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Taking a gander at this due in no small part to the circle jerk Beefy and Q are forming around Krayt.

Issue 001

In Insider 89, Jan Duursema says she and John Ostrander did not want to at all lessen Luke's accomplishments of destroying the Sith, defeating the Empire, and reviving the Jedi.

In order to preserve this legacy, their tactic was to write a story all about the Sith restored, the Empire ascendant, and the Jedi scattered.

http://31.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m8crcsEiGg1rdns3wo1_500.gif


My thoughts:

Krayt shits the mother of all infobricks on the audience, bypassing the major freakin' events that directly influence and precede the story; show, don't tell
Will give Nihl points for wanting to transcend the mistakes of the previous purge
The impact and implication of Sazen's resurrection/resuscitation are breezed over far too quickly
Cade intrigues me; he's like a young Han Solo with Force powers and a Skywalker last name
Kol's trying too hard to be Ganner Rhysode
Krayt's coup was way too easy; clever and opportunistic, but this is not the product of a mastermind
He's apparently overexerted by taking out Faux!Fel's bodyguards and his weakness is emphasized far too early, along with his overarching scheme for Cade


First impression:

The story loses major points for originality and its close proximity to the movies. Trying to determine which of the two major non-movie EU storylines (TOR and Legacy) is more offensive and degrading is going to be a source of heated internal debate.

Nihl and Cade are currently holding my interest. Otherwise, this issue was far too rushed, with a string of major events occurring too soon or only being relayed to the audience by way of exposition.

Score:

2/10

I need to remember that gif. It seems mighty convenient.

Krayt dies, the good guys win.

Issue 002

My thoughts:

Why didn't Sazen contact Shado and the others via hologram? Why meet in person? How did the Sith locate them? How did the Jedi not sense their approach?
Cade reminds me a bit of Mal Reynolds, which is pleasing. Though his opening liner: "We're bounty hunters. We're after a bounty" was pretty damn bad
Cade clearly acted to save Hosk's life, which makes me curious if he's going to let him escape en route to the Sith. Otherwise, it's an inordinately dick move that Cade really has no justification for
Hosk sure begged and whined a lot for a devout Jedi
The anointment of Darth Talon was lame; the impact of her execution of Ruyn was blunted by the fact that, again, we are only told the nature of their relationship. I don't expect it to be vividly portrayed, but even a glimpse of it would be better
Wow, a princess who places duty above personal relationships, relaying messages from fellow rebel sympathizers on her father's behalf; at last an original eleiament!


First impression:

Cade is showing some promise as a Malcolm Reynolds figure. The rest maintains its underwhelming momentum.

Score:

2/10

I approve this thread!

I'll make some comments, but not go too much.



Yes, *this* isn't the big masterwork of the sith.



Vital info: He's strong, but sick. The Emperor's personal bodyguard including his cousin is simply fodder to Krayt ('fight our way out, or maybe even kill Krayt!' Heh), but fighting at all has a cost for him.



On originality, I will note there's a fair amount being blended around. Rather than trying to be something entirely new, it tries to be something old remade. Cade as a Han Solo type 'Skywalker,' like you note. On time, hey, it's almost 140 years, by normal standards that's a lot! That's about as distant as we are the US civil war or Germany's unification. Not all history is in 1,000 year chunks ^^

What I want to emphasize here is that it's close enough to be familiar, while definitely not being the same. Legacy is a theme, not just a title. That's the author intent.

Anyway, that said, I look forward to your future reactions!

Q, your attempts to Legacy's tasteless and disrespectful aping of the core saga are noble but disastrous. It speaks to an inordinate lack of talent on part of the writers and a tacit admission that nothing that ever happens here will ever amount to anything in the grand scheme of Star Wars. It's been done before and done better. Beyond Cade, I'm seeing very little to care.

Issue 003

My thoughts:


The opening text compares Krayt to Sidious: "A Sith once more occupies the Imperial throne," but then goes on to say that, "however, after seven years of rule, Krayt's hold on the galaxy is not absolute"
Hosk has defied expectations and is being a real pain in the ass to Cade and co. rather than begging like a b1tch. I am well pleased
Cade not letting Hosk escape was a genuine surprise and a welcome one, though I do hope they properly explain his callousness towards them
If all it took was one mini-speech for Fel to convert the totality of Bastion to his cause, why not go live on the Holonet and persuade the galaxy to throw off Krayt's yoke? Though I do appreciate the attempted save-throw that Fel had been rotating loyalists quietly through the years into Bastion's service
Cade being a drug addict makes him suitably Dark and Edgy (lol) but I do appreciate Casper!Luke's presence as well as his tacit reminders that Luke's exploits are vastly more important than anything Cade will ever do
Cade's threat of suicide was a cool way to diffuse Luke
Marasiah is so derivative of Leia that I wouldn't be surprised if Marasiah Fel is an anagram for Leia Organa
Cade's plan to turn Marasiah over to Roan, collect the bounty, and then turn them both over to Krayt and collect that bounty is inspired and deliciously vile


First impression:

Cade continues to exude promise now that we know him being a jerkass is not a wafer-thin front, like Han. Like Malcolm Reynolds, he really is an ass. The political tug-o'-war between Fel and Roan continues to bore for its haste and lack of depth and the other characters aren't memorable beyond bewbz. Nevertheless, it's a solid improvement due to the protagonist.

Score:
4/10

Riiight. So much for approaching this with an open mind ^^

This isn't near the same story retold, it's some old elements remixed to tell a different story.

Issue 004

My thoughts:


A vortex of Sith powerplays and treason as seen through the eyes of an Imperial patriot: reminds me of Ghost Prison, but greatly inferior
Loyalty to the Imperial throne is peculiar when the guy who currently sits on it did so by killing the previous guy who sat on it. Still having a hard time accepting that unless we're talking about Klingons or Sith
For a one-dimensional Sith prick, Maleval was surprisingly merciful considering Kark's twice-open insubordination
Stormtrooper vs. stormtrooper would probably be a maelstrom of confusion and I'm glad this is emphasized
Trask's murder of Maleval was most welcome
That was the mother of all non-endings

First impression:

I appreciate Ostrander's attempt to explore other facets of this war. And while Trask is a mildly sympathetic Everyman, I'm back to not caring about anyone.

Score:
2/10

Originally posted by Q99
Riiight. So much for approaching this with an open mind ^^

I'm not sure how I can be completely open-minded about such an openly reprehensible premise. The writers claimed to have taken precautions against diminishing the impact of the films and yet appear to take every step towards diminishing the impact of the films.

I love the EU as much as the next fella, but they all need to understand that everything they bring to the table is ultimately inconsequential. This is Lucas's playground and, right or wrong, he's the singular reason they're employed. So rather than spit on his story with their hamfisted caricatures, why not tell something new and creative?

Originally posted by Q99
This isn't near the same story retold, it's some old elements remixed to tell a different story.

Isn't "near the same story"? lmao

Lmao, Tempests getting butthurt.

IMHO, if they're going to start making distant-future SW storylines, they need to shatter the galaxy's static nature.

That is, as Tempest pointed out, nothing seems to matter; we all know that another sith empire is going to rise to power another 50 years down the line, only to get overthrown by the Rebel Alliance 6.0, and the cycle repeats itself.

Why not undergo fundamental changes to the universe's workings? For example, consider the idea of major and fundamental social revolutions; droids rights, for one, is SW's ubiquitous civil rights issue that no author seems to want to address.

Originally posted by Master Han
IMHO, if they're going to start making distant-future SW storylines, they need to shatter the galaxy's static nature.

That is, as Tempest pointed out, nothing seems to matter; we all know that another sith empire is going to rise to power another 50 years down the line, only to get overthrown by the Rebel Alliance 6.0, and the cycle repeats itself.

http://24.media.tumblr.com/81b18b308ca41ebc74b726171fc1db04/tumblr_mpz3chpRqT1sytgpro1_400.gif

Homages and allusions will obviously find their place in Star Wars works. But these things can be done tastefully and quietly to better service the story without reeking of gratuitous narcissism.

Malak was a product of Vader and Tarkin: a man of monstrous bulk and marred with physical deformity, but an unrepentantly cold and brutal killer who was willing to raze worlds in singular pursuit of prey.

Revan was an amalgamation of Thrawn and Anakin: a prodigious mastermind who was also an inordinately gifted Force user.

Knights of the Old Republic took existing Star Wars tropes and expounded upon them (while introducing new ones) in tasteful ways that didn't amount to a bitter attempt to outdo a more popular story.

Legacy, like TOR, has revealed itself to me only as an attempt by obscure writers to match the popularity of that which spawned them by mimicking the original story to a dangerously absurd degree.

But we'll see. As long as Cade continues to be Cade, there may be hope yet.

Originally posted by Master Han
Why not undergo fundamental changes to the universe's workings? For example, consider the idea of major and fundamental social revolutions; droids rights, for one, is SW's ubiquitous civil rights issue that no author seems to want to address.

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_le8gifLkio1qf4it5.jpg

Originally posted by The_Tempest
Loyalty to the Imperial throne is peculiar when the guy who currently sits on it did so by killing the previous guy who sat on it. Still having a hard time accepting that unless we're talking about Klingons or Sith

Yep, it's completely unbelievable. Especially since he failed to kill Roan Fel.

Originally posted by Master Han
Why not undergo fundamental changes to the universe's workings? For example, consider the idea of major and fundamental social revolutions; droids rights, for one, is SW's ubiquitous civil rights issue that no author seems to want to address.

Great idea, I've always wanted that to be addressed.

Or, heres an idea: Have the bad guys not be Sith.

Like, have a completely different darkside cult rise to prominence after the OT.

Yup; the Sith should have died at Endor or Byss. Why would a self-respecting dark sider wanna be a Sith anyway? They fail far more times than they succeed.

Originally posted by ares834
Yep, it's completely unbelievable. Especially since he failed to kill Roan Fel.

Unless they're being literal when they speak of the throne. Maybe it all comes down to the goddamn chair.

http://tellulahdarling.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/snape-thoughtful.gif

Originally posted by The_Tempest
Yup; the Sith should have died at Endor or Byss. Why would a self-respecting dark sider wanna be a Sith anyway? They fail far more times than they succeed.

Exactly. Just once I'd like someone to lampshade how incredibly shit the Sith really are.

(Personally I think the Star Cabal were great non-Sith villains)

Originally posted by The_Tempest
http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_le8gifLkio1qf4it5.jpg

I'd be more invested in such a story, that promises actual changes to the SW galaxy, than merely defeating some random villain - all our current crises merely involve maintaining or restoring the status quo. Yawn.

Yea, I can definitely see a "The Sith should be dead-dead," argument, and can't say I entirely disagree (Btw, the One Sith is the *only* Post-Endor Sith I like).

That said, one can view it as, "Luke bought a century of peace and forged the Jedi who're fighting this one."

Originally posted by Master Han
I'd be more invested in such a story, that promises actual changes to the SW galaxy, than merely defeating some random villain - all our current crises merely involve maintaining or restoring the status quo. Yawn.

Though this is a difference in that the status quo involves the Empire.

I have all 50 issues and the War comics, do you want them or do you have them? Or are you starting to become jealous of the awesomeness of Krayt?


By "circle jerk" do you mean not mentally fellating Sidious and actually believing someone else stands a chance against him?

I downloaded all of them last night. So far, I have seen VERY little of Krayt's awesomeness, but I'm only on issue 5; he has 51 issues to change my mind.

Right now, though, he's not fit to kiss Sidious's boot as a warrior or mastermind.

Spend the next 3 hours of your miserable existence and finish everything including WAR.

Originally posted by mikemikeer
Spend the next 3 hours of your miserable existence and finish everything including WAR.

WAR? Huh, good God, y'all. What is it good for?

Wonderful.

You didn't catch it, did you? Fool.

No no, I got it.

It's the lyric to a popular protest song.

Yes douche, I know. Don't lecture me about music from the 60s-70s. It's above your paygrade.

Edwin Starr was the singer.

You like men.

That explains why I find you so hideous.

I said you liked men, not REAL men.

What's the difference?

Well, look at your man. Now look at me. Back to your man. Now back to me.

That is the difference. It is me. *FLEXES*

Originally posted by mikemikeer
I said you liked men, not REAL men.

Worst. Comeback. Ever.

Issue 005

My thoughts:

Krayt's consultation of the Sith holocrons is a nice continuity touch, but I find the nature of his summons dubious; from the sounds of it, he regularly demands this knowledge from his predecessors, who turn him down. Why ask again and in the same apparent manner?
Didn't Krayt say back in Issue 001 that he was going to seek an alternative path anyway with Cade?
I appreciated their taunts and remarks about Krayt's insignificance. I also find Krayt's justification for "One Sith" to be extremely weak; it's substantively no different from Kaan's Brotherhood
Talon's pursuit of the Jedi on Vendaxa was reminiscent of Maul's pursuit of the Jedi on Tatooine; a nice homage without being overly clumsy
I appreciated Syn's skepticism about taking Sazen down without some serious firepower
Cade hurling wreckage is a nice showing, though it's pretty hard for me to approximate the size of the debris
Konrad's allegiance isn't much of a twist since we know next to nothing about him, but I appreciate that they're trying to portray Krayt as an obstacle to all ends

First impression:

It's getting better, but I hope Legacy breaks from its mold and starts to endear me to its characters. Beyond Cade, the only interesting character is Nihl.

Score
4/10

Issue 006

My thoughts:

I like Antares and his poignant question about loyalty and obedience; looks like he's shaping up to be one to follow through this series
Roan might not be father of the year, but I admire his dedication to the cause and his willingness to endure personal sacrifice
If Cade reminds me of Mal, Syn reminds me of Jayne. An opportunistic scavenger of ambiguous loyalty; gotta love it
Dialogue is seriously hit-and-miss: Sazen's response to Nihl's taunt ("Perhaps I've returned to break your hold on the galaxy" is witless and clumsy; reminds me of Batman's line to Bane in The Dark Knight Rises before their final battle
Yay, Draco shows up and taunts Talon, who in turn outgambits Draco by springing her trap
Draco's anguished declaration of love in the heat of battle is clumsy and inappropriate given that this is the first time we see him interact at all with Marasiah. Why are we supposed to care that he loves her?
Uh oh, Cade's pissed

First impression:

Getting better still. Nothing extraordinary here, but I like Antares Draco.

Score
5/10

I figure that they might've used hologram to get into contact, meeting in person so they can hold longer discussion, and the Sith picked it up.

Hiding yourself in the force is a technique. Both Jedi and Sith use it a lot in these times, no doubt.

Also note how Sazen and Shado kill the five dudes who just killed a master and a knight, and the duo act like beating them is no big thing. These two are, of course, rather good at what they do.



Sith don't know when to quit, and different Holocrons will unlock info for different things, perhaps including persistence. Now, on the Holocrons specifically, note the ones he's talking to. Bane, of course, is probably the last Sith that'll ever help. Nihilus is... well, I can't even understand what he's saying. Andeddu might be new to you, his Holocron showed up in the clone-wars era Star Wars Republic comic under the possession of Dooku. Keep an eye on him.

Krayt does have other holocrons, btw, these just seem to be the holdouts-most-likely-to-have-the-knowledge.



Lacking in Kaan's play at 'equality,' though. The One Sith and Brotherhood have some similarities, but also some differences. I'm curious how you'll view them by the end.





It's visible in the background before he tosses it, and stands taller than them. Not starfighter size. Maybe Millennium Falcon size? Or a bit less?

It was well behind them, so he must've flung it pretty fast too.

1. Still seems unusually risky and stupid. And while shielding themselves in the Force is a technique, the Jedi at this point should have learned their history (PALPATINEPALPATINEPALPATINE) and either duplicated the ability or at least operated under the assumption at all times that Sith could be cloaking themselves.

2. Andeddu notes that Krayt is crawling back to them again; he's done so in the past. Just seems clumsy: "HEY GUYS IM BACK WILL YOU HELP ME?" "LOL NO" "DARN K." No subtle approach or act of persuasion, just begging.

3. I see more similarities than differences. It's really no different from every other legion of Sith we've seen before. So why Krayt thinks it's some colossal innovation or improvement is beyond me.

4. Not seeing the Millennium Falcon size.

And I'm gonna stop giving individual reviews. Takes too much time. Going on to issue 9.

Oh, they can do it too. But it's not fullproof- a stronger force user can still detect a weaker one hiding.



Shuttle sized? It's fairly tall but we don't know how wide.

Interesting twist about Corde being Cad's momma. She's pretty attractive for a woman in her 40s or 50s.

I read the series last year, when I had tons o' free time at work.

Imo it starts off "meh", transcends to "...not bad", and then ends as crap.

What were your favorite parts?

Huh, I'd say it starts out OK (like Tempest notes, some of the early events happen before you get proper context, and it starts off not showing the villain at his best), picks up and gets to be pretty strong, does have a few stumbles, but then finished very well.


Also, the side-stories following other characters tend to be very good. There's a lot more to the comic than Cade's story.

Originally posted by The_Tempest
Interesting twist about Corde being Cad's momma. She's pretty attractive for a woman in her 40s or 50s.

Corde's one of my favorite parts of the series.

Screw the story; we all know the most important part is how well Krayt would fair in a lightsaber duel with Sidious.

Well?

As of issue 13, Sidious would eviscerate Krayt with impunity.

Speaking of Issue 13, it was without question my favorite. I'm going to give it a solid 7. Fel is now my favorite character for his harsh response to Dorn's treachery.

Originally posted by The_Tempest
What were your favorite parts? All the Gar Stazi issues, as I recall. He's a badass, and the space battles later on in the series become exceptionally well drawn, and relatively well written.

I also like Wyyrlok quite a bit. Won't spoil anything for you doe.

edit- My thoughts are a bit scattered above. With the exception of Wyrrlock- I think that most of the plot that doesn't involve the main force sensitive cast is decent. Cade/Krayt and friends' shenanigans are kind of "meh" to me.

Originally posted by Tzeentch._
All the Gar Stazi issues, as I recall. He's a badass, and the space battles later on in the series become exceptionally well drawn, and relatively well written.

I also like Wyyrlok quite a bit. Won't spoil anything for you doe.


I'm going to have to agree with Tzeentch's taste on these matters.

I forget when the first Stazi story is, but it's badass.

Just passed Wyyrlok's coup. Decent so far, but nothing stellar.

Issue 36 was excellent. An 8/10. Stazi is growing on me.

I remember opining years ago that Krayt should have stayed dead and Wyyrlok should have been the Big Bad. I stand by that. Wyyrlok, Stazi, and Fel would have made great baddies.

Stazi's such a fvcking hardass, I like him.

Question- On Vector, did you just read the Legacy issues, or did you catch some of the prior ones too?

Also, what'd you think of Muur?

I'd read the Dark Times Vector issues; not the KOTOR ones, pretty uninterested in that era as well.

Muur was your standard cackling Sith minus Palpatine's charisma. Pretty powerful, though.

Just finished the first issue of War. Wyyrlok's death hollows me more than it did the first time I read it, but at least he went out like a badass. Still, it was a huge mistake bringing back a relatively boring Sith like Krayt from the dead when Wyyrlok was still around.

I'll finish the rest tomorrow.

I will recommend the KotoR comics. They have a very tight plot, especially the first act. Even if you don't like the rest of the era, it stands on it's own merits.

The main character is Zayne, who's kinda the anti-Cade, and most of the rest of the cast is non-force users.




I liked him too- if he'd been facing the old Krayt, he'd have won.


I really, really hope Saarai shows up in the next Legacy series... preferably with the name ^^

Finished it.

If I were to assign the entire series a grade, it would probably be a 5/10. It did indeed have its cool characters (Cade, Stazi, Wyyrlok) and moments (the island of dead Mon Calamarian bodies was an exceedingly powerful scene), but not enough to overcome its transcendent pacing issues and offensively derivative storytelling.

I will agree with the pacing issues- it jumped around, it had lull bits, etc.. I'll mention the KotoR comic has much superior pacing. And so far, by the looks of it, does the second Legacy comic.

Personally I found the unusual choice of protagonist, mixing up the force user equation a bit with third parties, and stuff enough to keep the storytelling fresh too.


Anyway, off of that, what are your thoughts on War specifically? Krayt reborn, the Sith Troopers, T'ra Saa doing her thing, and all that?

Reborn!Krayt was a colossal improvement over just!Krayt, but too little too late. They should have stuck with Wyyrlok.

Krayt's secret Sith stash was another unoriginal move; it's what Palpatine did with Byss. There again, no originality for these hacks.

T'ra's beam o' fvcking death was awesome. Loved Cad sending Krayt to Coruscant Prime.

But Reborn Krayt's power was impressive.

@Tempest, would you say Krayt stomped the imperial knights through speed or did he just batter through their defenses through sheer strength. I mean obviously his victory had to do with both strength and speed, but did his victory owe more to speed or strength? There are at least 2 depictions of that fight and they seemed a bit different, IIRC.

Wyyrlok was cool. A bit heavy-handed in command, but more than strong enough to claim the role of Dark Lord of the Sith if he hadn't wanted to milk the 'Krayt's-in-stasis' thing. His smackdown of Andeddu was one of my favorite individual issues.


And I hope his daughter Saarai shows up in the new comic (so badass for an initiate!).

Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
@Tempest, would you say Krayt stomped the imperial knights through speed or did he just batter through their defenses through sheer strength. I mean obviously his victory had to do with both strength and speed, but did his victory owe more to speed or strength? There are at least 2 depictions of that fight and they seemed a bit different, IIRC.

I'd give it to speed.

Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
@Tempest, would you say Krayt stomped the imperial knights through speed or did he just batter through their defenses through sheer strength. I mean obviously his victory had to do with both strength and speed, but did his victory owe more to speed or strength? There are at least 2 depictions of that fight and they seemed a bit different, IIRC.

I only know the one depiction, where it's pretty clearly speed.