacks.

Helspont

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Helspont


Based on?

Helspont currently has better feats. Atro will make it a fight tho.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Helspont currently has better feats. Atro will make it a fight tho.

But what were the bulk of the nature of these feats?

Mostly his showings against current superman.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Mostly his showings against current superman.


That's my point. Superman and Atrocitus are two different characters with totally different powers. Attrocitus is a very powerful hard light character with specific defenses against spiritual, and psychic assaults. Superman is a very powerful character, but he's a physical one. A powerful physical one but a physical one all the same.Do you see what I'm aiming at?

Originally posted by Stoic
Based on?
Based on a 2nd tier GL a la Gardner absolutely punking Atro.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Based on a 2nd tier GL a la Gardner absolutely punking Atro.




Never read that, but Helspont isn't hard light, and may not be able to replicate that feat against Atrocitus. Gardner imo wouldn't be able to run the bag off of J'onn and Apollo.

Originally posted by Stoic
That's my point. Superman and Atrocitus are two different characters with totally different powers. Attrocitus is a very powerful hard light character with specific defenses against spiritual, and psychic assaults. Superman is a very powerful character, but he's a physical one. A powerful physical one but a physical one all the same.Do you see what I'm aiming at?

Yes; i just dont think it makes as much of a difference as you do.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Based on a 2nd tier GL a la Gardner absolutely punking Atro.

And what exactly does Helspont being punked by Grifter speak to then?

Originally posted by ODG
And what exactly does Helspont being punked by Grifter speak to then?

Grifter>>>>Guy. Deal with it.

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Even%20More%20Random/Phail22.jpg

Originally posted by Stoic
That's my point. Superman and Atrocitus are two different characters with totally different powers. Attrocitus is a very powerful hard light character with specific defenses against spiritual, and psychic assaults. Superman is a very powerful character, but he's a physical one. A powerful physical one but a physical one all the same.Do you see what I'm aiming at?

Originally posted by ODG
And what exactly does Helspont being punked by Grifter speak to then?
Hoping no one would bring that up..

Thank you for that.

Am I the only one who thinks Guy beating Atros h2h is pure retarded?
I mean it's like he beat a Hulk type of guy in melee....ermm

lol, that's why your set changed

Guy just stopped holding back.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
lol, that's why your set changed
What set?

lol damn, you even repressed the memory of it

If you meant to say sig and avatar.I have been using MOS sig since may I just changed it to LOS 2....ermm

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Guy just stopped holding back.

#PeoplesChampion

Originally posted by Estacado
If you meant to say sig and avatar.I have been using MOS sig since may I just changed it to LOS 2....ermm Originally posted by Mindset
Nope.

Come at me.

Originally posted by Stoic
Uhmmm, hmmmm. You realize that one guy does not equate to the other. Superman really isn't the benchmark for every character out there under the sun. Majestic is a match for Helspont, so I think Atrocitus would be able to do as good or better against Helspont.

Atrocitus gets my vote for the win. Yes, but the way Helspont handled Superman showed a vast gap in their power levels.

I don't see Atrocitus casully owning Kal-El like Helspont did.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
#PeoplesChampion

A better fight would be Gardner vs Helspont ;D

Originally posted by Zack Fair
Yes, but the way Helspont handled Superman showed a vast gap in their power levels.

I don't see Atrocitus casully owning Kal-El like Helspont did.


Superman takes full damage, from magical attacks, and if those magical attacks happen to be laced with psychic energy he may take double the damage, whereas a hard light user has specific defenses against these types of attacks.

This is why using Superman as a benchmark in place of Atrocitus is wrong. I bet Captain Marvel would have done better against Helspont.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Guy just stopped holding back. http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Even%20More%20Random/Phail04.jpg

Originally posted by Golgo13
Current Atrocitus.

http://i1245.photobucket.com/albums/gg587/golgi7777/HELs_zps2bb5ffc5.jpeg

Lol, looks like Helspont is giving Superman the puppet treatment. Those tentacles got enter somewhere.

Originally posted by Stoic
Superman takes full damage, from magical attacks, and if those magical attacks happen to be laced with psychic energy he may take double the damage, whereas a hard light user has specific defenses against these types of attacks.

This is why using Superman as a benchmark in place of Atrocitus is wrong. I bet Captain Marvel would have done better against Helspont.

Wait; Helspont's attacks were magical in origin?

Originally posted by -Pr-
Wait; Helspont's attacks were magical in origin?



Yep he's a magical TP type of funky ass creature. Kind of like Despero.

Originally posted by Stoic
Yep he's a magical TP type of funky ass creature. Kind of like Despero. ???

Originally posted by Stoic
Yep he's a magical TP type of funky ass creature. Kind of like Despero.

He is? I never got that impression.

Originally posted by Stoic
Uhmmm, hmmmm. You realize that one guy does not equate to the other. Superman really isn't the benchmark for every character out there under the sun. Majestic is a match for Helspont, so I think Atrocitus would be able to do as good or better against Helspont.

Atrocitus gets my vote for the win. You are delusional to think Atrocitus can even win. Sure, he has decent feats but seriously, he gets destroyed. Superman got K.O'ed numerous of times in 1-3 punches. The fact that various Green Lanterns have been able to stalemate Atrocitus at times while losing to Superman should tell you who is truly superior.

Also, a bit weird to say Helspont's attack is magical? Can you indicated where it even hinted that?

Helspont thrashed Superman before he came to the realization that he needed to push himself harder than ever, in order to further develop his abilities. This was explicitly stated in Superman #13-- the same issue in which he bench-presses planetary weight for days on end. If Supes were to face 'spont now, chances are that the outcome would be different-- Superman's battle with H'el was indicative enough of that, imho.

Anyhow, 'spont likely wins.

Originally posted by Galan007
Helspont thrashed Superman before he came to the realization that he needed to push himself harder than ever, in order to further develop his abilities. This was explicitly stated in Superman #13-- the same issue in which he bench-presses planetary weight for days on end. If Supes were to face 'spont now, chances are that the outcome would be different-- Superman's battle with H'el was indicative enough of that, imho.

Anyhow, 'spont likely wins.

Really? feel like Superman needs to go a lot further.

It's not like he did that much against H'el. He hit him really hard. That's not going beyond, that's not really going a tiny bit further

Superman still did much better than anyone else against H'el. At one point during issue #17, Superman even appeared to have the advantage until he got distracted.

At any rate, I'm not necessarily saying that Superman could beat Helspont currently-- just that he would almost certainly put up a much better fight than he did before entering his current 'no holding back' mindset.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
You are delusional to think Atrocitus can even win. Sure, he has decent feats but seriously, he gets destroyed. Superman got K.O'ed numerous of times in 1-3 punches. The fact that various Green Lanterns have been able to stalemate Atrocitus at times while losing to Superman should tell you who is truly superior.

Also, a bit weird to say Helspont's attack is magical? Can you indicated where it even hinted that?


Helspont is a Daemonite. Daemonites are magical beings. However, Jim Lee may have decided to retcon Helspont, even though he did not do this to Majestic, and several other characters from his original Image stable. Unless you guys thought that the Kherubim, and the Daemonites were somehow linked to Kryptonians genetically. They aren't but whatever.

Once again you're using two different power sets to determine the outcome of this battle. Our best bet is to keep Big Blue out of this, because he takes full damage from magical attacks, and Helspont used one against him. Note what Superman said once he got up, as well as what happened when he faced off against helspont for the first time. Helspont did not use purely physical attacks on Superman when they first met, but he was playing head games with him. Hard light characters have pretty good defenses against these types of attacks due to their rings if I remember correctly.

Attrocitus would do far better against Helspont than the inept Kryptonian (Superman).

Helspont isn't magical in nature.

Atrocitus is magic based as well.

^^If Helspont isn't a magical creature, what is he then?

Originally posted by Galan007
Helspont thrashed Superman before he came to the realization that he needed to push himself harder than ever, in order to further develop his abilities. This was explicitly stated in Superman #13-- the same issue in which he bench-presses planetary weight for days on end. If Supes were to face 'spont now, chances are that the outcome would be different-- Superman's battle with H'el was indicative enough of that, imho.

Anyhow, 'spont likely wins.

You... I like you.

Originally posted by Stoic
^^If Helspont isn't a magical creature, what is he then?
He gained a mysterious energy source. Its not magical.

Did you read the Wildcats series? Daemonites, and the Kherubim are magical in nature, which is why they live as long as they do. Helspont is a Daemonite.

You realise if Helspont is magical, that heavily lessens the impact of the fights he had with Superman...

Originally posted by Stoic
Did you read the Wildcats series? Daemonites, and the Kherubim are magical in nature, which is why they live as long as they do. Helspont is a Daemonite.
You realize that its a different version of Helspont, right?

Originally posted by -Pr-
You realise if Helspont is magical, that heavily lessens the impact of the fights he had with Superman...


Dude, Majestic can hold Helspont by himself. Is Majestic greater than Kal because of this? Teth would be able to hold Helspont as well, due to his resistances.

Originally posted by -Pr-
You... I like you. this fangirl, here

@ abhilegend, you will have to prove the retcon, because Majestic still has the same powers. The only thing that I saw them do was exand on his origin, but aside from that, he looks the same, and uses his powers the same, so i assume that he is essentially the same Daemonite that he was before the New U came into being.

Originally posted by Stoic
Dude, Majestic can hold Helspont by himself. Is Majestic greater than Kal because of this? Teth would be able to hold Helspont as well, due to his resistances.

Huh?

Originally posted by psycho gundam
this fangirl, here

ikr?

Originally posted by -Pr-
Huh?



ikr?

You didn't understand what i wrote?

Just don't understand how the comparison is relevant.

Originally posted by Stoic
@ abhilegend, you will have to prove the retcon, because Majestic still has the same powers. The only thing that I saw them do was exand on his origin, but aside from that, he looks the same, and uses his powers the same, so i assume that he is essentially the same Daemonite that he was before the New U came into being.
What? Why would I've to prove something that has been retconned. Majestic is no longer a Kherubim. This is a different version of Helspont who has never fought Majestic before.

^ He's no longer a Kherubim? OK I'll take your word for it, but does that also mean that he is no longer a magical being? Also what proof do you have that the Daemonites are no longer magical or quasi magical beings? In order to reel this back to my first point on the subject, and not to stray from it, I strongly believe that Attrocitus would be able to resist the forces than incapacitated Superman, simply because he is both Psi/TP resistant, and magical resistant, both of which the inexperienced Superman was not, and perhaps still is not.

I am also not convinced that Helspont is a Trans tier yet, simply because he was able to exploit Superman's weaknesses like he appeared to do in their first meetings. Also Apollo was clearly compared to Superman in terms of power, and J'onn is nearly as powerful as Superman. Atrocitus was running through them like they were below his level of power. So I can't understand how anyone would automatically place Helspont above him so quickly just because he exploited an inexperienced Superman.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Just don't understand how the comparison is relevant.

Ah Ok, I understand. I used Teth because he is a magical being, and has pretty good resistance to magic. Which makes me believe that he would also be a good match up for Helspont, whereas Superman would not be due to Helspont's ability to exploit a Kryptonian on that level (low magical resistance). Helspont said that he knew, and encountered Kryptonians in the past if you recall, which hinted on him being able to deal with them effectively. Unless I am remembering wrong that is.

You have to still give a proof that Helspont is magical. Before reboot he might be magical as I don't know anything about him but after reboot there is zero proof that Daemonites and Helspont are megical. You are asking me to prove a negative. First give a proof that Daemonites are magical in DCnU.

^ You read what I wrote. I won't run around in circles with you Abhi.

Originally posted by Stoic
^ You read what I wrote. I won't run around in circles with you Abhi.
Yeah, I did read your speculations. Give me a single proof of your theories. I won't ask this again.

Did anyone read Voodoo? Helspont was in that and I thought his origins and homeplace was somewhat mystical.

If Helspont was rebooted just like the others, then his preboot stuff won't count.

Was he rebooted?

Originally posted by Golgo13
Did anyone read Voodoo? Helspont was in that and I thought his origins and homeplace was somewhat mystical.

what issue? I only read the first 2-3 issues of that book.

I'm not sure, I thought it was once Voodoo got on the planet. Helspont was different from the rest of his race, which is why i was thinking mystical related. Not entirely sure.

Originally posted by -Pr-
If Helspont was rebooted just like the others, then his preboot stuff won't count.

Was he rebooted?



what issue? I only read the first 2-3 issues of that book.
Of course he was rebooted.

LOL@this thread

Originally posted by Golgo13
I'm not sure, I thought it was once Voodoo got on the planet. Helspont was different from the rest of his race, which is why i was thinking mystical related. Not entirely sure.

ah okay.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Of course he was rebooted.

that's why I asked.

so post reboot, we need to nail down whether he's magical or not.

Originally posted by -Pr-
ah okay.



that's why I asked.

so post reboot, we need to nail down whether he's magical or not.
Exactly.