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who wins?

Pre reboot or DCNU?

Bill in either.

Pre reboot.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Bill in either. Why?

Pre reboot Diana wins

Originally posted by Drakon09
Why? More ruthless, more powerful, etc.

Split

Originally posted by quanchi112
More ruthless, more powerful, etc. Prove it.

Originally posted by Drakon09
Prove it. I am not posting images so take it or leave it.

Bill.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I am not posting images so take it or leave it. Ill leave it, your comments don't count.

Maybe a slight edge to Bill against preboot Diana, 10/10 against DCnU Diana

Originally posted by pym-ftw
Bill. any particular reason?

Versatility and viciousness

& Diana sucks currently

I think pre reboot Diana doesn't suck. Not her best but not all that bad.

Bill is legitimately a high Herald, Diana isn't.

I thought current BRB was a mid herald.

Is he? I remember people placing him on the mid-herald tier. When did we put him on HH? Although I'm not saying he shouldn't.

BTW I think its a very solid matchup with Diana having the speed, skill and a couple of tools to contend with Bill's raw power and versatility. True Bill can be vicious, but IMHO so can Diana. She is not Superman.

He's always been Thor's near equal.

Yeah, but that doesn't really make him HH.

BTW I think this crossover should happen. Would be cool to see their interactions. Specially with the similarity to Sif.

WW, especially with her haxx weaponry.

Originally posted by Drakon09
Ill leave it, your comments don't count. Well, not my problem you're begging for me to educate you.

Originally posted by pym-ftw
Bill is legitimately a high Herald, Diana isn't.



No, classic Diana really is.

High herald durability, strength, and speed, even without equipment.
Claiming otherwise is unfair. She's repeatedly proven herself in the weight class of Supes, Captain Marvel, MM, and the like.

She is in Supes weight class like Wonderman is in Thor's. She has looked good against Billy but again Superman's bad habit of beating everyone and only losing kinda makes it hard to put anyone in his category.

Don't get me started on wasted potential incarnate, the Martian Manjobber.

Originally posted by pym-ftw
She is in Supes weight class like Wonderman is in Thor's. She has looked good against Billy but again Superman's bad habit of beating everyone and only losing kinda makes it hard to put anyone in his category.


She's definitely closer than WM is to Thor.


Sacrifice, she did quite well in the grounded portion and ended the fight with a throat cut. For Tomorrow, stalemate with Superman. War of the Gods, shown to be on a level with Captain Marvel. Then there's the time when she fought Doomsdayified Superman under Circe's enchantment and won with a lasso tie after a sustained fight (Silver Swan stole her lasso so she had to get it back). And while that's not normal Superman... 'someone with the power of superman only more muscular and armored' is pretty clearly HH in power ^^


And since you bring up Martian Manjobber, in Doomsday War, Doomsday easily one-shotted MM, and trashed Orion with only somewhat more effort, then Wonder Woman went toe to toe with him and took four shots just fine, before DD won by using brains (as in, it was secretly brainiac so he tied her up). Of the three, only Wonder Woman was able to put up a good fight.

She also solidly beats Power Girl, a solid Mid Herald.


Solidly beats Achilles, who in turn beats Eradicator, a mid-herald.


Beats Barda, a mid herald.

Beat Zolomon-Zoom, a High Herald.

Beat Genocide, a high-herald to arguably trans (trashed a JLA team with two heralds in it).

Killed the god Phobos (I think- might've been Deimos. Perez run. Tiara decap), and like many gods he was herald level.


Or, long story short, classic WW beats Mid-Heralds by a margin fairly often, has good fights against High Heralds, and when faced with a physical trans, put up a much better fight than two other notable heralds.


On the flip side....





Current Diana did lose most of her versatility. Bracers are not as unbreakable, nor do they produce lightning, she doesn't have the killy tiara, and nor do I think her hand to hand feats are as impressive.

She can go 'god mode' by removing the bracers, but on the flip side that lowers her defense.


So, yea, I'm with you that nu52 Diana is less impressive than old.

Originally posted by Q99
She's definitely closer than WM is to Thor.


Sacrifice, she did quite well in the grounded portion and ended the fight with a throat cut. For Tomorrow, stalemate with Superman. War of the Gods, shown to be on a level with Captain Marvel. Then there's the time when she fought Doomsdayified Superman under Circe's enchantment and won with a lasso tie after a sustained fight (Silver Swan stole her lasso so she had to get it back). And while that's not normal Superman... 'someone with the power of superman only more muscular and armored' is pretty clearly HH in power ^^


And since you bring up Martian Manjobber, in Doomsday War, Doomsday easily one-shotted MM, and trashed Orion with only somewhat more effort, then Wonder Woman went toe to toe with him and took four shots just fine, before DD won by using brains (as in, it was secretly brainiac so he tied her up). Of the three, only Wonder Woman was able to put up a good fight.

She also solidly beats Power Girl, a solid Mid Herald.


Solidly beats Achilles, who in turn beats Eradicator, a mid-herald.


Beats Barda, a mid herald.

Beat Zolomon-Zoom, a High Herald.

Beat Genocide, a high-herald to arguably trans (trashed a JLA team with two heralds in it).

Killed the god Phobos (I think- might've been Deimos. Perez run. Tiara decap), and like many gods he was herald level.


Or, long story short, classic WW beats Mid-Heralds by a margin fairly often, has good fights against High Heralds, and when faced with a physical trans, put up a much better fight than two other notable heralds.


On the flip side....





Current Diana did lose most of her versatility. Bracers are not as unbreakable, nor do they produce lightning, she doesn't have the killy tiara, and nor do I think her hand to hand feats are as impressive.

She can go 'god mode' by removing the bracers, but on the flip side that lowers her defense.


So, yea, I'm with you that nu52 Diana is less impressive than old.

Didn't Diana also fight an enraged Daxamite?

Been done a million times.
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f77/t569050.html

Both are not high heralds. Wonder Woman has too much of a terrible record against mid heralds like Etrigan, J'onn, White Martians, Power Girl etc to be a high herald.

Diana gets Raped hard, Right after Bruce Rapes her as well in a different perspective

Originally posted by abhilegend
Both are not high heralds. Wonder Woman has too much of a terrible record against mid heralds like Etrigan, J'onn, White Martians, Power Girl etc to be a high herald.

Power Girl- Took her out when Wondy was poisoned, lost cleanly strait-up.

And J'onn's done well against High Heralds. Heck, so has Etrigan, iirc punching Superman to the moon once. White Martians got her from behind, and they took out every member of the JLA, and she's also trashed White martians strait up.

Mid and High herald are only one step apart, mid heralds occasionally doing well against a High is not rare and hardly a disqualification for the level.

Diana most of the time beats mids, but is threatened by them, and most of the time stalemates/does pretty well against highs, and has a number of good showings against Trans levels. Seems pretty clear to me.

I don't use abc logic of who beat who. Diana has the speed, defenses, and skill to defend against any attack from brb. She has the hax weaponry to outright one shot.

Given only speed and the lasso then she wins a majority

Originally posted by Q99
Power Girl- Took her out when Wondy was poisoned, lost cleanly strait-up. And then caught her punch straight up. PG was mindcontrolled when Diana got her in a full nelson, she wasn't beaten or anything.

Really? Post one high herald fight for him. He was amped there. Superman has casually owned him three times. This again? How many times are you going to repeat this lie? She got oneshotted by trionix and none of JLA sans Arthur were beaten.

No, that's not what a mid/high herald definition is.

Correction, she gets beaten by mids. Etrigan alone has a record of 3-1 against her, martians have 5-1 and so on. She isn't a high herald. Deal with it.

Whether or not she is a high herald is irrelevant to who wins in a forum fight.
She can simply lasso brb. This alone proves she will win.

Again, while poisoned.



No, she had her emotions controlled, same difference. Being made to think Diana had turned evil is not the same as a telepath puppeting her, she was still using her normal fighting skills, and still hit Diana with some full-power hits.


It's also funny how you think poison doesn't negatively affect strength, but being enraged does.




And they captured Superman, and she beat one strait-up later to boot, and she'd already clobbered Fluxus.

You stop lying ^^




Oh wow, so doing better than mids, around even with highs, and putting up fights against trans doesn't count?

No wonder you don't rate her as high, you obviously have your own, 'unique' definitions of what it is.



We all know how you love to under-sell her and ignore any parts of fights that don't indicate otherwise. It's so transparent a bias it's hardly worth mentioning.

Oh yea, left out a part: Tronix only zapped her when she looked to see the defeated Arthur, and the shot was literally shown hitting her *in the back*.

So when I say Tronix got her from behind... I am being entirely literal.


And the martians also off-panel beat Kyle and Flash....

But hey, keep leaving things out of fights.



Justice League International, first story, beats Captain Marvel (under Grey man's influence) in a slug fest.

Originally posted by Q99
White Martians got her from behind

Heh.

Originally posted by Martian_mind
Heh.

Ok, I walked into that one ^^

Originally posted by Q99
Again, while poisoned. Nope, diana had recovered at that time.



She was still mentally controlled and all wonder woman did was free her from it. She didn't beat her by KO or something. Restraining PG isn't some big feat anyway, supergirl and J'onn have both done it.


And where did I say she was affected by poison when she attacked PG at fortress?




By tricking him. Never did. All she did was hold her while she got unconscious by asphyxiation. Just punched him away. Kyle oneshotted the same Fluxus.

Hahahahaha.




The fact is she doesn't. She looks like an underdog against every high herald and sometimes even mid heralds.

Nah, I look at what she has done, not what she "should" be capable of. No high herald would need intervention to save himself from ****ing etrigan. She needed help twice.



Hahahaha, its just so cute now.

Did she? I thought she hit her in her side while Wonder Woman was peeking for Arthur. Oh well, look how well she does when she sees it coming.

http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u131/jason-todd/Jimscomics101.jpg

http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u131/jason-todd/Jimscomics102.jpg



She didn't fare any better when she actually blocked MV from malefic.


J'onn did. Martians were not even awake when J'onn took the form of Fluxus and took both of them out.

Like you are doing right below?


By a total suckershot. Before that Cap beat the shit out of him.

http://s167.photobucket.com/albums/u131/jason-todd/?action=view&current=Jimscomics232.jpg
http://s167.photobucket.com/albums/u131/jason-todd/?action=view&current=Jimscomics233.jpg
http://s167.photobucket.com/albums/u131/jason-todd/?action=view&current=Jimscomics234.jpg
http://s167.photobucket.com/albums/u131/jason-todd/?action=view&current=Jimscomics235.jpg
http://s167.photobucket.com/albums/u131/jason-todd/?action=view&current=Jimscomics236.jpg

But hey, I'm the one leaving out details, right? Cap beat Wonder Woman, J'onn, Kyle, Wally and Guy together in Underworld Unleashed.

mmm

BRB.

I don't consider either to be high herald, personally, and as far as this fight goes, I'm not entirely sure who would win.

My gut says Diana, but I see a split as being a more likely outcome.

Originally posted by -Pr-
I don't consider either to be high herald............
My gut says Diana
WTH?!

BRB is a legit high herald and confirmed planet buster. If he lets loose, they'd be peeling pieces of Diana off the pavement.

Originally posted by zopzop
WTH?!

BRB is a legit high herald No hes not.

Originally posted by Drakon09
No hes not.
Yeah, he is :
http://s23.postimg.org/zd97eul6v/brb_strike1.jpg http://s23.postimg.org/9izep2l6v/brb_strike2.jpg

Being planet buster doesn't make you high herald.

Originally posted by Drakon09
Being planet buster doesn't make you high herald.
The planet was just the warm up. It was Stardust getting owned that was the main event.

PS where is Diana's planet busting feat?

Originally posted by zopzop
WTH?!

BRB is a legit high herald and confirmed planet buster. If he lets loose, they'd be peeling pieces of Diana off the pavement.



He also damaged Galactus, straight up owned Stardust. Fought a being that was devistating the universe and straight up tanked 3 planets exploding on him during that run. That doesn't include him swimming in a star.

Originally posted by carver9


He also damaged Galactus, straight up owned Stardust. Fought a being that was devistating the universe and straight up tanked 3 planets exploding on him during that run. That doesn't include him swimming in a star.


Preach it brother Carver!

Yeah, I usually agree with Pr. but I can't see the argument for Bill not being a high Herald when guys like Nova Prime & Quasar are regularly considered HH.

If we are reserving High Herald for Superman, Hulk, Doctors Strange and Fate, then sure--BRB isn't high herald.

But Thor/BRB have typically been considered high herald on most boards, even if some guys in the category are even more powerful.

I think this fight is pretty even, btw. 50/50 ish.

Originally posted by -Pr-
My gut says Diana

She still hasn't made those sandwiches for you?

Originally posted by zopzop
WTH?!

BRB is a legit high herald and confirmed planet buster. If he lets loose, they'd be peeling pieces of Diana off the pavement.

Just because I said I don't consider him high herald, doesn't mean I don't leave room for the argument that he is.

Your lowballing of Diana, though, discourages me from explaining any more. Even if he was/is a high herald, he wouldn't have an easy time beating her. At all.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
She still hasn't made those sandwiches for you?

I don't like sandwiches.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Just because I said I don't consider him high herald, doesn't mean I don't leave room for the argument that he is.

Your lowballing of Diana, though, discourages me from explaining any more. Even if he was/is a high herald, he wouldn't have an easy time beating her. At all.



I don't like sandwiches.

You don't like it when women do what God put them on this Earth to make aside from babies? Hand over your Man-Card, I'm taking away your status.

Lol.

Originally posted by Delta1938
You don't like it when women do what God put them on this Earth to make aside from babies? Hand over your Man-Card, I'm taking away your status.



Sexism aside, I never said that.

Pre-reboot- Bill takes it maybe 6-7/10
New52- Diana tries to block his punch and gets her arms broken

Originally posted by -Pr-


Sexism aside, I never said that.

It's not sexism if it's true.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc1/t1/s720x720/12743_546346158716213_484784380_n.jpg

Look what backs me up.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc1/308820_551206461563516_845342658_n.jpg

Delta for president.

Originally posted by Delta1938
It's not sexism if it's true.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc1/t1/s720x720/12743_546346158716213_484784380_n.jpg

Look what backs me up.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc1/308820_551206461563516_845342658_n.jpg

I still don't like sandwiches.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Just because I said I don't consider him high herald, doesn't mean I don't leave room for the argument that he is.

Your lowballing of Diana, though, discourages me from explaining any more. Even if he was/is a high herald, he wouldn't have an easy time beating her. At all.



Who's lowballing? Notice I said "if he lets loose" she'd be paste. This is true because she would be.

Originally posted by -Pr-
I still don't like sandwiches.

Well disliking sandwiches doesn't mean one cannot produce them. And since I took your Man-Card away, go make us all some sweetie.

Originally posted by zopzop
Who's lowballing? Notice I said "if he lets loose" she'd be paste. This is true because she would be.

I disagree, assuming we're talking about preboot Diana. And, I consider it lowballing to say she couldn't compete with him.

Originally posted by Delta1938
Well disliking sandwiches doesn't mean one cannot produce them. And since I took your Man-Card away, go make us all some sweetie.

Banning for you.

Originally posted by -Pr-
I disagree, assuming we're talking about preboot Diana. And, I consider it lowballing to say she couldn't compete with him.



Banning for you.

aw Shucks, ruin my fun.

Originally posted by -Pr-
I disagree, assuming we're talking about preboot Diana. And, I consider it lowballing to say she couldn't compete with him.

Again, I didn't say she couldn't compete with him. I say if he lets loose she dies. Just like any mid herald going up against a high herald.

Originally posted by Delta1938
aw Shucks, ruin my fun.

I live to please.

Originally posted by zopzop
Again, I didn't say she couldn't compete with him. I say if he lets loose she dies. Just like any mid herald going up against a high herald.

You think he has another gear he can hit that puts him out of her league; I don't, hence my thinking it's lowballing.

I'm not calling you a **** or anything, so it's not like I'm attacking you.

LoL zop.

Originally posted by -Pr-
I live to please.

I don't see any sandwiches or hiring strippers passing-out tacos. Pr, you lied to me.

Originally posted by -Pr-
I don't like sandwiches. Originally posted by -Pr-
I still don't like sandwiches. reported for lowballing sandwiches

Originally posted by pym-ftw
reported for lowballing sandwiches

Reported.....for reporting the truth!!

Originally posted by -Pr-

You think he has another gear he can hit that puts him out of her league; I don't, hence my thinking it's lowballing.

I'm not calling you a **** or anything, so it's not like I'm attacking you.
He does, as evidenced by God Hunter. His power output dwarfs hers and his defense is easily on par with hers. And it's not like he can't take a hit. His physical stats + Stormbreaker are too much for Diana to overcome.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Been done a million times.
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f77/t569050.html
Seriously though... I think it's time for a merge.

April 2011 - http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=548746&pagenumber=1

June 2012 - http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=566730&pagenumber=1

August 2012 - http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=569050&pagenumber=1

Didnt ww block the godwave with her braclets?

Originally posted by Golgo13
Didnt ww block the godwave with her braclets?
Why asking a question u know the answer to?

Own ure statement Prep dude. Own it!!!
pissed

I dont remember if it was a myth or not, but if she did i can see her blocking stormbreaker.

Originally posted by Golgo13
I dont remember if it was a myth or not, but if she did i can see her blocking stormbreaker.
Block what?

Originally posted by zopzop
He does, as evidenced by God Hunter. His power output dwarfs hers and his defense is easily on par with hers. And it's not like he can't take a hit. His physical stats + Stormbreaker are too much for Diana to overcome.

I just don't agree, tbh. shrug

Originally posted by zopzop
He does, as evidenced by God Hunter. His power output dwarfs hers and his defense is easily on par with hers. And it's not like he can't take a hit. His physical stats + Stormbreaker are too much for Diana to overcome.

Come one now. She is far faster than him in combat speed. She can lasso him and it be over with. So how would she be dead then?


And she is arguably stronger than him. What if she gets in close quarters? She would demolish him in close quarters. She is far faster and more skilled.

I must be the only one who doesn't see much of a difference between most characters before and after flashpoint in reference to power level....I mean based on what little there is to go off of.

Originally posted by zopzop
He does, as evidenced by God Hunter. His power output dwarfs hers and his defense is easily on par with hers. And it's not like he can't take a hit. His physical stats + Stormbreaker are too much for Diana to overcome.
Really? That's why Surfer dropped him to his knees with two punches and a board to the back and said that he stands no chance against surfer at all?

Originally posted by abhilegend
Really? That's why Surfer dropped him to his knees with two punches and a board to the back and said that he stands no chance against surfer at all?
At least BRB doesn't have to hide behind Stormbreaker to deal with measly bullets.

Originally posted by zopzop
At least BRB doesn't have to hide behind Stormbreaker to deal with measly bullets.

Has Bill ever been shot with bullets? Serious question.

Originally posted by zopzop
At least BRB doesn't have to hide behind Stormbreaker to deal with measly bullets.
So does Bill's equal thor.

Brb = Thor << Superman <<<<< Batman. Everyone knows this.

Originally posted by zopzop
At least BRB doesn't have to hide behind Stormbreaker to deal with measly bullets.

I remember when that particular poster was arguing Surfer's fight against Bill wasn't indicative of his true capabilities because he had just fought Stardust and even had a planet blow up in his face.

Funny how perspectives change so quickly.