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This is not trolling so I ask that nobody come in here with that attitude. I have a question strength vs versatility, the true meaning of a trans character and what defines it. Now first question starting with hulk. Hulk has absolute strength, he can break the laws of the universe with his strength. Lets say a reality manipulater would be ranked higher then hulk. How is the hulk not a equal is can effect reality with his strength, destroy etc. Btw I'm just using the hulk for the sake of my question.

If a reality manipulator traps sbp or hulk or superman they can easily punch out.

I always thought the tiers were supposed to be a mixture of raw power and versatility.

You could have characters with extreme amounts of raw power, but narrowly channelled, in a lower tier to a character with a huge array of powers but not - overall - as powerful when channelled into a form capable of challenging the more 'limited' character.

There are Elders who have more powers than Hulk, but when they use them against Savage Hulk, he shrugs it off and they don't have the juice - the overall power - to compete against his raw power.

Originally posted by mighty adam
If a reality manipulator traps sbp or hulk or superman they can easily punch out.
Hulk has shrugged off matter manipulation on more than one occasion and matter manip is pretty similar to reality warping, imo.

Ok now with that said thors raw power output should put him at skyfather LV.

Originally posted by janus77
Hulk has shrugged off matter manipulation on more than one occasion and matter manip is pretty similar to reality warping, imo. I wouldn't say still yes ita a feat. Hulk cant be beat by drained he has infinite supply of power. I think pre dcun superman couldn't be killed due to sun regeneration. How is hulk not a trans or super they can destroy or effect reality on a universe LV.

Hulk consciously limits his power usage, well Banner does. So he's rarely operating at a high level.

As Green Scar, he's supposed to be orders of magnitude more powerful than Savage Hulk (who is the equal of Thor + Mjolnir, at average levels), and is willing to ramp it up more.

During HOTM he basically out performed Umar in her own dimension and, in most reasonable interpretations of the power-output, he would clearly be more than powerful enough to hang with skyfathers.

Other than Odin, I don't think any other trans or skyfather has a feat as outright powerful as HOTM.

That and the 2000 X BiBeast/Wendigo thing ...

There's also his more recent display of absurd power - shattering and resetting time-paradoxes across Marvel 616.


Still, when holding back heavily - as he usually is - he is the highest of high heralds, imo.

Originally posted by mighty adam
Ok now with that said thors raw power output should put him at skyfather LV.
Nah, raw power-wise, he's definitely high herald. As can be seen by how feeble he is in comparison to Thanos or his general feats. There are other high heralds with more raw power - Hulk, Sentry, Surfer for example.

Versatility-wise, he's one of the most versatile high heralds (Surfer being the most versatile).

His advantage is that he gets a lot of outside amps, in many of his feats, whether gear that amps him or gods that amp him...

Originally posted by janus77
Nah, raw power-wise, he's definitely high herald. As can be seen by how feeble he is in comparison to Thanos or his general feats. There are other high heralds with more raw power - Hulk, Sentry, Surfer for example.

Versatility-wise, he's one of the most versatile high heralds (Surfer being the most versatile).

His advantage is that he gets a lot of outside amps, in many of his feats, whether gear that amps him or gods that amp him... I never thought about it like that.

Originally posted by janus77
Nah, raw power-wise, he's definitely high herald. As can be seen by how feeble he is in comparison to Thanos or his general feats. There are other high heralds with more raw power - Hulk, Sentry, Surfer for example.

Versatility-wise, he's one of the most versatile high heralds (Surfer being the most versatile).

His advantage is that he gets a lot of outside amps, in many of his feats, whether gear that amps him or gods that amp him... http://img.pandawhale.com/87155-eddie-murphy-old-jewish-white-UmV2.gif

So you people are disagreeing that Thor isn't skyfather?

Thor is close to Abstract yo.

Power wise wouldn't doomsday given his evolution ability not be trans LV. Blackbolt with his abilities not be skyfather?

Originally posted by mighty adam
Power wise wouldn't doomsday given his evolution ability not be trans LV. Blackbolt with his abilities not be skyfather? . . . . . . .

Originally posted by ODG
. . . . . . . Originally posted by mighty adam
I never thought about it like that.