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Luna isn't very violent outside of nightmare mode, but I'm not sure Darkrai has the raw power to defeat someone who can take 140 Tsar Bombas to the chest. The pokedex provides no feats for it, is this the anime version?

Nemesis, you make the best f**king threads!

http://images.wikia.com/rwby/images/b/be/RubyxYang.png

That said, I have no idea who would win. I never looked into Gen 4 OR MLP.

(DISCLAIMER: Yes, I'm trying my hand at Yamcha's thing, so don't expect me to be good at it yet.)

Yamcha is trendy as ****.

That said, I can't recall anything from the movie to put Darkrai on Luna's level, and the game doesn't give him much in the way of feats either. mmm

Luna held back the elements of harmony for a moment, even forcing it's power back for just a second. After the beam overcame her it was still strong enough to carry her to the moon at .5 of c, that's more than the total energy of 100 Tsar Bombas going off in kinetic energy alone hitting her straight in the chest, and she remained conscious.

1.8 gigatons of TNT equivalent. To wrap your head around that, here:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/66/Nukecloud.png/800px-Nukecloud.png

haermm

Originally posted by ScreamPaste
Yamcha is trendy as ****.

What can I say? Yamcha's the shit!




This is kinda why I requested your help conducting calcs. haermm

It's true, Yamcha is pretty awesome.

And hah, fair. PM me if you have a specific scene you'd like me to look at, but as I said, I am known for two things.

1. My laziness
And I guess I'll list the rest later.

The movie/anime version is actually the best, and arguably more powerful than MewTwo.

He was able to use his Dark Void as a shield that was capable of surviving levels of power known for erasing things from existence. Not indefinitely, but for an impressive period of time.

I don't even know who Luna is, but I will still favor Darkrai.

Luna is My Little Pony's night goddess who can move celestial bodies with her mind, she's strongly implied to be more powerful than her sister, who has moved the sun faster than light.

She's also a dream walker, which might be why Nemesis put her against Darkrai.

I thought that much as well. Isn't Darkrai sorta the Freddy Kruger of the Poke verse, only he kicks significantly more ass?

If Freddy Kruger was a good guy who couldn't actually control the nightmares he gave people, yes.

Darkrai is a pretty cool guy, though. eh fights gods of time and space and doesn't afraid of anything.

Originally posted by The Scenario
If Freddy Kruger was a good guy who couldn't actually control the nightmares he gave people, yes.

Darkrai is a pretty cool guy, though. eh fights gods of time and space and doesn't afraid of anything.

That's my point. He sounds kinda like a (if only slightly) more uber Shadow the Hedgehog, in the sense that he's more powerful than he can stand. He sounds pretty raw if he's contending with the Creation Trio.

What would I watch to learn of both of these characters?

To be fair, that was the movie versions, not the game versions. The game versions are a completely different animal and Darkrai doesn't seem to have ever encountered them.

They may not have the same feats (assuming the game versions have much in the way of them shrug), but they still seem to be conceptually similar entities. Still need to watch all these.

The level of power the legendaries exhibits between the games and movies is vastly different. MewTwo and Darkrai become more powerful, while the cosmics become infinitely less so. The aforementioned Arceus losing it's plates when struck by a meteor comes to mind.

In the games Palkia and Dialga were capable of creating new universes and had to be chained by gems made from other legendaries.

Pokemon movie 10 for Darkrai.

Luna is scattered throughout the MLP series and doesn't appear very often. Depending on which form you're looking for, she appears as Nightmare Moon in 'Elements of Harmony' (Season 1) parts 1 and 2, and in 'Princess Twilight Sparkle' (season 4) parts 1 and 2. She appears as Luna in 'Luna Eclipsed' (Season 2) and 'Sleepless in Ponyville' (Season 3.)

You can find all of them on youtube.

The Arceus low showing comes off as PIS IMO. Kinda the same way Samus loses all her shit in the first two Prime games as a result of things that essentially would do her no harm. You just said yourself that Darkrai gets more powerful, so I guess there's that.

Thanks for the references, Even. I'll check what I can, when I can. I may have to dip my feet into MLP before I can observe much of it.

Whether or not Palkia and Dialga can create universes in the anime is irrelevant. Their battle still takes place in a parallel dimension and affects the real world by virtue of their power. The entire city the movie takes place in was ripped from its reality by just Palkia, if I recall, and was in danger of being erased from existence because of the battle. Darkrai managed to hold off an entire attack from both Palkia and Dialga at the same time.

Darkrai seemed to have a certain level of interdimensional power as well. Simply hitting a Pokemon with his dark void appeared to separate a Pokemon from its consciousness.

Originally posted by Sacred 117
The Arceus low showing comes off as PIS IMO. Kinda the same way Samus loses all her shit in the first two Prime games as a result of things that essentially would do her no harm. You just said yourself that Darkrai gets more powerful, so I guess there's that.

Thanks for the references, Even. I'll check what I can, when I can. I may have to dip my feet into MLP before I can observe much of it. Not so, he spent the entire movie being definitively ungodlike, lol. This is not just a bag of spilling, the pokegods are not up to their cube level selves in the anime.
Originally posted by MooCowofJustice
Whether or not Palkia and Dialga can create universes in the anime is irrelevant. Their battle still takes place in a parallel dimension and affects the real world by virtue of their power. The entire city the movie takes place in was ripped from its reality by just Palkia, if I recall, and was in danger of being erased from existence because of the battle. Darkrai managed to hold off an entire attack from both Palkia and Dialga at the same time.

Darkrai seemed to have a certain level of interdimensional power as well. Simply hitting a Pokemon with his dark void appeared to separate a Pokemon from its consciousness. It is kind of relevant, since it would prove their power to be above Luna's.

Originally posted by ScreamPaste
It is kind of relevant, since it would prove their power to be above Luna's.

Except it isn't, because their combined power is enough energy to erase matter from existence.

> Luna.

Originally posted by MooCowofJustice
Except it isn't, because their combined power is enough energy to erase matter from existence.

> Luna. They managed to effect a city in total. Luna > Cities.

Luna has erased things from existence before?

She's done so to nightmares, at least.

Not sure how useful that would be here.

Originally posted by MooCowofJustice
Luna has erased things from existence before? Luna can telekinetically move the sun at above light speed, and temporarily hold off the elements of harmony.

It might help her wake up, I suppose. But movie Darkrai didn't focus on his dream based powers anyway.

I suppose now it's just a question of whether or not Luna can wake herself up or defeat Darkrai before she's hit by a Dark Void.

Originally posted by MooCowofJustice
It might help her wake up, I suppose. But movie Darkrai didn't focus on his dream based powers anyway.

I suppose now it's just a question of whether or not Luna can wake herself up or defeat Darkrai before she's hit by a Dark Void. There's a lot more than that on the table.

I really have to doubt that. Considering that matter can't ever be erased and these two managed to literally do the impossible, that at least puts them on par.

Originally posted by MooCowofJustice
I really have to doubt that. Considering that matter can't ever be erased and these two managed to literally do the impossible, that at least puts them on par. Palkia can manipulate space, Dialga can manipulate time, either of them can do that, and in the anime their attacks are sub city level and can be blocked by Darkrai. shrug

Darkrai could be city+ level, continent level, or even planet level and his power would be vastly outstripped here.

Originally posted by ScreamPaste
Palkia can manipulate space, Dialga can manipulate time, either of them can do that, and in the anime their attacks are sub city level and can be blocked by Darkrai. shrug

Darkrai could be city+ level, continent level, or even planet level and his power would be vastly outstripped here.

I fail to see how manipulation of Time and Space is equivalent to erasing matter from existence.

There's also no evidence for sub city level attacks from Palkia or Dialga. You have even admitted that Palkia and Dialga are capable of manipulating Time and Space, yet you won't put Dakrai on their level.

IIRC, Darkrai was able to fight both Dialga and Palkia on even grounds. At his high end levels, he could probably take this, but on average the royal mare wins.

Originally posted by MooCowofJustice
I fail to see how manipulation of Time and Space is equivalent to erasing matter from existence.

There's also no evidence for sub city level attacks from Palkia or Dialga. You have even admitted that Palkia and Dialga are capable of manipulating Time and Space, yet you won't put Dakrai on their level. Because both powersets can be used to do this. In OoT Zelda with the ocarina erased Link from existence, she is not on Luna's level.

Erasing things is a good power, but at the end of the day just having enough firepower is enough, and Luna has that in excess. As i mentioned before, she actually held back the elements of harmony for a moment. They're basically the Friendship Triforce of the setting.

Originally posted by ScreamPaste
Because both powersets can be used to do this. In OoT Zelda with the ocarina erased Link from existence, she is not on Luna's level.

Erasing things is a good power, but at the end of the day just having enough firepower is enough, and Luna has that in excess. As i mentioned before, she actually held back the elements of harmony for a moment. They're basically the Friendship Triforce of the setting.

Zelda played a song to manipulate time to make it so that Link never existed. That's far from expelling an amount of energy to erase something through sheer power.

Okay...so now you're arguing that Luna is superior to Darkrai, because she essentially did the same thing that Darkrai did...

If this was game darkrai we might have a thread but movie darkai is going down.

It's actually the complete opposite. Movie Darkrai is vastly superior to game Darkrai.

Really I thought game version was stronger

Originally posted by MooCowofJustice
Zelda played a song to manipulate time to make it so that Link never existed. That's far from expelling an amount of energy to erase something through sheer power.

Okay...so now you're arguing that Luna is superior to Darkrai, because she essentially did the same thing that Darkrai did... Zelda manipulated time to erase Link, it's not so different from Dialga or Palkia's ability, she just used music.

Darkrai didn't hold back anything like the elements of harmony, that's the thing. Also Luna only managed this for a moment. The movie versions of Palkia and Dialga simply aren't as powerful as they are in game, if they were this wouldn't be a thread. The elements are the most powerful thing in the entire setting, they're the only thing that can take down Discord, a trans level reality warper who casually ****s with Solars systems the way you and I might stir our coffee. haermm

Originally posted by ScreamPaste
Zelda manipulated time to erase Link, it's not so different from Dialga or Palkia's ability, she just used music.

Darkrai didn't hold back anything like the elements of harmony, that's the thing. Also Luna only managed this for a moment. The movie versions of Palkia and Dialga simply aren't as powerful as they are in game, if they were this wouldn't be a thread. The elements are the most powerful thing in the entire setting, they're the only thing that can take down Discord, a trans level reality warper who casually ****s with Solars systems the way you and I might stir our coffee. haermm

Except they did not use time to make it so that something never existed, it was the amount of energy released that simply erased things from existence.

Except he ****ing did. How you can seriously say that I do not know. Elements of harmony? Sounds like something that maintains order and balance in the universe, and allows for all the universe's neat things like friendship. That sounds an awful lot like time and space, the cooperation of which in the Pokemon universe allows for the universe to exist, and also both of which you just admitted could singularly create another universe.

I don't drink coffee.

Darkrai.

Suck it.

Originally posted by MooCowofJustice
Except they did not use time to make it so that something never existed, it was the amount of energy released that simply erased things from existence.

Except he ****ing did. How you can seriously say that I do not know. Elements of harmony? Sounds like something that maintains order and balance in the universe, and allows for all the universe's neat things like friendship. That sounds an awful lot like time and space, the cooperation of which in the Pokemon universe allows for the universe to exist, and also both of which you just admitted could singularly create another universe.

I don't drink coffee. As far as the universe OoT Link was erased from is concerned, the effect is exactly the same.

I'm not sure where you're going with this, Moo. Darkrai held back Palkia and Dialga in the anime, but the anime versions are not as powerful as the game versions. If they were this would be a stomp, the level of power they sit at in the anime, and Arceus along with them, is just far below what the Moon Princess can manage.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Darkrai.

Suck it.
I'll remember this when that drinking competition eventually happens. estahuh

You'll remember to suck it when we're getting drunk?


I'm feeling the Ho Yay awesome

Originally posted by BloodRain
You'll remember to suck it when we're getting drunk?


I'm feeling the Ho Yay awesome
You ****ing suck, dude. haermm

We both know I don't play bottom, you're the one who'll be drunk under the table.

link-rape

Originally posted by ScreamPaste
As far as the universe OoT Link was erased from is concerned, the effect is exactly the same.

I'm not sure where you're going with this, Moo. Darkrai held back Palkia and Dialga in the anime, but the anime versions are not as powerful as the game versions. If they were this would be a stomp, the level of power they sit at in the anime, and Arceus along with them, is just far below what the Moon Princess can manage.

Then that universe should have consulted with the Darkrai movie's universe, because the effect may be the same, but the methods are entirely different. At no point did Dialga manipulate time nor did Palkia manipulate space to erase anything from existence. The erasings were passive consequences of their battle.

And no, they are not far below. Arceus has never been shown at full power, in game or anime. He's been missing something in every appearance.

All right then, Moo, if you feel Dialga or Palkia's anime versions compare to Moon Butt in power, what makes you believe so? I'm just not seeing it, what is it that makes you feel confident they're so powerful?

Full demonstration of the abilities they are stated to have via Pokedex.

Movie representations underplay their vast destructive capability, but is still faithful to their stated levels of ability. The trio still couldn't manage to defeat Arceus, only buy time, which fits with his status. And he still isn't even at full strength. It just all makes sense if you ask me.

So the ability to manipulate time and space, well yeah, but in the anime they never show this kind of power on the level necessary to move say, a star, or even a planet.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=70Nnur4497s&t=51m41s
This is the extent of Arceus power in the anime, in fact he was going to die after this, but was saved. Granted that's not a small meteor.

It falls perfectly in line with city busting+ Palkia and Dialga, though, which is the amount of damage they seemed capable of, and that would be the amount of power Darkrai held off.

Luna is simply far above the scale anime pokes work on. My god horse > your god horse. Huehuehuehue.

You are still ignoring a hell of a lot. Both Palkia and Dialga displayed trans-dimensional travel capabilities, in addition to Palkia's barrier holding out for however long against Arceus in the Arceus movie. And once again the most important factor, the fact that they erased matter from existence as a passive consequence of their battle, the very definition of casually. We're still not talking the use of time or space to do it, we're talking pure energy overload and assault on a specific point completely erasing it from existence. Like how a nuke would wipe a city off of the map, leaving no trace, these two wiped something from reality.

Originally posted by MooCowofJustice
You are still ignoring a hell of a lot. Both Palkia and Dialga displayed trans-dimensional travel capabilities, in addition to Palkia's barrier holding out for however long against Arceus in the Arceus movie. And once again the most important factor, the fact that they erased matter from existence as a passive consequence of their battle, the very definition of casually. We're still not talking the use of time or space to do it, we're talking pure energy overload and assault on a specific point completely erasing it from existence. Like how a nuke would wipe a city off of the map, leaving no trace, these two wiped something from reality. I'm really not ignoring anything, I watched the movie, yeah, Palkia's shield managed to block an attack, but Palkia spent the rest of the battle getting #rekt.

Beings whose primary attacks are time and space related causing things to disappear is not at all different from what I'd expect. Roar of Time and Spacial Rend literally manipulate time and space. Darkrai's shield doesn't have the feats necessary to stand up to Luna's sheer firepower, or the firepower himself to fight back effectively.

His only saving grace against her is that Luna in character isn't exactly filled with blood lust, and will probably find him intriguing. If she gets angry though, Arceus help you.