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This isn't about who is more powerful this is about who was more competent and effective as a villain. Let's compare these two villains.

Zant seemed effective as opposed to Ganondorf who seemed like an ignorant, blind to any danger, kind of ignoramus rarely ever seen in a story or game.

Zant was tricked into doing Ganondorf's dirty work.

Thread over?

So, is the battlezone done already?

Yes, but we've only received one vote so far.

Link(HA!) me to it so that I do not have to look for it.

Also Quan is running out of things he likes since now he is comparing just Zelda characters. This is a thread that doesn't belong in the All Versus considering it is just a video game character comparison.

Originally posted by The Scenario
Zant was tricked into doing Ganondorf's dirty work.

Thread over? They both achieved their goals. Dorf makes it clear he will want what Zant also wants. Xpzant actually conquered Hyrule while Dorf blew it again and again.


Thread over.

... wow.

Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
... wow. I am right.

You keep telling yourself that buddy.

Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
You keep telling yourself that buddy. What am I wrong about ?

Pretty much everything. Zant's plan and powers come directly from ganondorf. Your aargument is just like saying the stormtroopers are more effective thsn darth vader or sidious because they killed more jedi.

Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
Pretty much everything. Zant's plan and powers come directly from ganondorf. Your aargument is just like saying the stormtroopers are more effective thsn darth vader or sidious because they killed more jedi. Yes, they did but we see how much more effective he is with the power as opposed to Dorf who is more powerful. This is about competence not overall power. Understand the actual thread topic next time.

What makes zant more competent?

Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
What makes zant more competent? Fact he conquered Hyrule and actually had Link beaten at one point along with Midna. Dorfmwas just bfr'd and rode his coattails.

Took over hyrule by borrowing G powers and following his orders and was later defeated by the master sword. Ganondorf took advantage of a bad situation and became more powerful and took over hyrule with little effort.

Originally posted by quanchi112
This isn't about who is more powerful this is about who was more competent and effective as a villain. Let's compare these two villains. Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
Took over hyrule by borrowing G powers and following his orders and was later defeated by the master sword. Ganondorf took advantage of a bad situation and became more powerful and took over hyrule with little effort. I see you aren't capable of actually understanding the thread topic. Zant took it over and Dorf was beaten again with his reign being so pathetically short it is actually quite funny.

You're right I'm not capable of understanding why the more powerful mastermind is less competent than his weaker yes man. Zant was just following orders and had no power on his own.

Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
You're right I'm not capable of understanding why the more powerful mastermind is less competent than his weaker yes man. Zant was just following orders and had no power on his own. More power does not mean more effective. If you can't grasp simple words like this then I cannot help you. Look up the word effective and start there.

Snd how did zant use his powers more effectively?

Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
Snd how did zant use his powers more effectively? Taking over Hyrule and handing Link and Midna their asses.

Following ganondorf's orders. He did the exact same thing to a stronger midna and link.

Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
Following ganondorf's orders. He did the exact same thing to a stronger midna and link. He was competent unlike Dorf. That is the point not jurisdiction or who was in charge. That isn't the point and your inability to understand a simple thread premise explains a lot about you, scream.

Ok, I'm trying to understand this. Ganondorf is stronger, smarter, has the plan, and everything zant did was because of Ganondorf, and zant is the competent one? Zant wasn't the one who took over hyrule, he was just leading the charge.Why is zant the ccompetent one?

Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
Snd how did zant use his powers more effectively? Accomplishing his tasks.

And ganondorf didn't?

Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
And ganondorf didn't? Was being bfr'd a goal ? Was beating Link a goal ? Pathetic and two battles and he was sent on his way.

His goal was to take over hyrule. Who was sitting in the throne before the final fight? Was it's zant's goak to explode, cause he 'sploded...

Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
His goal was to take over hyrule. Who was sitting in the throne before the final fight? Was it's zant's goak to explode, cause he 'sploded... Zant took over Hyrule. Ganondorf lost both times he showed up raising hell on Hyrule. Zant was the competent one whereas Ganondorf was the ignorant boob.

Actually he only tried to take over hyrule once in TP's timeline and he took over hyrule using shadow beasts and an easily controlled mook named zant. Zant however was unable to take over the twilight without ganondorf's help.

Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
Actually he only tried to take over hyrule once in TP's timeline and he took over hyrule using shadow beasts and an easily controlled mook named zant. Zant however was unable to take over the twilight without ganondorf's help. Zant needed the power but achieved his goals. Ganondorf got beat, found out he had the Triforce of power backing him to get beat again. Then he came back to Hyrule in his possession to blow it.


What a worthless, incompetent villain.

... I don't think yoi know what that word means.

Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
... I don't think yoi know what that word means. Dorf was incompetent but powerful due to the top. That's it in a nutshell.

Dorf wanted to escape the twilight, he escaped the twilight. Dorf wanted to take over hyrule, he took over hyrule. Competent.

Zant wanted to take over the twilight, couldn't do it without ganondorf's help. Incompetent.

I really don't see how you can have so much hate for a franchise?

Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
Dorf wanted to escape the twilight, he escaped the twilight. Dorf wanted to take over hyrule, he took over hyrule. Competent.

Zant wanted to take over the twilight, couldn't do it without ganondorf's help. Incompetent.

I really don't see how you can have so much hate for a franchise? He did through Zant. Zant was the competent one who conquered Hyrule and allowed him to escape. Without Zant Dorf was screwed.

Zant lacked the power the top had. Dorf was basically a plot device who was an idiot and someone easily beatable.

The puppet or the puppeteer?

The pawn or the king?

The lapdog or the master?


Tough call..

Zant was a puppet and he didn't do anything but point the shadow beasts at hyrule castle. Why the sudden interest in zant? Did find that only zrlda characters are strong enough to take out ganondorf?

Another biased poster comes forward. Shocking.

... I thought the laptop was the master?

Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
... I thought the laptop was the master? Zant did what Ganondorf cannot. The top provided the power not Dorf. Plot device as left to his own devices he was shit.

Are you just mad you're losing the battlezone?

Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
Are you just mad you're losing the battlezone? Not at all. I realized the difficulty on my task knowing the minds of the debaters here with regards to feats. I won that debate hands down though. Hands down.

Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
You keep telling yourself that buddy.

Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
Tis true.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Another biased poster comes forward. Shocking.
Riight, I'm biased. Not the guy with the TB set making a dozen TB threads and/or Twilight Princess threads. Right.

My bias for TP makes me say a TP guy wins over a TP guy? /sense

Originally posted by BloodRain
Riight, I'm biased. Not the guy with the TB set making a dozen TB threads and/or Twilight Princess threads. Right.

My bias for TP makes me say a TP guy wins over a TP guy? /sense You are not honest and seem like Zelda fans lapdog.

You guys won this thread for about almost 5 hours. Then you all lost and deemed Quan the winner.

Originally posted by quanchi112
You are not honest and seem like Zelda fans lapdog.
Nice set.

This thread amuses me, and it gives me an excuse to point this out, so here's something to consider: Zant with and without Ganondorf's influence.

First, let's look at how Zant acts before discovering his god.

http://youtu.be/CbApgG2KAYU?t=12m34s

For context, this would be just after Zant was denied the throne. Notice how juvenile his behavior is? He doesn't get what he wants, so he throws a tantrum, runs outside, and beats the ground with his fists while screaming like a maniac. Then, when Ganondorf appears he simply stands in awe.

Next up, chronologically speaking, is this: http://youtu.be/7pNo_AptNPY?t=7m11s

This is almost a complete 180 from his previous personality. Zant is silent, wasting no time or movement as he curses Midna. A curse, lest we forget, that is stated to be from Ganondorf's magic. This is also the first appearance of Zant's helmet, but more on that later.

Now we can finally move on to Hyrule, though it's much earlier in the story.
http://youtu.be/4A9pu8Mrcig?t=4m48s
http://youtu.be/wCg0EwjQNyY

These two scenes are the player's first look at Zant, and naturally he appears competent and intimidating as a villain. One can be forgiven for thinking this is what Zant is really like. However, it is again opposite to Zant's chronologically earlier behavior, before he met Ganondorf. In any case, note for now that Zant is still wearing the helmet, it's semi-important.

For the next bit, I'm actually going back to the first video, if a different part of it: http://youtu.be/CbApgG2KAYU?t=11m

Here, we get our first real look at Zant's face, as he removes the helmet fully. The moment he does so, his behavior changes. He waves his arms aimlessly, twists his body around, and stomps like a petulant child. He's even spinning while he rants and screams like a madman. Then finally, during the boss fight, we see how Zant really is.

I'm sure we're all familiar with the big ball of crazy that is Zant's boss fight by now, so I'll just skip to the end. http://youtu.be/2Cn2DueD_7U?t=7m40s

After a battle of wild flailing and screaming, even after donning the helmet again, Zant is beaten. Now he can only scream, though there's a hesitation to his words. What happened to the Zant from before? Where is the imposing, confident villain from earlier, and why has he been replaced with this flailing, screeching lunatic?

"Already he has descended and been reborn in this world..."

And there it is. The reason behind all of this. Ganondorf has been reborn in a new body, one separate from Zant. Once again, Zant is alone, and the moment Ganondorf's influence is gone he reverts to the way he was before all of this started. An angry manchild throwing a tantrum.

We know Ganondorf can possess people thanks to Puppet Zelda, and we've even seen Ganondorf's god form completely envelop Zant. Is it really a coincidence that the moment Zant comes into contact with Ganondorf, he suddenly becomes competent? Is it just coincidence that as soon as Ganondorf gets a new body Zant regresses into the complete mess he was before? When Zant first meets Link face to face, what does he do? He starts off with a TK blast, of course. What is Puppet Zelda's first action? That would be TK blasting Midna across the room. What did the Zora do to Zant that would make him want to freeze their domain solid? I wonder if it would be the same reason Ganondorf froze them in Ocarina of Time.

It's a pretty interesting comparison, isn't it?

Originally posted by Wei Phoenix
You guys won this thread for about almost 5 hours. Then you all lost and deemed Quan the winner. I always win.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Nice set. Bigger than yours, obviously.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Bigger than yours, obviously.
The bigger to show thy fanboy level?


And have you even given a proper argument on this? So far its just been about why Zant is a good lapdog. Zant states that everything he is is because of Ganondorf who he views as a god, all that he does is under Dorf's thumb.

Why is the puppet more competent than the puppeteer? Why is the pawn more effective than the king? Why is the lapdog the greater evil overthe master?


I mean.. Zant himself would agree that Ganondorf wins this :l

Originally posted by BloodRain
The bigger to show thy fanboy level?


And have you even given a proper argument on this? So far its just been about why Zant is a good lapdog. Zant states that everything he is is because of Ganondorf who he views as a god, all that he does is under Dorf's thumb.

Why is the puppet more competent than the puppeteer? Why is the pawn more effective than the king? Why is the lapdog the greater evil overthe master?


I mean.. Zant himself would agree that Ganondorf wins this :l Zant and Dorf needed each other. Zant conquered Hyrule. Dorf failed and then lost hyrule.


Dorf's Triforce supplied the power but he was unsuccessful compared to Zant. That's even worse since Dorf is far more powerful due to his lucky connection to the Triforce of Power.

Successful in carrying out Dorf's plan with power supplied by Dorf. Saying 'Dorf fail and lost Hyrule' is pointless as Zant also lost.


And yeah Dorf needed Zant as he was still fluxing between realms. He was only in Hyrule for a fraction of the game yet he still pulled all the strings, and your "who seemed like an ignorant, blind to any danger, kind of ignoramus" description is mirroring what the Sages said about the early Dorf, not this one.

He's ignoring my post

I thought it was interesting.

I thought it was, even considering it as canon.

http://www.cannibalisticnerd.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/pat-pat-batman.gif

Originally posted by BloodRain
Successful in carrying out Dorf's plan with power supplied by Dorf. Saying 'Dorf fail and lost Hyrule' is pointless as Zant also lost.


And yeah Dorf needed Zant as he was still fluxing between realms. He was only in Hyrule for a fraction of the game yet he still pulled all the strings, and your "who seemed like an ignorant, blind to any danger, kind of ignoramus" description is mirroring what the Sages said about the early Dorf, not this one. no, the power supplied by the top which he lost by the games end. All he was some lucky guy the triforce favored while being executed for being too stupid to see any threat.

Zant was successful while Dorf was a complete failure. He did not last long despite being more powerful and having the keys of Hyrule handed to him.

He actually got the triforce because he successfully stole it but then that didn't happen...

Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
He actually got the triforce because he successfully stole it but then that didn't happen... Not here. Luckily backed him and he still lost. So incompetent.

But he got it because he stole it after he took over hyrule and ruled for a decade unchallenged before that never happened.

Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
But he got it because he stole it after he took over hyrule and ruled for a decade unchallenged before that never happened. That did not happen to this Dorf. This Dorf knew how to fail and how to fail in record time.

But that's the reason he got it, and he only failed because the other guys cheated.

Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
But that's the reason he got it, and he only failed because the other guys cheated. Not this version. This version got it but lost it badly.


Incompetent villain.

They're the same guy. Why do you choose to ignore continuity?

Originally posted by quanchi112
Not this version. This version got it but lost it badly.


Incompetent villain.
5. Lie.

Ganon receiving the ToP in OoT is why he receives it in TP.

Originally posted by quanchi112
no, the power supplied by the top which he lost by the games end. All he was some lucky guy the triforce favored while being executed for being too stupid to see any threat.

Zant was successful while Dorf was a complete failure. He did not last long despite being more powerful and having the keys of Hyrule handed to him. Did Dorf not lend Zant some of his power? You can call him lucky (lolwut?) or stupid when he was a power-mad mortal, he was still a god to zant and still pulling all of the strings.

Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
They're the same guy. Why do you choose to ignore continuity? Different experiences which means a different guy.

Originally posted by ScreamPaste
5. Lie.

Ganon receiving the ToP in OoT is why he receives it in TP. Not allowed in this thread.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Did Dorf not lend Zant some of his power? You can call him lucky (lolwut?) or stupid when he was a power-mad mortal, he was still a god to zant and still pulling all of the strings. Yes, he gave his power to him. Giving power doesn't have a thing to do with competence.

Originally posted by The Scenario
This thread amuses me, and it gives me an excuse to point this out, so here's something to consider: Zant with and without Ganondorf's influence.

First, let's look at how Zant acts before discovering his god.

http://youtu.be/CbApgG2KAYU?t=12m34s

For context, this would be just after Zant was denied the throne. Notice how juvenile his behavior is? He doesn't get what he wants, so he throws a tantrum, runs outside, and beats the ground with his fists while screaming like a maniac. Then, when Ganondorf appears he simply stands in awe.

Next up, chronologically speaking, is this: http://youtu.be/7pNo_AptNPY?t=7m11s

This is almost a complete 180 from his previous personality. Zant is silent, wasting no time or movement as he curses Midna. A curse, lest we forget, that is stated to be from Ganondorf's magic. This is also the first appearance of Zant's helmet, but more on that later.

Now we can finally move on to Hyrule, though it's much earlier in the story.
http://youtu.be/4A9pu8Mrcig?t=4m48s
http://youtu.be/wCg0EwjQNyY

These two scenes are the player's first look at Zant, and naturally he appears competent and intimidating as a villain. One can be forgiven for thinking this is what Zant is really like. However, it is again opposite to Zant's chronologically earlier behavior, before he met Ganondorf. In any case, note for now that Zant is still wearing the helmet, it's semi-important.

For the next bit, I'm actually going back to the first video, if a different part of it: http://youtu.be/CbApgG2KAYU?t=11m

Here, we get our first real look at Zant's face, as he removes the helmet fully. The moment he does so, his behavior changes. He waves his arms aimlessly, twists his body around, and stomps like a petulant child. He's even spinning while he rants and screams like a madman. Then finally, during the boss fight, we see how Zant really is.

I'm sure we're all familiar with the big ball of crazy that is Zant's boss fight by now, so I'll just skip to the end. http://youtu.be/2Cn2DueD_7U?t=7m40s

After a battle of wild flailing and screaming, even after donning the helmet again, Zant is beaten. Now he can only scream, though there's a hesitation to his words. What happened to the Zant from before? Where is the imposing, confident villain from earlier, and why has he been replaced with this flailing, screeching lunatic?

"Already he has descended and been reborn in this world..."

And there it is. The reason behind all of this. Ganondorf has been reborn in a new body, one separate from Zant. Once again, Zant is alone, and the moment Ganondorf's influence is gone he reverts to the way he was before all of this started. An angry manchild throwing a tantrum.

We know Ganondorf can possess people thanks to Puppet Zelda, and we've even seen Ganondorf's god form completely envelop Zant. Is it really a coincidence that the moment Zant comes into contact with Ganondorf, he suddenly becomes competent? Is it just coincidence that as soon as Ganondorf gets a new body Zant regresses into the complete mess he was before? When Zant first meets Link face to face, what does he do? He starts off with a TK blast, of course. What is Puppet Zelda's first action? That would be TK blasting Midna across the room. What did the Zora do to Zant that would make him want to freeze their domain solid? I wonder if it would be the same reason Ganondorf froze them in Ocarina of Time.

It's a pretty interesting comparison, isn't it?

Originally posted by The Scenario
He didn't have the power to do anything about it. As soon as he got the power he needed he ascended to rule. On the other hand once we see Dorf gain the power he loses immediately afterwards.

^Weak response.
Originally posted by quanchi112
Yes, he gave his power to him. Giving power doesn't have a thing to do with competence. Dorf pulled the strings.

Originally posted by BloodRain
^Weak response.
Dorf pulled the strings. He funded the power whereas Zant showed himself competent. Dorf lost as soon as he showed up.

All the while doing Dorf's bidding.

On a semi-tangent; What would you say if this was Vadar and Palpatine instead?

Allow me to explain how TP princess Ganon intertwines with OoT Ganon. I am an expert on this.

During OoT the timeline was split into three realities.

The reality where adult Link sealed Gannondorf into the sacred Realm for ever and ever before he reemerged in Wind Waker.

The reality where Link went back in time to enjoy his child hood and had his Majora's Mask adventure. He also (according to my sources) warned Hyrule about Ganondorf's impending attack and he was captured and exectuted by the old sages, but the Trifirce of Power reached through two time lines into this one and Ganondorf got the ToP at that point. An then was sent to the Twilight Zone.

The third is an alternate reality where Link never returned to save Hyrule as an adult. And thus the events of the very first Legend of Zelda game take place.

Originally posted by BloodRain
All the while doing Dorf's bidding.

On a semi-tangent; What would you say if this was Vadar and Palpatine instead? Palpatine is far more competent than Vader. It isn't even close.

Zant was competent whereas Dorf only knew failure. He had more power but was incompetent with it once he faced any opposition.

Zant succeeded in taking over Hyrule... against Hyrule's army. Not that much an accomplishment. You'l notice that even under twilight the Gorons were still strong and kept the Shadow Beasts out. Ganon had them locked up and ready to be fed to a dragon in OoT.

Originally posted by Dramatic Gecko
Zant succeeded in taking over Hyrule... against Hyrule's army. Not that much an accomplishment. You'l notice that even under twilight the Gorons were still strong and kept the Shadow Beasts out. Ganon had them locked up and ready to be fed to a dragon in OoT. That isn't relevant to Tp. Dorf failed against the sages and then failed against Link. Zant defeated Link.

Originally posted by quanchi112
He didn't have the power to do anything about it. As soon as he got the power he needed he ascended to rule. On the other hand once we see Dorf gain the power he loses immediately afterwards.

First, let's look at how Zant acts before discovering his god.

http://youtu.be/CbApgG2KAYU?t=12m34s

For context, this would be just after Zant was denied the throne. Notice how juvenile his behavior is? He doesn't get what he wants, so he throws a tantrum, runs outside, and beats the ground with his fists while screaming like a maniac. Then, when Ganondorf appears he simply stands in awe.

Next up, chronologically speaking, is this: http://youtu.be/7pNo_AptNPY?t=7m11s

This is almost a complete 180 from his previous personality. Zant is silent, wasting no time or movement as he curses Midna. A curse, lest we forget, that is stated to be from Ganondorf's magic. This is also the first appearance of Zant's helmet, but more on that later.

Now we can finally move on to Hyrule, though it's much earlier in the story.
http://youtu.be/4A9pu8Mrcig?t=4m48s
http://youtu.be/wCg0EwjQNyY

These two scenes are the player's first look at Zant, and naturally he appears competent and intimidating as a villain. One can be forgiven for thinking this is what Zant is really like. However, it is again opposite to Zant's chronologically earlier behavior, before he met Ganondorf. In any case, note for now that Zant is still wearing the helmet, it's semi-important.

For the next bit, I'm actually going back to the first video, if a different part of it: http://youtu.be/CbApgG2KAYU?t=11m

Here, we get our first real look at Zant's face, as he removes the helmet fully. The moment he does so, his behavior changes. He waves his arms aimlessly, twists his body around, and stomps like a petulant child. He's even spinning while he rants and screams like a madman. Then finally, during the boss fight, we see how Zant really is.

I'm sure we're all familiar with the big ball of crazy that is Zant's boss fight by now, so I'll just skip to the end. http://youtu.be/2Cn2DueD_7U?t=7m40s

After a battle of wild flailing and screaming, even after donning the helmet again, Zant is beaten. Now he can only scream, though there's a hesitation to his words. What happened to the Zant from before? Where is the imposing, confident villain from earlier, and why has he been replaced with this flailing, screeching lunatic?

"Already he has descended and been reborn in this world..."

And there it is. The reason behind all of this. Ganondorf has been reborn in a new body, one separate from Zant. Once again, Zant is alone, and the moment Ganondorf's influence is gone he reverts to the way he was before all of this started. An angry manchild throwing a tantrum.

We know Ganondorf can possess people thanks to Puppet Zelda, and we've even seen Ganondorf's god form completely envelop Zant. Is it really a coincidence that the moment Zant comes into contact with Ganondorf, he suddenly becomes competent? Is it just coincidence that as soon as Ganondorf gets a new body Zant regresses into the complete mess he was before? When Zant first meets Link face to face, what does he do? He starts off with a TK blast, of course. What is Puppet Zelda's first action? That would be TK blasting Midna across the room. What did the Zora do to Zant that would make him want to freeze their domain solid? I wonder if it would be the same reason Ganondorf froze them in Ocarina of Time.

It's a pretty interesting comparison, isn't it?

Originally posted by quanchi112
Palpatine is far more competent than Vader. It isn't even close.

Zant was competent whereas Dorf only knew failure. He had more power but was incompetent with it once he faced any opposition. Refresh memory, how many battles did Palpy take part in in the films?

Because The Dragon uses the Big Bads power and does his bidding as an inferior, and takes part in more action, that makes him more competent? You forget, the only battle Dorf was in was against Link with the MS. And what happened the instant Zant faced Link with the MS? He was slain.

Originally posted by The Scenario
First, let's look at how Zant acts before discovering his god.

http://youtu.be/CbApgG2KAYU?t=12m34s

For context, this would be just after Zant was denied the throne. Notice how juvenile his behavior is? He doesn't get what he wants, so he throws a tantrum, runs outside, and beats the ground with his fists while screaming like a maniac. Then, when Ganondorf appears he simply stands in awe.

Next up, chronologically speaking, is this: http://youtu.be/7pNo_AptNPY?t=7m11s

This is almost a complete 180 from his previous personality. Zant is silent, wasting no time or movement as he curses Midna. A curse, lest we forget, that is stated to be from Ganondorf's magic. This is also the first appearance of Zant's helmet, but more on that later.

Now we can finally move on to Hyrule, though it's much earlier in the story.
http://youtu.be/4A9pu8Mrcig?t=4m48s
http://youtu.be/wCg0EwjQNyY

These two scenes are the player's first look at Zant, and naturally he appears competent and intimidating as a villain. One can be forgiven for thinking this is what Zant is really like. However, it is again opposite to Zant's chronologically earlier behavior, before he met Ganondorf. In any case, note for now that Zant is still wearing the helmet, it's semi-important.

For the next bit, I'm actually going back to the first video, if a different part of it: http://youtu.be/CbApgG2KAYU?t=11m

Here, we get our first real look at Zant's face, as he removes the helmet fully. The moment he does so, his behavior changes. He waves his arms aimlessly, twists his body around, and stomps like a petulant child. He's even spinning while he rants and screams like a madman. Then finally, during the boss fight, we see how Zant really is.

I'm sure we're all familiar with the big ball of crazy that is Zant's boss fight by now, so I'll just skip to the end. http://youtu.be/2Cn2DueD_7U?t=7m40s

After a battle of wild flailing and screaming, even after donning the helmet again, Zant is beaten. Now he can only scream, though there's a hesitation to his words. What happened to the Zant from before? Where is the imposing, confident villain from earlier, and why has he been replaced with this flailing, screeching lunatic?

"Already he has descended and been reborn in this world..."

And there it is. The reason behind all of this. Ganondorf has been reborn in a new body, one separate from Zant. Once again, Zant is alone, and the moment Ganondorf's influence is gone he reverts to the way he was before all of this started. An angry manchild throwing a tantrum.

We know Ganondorf can possess people thanks to Puppet Zelda, and we've even seen Ganondorf's god form completely envelop Zant. Is it really a coincidence that the moment Zant comes into contact with Ganondorf, he suddenly becomes competent? Is it just coincidence that as soon as Ganondorf gets a new body Zant regresses into the complete mess he was before? When Zant first meets Link face to face, what does he do? He starts off with a TK blast, of course. What is Puppet Zelda's first action? That would be TK blasting Midna across the room. What did the Zora do to Zant that would make him want to freeze their domain solid? I wonder if it would be the same reason Ganondorf froze them in Ocarina of Time.

It's a pretty interesting comparison, isn't it?

I never noticed this. You are a very intelligent individual. I think this is the win.

Originally posted by Dramatic Gecko
I never noticed this. You are a very intelligent individual. I think this is the win. Quit cheerleading.

Originally posted by The Scenario
First, let's look at how Zant acts before discovering his god.

http://youtu.be/CbApgG2KAYU?t=12m34s

For context, this would be just after Zant was denied the throne. Notice how juvenile his behavior is? He doesn't get what he wants, so he throws a tantrum, runs outside, and beats the ground with his fists while screaming like a maniac. Then, when Ganondorf appears he simply stands in awe.

Next up, chronologically speaking, is this: http://youtu.be/7pNo_AptNPY?t=7m11s

This is almost a complete 180 from his previous personality. Zant is silent, wasting no time or movement as he curses Midna. A curse, lest we forget, that is stated to be from Ganondorf's magic. This is also the first appearance of Zant's helmet, but more on that later.

Now we can finally move on to Hyrule, though it's much earlier in the story.
http://youtu.be/4A9pu8Mrcig?t=4m48s
http://youtu.be/wCg0EwjQNyY

These two scenes are the player's first look at Zant, and naturally he appears competent and intimidating as a villain. One can be forgiven for thinking this is what Zant is really like. However, it is again opposite to Zant's chronologically earlier behavior, before he met Ganondorf. In any case, note for now that Zant is still wearing the helmet, it's semi-important.

For the next bit, I'm actually going back to the first video, if a different part of it: http://youtu.be/CbApgG2KAYU?t=11m

Here, we get our first real look at Zant's face, as he removes the helmet fully. The moment he does so, his behavior changes. He waves his arms aimlessly, twists his body around, and stomps like a petulant child. He's even spinning while he rants and screams like a madman. Then finally, during the boss fight, we see how Zant really is.

I'm sure we're all familiar with the big ball of crazy that is Zant's boss fight by now, so I'll just skip to the end. http://youtu.be/2Cn2DueD_7U?t=7m40s

After a battle of wild flailing and screaming, even after donning the helmet again, Zant is beaten. Now he can only scream, though there's a hesitation to his words. What happened to the Zant from before? Where is the imposing, confident villain from earlier, and why has he been replaced with this flailing, screeching lunatic?

"Already he has descended and been reborn in this world..."

And there it is. The reason behind all of this. Ganondorf has been reborn in a new body, one separate from Zant. Once again, Zant is alone, and the moment Ganondorf's influence is gone he reverts to the way he was before all of this started. An angry manchild throwing a tantrum.

We know Ganondorf can possess people thanks to Puppet Zelda, and we've even seen Ganondorf's god form completely envelop Zant. Is it really a coincidence that the moment Zant comes into contact with Ganondorf, he suddenly becomes competent? Is it just coincidence that as soon as Ganondorf gets a new body Zant regresses into the complete mess he was before? When Zant first meets Link face to face, what does he do? He starts off with a TK blast, of course. What is Puppet Zelda's first action? That would be TK blasting Midna across the room. What did the Zora do to Zant that would make him want to freeze their domain solid? I wonder if it would be the same reason Ganondorf froze them in Ocarina of Time.

It's a pretty interesting comparison, isn't it? His immaturity has no bearing on his competence as a villain. Zant is highly successful whereas Dorf is full of failure. Maybe Dorf should flail his arms and stomp his feet around since he is such an epic failure on his own in this game.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Refresh memory, how many battles did Palpy take part in in the films?

Because The Dragon uses the Big Bads power and does his bidding as an inferior, and takes part in more action, that makes him more competent? You forget, the only battle Dorf was in was against Link with the MS. And what happened the instant Zant faced Link with the MS? He was slain. battles doesn't determine success alone.

Palpatine was far more competent than Vader who in the end didn't save Padme and gave into Palptines desires in the first place.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Thanks for putting spoilers and I won't read it until I go through oot. I don't want any events of the game spoiled because I will be playing this game.

It does look like Zant abandoned him right at the end so maybe he will make his major play to the ultimate baddie in the sequel if it is a continuation to tp that is.

I for one think he was nowhere even near Ganondorf in coolness but that's just me.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=531409&pagenumber=4#post12736688

Originally posted by The Scenario
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=531409&pagenumber=4#post12736688 ?

Originally posted by quanchi112
?

You used to think Ganondorf was cooler than Zant.

Why the complete 180 in opinion?

Originally posted by The Scenario
You used to think Ganondorf was cooler than Zant.

Why the complete 180 in opinion? He is cooler just more incompetent in this game anyways.

Originally posted by quanchi112
He is cooler just more incompetent in this game anyways.

Then why the constant bashing?

Originally posted by The Scenario
Then why the constant bashing? Objectivity.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Objectivity.

Objectively, Ganondorf is Zant's superior. His boss. Why do you hate Ganondorf, though?

Originally posted by The Scenario
Objectively, Ganondorf is Zant's superior. His boss. Why do you hate Ganondorf, though? Yes, he is his incompetent boss. Many bosses are incompetent and rely on their underlings to achieve success.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Yes, he is his incompetent boss. Many bosses are incompetent and rely on their underlings to achieve success.

But Ganondorf accomplished more than Zant.

Why do you hate Ganondorf?

Originally posted by The Scenario
But Ganondorf accomplished more than Zant.

Why do you hate Ganondorf? Wrong. Zant actually conquered Hyrule whereas Dorf was soundly defeated very quickly when he showed his ugly face.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Wrong. Zant actually conquered Hyrule whereas Dorf was soundly defeated very quickly when he showed his ugly face.

But Ganondorf conquered Hyrule, though.