Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

how this goez?

BA.

(Scans courtesy of BA Respect Thread due to my laziness)

http://img147.imagevenue.com/loc24/th_7f423_spectree.jpg http://img135.imagevenue.com/loc24/th_b9d9d_spectree2.jpg

Awfully similar to what happened to Angrir already...mmm

Adam rips his face off.

Originally posted by Cogito
(Scans courtesy of BA Respect Thread due to my laziness)

http://img147.imagevenue.com/loc24/th_7f423_spectree.jpg http://img135.imagevenue.com/loc24/th_b9d9d_spectree2.jpg

Awfully similar to what happened to Angrir already...mmm

lol somehow i can't quite see adam simply "flying through" ben here.... not that i don't appreciate the parallel.

Eh, Spectre's made out of weird ectoplasmic goo and his durability isn't anything to write home about on some occasions considering he's been riddled by bullets and what not. And in the above scan, he had his face cut open by a spear from Northwind. Of course, Spectre's already dead, so it doesn't matter in the least what kind of damage he takes most of the time as he can just regenerate. Badass feat from Teth, though.

That said, I think if Black Adam was feeling particularly murderous, he could replicate Thor's feat of blowing a hole right through Ben's chest.

I can't see the scans. Is it the Spectre scene? Yea, that's a pretty cool feat for Black Adam. Until you realize that a Feitheran warrior split his cheek open with a spear:
http://s30.postimg.org/iotchlp7x/JSA_2005_074_page_08.jpghttp://s30.postimg.org/bzmt1l3vx/JSA_2005_074_page_09.jpghttp://s30.postimg.org/q7chq8gkt/JSA_2005_074_page_10.jpg

Not entirely sure why Spectre and Eclipso went all Deadpool (Thunderbolt burned his eyes out, Eclipso was stabbed through the head, neck snapped etc. all to no effect) but whatever. Like I said, cool feat but keep it in context as we see Adam fight Hawkman/Captain Marvel/Power Girl in the same story and he wasn't any stronger then usual. Still an elite top tier strong man.

Fun fact: I remember people posting that scan in favor of Black Adam beating Odin. Lol.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
That said, I think if Black Adam was feeling particularly murderous, he could replicate Thor's feat of blowing a hole right through Ben's chest.

Really? Based on what? Legitimately curious. When has Black Adam ever torn through someone on Angrir's level of durability like Mjolnir did?

Yes, he can tear through regular people and meta's like the Teen Titans but Angrir took hits from Rulk (Who's an elite strong man) as well as any brick would. People also seem to forget that he took a Mjolnir throw and bounced right back in that very same issue so it's not like he's any more fragile then other Heralds.

I think Black Adam can win but it would be a brutal fight and he'd have to be smart about taking hits from that hammer.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Fun fact: I remember people posting that scan in favor of Black Adam beating Odin. Lol.

Hah, idiots.

I just brought it up for the parallel, nothing more really.

That said, BA wins.

Black Adam wins after a good fight. Use any of the other Worthys minus the female (can't think of her name right now...working and KMCING at the same time) and Adam would lose. Big time.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Really? Based on what? Legitimately curious. When has Black Adam ever torn through someone on Angrir's level of durability like Mjolnir did?

Yes, he can tear through regular people and meta's like the Teen Titans but Angrir took hits from Rulk (Who's an elite strong man) as well as any brick would. People also seem to forget that he took a Mjolnir throw and bounced right back in that very same issue so it's not like he's any more fragile then other Heralds.

His ferocity and the like. That said, I do think a lot of people do mistakenly think that Teth kills everyone or tries to in every fight he's in, though. What Thor did to Ben was reluctant and somewhat casual (though we do have precendent of Thor being able to break Ben's hands/arms apart when irate). I think Adam wouldn't replicate that feat with the same mindset that Thor did, but if he was to imbue himself with the magical lightning and charge/strike at full speed/power, I think he could perform that task.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
His ferocity and the like. That said, I do think a lot of people do mistakenly think that Teth kills everyone or tries to in every fight he's in, though. What Thor did to Ben was reluctant and somewhat casual (though we do have precendent of Thor being able to break Ben's hands/arms apart when irate). I think Adam wouldn't replicate that feat with the same mindset that Thor did, but if he was to imbue himself with the magical lightning and charge/strike at full speed/power, I think he could perform that task.

Ferocity doesn't mean equate to power. Which unfortunately people so often do with Adam. Just because Mjolnir accomplished something doesn't in anyway mean Tech can as it can simply hit harder.

I disagree strongly. Black Adam is strong but he's still an elite Top Tier strong men and no way can he tear through a peer like that except maybe under the most unique of circumstances. It doesn't help but that he's very prone to fighting under extreme rage and he's never done what you're suggesting. One of the downsides of his rage is that everyone from Sand to Mr. Terrific to Wildcat have taken attacks from a pissed off Black Adam and gotten back up somehow.

During World War Three he broke the ribs of a Green Lantern but he was amped, and they were tackling him physically despite having human durability at base.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Ferocity doesn't mean equate to power. Which unfortunately people so often do with Adam. Just because Mjolnir accomplished something doesn't in anyway mean Tech can as it can simply hit harder.

I disagree strongly. Black Adam is strong but he's still an elite Top Tier strong men and no way can he tear through a peer like that except maybe under the most unique of circumstances. It doesn't help but that he's very prone to fighting under extreme rage and he's never done what you're suggesting. One of the downsides of his rage is that everyone from Sand to Mr. Terrific to Wildcat have taken attacks from a pissed off Black Adam and gotten back up somehow.

During World War Three he broke the ribs of a Green Lantern but he was amped, and they were tackling him physically despite having human durability at base.

Of course not. That said, Mjolnir wasn't even going particularly fast (at least not in terms of how fast it can go) nor was Thor trying exceptionally hard to slay Ben. I don't think Teth = Mjolnir's striking power, but I do think that a moderate Mjolnir return would be able to be replicated by an all out Teth.

A lot of the times, especially when dealing with the JSA, he's restraining himself from slaying them outright because he does respect them in his own way. Sure, he's willing to kill, but he's not out for the kill all the times he fights.

WWIII had some sketchy writing as far as power level depictions go, imo.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Ferocity doesn't mean equate to power. Which unfortunately people so often do with Adam. Just because Mjolnir accomplished something doesn't in anyway mean Tech can as it can simply hit harder.

I disagree strongly. Black Adam is strong but he's still an elite Top Tier strong men and no way can he tear through a peer like that except maybe under the most unique of circumstances. It doesn't help but that he's very prone to fighting under extreme rage and he's never done what you're suggesting. One of the downsides of his rage is that everyone from Sand to Mr. Terrific to Wildcat have taken attacks from a pissed off Black Adam and gotten back up somehow.

During World War Three he broke the ribs of a Green Lantern but he was amped, and they were tackling him physically despite having human durability at base.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Of course not. That said, Mjolnir wasn't even going particularly fast (at least not in terms of how fast it can go) nor was Thor trying exceptionally hard to slay Ben. I don't think Teth = Mjolnir's striking power, but I do think that a moderate Mjolnir return would be able to be replicated by an all out Teth.

A lot of the times, especially when dealing with the JSA, he's restraining himself from slaying them outright because he does respect them in his own way. Sure, he's willing to kill, but he's not out for the kill all the times he fights.

WWIII had some sketchy writing as far as power level depictions go, imo.

How do you know Mjolnir wasn't going particularly fast? But seriously, I don't know why Mjolnir has to be going extremely fast to strike with force beyond Teth? I don't recall any speed measurements given in almost all of it's high end feats.

Based on what though? Teth has never done anything to support tearing through the body of someone like Angrir. As a matter of fact, evidence would suggest that it is in fact not within his capabilities. We saw Ben literally bounce right back from a Mjolnir throw in a way I can't see Heralds replicating (Except maybe Superman/Hulk) and he was completely undamaged by a viscous assault from Rulk. Angrir's lowest showing by far was getting knocked back by an all out blitz from a desperate Spider-Man. When you consider what Spider-Man has done in the past and that this was a random tie-in to a large event, that's not bad at all. And we've seen Hourman drawing blood with a punch from Black Adam and Jay with some super speed punches so not everyone is always invulnerable all the time.

But he is sometimes and we've seen an out for blood Teth elbow Terrific in the face, punch Sand, toss Wildcat and Hourman, punch Hawkman etc.

Yes, World War Three was a pretty horrible depiction for Adam considering he was supposed to be more powerful then ever with Isis' God added to his own. The state he was in after fighting the Great Ten was meh, his face was partially melted off by John, and it was stated that some of the other strongmen like Power Girl and I guess Atom Smasher (Not sure who else would count) were stronger. Which imo is nonsense.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
How do you know Mjolnir wasn't going particularly fast? But seriously, I don't know why Mjolnir has to be going extremely fast to strike with force beyond Teth? I don't recall any speed measurements given in almost all of it's high end feats.

Based on what though? Teth has never done anything to support tearing through someone like Angrir by any means. As a matter of fact, evidence would suggest that it is in fact not within his capabilities. We saw Ben literally bounce right back from a Mjolnir throw in a way I can't see Heralds replicating (Except maybe Superman/Hulk) and he was completely undamaged by a viscous assault from Rulk. Angrir's lowest showing by far was getting knocked back by an all out blitz from a desperate Spider-Man. When you consider what Spider-Man has done in the past and that this was a random tie-in to a large event, that's not bad at all. And we've seen Hourman drawing blood with a punch from Black Adam and Jay with some super speed punches so not everyone is always invulnerable all the time.

But he is sometimes and we've seen an out for blood Teth elbow Terrific in the face, punch Sand, toss Wildcat and Hourman, punch Hawkman etc.

Yes, World War Three was a pretty horrible depiction for Adam considering he was supposed to be more powerful then ever with Isis' God added to his own. He was hurt and bruised from beings he should have stomped, his face was partially melted off by John, and it was stated that some of the other strongmen like Power Girl and I guess Atom Smasher (Not sure who else would count) were stronger.

I just don't think that that feat, while itself being a high end feat considering the fact he literally blew open a hole in Ben's body, was portrayed in the context of being Thor "all out", if that makes sense. The way he did it, reluctantly and almost with a resigned and casual attitude, suggests that, at least under Fraction, he could have fairly easily put down Worthy Ben if he wanted to kill him. Worthy Hulk is obviously another story.

Side note: Even with Aaron's Thor being well written, in character AND powerful, Fraction's Thor still stands out for being bipolar as phuck.

Moving on, I think an extremely pissed/murderous Black Adam might be able to replicate what a high end casual Mjolnir throw did based on the fact that he is an elite powerhouse in his respective universe (and would be if he was in Marvel), and the Power of Shazam can be ridiculously powerful. I don't, however, think Adam can casually beat, let alone, mortally wound Angrir.

Agreed on WWIII.

I view Thor and Adam as being quite similar in overall effectiveness. But Thor's fight versus the worthy was one of his better showings, so I don't think Adam can--on average--replicate that. He can, however, beat just Angrir. But it will be close.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
I just don't think that that feat, while itself being a high end feat considering the fact he literally blew open a hole in Ben's body, was portrayed in the context of being Thor "all out", if that makes sense. The way he did it, reluctantly and almost with a resigned and casual attitude, suggests that, at least under Fraction, he could have fairly easily put down Worthy Ben if he wanted to kill him. Worthy Hulk is obviously another story.

Side note: Even with Aaron's Thor being well written, in character AND powerful, Fraction's Thor still stands out for being bipolar as phuck.

Moving on, I think an extremely pissed/murderous Black Adam might be able to replicate what a high end casual Mjolnir throw did based on the fact that he is an elite powerhouse in his respective universe (and would be if he was in Marvel), and the Power of Shazam can be ridiculously powerful. I don't, however, think Adam can casually beat, let alone, mortally wound Angrir.

Agreed on WWIII.

Well, Fraction's Thor was also stalemating current Silver Surfer while suffering from a grievous wound. Mjolnir also tore through a resurrected Skurge who came off as ridiculously strong. His Thor also one shot incinerated an amped Ulik. What Fraction's Thor can do should not be reflective of what Black Adam can do. That's not a knock on Black Adam, Fraction's Thor was very powerful at times.

Agreed.

I just don't see how that's possible imo. Black Adam at best would knock out Angrir with such an attack; no way is he tearing through him like Mjolnir. And that's a generous assessment because I've seen him ramming into other beings and he did nowhere near the damage you're suggesting to anyone above human level IIRC. Captain Marvel and even Uncle Sam/Atom Smasher have been on the receiving end of a ramming attack.

Lol black adam would punch through him

hm, gotta say i'm a little surprised at the one-sided voting. i figured this was pretty dern even. rulk got his shite pushed in. adam isn't much if any stronger. he's def got speed on his side. if he has to go just h2h like rulk, i think this is a dead heat. if he brings the lightning to bear, i'd be very interested in seeing what his hammer could do to defend against it. i absolutely, in no way, could see adam tearing a hole through him. i'm a little surprised at that stance. i have a better idea why rage defended angrir so stridently in that ww thread--dude doesn't get much respect. lol

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus



Really? Based on what? Legitimately curious. When has Black Adam ever torn through someone on Angrir's level of durability like Mjolnir did?

Yes, he can tear through regular people and meta's like the Teen Titans but Angrir took hits from Rulk (Who's an elite strong man) as well as any brick would. People also seem to forget that he took a Mjolnir throw and bounced right back in that very same issue so it's not like he's any more fragile then other Heralds.

I think Black Adam can win but it would be a brutal fight and he'd have to be smart about taking hits from that hammer.

The fact that it blew through Angrir proves his durability isn't that great. Looking at Thor's history of feats and showings suggest this. Rulk at the time is inconsisent as had WM million dollar dream him. So I wouldn't weight his fight with him very much. Also, it can be debated that the previous Mjolnir hit was more of a glancing blow.

Bottomline: Thor has never and can not blow Mjolnir through any high herald level being.

Finally, BA would win in a forum fight rather easily due to speed. In a comic, it would be a closer fight though.

So BA rips his heart out with ease.

P.S. why pick Thor to have a high showing vs. Angrir to have a low showing in durability?

Originally posted by leonidas
hm, gotta say i'm a little surprised at the one-sided voting. i figured this was pretty dern even. rulk got his shite pushed in. adam isn't much if any stronger. he's def got speed on his side. if he has to go just h2h like rulk, i think this is a dead heat. if he brings the lightning to bear, i'd be very interested in seeing what his hammer could do to defend against it. i absolutely, in no way, could see adam tearing a hole through him. i'm a little surprised at that stance. i have a better idea why rage defended angrir so stridently in that ww thread--dude doesn't get much respect. lol I view BA as a lot stronger than Angrir. Remember Angrir was using a hammer vs. Rulk's fists for the most part. I'm sure those hammer hits are magnitudes more powerful than the fist. Anyway BA has speed and mobility on his side which makes the strength argument moot. In a forum setting BA would win 10/10 due to this advantage alone.

Originally posted by h1a8
I view BA as a lot stronger than Angrir. Remember Angrir was using a hammer vs. Rulk's fists for the most part. I'm sure those hammer hits are magnitudes more powerful than the fist. Anyway BA has speed and mobility on his side which makes the strength argument moot. In a forum setting BA would win 10/10 due to this advantage alone.
Post Crisis/Pre DCNu BA has the strength, durability, AND combat speed advantage over Angrir.

No he doesn't.

Originally posted by h1a8
The fact that it blew through Angrir proves his durability isn't that great. Looking at Thor's history of feats and showings suggest this. Rulk at the time is inconsisent as had WM million dollar dream him. So I wouldn't weight his fight with him very much. Also, it can be debated that the previous Mjolnir hit was more of a glancing blow.

Bottomline: Thor has never and can not blow Mjolnir through any high herald level being.

Finally, BA would win in a forum fight rather easily due to speed. In a comic, it would be a closer fight though.

So BA rips his heart out with ease.

P.S. why pick Thor to have a high showing vs. Angrir to have a low showing in durability?

Like I said, Thor's high end feats are far and away above Black Adam's. Mjolnir did greater things then plowing through Angrir under Fraction.

What are you talking about? The Wonder Man scene was a while after the Angrir fight and Rulk was firmly established as easily being an elite top tier brick in his first Avengers arc with the Infinity Gems (Right before Fear Itself IIRC). Fyi, that wasn't a low showing for Rulk, it was a ridiculous showing for Wonder Man. I'm guessing Simon was on his way to being the next crazy powerful Bendis Avenger, following in the steps of Wanda and Sentry.

Lol. So anytime Thor has a high end feat it automatically means that the character was jobbing? Smh. Mjolnir one shot disintegrated an amped Ulik under Fraction. Black Adam can't replicate anywhere close to that power either.

Thor HAS blown through a herald level being as indicated by what he did to Angrir. Get over it.

Hahaha gtfo with that nonsense.

Originally posted by leonidas
hm, gotta say i'm a little surprised at the one-sided voting. i figured this was pretty dern even. rulk got his shite pushed in. adam isn't much if any stronger. he's def got speed on his side. if he has to go just h2h like rulk, i think this is a dead heat. if he brings the lightning to bear, i'd be very interested in seeing what his hammer could do to defend against it. i absolutely, in no way, could see adam tearing a hole through him. i'm a little surprised at that stance. i have a better idea why rage defended angrir so stridently in that ww thread--dude doesn't get much respect. lol

Yeah, Rulk is easily on Black Adam's strength level but somehow Adam is going to stomp Angrir and tear through him as indicated by all the times he tore through regular humans and low metas. He once tore the head off an Amazo I think but those things inherently fluctuate depending on the model. It'd be like me pointing to Angrir one-shotting Dragon Man who back in the day could trade blows with the Hulk and Hercules. It ignores common sense. Not to mention it's a robot. For example: Wally and Hal both impaled an Amazo that was beating up the League relatively easily and no way could they do that to Wonder Woman, much less to someone stacking the powers of the Justice League.

Is black adam going to be written by Jeff Parker too who had everyone stomp Rulk's ass for like a dozen issues straight? Beating him is as impressive as beating a random jobber.

Mjolnir going through Angrir's chest was about as horrible as one could get as far as writing is concerned. Ben has been hit in the chest by Mjolnir in the past and it just knocked him down. But, when he is turned into a High Herald; it goes right through him. I call B.S.

Angrir destroys BA because he's angririer

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Like I said, Thor's high end feats are far and away above Black Adam's. Mjolnir did greater things then plowing through Angrir under Fraction.

What are you talking about? The Wonder Man scene was a while after the Angrir fight and Rulk was firmly established as easily being an elite top tier brick in his first Avengers arc with the Infinity Gems (Right before Fear Itself IIRC). Fyi, that wasn't a low showing for Rulk, it was a ridiculous showing for Wonder Man. I'm guessing Simon was on his way to being the next crazy powerful Bendis Avenger, following in the steps of Wanda and Sentry.

Lol. So anytime Thor has a high end feat it automatically means that the character was jobbing? Smh. Mjolnir one shot disintegrated an amped Ulik under Fraction. Black Adam can't replicate anywhere close to that power either.

Thor HAS blown through a herald level being as indicated by what he did to Angrir. Get over it.

Hahaha gtfo with that nonsense. Mjolnir going through a high herald means either
1. It was a high showing for Thor
or
2. It was a low showing for the high herald

I'm arguing 2. since going by history we know Thor can't do that to high heralds. Even when he is trying to kill.
Other so called high end showings from Thor could be easily seen as a low end showing from the higher being. We just can't pick and choose. But weigh his history in on it.

Mjolnir is not going through Nul, Silver Surfer, or even Thor himself, etc. That's just plain ridiculousness. What are current Rulk's strength feats or his feats around Fear itself?

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Yeah, Rulk is easily on Black Adam's strength level but somehow Adam is going to stomp Angrir and tear through him as indicated by all the times he tore through regular humans and low metas. He once tore the head off an Amazo I think but those things inherently fluctuate depending on the model. It'd be like me pointing to Angrir one-shotting Dragon Man who back in the day could trade blows with the Hulk and Hercules. It ignores common sense. Not to mention it's a robot. For example: Wally and Hal both impaled an Amazo that was beating up the League relatively easily and no way could they do that to Wonder Woman, much less to someone stacking the powers of the Justice League.

Remember Angrir was using a hammer vs. Rulk's fists for the most part. I'm sure those hammer hits are magnitudes more powerful than the fist. Anyway BA has speed and mobility on his side which makes the strength argument moot. In a forum setting BA would win 10/10 due to this advantage alone.