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Who will win between aquaman and attuma?

Depends on the versions.

Attuma upgraded by Doom wins pretty much effortlessly. Same with Worthy Attuma.

Aquaman 10/10
No matter the upgrade on Attuman, he still isn't even remotely as fast as Aquaman and the Trident should take care of Attuma's (upgrade or not) durability in a couple of hits.

Someone's wanking Aquaman.

Originally posted by Kazenji
Someone's wanking Aquaman.

LOL
I said AQ is faster and the Trident will put the hurt on Attuma.

Care to dispute any of this?

Originally posted by Kazenji
Someone's wanking Aquaman.

Yeah.

Normal Attuma gets beat dumb, upgraded Attuma (either of the mentioned above) hurt Aquaman and take the win.

Worthy Attuma is the only one that can take wins. I'm not too familiar with the "Doom upgraded" one so no comment on that. Standard/Classic Attuma gets destroyed.

Attuma could probably win on land, but he would lose underwater pretty much every time.

Originally posted by comicfan11
Aquaman 10/10
No matter the upgrade on Attuman, he still isn't even remotely as fast as Aquaman and the Trident should take care of Attuma's (upgrade or not) durability in a couple of hits.

So you have no idea how powerful Worthy Attuma is but Aquaman is going to win anyways?

Smh. Worthy Attuma would stomp Aquaman 10/10, no contest. The best Aquaman can hope for is to momentarily stun him with his trident, assuming it can hurt him. Regular Attuma would put up a fight but lose imo. No idea about the Doom upgraded version, don't remember reading about him.

Worthy Attuma was beating Silver Surfer (but Surfer was fighting like a retardad) and in the end he was defeated by Namor ...

Hard to say anything in a fight with so many PIS...

But he is at worst low herald.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
So you have no idea how powerful Worthy Attuma is but Aquaman is going to win anyways?

Smh. Worthy Attuma would stomp Aquaman 10/10, no contest. The best Aquaman can hope for is to momentarily stun him with his trident, assuming it can hurt him. Regular Attuma would put up a fight but lose imo. No idea about the Doom upgraded version, don't remember reading about him.

WTH has Worthy Attuma to do with this topic?
He was a one time upgrade character in a very specific storyline.
Why would anyone assume Worthy Attuma, unless specified by the op?

The OP says Attuma and Aquaman, no specified versions.
So I assume current versions for both.

In which case Aquaman would beat Attuma.

Originally posted by eaebiakuya
Worthy Attuma was beating Silver Surfer (but Surfer was fighting like a retardad) and in the end he was defeated by Namor ...

Hard to say anything in a fight with so many PIS...

But he is at worst low herald.

What? Namor got in a lucky shot with Neptune's Trident and it only managed to stun him for a panel. The Defenders dog piled him but he still broke free.

Worthy Attuma seemed to be much stronger then Namor underwater and I'd argue was more powerful then Surfer. Supported by Strange commenting about his energy and him owning Alpha Flight with his energies. IIRC, he was also kicking the shit out of Snowbird and Sasquatch in close combat.

All the Worthy hammers were ridiculously powerful:
http://s3d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16921814_FITD_02_0009_copy.jpg http://s3d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16921815_FITD_02_0010_copy.jpg

Unfortunately, few utilized their power and simply used their upgraded old abilities.

Dark Reign Made Men, Doom brought Attuma back to life and upgraded him to Namor levels. Aquagay's screwed.

Originally posted by comicfan11
WTH has Worthy Attuma to do with this topic?
He was a one time upgrade character in a very specific storyline.
Why would anyone assume Worthy Attuma, unless specified by the op?

The OP says Attuma and Aquaman, no specified versions.
So I assume current versions for both.

In which case Aquaman would beat Attuma.

You specifically said that Aquaman would win no matter the upgrades. In reply to a post that mentioned Worthy Attuma.

Originally posted by comicfan11
WTH has Worthy Attuma to do with this topic?
He was a one time upgrade character in a very specific storyline.
Why would anyone assume Worthy Attuma, unless specified by the op?

The OP says Attuma and Aquaman, no specified versions.
So I assume current versions for both.

In which case Aquaman would beat Attuma.

This.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
You specifically said that Aquaman would win no matter the upgrades. In reply to a post that mentioned Worthy Attuma.

I meant his normal upgrade.
Not something that probably lasted for a total of 5-10 issues and probably won't happen again.
That was a power up, not an upgrade.

Originally posted by comicfan11
I meant his normal upgrade.
Not something that probably lasted for a total of 5-10 issues and probably won't happen again.
That was a power up, not an upgrade.

Okay.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Dark Reign Made Men, Doom brought Attuma back to life and upgraded him to Namor levels. Aquagay's screwed.

I'll check it out.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Dark Reign Made Men, Doom brought Attuma back to life and upgraded him to Namor levels. Aquagay's screwed.

So he is still muuuuuuuuch slower than Aquaman and with no defense for the trident, on top of being a full Atlantean with no defense to telepathy?

AQ 10/10.
Land or sea.

Aquaman just owned Morgan Le Fay with his trident. It's been hinted that the trident has a lot of power, but we just don't know what it is.

Originally posted by comicfan11
So he is still muuuuuuuuch slower than Aquaman

You think Aquaman is much faster then Namor? Based on what? New feats or something?

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
You think Aquaman is much faster then Namor?

Why?

Based on feats.
Simple as that.
I have seen every Namor feat there is speedwise (from his respect thread on this and other sites) likewise for Aquaman, and based on feats there is a very considerable gap.
Every time I've debated this topic there hasn't been a single time that anyone could give feats for Namor close to Aquaman's speed.

Originally posted by comicfan11
Based on feats.
Simple as that.
I have seen every Namor feat there is speedwise (from his respect thread on this and other sites) likewise for Aquaman, and based on feats there is a very considerable gap.
Every time I've debated this topic there hasn't been a single time that anyone could give feats for Namor close to Aquaman's speed.

Maybe you haven't been debating the right people. What's Aquaman's best feat then?

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Maybe you haven't been debating the right people. What's Aquaman's best feat then?

Oh you are welcome to try and come up with something new for Namor.
I welcome it, since I was thinking they were closer before actually looking to their feats.

Anyway current New 52 Aquaman has hypersonic speed at minimum (Mach 5-Mach10) and his leaps/charges are also in the hypersonic category (like when he charged WW).

For pre Flashpoint Aquaman, he has many that border on ridiculous.
He outswam Superman, he has done 20000 feet per second, he has kept up with Flash on water multiple times and replicated Flash's tricks underwater, created vacumns in the water by spinning fast, etc etc.

I don't have scans now, but most of those scans should be posted on his respect thread.

Rage against comicfan11. This should be good, actually. Both people who'll debate without it turning into a sh!tstorm (and I'm being serious here).

Looking forward to it.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Rage against comicfan11. This should be good, actually. Both people who'll debate without it turning into a sh!tstorm (and I'm being serious here).

Looking forward to it.

Heh I'll be genuinely surprised for this to actually be a debate.
I have debated about this topic, also on this site for years, and the results are always the same.

Aquaman is faster.
But if Rage finds something it should be interesting.

Originally posted by comicfan11
Oh you are welcome to try and come up with something new for Namor.
I welcome it, since I was thinking they were closer before actually looking to their feats.

Anyway current New 52 Aquaman has hypersonic speed at minimum (Mach 5-Mach10) and his leaps/charges are also in the hypersonic category (like when he charged WW).

For pre Flashpoint Aquaman, he has many that border on ridiculous.
He outswam Superman, he has done 20000 feet per second, he has kept up with Flash on water multiple times and replicated Flash's tricks underwater, created vacumns in the water by spinning fast, etc etc.

I don't have scans now, but most of those scans should be posted on his respect thread.

When did Aquaman out swim Superman and move at 20,000 feet per second? The rest I've seen and it's nothing beyond what Namor's accomplished. We've seen Namor swim alongside Surfer in flight, keep up with the Quinjet etc. Creating whirlpools underwater to suck out oxygen etc. are all things Namor has accomplished. He's even done so against the Hulk.

Regarding the Wonder Woman leap, I'm not sure what about it makes you think it was hypersonic?

Namor has also shown more agility then I've seen Aquaman demonstrate in the past. Something like this for example:
http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp92/clokeagne_supernova/Namor%20Respect/Namor%20titles/Speedd%20Skill/Sub-Mariner52a.jpg

He's even done some Superman like moves where he turns his body into a drill (More then once) demonstrating legit super speed:
http://imageshack.us/a/img456/4111/001drillsthroughrockstrkk1.jpg

http://imageshack.us/a/img505/9677/002drillsthroughrockagafc0.jpg

http://imageshack.us/a/img174/333/012drillsthroughrockagajt7.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img357/3946/0122drillsthroughrockaggn4.jpg

Torpedoes might as well be in slow motion to Namor:
http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp92/clokeagne_supernova/Namor%20Respect/Namor%20titles/Speedd%20Skill/Saga03b.jpg

I don't have the original feat but here is a retelling of when Namor was even able to keep up and leap across asteroids/meteors (Speed is mach 20-300 I believe) to catch Doom's spaceship:
http://imageshack.us/a/img376/3624/026meteorspeedrecalledngp0.jpg

We've even seen him run at super speed:
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/183/007runsthroughstreetswiow3.jpg/

In terms of reflexes, Namor regularly keeps up speedy bricks but also has a few of his own legitimate speed feats. Here he hurls a Scepter at the speed of thought:
http://imageshack.us/a/img507/4668/004hurlswiththespeedoftyc9.jpg

He also has the obligatory laser dodging:
http://imageshack.us/a/img256/549/005dodgeslethoraystta75yk5.jpg

http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp92/clokeagne_supernova/Namor%20Respect/Namor%20titles/Speedd%20Skill/Sub-Mariner37a.jpg

And blasts:
http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp92/clokeagne_supernova/Namor%20Respect/Guest%20apps/Speed%20Skill/Avengers117b.jpg

Spear catching etc. super speed feats:
http://imageshack.us/a/img183/4004/022catchesaharpooncasolhp0.jpg

Moving too fast for any mortal etc.:
http://imageshack.us/a/img386/6544/019nomortalcanmovesofasfv1.jpg

Shielding a scientist in seconds:
http://imageshack.us/a/img505/966/010savesikthonsm032xo0.jpg

Too swift for tank fire and targeting:
http://imageshack.us/a/img362/5414/025dodgeswartankdfv1081xa0.jpg

He can also fly, extremely fast. Here he flies at 100,000 feet in moments:
http://imageshack.us/a/img71/9978/0202catchesamissiledfv1ph1.jpg

We've also seen Namor fly across the planet in minutes to hours (Depending on the comic), and even into space in seconds. Too lazy to find everything but I'll provide references and probably scans for anything you want.

Missed this. Namor pulls a Superman and reshapes an entire prison structure using super speed sculpting and blitzes some tanks:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/6/68297/1724834-namorspeedfeat428zm.gif
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/6/68297/1724835-namorspeedfeat439yt.gif
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/6/68297/1724836-namorspeedfeat440mz.gif

Yeah I've seen all those scans and while nice most are nice, they are not as fast as Aquaman's.
Aquaman's leaps in New 52 can be measured since it takes him a couple of seconds to go from the harbor of Boston to downtown Boston and the distance is between 3-8 kms depending on where in the harbor he was.

Those in space are also in vacumn, so not exactly legit in atmosphere speed.
A Quinjet also at the time of Namor swimming besides it had a max speed of Mach 1,2 which is nice but well below Aquaman's.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3378320-aq_sup+01.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3378321-aq_sup+02.jpg

Aquaman outreacting and then outswimming Superman.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3402295-aq+sil+1.jpg

Also confirming he is faster (when uninjured) than Supes underwater

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3378308-aq_fla+01.jpg

Doing an actual Flash trick, underwater.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420870-aq_sp+3.jpg

Elevating a plane by creating whirlpool

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420925-aq_mac+1.jpg

Superspeed dodging of machine gun fire on land.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420938-aq_tho+1.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420939-aq_tho+2.jpg

Superspeed dodging and deflecting a thousand spears targeting him

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420930-aq_sha+1.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420931-aq_sha+2.jpg

Dodging point blank laser (two), and despite some doubt being indeed faster than the Shark

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420926-aq_mul+1.jpg

Blitzing 3 different enemies in one page, 2 of them (Shark and King Shark) possessing super speed underwater.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420923-aq_fee+1.jpg

Creating a mini whirlpool that takes out multiple demons, just by using his legs

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420932-aq_shi+1.jpg

Swims so fast the water starts churning up and melting an iceberg, to free a huge ship

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420936-aq_sta+1.jpg

"speed of a star", dodges lasers (and gets hit by his supposed ally)

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420935-aq_spi+1.jpg

Spins so fast that the enemy can't touch him

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420929-aq_see+1.jpg

Too fast to see

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420958-aq_tun+1.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420941-aq_tun+2.jpg

Does the Namor drilling thing, but in water creating a trench in the water.

http://img381.imageshack.us/img381/2730/aquamanv510159vg.jpg

Dodges GL construct right in front of him and blitzes

http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/1876/aquamanswimmingat10000fps3pd.jpg

20000 feet per second (3,8 miles per second)

http://img91.imageshack.us/img91/8665/aquamanspeedfeat08ka1.jpg

Blitzing Thanatos (evil Aquaman double)

http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/2264/aquamanspeedfeat09yn1.gif

Stating how fast he is out of water.

http://img514.imageshack.us/img514/9915/jlagk02pg09js3.jpg
http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/4184/jlagk02pg10bv1.jpg

Dodging and taking out a giant

http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/718/aquamanspeedfeat19gm2.jpg

Dodging Fire and Gardner's blasts easily

http://img261.imageshack.us/img261/4886/aquamanspeedfeat22sr4.jpg

Keeping up with Flash

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420997-aq_eel+1.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420998-aq_eel+2.jpg

Dodging multiple projectiles and blitzing the villain multiple times before they hit water.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420998-aq_eel+2.jpg

Reacting to Flash.

I don't have any JL feats for now, but when I do I'll post if needed.

The Flash and Superman feats should be enough to make my point, but even if they aren't Aquaman has better quantifiable feats anyway.

Also by Namor's own admission if I'm not mistaken he is slower than Marinna and she has a top speed of around 800 knots, which is much slower than Aquaman in a bad day.

Originally posted by comicfan11
I don't have many JL post-Crisis feats for now Fixed for accuracy.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
You think Aquaman is much faster then Namor? Based on what? New feats or something?

Actually yeah, I'm confident to say Aquaman is faster then Namor. Even pre 52, Aquaman's speed feats were superior

Also what no one remembers their fight in JLA/Avengers?

Originally posted by comicfan11
Yeah I've seen all those scans and while nice most are nice, they are not as fast as Aquaman's.
Aquaman's leaps in New 52 can be measured since it takes him a couple of seconds to go from the harbor of Boston to downtown Boston and the distance is between 3-8 kms depending on where in the harbor he was.

We'll see.

So you don't know?

Originally posted by comicfan11
Those in space are also in vacumn, so not exactly legit in atmosphere speed.
A Quinjet also at the time of Namor swimming besides it had a max speed of Mach 1,2 which is nice but well below Aquaman's.

That doesn't mean it's not ridiculously fast. He reached Doom's speeding rocket by leaping across asteroids.

According to what?

Originally posted by comicfan11
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3378320-aq_sup+01.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3378321-aq_sup+02.jpg

Aquaman outreacting and then outswimming Superman.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3402295-aq+sil+1.jpg

Also confirming he is faster (when uninjured) than Supes underwater

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3378308-aq_fla+01.jpg

Doing an actual Flash trick, underwater.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420870-aq_sp+3.jpg

Elevating a plane by creating whirlpool

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420925-aq_mac+1.jpg

Superspeed dodging of machine gun fire on land.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420938-aq_tho+1.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420939-aq_tho+2.jpg

Superspeed dodging and deflecting a thousand spears targeting him

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420923-aq_fee+1.jpg

Creating a mini whirlpool that takes out multiple demons, just by using his legs

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420932-aq_shi+1.jpg

Swims so fast the water starts churning up and melting an iceberg, to free a huge ship

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420936-aq_sta+1.jpg

"speed of a star", dodges lasers (and gets hit by his supposed ally)

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420935-aq_spi+1.jpg

Spins so fast that the enemy can't touch him

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420930-aq_sha+1.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420931-aq_sha+2.jpg

Dodging point blank laser (two), and despite some doubt being indeed faster than the Shark

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420929-aq_see+1.jpg

Too fast to see

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420958-aq_tun+1.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420941-aq_tun+2.jpg

Does the Namor drilling thing, but in water creating a trench in the water.

http://img91.imageshack.us/img91/8665/aquamanspeedfeat08ka1.jpg

Blitzing Thanatos (evil Aquaman double)

I don't have any JL feats for now, but when I do I'll post if needed.



All of these are Pre-Crisis as far as I can tell. Why are they relevant here?

Originally posted by comicfan11

http://img381.imageshack.us/img381/2730/aquamanv510159vg.jpg

Dodges GL construct right in front of him and blitzes

http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/1876/aquamanswimmingat10000fps3pd.jpg

20000 feet per second (3,8 miles per second)


http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420926-aq_mul+1.jpg

Blitzing 3 different enemies in one page, 2 of them (Shark and King Shark) possessing super speed underwater.


http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/2264/aquamanspeedfeat09yn1.gif

Stating how fast he is out of water.

http://img514.imageshack.us/img514/9915/jlagk02pg09js3.jpg
http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/4184/jlagk02pg10bv1.jpg

Dodging and taking out a giant

http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/718/aquamanspeedfeat19gm2.jpg

Dodging Fire and Gardner's blasts easily

http://img261.imageshack.us/img261/4886/aquamanspeedfeat22sr4.jpg

Keeping up with Flash

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420997-aq_eel+1.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420998-aq_eel+2.jpg

Dodging multiple projectiles and blitzing the villain multiple times before they hit water.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/137442/3420998-aq_eel+2.jpg

Reacting to Flash.



Where did he react to Flash?

These are Post-Crisis and impressive I guess but which one of these is suppose to prove that Aquaman is faster then Namor, much less a lot faster? Mostly it's him dodging or swimming fast, which Namor has in spades. For example:
http://s3d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16924507_Avengers272_06b.jpghttp://s3d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16924510_Avengers272_07b.jpg

Originally posted by comicfan11
The Flash and Superman feats should be enough to make my point, but even if they aren't Aquaman has better quantifiable feats anyway.

You think swimming alongside the Flash proves he's faster? That is not at all the case. Contrary to popular believe, the Flash doesn't run around at light speed. Not even close.

Besides, it'd be like me posting a scan of Namor catching Surfer and claiming that conclusively proves he's faster:
http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp92/clokeagne_supernova/Namor%20Respect/Namor%20titles/Battles/Sub-Mariner34c.jpg
http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp92/clokeagne_supernova/Namor%20Respect/Namor%20titles/Battles/Sub-Mariner34d.jpg
http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp92/clokeagne_supernova/Namor%20Respect/Namor%20titles/Battles/Sub-Mariner34e.jpg

Or him swimming and keeping up with Captain Marvel while in her light form:
http://s3d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16924512_Avengers272_16b.jpghttp://s3d3.turboimagehost.com/t/16924514_Avengers272_17a.jpg

Regarding Superman: I'm not going to debate Pre-Crisis DC, I only have a cursory knowledge about that version.

Which quantifiable feats are better? Post them please.

Originally posted by comicfan11
Also by Namor's own admission if I'm not mistaken he is slower than Marinna and she has a top speed of around 800 knots, which is much slower than Aquaman in a bad day.

I've never seen this. If Marinna is faster then Namor, her ceiling must be much higher.

Namor blitzing the Hulk:
http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp92/clokeagne_supernova/Namor%20Respect/Namor%20titles/Battles/TalesToAstonish100h.jpg
http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp92/clokeagne_supernova/Namor%20Respect/Namor%20titles/Battles/TalesToAstonish100i.jpg

Eventually beating him with a Whirlpool:
http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp92/clokeagne_supernova/Namor%20Respect/Namor%20titles/Battles/TalesToAstonish100m.jpg
http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp92/clokeagne_supernova/Namor%20Respect/Namor%20titles/Battles/TalesToAstonish100n.jpg
http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp92/clokeagne_supernova/Namor%20Respect/Namor%20titles/Battles/TalesToAstonish100o.jpg

Another instance:
http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp92/clokeagne_supernova/Namor%20Respect/Guest%20apps/Battles/Hulk118c.jpg
http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp92/clokeagne_supernova/Namor%20Respect/Guest%20apps/Battles/Hulk118d.jpg
http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp92/clokeagne_supernova/Namor%20Respect/Guest%20apps/Battles/Hulk118e.jpg

It's true, he has said many times Marrina was faster then her, and I would NOT put her on the level of Aquaman's speed

Well, I'd definitely put Namor on Aquaman's level of speed unless someone presents some evidence that would say otherwise. Funny how thinks work like that.

Tbh, so far, Namor has the more impressive feats. I've been okay with mix and matching Pre and Post Flashpoint feats, although it can be a little confusing, but Pre-Crisis doesn't count in my book.

Namor flies from the Stratosphere to the ground in moments:
http://imageshack.us/a/img71/7201/019fromstratospheredfv1yb2.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img507/4773/0192fromstratospheredfvyr4.jpg

Here Captain Mar-Vell actually has to strain to catch up to a disoriented Namor:
http://s3d4.turboimagehost.com/t/16926493_Sub-Mariner_30-1213.jpg

Then they fly into space in moments:
http://s3d4.turboimagehost.com/t/16926491_Sub-Mariner_30-19.jpghttp://s3d4.turboimagehost.com/t/16926492_Sub-Mariner_30-20.jpg

http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j165/A_Flight10/MarvelvsDC02-24_zps5ed05a0c.jpg
http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j165/A_Flight10/MarvelvsDC02-28_zpsffc66006.jpg

I'm confused. Was that suppose to prove that Aquaman is noticeably faster? He was actively dodging all of Namor's hits (Which is all he really can do tbh) but at the same, he admitted that he couldn't land a punch either and that their speed was too evenly matched. Namor still rocked him good however when he needed to.

What was up with Namor though? Since when is he so obsessed with holding back and not hurting his opponent in a high stake battle? Well, I guess some liberties have to be taken for their to be a fight.

Because Aquaman was trying to talk down a pissed Namor and not taking it seriously and was still avoiding his shots (AM was smiling while Namor looked pissed). When he thought Namor was done...they stopped throwing punches, Namor landed the blow.

Regardless it's not canon

Originally posted by -K-M-
Because Aquaman was trying to talk down a pissed Namor and not taking it seriously and was still avoiding his shots (AM was smiling while Namor looked pissed). When he thought Namor was done...they stopped throwing punches, Namor landed the blow.

Regardless it's not canon

You think Namor was pissed? HA! He was relatively calm for Namor. As a matter of fact, he was all about holding back and not doing Aquaman real harm. Weird.

About the second point, it might be possible that Aquaman let his guard down but he seemed to be actively trying to dodge. Either way, Aquaman by his own admission said that their speed was evenly matched and that neither could land a blow. Not really supporting the whole idea that Aquaman has a noticeable speed edge.

To be clear, I'm not arguing that Namor is much faster then Aquaman. If Aquaman focuses on keeping distance, it is possible (Underwater) but at the same time, he's not faster imo (My mind is open to new evidence). It's not like Spider-Man vs. Rhino. He can't dance around Namor and land blows at will.

Also, where are you getting from that Aquaman was trying to talk Namor down? He was actively shit-talking.

Edit: Yea, non canon, so mostly irrelevant.

Because he was trying to say this could go on forever, were too evenly matched, lets end it....They stop...then punch.

Also yes, Namor had a pissed off look while Aquaman was smiling. Was Namor blood thirsty? No of course not, but you can be pissed and not be at that level. Definitely was taking it more seriously then Aquaman

Originally posted by -K-M-
Because he was trying to say this could go on forever, were too evenly matched, lets end it....They stop...then punch.

Also yes, Namor had a pissed off look while Aquaman was smiling. Was Namor blood thirsty? No of course not, but you can be pissed and not be at that level. Definitely was taking it more seriously then Aquaman

But he specifically says that neither of them will land a punch. So yes, Aquaman was actively dodging his attacks, but he couldn't land a punch either.

And right before he punches him, Namor was smiling. Saying that Namor was taking it more seriously then Aquaman is one thing. At his core, Namor is less open to a joking nature. However, that doesn't mean one of them was putting in less effort than the other, just to be clear. Both wanted the fight to end. Namor wanted to score a knock out, Aquaman was taunting him and wanted to end it. I guess in that respects, they are different characters.

and did we see him try?

He smiled which made Aquaman think the fight was over and he got through to him which allowed the punch to land That's actually a pretty common scene in MANY comic books. No, hook hand Aquaman is generally not in a joking manner. Have you read much Aquaman? Not to be rude, just asking.

Problem with DC vs. Marvel crossover it took liberties with many characters. The scans were not meant to cause this much discussion...it is pretty clear cut, but it's also non-canon

Originally posted by -K-M-
and did we see him try?

He smiled which made Aquaman think the fight was over and he got through to him which allowed the punch to land That's actually a pretty common scene in MANY comic books. No, hook hand Aquaman is generally not in a joking manner. Have you read much Aquaman? Not to be rude, just asking.

Problem with DC vs. Marvel crossover it took liberties with many characters. The scans were not meant to cause this much discussion...it is pretty clear cut, but it's also non-canon

Uh....yes.

Okay, I'm open to other interpretations but I think you're reading too much into this. Namor smiled and struck him. Imo, he was amused because Aquaman underestimated his speed. You can chose to disagree with this, but I don't think it was some clever ruse to get him to drop his guard or something. At least, I don't see any evidence to suggest this. Namor took him out mid sentence, a sentence that started before his grin.

I agree, hook Aquaman isn't much for jokes and is usually very serious (I have read most of Aquaman's Post-Crisis runs) while Wally, Plastic Man are the jokers. But like you said, this crossover took liberties. I'm just taking their characterization for what it is. Aquaman was more of a joker and it played off of Namor's more grim attitude.

But yea, enough of this. Agree to disagree.

Wally was never a joker. It was only in JLU.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Wally was never a joker. It was only in JLU.

And in the series before that not?

Nice stuff.

Never knew Namor was that fast.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
And in the series before that not?
fu

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Well, I'd definitely put Namor on Aquaman's level of speed unless someone presents some evidence that would say otherwise. Funny how thinks work like that.

Tbh, so far, Namor has the more impressive feats. I've been okay with mix and matching Pre and Post Flashpoint feats, although it can be a little confusing, but Pre-Crisis doesn't count in my book.

Namor flies from the Stratosphere to the ground in moments:
http://imageshack.us/a/img71/7201/019fromstratospheredfv1yb2.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img507/4773/0192fromstratospheredfvyr4.jpg

Here Captain Mar-Vell actually has to strain to catch up to a disoriented Namor:
http://s3d4.turboimagehost.com/t/16926493_Sub-Mariner_30-1213.jpg

Then they fly into space in moments:
http://s3d4.turboimagehost.com/t/16926491_Sub-Mariner_30-19.jpghttp://s3d4.turboimagehost.com/t/16926492_Sub-Mariner_30-20.jpg

Um precrisis and postcrisis Aquaman unlike other some other DC characters shares continuity.
The vast majority of his stories are based on precrisis continuity and would not be possible if it was a different character, same as his supporting cast and enemies. No precrisis, no dead kid, no crazy Mera, no Black Manta etc.
Apart from that if you want to get technical Post Crisis Aquaman received at least 2 power ups, which would make him more powerful than any of his previous incarnations.

Apart from that, TBH (as you like to say) all I saw was Namor looking fast (artwork) and not a single quantifiable feat close to Aquaman's speed (especially swimming).

Also if you believe that Namor floating in space translates to his actual speed in an atmosphere, then sorry dude I'm not here to teach you science.

So if these are Namor's best feats, then as I predicted, yeah he is much slower than Aquaman.
I'll find one of the multiple times Namor admits he is slower than Marrina and post it sometime, as well as her top speed at around 800 knots (swimming).

Finally does Namor have any quantifiable swimming feat better than 20000 feet per second?
He flies fast, but swimming? Does he have anything close to that?
Honestly the only feat I hadn't seen before was the one with the palace, which was OK, but as with most of Namor's feats it was nice artwork with no timeframe.

And in DC vs Marvel, Aquaman was noticeably faster than a Namor trying his best to tag him.

Also -K-M- since you are the resident expert in Alpha Flight, can you post the scans of Marinna, to put this debate to an end?

Originally posted by comicfan11
Um precrisis and postcrisis Aquaman unlike other some other DC characters shares continuity. No.

Rage wins.

Originally posted by Mindset
No.

Rage wins.

LOL, AQ's feats between 1985 and 2011 are more than enough to prove my point.
I'll just wait for -KM- to post the Marinna scans.
That should be more than enough.

AM beats regular attuma handily imo. he certainly doesn't beat worthy attuma. don't know about doom attuma.....

as far as speed--my generalized impression has always been that Am was faster, but not by some great amount. i think it's because his speed has been highlighted more often, perhaps because his strength wasn't so great as namor's? not sure. rage showed some great feats i'd long forgotten about and based on what has been shown in this thread, namor may well be as fast, if not faster. i think if they ever squared off for real, AM would prove to be quicker, but i certainly don't think the speed difference would be great enough to be any kind of major advantage in a fight between them.

Originally posted by comicfan11
Um precrisis and postcrisis Aquaman unlike other some other DC characters shares continuity.
The vast majority of his stories are based on precrisis continuity and would not be possible if it was a different character, same as his supporting cast and enemies. No precrisis, no dead kid, no crazy Mera, no Black Manta etc.
Apart from that if you want to get technical Post Crisis Aquaman received at least 2 power ups, which would make him more powerful than any of his previous incarnations.

A few of DC's characters have kept bits and pieces of their continuity from Pre-Crisis. That in no way means that their feats transfer over. Not sure why I have to explain this, when one of the driving points of the CoIE was to ground DC's power levels. As a matter of fact, we've seen that even when some Pre-Crisis events are re-enacted in Post-Crisis, and sometimes they are not exactly the same.

Originally posted by comicfan11
Apart from that, TBH (as you like to say) all I saw was Namor looking fast (artwork) and not a single quantifiable feat close to Aquaman's speed (especially swimming).

Also if you believe that Namor floating in space translates to his actual speed in an atmosphere, then sorry dude I'm not here to teach you science.

It's at least as impressive if not more so imo.

What?

Originally posted by comicfan11
So if these are Namor's best feats, then as I predicted, yeah he is much slower than Aquaman.
I'll find one of the multiple times Namor admits he is slower than Marrina and post it sometime, as well as her top speed at around 800 knots (swimming).

Much slower then Aquaman? Besides one swimming feat, everything you posted did not have any quantifiable numbers. As a matter of fact, it was mostly just him dodging generic lasers and shit.

Originally posted by comicfan11
Finally does Namor have any quantifiable swimming feat better than 20000 feet per second?
He flies fast, but swimming? Does he have anything close to that?
Honestly the only feat I hadn't seen before was the one with the palace, which was OK, but as with most of Namor's feats it was nice artwork with no timeframe.

I posted a scan of Namor going from the ocean floor into space in at least a few seconds. While carrying a heavy molecular destabilizing device. And IIRC he was having some head problems at the time.

20,000 fps is like 13,000 mph? To reach escape velocity alone, you need to hit 25,000 mph. And Namor did this while out of water where his strength isn't as great while lugging tons.

Originally posted by comicfan11
And in DC vs Marvel, Aquaman was noticeably faster than a Namor trying his best to tag him.

1. Non-canon.

2. If he was noticeably faster, Aquaman wouldn't have said they were equal. Nor would he have been unable to land a punch.

You're arguing that Aquaman is noticeably faster. And that it would give him a decent advantage in a fight. In that comic, all Aquaman could do is dodge.

Originally posted by comicfan11
Also -K-M- since you are the resident expert in Alpha Flight, can you post the scans of Marinna, to put this debate to an end?

Why do you think Marinna being faster then Namor will prove that Aquaman is faster if you can't prove with feats that Aquaman is faster then Namor?

Unless you're holding out on me in terms of feats, Namor has noticeably better movement speed (True super speed akin to a flying speed), arguably superior reflexes, and faster travel speed. At least with his flight aiding him.

^Meant to say flying brick there.

I just thought this was really cool. A young Namor "with the speed of a bullet" tosses a large ship "high" onto the shore:
http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp92/clokeagne_supernova/Namor%20Respect/Namor%20titles/Strength/MarvelComics01a.jpg

Originally posted by leonidas
AM beats regular attuma handily imo. he certainly doesn't beat worthy attuma. don't know about doom attuma.....

as far as speed--my generalized impression has always been that Am was faster, but not by some great amount. i think it's because his speed has been highlighted more often, perhaps because his strength wasn't so great as namor's? not sure. rage showed some great feats i'd long forgotten about and based on what has been shown in this thread, namor may well be as fast, if not faster. i think if they ever squared off for real, AM would prove to be quicker, but i certainly don't think the speed difference would be great enough to be any kind of major advantage in a fight between them.

Pretty much. Namor's strength has gotten more play then his speed (Vise versa for Aquaman) but even so, he has enough feats under his speed that should indicate he's easily on Aquaman's level.

Movement speed and reaction speed wise? I'm giving it to Namor. Aquaman is agile, but Namor seems to demonstrate legit super speed.

According to comicfan, she topped at 800 knots. According to that panel, the moment she hits the water she's already going faster then 900 knots.

But it doesn't matter ultimately. Marrina being faster then Namor is worth less then Quan in a debate if Namor has feats matching Aquaman.

So far, the most impressive feat is this scan:
http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/1876/aquamanswimmingat10000fps3pd.jpg

He's definitely very fast, but not beyond Namor. Especially when we take into account his flight.

Edit: I just re-read the above scan. The man specifically says Aquaman's full range is 10,000 fps. He'd have to travel at those speeds directly up from 20,000 feet, not that he's moving at 20,000 fps. A very important distinction to note.

For those who are curious: 10,000 fps is 10972.8 km/h. Marrina is comfortably faster then Aquaman I guess. For some reason, I find that kind of amusing after all this focus on Marrina.

Some more Namor speed feats. He easily catches to speeding missiles with his hands at point blank range:
http://i1355.photobucket.com/albums/q701/Matthews1986/namorefeat513dy_zpscc24a73c.gif

"Swimming at speeds beyond belief in a spiraling circle.."
http://i1355.photobucket.com/albums/q701/Matthews1986/namorfeat341pp_zpsac865f29.gif

Dodges a Torpedo in a split second:
http://i1355.photobucket.com/albums/q701/Matthews1986/torpedospeed15kz_zpsc6bda45f.gif
http://i1355.photobucket.com/albums/q701/Matthews1986/torpedospeed26gt_zps7631b0b0.gif

Catches a harpoon at point blank range:
http://i1355.photobucket.com/albums/q701/Matthews1986/harpooncatch4oh_zpsc66381e2.gif

Namor is faster then most give him credit for.

Guys, I'm not really sure this is relevant to the topic.

Also, some clarification on which versions are being argued would help.

^ Dr. Doom resurrected Attuma after his death at the hands of Sentry. He also augmented Attuma to be Namor's physical equal. That is the current Attuma that is showing up in comics right now.Originally posted by comicfan11
LOL, AQ's feats between 1985 and 2011 are more than enough to prove my point. If only that were the case, before and after you decided to post a dozen or so pre-Crisis scans.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Edit: I just re-read the above scan. The man specifically says Aquaman's full range is 10,000 fps. He'd have to travel at those speeds directly up from 20,000 feet, not that he's moving at 20,000 fps. A very important distinction to note.

For those who are curious: 10,000 fps is 10972.8 km/h. Marrina is comfortably faster then Aquaman I guess. For some reason, I find that kind of amusing after all this focus on Marrina.

No he traveled at 20,000 fps as that's what gave him the bends. That was his limit going UP, not his top speed. He is against the constant change of pressure, which is what wrecked his body (Decompression Sickness). That's a lot different then going in a straight line in a constant pressure. 10000 fps UPWARDS is what he could do safely, same thing why Aurora and Northstar don't always go 99% the speed of light. If he had to do it in a straight line, without needing to reach equilibrium he could do 20,000 fps and above safely.

This is the same principle why Scuba Divers don't rise too quickly.

Originally posted by ODG
^ Dr. Doom resurrected Attuma after his death at the hands of Sentry. He also augmented Attuma to be Namor's physical equal. That is the current Attuma that is showing up in comics right now.

Has he appeared since Dark Reign? Well other then Worthy Attuma.

IIRC, Aquaman has moved at a thousand knots, and regularly appears to take mere minutes when crossing oceans.

He's moved so fast as to appear as a blur underwater (Pre FP), so the dude is hella fast.

Whether that's faster than Attuma, I really don't know; just saying.

Originally posted by -K-M-
Has he appeared since Dark Reign? Well other then Worthy Attuma.
Most recent depiction of Attuma I've seen was his appearance in Indestructible Hulk, I think it was last year. He was able to tussle with Hulk for short a while, punching him across an underwater kingdom, so he has some power. It was a short fight though:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11111/111113173/3355590-hulk+vs.+atuma3.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11111/111113173/3355593-hulk+vs.+atuma4.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/14/146504/2946382- hulk_breaks_magically_impenetrable_hide_indestruct
ible_hulk_005_001.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/14/146504/2946383- hulk_breaks_magically_impenetrable_hide_indestruct
ible_hulk_005_002.jpg
http://www.comicbookbrain.com/_imagery/2013-03-28/leinil-francis-yu-hulk-5-pgb.jpg

Not my scans but that's the whole fight. Only time I can recall seeing him since Fear Itself.

Edit: scans 3 and 4 fixed
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc403/mmatvcomics/IndestructibleHulk005-016_zps1290b358.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-JT4jK3ltB48/UUogPIVnfJI/AAAAAAAAU0k/p7d9sBEmV0A/s1600/Indestructible+Hulk+005-017.jpg

Originally posted by -K-M-


http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j165/A_Flight10/MarvelvsDC02-24_zps5ed05a0c.jpg
http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j165/A_Flight10/MarvelvsDC02-28_zpsffc66006.jpg

Uh, I am reading on panel evidence that Namor is faster as well as an admission that Aquaman is stronger. This was supposed to help your argument how?

Originally posted by -Pr-
IIRC, Aquaman has moved at a thousand knots, and regularly appears to take mere minutes when crossing oceans.

He's moved so fast as to appear as a blur underwater (Pre FP), so the dude is hella fast.

Whether that's faster than Attuma, I really don't know; just saying.

Attuma is the equal of Namor now, so the question is is he faster than Namor. The evidence is not favorable.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Attuma is the equal of Namor now, so the question is is he faster than Namor. The evidence is not favorable.

Can't really apply ABC logic in this case. Was it stated that Attuma is as fast as Namor?

Originally posted by The Sorrow
Most recent depiction of Attuma I've seen was his appearance in Indestructible Hulk, I think it was last year. He was able to tussle with Hulk for short a while, punching him across an underwater kingdom, so he has some power. It was a short fight though:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11111/111113173/3355590-hulk+vs.+atuma3.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11111/111113173/3355593-hulk+vs.+atuma4.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/14/146504/2946382- hulk_breaks_magically_impenetrable_hide_indestruct
ible_hulk_005_001.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/14/146504/2946383- hulk_breaks_magically_impenetrable_hide_indestruct
ible_hulk_005_002.jpg
http://www.comicbookbrain.com/_imagery/2013-03-28/leinil-francis-yu-hulk-5-pgb.jpg

Not my scans but that's the whole fight. Only time I can recall seeing him since Fear Itself. Originally posted by The Sorrow
Edit: scans 3 and 4 fixed
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc403/mmatvcomics/IndestructibleHulk005-016_zps1290b358.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-JT4jK3ltB48/UUogPIVnfJI/AAAAAAAAU0k/p7d9sBEmV0A/s1600/Indestructible+Hulk+005-017.jpg

Thanks for the scans, forgot about that scene.

It's not much, but gave Hulk a decent amount of trouble, more then I see Aquaman doing.

Originally posted by -K-M-
No he traveled at 20,000 fps as that's what gave him the bends. That was his limit going UP, not his top speed. He is against the constant change of pressure, which is what wrecked his body (Decompression Sickness). That's a lot different then going in a straight line in a constant pressure. 10000 fps UPWARDS is what he could do safely, same thing why Aurora and Northstar don't always go 99% the speed of light. If he had to do it in a straight line, without needing to reach equilibrium he could do 20,000 fps and above safely.

This is the same principle why Scuba Divers don't rise too quickly.

The dialogue clearly states that he got the bends because he went up directly 20,000 feet, not that he was moving at 20,000 fps:
http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/1876/aquamanswimmingat10000fps3pd.jpg

His current power level apparently puts him at 10,000 fps at full range.

You might be right that he could travel faster in a straight line instead of going up, but he wasn't moving faster in that scene.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Thanks for the scans, forgot about that scene.

It's not much, but gave Hulk a decent amount of trouble, more then I see Aquaman doing.
Yeah it's not as if Hulk steamrolled him, though it was a pretty brief exchange.

Even in the animated universe he was able to take on Hulk toe to toe and defeat an Avengers line-up including Thor underwater. Since his resurrection he is being depicted as a physical powerhouse across the board it seems. He isn't a scrub anymore he just needs more appearances.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Can't really apply ABC logic in this case. Was it stated that Attuma is as fast as Namor?

In the absence of a direct comparision of speed between Attuma and Aquaman in comics, ABC logic is completely appropriate. Ths is the only reason why Namor and Aquaman's speed showing are being debated. It's the best information available.

Originally posted by The Sorrow
Yeah it's not as if Hulk steamrolled him, though it was a pretty brief exchange.

Even in the animated universe he was able to take on Hulk toe to toe and defeat an Avengers line-up including Thor underwater. Since his resurrection he is being depicted as a physical powerhouse across the board it seems. He isn't a scrub anymore he just needs more appearances.

Attuma was a complete monster in that scene. Even overly done.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
In the absence of a direct comparision of speed between Attuma and Aquaman in comics, ABC logic is completely appropriate. Ths is the only reason why Namor and Aquaman's speed showing are being debated. It's the best information available.

Namor isn't Attuma though. We'd need some sort of direct statement saying they were as fast as each other, or Attuma's own feats.

You can't just transplant Namor's feats in for Attuma's, even if you want to argue that he'd capable of such things.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Uh, I am reading on panel evidence that Namor is faster as well as an admission that Aquaman is stronger. This was supposed to help your argument how?

You read that wrong, it was Namor that was stronger and Aquaman was faster.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
In the absence of a direct comparision of speed between Attuma and Aquaman in comics, ABC logic is completely appropriate. Ths is the only reason why Namor and Aquaman's speed showing are being debated. It's the best information available.

Actually happened in the canon JLA/Avengers crossover. Aquaman KO'ed him in a second with his telepathy.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
The dialogue clearly states that he got the bends because he went up directly 20,000 feet, not that he was moving at 20,000 fps:
http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/1876/aquamanswimmingat10000fps3pd.jpg

His current power level apparently puts him at 10,000 fps at full range.

You might be right that he could travel faster in a straight line instead of going up, but he wasn't moving faster in that scene.

I took it the opposite, because if he can do 10,000 fps with no troubles why would 20,000 fps give him pause? Basically it would take him longer if he was 10,000 fps but still be ok. If the speed didn't change then he should still be able to adapt to the pressure shift. Generally if your at a constant speed that can help with pressure sickness. Only problem is we don't know how long it actually took Aquaman to complete the said feat. Did he travel 20,000 in a second? 5? 10? etc.

Upwards again, not a direct straight light.

Not might be right, I am.

How strong is aquaman now-a-days?
I see him as 20 - 50 tonner. I know he has had a few feats that might put him over 100 tons, but other characters have had high feats above their norm (ex. spiderman, Cap, etc)

Originally posted by Inhuman
How strong is aquaman now-a-days?
I see him as 20 - 50 tonner. I know he has had a few feats that might put him over 100 tons, but other characters have had high feats above their norm (ex. spiderman, Cap, etc)

Honestly, I would say current Aquaman is a solid class 100.

He's flung a sub-marine out of water and lifted a sunk ocean liner in his current run. Not to mention decking Superman miles away in Justice League.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Namor isn't Attuma though. We'd need some sort of direct statement saying they were as fast as each other, or Attuma's own feats.

You can't just transplant Namor's feats in for Attuma's, even if you want to argue that he'd capable of such things.

He's been granted "Namor's strength, flight and ability to breathe on land".

Attuma blasts him from a distance

Originally posted by Inhuman
How strong is aquaman now-a-days?
I see him as 20 - 50 tonner. I know he has had a few feats that might put him over 100 tons, but other characters have had high feats above their norm (ex. spiderman, Cap, etc)

Aquaman's norm nowadays is comfortably in the triple digit ranges, I would say.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
He's been granted "Namor's strength, flight and ability to breathe on land".

Attuma blasts him from a distance

lol.

I can see where the spirit of the amp would be to make him Namor's equal in all things, but we still go by feats at the end of the day.

Originally posted by -K-M-
Actually happened in the canon JLA/Avengers crossover. Aquaman KO'ed him in a second with his telepathy.

First off, we are not supposed to be referencing JLA/A per forum rules. Secondly, he did not KO him, he gave him a headache.

Originally posted by -K-M-
You read that wrong, it was Namor that was stronger and Aquaman was faster.

No I didn't. I said Namor was stated to be stronger and Namor SHOWED he was faster or as fast when he punted AM out of the water into the sky. If Aquaman was faster, he would have dodged the hit. Namor took Aquaman's statement about being faster as a challenge and showed him real speed.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
First off, we are not supposed to be referencing JLA/A per forum rules. Secondly, he did not KO him, he gave him a headache.

He gave Namor a headache, but he also wasnt fighting Namor he was fighting ATTUMA (and ko'ed him) and his forces. You know the character that this thread is about?

They have said in others threads canon, but not to use it as people argue about it. Regardless it's still canon. JLA/Avengers directly tied into the Trinity series in DC.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
No I didn't. I said Namor was stated to be stronger and Namor SHOWED he was faster or as fast when he punted AM out of the water into the sky. If Aquaman was faster, he would have dodged the hit. Namor took Aquaman's statement about being faster as a challenge and showed him real speed.

Oh you mean the part where he put his guard down and that's when he got punched?....thought so. Because when AM didn't have his guard down Namor was complaining he couldn't tag him.

Originally posted by -K-M-
He gave Namor a headache, but he also wasnt fighting Namor he was fighting ATTUMA (and ko'ed him) and his forces. You know the character that this thread is about?

They have said in others threads canon, but not to use it as people argue about it. Regardless it's still canon. JLA/Avengers directly tied into the Trinity series in DC.



Oh you mean the part where he put his guard down and that's when he got punched?....thought so. Because when AM didn't have his guard down Namor was complaining he couldn't tag him.

- You said he KOed Namor and he didn't.

- Namor is an Atlantean/Human. This is why he was barely affected by the psi attack that KOed the fish people. I have no idea why you brought up the psi attack in the first place.

- Namor reacted faster than Aquaman could react. That's why he got hit. As far as "letting his guard down" they were talking while Namor was pursuing Aquaman. You know, because Aquaman knew Namor was stronger than him. If Aquaman was significantly faster than Namor, he would not have gotten hit because he would have moved out of the way. This is a situation in which a speed advantage would be utilized.

- Finally, AM is being compared to the CURRENT Attuma, not the one from JLA/A

Question: Why does it matter whether Namor is half human or not?

Originally posted by -Pr-
Question: Why does it matter whether Namor is half human or not?

That's why he was not affected by Aquaman's psi. I didn't bring the psi attack up and I have no idea what it's relevance is to the discussion.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
That's why he was not affected by Aquaman's psi. I didn't bring the psi attack up and I have no idea what it's relevance is to the discussion.

I don't follow. What does Namor's heritage have to do with Aquaman's psionics?

Originally posted by -Pr-
I don't follow. What does Namor's heritage have to do with Aquaman's psionics?

It's the difference between him and the other Atlanteans Aquaman took out with this psi.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
It's the difference between him and the other Atlanteans Aquaman took out with this psi.

Even though Aquaman's telepathy has long since worked on beings other than sea creatures, we're still to assume it was his heritage that was the reason?

If I'm misremembering the panel, fair enough though.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Even though Aquaman's telepathy has long since worked on beings other than sea creatures, we're still to assume it was his heritage that was the reason?

If I'm misremembering the panel, fair enough though.

I don't know that heritage is the correct term, but the difference between Namor and Atlanteans is that he is half human. He is genetically different.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
I don't know that heritage is the correct term, but the difference between Namor and Atlanteans is that he is half human. He is genetically different.

I'm not arguing that; I'm just saying it wouldn't matter, unless the writer really dropped the ball.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
- You said he KOed Namor and he didn't.

- Namor is an Atlantean/Human. This is why he was barely affected by the psi attack that KOed the fish people. I have no idea why you brought up the psi attack in the first place.

- Namor reacted faster than Aquaman could react. That's why he got hit. As far as "letting his guard down" they were talking while Namor was pursuing Aquaman. You know, because Aquaman knew Namor was stronger than him. If Aquaman was significantly faster than Namor, he would not have gotten hit because he would have moved out of the way. This is a situation in which a speed advantage would be utilized.

- Finally, AM is being compared to the CURRENT Attuma, not the one from JLA/A

Ummm no I didn't, ever time I referred to JLA/Avengers was the Attuma fight. Where did I even say he ko'ed Namor?

I didn't, I brought it up against when he used it on Attuma. Like are you being serious right now? Namor isn't in this fight. Nor have I debated who would win between Namor and Aquaman as this is not what the thread is about.

haha wrong. Do you not understand what the logic behind lowering ones guard and sucking punching someone?

Finally now your talking on topic. Now prove to me his psi-resistance impoved.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
That's why he was not affected by Aquaman's psi. I didn't bring the psi attack up and I have no idea what it's relevance is to the discussion.

Because AM used his psi attacks on Attuma....which this thread is about. Like are you being serious?

Why would his psi attack have no relevance in a fight?

Originally posted by -Pr-
I'm not arguing that; I'm just saying it wouldn't matter, unless the writer really dropped the ball.

He did, as even Marrina who is alien (Plodex) was taken out from the psi attack.

Originally posted by -Pr-
I'm not arguing that; I'm just saying it wouldn't matter, unless the writer really dropped the ball.

Not necessarily IMO. Namor has boasted high TP resistance throughout his exsitence. They only answer as to why, whether we feel it it logical or not, is that he is a half breed.

Originally posted by -K-M-
He did, as even Marrina who is alien (Plodex) was taken out from the psi attack.

Ah, the bad writing excuse. Namor wasn't taken out because is psi resistant. Consistent writing.

Attuma is class 60 while Aquman is solid class 100. AM is also faster and imo the better fighter. He wins.

Originally posted by -K-M-
Because AM used his psi attacks on Attuma....which this thread is about. Like are you being serious?

Why would his psi attack have no relevance in a fight?

Because for the third time, that Attuma is from the past and this is the current resurrected Attuma which is supposed to be Namor's equal.

At this point, I have to ask the question, have you read JLA/A, or are you going by what you heard or read?

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Attuma is class 60 while Aquman is solid class 100. AM is also faster and imo the better fighter. He wins.

Attuma is not class 60, he is the equal of Namor who is over class 1000 per his showings. There is no scaled class system in DC, so at best you are estimating Aquaman is class 100. Namor has always been portayed as stronger than Aquaman, so if Attuma is Namor's equal, he is stronger than Aquaman.

^Namor portrayed stronger then Aquaman? Are they in the same Universe? DCnU AM has strength feats that put him easily at CL100, that's the only thing that counts. Attuma is listed as CL60 im the Handbooks iirc.

Mungi is going to end this n00b.

Wait...you're comparing a handbook to comic showings?

Originally posted by -K-M-
He did, as even Marrina who is alien (Plodex) was taken out from the psi attack.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Not necessarily IMO. Namor has boasted high TP resistance throughout his exsitence. They only answer as to why, whether we feel it it logical or not, is that he is a half breed.

So, bad writing then. Being a half-breed shouldn't make a damn bit of difference.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Attuma is not class 60, he is the equal of Namor who is over class 1000 per his showings. There is no scaled class system in DC, so at best you are estimating Aquaman is class 100. Namor has always been portayed as stronger than Aquaman, so if Attuma is Namor's equal, he is stronger than Aquaman.

Bad ABC logic. Bad.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
^Namor portrayed stronger then Aquaman? Are they in the same Universe? DCnU AM has strength feats that put him easily at CL100, that's the only thing that counts. Attuma is listed as CL60 im the Handbooks iirc.

Attuma was upgraded by Doom in 2009. Maybe this synopsis will help you out:

http://marvel.wikia.com/Dark_Reign:_Made_Men_Vol_1_1

Or Attuma, for that matter, but needs a "counter" in case Namor turns on him. He has used his mystic and scientific knowledge to give Attuma all of Namor's powers. He offers Attuma a choice: serve him or walk out the door. If Attuma serves, Doom will offer him a home for his people within Atlantean waters, a safe harbour in between schemes, and a strong master to aid him... and possibly, the chance to fight Namor.

As far as Namor being stronger, it's been quite obvious throughout his existence, so much so that JLA/A acknowledged the strength gap. Namor could always go toe to toe with Hulk, Aquaman has traditionally been at least two classes lower.

Originally posted by -Pr-
So, bad writing then. Being a half-breed shouldn't make a damn bit of difference.



Bad ABC logic. Bad.

It's not bad writing, it's been the case throughout Namor's existence. To be consistent, you'd also have to chalk up his ability to fly due as bad writing as well.

I thought that the board's standard was supposed to be what shown on panel? You can't say it's bad writing simply because you don't approve.

ABC Logic is fine when that's the best information you have available. Ressurected Attuma and Aquaman have never met in comics. How else would you better handicap a theorectical battle?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Wait...you're comparing a handbook to comic showings?

I think that's what the man did. Pr is calling the portrayal of Namor being able to resist AM's psi as "bad writing." Sigh....

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Attuma was upgraded by Doom in 2009. Maybe this synopsis will help you out:

http://marvel.wikia.com/Dark_Reign:_Made_Men_Vol_1_1

Or Attuma, for that matter, but needs a "counter" in case Namor turns on him. He has used his mystic and scientific knowledge to give Attuma all of Namor's powers. He offers Attuma a choice: serve him or walk out the door. If Attuma serves, Doom will offer him a home for his people within Atlantean waters, a safe harbour in between schemes, and a strong master to aid him... and possibly, the chance to fight Namor.

As far as Namor being stronger, it's been quite obvious throughout his existence, so much so that JLA/A acknowledged the strength gap. Namor could always go toe to toe with Hulk, Aquaman has traditionally been at least two classes lower.

So you are talking about upgraded attuma. Well normal attuma is on CL60

Obvious? Not a fact. JL/Avengers is not up to date anymore. AQ showed in the DCnU that he is a legit CL100 powerhouse. Accept it.

Aquaman seems a lot tougher these days--even in the Flashpoint cartoon, he was giving WW a fight.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
So you are talking about upgraded attuma. Well normal attuma is on CL60

Obvious? Not a fact. JL/Avengers is not up to date anymore. AQ showed in the DCnU that he is a legit CL100 powerhouse. Accept it.


Again, his upgrade occured in 2009- it's 2013.

CURRENT Attuma = Upgraded Attuma

The rules of the board is that current versions are used unless otherwise stated.

Originally posted by Pillow Biter
Aquaman seems a lot tougher these days--even in the Flashpoint cartoon, he was giving WW a fight.

Perhaps, and I have no reason to doubt that. If that's the case, they he would simply be closing the strength gap between he and Namor.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Again, his upgrade occured in 2009- it's 2013.

CURRENT Attuma = Upgraded Attuma

The rules of the board is that current versions are used unless otherwise stated.

Ok so he is on AQ level. Cool, both CL100?

Here is the JLA/A scan where AM knocked out everyone in the room accept for Namor and Plasticman. Marrina and the Atlantean army lead by Attuma are knocked out.


http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/10/108905/3233111-capture.png

Namor mentions how he is "only" half Atlantean and has a headache. So a psi attack that completey took out an Atlantean army only gave Namor a headache. This is completely consistent with his psi resistance which is well documented. He has resisted mind attacks in the form of direct psi attacks, astral plane attacks, attempts at mind control and mystic attacks.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Ok so he is on AQ level. Cool, both CL100?

Like I said, I don't know for myself, but I hear people saying that he has been portrayed as stronger lately. The question is whether this is a portrayal or if it's proven that he is "upgraded" over the "old" Aquaman. Attuma's upgrade however is not is doubt, it's official as of 2009.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
It's not bad writing, it's been the case throughout Namor's existence. To be consistent, you'd also have to chalk up his ability to fly due as bad writing as well.

I thought that the board's standard was supposed to be what shown on panel? You can't say it's bad writing simply because you don't approve.

ABC Logic is fine when that's the best information you have available. Ressurected Attuma and Aquaman have never met in comics. How else would you better handicap a theorectical battle?

Namor being half human being the reason Aquaman's psionics don't work on him ignores Aquaman's showings, and is bad writing, at least in terms of representing Aquaman.

No, ABC logic isn't fine. Deduction is a different thing.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Like I said, I don't know for myself, but I hear people saying that he has been portrayed as stronger lately. The question is whether this is a portrayal or if it's proven that he is "upgraded" over the "old" Aquaman. Attuma's upgrade however is not is doubt, it's official as of 2009.

Aquaman has been portrayed as a solid low herald strength wise for almost two years now.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Namor being half human being the reason Aquaman's psionics don't work on him ignores Aquaman's showings, and is bad writing, at least in terms of representing Aquaman.

No, ABC logic isn't fine. Deduction is a different thing.



Aquaman has been portrayed as a solid low herald strength wise for almost two years now.

But it did work, it just wasn't potent enough for Namor. If it didn't work, then Namor would have been completely unaffected like Plasticman was. Namor being resistent to psi attacks is great writing regardless of the reasons because it's consistent with the character.

White Martians are also quite resistant to mental attacks.

Aquaman drops them like it aint no thang.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
But it did work, it just wasn't potent enough for Namor. If it didn't work, then Namor would have been completely unaffected like Plasticman was. Namor being resistent to psi attacks is great writing regardless of the reasons because it's consistent with the character.

I have no problem with Namor having psionic resistance that would allow him to not be taken out by Aquaman's telepathy.

The problem is that the scan you posted completely downplays Aquaman's telepathy, even in his own phrasing of his own telepathic ability. That's bad writing, given how inconsistent it is with Aquaman's showings.

That doesn't mean Namor resisting is bad writing; just HOW he resisted it.

The writer obviously still thinks that Aquaman can only commune with ocean life, and is showing his ignorance.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Here is the JLA/A scan where AM knocked out everyone in the room accept for Namor and Plasticman. Marrina and the Atlantean army lead by Attuma are knocked out.


http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/10/108905/3233111-capture.png

Namor mentions how he is "only" half Atlantean and has a headache. So a psi attack that completey took out an Atlantean army only gave Namor a headache. This is completely consistent with his psi resistance which is well documented. He has resisted mind attacks in the form of direct psi attacks, astral plane attacks, attempts at mind control and mystic attacks.

AQ wins 10/10 then by shutting Attumas mind off.

Shit, this got off topic.

Guys, can we please move back on topic.

Aquaman induces a seizure in Attuma.

Originally posted by -Pr-
I have no problem with Namor having psionic resistance that would allow him to not be taken out by Aquaman's telepathy.

The problem is that the scan you posted completely downplays Aquaman's telepathy, even in his own phrasing of his own telepathic ability. That's bad writing, given how inconsistent it is with Aquaman's showings.

That doesn't mean Namor resisting is bad writing; just HOW he resisted it.

The writer obviously still thinks that Aquaman can only commune with ocean life, and is showing his ignorance.

Huh? Where are you getting that from? Aquaman specifically says he had to atune his psi to affect the physiology of the Atlanteans. He says it took some time and it was strenuous. This does not mean that he can't take out humans with his psi. He wasn't trying to.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Because for the third time, that Attuma is from the past and this is the current resurrected Attuma which is supposed to be Namor's equal.

At this point, I have to ask the question, have you read JLA/A, or are you going by what you heard or read?

Bwahaha are you for real? Yes it have and have referenced key things from that issue. Nice attempt at a deflect. Swing and a miss.

Now prove to me new attuma has better psi resistance or any for that matter. also you think aquaman hasn't gone through his own upgrades during that time?

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Here is the JLA/A scan where AM knocked out everyone in the room accept for Namor and Plasticman. Marrina and the Atlantean army lead by Attuma are knocked out.


http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/10/108905/3233111-capture.png

Namor mentions how he is "only" half Atlantean and has a headache. So a psi attack that completey took out an Atlantean army only gave Namor a headache. This is completely consistent with his psi resistance which is well documented. He has resisted mind attacks in the form of direct psi attacks, astral plane attacks, attempts at mind control and mystic attacks.

Well, that settles it. Aquaman has shut Attuma down with a thought before. /thread.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Huh? Where are you getting that from? Aquaman specifically says he had to atune his psi to affect the physiology of the Atlanteans. He says it took some time and it was strenuous. This does not mean that he can't take out humans with his psi. He wasn't trying to.

Where in that scan does it say so?

Originally posted by -K-M-
Bwahaha are you for real? Yes it have and have referenced key things from that issue. Nice attempt at a deflect. Swing and a miss.

Now prove to me new attuma has better psi resistance or any for that matter. also you think aquaman hasn't gone through his own upgrades during that time?

The reason I ask is because you said the psi attack was focused on a Attuma . It was focused on the entire Atlantean army led by Attuma.

As far as the deflection, there is nothing for me to deflect. Attuma is stated to have all the powers of Namor. If you choose to believe that statement to be untrue, then that's your prerogative, but you have not even offered a reason as to why it might be untrue. Looks more and more like you wish it wasn't true.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Where in that scan does it say so?

I provided the scan, you're going to have to read it for yourself.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
I provided the scan, you're going to have to read it for yourself.

I read the scan.

Unless there was a second one?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Well, that settles it. Aquaman has shut Attuma down with a thought before. /thread.

Yes but not Attuma with the powers of Namor.

Does Attuma have impressive psionic resistance?

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Yes but not Attuma with the powers of Namor.

Bein half Human is not a power .

Originally posted by -Pr-
I read the scan.

Unless there was a second one?

Ah! I see, it didn't link to the right scan even though that's scan was on the page of the other scans that did display . I'll try to link it when I get to my office.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
The reason I ask is because you said the psi attack was focused on a Attuma . It was focused on the entire Atlantean army led by Attuma.

As far as the deflection, there is nothing for me to deflect. Attuma is stated to have all the powers of Namor. If you choose to believe that statement to be untrue, then that's your prerogative, but you have not even offered a reason as to why it might be untrue. Looks more and more like you wish it wasn't true.

Again are you being serious? I even said earlier it was attuma and his forces? Also how are you trying to diminish the fact AM took out Attuma who this thread is about. Prove to me he has psi resistance.

Prove it! Lip service is nothing more then lip service. The burden of proof is on you to back that claim up. Haha riiiiiight? That's clearly what I'm saying.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Bein half Human is not a power .

you are really being quite silly and argumentative at this point. Being able to resist high level mental attacks is a power regardless of the source.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Bein half Human is not a power .

Ding ding. Regardless scene doesn't make much sense as marrina is neither human or Atlantean and she was ko'ed

Originally posted by -K-M-
Again are you being serious? I even said earlier it was attuma and his forces? Also how are you trying to diminish the fact AM took out Attuma who this thread is about. Prove to me he has psi resistance.

Prove it! Lip service is nothing more then lip service. The burden of proof is on you to back that claim up. Haha riiiiiight? That's clearly what I'm saying.

I've already addressed all your points and answered all your questions. I have provided scans, and advised you of the current version of Attuma yet you still keep repeating yourself like a broken record. That's not debating that's being stubborn. This is why there are rules against badgering

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
you are really being quite silly and argumentative at this point. Being able to resist high level mental attacks is a power regardless of the source.

Except the part where nanor thanked the fact he was only half human A feat attuma can't utilize

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
you are really being quite silly and argumentative at this point. Being able to resist high level mental attacks is a power regardless of the source.

But Namor stated why he could resist it. Not because of his power but his half human race.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
I've already addressed all your points and answered all your questions. I have provided scans, and advised you of the current version of Attuma yet you still keep repeating yourself like a broken record. That's not debating that's being stubborn. This is why there are rules against badgering

So again no proof.

You know how to debate? You post facts. That's pretty basic stuff.

Originally posted by -K-M-
Ding ding. Regardless scene doesn't make much sense as marrina is neither human or Atlantean and she was ko'ed

It makes perfect sense. Aquaman still affected her as she is marine life. It affected Namor as well but not nearly as much. the reason you don't see that is because you are determined not to give me a more proper credit for his high level resistance to mental attacks.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
It makes perfect sense. Aquaman still affected her as she is marine life. It affected Namor as well but not nearly as much. the reason you don't see that is because you are determined not to give me a more proper credit for his high level resistance to mental attacks.

No she's an alien that adapted to survive in the water. Huge difference. Regardless aquaman has affected humans, gods, Martians, birds, etc

Never said nanor doesn't have high level psi defence. I said attuma doesn't. Prove to me attuma has the same level of Namor. Namor said he could resist his power as he was half human. That's different.

Originally posted by -K-M-
So again no proof.

You know how to debate? You post facts. That's pretty basic stuff.

That's exactly what I did when I posted the narrative of Doom giving Attuma Namor's powers.

All right, guys? Back on topic please. No crossovers.

Just use feats/showings etc. Let's get this on track.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
That's exactly what I did when I posted the narrative of Doom giving Attuma Namor's powers.

That's not proof. That's a statement with no backing. I can make any claim I want. If I don't have facts that back up the statement, the statement is unproven. Basic debating principle.

Originally posted by -Pr-
All right, guys? Back on topic please. No crossovers.

Just use feats/showings etc. Let's get this on track.

Sounds good. Let's see some proof of attuma's fabled psi-resistance

Originally posted by -K-M-
No she's an alien that adapted to survive in the water. Huge difference. Regardless aquaman has affected humans, gods, Martians, birds, etc

Never said nanor doesn't have high level psi defence. I said attuma doesn't. Prove to me attuma has the same level of Namor. Namor said he could resist his power as he was half human. That's different.

No, Namor did NOT say that. Prove to me you are able and willing to read scans provided and accurately relay what they say.

Originally posted by -K-M-
That's not proof. That's a statement with no backing. I can make any claim I want. If I don't have facts that back up the statement, the statement is unproven. Basic debating principle.

It's a synopsis on what occurred in the cited issue of Dark Reign, Made Men, 2009. Are you saying that it didn't happen?

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
No, Namor did NOT say that. Prove to me you are able and willing to read scans provided and accurately relay what they say.

yeah you're trolling. He said and I quote "glad I am, then that I am only half Atlantean. Even so, my head pounds...."

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
It's a synopsis on what occurred in the cited issue of Dark Reign, Made Men, 2009. Are you saying that it didn't happen?

*facepalm* do you not get what a unproven statement is? Clearly not. Anyone can give lip service, provide proof attuma gained even psi-resistance. If you can't do that simple thing don't even bother replying.

Originally posted by -K-M-
yeah you're trolling. He said and I quote "glad I am, then that I am only half Atlantean. Even so, my head pounds...."

I'm not trolling, I am presenting a concept you have yet to full comprehend.

Namor is more than the sum of his parts. Namor isn't simply a human Atlantean hyrid, he is a human Atlantean mutate. This account for great strength that is far above any normal Atlantean. If he was simply the sum of his parts, he should actually be weaker than the average Atlantean because humans are significantly weaker than Atlanteans. This is not the case. His foot wings and his TP resistence are also due to him being mutant as neither humans or Atlanteans have these features.

If you can grasp the the concept that Namor's TP is derived from his mutation, then you can understand his statement in a different context. If he was full Atlantean, he would be KOed because he would not be a mutant with TP resistence. You are making the incorrect assumption that Aquaman's psi blast would not have affected non Atlanteans (including humans) around him based on Namor's statement. As you pointed out, the psi blast affected Marrina, which you seem to have a problem with. The important thing with her is that she is not an Atlantean but was still KOed. The ONLY guy who was completely unaffected was Plasticman who is completed unaffected by psi. This entire scene is a reflection of Namor's TP resistance due to being a mutant.

So yes, twisting Namor's statement in the manner you did caused you to misinterpret it. That's why I pointed out what you said was not his quote.

Originally posted by -K-M-
*facepalm* do you not get what a unproven statement is? Clearly not. Anyone can give lip service, provide proof attuma gained even psi-resistance. If you can't do that simple thing don't even bother replying.

I'm not giving lip service, at the same time, I'm not under trial by you. If you don't want to believe it occured, then carry on. Chest beating is a behavior that is beneath me.

I'm fully aware he is a mutate. Something attuma isn't. That long winded speech proved nothing.

And again from namors own words said he was glad he was only half Atlantean. Something you said he never said. Lulz.