Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

Which is more powerful?
which is more destructive?

See heres the thing; the Omega Effect is not (or rather has not) been written as it was originally written; its no longer as all-mighty as it once was...

The Omega Effect is supposed to erase any being thats not essential to the universe, yet it failed to erase HP Doomsday...

Because of that, I gotta go with the God Blast; especially given its feat against Exitar...

The Omega Beam might be powerful, but it's almost a generic laser blast if it's regular Darkseid at this point tbh.

As it stands now, on a good day, it takes down a Herald in one hit. On a bad day it's the equivalent to a punch. God Blast ftw.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
See heres the thing; the Omega Effect is not (or rather has not) been written as it was originally written; its no longer as all-mighty as it once was...

The Omega Effect is supposed to erase any being thats not essential to the universe, yet it failed to erase HP Doomsday...

Because of that, I gotta go with the God Blast; especially given its feat against Exitar...

Pretty much this.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
See heres the thing; the Omega Effect is not (or rather has not) been written as it was originally written; its no longer as all-mighty as it once was...

The Omega Effect is supposed to erase any being thats not essential to the universe, yet it failed to erase HP Doomsday...

Because of that, I gotta go with the God Blast; especially given its feat against Exitar... isnt there a difference between omega beam an the omega effect?

Originally posted by LeonBuco666
isnt there a difference between omega beam an the omega effect?

If you played VS System.

They're supposed to be separate, but too many writers fail to grasp the distinction, iirc.

Gblast by leaps and bounds.

Id say OB is more powerful but GB has more sheer destructive force

Originally posted by LeonBuco666
Id say OB is more powerful but GB has more sheer destructive force Based on ?

Originally posted by quanchi112
Based on ? because the godblast just wrecks shit an obliterates shit, but the OB or OE both stem from the OS(OBVIOISLY) so the ob is much more capable than just concuasive force, like time travel, transmution, disintigration and being able to erase a being from existence
wonder woman has deflected the omega effect/omega beam with her bracelets, where as the godblast has actually stopped AND pushed back juggernaut(see were im going with the GB>>>>jOB/OE in terms of concussive an destructive force but the ob/oe>>>>GB is sheer power

The OE is certainly more versatile, but at this point it's definitely not more powerful or destructive.

Originally posted by LeonBuco666
because the godblast just wrecks shit an obliterates shit, but the OB or OE both stem from the OS(OBVIOISLY) so the ob is much more capable than just concuasive force, like time travel, transmution, disintigration and being able to erase a being from existence
wonder woman has deflected the omega effect/omega beam with her bracelets, where as the godblast has actually stopped AND pushed back juggernaut(see were im going with the GB>>>>jOB/OE in terms of concussive an destructive force but the ob/oe>>>>GB is sheer power Thats more versatile not powerful or more destructive.

Omega

Originally posted by quanchi112
Thats more versatile not powerful or more destructive.

Based on?

Originally posted by Raisen
Based on? Do you know what versatile means ?

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Omega Based on ?

Originally posted by Cogito
The OE is certainly more versatile, but at this point it's definitely not more powerful or destructive.

Yep. Godblast is more destructive, while the OB/OF is more versatile.

Has the OD/OF done anything versatile post flash point

Originally posted by xJLxKing
Has the OD/OF done anything versatile post flash point

DS has only been in one story arc so far.

Originally posted by Golgo13
DS has only been in one story arc so far. So the answer is no.

Godblast for destruction
Omegas for versatility

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Godblast for destruction
Omegas for versatility

Pretty much.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Godblast for destruction
Omegas for versatility

GB blasts OB to oblivion.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Godblast for destruction
Omegas for versatility

hmm haven't seen the full extent of gb to make a judgement. The only one i could recall was against durok which pretty much aoe obliterated him (class 100) along with the other enemy troops in a wide area. Is the antiforce blast he used against Exitar a godblast too?

Originally posted by quanchi112
Based on ?

Assuming we're talking pre-flashpoint, the Omega Force is far more versatile and has done more to more powerful opponents (Anti-Monitor, Imperiex, Spectre, etc.)

The best feat of the Godblast IIRC is driving off a starving Galactus, and Thor was receiving energy from Odin at that point.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Assuming we're talking pre-flashpoint, the Omega Force is far more versatile and has done more to more powerful opponents (Anti-Monitor, Imperiex, Spectre, etc.)

The best feat of the Godblast IIRC is driving off a starving Galactus, and Thor was receiving energy from Odin at that point. I am disputing more powerful not destructive power.

OE has more raw power, more versatility, and more combat effectiveness.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Assuming we're talking pre-flashpoint, the Omega Force is far more versatile and has done more to more powerful opponents (Anti-Monitor, Imperiex, Spectre, etc.)Random energy spike given to Alexander Luthor wasn't ever alluded to as being Omega Force. The Entropy Aegis no-sold the OE, and frankly that should tell you how effective it was against Imperiex Prime when he was being bombarded by several attacks. And you should probably reread Darkseid's "fight" with Spectre. Originally posted by Endless Mike
The best feat of the Godblast IIRC is driving off a starving Galactus, and Thor was receiving energy from Odin at that point. lolwut?

Originally posted by ODG
The Entropy Aegis no-sold the OE, and frankly that should tell you how effective it was against Imperiex Prime To be fair the EA armor was also enhanced with Apokoliptian tech-- it wasn't just your average Probe.

However, I agree with your assertion that the OE/OF wouldn't have done jack shit to Imperiex by itself.

Darkseid's entire power is based upon omega force, the attack on Anti-monitor was Omega forced based upon that too.

The Entropy Aegis wasn't a normal Imperiex Probe but it was still the Probes armor that repelled Darkseid's Omega Effect. The Probes are truly uber compared to anything else in the DCU.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
The best feat of the Godblast IIRC is driving off a starving Galactus, and Thor was receiving energy from Odin at that point.
No he wasn't. And the GB's arguably best feat is breaking Oblivion's subtle control on Galactus/Scrier/Other, or smashing apart Exitar's indestructible braincase. Both of which are beyond anything the Omega Beams have ever done post-crisis.

The Crisis didn't affect the Fourth World...

all the kirby characters need to get their respect threads redone. ODG is doing an exceptional job but the man can only do so much.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
No he wasn't. And the GB's arguably best feat is breaking Oblivion's subtle control on Galactus/Scrier/Other, or smashing apart Exitar's indestructible braincase. Both of which are beyond anything the Omega Beams have ever done post-crisis.
That godblast against Exitar was arguably amped by belt of strength as mjolnir has never shattered channeling godblast. Oh and that godblast against Galactus/Scrier/Other was amped too, not that it did anything against them.

actually, the belt was used to brace the hammer from the energies. that was the most powerful godblast on-panel by several magnitudes

Originally posted by psycho gundam
all the kirby characters need to get their respect threads redone. ODG is doing an exceptional job but the man can only do so much.
Mungi has a fantastic darkseid respect thread here.

Originally posted by abhilegend
That godblast against Exitar was arguably amped by belt of strength as mjolnir has never shattered channeling godblast. Oh and that godblast against Galactus/Scrier/Other was amped too, not that it did anything against them.
The godblast wasn't amped, Mjolnir's durability was amped. Thor even says so in that comic. It was a shared blast I agree, but it broke Oblivion's spell upon them. Oblivion hinted that he had played the 3 Abstracts for puppets at the end of the comic, so that's a stupendous feat for the GB, shared feat or not.
Originally posted by Endless Mike
The Crisis didn't affect the Fourth World...
I was talking specifically about its feats from the post-crisis era, not whether the Crisis affected the New Gods universe or not.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
actually, the belt was used to brace the hammer from the energies. that was the most powerful godblast on-panel by several magnitudes
That's why I said arguably. Thor was touching the belt, right?

Originally posted by abhilegend
That godblast against Exitar was arguably amped by belt of strength as mjolnir has never shattered channeling godblast. Oh and that godblast against Galactus/Scrier/Other was amped too, not that it did anything against them.

Actually the God Blast was not amped, it was the hammer which was reinforced. And yes, the hammer has never shattered on another occasion, which is why it's considered to be far and away the most powerful God Blast seen so far.

Which makes sense, the blast was so intense it actually stunned Exitar and broke his internal dome casting which was more durable then his outside armor. And this was when Celestials were at the height of their power.

I think Godkiller meant that the God Blast shook the three free from Oblivion's negative influence.

Originally posted by abhilegend
That's why I said arguably. Thor was touching the belt, right?
Thor clearly stated that he tied it up in the belt of strength to reinforce it against the massive energies produced from the GB. There is absolutely no indication whatsoever that the blast itself was amped in any form at all.

Originally posted by abhilegend
That's why I said arguably. Thor was touching the belt, right?

Pretty sure that the belt was wrapped around the head of Mjolnir and Thor had both his hands on the handle of the hammer.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I think Godkiller meant that the God Blast shook the three free from Oblivion's negative influence.
More or less that. Considering Oblivion's place in the cosmic hierarchy, how the Chaos King turned out to be a mere infinitesimal aspect of him, and how Oblivion embodies the very concept behind the Ultimate Nullifier's offensive capabilities, I'd say it's a big feat.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
The godblast wasn't amped, Mjolnir's durability was amped. Thor even says so in that comic. It was a shared blast I agree, but it broke Oblivion's spell upon them. Oblivion hinted that he had played the 3 Abstracts for puppets at the end of the comic, so that's a stupendous feat for the GB, shared feat or not.

I was talking specifically about its feats from the post-crisis era, not whether the Crisis affected the New Gods universe or not.
How does that even works? BOS amps thor, not an inanimate object like mjolnir.

It was a shared feat and it didn't do much than catching their attention since someone was attacking them. Was it ever explained that it broke any spell over them?

Originally posted by abhilegend
How does that even works? BOS amps thor, not an inanimate object like mjolnir.

What kind of silly question is that? How do you expect anyone to even answer that with a straight face? The writer most likely has no idea how the belt of strength works, much less us.

Mjolnir was reinforced by the belt of strength. Trying to get into anymore in-depth analysis will just end up people yelling magic at you.

Originally posted by abhilegend
How does that even works? BOS amps thor, not an inanimate object like mjolnir.

It was a shared feat and it didn't do much than catching their attention since someone was attacking them. Was it ever explained that it broke any spell over them?
Ask DeFalco how that works. Although my money would be on the fact that since it augments Thor's physical strength when it's wielded by him, it was hence reasoned by Thor that it would similarly strengthen Mjolnir as well.

Look over what the phrase "under someone's spell" means. I am talking about Oblivion's manipulation of the Abstracts when I use the term spell. Why would any explanation be given, when we are shown that the 3 of them are no longer acting buck crazy after being hit by the GB, and Oblivion himself tells us that is expectation of the fight to continue doesn't happen?

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Actually the God Blast was not amped, it was the hammer which was reinforced. And yes, the hammer has never shattered on another occasion, which is why it's considered to be far and away the most powerful God Blast seen so far.

Which makes sense, the blast was so intense it actually stunned Exitar and broke his internal dome casting which was more durable then his outside armor. And this was when Celestials were at the height of their power.

I think Godkiller meant that the God Blast shook the three free from Oblivion's negative influence.
Can I see the scan since its not in either your or ODG's respect thread that only mjolnir was reinforced?

Originally posted by abhilegend
Can I see the scan since its not in either your or ODG's respect thread that only mjolnir was reinforced?

I'm at work right now (Yes, I'm that bored), I'll post the scans when I get home. I can guarantee you that Thor said he was reinforcing Mjolnir however.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
What kind of silly question is that? How do you expect anyone to even answer that with a straight face? The writer most likely has no idea how the belt of strength works, much less us.

Mjolnir was reinforced by the belt of strength. Trying to get into anymore in-depth analysis will just end up people yelling magic at you.
Considering it was DeFalco, I doubt that he doesn't know how BOS works.Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Ask DeFalco how that works. Although my money would be on the fact that since it augments Thor's physical strength when it's wielded by him, it was hence reasoned by Thor that it would similarly strengthen Mjolnir as well.

Look over what the phrase "under someone's spell" means. I am talking about Oblivion's manipulation of the Abstracts when I use the term spell. Why would any explanation be given, when we are shown that the 3 of them are no longer acting buck crazy after being hit by the GB, and Oblivion himself tells us that is expectation of the fight to continue doesn't happen?
Ok.

Oblivion didn't have them under control anywhere. He was manipulating the fight from behind the scenes.

Because there was no indication that the abstracts were in his control to begin with? Manipulation=/=controlling. Also I find it hilarious that Scrier was an abstract without any explanation when before he was somewhere in Thanos class going by SS v3.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I'm at work right now (Yes, I'm that bored), I'll post the scans when I get home. I can guarantee you that Thor said he was reinforcing Mjolnir however.
I don't doubt you.

Everyone knows how the belt of strength works on Thor, it doubles his strength. But you asked an explaniation as to how it would reinforce the hammer, that's a dumb question tbh. It's magic, that's the best answer you'll get.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Oblivion didn't have them under control anywhere. He was manipulating the fight from behind the scenes.

Because there was no indication that the abstracts were in his control to begin with? Manipulation=/=controlling. Also I find it hilarious that Scrier was an abstract without any explanation when before he was somewhere in Thanos class going by SS v3.
Oblivion broke 4th wall and teased the reader in the end that it was him who had been pulling the strings all along.

What? Scrier has been able to crush Mephisto outside his realm. That easily puts him beyond Thanos-level.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I'm at work right now (Yes, I'm that bored), I'll post the scans when I get home. I can guarantee you that Thor said he was reinforcing Mjolnir however.
It's available on the respect thread. If abhi has doubts about the validity of our claims, he can verify it himself by checking out the respect thread. Especially considering that this particular idea of the GB being amped when it stunned Exitar has been debunked to death in previous arguments as well.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Oblivion broke 4th wall and teased the reader in the end that it was him who had been pulling the strings all along.

What? Scrier has been able to crush Mephisto outside his realm. That easily puts him beyond Thanos-level.
Pulling strings=/=controlling someone's mind.

That was a dead mephisto who was a shadow of his prime and Scrier took him by surprise.Originally posted by TheGodKiller
It's available on the respect thread. If abhi has doubts about the validity of our claims, he can verify it himself by checking out the respect thread. Especially considering that this particular idea of the GB being amped when it stunned Exitar has been debunked to death in previous arguments as well.
No its not. I checked it. If you found the scan, please post it.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Pulling strings=/=controlling someone's mind.

That was a dead mephisto who was a shadow of his prime and Scrier took him by surprise.

No its not. I checked it. If you found the scan, please post it.
He had them under some kind of cosmic mind control spell. Or do you think that the 3 Abstracts just randomly went crazy and started destroying the multiverse?

Mephisto wasn't on his deathbed. He straight up crushed the devil. His most recent portrayal solidified his place as a peer of Galactus-level abstracts in the cosmic hierarchy. Trying to dispute such a basic fact is pointless.

What? It's present on literally the very first page of the thread:
Originally posted by ODG

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Fights/ThorvsCelestials15.jpg

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
He had them under some kind of cosmic mind control spell. Or do you think that the 3 Abstracts just randomly went crazy and started destroying the multiverse?

Mephisto wasn't on his deathbed. He straight up crushed the devil. His most recent portrayal solidified his place as a peer of Galactus-level abstracts in the cosmic hierarchy. Trying to dispute such a basic fact is pointless.

What? It's present on literally the very first page of the thread:
Not without any kind of proof though.

I'm not dismissing Scrier's recent feats. I'm just amused how Scrier went from needing to add his power to Agatha Harkness to take down a dead mephisto from behind to destroying multiverse and shit.

http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t1/16229981_SS_v3_136_07b.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t1/16229982_SS_v3_136_08a.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t1/16229983_SS_v3_137_08a.jpg

That's a big leap for a z list character.

Thanks for the scans. Going by that feat, mjolnir can't contain godblast from an exhausted Thor? That contradicts every other godblast showing. Meh.

Agatha is hardcore

Originally posted by abhilegend
Not without any kind of proof though.

I'm not dismissing Scrier's recent feats. I'm just amused how Scrier went from needing to add his power to Agatha Harkness to take down a dead mephisto from behind to destroying multiverse and shit.

http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t1/16229981_SS_v3_136_07b.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t1/16229982_SS_v3_136_08a.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t1/16229983_SS_v3_137_08a.jpg

That's a big leap for a z list character.

Thanks for the scans. Going by that feat, mjolnir can't contain godblast from an exhausted Thor? That contradicts every other godblast showing. Meh.
Then agree to disagree.

Agatha has been able to briefly hold her own in a psychic battle with a pissed off Franklin Richards. She has her moments. Scrier is what he is. You being stupended at his supposed push doesn't make him anything less than what he is.

Thor wasn't really exhausted. That was also probably his most powerful individual godblast as well, judging by the fact that DeFalco has written another story in which Thor godblasted the Juggernaut.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Then agree to disagree.

Agatha has been able to briefly hold her own in a psychic battle with a pissed off Franklin Richards. She has her moments. Scrier is what he is. You being stupended at his supposed push doesn't make him anything less than what he is.

Thor wasn't really exhausted. That was also probably his most powerful individual godblast as well, judging by the fact that DeFalco has written another story in which Thor godblasted the Juggernaut.
Ok.

One high end feat? I've also seen a no name witch knock out Agatha once with a simple spell. I'm just amused how he went from needing help against a dead mephisto to battling galactus without any explanation.

It was made clear by narration that he was exhausted in the same scan.

That's why I think its an outlier.

Originally posted by abhilegend
One high end feat? I've also seen a no name witch knock out Agatha once with a simple spell. I'm just amused how he went from needing help against a dead mephisto to battling galactus without any explanation.

It was made clear by narration that he was exhausted in the same scan.

That's why I think its an outlier.
The point is that she's like a walking talking plot device. Scrier is an Abstract-level being, always has been. Deal with it.

It was also made clear in the very same panel, that Thor was regaining his strength. Now you're being straight-up dishonest.

Of course it's an outlier, considering that it's believed to be his most powerful godblast yet.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
The point is that she's like a walking talking plot device. Scrier is an Abstract-level being, always has been. Deal with it.

It was also made clear in the very same panel, that Thor was regaining his strength. Now you're being straight-up dishonest.

Of course it's an outlier, considering that it's believed to be his most powerful godblast yet.
Needing help against a dead mephisto makes you an abstract? Haha.

Thor was wearing his BOS in that panel too which he removed.

It isn't an outlier because of that. Its an outlier because a healthy Thor has fired a full godblast and it didn't shatter mjolnir.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Needing help against a dead mephisto makes you an abstract? Haha.

Thor was wearing his BOS in that panel too which he removed.

It isn't an outlier because of that. Its an outlier because a healthy Thor has fired a full godblast and it didn't shatter mjolnir.
Mephisto died only after Scrier crushed him. Context.

The BOS amps his base level strength, when has it ever been used to rejuvenate his juices?

It's an outlier simply because of what it did to a Mjolnir with amped durability.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Mephisto died only after Scrier crushed him. Context.

The BOS amps his base level strength, when has it ever been used to rejuvenate his juices?

It's an outlier simply because of what it did to a Mjolnir with amped durability.
Did you by any chance forgot to read this?

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/16229981/SS_v3_136_07b.jpg.html
http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/16229982/SS_v3_136_08a.jpg.html

"Murdered by my own faithless offspring", "But I'm barely a shadow of my prime self".

It has been used to rejuvenate him too IIRC.

Essentially yes. It has never happened before or after that scene even with a healthy Thor.

When has the belt of strength been used to rejuvenate Thor? As a matter of fact, it's been said to drain him of energy.

Thor was exhausted but he regained his strength. And even after he performed the God Blast, he had enough energy to perform this:
http://s3d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16230782_Thor_388-23.jpg http://s3d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16230783_Thor389pg04.jpg http://s3d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16230784_Thor389pg05.jpg http://s3d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16230785_Thor389pg06.jpg http://s3d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16230786_Thor389pg07.jpg http://s3d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16230787_Thor389pg08.jpg

Exitar also blasts him down to the planet and in moments he gets back up. Classic Thor just didn't know how to stay down, dude was the definition of stamina.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Did you by any chance forgot to read this?

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/16229981/SS_v3_136_07b.jpg.html
http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/16229982/SS_v3_136_08a.jpg.html

"Murdered by my own faithless offspring", "But I'm barely a shadow of my prime self".

It has been used to rejuvenate him too IIRC.

Essentially yes. It has never happened before or after that scene even with a healthy Thor.
That doesn't in any way take away from the fact that Scrier ultimately crushed him like the insect that he was in Scrier's palms.

It has never been used to rejuvenate him ever as far as I know.

Thor was healthy as a horse in that comic. The panel also clearly states that he was regaining strength. You can't ignore one bit of on-panel evidence and cling to another simply because it suits your argument.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
That doesn't in any way take away from the fact that Scrier ultimately crushed him like the insect that he was in Scrier's palms.

It has never been used to rejuvenate him ever as far as I know.

Thor was healthy as a horse in that comic. The panel also clearly states that he was regaining strength. You can't ignore one bit of on-panel evidence and cling to another simply because it suits your argument.
That doesn't mean he was an abstract. Heck beating a full power mephisto doesn't makes you skyfather. He also did that by a cheapshot.

Maybe I missed that to some other trinket Thor carries but it was said to rejuvenate him against Kurse in Thor 363 or something. Anyway even if his strength was returning, he still wasn't at 100%.

Returning strength=/=full strength.

Lol, the exact opposite was said:
http://s3d4.turboimagehost.com/t/16230835_Thor_363-12.jpg http://s3d4.turboimagehost.com/t/16230836_Thor_363-13.jpg

Originally posted by abhilegend
That doesn't mean he was an abstract. Heck beating a full power mephisto doesn't makes you skyfather. He also did that by a cheapshot.

Maybe I missed that to some other trinket Thor carries but it was said to rejuvenate him against Kurse in Thor 363 or something. Anyway even if his strength was returning, he still wasn't at 100%.

Returning strength=/=full strength.
Why would beating a full-power Mephisto not mean that one is a skyfather? He crushed him like a bug.

That's not what happened. Anyways, even if you believe that it rejuvenates him, then that coupled with the fact that he was still wearing it in the panel where the narrative claims he's exhausted, means that it also rejuvenated him before he put it on Mjolnir. Kind of puts a hole in your argument, so I suggest you drop it and take into consideration the rest of the narrative statement which tells us that Thor is regaining his strength.

How would you know? Notwithstanding the colossal amount of punishment Thor took in that comic and still kept coming, your own rejuvenation theory tells us that he performed the GB at full power.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Actually the God Blast was not amped, it was the hammer which was reinforced. And yes, the hammer has never shattered on another occasion, which is why it's considered to be far and away the most powerful God Blast seen so far.

Which makes sense, the blast was so intense it actually stunned Exitar and broke his internal dome casting which was more durable then his outside armor. And this was when Celestials were at the height of their power.

I think Godkiller meant that the God Blast shook the three free from Oblivion's negative influence.

Why couldn't the hammer have had varying durabilities in both scenes (Exitar vs. Juggs)? Characters and other objects do.

The writer clearly explained both Godblasts to be equal in power.

So we can either ignore the varying durability concept in comics and go against the writer.
Or we can go along with the writer and apply the varying durability concept.


Lastly, we can't fully know the upper durability of Exitar's inner dome without speculation. Obviously, his armor is less durable than enchanted Uru or adamantium. So how much more can we assign his inner dome over his hammer?

The writer never said that they were equal in power, stop lying.

Originally posted by Silent Master
The writer never said that they were equal in power, stop lying.

The writer clearly explained both Godblasts to be equal in power.
Explained and said are two different things.

Originally posted by h1a8
The writer clearly explained both Godblasts to be equal in power.
Explained and said are two different things.

He did no such thing, stop lying.

Originally posted by Silent Master
He did no such thing, stop lying.

How am I lying?
Did you read the comic?
The writer clearly compared the Godblast against Exitar as the same one against Juggernaut.

What exactly did the writer say?

Originally posted by h1a8
How am I lying?
Did you read the comic?
The writer clearly compared the Godblast against Exitar as the same one against Juggernaut.

The writer did not compare them in regards to power, please stop lying.

Originally posted by -Pr-
What exactly did the writer say?

"A power which once hurled back Galactus, the world eater, and e'en gave pause to an almighty celestial!"

Originally posted by h1a8
"A power which once hurled back Galactus, the world eater, and e'en gave pause to an almighty celestial!"

That's very vague, tbh. You can't really use that as the sole basis for a comparison.

Originally posted by -Pr-
That's very vague, tbh. You can't really use that as the sole basis for a comparison.

Espcially when it was shown to be very different blasts, Thor had to use a stand for the Galactus blast and needed to wrap the belt of strength around Mjolnir for the Celestial blast.

Originally posted by -Pr-
That's very vague, tbh. You can't really use that as the sole basis for a comparison.

This was stated right before Thor used the attack on Juggs. The writer was trying to show the reader that Juggs can withstand the very same attack. There is no mention that the attack is lesser than before but it's the writer's intention that it is the same.

Here's the image

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v345/sifu1/invulnerable.jpg

I don't think his intent is what you say it is at all, to be honest.

One, it's not even narration; it's Thor speaking. Second, he could very easily be talking about the type of attack he's using. In fact, i'd say it's more likely than him conveying that it's the exact same intensity and power as the other, previous attack.

Originally posted by -Pr-
I don't think his intent is what you say it is at all, to be honest.

One, it's not even narration; it's Thor speaking. Second, he could very easily be talking about the type of attack he's using. In fact, i'd say it's more likely than him conveying that it's the exact same intensity and power as the other, previous attack.

The writer made Thor say those words. So Thor is speaking for the writer. I could be wrong but
I believe it's the writer's intention to show that both attacks are the same.
Otherwise, what would be the point of referencing those events and having Juggs tank the attack afterwards?

The plot or story was to sell and cement Jugg's massive durability.

Originally posted by h1a8
The writer made Thor say those words. So Thor is speaking for the writer. I could be wrong but
I believe it's the writer's intention to show that both attacks are the same.
Otherwise, what would be the point of referencing those events and having Juggs tank the attack afterwards?

The plot or story was to sell and cement Jugg's massive durability.

You're free to believe it's his intent, but proving that it's in any way definitive is not going to be easy.

And in general on this forum, we treat character statements to be different from narration; just saying.

Originally posted by h1a8
The writer made Thor say those words. So Thor is speaking for the writer. I could be wrong but
I believe it's the writer's intention to show that both attacks are the same.
Otherwise, what would be the point of referencing those events and having Juggs tank the attack afterwards?

The plot or story was to sell and cement Jugg's massive durability.

Saying that something is the same attack doesn't mean it's the same power level.

Originally posted by abhilegend
That godblast against Exitar was arguably amped by belt of strength as mjolnir has never shattered channeling godblast. Oh and that godblast against Galactus/Scrier/Other was amped too, not that it did anything against them.


Hmmm I wasn't aware that the belt of strength amped magical attacks from thor, I thought it was only physical stats and drained his stamina over time.

Originally posted by h1a8
Why couldn't the hammer have had varying durabilities in both scenes (Exitar vs. Juggs)? Characters and other objects do.

The writer clearly explained both Godblasts to be equal in power.

So we can either ignore the varying durability concept in comics and go against the writer.
Or we can go along with the writer and apply the varying durability concept.


Lastly, we can't fully know the upper durability of Exitar's inner dome without speculation. Obviously, his armor is less durable than enchanted Uru or adamantium. So how much more can we assign his inner dome over his hammer?

If you think that's the case, prove it then.

No, he did not. He explained it as the same attack. It wasn't the same level of power. He literally destroyed a fortified Mjolnir in the Exitar scene, it by definition could not be.

Stop pretending the writer fully agreed with you.

It took all his might just to shatter the exterior shell and the interior was even more durable. This was Celestials in their prime, before almost anyone could even singe them.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Why would beating a full-power Mephisto not mean that one is a skyfather? He crushed him like a bug.

That's not what happened. Anyways, even if you believe that it rejuvenates him, then that coupled with the fact that he was still wearing it in the panel where the narrative claims he's exhausted, means that it also rejuvenated him before he put it on Mjolnir. Kind of puts a hole in your argument, so I suggest you drop it and take into consideration the rest of the narrative statement which tells us that Thor is regaining his strength.

How would you know? Notwithstanding the colossal amount of punishment Thor took in that comic and still kept coming, your own rejuvenation theory tells us that he performed the GB at full power.
Because of his low showings. This wasn't a prime mephisto anyway and Scrier needed help and surprise to beat him.

Returning strength=/=full strength.

Because he took off the belt.

Originally posted by kevdude
The Entropy Aegis wasn't a normal Imperiex Probe but it was still the Probes armor that repelled Darkseid's Omega Effect. The Probes are truly uber compared to anything else in the DCU. Other than Firestorm's funnel, GL constructs, Wonder Woman's bracers, heat vison, etc.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Because of his low showings. This wasn't a prime mephisto anyway and Scrier needed help and surprise to beat him.

Returning strength=/=full strength.

Because he took off the belt.
His later showings establish him as a legit Abstract-level character, so no need to cling to particular showings just to denigrate him. Current versions are used unless specified.

He regained his strength. That means he wasn't exhausted.

In later panels. Your rejuvenation theory clearly tells us that he wasn't exhausted.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
His later showings establish him as a legit Abstract-level character, so no need to cling to particular showings just to denigrate him. Current versions are used unless specified.

He regained his strength. That means he wasn't exhausted.

In later panels. Your rejuvenation theory clearly tells us that he wasn't exhausted.
What later showingS? He has only one showing since then and he jumped to abstract level without any explanation. This is the same scrier unless you know of an amp I don't. Not to mention The Other was imprisoned by the same scrier.

He didn't said that. He said his strength was returning, not that he was at full strength.

One or two panels where his strength returning doesn't mean much.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Saying that something is the same attack doesn't mean it's the same power level.

If the writer WANTED the power level to be the same then it is the same.
The writer has absolute power of creation.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
If you think that's the case, prove it then.

No, he did not. He explained it as the same attack. It wasn't the same level of power. He literally destroyed a fortified Mjolnir in the Exitar scene, it by definition could not be.

Stop pretending the writer fully agreed with you.

It took all his might just to shatter the exterior shell and the interior was even more durable. This was Celestials in their prime, before almost anyone could even singe them.
Only someone deluded or bias would not clearly see the writer wanted the attacks to be exactly the same.

2 Things
1. Objects have variable durability in comics
2. Writer's intentions trump anything else though.

So we can't ignore the varying durability concept in comics and go against the writer.
In other words, We must go along with the writer and apply the varying durability concept.

Originally posted by abhilegend
What later showingS? He has only one showing since then and he jumped to abstract level without any explanation. This is the same scrier unless you know of an amp I don't. Not to mention The Other was imprisoned by the same scrier.

He didn't said that. He said his strength was returning, not that he was at full strength.

One or two panels where his strength returning doesn't mean much.
Yes, and said showing cements his position as an Abstract level being.

You're just arguing to argue at this point. Nevermind the fact that the comic clearly tells us that Thor is regaining his strength, your own rejuvenation logic destroys the idea that Thor was still exhausted by the time he got to charging up his Godblast.

Except they do. Claiming that Thor was exhausted after a scan has been provided to you, even while ignoring the rest of the statement that tells us clearly that he's regaining his strength is dishonest to say the least.

Originally posted by h1a8
Only someone deluded or bias would not clearly see the writer wanted the attacks to be exactly the same.

2 Things
1. Objects have variable durability in comics
2. Writer's intentions trump anything else though.

So we can't ignore the varying durability concept in comics and go against the writer.
In other words, We must go along with the writer and apply the varying durability concept.

Why would Mjolnir have fluctuating durability under the same writer who was explicitly aware of the Exitar scene? This line of reasoning from you requires far too much insight on what a writer was thinking and ignoring what was in the comic.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Yes, and said showing cements his position as an Abstract level being.

You're just arguing to argue at this point. Nevermind the fact that the comic clearly tells us that Thor is regaining his strength, your own rejuvenation logic destroys the idea that Thor was still exhausted by the time he got to charging up his Godblast.

Except they do. Claiming that Thor was exhausted after a scan has been provided to you, even while ignoring the rest of the statement that tells us clearly that he's regaining his strength is dishonest to say the least.
I know. I'm just amused by it. You still haven't posted any proof that Oblivion had them under control besides drawing assumptions.

I am? Thor regaining his strength gradually=/=being at full strength. If you have a caption that tells us that he was at full power, its well past time to post it.

Except they don't. Thor was exhausted and he was regaining his strength. How does that tells us that he was back at full strength except you drawing assumptions again?

Originally posted by ODG
Other than Firestorm's funnel, GL constructs, Wonder Woman's bracers, heat vison, etc.

Considering they didn't use any of those things but used the Imperiex armor AE to send Imperiex Prime and Brainiac 13 back in time, if its not the top it's gotta be near it...

Originally posted by abhilegend
I know. I'm just amused by it. You still haven't posted any proof that Oblivion had them under control besides drawing assumptions.

I am? Thor regaining his strength gradually=/=being at full strength. If you have a caption that tells us that he was at full power, its well past time to post it.

Except they don't. Thor was exhausted and he was regaining his strength. How does that tells us that he was back at full strength except you drawing assumptions again?
Apart from my citation of the note on which Oblivion ended the comic?

Him regaining his strength somehow means that he hadn't been restored by the time he started the Godblast? By this line of logic, you might as well start claiming that Thor never performed the Godblast itself, since the narrative merely indicated that he had been charging it up.

Basic grasp of the English language would tell us that when the narrative claims that Thor was regaining strength, then that mans he was restored by the time he started invoking the GB.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Apart from my citation of the note on which Oblivion ended the comic?

Him regaining his strength somehow means that he hadn't been restored by the time he started the Godblast? By this line of logic, you might as well start claiming that Thor never performed the Godblast itself, since the narrative merely indicated that he had been charging it up.

Basic grasp of the English language would tell us that when the narrative claims that Thor was regaining strength, then that mans he was restored by the time he started invoking the GB.
Yes.

Yes. Now you're just using a strawman argument.

No.

Originally posted by kevdude
Considering they didn't use any of those things but used the Imperiex armor AE to send Imperiex Prime and Brainiac 13 back in time, if its not the top it's gotta be near it... That was Tempest, guided by Darkseid, empowered by the Amazons and Lex Luthor's time machine. I think you've got your scenes mixed up.

Originally posted by ODG
That was Tempest, guided by Darkseid, empowered by the Amazons and Lex Luthor's time machine. I think you've got your scenes mixed up.

It shows them using it as a crucible, melded the Apokolips tech and Brainiac 13's tech which made the temporal boom tube. Brainiac 13 calculated it and said that Steel could not withstand both the power of Lextower and Apokolips, but he did and Brainiac 13 said "no, error, no". Without it they would have not been able to make the boom tube.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Now you're just using a strawman argument.
I find it funny coming from you.

Anyways, as silly as this endeavor sounds, I am willing to get a mod ruling on this matter, whether Thor was weakened or not when he performed the Godblast against Exitar.

Originally posted by kevdude
It shows them using it as a crucible, melded the Apokolips tech and Brainiac 13's tech which made the temporal boom tube. Brainiac 13 calculated it and said that Steel could not withstand both the power of Lextower and Apokolips, but he did and Brainiac 13 said "no, error, no". Without it they would have not been able to make the boom tube.

How is any of this applicable to the Omega Beam?

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
If you think that's the case, prove it then.

No, he did not. He explained it as the same attack. It wasn't the same level of power. He literally destroyed a fortified Mjolnir in the Exitar scene, it by definition could not be.

Stop pretending the writer fully agreed with you.

It took all his might just to shatter the exterior shell and the interior was even more durable. This was Celestials in their prime, before almost anyone could even singe them.

It's the same level of power because THE WRITER WANTED IT TO BE.
Stop acting like the two attacks actually happened in real life and one was ACTUALLY more powerful than the other.

The goal of the showing was to cement Juggs durability. This is obvious.

Lastly, Mjolnir's durability does change from comic to comic. This is a fact.

Originally posted by h1a8
It's the same level of power because THE WRITER WANTED IT TO BE.
Stop acting like the two attacks actually happened in real life and one was ACTUALLY more powerful than the other.

The goal of the showing was to cement Juggs durability. This is obvious.

Lastly, Mjolnir's durability does change from comic to comic. This is a fact.

So you're a telepath now that can dig into the mind of the writer? Otherwise no, we don't get to ignore on panel evidence in favor of your guesswork. The arrogance of it all.

So what? That doesn't mean the God Blast was on par. Not to mention Juggernaut's durability wasn't even mentioned, the scene was meant to showcase that Thor's power can even stop and push back Juggernaut.

It's a fact is it? How are you going to go about prove this fact? Especially under this writer who never gave any indication of fluctuating durability.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
So you're a telepath now that can dig into the mind of the writer? Otherwise no, we don't get to ignore on panel evidence in favor of your guesswork. The arrogance of it all.

So what? That doesn't mean the God Blast was on par. Not to mention Juggernaut's durability wasn't even mentioned, the scene was meant to showcase that Thor's power can even stop and push back Juggernaut.

It's a fact is it? How are you going to go about prove this fact? Especially under this writer who never gave any indication of fluctuating durability.

This is not rocket science dude.
Why in the hell would the writer PURPOSELY want the attack to be lesser than previous? Especially when he referenced the previous Godblasts right before Thor did the attack?

The feat doesn't take away from Thor. It only adds to Juggernaut. The Godblast is still awesome.

Originally posted by h1a8
This is not rocket science dude.
Why in the hell would the writer PURPOSELY want the attack to be lesser than previous? Especially when he referenced the previous Godblasts right before Thor did the attack?

It isn't, which is why I'm curious what in particular is confusing you.

Ask the writer, I'm not a mind reader like you. A few issues before that fight, he had a Mjolnir reinforced with the belt of strength explode under the strain of the God Blast. This indicates far more powerful energy was used.

Which is hardy contradictory, the Celestials are far more powerful then Juggernaut. Especially in that era when there armor shrugged off even planetary levels of power.

Originally posted by h1a8

The feat doesn't take away from Thor. It only adds to Juggernaut. The Godblast is still awesome.



I don't give a shit. I'm not going to ignore the only possible logical conclusion and evidence slapping us in the face because you're desperate to give Juggernaut a better feat.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
It isn't, which is why I'm curious what in particular is confusing you.

Ask the writer, I'm not a mind reader like you. A few issues before that fight, he had a Mjolnir reinforced with the belt of strength explode under the strain of the God Blast. This indicates far more powerful energy was used.

Which is hardy contradictory, the Celestials are far more powerful then Juggernaut. Especially in that era when there armor shrugged off even planetary levels of power.
He referenced the other Godblast as being the same attack (while boasting that they were able overcome the enemy) prior to Thor doing it. It's obviously he's not trying to confuse the reader into thinking 'this' Godblast is weaker than the previous one.

There is 0 reason why the writer would want the Godblast to be lesser than previous, especially given the wording of the comic. You don't have to mind read when logic and common sense is perfect.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus


I don't give a shit. I'm not going to ignore the only possible logical conclusion and evidence slapping us in the face because you're desperate to give Juggernaut a better feat. I love the Juggernaut. Way better than Hulk and possibly DD. He's my favorite brick by far.

lol. not even close

Originally posted by h1a8
He referenced the other Godblast as being the same attack (while boasting that they were able overcome the enemy) prior to Thor doing it. It's obviously he's not trying to confuse the reader into thinking 'this' Godblast is weaker than the previous one.

There is 0 reason why the writer would want the Godblast to be lesser than previous, especially given the wording of the comic. You don't have to mind read when logic and common sense is perfect.

Yes, same attack. That does not mean it's the same level of power. No one denied it wasn't a God Blast.

What the hell are you even talking about? How about you shut up, read the comic, and stop trying to speculate in favor of on panel evidence? Just compare the preparation against Exitar in comparison to Juggernaut alone:
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e139/RageOfTheGod/Thor/DestroysCelestialBrainDome1.jpghttp://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e139/RageOfTheGod/Thor/DestroysCelestialBrainDome2.jpg

Except it is. Then start using some.

Originally posted by h1a8
I love the Juggernaut. Way better than Hulk and possibly DD. He's my favorite brick by far.

I figured that out when you argued he was more durable then Galacus.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Yes, same attack. That does not mean it's the same level of power. No one denied it wasn't a God Blast.

What the hell are you even talking about? How about you shut up, read the comic, and stop trying to speculate in favor of on panel evidence? Just compare the preparation against Exitar in comparison to Juggernaut alone:


Except it is. Then start using some.



I figured that out when you argued he was more durable then Galacus.

So you believe that the writer wanted the Godblast against Juggs to be weaker when prior Godblasts were carefully referenced?

Or are you arguing that what the writer wanted doesn't count?

Or are you arguing that Mjolnir's durability doesn't fluctuate?

Originally posted by h1a8
So you believe that the writer wanted the Godblast against Juggs to be weaker when prior Godblasts were carefully referenced?

Or are you arguing that what the writer wanted doesn't count?

Or are you arguing that Mjolnir's durability doesn't fluctuate?

Yes. Because he referenced a story where a God Blast he wrote, shattered the hammer while it was reinforced and produced a powerful, and large enough explosion to stun Exitar.

Are you arguing that you know what a writer wants when the comic conflicts with it? Look at all the telepaths we have on KMC all of a sudden.

I'm arguing that basing your case on a point that you cannot prove in anyway is complete idiotic. We aren't comparing two writers from across decades, this is the same guy who wrote the story like a dozen issues apart. And he's pretty well versed no his Thor stuff.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Yes. Because he referenced a story where a God Blast he wrote, shattered the hammer while it was reinforced and produced a powerful, and large enough explosion to stun Exitar.

Are you arguing that you know what a writer wants when the comic conflicts with it? Look at all the telepaths we have on KMC all of a sudden.

I'm arguing that basing your case on a point that you cannot prove in anyway is complete idiotic. We aren't comparing two writers from across decades, this is the same guy who wrote the story like a dozen issues apart. And he's pretty well versed no his Thor stuff.


What would be the point of making Godblast weaker? Wouldn't that be confusing to the reader, especially in light of it stopping Juggs and being referenced to give Celestials pause? The writer is not trying to confuse the reader at all but make things clear as day.

If you don't accept the variable durability concept (which is a proven fact in comics) then when the hammer was repaired maybe it was stronger and didn't need reinforcements the second time.

The comic doesn't not conflict with the writer because of
1. Variable durability concept

I did prove my argument. Writer's don't write things not shown or explained, nor do they secretly try to confuse the reader. Readers who read the comic instantly knew that Juggs was hit with the same Godblast as Thor hit Exitar with as the reason it was referenced.

If the Godblast was weaker than before the writer would have explained that it was and why it was, instead of confusing the reader and referencing past Godblast feats to compare. That's the proof.


1. Godblast was weaker (non founded) and hammer's durability is same
2. Godblast was same and hammer's durability is different
You are basically picking and choosing what suits you instead of what makes more sense. At best 2. is at least as credible as 1. and makes more sense