Superman (Man of Steel) vs HSDKverse

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danteiscool
like title says, Man of Steel Superman takes on History's Strongest Disciple Kenichi all at once.

heat vision and flight not allowed.

how does this go?

Wei Phoenix
no expression

NemeBro
How does Superman's speed match up to Hayato's?

StealthRanger
Supes did fly out of Earth's atmosphere, so perhaps about Mach 32+ ish

NemeBro
So comparable, IIRC.

StealthRanger
Yeah, nowhere near enough to blitz one way or the other

So it comes down to DC and durability

Zack Fair
DC?

StealthRanger
Destructive Capacity. OBD term

danteiscool
yeah, I figured it'd come to that as I made this. so do the HSDK characters have what it takes to KO Supes or vice versa?

Silent Master
Originally posted by StealthRanger
Supes did fly out of Earth's atmosphere, so perhaps about Mach 32+ ish

That's his flight speed, what is his best reaction/reflex speed feat?

danteiscool
well, assuming Zod is capable of flying at comparable speeds in the movie, the fact that Superman and him can naturally fight with one another on even enough footing, I'd say that Superman's reaction/combat speed is at a level comparable to that.

though I could horrifically wrong.

StealthRanger
Originally posted by Silent Master
That's his flight speed, what is his best reaction/reflex speed feat?

>combat speed fallacy

You're doing it wrong, matey

Silent Master
Flight isn't allowed per the OP, that means his flight speed is irrelevant.

StealthRanger
Still doing the combat speed fallacy wrong dur

And besides, if you have flight on that level, common sense you also have reactions on that level, otherwise you couldn't control your movements

Silent Master
Originally posted by StealthRanger
Still doing the combat speed fallacy wrong dur

And besides, if you have flight on that level, common sense you also have reactions on that level, otherwise you couldn't control your movements

Flight speed and reaction speed are two different things.

StealthRanger
No they're not. If you can move that fast you can perceive and react that fast. Otherwise you'd crash into everything and appear invisible to yourself. There is no such thing as "combat speed"

Not ****ing rocket science, matey

Silent Master
Tell that to Jet pilots, they manage to fly at several Mach without hitting anything.

StealthRanger
That's piloting a device, not moving under your own power

Silent Master
They are still moving at that speed without hitting anything. which proves you don't need mach level reactions to travel at that speed.

StealthRanger
>combat speed fallacy

Still doing it wrong

Of course, there is the fact that in fiction characters often fight characters on a more or less similar speed level, which makes the whole "combat speed" debate null and void

Ignoring that, it's also possible for humans to react to supersonic objects from tens to hundreds of meters away anyways

NemeBro
Originally posted by Silent Master
Tell that to Jet pilots, they manage to fly at several Mach without hitting anything. They don't fly through heavily crowded by skyscrapers buildings without hitting them.

Silent Master
Originally posted by NemeBro
They don't fly through heavily crowded by skyscrapers buildings without hitting them.

Do you have any proof that MOS Superman was flying at mulitple mach while doing that?

StealthRanger
Occam's Razor. Unless he's stated to be going at any different speed or holding back, we normally assume they're going at calced/recorded speeds. As to avoid annoying debates otherwise

And we have no reason to believe he wasn't so, yeah

ScreamPaste
It could be argued Superman would move more slowly while avoiding obstacles, not saying that happened, haven't seen MOS, just throwing it out there. stick out tongue

Silent Master
Originally posted by StealthRanger
Occam's Razor. Unless he's stated to be going at any different speed or holding back, we normally assume they're going at calced/recorded speeds. As to avoid annoying debates otherwise

And we have no reason to believe he wasn't so, yeah

IOW, you have zero proof that he was going anywhere near that fast in the scenes in question, you're just going to handwave it.

NemeBro
Originally posted by Silent Master
Do you have any proof that MOS Superman was flying at mulitple mach while doing that? No, I haven't seen the movie.

I was just pointing out how stupid your logic was.

StealthRanger
Originally posted by Silent Master
IOW, you have zero proof that he was going anywhere near that fast in the scenes in question, you're just going to handwave it.

No, just Occam's Razor, he's in the heat of a fight of all things, why would he purposely slow down? Hint: no reason to do so, thus we have no reason to assume he was going slower and so we won't

XanatosForever
Actually, his very character would be a strong reason Superman would purposely slow down.

Then again, MOS pretty much ignored a lot of that anyways, so...yeah.

Silent Master
Originally posted by StealthRanger
No, just Occam's Razor, he's in the heat of a fight of all things, why would he purposely slow down? Hint: no reason to do so, thus we have no reason to assume he was going slower and so we won't

He would also slow down if he didn't have the reaction speed to maneuver around the buildings using his full flight speed.

StealthRanger
Originally posted by Silent Master
He would also slow down if he didn't have the reaction speed to maneuver around the buildings using his full flight speed.

Well the fact he can maneuver around buildings is a positive for his reactions, especially against someone in a fight to the death

BloodRain
Originally posted by StealthRanger
Supes did fly out of Earth's atmosphere, so perhaps about Mach 32+ ish Swear that doesn't include self propelled flight?

StealthRanger
Originally posted by BloodRain
Swear that doesn't include self propelled flight?

Well if you mean fly under his own power, I fail to see what difference would be made, though he did fly around parts of the globe from in space so, HS+ to MHS

BloodRain
Because self propelled things dont need to hit double digit machs to escape earth, only projectiled ones iirc.

AuraAngel
HSDK characters fighting Superman? Will wonders never cease.

danteiscool
what can I say? I thought it'd be an interesting thing to discuss.

BloodRain
What are Supes feats?

danteiscool
well, speedwise, I can't be too exact, but he constantly breaks the sound barrier in the movie, managed to make it from the Indian ocean to somewhere near Metropolis to take down a ship that iirc was at least traveling at Mach 24 at some point or another.

strengthwise, he managed to hold up a part of an oil rig for a minute or two before the floor beneath him gave way, in his fight with Zod, his punches would create shockwaves, and he and Zod probably caused at least several million bucks worth of property damage and I'm in all likelihood drastically understating that money bit.

durabilitywise, well no matter how much he got hit, he seemed to be doing pretty well by the end of the final battle. hell, his costume and hair weren't even out of place despite being smashed through several buildings and going through reentry at one point near the end.

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