Dr. Strange VS Thor

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LordofBrooklyn
Dr. Strange- Classic

http://cdn.bleedingcool.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/dr-strange-22-6-10-kc.jpg

VS

Thor- Simonson, Fraction etc.

http://images2.fanpop.com/image/photos/10100000/thor-marvel-comics-10113598-1000-1044.jpg

Sorceror Supreme or Son of Odin?

JakeTheBank
Mjolnir is a potent tool against the likes of Stephen.

I'd personally give it to Thor 6-7/10. Strange could take a few wins, either after a grueling fight or he could pull off a crazy high end feat (under his own power and without context) and best Thor. Thor generally has all the right tools to beat Strange in a straight up fight, though, imho.

Branlor Swift
Thor breaks Strange.

abhilegend
Thor bashes strange's head in.

LordofBrooklyn
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Thor breaks Strange.

LIES!

LordofBrooklyn
Originally posted by abhilegend
Thor bashes strange's head in.

More LIES!

What percentage do you give Dr. Strange?

abhilegend
Originally posted by LordofBrooklyn
More LIES!

What percentage do you give Dr. Strange?
Maybe 3-4/10.

Vensai
I tend to favor Thor if they both have standard equipment.

Branlor Swift
http://i40.tinypic.com/2r6l9pf.jpg

LordofBrooklyn
IIRC Strange protects himself from a massive lightning bolt with auto-shields.

Mind control or mind-wipe for the win.

Branlor Swift
The electrical storm stopped him from being able to use magic, so that.

Plus if his auto shields protected him there and he was still almost KO'ed, then I'd hate to see Thor's severely enhanced lightning against his auto shields.

If he loses focus to attack his mind, then he gets his physical body destroyed.

JakeTheBank
There's no guarantee a mental assault would stop Thor either considering he has days where he's susceptible to psychic attacks and then days where he pushes through intense psychic and spiritual assault like a beast.

SamZED
I thought Loki > Strange?

Also lol at Powerman using turkey and beef all in the same sentence.

Endless Mike
Strange

the Darkone
Thor wins the vast majority, Thor can cancel out Dr Strange magic with mojlner and speed blitz the good Doctor shifty

TheGodKiller
Strange wins.

Endless Mike
Strange back in the day is the only Marvel superhero who could be traditionally expected to take on abstracts and win, without it being PIS. The guy was a ****ing monster.

abhilegend
That's how mages work in the comics. Even low level magicians have feats that should be beyond them.

"Id"
Strange

janus77
"Classic" Strange would stomp Odin.
Current Strange would lose to Thor.

Rage.Of.Olympus
^laughing out loud

This can definitely be a great fight but I'm going to give Thor the win. I think Thor giving Strange the Loki treatment is more likely then Strange pulling some hocus pocus win. And Asgardian power has usually been tough for Strange. I remember when the Asgardian magic in the Wrecking Crew was too much for Strange, he admitted the power of the World Tree was beyond anything he ever encountered, Loki owning him etc. Mjolnir has also been historically a great counter for magic.

abhilegend
Piledriver once oneshotted him.

Rage.Of.Olympus
I don't even consider that a low showing. Strange has low level durability and the Wrecking Crew can be legit threats. F*cking Shooter turned them into Spider-Man's punching bag and they never recovered in terms of consistent respect.

Insane Titan
Strange wins, a weaker strange was able to restore Thor's hammer don't see why a far more can't depower it .

JakeTheBank
Originally posted by janus77
"Classic" Strange would stomp Odin.
Current Strange would lose to Thor.

no expression

So, what, you think Classic Strange was consistently at Elder God level or something?

Originally posted by Insane Titan
Strange wins, a weaker strange was able to restore Thor's hammer don't see why a far more can't depower it .

Thor also had to willingly give up what portion of the Odin Force he had to do so.

Endless Mike
Originally posted by JakeTheBank So, what, you think Classic Strange was consistently at Elder God level or something?

No, but he has many ways to easily summon that level of power and beyond.

JakeTheBank
Originally posted by Endless Mike
No, but he has many ways to easily summon that level of power and beyond.

Such as? And without using all off his artifacts/prep time/or a huge array of plot device?

Because really, if we're going to say Strange "stomps" Odin of all people, then really, we may as well argue that he's easily Skyfather+ level...and toss out the tons of comics which portray him as anything but.

Galan007
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I'm going to give Thor the win. http://kavr.dk/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/Shocked_fans_omg_GIF.gif

dmills
laughing out loud

celeyhyga17
Thor edges him..
Close though...

LordofBrooklyn
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Such as? And without using all off his artifacts/prep time/or a huge array of plot device?

Because really, if we're going to say Strange "stomps" Odin of all people, then really, we may as well argue that he's easily Skyfather+ level...and toss out the tons of comics which portray him as anything but.

DR. Strange can call upon the power of the Vishanti to enhance his power.

Endless Mike
Not to mention the Octessence, Eternity, etc.

Even without their powers he was holding out against a 1000 times amped Mephisto in his own dimension just fine.

SamZED
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I don't even consider that a low showing. Strange has low level durability and the Wrecking Crew can be legit threats. F*cking Shooter turned them into Spider-Man's punching bag and they never recovered in terms of consistent respect. They've been playing ping pong with Spider-man and Deadpool last they met.

Rage.Of.Olympus
Did they? Scans?

SamZED
You've probably seen it, Suicide Kings. Dont have the scans right now. Was pretty brutal, Wrecker sent Pete flying like 10 stories into the air.

Rage.Of.Olympus
I don't think I have. I'll check it out.

SamZED
Ill post the scans as soon as I get the chance.

Rage.Of.Olympus
No need, I found them:
http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16317536_dpsk_05_003.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16317539_dpsk_05_004.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16317541_dpsk_05_005.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16317544_dpsk_05_006.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16317547_dpsk_05_007.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16317549_dpsk_05_008.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16317553_dpsk_05_009.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16317555_dpsk_05_010.jpg

Thanks though.

SamZED
Been a while since ive read it, make that 30 stories...

Rage.Of.Olympus
Yeah, pretty good durability feat for Spider-Man. He's like the Captain America of the low meta tier.

Mr Master
Originally posted by Endless Mike

Strange back in the day is the only Marvel superhero who could
be traditionally expected to take on abstracts and win, without it being PIS.
Let's not get ahead of ourselves good friend.

quanchi112
Thor wins.

zopzop
Dr. Strange dies

Sundipped
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
The electrical storm stopped him from being able to use magic, so that.

Plus if his auto shields protected him there and he was still almost KO'ed, then I'd hate to see Thor's severely enhanced lightning against his auto shields.

If he loses focus to attack his mind, then he gets his physical body destroyed.

Way to go.....using a nerfed Strange from the Defenders arcs thumb up
Since Thor gets backing from Fraction and Simonson in this thread, I feel it would be appropriate to give Doc backing from let's say...Englehart.

There were no auto shields in play there. Even in defense of this weaksauce Doc, it would be a different story fighting Thor 1on 1 in which a shield can be erected instead of getting hit and actually withstanding a bolt while focusing on teleportation. People like to pick on Strange's durability but I suspect he'll bring his A game and turn it up against someone like Thor like when he was able to sustain shots from an amped Juggs.

That scan was really just flat out stupidity on the writers part. A mystical obstruction due to bad weather? erm
Strange has done shit like taking a bolt and spliting Ghostrider in half with it.

http://i1292.photobucket.com/albums/b571/superior100/633fda28-cd15-4cb6-856b-a561a91afd9b_zps1de06a8a.jpg

Anyway I see this fight as a split. To reiterate what rage said, it would be a good battle.

Branlor Swift
Originally posted by Sundipped
Way to go.....using a nerfed Strange from the Defenders arcs thumb up
Since Thor gets backing from Fraction and Simonson in this thread, I feel it would be appropriate to give Doc backing from let's say...Englehart.

There were no auto shields in play there. Even in defense of this weaksauce Doc, it would be a different story fighting Thor 1on 1 in which a shield can be erected instead of getting hit and actually withstanding a bolt while focusing on teleportation. People like to pick on Strange's durability but I suspect he'll bring his A game and turn it up against someone like Thor like when he was able to sustain shots from an amped Juggs.

That scan was really just flat out stupidity on the writers part. A mystical obstruction due to bad weather? erm
Strange has done shit like taking a bolt and spliting Ghostrider in half with it.

http://i1292.photobucket.com/albums/b571/superior100/633fda28-cd15-4cb6-856b-a561a91afd9b_zps1de06a8a.jpg

Anyway I see this fight as a split. To reiterate what rage said, it would be a good battle. His powers flickering from being potent to not there had nothing to do with the lightning. In fact, he was about to teleport which is something he had extreme problems with when his powers were waning as he could really only fire blasts.

Fraction writes Thor more powerful than God would write Dr Strange, so not seeing the connection there...



If there were no auto shields, then you should be speaking to the person who I quoted:
Originally posted by LordofBrooklyn
IIRC Strange protects himself from a massive lightning bolt with auto-shields.

Mind control or mind-wipe for the win.

Strange's A game may or may or may not be taking shots from Juggernaut (even though he almost got floored by it), but the many many many other scenes indicate he's not taking shots from Thor un shielded.

You know what the funny part about the Ghost Rider fight was (besides Ghost Rider giving him a ton of problems and eventually leaving him a mess on the floor)? That that actually backs up the stance in the comic I posted that the magic attracts lightning...
http://i42.tinypic.com/5cahko.jpg

Because the lightning didn't block it... the magic only attracted it. Just like the scene you posted.
So, yeah, either the magic attracted lightning, or Strange made a spell that called forth lightning. Which goes against absolutely nothing in the first scan, and at worst backs it up.

LordofBrooklyn
Originally posted by Sundipped
Way to go.....using a nerfed Strange from the Defenders arcs thumb up
Since Thor gets backing from Fraction and Simonson in this thread, I feel it would be appropriate to give Doc backing from let's say...Englehart.

There were no auto shields in play there. Even in defense of this weaksauce Doc, it would be a different story fighting Thor 1on 1 in which a shield can be erected instead of getting hit and actually withstanding a bolt while focusing on teleportation. People like to pick on Strange's durability but I suspect he'll bring his A game and turn it up against someone like Thor like when he was able to sustain shots from an amped Juggs.

That scan was really just flat out stupidity on the writers part. A mystical obstruction due to bad weather? erm
Strange has done shit like taking a bolt and spliting Ghostrider in half with it.

http://i1292.photobucket.com/albums/b571/superior100/633fda28-cd15-4cb6-856b-a561a91afd9b_zps1de06a8a.jpg

Anyway I see this fight as a split. To reiterate what rage said, it would be a good battle.

He downplays the Juggernaut feat.

Would that scan be yours?

I'm trying to re-read all the issues involved in teh respect thread where Strange may have received an outside amp.

You can go to the original "Rank Em" thread to see more.

LordofBrooklyn
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
His powers flickering from being potent to not there had nothing to do with the lightning. In fact, he was about to teleport which is something he had extreme problems with when his powers were waning as he could really only fire blasts.

Fraction writes Thor more powerful than God would write Dr Strange, so not seeing the connection there...



If there were no auto shields, then you should be speaking to the person who I quoted:


Strange's A game may or may or may not be taking shots from Juggernaut (even though he almost got floored by it), but the many many many other scenes indicate he's not taking shots from Thor un shielded.

You know what the funny part about the Ghost Rider fight was (besides Ghost Rider giving him a ton of problems and eventually leaving him a mess on the floor)? That that actually backs up the stance in the comic I posted that the magic attracts lightning...
http://i42.tinypic.com/5cahko.jpg

Because the lightning didn't block it... the magic only attracted it. Just like the scene you posted.
So, yeah, either the magic attracted lightning, or Strange made a spell that called forth lightning. Which goes against absolutely nothing in the first scan, and at worst backs it up.

To Ghost Rider, IIRC, Strange was able to either block Zarathos power from Blaze or pull Zarathos out entirely.

Branlor Swift
Originally posted by LordofBrooklyn
To Ghost Rider, IIRC, Strange was able to either block Zarathos power from Blaze or pull Zarathos out entirely.

IIRC that was when Ghost Rider was knocked out and Strange borrowed his power. But since I don't feel like looking for it to make sure, I'll ask for a scan.

Originally posted by LordofBrooklyn
He downplays the Juggernaut feat.
Why should I be impressed by this exactly?
http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/DrStrangeSorcerersupre44-17.jpg
http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/DrStrangeSorcerersupre44-18.jpg
http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/DrStrangeSorcerersupre44-19.jpg

When Thor can strike way the shit harder than something that almost took Strange out?

Or are we under the assumption that Strange should be able to take Thor shots unshielded, and ignore hundreds of examples to the contrary?

LordofBrooklyn
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Why should I be impressed by this exactly?
http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/DrStrangeSorcerersupre44-17.jpg
http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/DrStrangeSorcerersupre44-18.jpg
http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/DrStrangeSorcerersupre44-19.jpg

When Thor can strike way the shit harder than something that almost took Strange out?

Or are we under the assumption that Strange should be able to take Thor shots unshielded, and ignore hundreds of examples to the contrary?

Acknowledging Strange's physical limitations and giving Thor his due credit, The Odinson may get in one clean shot. The point is that Strange can surmount the initial attack and then launch his own.

Are you arguing that Thor is that much stronger than Cain that the feat wouldn't be comprable?

Calling upon the Vishanti for help increases his power where he can more than deal with brute force from Thor.

Sundipped
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
And Asgardian power has usually been tough for Strange. I remember when the Asgardian magic in the Wrecking Crew was too much for Strange

WUT?!

http://i1292.photobucket.com/albums/b571/superior100/1f4bd2c6-6317-49d0-9b4c-bf183def0cef_zps63ea88f4.jpg

http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/14kwrhk.gif

Branlor Swift
Originally posted by LordofBrooklyn
Acknowledging Strange's physical limitations and giving Thor his due credit, The Odinson may get in one clean shot. The point is that Strange can surmount the initial attack and then launch his own.

Are you arguing that Thor is that much stronger than Cain that the feat wouldn't be comprable?

Calling upon the Vishanti for help increases his power where he can more than deal with brute force from Thor. If Strange gets hit though without shields, he's done. You are not in any way giving Thor his due if you think Strange can shrug off an attack from him unshielded.

He hits harder for sure.
And he def hits hard enough to one shot Dr Strange. You made it Fraction Thor, the guy one shot killed an amped Thing, dented Surfer's head with a headbutt, Damaged Galactus' head, etc.
But like I said, hundreds of examples to the contrary of the Juggernaut example. And he almost got taken out anyway by tractor trailer punches.

First off, prove it. Second off, not a good tactic unless Thor is standing there.

Branlor Swift
Originally posted by Sundipped
WUT?!

http://i1292.photobucket.com/albums/b571/superior100/1f4bd2c6-6317-49d0-9b4c-bf183def0cef_zps63ea88f4.jpg

http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/14kwrhk.gif
Yeah, it was Hulk who took out Strange there.

http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/Defenders_018_12.jpg
http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/Defenders_018_13.jpg
http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/Defenders_018_14.jpg

Mind you Mjolnir is no Wrecking Crew.

LordofBrooklyn
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
If Strange gets hit though without shields, he's done. You are not in any way giving Thor his due if you think Strange can shrug off an attack from him unshielded.

He hits harder for sure.
And he def hits hard enough to one shot Dr Strange. You made it Fraction Thor, the guy one shot killed an amped Thing, dented Surfer's head with a headbutt, Damaged Galactus' head, etc.
But like I said, hundreds of examples to the contrary of the Juggernaut example. And he almost got taken out anyway by tractor trailer punches.

First off, prove it. Second off, not a good tactic unless Thor is standing there.

Prove what?

The Vishanti scan is in the Respect thread but I don't have the issue to know the context.

If you mean taking a shot the Cain feat works well enough. It is more likely Strange has the shields up and that os more than enough to hold Thor off.

Branlor Swift
Originally posted by LordofBrooklyn
Prove what?

The Vishanti scan is in the Respect thread but I don't have the issue to know the context.

If you mean taking a shot the Cain feat works well enough. It is more likely Strange has the shields up and that os more than enough to hold Thor off. What you're saying. Prove your statements.

I see. So no proof then.

So your stance is that Strange can take a shot from Thor because of the one time he took an attack from Juggernaut that almost wrecked him in the process? Do I not only have to post the Juggernaut feat but a bunch of feats that completely contradict that?
Not only that, but Strange has stated in the past that his cloak has shielded the brunt of Wrecker's attack before. And Juggernaut struck him in the cloak. And Strange still was in terrible shape afterwards.

If he has his shields up that's fine. But claiming he won't be KO'ed from Thor when he's unshielded is insane.

Sundipped
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Yeah, it was Hulk who took out Strange there.

http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/Defenders_018_12.jpg
http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/Defenders_018_13.jpg
http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/Defenders_018_14.jpg

Mind you Mjolnir is no Wrecking Crew.

What are you talking about? Wrecker clearly states the crew is free now....thanks to Hulk. Hulk saved their asses. no expression

Branlor Swift
Originally posted by Sundipped
What are you talking about? Wrecker clearly states the crew is free now....thanks to Hulk. Hulk saved their asses. no expression I'm confused. Are you trying to go against something I said or something?

Just saying rage remembered it wrong.

Rage.Of.Olympus
Originally posted by Sundipped
WUT?!

http://i1292.photobucket.com/albums/b571/superior100/1f4bd2c6-6317-49d0-9b4c-bf183def0cef_zps63ea88f4.jpg

http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/14kwrhk.gif Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Yeah, it was Hulk who took out Strange there.

http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/Defenders_018_12.jpg
http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/Defenders_018_13.jpg
http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/Defenders_018_14.jpg

Mind you Mjolnir is no Wrecking Crew.

My bad, it was Hulk pounding on his barrier that tipped the scales.

Still, it taking pretty much everything Strange had -to the point of being in utter agony and endangering his sanity- to drain the Wrecking Crew does not bode well for him attempting to drain Mjolnir of it's power or whatever was suggested.

Also:
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e139/RageOfTheGod/Thor/DrainsWreckingCrew1.jpg
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e139/RageOfTheGod/Thor/DrainsWreckingCrew2.jpg

Just for some comparison.

LordofBrooklyn
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
What you're saying. Prove your statements.

I see. So no proof then.

So your stance is that Strange can take a shot from Thor because of the one time he took an attack from Juggernaut that almost wrecked him in the process? Do I not only have to post the Juggernaut feat but a bunch of feats that completely contradict that?
Not only that, but Strange has stated in the past that his cloak has shielded the brunt of Wrecker's attack before. And Juggernaut struck him in the cloak. And Strange still was in terrible shape afterwards.

If he has his shields up that's fine. But claiming he won't be KO'ed from Thor when he's unshielded is insane.

Look, you're being willfully obtuse.

Scenario 1- Strange has auto-shields up most of the time in his classic depictions and under Englehart. Thor brings his usual mentality and Mjolnir and they go to war.

This is the most likely scenario

Scenario 2- Strange's human frailty is taken into greatr account in comparison with Thor's physical supremacy. Speed is a factor in that difference and it could be argued that Thor can get an initial shot. Strange critics cite low durability and non-shielded events, taken that into account I bring up Cain.

Reasonable according to canon and fair to Thor supporters.

Scenario 3- Strange has auto-shields tanks an initial attack and takes Thor down with psionic attack. Thor's history against psionic attack is almost as erratic as Strange's to physical assaults.

I'm not a superfan( Though I admire all of you that are) with scans at the ready. You have posted in the Strange respect thread and are knowledgeable about the character. Working off memory some things may be off but the claims are well within the realm of Strange's canon.

I will get scans but I think you know exactly what is accurate in my claims.

Sundipped
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
His powers flickering from being potent to not there had nothing to do with the lightning. In fact, he was about to teleport which is something he had extreme problems with when his powers were waning as he could really only fire blasts.

Fraction writes Thor more powerful than God would write Dr Strange, so not seeing the connection there...



If there were no auto shields, then you should be speaking to the person who I quoted:


Strange's A game may or may or may not be taking shots from Juggernaut (even though he almost got floored by it), but the many many many other scenes indicate he's not taking shots from Thor un shielded.

You know what the funny part about the Ghost Rider fight was (besides Ghost Rider giving him a ton of problems and eventually leaving him a mess on the floor)? That that actually backs up the stance in the comic I posted that the magic attracts lightning...
http://i42.tinypic.com/5cahko.jpg

Because the lightning didn't block it... the magic only attracted it. Just like the scene you posted.
So, yeah, either the magic attracted lightning, or Strange made a spell that called forth lightning. Which goes against absolutely nothing in the first scan, and at worst backs it up.

In the scan it was clearly mentioned that it was a constant storm ongoing and mystical energy attracted lightning. Absolute BS. Seriously doubt Thor tries weather tactics in this case anyway.

"God can't write Strange more powerful than a Fraction Thor"? Get Thor's balls out cha mouth will ya roll eyes (sarcastic)

So you don't think shields (auto or common) won't be on standby in a one on one matchup? Okedokey.

Strange had him dead to rights until CIS allowed the chains to grab him for the Penance Stare. It was a sneak attack. Strange thought he was finished.
I don't doubt a hammer shot would do damage but Doc knows Thor very well and melee tactics would most likely be accounted for and properly defended in a forum fight.

Highly doubt a lightning bolt gets through a shield capable of blocking cosmic energy, lasers, core of the sun heat, Doramammu etc. That makes that scan even more ridiculous. If magic did bring forth the lightning, then the Ghostrider fight shows that it is well within his control. Sometimes plot plays a part in all of this and at times stupidity is inserted...like the case in your scan.

Branlor Swift
Originally posted by LordofBrooklyn
Look, you're being willfully obtuse.

Scenario 1- Strange has auto-shields up most of the time in his classic depictions and under Englehart. Thor brings his usual mentality and Mjolnir and they go to war.

This is the most likely scenario

Scenario 2- Strange's human frailty is taken into greatr account in comparison with Thor's physical supremacy. Speed is a factor in that difference and it could be argued that Thor can get an initial shot. Strange critics cite low durability and non-shielded events, taken that into account I bring up Cain.

Reasonable according to canon and fair to Thor supporters.

Scenario 3- Strange has auto-shields tanks an initial attack and takes Thor down with psionic attack. Thor's history against psionic attack is almost as erratic as Strange's to physical assaults.

I'm not a superfan( Though I admire all of you that are) with scans at the ready. You have posted in the Strange respect thread and are knowledgeable about the character. Working off memory some things may be off but the claims are well within the realm of Strange's canon.

I will get scans but I think you know exactly what is accurate in my claims.

Like I said before, you can find 100 scans of Strange not having auto shields to every 1 scan you find of an auto shield
Tell you what, for every scan of an auto shield you can find, I'll show Thor godblasting

But Strange's durability still is low citing the Cain example...

Strange's auto shield is simply not tanking an attack from Thor though.
And Thor's history against the psychic angle is nowhere near as bad as you make it seem. Like Rage already said, Thor (berserk) already violently expelled Strange from his mind.

I know a lot. I know a little. No one besides me will ever know exactly how much I know, and I'll keep it that way. But it's not up to me to prove claims, especially when it's not just the scan, but also the interpreter that matter.
Plus, I also don't care one way or another, which is why you should probably make me care.

Sundipped
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
My bad, it was Hulk pounding on his barrier that tipped the scales.

Still, it taking pretty much everything Strange had -to the point of being in utter agony and endangering his sanity- to drain the Wrecking Crew does not bode well for him attempting to drain Mjolnir of it's power or whatever was suggested.

Also:
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e139/RageOfTheGod/Thor/DrainsWreckingCrew1.jpg
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e139/RageOfTheGod/Thor/DrainsWreckingCrew2.jpg

Just for some comparison.

Ok.
Thor's looked better but if I go back to Marvel Premier Strange, he was absorbing elder god scale mystical energy which was said could destroy galaxies. Thor would get sucked dry.

Branlor Swift
Originally posted by Sundipped
In the scan it was clearly mentioned that it was a constant storm ongoing and mystical energy attracted lightning. Absolute BS. Seriously doubt Thor tries weather tactics in this case anyway.

"God can't write Strange more powerful than a Fraction Thor"? Get Thor's balls out cha mouth will ya roll eyes (sarcastic)

So you don't think shields (auto or common) won't be on standby in a one on one matchup? Okedokey.

Strange had him dead to rights until CIS allowed the chains to grab him for the Penance Stare. It was a sneak attack. Strange thought he was finished.
I don't doubt a hammer shot would do damage but Doc knows Thor very well and melee tactics would most likely be accounted for and properly defended in a forum fight.

Highly doubt a lightning bolt gets through a shield capable of blocking cosmic energy, lasers, core of the sun heat, Doramammu etc. That makes that scan even more ridiculous. If magic did bring forth the lightning, then the Ghostrider fight shows that it is well within his control. Sometimes plot plays a part in all of this and at times stupidity is inserted...like the case in your scan.

Yes, and point out why that's bs.
Thor always uses lightning, and used weather attacks even against the Hulk. If you want to start doubting tactics, then you shouldn't be backing up the "auto shield" tactic.

Good deflection from just dropping Englehart and thinking that's enough.

I never said that. Though I think Thor would smash it anyway, but I digress...
It's just that you're speaking as if Strange can take Thor's attacks unshielded.

Good for Strange. And GR had the chance to finish him as well throughout the fight. But he didn't press the advantage. Hell, Strange even asked him for a moment while he was charging at him that stopped GR from attacking.

That's like saying magic attacks would be accounted for by Thor. Does that mean a lot to you?
He can stop himself from going melee, but he's not going to stop Thor.

Funny thing you mention core of the sun heat considering Thor literally fired off lightning at Atum in the core of the sun that effected him.
But in the Ghost Rider scan, it was completely calm and the magic attracted a bolt. If Thor activates a big storm like he's capable of, and Strange starts using magic... judging from your scan and mine, he's going to attract it. Which brings about a distraction at the least.

You can claim stupidity, but when even your own scan meant to disprove it accidentally backs it up? Well, that's not the best way to go about it.

JakeTheBank
lol @ Thor not resorting to weather/lightning tactics.

Strange's best bet is to attempt to mind rape Thor and hope he's having an off day. Anything remotely close to a direct fight and Strange is going to get overwhelmed.

LordofBrooklyn
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
lol @ Thor not resorting to weather/lightning tactics.

Strange's best bet is to attempt to mind rape Thor and hope he's having an off day. Anything remotely close to a direct fight and Strange is going to get overwhelmed.

Strange will be overwhelmed by what exactly?

Certaintly not brute force. The Odinson is not hammering down shields and/or constructs put up by Strange with ease.

Dr. Strange's ability to augment his own power(sans artifacts) is much greater than Thor's.

To Thor supporters, in particular RageOfOlympus, how does Thor beat the Sorceror Supreme?

JakeTheBank
Originally posted by LordofBrooklyn
Strange will be overwhelmed by what exactly?

Certaintly not brute force. The Odinson is not hammering down shields and/or constructs put up by Strange with ease.

Dr. Strange's ability to augment his own power(sans artifacts) is much greater than Thor's.

To Thor supporters, in particular RageOfOlympus, how does Thor beat the Sorceror Supreme?

How can you honestly claim that it's beyond Thor's power to physically dominate Strange after all the evidence to the contrary?

I don't see how hammer tosses or swings wouldn't put a lot of stress on Stephen based on both what has taxed him and the kind of feats Thor has with Mjolnir used as a melee or ranged weapon.

And yet, it doesn't translate that way in comics For all this talk of Strange "amping" himself or calling upon the Vishanti or Eternity or other forces, the fact is that his win record against actual heralds is very spotty to say nothing of beings beyond that tier. With the right context, prep, or artifacts, Strange can bat well outside his tier every now and then, but Thor does that, too, and generally without any of those to help him out. And citing all the times Strange has been felled or put in dire straights by physical force or through herald level power isn't "lowballing" him or citing PIS, not at the consistent level that it happens on.

Physically, Thor is far beyond Strange, and to be frank, could probably speedblitz him. Without shields, the likes of which have been greatly overstated (auto or not), he has very human durability. Personally, I think if Strange were to trade blasts with Thor or engage him in a direct combative matter, he's going to be broken like the glass cannon he is. His shields certainly aren't beyond Thor's means to break through. Thor wouldn't even really have to tap into his more versatile abilities to prove to be a drastic issue to him.

Strange beating Thor is certainly possible, sure. But Strange being in a completely different tier than him and Surfer is ludicrous and easily one of the worst myths of comics.

Sundipped
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Yes, and point out why that's bs.
Thor always uses lightning, and used weather attacks even against the Hulk. If you want to start doubting tactics, then you shouldn't be backing up the "auto shield" tactic.

Doc's mystical energy atracted a bolt because a storm was already present. So you're giving Thor great odds in favor of creating a ordinary storm against Strange in order for a bolt to be fired as a result of a mystical glitch? What would Thor only make it rain for when he could just fire a bolt outright anyway? This is very much not a presumable strategy nor would it make much sense.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Good deflection from just dropping Englehart and thinking that's enough.

What deflection? The OP listed writers to back Thor. Is it something wrong with me suggesting backing for Strange? We all know what a Fraction Thor can do but you went overboard by elevating Thor to this "untouchable" status by implying even God can't write Strange to a level where competetion can't be seen at least in a somewhat balanced manner. I wouldn't even expect a statement like that even from Rage or Jake who may be the biggest Thor supporters on Earth. You sounded like a foaming at the mouth rabid fanboy to say the least.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
I never said that. Though I think Thor would smash it anyway, but I digress...
It's just that you're speaking as if Strange can take Thor's attacks unshielded.

With repeated bludgeoning he may smash it but Doc is not going to just sit there while he wails away. Oh yeah...if you're thinking about bringing up that lack of context shield smash collection you like to lowball with forget it. I already responded numerous times to it and provided the hows and whys.

Regarding Thor's attacks, Strange has already took em. In New Avengers #34, the current Strange (who most consider a noob) took on the whole Avengers team. He withstood a bolt from Thor that freed the team from the Crimson Bands with no shield and got right back up and immediately incapacitated Rulk. Later in the fight he shielded himself from a lightining attack from Thor at ground zero and directly after that shielded a blast from Ms. Marvel. This Strange wasn't even a Sorceror Supreme and had non of his standard gear.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Good for Strange. And GR had the chance to finish him as well throughout the fight. But he didn't press the advantage. Hell, Strange even asked him for a moment while he was charging at him that stopped GR from attacking.

Good for GR...even tho Doc was never out of it at any time. He even brushed off the hellfire with no shield. Just because you tell your opponent to "hold up" doesn't mean you're necessarily hanging on for dear life. The only reason GR got those couple of licks off in the beginning was because Strange held back trying to figure out if it was Blaze or not.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
That's like saying magic attacks would be accounted for by Thor. Does that mean a lot to you?
He can stop himself from going melee, but he's not going to stop Thor.

Yeah it means alot. Doramammu's magic attacks have been accounted for so why not Thor's? They're capable of stopping each other which is why I gave a split in this matchup.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Funny thing you mention core of the sun heat considering Thor literally fired off lightning at Atum in the core of the sun that effected him.

What's that supposed to prove? Doc's shield is not composed of the gases that constitute a sun. It can be blocked.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
But in the Ghost Rider scan, it was completely calm and the magic attracted a bolt. If Thor activates a big storm like he's capable of, and Strange starts using magic... judging from your scan and mine, he's going to attract it. Which brings about a distraction at the least.

In all likelyhood that bolt from Strange was totally mystical in origin being that he uttered a spell right beforehand. And once again..why would he opt to summon a typical storm instead of just firing the most potent attack of a storm which would be the bolt? I think he knows the typical elements of a storm like wind/rain/hail etc. (by way of not having knowledge of this BS counter weakness) would be useless against Strange.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
You can claim stupidity, but when even your own scan meant to disprove it accidentally backs it up? Well, that's not the best way to go about it.

Ok so now we can throw out how the lightining originated but while we're on the subject of that scan, tell me how Thor would fare if that bolt struck him like it did GR? Remember GR's body was symmetrically seperated. And no, there will be no Mjolnir defense because that spell is designed to have the opposition in a state of bewilderment before the strike like GR was.

Mr Master
===============================

I just wanted to point out that the Abstracts are not at Dr Strange's beck and call.

They aided him in specific situations where they had some stake in.

Ok, so proceed with this enriched debate.

LordofBrooklyn
Originally posted by Mr Master
===============================

I just wanted to point out that the Abstracts are not at Dr Strange's beck and call.

They aided him in specific situations where they had some stake in.

Ok, so proceed with this enriched debate.

The power of the Vishanti IS at the disposal of Dr. Strange and that is more than enough.

Branlor Swift
Originally posted by Sundipped
Doc's mystical energy atracted a bolt because a storm was already present. So you're giving Thor great odds in favor of creating a ordinary storm against Strange in order for a bolt to be fired as a result of a mystical glitch? What would Thor only make it rain for when he could just fire a bolt outright anyway? This is very much not a presumable strategy nor would it make much sense. I agree. Which Thor can repeat.

Because Thor can make a giant storm, and it can be on the field while he carries on with whatever he needs to do. And he can do it quickly.

I'm not giving great odds for it, I just find it funny that something Thor does a lot in comics has been shown to be detrimental to Dr Strange.

But no, it doesn't make sense for Thor to summon a storm. I don't find it very probable that Dr Strange will utilize magic either.

Originally posted by Sundipped
What deflection? The OP listed writers to back Thor. Is it something wrong with me suggesting backing for Strange? We all know what a Fraction Thor can do but you went overboard by elevating Thor to this "untouchable" status by implying even God can't write Strange to a level where competetion can't be seen at least in a somewhat balanced manner. I wouldn't even expect a statement like that even from Rage or Jake who may be the biggest Thor supporters on Earth. You sounded like a foaming at the mouth rabid fanboy to say the least.
You're still deflecting though. If you disagree with my statement, then prove to me how Englehart writes a more powerful Strange.

My 'joke' was meant for you to actually show something. But you'd rather deflect to how much of a rabid fanboy of Thor I am.

K, I'm a rabid Thor fanboy. Now show how dropping Englehart's name is relevant.



Originally posted by Sundipped
With repeated bludgeoning he may smash it but Doc is not going to just sit there while he wails away. Oh yeah...if you're thinking about bringing up that lack of context shield smash collection you like to lowball with forget it. I already responded numerous times to it and provided the hows and whys.
Doc doesn't have to sit there though for Thor to break it.

You made up a bunch of excuses that didn't ring true at all though. You might think you answered it, but I really doubt you feel confident about that. lol at lack of context though.
At this point in time, I really shouldn't have to prove Thor can break his shield without going all out. I could requote it, but then again, I could also move onto another decade and surely find an entirely new set of scans.
Either way the end result is the same; excuses being made for why 30 different beings can smash his shield, and why Thor couldn't repeat it.

Originally posted by Sundipped
Regarding Thor's attacks, Strange has already took em. In New Avengers #34, the current Strange (who most consider a noob) took on the whole Avengers team. He withstood a bolt from Thor that freed the team from the Crimson Bands with no shield and got right back up and immediately incapacitated Rulk. Later in the fight he shielded himself from a lightining attack from Thor at ground zero and directly after that shielded a blast from Ms. Marvel. This Strange wasn't even a Sorceror Supreme and had non of his standard gear.
He got blown away from a blast that hit Thor directly and blew the entire team back.
http://i41.tinypic.com/k0olg3.jpg

You know who was closer to that attack than Strange? Everyone. Including Daredevil, Black Widow, and the like.

But yes he did take what looked like a weak lightning attack by Thor, and then he got trashed by Ms Marvel while he was using his shield...
http://i40.tinypic.com/11mgjk7.jpg
http://i40.tinypic.com/k2zkvn.jpg
http://i42.tinypic.com/e8vcxy.jpg

Unless we think Thor was using an actual powerful attack there, and Ms Marvel is more powerful than Thor... Not the best evidence on your end.


Originally posted by Sundipped
Good for GR...even tho Doc was never out of it at any time. He even brushed off the hellfire with no shield. Just because you tell your opponent to "hold up" doesn't mean you're necessarily hanging on for dear life. The only reason GR got those couple of licks off in the beginning was because Strange held back trying to figure out if it was Blaze or not.

He was glowing almost the entire fight, and had sparkles around him in the shape of a shield right before the hellfire.
http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/GR03_11.jpg
http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/GR03_20.jpg

He was definitely dazed and the "hold up" definitely stopped him from getting attacked.
http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/GR03_06.jpg
http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/GR03_07.jpg

I have my doubts he was completely unshielded. Although irrelevant as well considering Thor>>>>Ghost Rider.

But at the end of the day, them both being in a position to being beaten is ultimately irrelevant considering Ghost Rider did win.
And that was the first time Ghost Rider used hellfire in that incarnation too. Should have seen him at the end of that run, he was way more powerful.


Originally posted by Sundipped
Yeah it means alot. Doramammu's magic attacks have been accounted for so why not Thor's? They're capable of stopping each other which is why I gave a split in this matchup. Because Thor doesn't do enchantments/spells like Dormammu.

His attacks are laced with magic, that's not something you can account for unless he can completely stop Thor's attacks. That's the job for a shield.
And his shield IMO is questionable, but I digress.

Strange can account for his attacks via a shield. Thor can account for his attacks via absorption. If they stand in front of each other and blast away. Although that would be an absolutely dreadful idea for Strange.

But I don't have much problems with people saying split since I realize it's tough to sway from your 'guy'. What I take issues with is people under the assumption that Strange is clearly a whole tier higher than Thor like this lord fellow here.



Originally posted by Sundipped
What's that supposed to prove? Doc's shield is not composed of the gases that constitute a sun. It can be blocked. Playing dumb doesn't work.

You brought up Strange's shield blocking the heat of the sun, and I said Thor's lightning has proven more potent than the heat of the sun to the point of effecting someone way more durable than Dormammu.
IE Thor was more powerful in that example.

Originally posted by Sundipped
In all likelyhood that bolt from Strange was totally mystical in origin being that he uttered a spell right beforehand. And once again..why would he opt to summon a typical storm instead of just firing the most potent attack of a storm which would be the bolt? I think he knows the typical elements of a storm like wind/rain/hail etc. (by way of not having knowledge of this BS counter weakness) would be useless against Strange. He uttered the spell to attract it on a calm day.

Because he can do both, again. Hell, he can fire off lightning while he's summoning storms.



Originally posted by Sundipped
Ok so now we can throw out how the lightining originated but while we're on the subject of that scan, tell me how Thor would fare if that bolt struck him like it did GR? Remember GR's body was symmetrically seperated. And no, there will be no Mjolnir defense because that spell is designed to have the opposition in a state of bewilderment before the strike like GR was. Considering Ghost Rider is way less durable than Thor, unless we're of the opinion that Jack'O Lantern's gun can blow off Thor's head:
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/Ghost%20Rider/img017-1.jpg

I don't think much of it. And considering Thor controls the shit out of lightning, I really don't think much of it.

The spell "bewildered" Ghost Rider because it initially did nothing but conjure up/attract lightning.

ODG
^ Dr. Strange would win. Come at me, bro.

Branlor Swift
Originally posted by ODG
^ Dr. Strange would win. Come at me, bro. You're as big of a traitor to Thor as Quan is to Thanos.

ODG
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
You're as big of a traitor to Thor as Quan is to Thanos. I just recognize that the Sorcerer Supreme notches it up a level when he has to against the highest level of opponents/threats but can turn around and be bruised about by third-rate villains. Much the same way Flash operates. But when you're dealing with Thor-level threats, the former is more instructive than the latter.

Like when a diminished Dr. Strange fought and defeated a mind-controlled Thor not long ago while being gang-raped by the entirety of the Avengers.

Branlor Swift
Originally posted by ODG
I just recognize that the Sorcerer Supreme notches it up a level when he has to against the highest level of opponents/threats but can turn around and be bruised about by third-rate villains. Much the same way Flash operates. But when you're dealing with Thor-level threats, the former is more instructive than the latter.

Like when a diminished Dr. Strange fought and defeated a mind-controlled Thor not long ago while being gang-raped by the entirety of the Avengers. That's true of any character

No he didn't

ODG
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
That's true of any character

No he didn't My point.

Thor's "oh sh1t" face when he blasted him/reflected his lightning looked pretty definitive to me.

Branlor Swift
Originally posted by ODG
My point.

Thor's "oh sh1t" face when he blasted him/reflected his lightning looked pretty definitive to me. So... it only benefits Strange in this fight?

How is this Thor getting defeated?
http://i40.tinypic.com/11mgjk7.jpg
http://i40.tinypic.com/k2zkvn.jpg
http://i42.tinypic.com/e8vcxy.jpg

TheGodKiller
^Lol at the artwork in the 2nd scan.

ODG
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
So... it only benefits Strange in this fight?

How is this Thor getting defeated?
http://i40.tinypic.com/11mgjk7.jpg
http://i40.tinypic.com/k2zkvn.jpg
http://i42.tinypic.com/e8vcxy.jpg Spider-Man and Captain America were up and about on the next page too although they were defeated. They were saved by Captain Marvel. Just like Thor.

thumb up

Branlor Swift
Originally posted by ODG
Spider-Man and Captain America were up and about on the next page too although they were defeated. They were saved by Captain Marvel. Just like Thor.

thumb up They were shown struggling to get up for a page and a panel as we actually seen them get 'beaten' (Spider-Man trapped, Cap put on his knees with a spell surrounding his head).

I guess anytime Thor is shown to be blasted in the face he's knocked out, even if he's perfectly fine 2 pages later talking down to his enemy.

Odekahn
Originally posted by Galan007
http://kavr.dk/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/Shocked_fans_omg_GIF.gif

I came.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
You're as big of a traitor to Thor as Quan is to Thanos. I'll kill you where you stand.

ODG
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
They were shown struggling to get up for a page and a panel as we actually seen them get 'beaten' (Spider-Man trapped, Cap put on his knees with a spell surrounding his head).

I guess anytime Thor is shown to be blasted in the face he's knocked out, even if he's perfectly fine 2 pages later talking down to his enemy. ... when Captain Marvel saves him, sure. thumb up

Branlor Swift
Instead of admitting you're wrong, you're going with weaker Dr Strange one shotting Thor based on nothing?

Well, as long as it makes you feel better. You may have the last word too. thumb up

ODG
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Instead of admitting you're wrong, you're going with weaker Dr Strange one shotting Thor based on nothing?

Well, as long as it makes you feel better. You may have the last word too. thumb up I can admit that a mind-controlled Thor can be defeated by a weaker Dr. Strange who was finally bringing his A-game. He was dismantling the Avengers one-by-one. That stopped by the time Captain Marvel finally managed a good shot in. In no small part, I'm sure, due to the exhaustion and efforts required to take on Thor.

It that offends you, it shouldn't.

Rage.Of.Olympus
Originally posted by Sundipped
Ok.
Thor's looked better but if I go back to Marvel Premier Strange, he was absorbing elder god scale mystical energy which was said could destroy galaxies. Thor would get sucked dry.

Post scans if you can. I've learned to be weary of feats from Strange without analyzing context.

And Thor has dealt with energy on such a scale before as well.

Rage.Of.Olympus
Originally posted by ODG
Like when a diminished Dr. Strange fought and defeated a mind-controlled Thor not long ago while being gang-raped by the entirety of the Avengers.

Defeated? More like knocked back/blasted away or whatever for a page.

Might as well argue Thor defeated Strange here:
http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/16334555_06.jpg http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/16334556_08.jpg

Sundipped
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
I agree. Which Thor can repeat.

Because Thor can make a giant storm, and it can be on the field while he carries on with whatever he needs to do. And he can do it quickly.

I'm not giving great odds for it, I just find it funny that something Thor does a lot in comics has been shown to be detrimental to Dr Strange.

But no, it doesn't make sense for Thor to summon a storm. I don't find it very probable that Dr Strange will utilize magic either.

You're not giving great odds ok cool, that's really all I wanted to hear.
Nice twist you put on those occurences. Magic instances>>>>>>>>...infinite >'s >storm instances.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
You're still deflecting though. If you disagree with my statement, then prove to me how Englehart writes a more powerful Strange.

My 'joke' was meant for you to actually show something. But you'd rather deflect to how much of a rabid fanboy of Thor I am.

K, I'm a rabid Thor fanboy. Now show how dropping Englehart's name is relevant.

Ok that was a joke of yours. Just came off as too arrogant for me initially.
Classic Thor won't beat Marvel Premier black magic Strange. You know the one who couldn't even come to the 616 plane without indirectly destroying it after fighting Shuma. That's the best one to pick and has the greatest chances of emerging victorious.


Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Doc doesn't have to sit there though for Thor to break it.

You made up a bunch of excuses that didn't ring true at all though. You might think you answered it, but I really doubt you feel confident about that. lol at lack of context though.
At this point in time, I really shouldn't have to prove Thor can break his shield without going all out. I could requote it, but then again, I could also move onto another decade and surely find an entirely new set of scans.
Either way the end result is the same; excuses being made for why 30 different beings can smash his shield, and why Thor couldn't repeat it.

Didn't ring true or you just chose to not accept them. Those "excuses" were stated on panel and many of them were even in the actual scans you posted. Go head lowball away all you want and go digging. It won't take away from the good showings.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
He got blown away from a blast that hit Thor directly and blew the entire team back.
http://i41.tinypic.com/k0olg3.jpg

You know who was closer to that attack than Strange? Everyone. Including Daredevil, Black Widow, and the like.

But yes he did take what looked like a weak lightning attack by Thor, and then he got trashed by Ms Marvel while he was using his shield...
http://i40.tinypic.com/11mgjk7.jpg
http://i40.tinypic.com/k2zkvn.jpg
http://i42.tinypic.com/e8vcxy.jpg

Unless we think Thor was using an actual powerful attack there, and Ms Marvel is more powerful than Thor... Not the best evidence on your end.

Strange wasn't that far away. Only a few feet.

http://s4d2.turboimagehost.com/t/16334553_NewAvengers-Zone-004-2.jpg

The lightining had to be meant to affect only Strange but at the same time free the team because like you said, people like Daredevil and Black Widow were unharmed.

Of course, you would say it was weak huh? laughing out loudNonetheless , the lightining and a full blast from Ms.Marvel was still shielded. Overall a good showing from Strange.

He also froze Thing in place where he couldn't do anything for a few pages. And don't forget that this was a non SS non prep Strange that took on this team for about 8 pages or so.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
He was glowing almost the entire fight, and had sparkles around him in the shape of a shield right before the hellfire.
http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/GR03_11.jpg
http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/GR03_20.jpg

He was definitely dazed and the "hold up" definitely stopped him from getting attacked.
http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/GR03_06.jpg
http://i1134.photobucket.com/albums/m610/sonnendawg/GR03_07.jpg

I have my doubts he was completely unshielded. Although irrelevant as well considering Thor>>>>Ghost Rider.

But at the end of the day, them both being in a position to being beaten is ultimately irrelevant considering Ghost Rider did win.
And that was the first time Ghost Rider used hellfire in that incarnation too. Should have seen him at the end of that run, he was way more powerful.

There is no evidence of a shield being projected in those first few scans. Only an aura which Strange has had plenty of times. Looked to me like the hellfire hit him straight up. And once again Strange being down doesn't mean he's out of it. Like how he got up and handled Rulk in New Avengers after the lightining blast from Thor.

GR's immortality and Doc's guilt is what guaranteed the victory but it's really moot because Thor has no Pennance Stare. I sure hope GR got more powerful. The way ol frail body Steven <-----as you would describe him, tanked it, he had nowhere to go but up.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Because Thor doesn't do enchantments/spells like Dormammu.

His attacks are laced with magic, that's not something you can account for unless he can completely stop Thor's attacks. That's the job for a shield.
And his shield IMO is questionable, but I digress.

Strange can account for his attacks via a shield. Thor can account for his attacks via absorption. If they stand in front of each other and blast away. Although that would be an absolutely dreadful idea for Strange.

But I don't have much problems with people saying split since I realize it's tough to sway from your 'guy'. What I take issues with is people under the assumption that Strange is clearly a whole tier higher than Thor like this lord fellow here.

The purpose of his shields are to protect against whatever foe he's facing. Doesn't matter if it's enchanted lighting or Flames of the Faltine, power cosmic, it makes no difference.

You don't have to inform me that you think his shields are questionable, I get reminded by you on the regular. wink

Not sure who'll win in a blastoff but the channelling the Vishanti which he's done for his most powerfull blasts should keep him in the game. I suppose the GB can match it but a contest like that would leave both in a weakened state.

If someone wants place him in a slightly higher tier let them subjectively be satisfied. Won't get a argument from me tho. cool

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Playing dumb doesn't work.

You brought up Strange's shield blocking the heat of the sun, and I said Thor's lightning has proven more potent than the heat of the sun to the point of effecting someone way more durable than Dormammu.
IE Thor was more powerful in that example.

He uttered the spell to attract it on a calm day.

Because he can do both, again. Hell, he can fire off lightning while he's summoning storms.

Atum labeled it as "bothersome". The threat significance of it wasn't that great. Not to mention the energies were "of the same essence as the sun". No biggie, whether it was lightining or solar based it can be blocked.

So what it was a calm day? The bolt was mystical. It was a 2 part spell.

Still hanging your hat on that storm huh? I understand though...against Strange you'll need to take advantage of any exploitation available.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Considering Ghost Rider is way less durable than Thor, unless we're of the opinion that Jack'O Lantern's gun can blow off Thor's head:
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/Ghost%20Rider/img017-1.jpg

I don't think much of it. And considering Thor controls the shit out of lightning, I really don't think much of it.

The spell "bewildered" Ghost Rider because it initially did nothing but conjure up/attract lightning.

Except that GR was lying flat on his back dealing with Strange and had to use his chains on a then feeling guilty Steve.

No, you can't put much thought into it considering Thor won't be controlling what's he's not even expecting. That small orb what GR thought was insignificant distracted him and allowed the strike to hit him. Thor can endure some punishment but it will connect and have an affect.

Sundipped
Originally posted by TheGodKiller
^Lol at the artwork in the 2nd scan.

They had like 3 different artists doing the scene. Kinda phucked up if you ask me.

Sundipped
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Defeated? More like knocked back/blasted away or whatever for a page.

Might as well argue Thor defeated Strange here:
http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/16334555_06.jpg http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/16334556_08.jpg

Alotta pages inbetween those 2 scans.

About that scan, I'll post it tomorrow if nobody beats me to it. Gotta go for now.

ODG
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Defeated? More like knocked back/blasted away or whatever for a page.

Might as well argue Thor defeated Strange here:
http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/16334555/06.jpg.html
http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/16334556/08.jpg.html I think it's rather obvious from Thor's "oh sh1t" face and the one-by-one systematic dismantling of every Avenger that Dr. Strange took on before finally being overwhelmed. Thor was obviously the most powerful chess piece on the board, so there would be no reason for Brother Voodoo to switch into Captain Marvel's body for the coup de grace, if Thor was only momentarily staggered.

If the art isn't clear to you, and I can't blame you for that, the pattern and progression of the fight ought to be.

Rage.Of.Olympus
Originally posted by Sundipped
Alotta pages inbetween those 2 scans.

About that scan, I'll post it tomorrow if nobody beats me to it. Gotta go for now.

What are you talking about? Those two scans are consecutive.

Rage.Of.Olympus
Originally posted by ODG
I think it's rather obvious from Thor's "oh sh1t" face and the one-by-one systematic dismantling of every Avenger that Dr. Strange took on before finally being overwhelmed. Thor was obviously the most powerful chess piece on the board, so there would be no reason for Brother Voodoo to switch into Captain Marvel's body for the coup de grace, if Thor was only momentarily staggered.

If the art isn't clear to you, and I can't blame you for that, the pattern and progression of the fight ought to be.

Reasonable but not conclusive evidence either as Voodoo was jumping from host to host often whether they were out or not. Of course he was only momentarily staggered or whatever, what else do you think happened? Thor was standing over Strange on the next page without a scratch. That entire sequence with Captain Marvel couldn't have lasted for more then a brief moment.

So as far as you're concerned, Thor defeated Doctor Strange then?

ODG
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Not evidence of anything, Voodoo was jumping from host to host often whether they were out or not. Of course he was only momentarily staggered or whatever, what else do you think happened? Thor was standing over Strange on the next page without a scratch. That entire sequence of Captain Marvel couldn't have lasted for more then a brief moment.

That was one hell of a temporary defeat. And I believe it's the same silly reasoning that follows every time a character is knocked off panel, they are automatically knocked out. Voodoo was only jumping around when he was getting the Avengers to hurt each other to goad Strange into fighting him. He had accepted Dr. Strange's duel to the death and was only focusing on him at the time. He actually won until Vision and Cage interfered and bought him the time to find that exorcism spell. I think what happened was Thor and Thing were laid low by Dr. Strange. And by the time Captain Marvel finally laid Dr. Strange out, Thor and Thing were up and at em again.

If that's all I relied on, you'd have a point. But between the look on Thor's face and the systematic dismantling of each Avenger, Strange took out Thor and forced Brother Voodoo to switch out. If I had to look at that obvious sequence of events and argue that out of all the people Strange took out before he lost to Captain Marvel -- Rulk, Spider-Man, Thing, Cap, Thor -- that Thor was the only one who didn't get laid low, I'd call that an awfully convenient conclusion.

Rage.Of.Olympus
Originally posted by ODG
Voodoo was only jumping around when he was getting the Avengers to hurt each other to goad Strange into fighting him. He had accepted Dr. Strange's duel to the death and was only focusing on him at the time. He actually won until Vision and Cage interfered and bought him the time to find that exorcism spell. I think what happened was Thor and Thing were laid low by Dr. Strange. And by the time Captain Marvel finally laid Dr. Strange out, Thor and Thing were up and at em again.

If that's all I relied on, you'd have a point. But between the look on Thor's face and the systematic dismantling of each Avenger, Strange took out Thor and forced Brother Voodoo to switch out. If I had to look at that obvious sequence of events and argue that out of all the people Strange took out before he lost to Captain Marvel -- Rulk, Spider-Man, Thing, Cap, Thor -- that Thor was the only one who didn't get laid low, I'd call that an awfully convenient conclusion.

Or when he was talking through them and so on. Hell, on the next page where Thor is standing over Strange, Voodoo jumps from Thor to Vision to Red Hulk in between sentences. Body swapping was something he did constantly. So iyo, how long did the sequence with Captain Marvel last? I'm trying to find an estimate as to how long you think Thor was defeated. The entire sequence without dialogue would indicate it's nonstop action, going on for only a few seconds tops but that's my take.

And you'd have a point if we saw Thor struggling like Daredevil etc. instead of being fine on the next page. Like I said, if you want to argue Thor was defeated, go ahead. I think it's stupid, I laughed at Abhil arguing Thing knocked out Thor or that Vision took out Thor, and this isn't any better. Personally, it's the equivalent of momentarily blasting him off his feet but that's my interpretation. So Thor defeated Strange as well then I take it?

ODG
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Or when he was talking through them and so on. Hell, on the next page where Thor is standing over Strange, Voodoo jumps from Thor to Vision to Red Hulk in between sentences. Body swapping was something he did constantly. So iyo, how long did the sequence with Captain Marvel last? I'm trying to find an estimate as to how long you think Thor was defeated. The entire sequence without dialogue would indicate it's nonstop action, going on for only a few seconds tops but that's my take.

And you'd have a point if we saw Thor struggling like Daredevil etc. instead of being fine on the next page. Like I said, if you want to argue Thor was defeated, go ahead. I think it's stupid, I laughed at Abhil arguing Thing knocked out Thor or that Vision took out Thor, and this isn't any better. Personally, it's the equivalent of momentarily blasting him off his feet but that's my interpretation. So Thor defeated Strange as well then I take it? It lasted long enough for Thor to regain his bearings.

Daredevil wasn't even part of the fight. Rulk and Thing weren't "struggling" either afterwards. But they were defeated as well, as was Cap and Spider-Man. Somehow, just not Thor. Even though it was Captain Marvel that finally took him down. Convenient. Originally posted by ODG
But I can admit that a mind-controlled Thor can be defeated by a weaker Dr. Strange who was finally bringing his A-game. He was dismantling the Avengers one-by-one. That stopped by the time Captain Marvel finally managed a good shot in. In no small part, I'm sure, due to the exhaustion and efforts required to take on Thor.

It that offends you, it shouldn't.

Sundipped
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
What are you talking about? Those two scans are consecutive.

You're right. I was on mobile and thought it was the second scene that showed Doc down. I got it confused with this scan which happened like 7 pages later after that shot from Marvel.

http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16334651_e8vcxy.jpg

Rage.Of.Olympus
Originally posted by Sundipped
You're right. I was on mobile and thought it was the second scene that showed Doc down. I got it confused with this scan which happened like 7 pages later after that shot from Marvel.

http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16334651_e8vcxy.jpg

Lol what? That scan is right after Carol hits Strange. These scans are in order:
http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16334663_14-HD.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16334664_15-HD.jpg http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16334665_16-HD.jpg

Rage.Of.Olympus
Originally posted by ODG
It lasted long enough for Thor to regain his bearings.

Daredevil wasn't even part of the fight. Rulk and Thing weren't "struggling" either afterwards. But they were defeated as well, as was Cap and Spider-Man. Somehow, just not Thor. Even though it was Captain Marvel that finally took him down. Convenient.

And how long was that? You said Thor was defeated. This implies a definitive conclusion to a fight. Yet we see Thor completely fine after a page of brief action that couldn't have lasted for more then a brief moment. That is imho utterly ridiculous. Character's have been knocked off panel for far longer and were just fine in the past. Hell, in this issue Thor was gone for longer when Vision tossed him by his cape. And I hope you aren't using it as reasoning that Strange beats Thor in this thread as that would be silly.

And I meant Captain America. Sorry.

Sundipped
^
I said I got the second scan you posted up top confused with that last scan you just posted...get it? Calm down.

ODG
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
And how long was that? You said Thor was defeated. This implies a definitive conclusion to a fight. Yet we see Thor completely fine after a page of brief action that couldn't have lasted for more then a brief moment. Ultimately, I think using it as reasoning that Strange beats Thor in this thread is asinine and you might as well argue Thor defeats Strange because of that lightning bolt.

And I meant Captain America. We get it. Dr. Strange defeated Rulk, Spider-Man, Thing, Cap, Thor one-by-one forcing Voodoo to keep switching out. Because Thor had recovered by the time Captain Marvel took him down. As did Thing. As did Rulk. Wait... what?

Branlor Swift
Originally posted by Sundipped
You're not giving great odds ok cool, that's really all I wanted to hear.
Nice twist you put on those occurences. Magic instances>>>>>>>>...infinite >'s >storm instances.

It's just something that can and probably will happen. As we've seen, it bugs Strange. Just a funny little tidbit is all

I'd wager Thor's summoned storms on par with at the very least half of Strange's appearances in comics.

Either way, the point is the same. Both use them a lot. Acting like Thor summoning a storm is out of character doesn't make any sense.



Originally posted by Sundipped
Ok that was a joke of yours. Just came off as too arrogant for me initially.
Classic Thor won't beat Marvel Premier black magic Strange. You know the one who couldn't even come to the 616 plane without indirectly destroying it after fighting Shuma. That's the best one to pick and has the greatest chances of emerging victorious. Yes, I firmly believe that God couldn't make Strange more powerful than Thor. He couldn't though, seriously.

Are you talking about Strange Tales v2 15 (14 was where the fight happened)?

The one where Strange straight up had infinite power going into the fight (though admittedly he took it from his Shuma's dudes which was a tremendous feat)?
And he was going to destroy galaxies, not the plane, because he absorbed a shit ton of energy from Shuma as well and Strange couldn't control it. And he went crazy from it to a point where he didn't even know he was Strange and it took multiple issues for him to regain his Dr Strange persona?

That is about as much normal Strange's level as Rune King Thor is normal Thor.

Marvel Premiere was where Shuma was siphoning off of Ancient One to a point of death inside his mind, and Strange destroyed a defenseless weakened Ancient One's ego thus 'killing' both.

Is this the type of feats I should be using for Thor? The ones where he is so crazily amped it's not even funny?




Originally posted by Sundipped
Didn't ring true or you just chose to not accept them. Those "excuses" were stated on panel and many of them were even in the actual scans you posted. Go head lowball away all you want and go digging. It won't take away from the good showings. All of the context was in the scans I posted, and there was only a couple where the excuses made any conceivable sense as to why his shield could be construed as weaker.
Which was about 2 out of many... many.

I don't need to lowball, or average out his shield (since it's so numerous), since I find it unlikely that people believe Strange's shield is unbreakable anymore, let alone for someone on the level of Thor.

Question though. If cases of his shield breaking matched up with instances of his shield holding, how would you view that?



Originally posted by Sundipped
Strange wasn't that far away. Only a few feet.

http://s4d2.turboimagehost.com/t/16334553_NewAvengers-Zone-004-2.jpg

The lightining had to be meant to affect only Strange but at the same time free the team because like you said, people like Daredevil and Black Widow were unharmed.

Of course, you would say it was weak huh? laughing out loudNonetheless , the lightining and a full blast from Ms.Marvel was still shielded. Overall a good showing from Strange.

He also froze Thing in place where he couldn't do anything for a few pages. And don't forget that this was a non SS non prep Strange that took on this team for about 8 pages or so. It was a lightning bolt that hit Thor directly, when Strange was 'behind' the Crimson Bands about 12 feet away.
It hit Strange less than it hit Daredevil.

Or the lightning was just meant to free Thor since it came quite a ways from Strange...
Are you really arguing that it was meant to bypass everyone else when Drumm straight up claimed he didn't care if any of them died? Let alone the notion of that in the first place.

Of course it was weak. Ms Marvel hit him while he was actively shielding from her attacks, ie broke through. And Thor's previous attack shattered the bands of Cytorrak from a focused magician with a lightning attack.

Yes, good feat for Strange. Irrelevant to Thor.


Originally posted by Sundipped
There is no evidence of a shield being projected in those first few scans. Only an aura which Strange has had plenty of times. Looked to me like the hellfire hit him straight up. And once again Strange being down doesn't mean he's out of it. Like how he got up and handled Rulk in New Avengers after the lightining blast from Thor.

GR's immortality and Doc's guilt is what guaranteed the victory but it's really moot because Thor has no Pennance Stare. I sure hope GR got more powerful. The way ol frail body Steven <-----as you would describe him, tanked it, he had nowhere to go but up.
There's literally an aura surrounding him like a bubble in the third scan I posted. There's a lot of that in that comic for that matter, but it's again, not needed. Hellfire is not a Thor level attack.

He wasn't lying flat on his back in the Thor scenario though asking for a "time out".

But Thor has more powerful attacks so there's that.

The funny thing about the instances you're bringing up though aren't exactly helping the notion of him having an auto shield all the time though. Or even using a shield half the time... but I digress.
It also doesn't help when you bring up feats from fights where he loses, but again, digress.



Originally posted by Sundipped
The purpose of his shields are to protect against whatever foe he's facing. Doesn't matter if it's enchanted lighting or Flames of the Faltine, power cosmic, it makes no difference.

You don't have to inform me that you think his shields are questionable, I get reminded by you on the regular. wink

Not sure who'll win in a blastoff but the channelling the Vishanti which he's done for his most powerfull blasts should keep him in the game. I suppose the GB can match it but a contest like that would leave both in a weakened state.

If someone wants place him in a slightly higher tier let them subjectively be satisfied. Won't get a argument from me tho. cool I realize. I'm not saying different attacks will go through his shield based on the nature though.
Strange can block anything (except gas apparently), it's just the level of the attacks. Which Thor specializes in.

Just want to keep you in the know.

I should hope the Godblast can't only match him.

I wouldn't expect you to correct them... not sure if that's good or bad though.
Anyway, I can't sway you from the split I admit. But I can sure as hell definitively prove Thor is not a tier below Strange is basically what my real gripe is.


Originally posted by Sundipped
Atum labeled it as "bothersome". The threat significance of it wasn't that great. Not to mention the energies were "of the same essence as the sun". No biggie, whether it was lightining or solar based it can be blocked.

So what it was a calm day? The bolt was mystical. It was a 2 part spell.

Still hanging your hat on that storm huh? I understand though...against Strange you'll need to take advantage of any exploitation available. And he's far above the likes of Mephisto so there's that. Plus he sleeps inside the sun. And he was still taken back by Thor's lightning.
It just shows that Thor's lightning > the sun.
And Strange's shields can be broken. Especially when Thor's lightning can destroy secondary adamantium, as can his hammer throws...

Or it just attracted it from the sky with no mystical properties. Although I can't fathom why it being magical has to do with anything.

Any exploitation available? lol. Thor could literally ram forward and smash the shit out of Strange. I'm just giving Strange the benefit of the doubt.


Originally posted by Sundipped
Except that GR was lying flat on his back dealing with Strange and had to use his chains on a then feeling guilty Steve.

No, you can't put much thought into it considering Thor won't be controlling what's he's not even expecting. That small orb what GR thought was insignificant distracted him and allowed the strike to hit him. Thor can endure some punishment but it will connect and have an affect. OK cool. Thor is far more durable than Ghost Rider, who beat Strange.
Ghost Rider was torn apart by way lesser than a lightning bolt in that series.

So lightning changes the odds in Strange's favor?
You realize... you really realize that you just literally brought up a scene where Thor struck himself with a lightning bolt with enough force to break the Crimson Bands and was none the worse for wear from it... don't you?

But a bolt used against a standing still Ghost Rider that damaged him will have some sort of significant effect on Thor?

Are you following this train of thought logically?

Not to mention Strange left himself wide open for an attack while doing this. So you better hope Thor stops dead in his tracks.

Rage.Of.Olympus
Originally posted by ODG
We get it. Dr. Strange defeated Rulk, Spider-Man, Thing, Cap, Thor one-by-one forcing Voodoo to keep switching out. Because Thor had recovered by the time Captain Marvel took him down. As did Thing. As did Rulk. Wait... what?

So because Strange took down other Avengers, that in itself is prove and evidence that he had to have defeated Thor? You also seem to be ignoring how ridiculous your statement is in light of the fact that Thor is fine after a page.

Thor could have been out of the book for five pages, that still doesn't in itself mean he was defeated. Characters get knocked off panel all the time in comics, particularly heavy hitters in team fights.

Did Vision defeat Thor iyo as well? After all, he did toss him by his cape off panel for longer then Strange did.

Rage.Of.Olympus
Originally posted by Sundipped
^
I said I got the second scan you posted up top confused with that last scan you just posted...get it? Calm down.

I am calm. erm

I thought you meant the scene with Thor over Strange takes place seven pages after Carol hits Strange.

Branlor Swift
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Post scans if you can. I've learned to be weary of feats from Strange without analyzing context.

And Thor has dealt with energy on such a scale before as well.
Are you talking about Strange Tales v2 15 (14 was where the fight happened)?

The one where Strange straight up had infinite power going into the fight (though admittedly he took it from his Shuma's dudes which was a tremendous feat)?
And he was going to destroy galaxies, not the plane, because he absorbed a shit ton of energy from Shuma as well and Strange couldn't control it. And he went crazy from it to a point where he didn't even know he was Strange and it took multiple issues for him to regain his Dr Strange persona?

That is about as much normal Strange's level as Rune King Thor is normal Thor.

Marvel Premiere was where Shuma was siphoning off of Ancient One to a point of death inside his mind, and Strange destroyed a defenseless weakened Ancient One's ego thus 'killing' both.

If that's the fight he's talking about

ODG
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
So because Strange took down other Avengers, that in itself is prove and evidence that he had to have defeated Thor? You also seem to be ignoring how ridiculous your statement is in light of the fact that Thor is fine after a page.

Thor could have been out of the book for five pages, that still doesn't in itself mean he was defeated. Characters get knocked off panel all the time in comics, particularly heavy hitters in team fights.

Did Vision defeat Thor iyo as well? After all, he did toss him by his cape off panel for longer then Strange did. When the repeating pattern is that phucking obvious, yes. Rulk and Thing were fine too after being allowed to recover. So were Captain America and Spider-Man after being allowed more time to recover. Dr. Strange takes on Avenger after Avenger subduing and defeating each one up until the point of exhaustion and a Captain Marvel punch... and somehow, Thor just happened to be knocked to the side out of all those Avengers. Again, convenient.

Had Thor not been just another bowling pin, amongst page-after-page of Dr. Strange single-handedly battling Avengers and taking them down one-by-one, you'd have a point.

If we switched Thor and Dr. Strange's positions, with a weakened Thor taking on mindcontrolled Avenger after Avenger and beating them one-by-one until he couldn't, we wouldn't even be having this conversation. So save the obtuse strawmans for another argument.

Rage.Of.Olympus
Originally posted by ODG
When the repeating pattern is that phucking obvious, yes. Rulk and Thing were fine too after being allowed to recover. So were Captain America and Spider-Man after being allowed more time to recover.

Had Thor not been just another bowling pin, amongst page-after-page of Dr. Strange single-handedly battling Avengers and taking them down one-by-one, you'd have a point.

If we switched Thor and Dr. Strange's positions, with a weakened Thor taking on mindcontrolled Avenger after Avenger and beating them one-by-one until he couldn't, we wouldn't even be having this conversation. So save the obtuse strawmans for another argument.

You're entire argument is based on a very subjective interpretation of the comic and mostly on the telepathic ability to read the writer's mind and what he was intending.

Simply put, Thor was 'taken out' for a brief page and didn't have a scratch on him. No matter how you try and approach this, the evidence won't change.

And I'm sure if I did so, people would call me out on being an idiot for arguing a one page, inconclusive and unclear pink glow is evidence of a defeat. And also sufficient evidence to base a conclusion in a thread despite more definitive contrary evidence.

ODG
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
You're entire argument is based on a very subjective interpretation of the comic and mostly on the telepathic ability to read the writer's mind and what he was intending.

Simply put, Thor was 'taken out' for a brief page and didn't have a scratch on him. No matter how you try and approach this, the evidence won't change.

And I'm sure if I did so, people would call me out on being an idiot for arguing a one page, inconclusive and unclear pink glow is evidence of a defeat. And also sufficient evidence to base a conclusion in a thread despite more definitive contrary evidence. I can detect simple repeating patterns. This isn't just page-after-page of Dr. Strange beating down Avengers. It's splash page after splash page, with rotating artists for extra oomph. Added to that, it was the final issue of Bendis' near-decade long run with the Avengers culminating in Dr. Strange's triumphant return to the mantle of Sorcerer Supreme. So, no, I don't think it's subjective to believe that a mind-controlled Thor ends up being a victim of A-game Dr. Strange. When he was one of many.

Dr. Strange knocked him down like a bowling pin, amongst a bunch of other Avengers. Get over it.

Don't bother trying to sell any other outcome. We both know if the positions were reversed, there isn't a doubt in your mind.

Rage.Of.Olympus
Originally posted by ODG
I can detect simple repeating patterns. This isn't just page-after-page of Dr. Strange beating down Avengers. It's splash page after splash page, with rotating artists for extra oomph. Added to that, it was the final issue of Bendis' near-decade long run with the Avengers culminating in Dr. Strange's triumphant return to the mantle of Sorcerer Supreme. So, no, I don't think it's subjective to believe that a mind-controlled Thor ends up being a victim of A-game Dr. Strange. When he was one of many.

Dr. Strange knocked him down like a bowling pin, amongst a bunch of other Avengers. Get over it.

Don't bother trying to sell any other outcome. We both know if the positions were reversed, there isn't a doubt in your mind.

So far you've just been repeating the same thing over and over again without even bothering to counter any point I've made. So I'm done.

Doctor Strange defeated Thor. Despite the fact that Thor was fine and unharmed on the next page. You can't even tell me what happened and it was extremely inconclusive. thumb up

I'm certain you believe Aquaman one shot knocked out Superman a while back as well.

Again with the telepathy. First you want to ignore evidence in favor of what you think Bendis was thinking and now you want to sell me on what my argument would be.

ODG
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
So far you've just been repeating the same thing over and over again without even bothering to counter any point I've made. So I'm done.

Doctor Strange defeated Thor. Despite the fact that Thor was fine and unharmed on the next page. You can't even tell me what happened and it was extremely inconclusive. thumb up I've pretty much responded to every single thing you've said. Line for line. All of it. But again, Bendis' farewell and tying up huge loose plot threads like Strange's depowering, couldn't possibly be a scenario ripe for a certain mindcontrolled Avenger to be taken out. Not like Avengers were being beaten left and right... except, yknow, they were...

It wasn't the next page. At that point, Thor was out of the fight having just been defeated. And, yes, Strange took out Thor just like he took out every other Avenger in five consecutive splash pages of rotating artists where Avengers were being defeated one-by-one. And then those Avengers recovered when Voodoo beat Strange. Some of those Avengers, at the same time Thor recovered. Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I'm certain you believe Aquaman one shot knocked out Superman a while back as well.

Again with the telepathy. First you want to ignore evidence in favor of what you think Bendis was thinking and now you want to sell me on what my argument would be. I'm certain this strawman is about as wasted as the last one.

I'm sure if I looked hard enough, there's some random comic where Thor dismantles a group one-by-one -- maybe the Infinity Watch, or a bunch of named Asgardians, or maybe even the Godpack -- where Thor systematically takes out all of em, and the battle abruptly ends with some of the combatants looking unharmed after only two pages, and it'd be like Thor didn't defeat any of them whatsoever, especially the second-to-last one. But that would be wasted effort over the obscenely obvious: if the positions were reversed, there wouldn't even be a conversation.

LordofBrooklyn
Dr. Strange removes Thor and forces the 2 of them to move at FTL speed. Thor then becomes disoriented and is manhandled by Strange!

Canon!

Rage.Of.Olympus
Originally posted by LordofBrooklyn
Dr. Strange removes Thor and forces the 2 of them to move at FTL speed. Thor then becomes disoriented and is manhandled by Strange!

Canon!

That's what you want to do, start lowballing? That's really the smartest move in a Strange thread iyo?

Not to mention that it wasn't even anywhere near a bad showing and Sentry has easily broken free of Strange's magic and one shotted him IIRC. no expression

Rage.Of.Olympus
Originally posted by ODG
I've pretty much responded to every single thing you've said. Line for line. All of it. But again, Bendis' farewell and tying up huge loose plot threads like Strange's depowering, couldn't possibly be a scenario ripe for a certain mindcontrolled Avenger to be taken out. Not like Avengers were being beaten left and right... except, yknow, they were...

It wasn't the next page. At that point, Thor was out of the fight having just been defeated. And, yes, Strange took out Thor just like he took out every other Avenger in five consecutive splash pages of rotating artists where Avengers were being defeated one-by-one. And then those Avengers recovered when Voodoo beat Strange. Some of those Avengers, at the same time Thor recovered. I'm certain this strawman is about as wasted as the last one.

I'm sure if I looked hard enough, there's some random comic where Thor dismantles a group one-by-one -- maybe the Infinity Watch, or a bunch of named Asgardians, or maybe even the Godpack -- where Thor systematically takes out all of em, and the battle abruptly ends with some of the combatants looking unharmed after only two pages, and it'd be like Thor didn't defeat any of them whatsoever, especially the second-to-last one. But that would be wasted effort over the obscenely obvious: if the positions were reversed, there wouldn't even be a conversation.

So Strange took out and defeated Thor for a total of one page which lasted for about a few seconds or so. Just like Thor showed his total and definitive superiority when he effortlessly and completely defeated Strange with a lightning bolt:
http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/16334555_06.jpg http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/16334556_08.jpg

Glad that we could come to this silly and ridiculous understanding. thumb up

And oh, look at that. Voodoo switched from Thor to Rulk to attack Strange. Clearly definitive evidence that Thor must have somehow been taken out by Strange. Because a constantly body jumping ghost, body jumping, is evidence of incapacitation.

Look all you want, someone being knocked off panel for a page being called a defeat is going to be stupid no matter who does it. You want to prove an incapacitation, you need evidence. Like them lying face down instead of standing unharmed after a moment.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
So Strange took out and defeated Thor for a total of one page which lasted for about a few seconds or so. Just like Thor showed his total and definitive superiority when he effortlessly and completely defeated Strange with a lightning bolt:
http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/16334555_06.jpg http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/16334556_08.jpg

Glad that we could come to this silly and ridiculous understanding. thumb up

And oh, look at that. Voodoo switched from Thor to Rulk to attack Strange. Clearly definitive evidence that Thor must have somehow been taken out by Strange. Because a constantly body jumping ghost, body jumping, is evidence of incapacitation.

Look all you want, someone being knocked off panel for a page being called a defeat is going to be stupid no matter who does it. You want to prove an incapacitation, you need evidence. Like them lying face down instead of standing unharmed after a moment. Spot on.

LordofBrooklyn
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
That's what you want to do, start lowballing? That's really the smartest move in a Strange thread iyo?

Not to mention that it wasn't even anywhere near a bad showing and Sentry has easily broken free of Strange's magic and one shotted him IIRC. no expression

You've stated that it wasn't a "Bad showing" then by definition it can't be lowballing.

Sentry, the beast of the cosmos, and Thor destroyer, is not relevant here.

P.S. Kill the Odinson, Sentry. Kill him! cool

Sundipped
Ok last post from me on this subject and if you want to respond you can have the last word but I don't see why you would afford ODG that luxury so easily. erm

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
It's just something that can and probably will happen. As we've seen, it bugs Strange. Just a funny little tidbit is all

I'd wager Thor's summoned storms on par with at the very least half of Strange's appearances in comics.

Either way, the point is the same. Both use them a lot. Acting like Thor summoning a storm is out of character doesn't make any sense.

Good luck basing victory for Thor on a storm. The odds drop even less depending on if the lightining is mystical or electrical. As we saw it HAD to be electrical to cause a hinderance. All this considering if this weakness is even commonplace to begin with.

LOL! That wager would be wrong. Strange has been around since the 60's and you're going to stack Thor's storm production up against EVERY SINGLE Dr. Strange apperance? Extra LOL!

Of course it's not out of character and if you want to give him wins due to an BS plot induced enchantment restriction that was never again seen (to my knowledge), and that was never shown to disturb other effects besides enchantments like invoking entities then that's your perrogative. Guess that lightining in New Avengers wasn't electrical huh?

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
Yes, I firmly believe that God couldn't make Strange more powerful than Thor. He couldn't though, seriously.

Are you talking about Strange Tales v2 15 (14 was where the fight happened)?

The one where Strange straight up had infinite power going into the fight (though admittedly he took it from his Shuma's dudes which was a tremendous feat)?
And he was going to destroy galaxies, not the plane, because he absorbed a shit ton of energy from Shuma as well and Strange couldn't control it. And he went crazy from it to a point where he didn't even know he was Strange and it took multiple issues for him to regain his Dr Strange persona?

That is about as much normal Strange's level as Rune King Thor is normal Thor.

Marvel Premiere was where Shuma was siphoning off of Ancient One to a point of death inside his mind, and Strange destroyed a defenseless weakened Ancient One's ego thus 'killing' both.

Is this the type of feats I should be using for Thor? The ones where he is so crazily amped it's not even funny?

Now you're flip floping back and forth from joke to now "firmly believing"? LOL#3 laughing out loud

Aside from me getting the arcs mixed up, yeah were using Strange Tales Strange that was written by Gillis. Thanks for pointing that out. The Strange that had his all his talismans and scrolls taken by Agamotto which forced him to resort to black magic. The Strange that went around absorbing mystical powers left and right UNDER HIS OWN POWER which makes this applicable dispite your rant about a comparison being made to Rune King Thor who has that title directly applied to his name for that arc. Strange's black magic practices have STAYED with him since he learned them although he chooses not to use them. That comes with his STANDARD personna. He even used it just recently in New Avengers when he destroyed Drum's astral form/spirit essence.

Don't get upset because this Strange is capable of absorbing mystical energy on a scale that he could challenge and defeat Elder gods and would most likely shitstomp Thor. Forget about the fact that Strange was VOLUNTARILY able to release that galaxy busting energy and what happened afterwards.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
All of the context was in the scans I posted, and there was only a couple where the excuses made any conceivable sense as to why his shield could be construed as weaker.
Which was about 2 out of many... many.

I don't need to lowball, or average out his shield (since it's so numerous), since I find it unlikely that people believe Strange's shield is unbreakable anymore, let alone for someone on the level of Thor.

Question though. If cases of his shield breaking matched up with instances of his shield holding, how would you view that?

LOL#3 laughing out loud
Why are you lying about this, and I'm sure Leo can attest to this because I gave context on all of those except maybe a couple to your credit.

Whenever you just post a scan and say "hey look it got smashed here" like you did without providing the circumstances.....it's lowballing. It surfaces and rears it's ugly head everytime a thread with Strange pops up. Whether you know it or not, it's really a bad look.

Gotta check on the circumstantial context involved. Was he nerfed for the sake of being a team player, depowered, things of that nature. However, for the sake of this thread, it had no problems in a direct confrontation against Thor.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
It was a lightning bolt that hit Thor directly, when Strange was 'behind' the Crimson Bands about 12 feet away.
It hit Strange less than it hit Daredevil.

Or the lightning was just meant to free Thor since it came quite a ways from Strange...
Are you really arguing that it was meant to bypass everyone else when Drumm straight up claimed he didn't care if any of them died? Let alone the notion of that in the first place.

Of course it was weak. Ms Marvel hit him while he was actively shielding from her attacks, ie broke through. And Thor's previous attack shattered the bands of Cytorrak from a focused magician with a lightning attack.

Yes, good feat for Strange. Irrelevant to Thor.

If it hit Strange less than it hit Daredevil then why wasn't Daredevil any worse for wear but Strange was on the ground visibly shook up for a panel?

He didn't care if any of them died but at the same time he knew he still needed the whole team to participate in taking down Strange. He was utilizing everyone by jumping from host to host.

You have no definitive evidence that it was weak. What you want it to be doesn't count and you're only going off conjecture.

I suspect the lightning wouldn't have a hard time shattering the bands considering the bands were trying to restrain the entire team so there's that.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
There's literally an aura surrounding him like a bubble in the third scan I posted. There's a lot of that in that comic for that matter, but it's again, not needed. Hellfire is not a Thor level attack.

He wasn't lying flat on his back in the Thor scenario though asking for a "time out".

But Thor has more powerful attacks so there's that.

The funny thing about the instances you're bringing up though aren't exactly helping the notion of him having an auto shield all the time though. Or even using a shield half the time... but I digress.
It also doesn't help when you bring up feats from fights where he loses, but again, digress.

Still no evidence of a shield tho. Strange has gotten hit by a typical lightning bolt as well as feeling the effects of thor's lightning so yeah...the hell with the Hellfire.

Once again, momentarily down but not out.
Of course but many varibles take place during the course of a fight. It won't be a stomp in eithers favor so there's that.

Who cares about auto shields? He didn't even have the Eye or Amulet on him vs the Avengers and he still endured. Just imagine if he had his gear during that fight. Dwell on that. Also once again, Thor has no Pennance Stare so the feats from that fight can be validily discussed.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
I realize. I'm not saying different attacks will go through his shield based on the nature though.
Strange can block anything (except gas apparently), it's just the level of the attacks. Which Thor specializes in.

Just want to keep you in the know.

I should hope the Godblast can't only match him.

I wouldn't expect you to correct them... not sure if that's good or bad though.
Anyway, I can't sway you from the split I admit. But I can sure as hell definitively prove Thor is not a tier below Strange is basically what my real gripe is.

Yeah I know, Thor has powerful attacks yada yada ya. Becoming repetitive at this point.

How can I forget?

Both can have affect on abstracts so they should be in the same ballpark.

Not my place I feel. Especially when there are others who'll jump at the opportunity. Yeah you can take that up with the actual poster in question.

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
And he's far above the likes of Mephisto so there's that. Plus he sleeps inside the sun. And he was still taken back by Thor's lightning.
It just shows that Thor's lightning > the sun.
And Strange's shields can be broken. Especially when Thor's lightning can destroy secondary adamantium, as can his hammer throws...

Or it just attracted it from the sky with no mystical properties. Although I can't fathom why it being magical has to do with anything.

Any exploitation available? lol. Thor could literally ram forward and smash the shit out of Strange. I'm just giving Strange the benefit of the doubt.

It was of "the same essence as the sun" and didn't cause him much trouble. Moot because we've seen Strange in the presence of Thor's lightning without SS invoked shields.

It was a mystically influenced. A two part spell. But wait... his magic and electricity don't mix right?

Yeah and a blast channeling the Vishanti would smash the shit out of Thor and lay him out like it did Death. I'm just giving Thor the benefit of the doubt. See what I did there?

Cont. next post...

Sundipped
Originally posted by Branlor Swift
OK cool. Thor is far more durable than Ghost Rider, who beat Strange.
Ghost Rider was torn apart by way lesser than a lightning bolt in that series.

So lightning changes the odds in Strange's favor?
You realize... you really realize that you just literally brought up a scene where Thor struck himself with a lightning bolt with enough force to break the Crimson Bands and was none the worse for wear from it... don't you?

But a bolt used against a standing still Ghost Rider that damaged him will have some sort of significant effect on Thor?
Are you following this train of thought logically?

Not to mention Strange left himself wide open for an attack while doing this. So you better hope Thor stops dead in his tracks.

Must of missed where I said Thor can endure some punishment.

WTF are you talking about, of course Thor is not going to hurt himself. And as I said earlier, it shouldn't be a hard task to break the bands trying to hold the whole team.

Sorry by in my opinion that attack won't be no sold if thats what you're implying.

Dude I know you read the comic, Strange was feeling guilty and him being supceptible to attack was a result of not even having his mind on fighting at that present time. You like to ignore context in order to favor your argument. You did that with that Frankensurfer story a couple of times. I'm starting to notice a pattern.

Anyway, I have one word to your upcomming response should there be one: SPLIT

Branlor Swift
Originally posted by Sundipped
Ok last post from me on this subject and if you want to respond you can have the last word but I don't see why you would afford ODG that luxury so easily. erm
Because ODG is known to spew absolute crap when he's been proven wrong. I'd rather not engage in a 30 page argument about why Thor not being shown to be knocked out or even alluded to means that he was actually defeated.


Originally posted by Sundipped
Good luck basing victory for Thor on a storm. The odds drop even less depending on if the lightining is mystical or electrical. As we saw it HAD to be electrical to cause a hinderance. All this considering if this weakness is even commonplace to begin with.

LOL! That wager would be wrong. Strange has been around since the 60's and you're going to stack Thor's storm production up against EVERY SINGLE Dr. Strange apperance? Extra LOL!

Of course it's not out of character and if you want to give him wins due to an BS plot induced enchantment restriction that was never again seen (to my knowledge), and that was never shown to disturb other effects besides enchantments like invoking entities then that's your perrogative. Guess that lightining in New Avengers wasn't electrical huh? Do you think Thor's lightning is not electricity or something?
Not to mention you're making shit up about it anyway. It had to be electrical to have an effect? Really? So Thor's magical lightning would have none? Because all the scan really said is that the storm was attracted to the magic Strange was trying to use.
Which if Thor used his apparently never used storms, it would attack Strange and at the very least serve as a distraction. Based on our two scans. smile

Thor has been around longer. Has appeared in twice as many comics, and his whole thing is basically creating storms. All he has to do is create a storm in a quarter of his appearances, and that's assuming he only creates one in those issues.
It's not far off.
That's if you take what I said literally, and ignore the actual point. Thor creates storms. It's what he does. Dr Strange uses magic, that's what he does. Laughing at one of these guys using these powers is retarded when it's something they're heavily known for.

Again, you fail to understand even the slightest things after I even explain them. I never said that lightning is Dr Strange's weakness. I never said normal lightning is going to go through his shield. I said Dr Strange's magic attracts lightning.
Which it apparently does again judging by yours and my scan.

Simply laughing at things and acting like that covers it isn't going to work. You've failed to bring up anything to counteract it, and when you tried, you only reinforced it.

Is Thor creating a storm going to be a game changer? No, of course not. I never acted like it would be. Is Thor creating a storm going to be a hindrance for Strange? Apparently. That's all, nothing more, nothing less.




Originally posted by Sundipped
Now you're flip floping back and forth from joke to now "firmly believing"? LOL#3 laughing out loud

Aside from me getting the arcs mixed up, yeah were using Strange Tales Strange that was written by Gillis. Thanks for pointing that out. The Strange that had his all his talismans and scrolls taken by Agamotto which forced him to resort to black magic. The Strange that went around absorbing mystical powers left and right UNDER HIS OWN POWER which makes this applicable dispite your rant about a comparison being made to Rune King Thor who has that title directly applied to his name for that arc. Strange's black magic practices have STAYED with him since he learned them although he chooses not to use them. That comes with his STANDARD personna. He even used it just recently in New Avengers when he destroyed Drum's astral form/spirit essence.

Don't get upset because this Strange is capable of absorbing mystical energy on a scale that he could challenge and defeat Elder gods and would most likely shitstomp Thor. Forget about the fact that Strange was VOLUNTARILY able to release that galaxy busting energy and what happened afterwards. God could definitely not write a more powerful Strange. Deal with it.

He was absorbing black magic yes. And he was severely amped even before absorbing the black magic out of Arioch. I believe it stated he was above Ancient One due to all the magic he absorbed before Arioch.
Although it's funny you know this for a fact seeing as you previously thought it happened in a completely other book and restated this a couple times, even though there was a substantial amount of time between the two.

And yes, Strange absorbed 'infinite' power before his fight with Shuma. Great feat, never denied it. However, the power he absorbed was not his in anyway. And he doesn't have access to it in any of these threads. You're arguing about a powered up Strange and acting like he can just become that level in a thread where he has no access to infinite power. I could see if you tried to loop this around to him absorbing Thor's Mjolnir, but you're just talking about it like he can accomplish this power instantly. It's dumb.

As well as you previously showing Strange having problems absorbing a far weaker spell than Mjolnir in the Wrecking Crew (well, you didn't show it, you showed a cropped scan) when Thor has accomplished it far easier. Thor's hammer is neither black magic, nor can his hammer's enchantment simply be absorbed, especially when we have evidence to the contrary of Strange being able to accomplish it.

Yes, Strange was able to absorb enough black magic to put him on a high level. Too bad everything about that arc is completely irrelevant to a fight with Thor.

Like I said, if we're speaking about amps, we might as well throw Rune King Thor in there. Or act like Thor just absorbed a huge blast from Phoenix and is coming into the fight with that in his hammer. It was not their power and it is not relevant in a fight where these other beings are not in the vicinity. Basically, it'd be like Thor absorbing a bunch of sources that powered him up each time and acting like it's all his power that he gained from these beings, but then act like it's within his starting power to absorb the later beings as well.

I don't even get why you'd reach that far in the first place though. Quite a lot of people know the context of that fight, so... last ditch effort or something?

Originally posted by Sundipped
LOL#3 laughing out loud
Why are you lying about this, and I'm sure Leo can attest to this because I gave context on all of those except maybe a couple to your credit.

Whenever you just post a scan and say "hey look it got smashed here" like you did without providing the circumstances.....it's lowballing. It surfaces and rears it's ugly head everytime a thread with Strange pops up. Whether you know it or not, it's really a bad look.

Gotta check on the circumstantial context involved. Was he nerfed for the sake of being a team player, depowered, things of that nature. However, for the sake of this thread, it had no problems in a direct confrontation against Thor. You gave context on scans where context was already in the scans.
That's literally all you did.
And like I said, there was only one where the context made it seem not as bad, but that was already in the scans.
I'm not you, I don't try and mask context (lol at bringing up Strange vs Shuma). You can pretend like you unearthed secret documents all you want but in the end, nothing was hidden. And you also failed to explain why it's actually irrelevant for Strange on all of them as well, so there's that.

But I did provide the circumstances. In fact, you already said I did, so there's that.
In threads where people act like Thanos or Surfer can't get through his shield, scans are needed to the contrary. You call it lowballing, but when I've posted more like 20 times the scans of the opposition, that certainly doesn't look too good.

I need no lectures from you. Like I said, I'd rather not be caught lying, which is why I don't get caught lying. You can bump those threads if you want to see how much I 'hid' if that suits you. Although I bet you won't want to after you find the threads. No sweat off my back though.

Yes, it withstood a IYO-Strong attack from Thor, and then seemingly got smashed by Ms Marvel. Ms Marvel > Thor apparently.
Unless we realize it wasn't actually a strong attack. Although I'm not pretending like Strange can't protect against weak Thor attacks.

Branlor Swift
Originally posted by Sundipped
If it hit Strange less than it hit Daredevil then why wasn't Daredevil any worse for wear but Strange was on the ground visibly shook up for a panel?

He didn't care if any of them died but at the same time he knew he still needed the whole team to participate in taking down Strange. He was utilizing everyone by jumping from host to host.

You have no definitive evidence that it was weak. What you want it to be doesn't count and you're only going off conjecture.

I suspect the lightning wouldn't have a hard time shattering the bands considering the bands were trying to restrain the entire team so there's that. Daredevil wasn't even shown after the blast for one. And Strange was knocked away. That's why he was shaken up.
But, if you still think it was supposed to only do anything to Thor, I direct you to Red Hulk's skin in this scan:
http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/16334556/08.jpg.html

Unless you now think that Thor's attack was only directed at himself, Red Hulk, and Strange.
lol at thinking it was only meant for Strange though. That's some picking and choosing I can only dream of.

He literally stated in the same scan that he doesn't care if they live or die after he fired off the lightning bolt. So, that

Because it was weak. It looked weak. Ms Marvel did better against his shields. And his previous lightning bolt broke the Crimson Bands of Cy.
He protected against a lightning attack, good for him. That doesn't however mean he can protect against any lightning attack from Thor. Especially when we know he can vary the attack.

That doesn't make any sense. The bands were strong enough to contain a team with Thor and Red Hulk on it, so that means that the lightning bolt should have an easier time breaking it? Almost as soon as they were summoned Thor fired off a lightning bolt. If you're implying they weakened the bands, that doesn't leave a lot of time to accomplish so.
Either way, the lightning bolt destroyed a strong version of the crimson bands.
But you're trying to downplay a lightning bolt that accomplished destroying something very durable, and then up playing a lightning bolt that accomplished nothing. Fishy business. Originally posted by Sundipped
Still no evidence of a shield tho. Strange has gotten hit by a typical lightning bolt as well as feeling the effects of thor's lightning so yeah...the hell with the Hellfire.

Once again, momentarily down but not out.
Of course but many varibles take place during the course of a fight. It won't be a stomp in eithers favor so there's that.

Who cares about auto shields? He didn't even have the Eye or Amulet on him vs the Avengers and he still endured. Just imagine if he had his gear during that fight. Dwell on that. Also once again, Thor has no Pennance Stare so the feats from that fight can be validily discussed. Sure thing. Let's cover our eyes and pretend Strange wouldn't use a shield that wasn't stated to be used.
Like I said though, irrelevant. Possible evidence of Strange taking attacks from Ghost Rider unshielded do not in any way help him against Thor.

Typical doesn't mean powerful. And he got hit by the effects due to it knocking him down. He did not however get hit by the bolt.
But yes, the hell with hellfire.

Just like Ghost Rider was momentarily down but not out. Fancy that.

Well, that's your opinion, so you can keep that.

You care about autoshields.Originally posted by Sundipped
So you don't think shields (auto or common) won't be on standby in a one on one matchup? Okedokey.


Just imagine if Thor had his own mind and control of his powers. Or apparently even worse, imagine if Ms Marvel was operating to her peak capacity?

And again, Thor doesn't need a penance stare. But you don't care since your next post has you ignoring his attacks again.
All I'm saying is a fight where Dr Strange has a lot of issues with Ghost Rider and then loses isn't a terribly good fight to use. As evidenced.

Originally posted by Sundipped
Yeah I know, Thor has powerful attacks yada yada ya. Becoming repetitive at this point.

How can I forget?

Both can have affect on abstracts so they should be in the same ballpark.

Not my place I feel. Especially when there are others who'll jump at the opportunity. Yeah you can take that up with the actual poster in question. That's how you get things to stick into thick objects.

Are you talking about Galactus where he only knocked him down to no effect? Thor's accomplished that even without a Godblast. That's about it really...

It's not your place to say anything to people who run absolutely amok with the character you feel deserves a fair shake?
Here's my opinion though, and it's a doozy. You think Strange should be on a higher tier than other heralds, you just can't prove it.

Originally posted by Sundipped
It was of "the same essence as the sun" and didn't cause him much trouble. Moot because we've seen Strange in the presence of Thor's lightning without SS invoked shields.

It was a mystically influenced. A two part spell. But wait... his magic and electricity don't mix right?

Yeah and a blast channeling the Vishanti would smash the shit out of Thor and lay him out like it did Death. I'm just giving Thor the benefit of the doubt. See what I did there?

Cont. next post... See, here's the funny thing that I mentioned earlier. You feel as though because Strange protected himself against Thor's lightning at a weaker form, that he can protected against any lightning produced by Thor. And it doesn't matter what Thor has done apparently.
You really think Thor used the same lightning that smashed secondary adamantium on Strange there? No, not even that, you really think Thor used the same lightning that shattered the crimson bands in the same comic?

You're gleaning an awful lot from no words being said about it.
And it really doesn't matter if they mix. Like I said, I can't fathom why it matters. That was a clue for you to show me why it mattered. You did not show why it's important at all.

Considering Thanos after just gaining the ability to fire energy just blasted a hole through Death's head, and Thor has been able to take shots from a Thanos presumably more powerful... smile
But anyway, glad to know you don't think it's actually a split.


But yes, I see what you did. You threw out a random feat and hoped it would be enough to deter me. I've been backing my opinion up the entire debate on the other hand.

IE, Thor can break his shields and knock him out.

Originally posted by Sundipped
Must of missed where I said Thor can endure some punishment.

WTF are you talking about, of course Thor is not going to hurt himself. And as I said earlier, it shouldn't be a hard task to break the bands trying to hold the whole team.

Sorry by in my opinion that attack won't be no sold if thats what you're implying.

Dude I know you read the comic, Strange was feeling guilty and him being supceptible to attack was a result of not even having his mind on fighting at that present time. You like to ignore context in order to favor your argument. You did that with that Frankensurfer story a couple of times. I'm starting to notice a pattern.

Anyway, I have one word to your upcomming response should there be one: SPLIT I know what you said, but you're acting like it will have some amazing effect.

Thor's hurt himself with lightning before. Like when he killed Durok who was tanking his normal attacks, mind you that was quite the powerful attack without Mjolnir, but still lightning.
But your opinion again is that Thor is completely immune to his own lightning, but Strange's lightning will hurt him?
Either way you turn it's stupid.
But that's retarded, as I explained earlier.

It will be. Assuming it hits considering Thor's control over lightning and his ability to easily draw it into his hammer.

I'm not talking about the after effects. I'm talking about this:
http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=5cahko&s=5
http://i1292.photobucket.com/albums/b571/superior100/633fda28-cd15-4cb6-856b-a561a91afd9b_zps1de06a8a.jpg

Leaving himself completely wide open to be attacked.

But I didn't with the FrankenSurfer story. You can stop lying at any time.
In fact, I went through the entire story almost of the FrankenSurfer story, while you sat there and claiming him getting through his shield of seraphim was pis because he previously failed to get through it, and apparently characters don't try harder in comics. You also tried to claim that FrankenSurfer had "real PC" like it meant anything when we knew for a fact he was weaker. As well as tried to twist me saying that Surfer going way faster than the speed of sound meant he was just going the speed of sound.
You want to actually read the thread and tell me what I lied about?
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=560278&pagenumber=3

And I know there's other threads where I spammed the hell out of threads with like half the scans from the FrankenSurfer story.

Good for you. But since you provided a bevy of ways that Strange splits with Thor and the why of things (you didn't), I guess I'll just stick with Thor smashing Strange

Endless Mike
Strange teleports him to the Dark Dimension and lets Dormammu play with him for a bit.

TheGodKiller
OneDumbG0's interpretation of the scans is correct. Bran and Rage are just haters. 13

celeyhyga17
Thor takes it

Nibedicus
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Thor takes it

In the butt...

uhuh

SamZED
Originally posted by Nibedicus
In the butt...

uhuh Not the kind of art doc practices...

Sundipped
Originally posted by TheGodKiller
OneDumbG0's interpretation of the scans is correct. Bran and Rage are just haters. 13

thumb up
Every time a new character was shown, the previous one had been taken out granted they were up panels/pages later. Strange used a different method for each Avenger he faced.

Doc just ran out of gas (physically) after he shielded Marvel's blast but he was still using Crimson Bands and other spells afterwards on Drumm.

celeyhyga17
Originally posted by Nibedicus
In the butt...

uhuh
Take that kind of shiet to the Apollo and Midnighter threads.. Kthnksbai...

big grin

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