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Who will win this grand battle? Takes place in Malgus's Throne Room.

Honestly? Ulic is a master swordsman, but I don't recall his Force powers being on the level of say Revan and Malgus, both of which are well versed Force users with a stronger knowledge of the Dark Side. Kun is a better fight for either Malgus or Revan, but Ulic may be overmatched here. I'd need to review the TOTJ comics for anything more conclusive on his part.

Well he does have that amulet and he still is extremely powerful. But yeah, he's a duelist, not a Force dude.

Well he did have a Kun-esque Amulet, so overall I think he'd be capable of holding his own.

Ninja'd.

He's never shown to use the amulet in any truly powerful way, unless I'm having amnesia here. Again, I'd need to look over the source material, but having recently gone over just his battle from Kun to the end of the War, he doesn't so much as TK anybody. He just dominates with his saber, every time.

Perhaps, however even if he is mainly a sith warrior, I think he's more than capable of competing with either of these combatants.

But there's no bar for that besides Kun and him being explicitly "master swordsmen". They're unrivaled within their time, but that's about it. So is Mace/Dooku/Yoda in their time, but there's still some disparity, even if a little in the formers' cases, and then there's Force use.

We see that in terms of Force use, Kun is superior by far to Ulic. Ulic is captured by the Republic and held on trial. Kun freezes the entire chamber, ragdolls or butchers the opposing Jedi, and walks out with a freed Ulic in tow. In sword to sword, neither claimed the victory but in Force power Kun was head and shoulders above Ulic in every showing.

I know that Kun>>>Ulic in the force, Ulic even admits this I believe, however Ulic is still a very fast, skilled, and powerful swordsman, and I do think he could keep up with Revan or Malgus in a combat situation. I doubt either will ragdoll him with TK, and regular lightning won't do too much, although Malgus has his force Maelstrom. Pretty sure both could keep up with him as far as swordsmanship goes, Revan may be a bit inferior though.

Their command of the Force seems superior though and this impacts their ability to dictate distance and overpower him without succumbing in a melee. Malgus is vicious, and his use of the Force against Vem was pretty quick and effective. He is also pretty undeterred by saber combat. Meanwhile, you have Revan "hurr hurr of the Force" Unmasked who can pretty much ash Sith Lords at his peak. Not sure Ulic has anything to offer him either.

This fight would depend extremely on Ulic closing the distance while Kun plays some kind of Force support, and quite frankly I don't see that happening.

Originally posted by Stealth Moose
But there's no bar for that besides Kun and him being explicitly "master swordsmen". They're unrivaled within their time, but that's about it. So is Mace/Dooku/Yoda in their time, but there's still some disparity, even if a little in the formers' cases, and then there's Force use.

Uliq held his own against pissed off Sylvar, without the use of the Force. Which is one of the best skill feats ever imo. Plus he was old and out of practice and doesn't he have some constant wound? Seriously impressive that he did that well.

Revan's most powerful uses of the force have been through defensive applications. Ulic doesn't really use things like lightning, so Revan won't have that advantage over him anyway. revan does have his own lightning, although the amount of power in said lightning is unknown. Exar could possibly keep malgus at bay while Ulic battles it out with Revan.

Uliq would beat Revan in a lightsaber fight imo. If he could get to him. Which i don't think he would since Revans TK is way above his.

I still have doubts about Revan ragdolling Ulic.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Uliq held his own against pissed off Sylvar, without the use of the Force. Which is one of the best skill feats ever imo. Plus he was old and out of practice and doesn't he have some constant wound? Seriously impressive that he did that well.

True. I'm not saying Ulic is a chump, but Ulic in his prime was unable to defeat Kun. If he can't likewise overcome Revan or Malgus quickly, he has no Force feats to fall back on.

Meanwhile, Kun may be fighting a handicap match.

Team 1!

I don't see Revan rag dolling Ulic in this equation. His absolute best is a hypothetical statement from Drew that he, under the right mindset, could collapse a building. Other than that he's opened a door, collapsed an archway, and pushed an Emperor. While that's good, I don't see him shitting on Ulic Quel Droma with TK.

That being said, this is a really good fight Supreme. Both teams are formidable.

all has proceeded as I have forseen.

To be entirely honest, I don't know enough about Ulic's specific feats to say whether or not he could take Revan. From his general information, I'd say it's pretty close, though.

Well he did defeat Mandalore while at a large disadvantage, and stalemated pissed Sylvar while having no force connection.

Ulic is the Malak to Exar Kun's Revan that is he has far less feats than his master in spite of having good deal of hype.

Originally posted by Mizukage Yoda
Ulic is the Malak to Exar Kun's Revan that is he has far less feats than his master in spite of having good deal of hype.

This is somewhat true. Ulic has more feats relating to him, but they take place in earlier comics and few people read them. Malak is more nebulous; he is in the comics, but his feats if any are rare (or at least unknown to us here; I don't know of anyone who has read all of the KotOR comics) and the only version of him we can argue even slightly is Augmented Star Forge Malak, since canonically he was juiced during his finale with Revan.

Ulic is, however, a master swordsman. His equal in that department, Exar Kun, toyed with and destroyed a Jedi master and proficient duelist of over 500+ years experience. Pretty much the moment Kun decided Vodo was annoying to him, he killed him. It's one of the most conclusive stomps in TOTJ. If Kun didn't exist, or Ulic had stayed a Jedi and helped defeat Kun, then he'd be more memorable, perhaps have more feats, or would have used the Force to do something other than aid his saber skills. But as it is, he has one facet of Kun's uberness and negligible Force usage on-panel.

That being said, Kun genuinely thought Ulic was a threat compared to Aleema, who can generate a Force illusion army and all her Krath kin, so maybe he had a lot more potential than we realize. There's just no reason to assume he can TK or tank the TK of anyone Master level of higher in this case.

I've read all the KOTOR comics and Malak doesn't appear to do anything in them.

He fights Cassus Fett, gets pwned by Mandalore and spars with Jarael as far as I know.

Right. He doesn't do anything.

And his name is atrocious.

Originally posted by Stealth Moose


That being said, Kun genuinely thought Ulic was a threat compared to Aleema, who can generate a Force illusion army and all her Krath kin, so maybe he had a lot more potential than we realize. There's just no reason to assume he can TK or tank the TK of anyone Master level of higher in this case.

I think he does indeed have a shitlod of untapped potential. After all, Ragnos chose him as apprentice and Kun as Master, suggesting Ragnos thought Ulic had the potential to surpass or equal his Master.

Well, both had similar amulets and Kun was drastically stronger in the Force, so I think Ulic might be the Obi-Wan to Kun's Anakin in that regard. But you're right, improvement was not out of the question. They really could flesh out those characters and that era better, but IIIRC, they were limited in the number of comics they were allowed to print by LFL.

Maybe, but the difference is that the Jedi Code doesn't require the Padawan to surpass and kill his Master, lol.

Yeah, I think that era had more potential.

And KotOR retcons a lot of it or ignores it. Double bladed sabers, made by Sith Kun (and unfound by the Jedi, I might add. It was on him when he died in that flaming temple) become norm for both Jedi and Sith. Tech looks PT instead of archaic like the comics. Vima disappears in 40 years, neither hide nor hair is found. Etc. etc.

The writers could've done a much better job with KotOR and prior. They did magnificently with the KotOR game, but other than that it's nothing too good. Which sucks, because I'm a big EU fan.

EDIT - I do love the TOR storylines, though.

KotOR was my gateway drug into EU. Before that, I wasn't terribly interested. Then I rewatched AotC, got some Clone War novels, and it escalated from there. The reason I first came here was related to KotOR Google searches even.

KotOR is the EU's marihuana.

Everything about Revan is hazy. This makes sense.

It also makes that cracked article about Dick Revan much more plausible.

Originally posted by Stealth Moose
The reason I first came here was related to KotOR Google searches even.

Thats how I found you guys as well.

OMG me too.

Yeah, I arrived a day before SWVF came onboard. Revan v. Vader was the thread. And it was before RotS had even come out.

Originally posted by Stealth Moose
This is somewhat true. Ulic has more feats relating to him, but they take place in earlier comics and few people read them. Malak is more nebulous; he is in the comics, but his feats if any are rare (or at least unknown to us here; I don't know of anyone who has read all of the KotOR comics) and the only version of him we can argue even slightly is Augmented Star Forge Malak, since canonically he was juiced during his finale with Revan.

Ulic is, however, a master swordsman. His equal in that department, Exar Kun, toyed with and destroyed a Jedi master and proficient duelist of over 500+ years experience. Pretty much the moment Kun decided Vodo was annoying to him, he killed him. It's one of the most conclusive stomps in TOTJ. If Kun didn't exist, or Ulic had stayed a Jedi and helped defeat Kun, then he'd be more memorable, perhaps have more feats, or would have used the Force to do something other than aid his saber skills. But as it is, he has one facet of Kun's uberness and negligible Force usage on-panel.

That being said, Kun genuinely thought Ulic was a threat compared to Aleema, who can generate a Force illusion army and all her Krath kin, so maybe he had a lot more potential than we realize. There's just no reason to assume he can TK or tank the TK of anyone Master level of higher in this case.

I disagree. If Vodo had a saber he would not have lost so easily. The only reason Kun won was due to his raw power to cut through his cane. He wouldn't be able to do that to a saber.

Originally posted by Stealth Moose
And KotOR retcons a lot of it or ignores it. Double bladed sabers, made by Sith Kun (and unfound by the Jedi, I might add. It was on him when he died in that flaming temple) become norm for both Jedi and Sith. Tech looks PT instead of archaic like the comics. Vima disappears in 40 years, neither hide nor hair is found. Etc. etc.

Well, to be fair, Bastila Shan was originally going to be Vima Sunrider, but they changed it last minute.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
Well, to be fair, Bastila Shan was originally going to be Vima Sunrider, but they changed it last minute.

Which was due to some copyright claim on the name "Sunrider".

Also--Ulic stalemated Exar Kun prior to the timeskip. Before the timeskip, Exar Kun lost single-saber battle with Vodo Siosk Baas. He only won slightly when he gained his second saber.

After the timeskip, he overpowered Vodo with a single blade, and crushed him with dual. I'm sure Ulic improved too, but he spent lots of that time in prison, so I'd say he's still marginally below Exar Kun.

Nevertheless, he does have Force Feats. Wasn't he able to like, control people's minds and shit as a Sith Lord? And he did have dat Amulet, which means Force Blasts are entirely possible on Ulic's end if he ever attempted it.

Revan vs Ulic Quel Droma is actually an interesting battle imo.

Team 1 takes this.

How so?

Revan and Exar battle for awhile during which time Malgus defeats Ulic. They then double team Exar Kun.

Hmm. Personally I don't think Revan can handle Kun any better than Malgus would handle Ulic. Exar's just more powerful, and is more skilled with the lightsaber.

Ugh. We've had this debate before and suffice to say I'm not debating it again.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
Also--Ulic stalemated Exar Kun prior to the timeskip. Before the timeskip, Exar Kun lost single-saber battle with Vodo Siosk Baas. He only won slightly when he gained his second saber.

After the timeskip, he overpowered Vodo with a single blade, and crushed him with dual. I'm sure Ulic improved too, but he spent lots of that time in prison, so I'd say he's still marginally below Exar Kun.

Between his Vodo duel and his Ulic duel is when he got his sith training from Freedon and went on his quest and got his amulet. That's when he most likely jumped in power the most.

Originally posted by Mizukage Yoda
I disagree. If Vodo had a saber he would not have lost so easily. The only reason Kun won was due to his raw power to cut through his cane. He wouldn't be able to do that to a saber.

Vodo's cane was, per narration "as strong as a lightsaber". While no one would argue sensibly that Kun could cut through a lightsaber, it's a fair bet to say that his rage and raw Force power pretty much overpowered his master's considerable talents.

Let's think about this here: Vodo is using the Force to hold his staff together, like Sion held his body together, except that Vodo's staff looks better after it's taken a few blows. It looks immaculate, actually. Either that's an extremely esoteric and shockingly simple Force technique anyone could learn, or he has some implied Force power higher than we realize.

And Kun overpowered this physically, before getting his amulets.

I'm rather certain, some people are underestimating Ulic quite a bit.

True. He didn't demonstrate the Force grandeur of Exar Kun, but some of his actions are quite noteable, even in that regard. While during his training, he already demonstrated some nice proficiency with the force and his lightsaber, we might move to the first "real" conflict he is involved in: the Beast Wars of Onderon.

While the outcome of that conflict in particular didn't do much to credit Qel-Droma's skill, one particular scene does: The escape from Onderon's palace, after Queen Amanoa did unveil her dark side abilities. Ulic is, at least partitially, able to withstand the Sith sorcery unleashed by the ruler of the planet. Enough to carry his wounded brother Cay of to safety, through blaster fire barrages from the dark side adept guards of the palace. Not an exceptionally "uber" demonstration of force connection, yet, demonstrating some talent on his part.

Even more "force tanking" of him is seen in the Freedon Nadd uprising. When the Jedi set out to confront the Sith Sorcerer King Ommin, who has managed to overwhelm Master Arca with his force abilities, the Sith Sorcerer unleashs a wave of dark side energy against the strike team. The entire team, consisting of half a dozen Jedi - including a noteable force adept like Nomi Sunrider - was floored by Ommins attack. With the exception of Ulic, who jumped right through it and destroyed the Sorcerer's exo-skeleton, effectively defeating him.

His next force feat is one that, possibly, served as prototype for the RotS scene in which Vader, now in his suit, tears apart that room in a fit of dark side emotion. Ulic does quite the same, when being poisoned and chained to some torture device by Satal Keto. He tears himself free from a rather stable looking connection to ground and ceiling. After that, he purges the Sith poison from his blood, basically on instinct, kills Satal and floors a Jedi trio coming to rescue him (with Nomi Sunrider among them) with some massive force wave.

We can also note, that it took Master Vodo and several other Jedi to use the sever force ability against Ulic, and that just with a temporary effect. The later use of that ability against him by Nomi Sunrider, apparently just worked, because he was destracted by the anguish he felt after having cut down his own brother Cay. And even then, his lightsaber skill alone was sufficient to fend of an enraged Jedi (Sylvar).

That aside, we shouldn't face his probable least prominent appearance in "The Clone Wars" video game. He teaches Anakin Skywalker how to resist the effects of the Dark Reaper superweapon, demonstrating some familiarity with the Sith Magic empowering the weapon and defensive force techniques capable of defeating such power. And apparently he had enough arcane knowledge to built his own holocron, that was later used by Darth Malgus (as mentioned in "Book of Sith".

So we can conclude that Ulic enjoys a rather powerful force connection and seemingly is equiped with a quite nice force defense / resistance. Enough to duke it out with Malgus or Revan? I don't know. But neither do I see on of the both standing before Kun. So maybe Ulic would go down here, while Kun kills the first of the opposing team to destroy the second, after the latter has killed Ulic. Just an idea, though.

Good stuff. I had kind of forgotten some of that.

Team 2 just may take this.

How sure are we that Vodo and the jedi used force sever? Also, it's very likely that Nomi's proficiency with the technique was superior to that of Vodo and those jedi, and that's why it worked so well on Ulic, not because he was "distracted".

Nomi herself seems shocked that it was "so complete". It's her first time ever using the ability. I personally think that it's dependent on the power of the user versus the affected; as Kun had no idea Odan-Urr was going to try it on him and he shrugged it off naturally anyways.

Originally posted by psmith81992
How sure are we that Vodo and the jedi used force sever?


As the effect is, that Ulic does temporarily lose his force connection, and we know of no other ability causing such effects, I guess, we have a winner there.



She, up to that point, had just theoretical knowledge of the ability in question, if I'm not mistaken. And while her supreme talent might certainly have influenced the strength of the effect on Ulic, the fact that he didn't offer any kind of resistance to it, does still remain.