Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

Everyone always said that it has only been city level and that Bleach hasn't shown anything more impressive visually than that. But in actuality it is country level.

Las Noches takes 3 days to cross. That makes it the size of texas which is the size of a small country.

Lanza dwarfed that so that makes it country level.

And Renji and Ichigo move far faster than humans. I f it took them 3 days then that means it is even larger than texas.

The authors don't take calculations into consideration. So no.

Originally posted by HST Gambit

Las Noches takes 3 days to cross. That makes it the size of texas which is the size of a small country. lol

Originally posted by TheTyrant
The authors don't take calculations into consideration. So no.

What?

Originally posted by NemeBro
lol

Ur just mad because you can't debunk so you can stop acting like it isn't plausible.

Except Lanza didn't cross all of las noches or even hueco mundo. The explosion was smaller than Hueco mundo anyway, and was at most a small village buster.

Originally posted by HST Gambit
First of all Nel's statement should be taken as fact since she was right when she gave information on both Aizen and The espada. She wouldn't lie.

Sure, except for the fact that doing so is ridiculous.

Everyone and his cousin got to the geographic center of Las Noches within a day of having breached the outer walls and that was with everyone having major fights and getting beat up to all hell.

Therefore, Nel is full of shit. Somehow, that's not all that surprising.

Originally posted by Estrecca
Sure, except for the fact that doing so is ridiculous.

Everyone and his cousin got to the geographic center of Las Noches within a day of having breached the outer walls and that was with everyone having major fights and getting beat up to all hell.

Therefore, Nel is full of shit. Somehow, that's not all that surprising.

That was because they were using their superhuman speeds, and not simply peak human walking speeds.

Ichigo and Grimmjow flew off at hypersonic+ speeds to take the fight away. And Ichigo again flew at his top speed for an unknown amount of time, to reach the center to fight Ulquiorra.

Assuming a speed Mach 20 and the flight even as small as 5 minutes, the distance they can cross in this time will be over 2000 km.
But half of LN is only 90 km at a low end using calcs.

lol

I'm pretty sure it would take longer than three days to walk from one side of Texas to another.

edit- It would take the average person 27 days to walk across Texas at its thinnest point.

Originally posted by Tzeentch
I'm pretty sure it would take longer than three days to walk from one side of Texas to another.

edit- It would take the average person 27 days to walk across Texas at its thinnest point.

Source?

And then what would take 3 days of walking to cross?

Oh wait but you are clearly wrong see

It all depends on which gate they started at... Average walking distance (you can’t prove they would WALK faster than average) would be around 215 miles in 72 hours. Then you have to deduct roughly 18 hours for sleep. (assuming they only got about 6 hours a day) And a little over an hour a day for breaks and whatnot (just to be fair) and you’d come up with around 50 hours for walking. According to Google Maps, you can walk 150 miles in 50 hours. That’s roughly 3 miles per hour.

Now, if I recall correctly, they were on the corner of Los Noches when Neil pointed and said the closest gate is that way. We’ll just assume for consistency that there would be a gate in the middle of each wall. (you really don’t want there to be more than one gate because it really just makes it much larger) She’d be pointing to the short end of Los Noches and basically saying the middle of the wall is 150 miles that way. So you have 300 miles for the total length of the short side.

Just judging by this panel, Los Noches' long side is at least 3 times longer than the short. So basically the long side is around 900 miles.

Giving you a square footage of roughly 270,000 miles. Or roughly 434,000 km. So basically the size of Texas. Even if you cut down drastically... Giving them only 25 hours of walking instead of 50, it’s still half the size of Texas. You’re looking at a huge structure no matter how you slice it.

Can someone just shut this guy up already? He won't stop unless someone crushes him.

@ Rikudo sennin: I don't see the point. Don't feed the troll. Anyone that's stupid enough to believe that LN is half the size of Texas is obviously a troll.

@ HST Gambit: Except they rode on a giant worm thing for most of the way, so you can't gather an actual distance OR time frame. It's eternal night, so... you're dumb.

Las Noches is big, but definitely no bigger than the leaf village at best, considering the giant sand guy was actually comparable in size to it. Not to mention that you can calc from how big Ulquiorra was in comparison to the pillars that it's only about town sized AT THE MOST. It's actually pretty small for a castle, and you to say it's half the size of Texas makes you look... dumb.

If anyone's clearly wrong, it's obviously you.

Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
@ Rikudo sennin: I don't see the point. Don't feed the troll. Anyone that's stupid enough to believe that LN is half the size of Texas is obviously a troll.

@ HST Gambit: Except they rode on a giant worm thing for most of the way, so you can't gather an actual distance OR time frame. It's eternal night, so... you're dumb.

Las Noches is big, but definitely no bigger than the leaf village at best, considering the giant sand guy was actually comparable in size to it. Not to mention that you can calc from how big Ulquiorra was in comparison to the pillars that it's only about town sized AT THE MOST. It's actually pretty small for a castle, and you to say it's half the size of Texas makes you look... dumb.

If anyone's clearly wrong, it's obviously you.

nel stated is took 3 days of walking to get from point a to point b.

she didnt say how fast, or taking breaks, or any other factors in fact.
what is another fact is that shinigamis are far above the average human.

if people is gonna say excuses like, taking breaks or the speed, or any other obstacles that slows the the time from point a to point b, thats a assumption.

Originally posted by HST Gambit
Oh wait but you are clearly wrong see

It all depends on which gate they started at... Average walking distance (you can’t prove they would WALK faster than average) would be around 215 miles in 72 hours. Then you have to deduct roughly 18 hours for sleep. (assuming they only got about 6 hours a day) And a little over an hour a day for breaks and whatnot (just to be fair) and you’d come up with around 50 hours for walking. According to Google Maps, you can walk 150 miles in 50 hours. That’s roughly 3 miles per hour.

Now, if I recall correctly, they were on the corner of Los Noches when Neil pointed and said the closest gate is that way. We’ll just assume for consistency that there would be a gate in the middle of each wall. (you really don’t want there to be more than one gate because it really just makes it much larger) She’d be pointing to the short end of Los Noches and basically saying the middle of the wall is 150 miles that way. So you have 300 miles for the total length of the short side.

Just judging by this panel, Los Noches' long side is at least 3 times longer than the short. So basically the long side is around 900 miles.

Giving you a square footage of roughly 270,000 miles. Or roughly 434,000 km. So basically the size of Texas. Even if you cut down drastically... Giving them only 25 hours of walking instead of 50, it’s still half the size of Texas. You’re looking at a huge structure no matter how you slice it. what

Originally posted by HST Gambit
nel stated is took 3 days of walking to get from point a to point b.

she didnt say how fast, or taking breaks, or any other factors in fact.
what is another fact is that shinigamis are far above the average human.

if people is gonna say excuses like, taking breaks or the speed, or any other obstacles that slows the the time from point a to point b, thats a assumption.

Okay, so explain to me how you calculated their running speed. They were NOT moving faster than human speed, because Chad was with them, and is a normal human.

Nel didn't know how fast they were. She was definitely judging from HER specific biology, not a bankai Ichigo's, which she'd never seen. A five year old girl taking three days to get somewhere obviously proves it's not that far. Not to mention that it still doesn't calculate the size of LN. What you're arguing literally makes no sense at all. LN's pillars weren't that much bigger than Ulquiorra. If the castle was half the size of Texas, then Ulquiorra would have been about as big as an amoeba compared to a blue whale, when in contrast with the pillars.

Even Aizen couldn't outrun an earthly explosion, which expands at mach 24. High-balling it, LN is still barely calc-able as about 26 miles in diameter.

Proof of this, and debunk of your argument, is the sole fact that Aizen possessed by the hogyoku in hollow form wasn't even able to destroy a single, japanese town with his strongest demonstrated attack.

what is this I don't even.....

I was talking about Yoruichi's statement about how long it takes to get to another part of sereitei.

Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
Unless Ulquiorra is that big compared to a 32nd of Texas
What if he actually is mmm

Originally posted by Rikudo sennin
Can someone just shut this guy up already? He won't stop unless someone crushes him. I thought about it but his posts are barely legible man.

You have to be a semi-competent writer to justify my divine retribution. Those are the rules.

Originally posted by NemeBro
I thought about it but his posts are barely legible man.

You have to be a semi-competent writer to justify my divine retribution. Those are the rules.

Nah, you just know that you can't win this debate. There's no way you could possibly prove that Orihime isn't mach 11...

mmm

I'm kidding...

There have been normal humans in movies who have reacted/outran explosions. It's often not an legit feat. Sasuke summing a giant snake, putting a genjustu on it, and jumping in its mouth after a 10km bomb went off is a good example.

Btw, this guy is copy/pasting posts from multiple users at Lounge Moviecodec. HM being country size was debunked there.

Originally posted by Zamiel
There have been normal humans in movies who have reacted/outran explosions. It's often not an legit feat. Sasuke summing a giant snake, putting a genjustu on it, and jumping in its mouth after a 10km bomb went off is a good example.

Btw, this guy is copy/pasting posts from multiple users at Lounge Moviecodec. HM being country size was debunked there.

Yeah but there are also times when it is legit.

While that is true and I said I got it from externals it wouldn't change the face that there are good arguments for it.

It doesn't change the Orihime is mach 11 and that the sand guy was never shown to be near the size of a pillar.

The feat by Orihime is obviously not legit seeing as how she can't move faster than the human eye can see. Btw, it took a man 27 days to RUN across texas.

Originally posted by Zamiel
The feat by Orihime is obviously not legit seeing as how she can't move faster than the human eye can see. Btw, it took a man 27 days to RUN across texas.

Did that happen after he explosion feat? If so can u give me a scan.

I am aware of that. While not texas sized it is still quite large by the statement given.

The downplay is the scaling from pillars. however gogeta has failed to show a scan of the sandman in comparison to one to prove his scaling.

Originally posted by HST Gambit
Did that happen after he explosion feat? If so can u give me a scan.

I am aware of that. While not texas sized it is still quite large by the statement given.

The downplay is the scaling from pillars. however gogeta has failed to show a scan of the sandman in comparison to one to prove his scaling.

http://i3.mangapanda.com/bleach/246/bleach-14322.jpg

Show a scan of Orihime moving faster than the human eye. In fact, I can show a scan of her running at top speed being normal human speed.

http://i11.mangapanda.com/bleach/349/bleach-2402723.jpg

Here you see Orihime being so slow, even when moving as fast as she could, that she could barely catch Ichigo from his fall, and wouldn't have been able to if it weren't for her fairy barrettes. If a scan after this proves she was faster than a normal human, then please, by all means post it.

This is the sandman in comparison to a pillar, dumb phuck.

You can obviously see the pillar on his left, which is just a bit bigger than him. And yes, they are close to the palace.

Um hello that doesn't prove he is anywhere near the size of the pillar.

it's so far back of course it will look smaller or comparable. You can't even see where the pillar ends. He is not near one.

Originally posted by HST Gambit
Um hello that doesn't prove he is anywhere near the size of the pillar.

it's so far back of course it will look smaller or comparable. You can't even see where the pillar ends. He is not near one.

http://i2.mangapanda.com/bleach/250/bleach-1589754.jpg

As you can see, the opening to LN isn't much larger than Ichigo. It being that big compared to the sand guy proves that they were already close.

You still haven't proved a single thing. You've posted no proof other than your own opinion.

If you calced LN to be half the size of Texas, then wouldn't the doors be city sized? Ichigo was not much smaller than them, so unless he's sky-scraper sized, LN is not even small town sized.

Id say about small mountain or city level between those two

Originally posted by chasedown
Id say about small mountain or city level between those two

Small mountain, but not city level. I'd definitely say about small mountain or large hill size though. "Half of Texas" sized, lolol, pile

HST Gambit's post on Lounge Moviecodec.

wow.

oh yeah, the OBD. how I miss that site; whenever I try to go there, the original character profiles and stuff are no longer found. thankfully they made a version 2 of it, but it's taking them some time to get it back up. to be expected given all of the info lost.

Gather your feeble army and send them to their graves.

OBD calcs are full of BS as they rely on pixel-scaling. Author's don;t draw to scale.

On topic, Lanza is far above city level and should be hitting Island level (atleast 90 km in length). They should be able to walk 30km per day.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
OBD calcs are full of BS as they rely on pixel-scaling. Author's don;t draw to scale.

On topic, Lanza is far above city level and should be hitting Island level (atleast 90 km in length). They should be able to walk 30km per day.

Bringer Light, that you?

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
OBD calcs are full of BS as they rely on pixel-scaling. Author's don;t draw to scale.

On topic, Lanza is far above city level and should be hitting Island level (atleast 90 km in length). They should be able to walk 30km per day.

Yeah, I agree with you on the first thing. Just like in DBZ when Vegeta was drawn looking like he was as big as mountains on Namek.

However... You are cracked on the second thing. I already posted a scan showing the sand dude to be nearly as big as the pillars of LN, making it way smaller than town sized. It's at the most multi-building sized. All of LN is at the most small town sized. Island sized? No... no, just no... No matter how much you want to assume the distance they walked or time frame, there's nothing you can say to disprove the scans.

Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
However... You are cracked on the second thing. I already posted a scan showing the sand dude to be nearly as big as the pillars of LN, making it way smaller than town sized. It's at the most multi-building sized. All of LN is at the most small town sized. Island sized? No... no, just no... No matter how much you want to assume the distance they walked or time frame, there's nothing you can say to disprove the scans. I've already debunked all these arguments before. I'm unable to post links now because of my post count. Visuals are inconsistent as writers don't draw to scale.

Las Noches appears only as big as the sand guy because it was several kilometers away, while the sand guy was just a dozen meters in front of them. Its like saying the person in front of me is bigger than a mountain a few kilometers away, and a terrible argument.

FYI, the sand guy later appears inside Las Noches, when Ichigo rushes in to fight Ulquiorra, and his height is nowhere close to the roof. So that argument is outright fallacious.


How the heck can LN be only town sized when:
1. It has a sky and a weather of its own.
2. Its end is not even visible when they are inside, and the human eye can see for 3 miles upto the horizon.
3. It takes 3 days walk to reach a gate from the corner
4. Ichigo and his friends ran for several hours, yet its size didn't change from their perspective.

Originally posted by Zamiel
Bringer Light, that you? Yep. You?

country is a very loose term. What size country in today's world is it being implied that lanza could destroy because im still stuck on mountain level

Should be small country level at most (probably the size of Belgium).

Average Island level sounds right

no, just no.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
Should be small country level at most (probably the size of Belgium).

Average Island level sounds right

Idk a country just seems way too large... Id agree with small island or city


I take back my mountain level classification in my posts earlier because that would make lanza as strong as the lower s class spirit gun used against sensui. This is clearly not the case

Originally posted by chasedown
Idk a country just seems way too large... Id agree with small island or city


I take back my mountain level classification in my posts earlier because that would make lanza as strong as the lower s class spirit gun used against sensui. This is clearly not the case What does Sensui or YYH have to do with this? They are two different series, independent of each others' power.

Island level is beyond mountain level.

Originally posted by God Cloth Seiya
no, just no. > No proof

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
What does Sensui or YYH have to do with this? They are two different series, independent of each others' power.

Island level is beyond mountain level.

> No proof

Im just saying that would put lanza and a lower s class spirit gun as equal strength which i dont think is true......ma b i mustve got how the power labels were ranked. If thats the case the i think lanza's power is evn smaller

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
What does Sensui or YYH have to do with this? They are two different series, independent of each others' power.

Island level is beyond mountain level.

> No proof

Yusuke's spirit gun busted a mountain so the comaparison he was trying to make is relavent.

Originally posted by yungz22
Yusuke's spirit gun busted a mountain so the comaparison he was trying to make is relavent. Whether Yusuke's reigun destroys only a wall, or a mountain, or a planet is irrelevant as it has nothing to do with Ulquiorra's power.

They are both different characters from different verses

Originally posted by chasedown
Im just saying that would put lanza and a lower s class spirit gun as equal strength which i dont think is true......ma b i mustve got how the power labels were ranked. If thats the case the i think lanza's power is evn smaller This has nothing to do with YYH but the reigun is a concentrated attack. Sensui's normal shockwaves can destroy mountains, and the reigun should have a lot more potency then them. And the Makai world is much more durable than the human world. So that's small country level IMO.

Lanza is only Island level.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
Whether Yusuke's reigun destroys only a wall, or a mountain, or a planet is irrelevant as it has nothing to do with Ulquiorra's power.

They are both different characters from different verses

This has nothing to do with YYH but the reigun is a concentrated attack. Sensui's normal shockwaves can destroy mountains, and the reigun should have a lot more potency then them. And the Makai world is much more durable than the human world. So that's small country level IMO.

Lanza is only Island level.

well when deciding the strength of a character to determine how powerful a technique is so that the result we find can be used in future crossover battles. Id say a comparison to a mountain busting technique is pretty relavant. Just to get any idea of its strength.

When was it determined that matter in both makai world and human world was different in durability. Its just a world where demons live. Matter should work the same. unless it where proven to be like the sereitei world where matter was made of reishi.

Originally posted by yungz22
well when deciding the strength of a character to determine how powerful a technique is so that the result we find can be used in future crossover battles. Id say a comparison to a mountain busting technique is pretty relavant. Just to get any idea of its strength.Yeah, but why can't Ulquiorra be as strong as characters in YYH? We shouldn't downgrade a feat just because it puts a certain verse on par with another.

Btw even Sensui's shockwave (the air pressure of his punch) could smash a mountain.

Sensui couldn't use even 1/5th of his power in the real world, was creating tremors across the city, and was causing the cave to crumble apart.

In the makai, he could easily go full power without any worries and still doesn't

Cero Oscuras is city+ level, while Lanza is Island level.

Pre-SS arc Ichigo already had Multi-city block feats.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
Yeah, but why can't Ulquiorra be as strong as characters in YYH? We shouldn't downgrade a feat just because it puts a certain verse on par with another.

Btw even Sensui's shockwave (the air pressure of his punch) could smash a mountain.

Sensui couldn't use even 1/5th of his power in the real world, was creating tremors across the city, and was causing the cave to crumble apart.

In the makai, he could easily go full power without any worries and still doesn't

Cero Oscuras is city+ level, while Lanza is Island level.

Pre-SS arc Ichigo already had Multi-city block feats.

Are you retarded?

Ichigo has no feats that put him even CLOSE to city level before he trained in the Dangai world.

Since you're using powerscaling to determine the potency and AOE of Yusuke's soul gun, I can do the same to determine Ulquiorra's lanza.

http://i16.mangapanda.com/bleach/419/bleach-2399545.jpg

See this? This is Aizen's most powerful demonstrated attack. Comparing the AOE of this and Ulquiorra's lanza, you saying lanza is island level is suggesting that Ulquiorra can destroy more than Aizen can. That's completely ABSURD. Aizen is MUCH more powerful than Ichigo, and even his strongest attack made an explosion nowhere near the size of Karakura town. Now to assume Ulquiorra's power, we would have to scale it with Aizen's. Aizen was still confident that he could beat Ichigo when he was in bankai hollow form, the form that decimated Ichigo. Therefor we can accurately say that Aizen, at least while transformed with the Hogyoku, could easily beat Ulquiorra. Ulquiorra's lanza is therefor much weaker than Aizen's cero(thing). I don't know how you can say that it's island level when a much stronger character is incapable of even a much smaller feat.

Nit-picking statements and scaling to figure out how big LN is proves nothing. Aizen couldn't even come close to town busting. Ichigo could, but only with final getsuga tensho. No one in ALL of bleach has come to island busting level or country busting level yet, even currently in the manga. Unless they have feats that suggest so, they can NOT.

Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
Are you retarded?

Ichigo has no feats that put him even CLOSE to city level before he trained in the Dangai world.

Since you're using powerscaling to determine the potency and AOE of Yusuke's soul gun, I can do the same to determine Ulquiorra's lanza.

http://i16.mangapanda.com/bleach/419/bleach-2399545.jpg

See this? This is Aizen's most powerful demonstrated attack. Comparing the AOE of this and Ulquiorra's lanza, you saying lanza is island level is suggesting that Ulquiorra can destroy more than Aizen can. That's completely ABSURD. Aizen is MUCH more powerful than Ichigo, and even his strongest attack made an explosion nowhere near the size of Karakura town. Now to assume Ulquiorra's power, we would have to scale it with Aizen's. Aizen was still confident that he could beat Ichigo when he was in bankai hollow form, the form that decimated Ichigo. Therefor we can accurately say that Aizen, at least while transformed with the Hogyoku, could easily beat Ulquiorra. Ulquiorra's lanza is therefor much weaker than Aizen's cero(thing). I don't know how you can say that it's island level when a much stronger character is incapable of even a much smaller feat.

Nit-picking statements and scaling to figure out how big LN is proves nothing. Aizen couldn't even come close to town busting. Ichigo could, but only with final getsuga tensho. No one in ALL of bleach has come to island busting level or country busting level yet, even currently in the manga. Unless they have feats that suggest so, they can NOT.


you make a good point here kind makes me want to change my mind. but the only thing isthats them looking at the blast from far away it wasnt in Karakura town but im sure if the blast was in karakura it would definitely destoroyed.

I def feel like aizen could blow up a city maybe even island level. With the hogyoku thats not impossible. im kinda wishy washy with this topic because i definitely feel like ulq could destroy a city just not an island because its as you said hes clearly not stronger than aizen.

i feel like ulq should have been the number 1 espada as he showed way more power than stark did.

Seems like this needs some serious debunking...

Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
Are you retarded? What? Its retarded to think Lanza is anything below city level.

Lol, your downplay is terrible.

- Fodders in Bleach (like pre-SS arc Ichigo and Shikai Ikkaku) are multi city block+. Lol at Espada level characters and especially top tiers not being town level
- Lanza dwarfed Las Noches which is larger than a city
- Shikai Ichigo during the Ginjo fight destroyed a city sized dimension
- Yamamoto's Ennetsu Jigoku would have destroyed an area exponentially larger than a city, as stated by Aizen.
- Hitsugaya can freeze anything within a 24 kilometer diameter (city sized)

Lol at Ichigo not being town level other than dangai.

What powerscaling did I use for Yusuke? Did you even read my argument?

AoE =/= attack potency. Try again

Aizen's blast may appear smaller, but the potency behind the blast is far more than Lanza's.

Super Buu is much stronger than Frieza, but his attacks don't even destroy the earth.

By your logic, Frieza shouldn't be a planet buster.

Wrong. You need to do the vice versa.

Just like you scale Buu's power from Frieza, you need to scale Aizen's power from Ulquiorra's

Yes, Ulquiorra's Lanza maybe weaker than Fragor (potency wise), but that doesn't prevent it from being Island level.

If Lanza is Island level, Fragor is Island+ or higher in terms of attack potency even if the blast radius is small.

Those are not simply statements and scaling. Its called exposition, which Kubo has put in the manga to portray the characters' DC.

Author's word > your opinion.

Bullshit.

Yamamoto's bankai can destroy Soul society which is atleast continent sized with its mere presence, stated twice in the manga.

Originally posted by chasedown
looking at the blast from far away it wasnt in Karakura town but im sure if the blast was in karakura it would definitely destoroyed. That's not a good way to judge Aizen's power. For example, DBZ characters don't destroy planets or cities everytime they fire a blast. And its the same case here with Aizen.

The blast looking small doesn't mean its potency is anything below Island level.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
Seems like this needs some serious debunking...

What? Its retarded to think Lanza is anything below city level.

Lol, your downplay is terrible.

- Fodders in Bleach (like pre-SS arc Ichigo and Shikai Ikkaku) are multi city block+. Lol at Espada level characters and especially top tiers not being town level
- Lanza dwarfed Las Noches which is larger than a city
- Shikai Ichigo during the Ginjo fight destroyed a city sized dimension
- Yamamoto's Ennetsu Jigoku would have destroyed an area exponentially larger than a city, as stated by Aizen.
- Hitsugaya can freeze anything within a 24 kilometer diameter (city sized)

Lol at Ichigo not being town level other than dangai.

What powerscaling did I use for Yusuke? Did you even read my argument?

AoE =/= attack potency. Try again

Aizen's blast may appear smaller, but the potency behind the blast is far more than Lanza's.

Super Buu is much stronger than Frieza, but his attacks don't even destroy the earth.

By your logic, Frieza shouldn't be a planet buster.

Wrong. You need to do the vice versa.

Just like you scale Buu's power from Frieza, you need to scale Aizen's power from Ulquiorra's

Yes, Ulquiorra's Lanza maybe weaker than Fragor (potency wise), but that doesn't prevent it from being Island level.

If Lanza is Island level, Fragor is Island+ or higher in terms of attack potency even if the blast radius is small.

Those are not simply statements and scaling. Its called exposition, which Kubo has put in the manga to portray the characters' DC.

Author's word > your opinion.

Bullshit.

Yamamoto's bankai can destroy Soul society which is atleast continent sized with its mere presence, stated twice in the manga.

That's not a good way to judge Aizen's power. For example, DBZ characters don't destroy planets or cities everytime they fire a blast. And its the same case here with Aizen.

The blast looking small doesn't mean its potency is anything below Island level.

A for effort with the attempt at a debunk, but let me point a few things out, princess.

"What? Its retarded to think Lanza is anything below city level."

Considering the fact that you have no basis on which to back that assumption up, yes.

"Lol, your downplay is terrible.

- Fodders in Bleach (like pre-SS arc Ichigo and Shikai Ikkaku) are multi city block+. Lol at Espada level characters and especially top tiers not being town level
- Lanza dwarfed Las Noches which is larger than a city
- Shikai Ichigo during the Ginjo fight destroyed a city sized dimension
- Yamamoto's Ennetsu Jigoku would have destroyed an area exponentially larger than a city, as stated by Aizen.
- Hitsugaya can freeze anything within a 24 kilometer diameter (city sized)

Lol at Ichigo not being town level other than dangai."

Lol, your Bleach wanking is terrible.

- Fodders in Bleach like Shikai Ikkaku have absolutely zero statements or feats that point to them being capable of even small building busting. It's cute that you think it's okay to make baseless assumptions and statements about characters when the only "proof" you have is your own twisted, biased opinion.
- Las Noches has never been stated to be anywhere near city sized. The fact that Ichigo's cero also dwarfed LN when it wasn't even as large as released Yammy is enough to disprove this.
- That never happened. He destroyed an illusion barrier in bankai.
- Aizen said Yamamoto's attack would destroy the barrier covering the city and potentially cause humans to be subjugated to harm in the vicinity.
- First off, it's 3 RI, or approximately 12 km, not 24, you douche bag Bleach wanker. Secondly, Hitsugaya uses the entire sky as a medium for his freezing. Causing snow to rain down for 12 km is NOT city busting, but merely having a technique that can cover a 12 km diameter. That's like saying that a collection of rain clouds can city bust. Literally.

Lol at someone who has demonstrated to be incapable of even destroying a single hill to be a town buster.

"What powerscaling did I use for Yusuke? Did you even read my argument?"

You power scaled by saying Yusuke could mountain bust even though he never has demonstrated being able to, iirc.

"AoE =/= attack potency. Try again

Aizen's blast may appear smaller, but the potency behind the blast is far more than Lanza's."

Obviously, but he still hasn't shown anything capable of town busting. If he had used a weaker attack to town bust, then that attack could easily town+ bust. However, he has not, meaning that he is incapable of town busting with even his strongest demonstrated attack.

"Super Buu is much stronger than Frieza, but his attacks don't even destroy the earth.

By your logic, Frieza shouldn't be a planet buster."

No, by my logic, Frieza destroyed planets casually because he wanted to for whatever reason. Super Buu didn't because he wanted a challenge. He wanted someone who could fight him on par, without getting utterly shat on. Even Frieza wanted to fight SSJ Goku, and said he didn't destroy Namek for that SOLE reason, even though he set it to blow after five minutes to ensure Goku's death.

By your logic, someone who wanted to do as much damage possible couldn't town bust, even though someone much weaker could "island bust"... Hmm... Do you see the problem here?

"Wrong. You need to do the vice versa.

Just like you scale Buu's power from Frieza, you need to scale Aizen's power from Ulquiorra's"

Wrong. You need to do the opposite.

Since Ulquiorra has no real definable feats, you need to scale his power down from Aizen's. Aizen's power is very clear. He can mountain bust with his strongest attack. This instantly proves that LN is nowhere near town sized, and lanza is nowhere near island level, unless you're also suggesting that Ulquiorra is MUCH more powerful than Aizen. What you're saying is that Aizen's most potent explosive cero has less AOE than Ulquiorra's most potent lanza(which is basically his more powerful version of a cero that can also be used as a sword). That is ridiculous.

"Those are not simply statements and scaling. Its called exposition, which Kubo has put in the manga to portray the characters' DC.

Author's word > your opinion."

A few vague statements related to distance =/= exposition.

They said it would take three days to get to Las Noche's. They didn't say how far it was, how fast they were walking or how long they rested in between walking. Therefor, assuming the size of the structure they were headed to is completely baseless and stupid. LN was big enough to hold ten complexes, not ten cities. The complexes could have been any size. The size of LN was never even hinted at. Another way to estimate though, is the fact that Chad could bust a huge hole in one of the walls and still be visible in size contrast.

" Bullshit.

Yamamoto's bankai can destroy Soul society which is atleast continent sized with its mere presence, stated twice in the manga."

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLO
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLO


pile

Soul society? Continent sized? LOL. If it was continent sized, then why was a single hill the bulk of the entire area? Sokyoku hill was huge even compared to all of SS. If SS was continent sized, that would make Sokyoku hill as large as several mountain ranges. Even Mayuri's bankai was almost a quarter of the size of the hill, and it wasn't even that much bigger than Uryu. The Sokyoku's nearly DWARFED the hill, and Ichigo was as big as it's beak.

lol, continent sized...

"That's not a good way to judge Aizen's power. For example, DBZ characters don't destroy planets or cities everytime they fire a blast. And its the same case here with Aizen.

The blast looking small doesn't mean its potency is anything below Island level."

The blast being small means Ulquiorra's blast was smaller. This is because they were both as potent as the characters could make them. You can argue the potency all you want, but the fact of the matter is that you have no way of knowing the potency of the attack. In DBZ, they casually shoot blasts that only destroy small portions of the ground, but when they want to, a blast just as small can destroy entire planets just because it's not as condensed. Aizen shot his strongest attack at Ichigo, and it didn't even compare to town busting. Ulquiorra's much weaker, so his lanza has nowhere near the same level of destructive capacity that Aizen's does. You might as well say that Ichigo's getsuga is more potent just because it has a smaller AOE. The rule of thumb is "whoever can destroy more is stronger", not "Whoever has smaller explosions can destroy the most within said explosion".

Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
A for effort with the attempt at a debunk, but let me point a few things out, princess.

Considering the fact that you have no basis on which to back that assumption up, yes.I have a basis:

1. Nel states it takes 3 days to cross Las Noches by walk
2. Las Noches has its own climate along with a sky with clouds, which has to be a few miles high
3. The ends of LN on any direction aren't visible when they are inside it, though the human eye can see for 3 miles before the horizon
4. Ichigo (who can run for a day on a treadmill), was tired after running towards Las Noches for several hours, and yet they didn't make it any closer.
Assuming he ran only for 3 hours at peak human speeds, 3*20 = 60 km.
LN has to be larger than this since they didn't get any closer.


Its cute how you're making these claims without reading Bleach. Small building lololol, Gillians are skyscraper sized.

Chapter 67 page 17: Pre-SS arc Ichigo rips a huge canyon destroying a few small hills in the process, and this is an MCB+ feat. Ikkaku is stronger than that Ichigo.

Chapter 204 page 20: Shikai Ikkaku tanks an MCB+ attack that dwarfs skyscrapers.


Wrong. It was stated to be 3 days long on foot.

Debunk the above points if you want to prove its smaller than a city.

You are technically Yammy is larger than Las Noches when he was inside the entire time.

Think twice before typing bullshit.


It wasn't an illusion. It was a pocket dimension, which was the size of a city.

Wrong again. Read the chapter 'The burnout inferno 3'.

Aizen: "If you hadn't blocked the explosion with your body, then your fragile little barrier would have been blown away, and an area many times the size of Karakura town would be reduced to ash"

Are you blind? I said 24 km diameter

Hitsugaya's bankai can freeze anything within 12 km radius, which makes its diameter 24 km


Hitsugaya's ice is strong enough to shatter arrancars, whose skin is harder than steel. So destroying cement buildings should be easier.

Hitsugaya's bankai doesn't fire energy blasts, its technically ice. Freezing all the buildings within 24 km is city level.

Goku never destroyed a planet. So I guess he isn't planet level?

Sensui destroyed a mountain with air pressure, and Yusuke = Sensui so they are both far above mountain level.

That is not de-scaling. If Ulquiorra can destroy an Island, even Aizen can.


Even Cell hasn't shown an attack that destroyed a planet. Are you saying Frieza is not planet level because Cell never destroyed one?

Very good. For the same reason, Aizen was trying to destroy Ichigo, not blow up towns and mountains.

His blasts were concentrated.

1. Aizen can casually townbust or Island-bust if he really tries.

2. Aizen's blasts are much more potent, but their AoE is not as much as Ulquiorra's or Shikai Yamamoto's

Who said Aizen's max power is limited to mountain busting? He wasn't trying to blow up mountains, and that destruction was just the side effect of his fight with Ichigo.

Ulquiorra's Lanza only has more AoE because Aizen's blasts were more concentrated


Even at normal human walking speeds, it comes out to be 90 km long, though we know Ichigo is above peak human level. 90 km is consistent with what's portrayed.

There are not only statements, but we see Ichigo and co. ran for several hours towards it, got tired, and it still didn't change in their perspective.

No, that hole wasn't visible. Chad fought Mosqueda and Nnoitra at the center of Las Noches when they were inside.

That's just the Seireitei where the Gotei 13 resides, duh.
Outside of Seireitei, there are 320 Rukongai districts, which accomodate as much population as the earth. In addition they have all those forests, deserts, mountains where Ichigo fought Aizen and other stuff.

You need atleast a continent sized land to comfortably accommodate as much population as the Earth's (7 billion).


Riddle me this: Look at the Future Trunks vs Frieza fight. In chapter 331, just before killing Frieza, Trunks fires a blast at him. The blast is strong enough to force Frieza to dodge, the blast hits the ground, but the planet doesn't get destroyed and it only makes a small crater.
If I use your logic that you're using for Aizen's fragor, Trunks' blast is only building level, and Frieza should be building level as he is below Trunks. (I could argue the same for cell saga Piccolo's light grenade that only destroys a small Island)

I hope you understand now. Aizen's fragor is just like Trunks' blast. Though its AoE is small, the potency behind the blast is Island+ level as its stronger than Ulquiorra's Lanza. So there's no contradiction with Las Noches being Island sized, and Aizen being above him.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
I have a basis:

1. Nel states it takes 3 days to cross Las Noches by walk
2. Las Noches has its own climate along with a sky with clouds, which has to be a few miles high
3. The ends of LN on any direction aren't visible when they are inside it, though the human eye can see for 3 miles before the horizon
4. Ichigo (who can run for a day on a treadmill), was tired after running towards Las Noches for several hours, and yet they didn't make it any closer.
Assuming he ran only for 3 hours at peak human speeds, 3*20 = 60 km.
LN has to be larger than this since they didn't get any closer.


Its cute how you're making these claims without reading Bleach. Small building lololol, Gillians are skyscraper sized.

Chapter 67 page 17: Pre-SS arc Ichigo rips a huge canyon destroying a few small hills in the process, and this is an MCB+ feat. Ikkaku is stronger than that Ichigo.

Chapter 204 page 20: Shikai Ikkaku tanks an MCB+ attack that dwarfs skyscrapers.


Wrong. It was stated to be 3 days long on foot.

Debunk the above points if you want to prove its smaller than a city.

You are technically Yammy is larger than Las Noches when he was inside the entire time.

Think twice before typing bullshit.


It wasn't an illusion. It was a pocket dimension, which was the size of a city.

Wrong again. Read the chapter 'The burnout inferno 3'.

Aizen: "If you hadn't blocked the explosion with your body, then your fragile little barrier would have been blown away, and an area many times the size of Karakura town would be reduced to ash"

Are you blind? I said 24 km diameter

Hitsugaya's bankai can freeze anything within 12 km radius, which makes its diameter 24 km


Hitsugaya's ice is strong enough to shatter arrancars, whose skin is harder than steel. So destroying cement buildings should be easier.

Hitsugaya's bankai doesn't fire energy blasts, its technically ice. Freezing all the buildings within 24 km is city level.

Goku never destroyed a planet. So I guess he isn't planet level?

Sensui destroyed a mountain with air pressure, and Yusuke = Sensui so they are both far above mountain level.

That is not de-scaling. If Ulquiorra can destroy an Island, even Aizen can.


Even Cell hasn't shown an attack that destroyed a planet. Are you saying Frieza is not planet level because Cell never destroyed one?

Very good. For the same reason, Aizen was trying to destroy Ichigo, not blow up towns and mountains.

His blasts were concentrated.

1. Aizen can casually townbust or Island-bust if he really tries.

2. Aizen's blasts are much more potent, but their AoE is not as much as Ulquiorra's or Shikai Yamamoto's

Who said Aizen's max power is limited to mountain busting? He wasn't trying to blow up mountains, and that destruction was just the side effect of his fight with Ichigo.

Ulquiorra's Lanza only has more AoE because Aizen's blasts were more concentrated


Even at normal human walking speeds, it comes out to be 90 km long, though we know Ichigo is above peak human level. 90 km is consistent with what's portrayed.

There are not only statements, but we see Ichigo and co. ran for several hours towards it, got tired, and it still didn't change in their perspective.

No, that hole wasn't visible. Chad fought Mosqueda and Nnoitra at the center of Las Noches when they were inside.

That's just the Seireitei where the Gotei 13 resides, duh.
Outside of Seireitei, there are 320 Rukongai districts, which accomodate as much population as the earth. In addition they have all those forests, deserts, mountains where Ichigo fought Aizen and other stuff.

You need atleast a continent sized land to comfortably accommodate as much population as the Earth's (7 billion).


Riddle me this: Look at the Future Trunks vs Frieza fight. In chapter 331, just before killing Frieza, Trunks fires a blast at him. The blast is strong enough to force Frieza to dodge, the blast hits the ground, but the planet doesn't get destroyed and it only makes a small crater.
If I use your logic that you're using for Aizen's fragor, Trunks' blast is only building level, and Frieza should be building level as he is below Trunks. (I could argue the same for cell saga Piccolo's light grenade that only destroys a small Island)

I hope you understand now. Aizen's fragor is just like Trunks' blast. Though its AoE is small, the potency behind the blast is Island+ level as its stronger than Ulquiorra's Lanza. So there's no contradiction with Las Noches being Island sized, and Aizen being above him.

I was going to post a super long post debunking this retarded post, but my browser quit unexpectedly.

Anyway, I'll make this debunk short and sweet.

Your logic with Aizen is completely flawed. Cell has attacks that can bust solar systems and be powerscaled to be on the level of galaxy busting. Even Frieza was a star buster. The only basis you have to support an island busting Aizen, is a retarded pseudo gauge of simple, vague, unsupported statements.

The bottom line is that the most Chad could travel for three days, as a normal human with no food or water, is around 10 hours a day. Him keeping up with the others is proof that they were, at least at that point, bound to human levels. The most they could travel in that time is around 60 km. Again, Nel said it took three days to cross LN, not HM.

60-70 km diameter explosion is obviously the limit of Ulquiorra's lanza at that point. You have nothing to gauge the size of LN after that. New york city has a diameter of around 114 km. At the most, I guess we can powerscale Aizen's attack potency to be at city level at that point, but Yamamoto's attack has nothing to do with that. Again, AOE =/= attack potency, unless you're also arguing that Toshiro is stronger than Aizen.

There are only assumptions that you can make in Bleach. The size of Karakura town was never given, so that is speculation. The only time it was hinted at was when Toshiro said his 3 RI bankai could cover most of the city, but that's still too vague to calc, and can at most be calced to around 20 km, which puts Yama and Aizen at nowhere near the full power of Ulquiorra.

Anyway, how about this. When you can give me a cannon, 100% accurate calculation of how big LN was, as well as the size of Karakura town, then I will accept that the attack AOE or overall potency is as you can calc it. If not, then we still have to assume the bare minimum, as no feats or statements were given to suggest otherwise.

You're trying to calculate the possibility that Aizen might have island busting capacity, even though it has never been even hinted at, and no feats even SUGGEST so. You have one piece of evidence, and it doesn't fit in with the rest of the series. You are completely wrong.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
I have a basis:


Goku never destroyed a planet. So I guess he isn't planet level?


Even Cell hasn't shown an attack that destroyed a planet. Are you saying Frieza is not planet level because Cell never destroyed one?


Riddle me this: Look at the Future Trunks vs Frieza fight. In chapter 331, just before killing Frieza, Trunks fires a blast at him. The blast is strong enough to force Frieza to dodge, the blast hits the ground, but the planet doesn't get destroyed and it only makes a small crater.
If I use your logic that you're using for Aizen's fragor, Trunks' blast is only building level, and Frieza should be building level as he is below Trunks. (I could argue the same for cell saga Piccolo's light grenade that only destroys a small Island)

I hope you understand now. Aizen's fragor is just like Trunks' blast. Though its AoE is small, the potency behind the blast is Island+ level as its stronger than Ulquiorra's Lanza. So there's no contradiction with Las Noches being Island sized, and Aizen being above him. Shut the **** up. Raditz solos Bleach.

Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
I was going to post a super long post debunking this retarded post, but my browser quit unexpectedly.

Anyway, I'll make this debunk short and sweet.

Your logic with Aizen is completely flawed. Cell has attacks that can bust solar systems and be powerscaled to be on the level of galaxy busting. Even Frieza was a star buster. The only basis you have to support an island busting Aizen, is a retarded pseudo gauge of simple, vague, unsupported statements. Key word: powerscaled.

Neither of them showed Star/Solar system busting feats and all we have is statements for it. You could do the same for Ulq and Yamamoto.

Ok, I can agree with 10 hours a day to get a low end value.

If you walk at 4 km/hr, you can cross 40 km in 10 hours. So for 3 days, it makes it 120 km (though I'll agree with 90 km as a low end).

If one side of LN is 90 km, its area will be 90x90 = 8100 sq-km.

Area of New York City is 1200 sq-km http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City

So Las Noches is around 6 times larger than it which makes Lanza multi-city/Island level.

Yamamoto tanked his own shikai, and still had energy to use a level 96 Kido. If Aizen's fragor would kill Yamamoto, so its potency should be even higher than Yama's attack, which is capable of reducing an area exponentially larger than Karakura town to ash.

The only thing is, its AoE is small as Aizen fired compressed blast like Trunks did on Frieza.

*24 km.

That puts Bankai Toshiro at city level and Shikai Yama wayyy above that. The manga stated that Yama's Ennetsu Jigoku would have destroyed an area exponentially larger than KT, so its again multi-city to Island level.

Secondly, don't forget that Ulq's attack could simply have more AoE while Yama/Aizen's attacks have more potency as they are more concentrated.

I've given you three feats - Toshiro, Ulquiorra, Shikai Yama. And Aizen is stronger than them.

Just like Trunks has no feats, but we powerscale him to planet+ using Frieza's feats.


Moreover, don't forget that Aizen's fragor made a HUGE crater in the ground and we don't know how deep the crater was. This was despite the fact that Ichigo's arm took most of the Fragor's damage.


Originally posted by God Cloth Seiya
Shut the **** up. Raditz solos Bleach. What does Raditz have to do with this thread?

And why are you getting angry over it?

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
Key word: powerscaled.

Neither of them showed Star/Solar system busting feats and all we have is statements for it. You could do the same for Ulq and Yamamoto.

Ok, I can agree with 10 hours a day to get a low end value.

If you walk at 4 km/hr, you can cross 40 km in 10 hours. So for 3 days, it makes it 120 km (though I'll agree with 90 km as a low end).

If one side of LN is 90 km, its area will be 90x90 = 8100 sq-km.

Area of New York City is 1200 sq-km http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City

So Las Noches is around 6 times larger than it which makes Lanza multi-city/Island level.

Yamamoto tanked his own shikai, and still had energy to use a level 96 Kido. If Aizen's fragor would kill Yamamoto, so its potency should be even higher than Yama's attack, which is capable of reducing an area exponentially larger than Karakura town to ash.

The only thing is, its AoE is small as Aizen fired compressed blast like Trunks did on Frieza.

*24 km.

That puts Bankai Toshiro at city level and Shikai Yama wayyy above that. The manga stated that Yama's Ennetsu Jigoku would have destroyed an area exponentially larger than KT, so its again multi-city to Island level.

Secondly, don't forget that Ulq's attack could simply have more AoE while Yama/Aizen's attacks have more potency as they are more concentrated.

I've given you three feats - Toshiro, Ulquiorra, Shikai Yama. And Aizen is stronger than them.

Just like Trunks has no feats, but we powerscale him to planet+ using Frieza's feats.


Moreover, don't forget that Aizen's fragor made a HUGE crater in the ground and we don't know how deep the crater was. This was despite the fact that Ichigo's arm took most of the Fragor's damage.


What does Raditz have to do with this thread?

And why are you getting angry over it?

Except you don't even have statements for Yama and Ulq.

A human without water or food cannot walk for ten hours at 4 km/hour. At most, which I was calcing, they can manage 2.5 km/hour, and going any faster could kill or dehydrate(at the least) them, because they won't be conserving their calories at all. Anyway, this is stupid as phuck. Nel gave a vague statement claiming it takes three days to cross LN. There's no way to know who she meant was walking, how long they braked for, what supplies they had, or what species the walker was. For all we know, she could have meant anywhere from her(the equivalent to a four year old child), to Yammy. There's no way to know, meaning there's no way to accurately scale LN, as it can be as small as 100 km squared to as huge as 10,000.

Find a better way to figure out the range of the attack, or you, again, have NO basis.

Aizen stated that Yama's shikai could destroy exponentially more than the city. However, you know what? Since you pulled the "statements aren't vaild card", I'm gonna follow that example. Aizen has been proven wrong DOZENS of times in the manga, an example is when he said that he was evolving past Ichigo, when the Hogyoku was in fact abandoning him.

Toshiro's bankai's strongest attack was shaken off by Wonderwiess screaming. His AOE means nothing if it's potency is that weak.

Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
Except you don't even have statements for Yama and Ulq. We do. And we also have feats for Ulq in addition to the statements.


They are well above superhumans, so they don't need food and water. Also keep in mind, they were all super-charged by HM's atmosphere, which is full of reishi.

Here's a machine that absorbs one's rieatsu as one walks on it.
http://oi40.tinypic.com/2cfbpye.jpg


Ichigo had been running on it for A WHOLE DAY without rest, and still claims he can do more.
http://oi39.tinypic.com/k4ufys.jpg

Chad and Ishida are stronger than Shikai Ichigo as they both defeated Privaron Espadas, and if you notice, Ichigo was the first one to collapse after running towards Las Noches.

Average human walking speed is 4 km/h, just google it. And you can easily walk a marathon (42 km) in a day lol.

Nel was referring to Ichigo's group (who she thinks are pretty strong), and Nel herself is faster than a peak human, as she could keep up with Ichigo when she tried to ran.

And this is why I'm going by low end calcs, and saying its 90-100 km.

Look at Narutoverse for example. It takes 3 days to cover the distance between Konoha to the sand village, and they are in different countries. Las Noches should be comparable to that.

I never said statements aren't valid. I do accept Cell to be a star buster because of his statement, though its highly possible he was boasting.

That's because Aizen was boasting about his abilities. There was no reason for him to boast about Yamamoto, who was his enemy.

Secondly, unless statements are shown to be contradicted, you should treat them as canon. Yama's shikai destroying the said area is never contradicted as Yama himself blocked the attack with his body.

That just means WW's scream releases powerful soundwaves, which are strong enough to break Hitsu's ice, which is stronger than steel.

Toshiro's bankai has 24 km AoE with steel+ potency, and Ulq's Lanza has 90 km AoE with rock/quartz+ potency.

Btw whats the day/night cycle like in that realm?

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
We do. And we also have feats for Ulq in addition to the statements.


They are well above superhumans, so they don't need food and water. Also keep in mind, they were all super-charged by HM's atmosphere, which is full of reishi.

Here's a machine that absorbs one's rieatsu as one walks on it.
http://oi40.tinypic.com/2cfbpye.jpg


Ichigo had been running on it for A WHOLE DAY without rest, and still claims he can do more.
http://oi39.tinypic.com/k4ufys.jpg

Chad and Ishida are stronger than Shikai Ichigo as they both defeated Privaron Espadas, and if you notice, Ichigo was the first one to collapse after running towards Las Noches.

Average human walking speed is 4 km/h, just google it. And you can easily walk a marathon (42 km) in a day lol.

Nel was referring to Ichigo's group (who she thinks are pretty strong), and Nel herself is faster than a peak human, as she could keep up with Ichigo when she tried to ran.

And this is why I'm going by low end calcs, and saying its 90-100 km.

Look at Narutoverse for example. It takes 3 days to cover the distance between Konoha to the sand village, and they are in different countries. Las Noches should be comparable to that.

I never said statements aren't valid. I do accept Cell to be a star buster because of his statement, though its highly possible he was boasting.

That's because Aizen was boasting about his abilities. There was no reason for him to boast about Yamamoto, who was his enemy.

Secondly, unless statements are shown to be contradicted, you should treat them as canon. Yama's shikai destroying the said area is never contradicted as Yama himself blocked the attack with his body.

That just means WW's scream releases powerful soundwaves, which are strong enough to break Hitsu's ice, which is stronger than steel.

Toshiro's bankai has 24 km AoE with steel+ potency, and Ulq's Lanza has 90 km AoE with rock/quartz+ potency.

For the last phucking time, Chad=/=Ichigo. Chad is a normal human in terms of speed, and REQUIRES water and food, just like Ichigo does. Them being superhumans has NOTHING to do with what they NEED to survive. Just look at Goku. A multiversal reality buster that can't get through the day without at least three GIGANTIC meals fit for dozens of grown men.

What evidence to you have that says Nel is faster than a full grown human? Exactly, NONE. The fact that Chad alone was keeping up with them proves them to be no more than average human walking speed.

Hitsugaya's ice? Stronger than steel? LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL, EVEN CURRENT KENPACHI, THE STRONGEST CAPTAIN EVER, HAD A BIT OF TROUBLE CUTTING THROUGH STEEL, LOL. Yeah though, Hitsugaya's ice is normal ice, and you're ****ing retarded for suggesting otherwise.

For the last time though, you can't base a calc on something that has so many variables needed to be inferred just to support it. The reason being, obviously, that you can change the outcome so often. For example, since it doesn't mention the walking speed, the breaks you take, or even the water/food you need to support yourself, I could easily infer than LN is only 10 km long, because they could have been leisurely walking with dozens of hour long breaks in between.

Find something more set in stone, or just forfeit.

Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
For the last phucking time, Chad=/=Ichigo. Chad is a normal human in terms of speed, Chad kept up with and defeated a Privaron Espada, who is hypersonic+. The same Privaron is faster than Shikai Ichigo.

Even Orihime has supersonic attacks- http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-MkzWroXQhLo/TlSXlYCMdXI/AAAAAAAABEs/KWGhO8ZVrb0/015.png?imgmax=3000 (a clear sonicboom)

and fodder 4th seats can react to her. Chad one-shotted a 3rd seat long back when he was a weakling in the SS arc.


Lol human-level speed.


Food and water to survive?

> Do you not see Ichigo running for an entire day on a treadmill without food and water and claiming he can do more?
> Do you not see Uryu training for 7 days and 7 nights without rest?
> Do you not see Ichigo, Chad and Uryu spending more than a day in hueco Mundo without food and water?
> Do you not see Ichigo fighting Zangetsu for 3 full days in the SS arc?
> Do you not see Ichigo fighting for 3 months in the dangai, and Isshin holding the currents while having his rieatsu continuously drained for ENTIRE 3 MONTHS?


http://i23.mangapanda.com/bleach/249/bleach-1589747.jpg
http://i2.mangapanda.com/bleach/250/bleach-1589754.jpg
http://i32.mangapanda.com/bleach/250/bleach-1589761.jpg

Nel caught up with Ichigo who was running, making her speed atleast peak human+.


Ofcourse it is stronger than steel. Butthurt, much?


Gremmy's body was harder than steel and Kenpachi was able cut through it.

You have no idea what you're talking about lel.

Even the fodder hollow in Chapter 1 could punch through concrete walls and broke Ichigo's steel bat - http://i33.mangapanda.com/bleach/1/bleach-1585800.jpg
And left a hole through rebar - http://i2.mangapanda.com/bleach/1/bleach-1585796.jpg

Hitsugaya's ice can shatter arrancar skin, which is stated to be tougher than yards of steel.


I've already shown you a scan of Ichigo, Chad and Uryu running towards Las Noches for hours, yet not getting any closer to it.

How can it be only 10km? There are even humans who run more than a marathon's distance in that time lel.

I'll post it again - http://i40.mangapanda.com/bleach/245/bleach-1589675.jpg

This proves Las Noches is easily around a 100km in length.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
Chad kept up with and defeated a Privaron Espada, who is hypersonic+. The same Privaron is faster than Shikai Ichigo.

Even Orihime has supersonic attacks- http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-MkzWroXQhLo/TlSXlYCMdXI/AAAAAAAABEs/KWGhO8ZVrb0/015.png?imgmax=3000 (a clear sonicboom)

and fodder 4th seats can react to her. Chad one-shotted a 3rd seat long back when he was a weakling in the SS arc.


Lol human-level speed.


Food and water to survive?

> Do you not see Ichigo running for an entire day on a treadmill without food and water and claiming he can do more?
> Do you not see Uryu training for 7 days and 7 nights without rest?
> Do you not see Ichigo, Chad and Uryu spending more than a day in hueco Mundo without food and water?
> Do you not see Ichigo fighting Zangetsu for 3 full days in the SS arc?
> Do you not see Ichigo fighting for 3 months in the dangai, and Isshin holding the currents while having his rieatsu continuously drained for ENTIRE 3 MONTHS?


http://i23.mangapanda.com/bleach/249/bleach-1589747.jpg
http://i2.mangapanda.com/bleach/250/bleach-1589754.jpg
http://i32.mangapanda.com/bleach/250/bleach-1589761.jpg

Nel caught up with Ichigo who was running, making her speed atleast peak human+.


Ofcourse it is stronger than steel. Butthurt, much?


Gremmy's body was harder than steel and Kenpachi was able cut through it.

You have no idea what you're talking about lel.

Even the fodder hollow in Chapter 1 could punch through concrete walls and broke Ichigo's steel bat - http://i33.mangapanda.com/bleach/1/bleach-1585800.jpg
And left a hole through rebar - http://i2.mangapanda.com/bleach/1/bleach-1585796.jpg

Hitsugaya's ice can shatter arrancar skin, which is stated to be tougher than yards of steel.


I've already shown you a scan of Ichigo, Chad and Uryu running towards Las Noches for hours, yet not getting any closer to it.

How can it be only 10km? There are even humans who run more than a marathon's distance in that time lel.

I'll post it again - http://i40.mangapanda.com/bleach/245/bleach-1589675.jpg

This proves Las Noches is easily around a 100km in length.

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL, Battle speed=/=Running speed.

Clear sonic boom? Are you high? A sonic boom would have killed her, or at least knocked her over at that distance, considering, you know, she's A NORMAL HUMAN, LOL.

Chad used his fist shit to do that. How does that equat to his speed? LOL, you're phucking retarded.

1. Ichigo = Soul Reaper. Chad = Normal Human with arm shit.

2. Ichigo bodily needs feats =/= Chads bodily needs feats.

3. Humans can survive for a day without food and water, dumb ass.



Not to mention that Nel's statement was obviously proven wrong by everyone else traveling all over LN in just one day.

Ah, so you're saying that Ichigo's running speed IS normal human level. I see. Thanks for admitting it finally.

LOL, show some proof, dumb phuck. Hitsugaya's "steel ice" was broken by wonderweiss shouting. Wonderweiss, who got shat on by Yamamoto, who was weaker than any given Sternritter(currently), the Sternritter's that Kenpachi can shit on easily. Yes, the same Kenpachi who had trouble cutting through steel.

I have no idea what I'm talking about? You're LITERALLY saying that all Bleach characters can cut through solid steel without even giving A SINGLE FEAT! Christ, how phucking stupid can someone be?

WHERE WAS IT STATED TO BE THAT STRONG? "tougher than yards of steel", you're out of your phucking mind.

And? Again, it can be perceived to the bare minimum, or bare maximum, because there are so many variables in you shitty, flawed calc. Since you're debating an undetermined scale, you have to take the bare minimum, dumb ass. You can't just give your preferred character all kinds of bullshit, untrue feats.

Phucking dumb ass.

Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL, Battle speed=/=Running speed. What?

I never used supersonic running speed for Chad. I used a peak human running speed of 20 km/h.


Orihime's attacks are hypersonic, not herself. Anyone with common sense can understand that.

A sonic boom: http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-MkzWroXQhLo/TlSXlYCMdXI/AAAAAAAABEs/KWGhO8ZVrb0/015.png?imgmax=3000

HM chad >>> SS arc Chad >>> 3rd seat > 4th seat >> Orihime's attack = Mach 1+.


What the hell are you talking about?
If that guy was faster than Chad, he could have easily evaded his punch.

Seems like you're lacking some brain cells.

1. Chad is a fullbringer, not a normal human.

Fullbringers can run ar superhuman speeds on rooftops: http://i10.mangapanda.com/bleach/429/bleach-2403619.jpg

2. Ok, so what? Should I not remind you that Chad was in spirit form when he went to HM, and spirits have a different bodily requirement?
He even survived for several days in Soul Society without food.

3. There are humans who even survived for 10 days without food and water when they go on hunger-strike lol.
What makes you think a superhuman fighter like Chad can't?


More BS.

Thats because they rode a hollow, which was travelling at an unknown speed. If it was travelling faster than a car, ofcourse they could do it in less than a day.


I never admitted it. In this case, I've just taken it as a minimum as we don;t know how fast he was running.


I showed you enough proof. Stop repeating the same BS like a parrot.

And btw, Kenpachi has been cutting through solid skyscrapers with just the "air pressure of his swings" all the way since the SS arc
http://img.mangastream.to/manga/bleach/113/bleach-ch113-06.png

Current Kenpachi never had difficulty cutting through steel, and we don't know how much he was holding back. Apart from the fact that Gremmy's body was harder than steel.

I gave you scans. Stop ignoring them

Even the fodder hollow in Chapter 1 could punch through concrete walls and broke Ichigo's steel bat - http://i33.mangapanda.com/bleach/1/bleach-1585800.jpg
And left a hole through rebar - http://i2.mangapanda.com/bleach/1/bleach-1585796.jpg

Hitsugaya's ice >>>> fodder hollow > concrete walls and steel rebar.

Yammy's skin was stated to be hard as steel, and he's the weakest Espada in base. You'd know that if you actually read Bleach.

http://easycaptures.com/fs/uploaded/681/4961936330.jpg

Hitsugaya's ice >> Luppi's skin > Yammy's skin
I've only taken a bare minimum as we don't know its upper limit. Las Noches could be anything from 90km to a few hundred km.

So let's take it to be a minimum of 90km for your sake.

In short, all you did was throw a bunch of insults after getting upset about losing a debate.

Bring it on kiddo. Any more BS excuses? I love debunking fantards.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
What?

I never used supersonic running speed for Chad. I used a peak human running speed of 20 km/h.

Except Nel said walking. Not sprinting.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
Orihime's attacks are hypersonic, not herself. Anyone with common sense can understand that.

A sonic boom: http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-MkzWroXQh...png?imgmax=3000

HM chad >>> SS arc Chad >>> 3rd seat > 4th seat >> Orihime's attack = Mach 1+.

What basis supports that? Your perception of a sonic boom, that was obviously just her attack kicking up dust, considering even Hollow Ichigo throwing rocks at Ulquiorra didn't make sonic booms?

Is that so? Then why did Orihime actually tag several high seat soul reapers?

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
What the hell are you talking about?
If that guy was faster than Chad, he could have easily evaded his punch.

Seems like you're lacking some brain cells.

Because EVERY human can run faster than they can punch. Obviously.

Dumb ass.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
1. Chad is a fullbringer, not a normal human.

Fullbringers can run ar superhuman speeds on rooftops: http://i10.mangapanda.com/bleach/429/bleach-2403619.jpg

2. Ok, so what? Should I not remind you that Chad was in spirit form when he went to HM, and spirits have a different bodily requirement?
He even survived for several days in Soul Society without food.

3. There are humans who even survived for 10 days without food and water when they go on hunger-strike lol.
What makes you think a superhuman fighter like Chad can't?

1. Chad wasn't a fullbringer until the fullbringer arc.

http://i10.mangapanda.com/bleach/429/bleach-2403619.jpg

Key phrase, "What is he using to accelerate like that?", not "How is he running that fast?". The entire fullbring arc was stupid because normal humans using bringer light could move and maneuver faster than captains. Bringer light isn't normal movement speed, idiot, just like Sonido and flash step aren't.

2. But they still need food and water, otherwise they'll lose all their reiatsu and die, as stated in the SS arc.

Based on? We don't know if he ate or not during the SS infiltration arc, but he was in human form then, so he obviously did.

3. I know that for a fact because he's burning calories and using energy to extremes that no other human does. He probably can't go for 5 or 6 hours without food and water while fighting.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
More BS.

Thats because they rode a hollow, which was travelling at an unknown speed. If it was travelling faster than a car, ofcourse they could do it in less than a day.

Exactly, unknown. In other words, A VARIABLE. MEANING THAT YOU CAN'T MAKE ANY RELIABLE CALCS FROM IT.

Dumb ass.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
I showed you enough proof. Stop repeating the same BS like a parrot.

And btw, Kenpachi has been cutting through solid skyscrapers with just the "air pressure of his swings" all the way since the SS arc
http://img.mangastream.to/manga/ble...ch-ch113-06.png

Current Kenpachi never had difficulty cutting through steel, and we don't know how much he was holding back. Apart from the fact that Gremmy's body was harder than steel.

In your biased, twisted opinion. When someone can poke innumerable holes in it like I did, there's obviously a problem with it.

And? Those "skyscrapers(which are actually just normal sized building, not the skyscrapers like in Ichigo's soul world)" are made of simple reishi, in case you've forgotten. The same type of material that the concrete Orihime fractured was made from.

Actually, he kind of did. Him failing to cut with his initial swing was proof that he was surprised that Gremmy was as hard as steel. Otherwise, he wouldn't have been able to easily slice through Noitora in a MUCH weaker form.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
I gave you scans. Stop ignoring them

Even the fodder hollow in Chapter 1 could punch through concrete walls and broke Ichigo's steel bat - http://i33.mangapanda.com/bleach/1/bleach-1585800.jpg
And left a hole through rebar - http://i2.mangapanda.com/bleach/1/bleach-1585796.jpg

Hitsugaya's ice >>>> fodder hollow > concrete walls and steel rebar.

Scans? Of WHAT? You've shown NO SCANS WHATSOEVER proving that Hitsugaya's ice>steel.

When was the bat stated to be steel? A much more common metal to make bats with is aluminum, and even then it's still hollow. Otherwise you couldn't bend them by hitting a tree with them.

You mean a hole left through a wall of unknown material? It was a simple building, so dry wall is what we must assume it to be. That is unimpressive as ****.

Solid steel>>>>>Hitsugaya's bankai Ice>>>>Fodder hollow>Dry wall and hollow aluminum.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
Yammy's skin was stated to be hard as steel, and he's the weakest Espada in base. You'd know that if you actually read Bleach.

http://easycaptures.com/fs/uploaded/681/4961936330.jpg

Hitsugaya's ice >> Luppi's skin > Yammy's skin

Once again, since you failed to understand the first time, Name of attack=/=Effect of the attack.

You obviously don't know what hierro translates to. Hint, that's why Ulq. said steel skin, and not steel hard skin. Idiot.

BTW, luppi broke out of Hitsugaya's ice.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
I've only taken a bare minimum as we don't know its upper limit. Las Noches could be anything from 90km to a few hundred km.

So let's take it to be a minimum of 90km for your sake.

Again, for the last time, YOU CANNOT CALC SOMETHING RELIABLY WHEN THE RESULTS CAN BE VARIED FROM 10KM TO 100KM.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
In short, all you did was completely prove me wrong by punching indisputable holes in my failed calcs, and shit all over my retarded, fanbiased argument that a three year old could debunk.

Bring it on kiddo. Any more BS excuses? I love debunking fantards like myself in my own comment.

This is obviously what you meant.

Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
Except Nel said walking. Not sprinting. Except I'm talking about this:
http://i40.mangapanda.com/bleach/245/bleach-1589675.jpg

and not the 3 day walk statement.

"No matter how much we run and run and run it doesn't feel like we're getting any closer"


As for the 3 day walk statement, consider that Chad walks 30-40km per day, and you'll end up with 90-120km for LN.

Except that there was no dust around when Orihime used that attack. It was in mid-air.
The air around moved as a shockwave, proving that the attack was atleast Mach 1.


Plot device.

Even a 4th seat easily dispatches Orihime's attack
http://i10.mangapanda.com/bleach/91/bleach-10858.jpg
http://i26.mangapanda.com/bleach/91/bleach-10859.jpg



I'm not talking about running. I'm talking about dodging (aka. reactions).

Think before what you're talking about.



Where is it stated that they'll die if they don't eat? They never took any food supplies with them when they infiltrated SS.

Even during the dangai training, Ichigo and Isshin didn't eat for 3 months.


He isn't in human form once he gets past the Senkaimon (their bodies get converted to Reishi)

http://i28.mangapanda.com/bleach/70/bleach-10422.jpg

And there are humans who have run for 23 hours continuous. So walking 10 hours a day isn't a big deal.


I never used the speed of the hollow Bawabawa to prove its size. You brought it up. I was only using peak human walking speeds for 3 days (ie. 4km/h) but you keep twisting facts.

Ok, any more insults?

I'm pretty disappointed in you.


In your biased, twisted opinion. When someone can poke innumerable holes in it like I did, there's obviously a problem with it.

And? Those "skyscrapers(which are actually just normal sized building, not the skyscrapers like in Ichigo's soul world)" are made of simple reishi, in case you've forgotten. The same type of material that the concrete Orihime fractured was made from.


Obviously because he was holding back, duh.

Anyways, Gremmy's body was MORE RESISTANT than steel http://i16.mangapanda.com/bleach/573/bleach-4850137.jpg



Walls are made of concrete. the fodder hollow made a hole through it.

Hitsu's ice >>>> Fodder hollow > Concrete, so its capable of destroying all the concrete buildings within 24 km making it city level.


Hierro translates to iron skin, but its also supported by several statements taht its so hard.

A fodder fraccion states blades are useless against Hierro skin, and this Ikkaku's sword is more durable than a normal steel sword.

http://i5.mangapanda.com/bleach/203/bleach-13263.jpg



You cannot get 10km no matter how hard you try to downplay.

90 km is the bare MINIMUM. I'm only taking minimum values, nothing else.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
Except I'm talking about this:
http://i40.mangapanda.com/bleach/245/bleach-1589675.jpg

and not the 3 day walk statement.

"No matter how much we run and run and run it doesn't feel like we're getting any closer"


As for the 3 day walk statement, consider that Chad walks 30-40km per day, and you'll end up with 90-120km for LN.

Except that there was no dust around when Orihime used that attack. It was in mid-air.
The air around moved as a shockwave, proving that the attack was atleast Mach 1.


Plot device.

Even a 4th seat easily dispatches Orihime's attack
http://i10.mangapanda.com/bleach/91/bleach-10858.jpg
http://i26.mangapanda.com/bleach/91/bleach-10859.jpg



I'm not talking about running. I'm talking about dodging (aka. reactions).

Think before what you're talking about.



Where is it stated that they'll die if they don't eat? They never took any food supplies with them when they infiltrated SS.

Even during the dangai training, Ichigo and Isshin didn't eat for 3 months.


He isn't in human form once he gets past the Senkaimon (their bodies get converted to Reishi)

http://i28.mangapanda.com/bleach/70/bleach-10422.jpg

And there are humans who have run for 23 hours continuous. So walking 10 hours a day isn't a big deal.


I never used the speed of the hollow Bawabawa to prove its size. You brought it up. I was only using peak human walking speeds for 3 days (ie. 4km/h) but you keep twisting facts.

Ok, any more insults?

I'm pretty disappointed in you.


In your biased, twisted opinion. When someone can poke innumerable holes in it like I did, there's obviously a problem with it.

And? Those "skyscrapers(which are actually just normal sized building, not the skyscrapers like in Ichigo's soul world)" are made of simple reishi, in case you've forgotten. The same type of material that the concrete Orihime fractured was made from.


Obviously because he was holding back, duh.

Anyways, Gremmy's body was MORE RESISTANT than steel http://i16.mangapanda.com/bleach/573/bleach-4850137.jpg



Walls are made of concrete. the fodder hollow made a hole through it.

Hitsu's ice >>>> Fodder hollow > Concrete, so its capable of destroying all the concrete buildings within 24 km making it city level.


Hierro translates to iron skin, but its also supported by several statements taht its so hard.

A fodder fraccion states blades are useless against Hierro skin, and this Ikkaku's sword is more durable than a normal steel sword.

http://i5.mangapanda.com/bleach/203/bleach-13263.jpg



You cannot get 10km no matter how hard you try to downplay.

90 km is the bare MINIMUM. I'm only taking minimum values, nothing else.

That doesn't matter. It still doesn't show how long they were running. They could have been running for ten minutes, and you're assuming because of one statement that they were running for days.

Which obviously isn't true. Again, it took them all only a few hours to travel all over LN WHILE fighting espada in their down time.

It obviously takes less than three days to walk it, unless you're a little girl like Nel that can't keep her attention span.

So anything that moves air is mach 1? So me fanning myself with a hand is mach 1? Nice logic pal.

Exactly. Bleach is riddled with plot devices like that, but you're only taking them into account unless they are detrimental to your argument. The plot devices like Nel keeping up with Ichigo, or Chad keeping up with people much faster than him. You're ignoring all these, so I'll ignore this one, meaning Orihime is, as I said earlier, A NORMAL ****ING HUMAN.

And? Chad can't run faster than a normal human, but he can keep up with people who can go about mach 10? Sounds like something you JUST brought up doesn't it? A plot device.

I don't have the scan or remember when it was stated, but you can probably remember this part if you try. It was when Rukia and Renji were kids, and no one had to eat outside of the soul reapers. Rukia got hungry, and a newly appointed soul reaper told her that if she didn't eat, she'd be dead in a few hours. That's what I'm talking about.

I forgot about that, it's been so long since I read Bleach. Anyway, a normal human can jog for 24 hours continuously, IF they are constantly eating healthy and drinking plenty of water while doing so. Otherwise, their bodies will completely drain themselves, and they'll run on their fat reserves, and completely destroy their internal organs by not sustaining them. So, that literally means nothing.

So now you ARE using the three day statement? Again, there's no indication of LN's size, because Nel said it took three days to walk across it, which is obviously a... what's it called, plot device?, and they rode on Bawawa to get to LN. There is NO cannon measure of LN.

OBVIOUSLY he was holding back. However, are you saying that Gremmy is weaker than Kenny when he fought Giriko? He's obviously not. Kenny was surprised at how strong Gremmy was, otherwise he wouldn't have needed to slash again to cut him. He would have been able to just because he was so much stronger than he used to be. However, he couldn't. He needed to use more strength than he did on Giriko, even though Kenny was much stronger than when he shat on Giriko. Unless you're saying that Kenny couldn't have broke Hitsugaya's ice casually with the same force that Gremmy easily blocked, then Hitsugaya's ice is NOWHERE NEAR steel level.

Where did it say that? Nowhere. Again, for all we know, those walls were made of common dry wall, making that feat unimpressive.

I can by arguing that Nel is a child, and can only walk about 2 hours a day at 2 km per hour, without food or water, as even Reishi beings need. This brings us to a total distance of 12 km crossed in three days, which is more accurate than your silly 90 km calc that puts a four year old at 4 km per hour walking for 12 hours a day.

Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
That doesn't matter. It still doesn't show how long they were running. They could have been running for ten minutes, and you're assuming because of one statement that they were running for days.Wrong. Ichigo won't collapse if they ran only for 10 minutes, as he's shown the ability to run for an entire day on a treadmill.

So they ran atleast a day's worth distance.

He can easily run an Ultra-marathon worth distance if he can run continuously for a day http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultramarathon


That's because Ichigo was flying at Hypersonic+ speeds and not walking.


Wrong. I've already proved it does since Ichigo and co ran towards it for hours yet didn't get any closer.


Fanning yourself with a fan doesn't create a sonicboom, which Orihime's attack created.


http://www.imageupload.co.uk/images/2014/04/08/3QGACo.jpg

Do an attack like this and show me, which creates a visible sonicboom in midair.

No normal human can beat a hollow who has enough power to punch through concrete.

Orihime's attack creating a sonicboom has nothing to do with plot. You're conveniently trying to bring up excuses because fodders in Bleach like Orihime and 4th seats are supersonic+.


Who said Chad can't run faster than a normal human? You're the one who brought that up.

Chad beating a hypersonic+ Privaron Espada was a feat to show Chad's power, not a plot device.


That's why I'm using 12 hours of WALKING with 12 hours of rest. not running

If a human gets to sleep for 12 hours, he can easily restore his energy and 12 hours walking at 4 km/h makes it 48 km per day.

I have 2 proofs to quantify LN as Island sized:
1. Nel's statement of a 3 day walk
2. Ichigo and his friends running for hours and still not getting any closer

Bawabawa's speed is not required, so stop bringing that up.

Doesn't matter. Gremmy said his body was MORE resistant than steel

And its obviously a low showing like Whitebeard getting killed by bullets.

What dry wall? That's a building and building walls are made of concrete.

If fodder hollows can punch through buildings, Hitsugaya's ice is definitely strong enough to destroy buildings within 24km, making it city+ level.

I've also shown you scans of Ikkaku's blade being blocked by arrancar skin with his bare hands, and that blade is atleast as durable as a normal steel sword.

Oh wait...how do you think she survived all these years in HM without food and water? Lel.

Nel is a hollow and doesn't need food and water. Hollow's survive on the nourishment that HM's atmosphere provides.

Even if she sleeps for 9 hours everyday and walks for 15 hours at 2 km/h, she can walk 30 km a day making it 90km. And Nel was obviously referring to Ichigo (who she thinks is superhuman), and wasn't taking any resting time into account, so it should be atleast 90km no matter how much you try to downplay.

Even an observant guy like Ishida never objected to that statement.

Ulquiorra for the win hes clearly planet level lol


Clearly fanboying but nah foreal he is in between city and country level

He's just city level

Nothing in Bleach is island level, let alone country level

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
Wrong. Ichigo won't collapse if they ran only for 10 minutes, as he's shown the ability to run for an entire day on a treadmill.

So they ran atleast a day's worth distance.

He can easily run an Ultra-marathon worth distance if he can run continuously for a day http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultramarathon


That's because Ichigo was flying at Hypersonic+ speeds and not walking.


Wrong. I've already proved it does since Ichigo and co ran towards it for hours yet didn't get any closer.


Fanning yourself with a fan doesn't create a sonicboom, which Orihime's attack created.


http://www.imageupload.co.uk/images/2014/04/08/3QGACo.jpg

Do an attack like this and show me, which creates a visible sonicboom in midair.

No normal human can beat a hollow who has enough power to punch through concrete.

Orihime's attack creating a sonicboom has nothing to do with plot. You're conveniently trying to bring up excuses because fodders in Bleach like Orihime and 4th seats are supersonic+.


Who said Chad can't run faster than a normal human? You're the one who brought that up.

Chad beating a hypersonic+ Privaron Espada was a feat to show Chad's power, not a plot device.


That's why I'm using 12 hours of WALKING with 12 hours of rest. not running

If a human gets to sleep for 12 hours, he can easily restore his energy and 12 hours walking at 4 km/h makes it 48 km per day.

I have 2 proofs to quantify LN as Island sized:
1. Nel's statement of a 3 day walk
2. Ichigo and his friends running for hours and still not getting any closer

Bawabawa's speed is not required, so stop bringing that up.

Doesn't matter. Gremmy said his body was MORE resistant than steel

And its obviously a low showing like Whitebeard getting killed by bullets.

What dry wall? That's a building and building walls are made of concrete.

If fodder hollows can punch through buildings, Hitsugaya's ice is definitely strong enough to destroy buildings within 24km, making it city+ level.

I've also shown you scans of Ikkaku's blade being blocked by arrancar skin with his bare hands, and that blade is atleast as durable as a normal steel sword.

Oh wait...how do you think she survived all these years in HM without food and water? Lel.

Nel is a hollow and doesn't need food and water. Hollow's survive on the nourishment that HM's atmosphere provides.

Even if she sleeps for 9 hours everyday and walks for 15 hours at 2 km/h, she can walk 30 km a day making it 90km. And Nel was obviously referring to Ichigo (who she thinks is superhuman), and wasn't taking any resting time into account, so it should be atleast 90km no matter how much you try to downplay.

Even an observant guy like Ishida never objected to that statement.

I'm done with this stupid excuse for a debate. Everyone on here, even the people I constantly disagree with, can see that you're clearly fan-wanking Bleach so out of proportion, it's not even funny.

At this point, it would just me be repeating myself constantly though, as you seem to enjoy avoiding other peoples arguments to give yourself a false sense of superiority. Whatever helps you sleep at night, man.

Nel never said that the Gate was on the other aside of the dome. She was pointing in the direction of the desert and said "it's that direction". So she's probably referring to another under tunnel gate (like the other gate) that leads into the dome. There were no ground lvl doors and that climate was man-made, iirc.

Also, isn't the population of arrancars only in the hundreds? Why create a country sized dome for such a small population?

Btw, I don't think that is an actual sonic boom.

I also have to point out the nail in the coffin. Reji implies that it would take them 3 days to travel the Gate and that it would be troublesome. Yet everyone gets to the center of the dome in less than a day. So for the Gate to be near the dome doesn't make much sense...

Looking at even closer Orihime's attack doesn't even look like a SB cone...

Originally posted by StealthRanger
He's just city level

Nothing in Bleach is island level, let alone country level

Alright then, provide some scans for proof please.
You know what's the funny thing about you? You never ever provide proof for your statements.

Just so I'm clear here.

http://www.mangastream.to/bleach-chapter-364-page-10.html

This is the country busting level explosion up for discussion?

Originally posted by AuraAngel
Just so I'm clear here.

http://www.mangastream.to/bleach-chapter-364-page-10.html

This is the country busting level explosion up for discussion?

Yes.

Ah. Well then.

It is not country busting level.

/settled argument.

Originally posted by AuraAngel
Ah. Well then.

It is not country busting level.

/settled argument.

No you didn't.
Las Noches is at least Island Sized to Country Sized. Going by that, and if you take a look at Lanza, you will see that you can stack at least 4 to 5 Las Noches's on top of each other, and it might reach to its full height.
Lanza is also longer then Las Noches's entire width.

Las Noches is probably more than city sized since Aizen had to do quite a bit of exploring to find Vasto Lords.

Means nothing though. Ulquiorra's Lanza is not country busting.

Lol at lowballing the size of a country in order to shoe horn a label on a feat.

Originally posted by AuraAngel
Las Noches is probably more than city sized since Aizen had to do quite a bit of exploring to find Vasto Lords.

Means nothing though. Ulquiorra's Lanza is not country busting.

It is.
Lanza's height was many many times longer then Las Noches itself, its a Island to small or mid country buster.
It's width is far longer then Las Noches's short side.
It's speed is insane.

The height of the Lanza is sort of irrelevant. The width is all that matters and the width isn't the length of a country no matter how you look at it.

Besides if the Lanza is a country buster then why does Las Noches remain?

Originally posted by AuraAngel
The height of the Lanza is sort of irrelevant. The width is all that matters and the width isn't the length of a country no matter how you look at it.

Besides if the Lanza is a country buster then why does Las Noches remain?


Both width and height is relevant, and Lanza's width is far far longer then Las Noches's short side.
Only reason why Las Noches remained is because it was thrown lol, have you read the manga? It was thrown quite a ways from Las Noches.
And yet Lanza's shock-waves was so powerful that it utterly crumbled a structure in HM, and HM structures are incredibly resilient. The trees are made of quartz.
Not only that, but the shock-waves were felt all the way back at Las Noches.
I don't quite know what your smocking, but it must be something.
Anyway, if height doesn't matter, then why do Naruto fans make such a big deal out of a attacks height?
Because it does matter.

Learn2English mate and try to keep up.

1. The height does not matter in terms of destruction capacity unless you're comparing it to real life things like the Atom bomb. What is most important is seeing the aftermath of the explosion.

2. We never see the aftermath of the explosion. No giant crater, nothing ruined, and nothing really noteworthy. We see the characters above the dome react but frankly they don't matter. If someone like, say, Rukia(being below the dome when it hit) were to say something like "wow that could've taken out a mountain!" or some such then we'd have an argument. As is, you have no real aftermath to the lanza's impact.

3. Which leaves us looking before the explosion. What did the Lanza actually bust that makes it worthy of the term "country busting"? Not a lot. I saw some pillars in the distance and...that is literally all. This isn't a country busting attack. We know Roshi can destroy the moon because he did so. We know Freeza and those above him can destroy planets because he did so. We can't call the attack country busting because there was nothing busted except a few pillars.

4. Height in Naruto is also less important. Observe how most of the scaling is done by width and comparisons of the aftermath, rather than the height of the explosions. In Naruto the damage is clearly done and that is what matters for feats.

5. If I were a lesser, ruder man I could say that the insistence of the Lanza being a country buster implies a Napoleon complex over the power levels of something you like. But I shan't say such a rude thing and acknowledge my own errors. Namely that I was forgetting the difference between Las Noches and Hueco Mundo as most of the story takes place in the former. Hueco Mundo is the size of a country. Las Noches not so much.

6. You are the person who dismissed the Sage's creation of the moon as something one "cant use to scale how much the Sage can bust" which is a frankly hypocritical statement since the creation of the moon does in fact show the Sage as plenty capable of busting a country(because we know how Chibaku Tensei works). Yet Ulquiorra's lanza, which hasn't busted anything short of a couple pillars, gets contorted into country busting.

Don't we see Ulq and Ichigo fighting around those roof pillars?

Originally posted by AuraAngel
Learn2English mate and try to keep up.

1. The height does not matter in terms of destruction capacity unless you're comparing it to real life things like the Atom bomb. What is most important is seeing the aftermath of the explosion.

2. We never see the aftermath of the explosion. No giant crater, nothing ruined, and nothing really noteworthy. We see the characters above the dome react but frankly they don't matter. If someone like, say, Rukia(being below the dome when it hit) were to say something like "wow that could've taken out a mountain!" or some such then we'd have an argument. As is, you have no real aftermath to the lanza's impact.

3. Which leaves us looking before the explosion. What did the Lanza actually bust that makes it worthy of the term "country busting"? Not a lot. I saw some pillars in the distance and...that is literally all. This isn't a country busting attack. We know Roshi can destroy the moon because he did so. We know Freeza and those above him can destroy planets because he did so. We can't call the attack country busting because there was nothing busted except a few pillars.

4. Height in Naruto is also less important. Observe how most of the scaling is done by width and comparisons of the aftermath, rather than the height of the explosions. In Naruto the damage is clearly done and that is what matters for feats.

5. If I were a lesser, ruder man I could say that the insistence of the Lanza being a country buster implies a Napoleon complex over the power levels of something you like. But I shan't say such a rude thing and acknowledge my own errors. Namely that I was forgetting the difference between Las Noches and Hueco Mundo as most of the story takes place in the former. Hueco Mundo is the size of a country. Las Noches not so much.

6. You are the person who dismissed the Sage's creation of the moon as something one "cant use to scale how much the Sage can bust" which is a frankly hypocritical statement since the creation of the moon does in fact show the Sage as plenty capable of busting a country(because we know how Chibaku Tensei works). Yet Ulquiorra's lanza, which hasn't busted anything short of a couple pillars, gets contorted into country busting.

Not saying I agree with what they said but the main reasons they believe it's country level is because:

The 3 days statement
The fact Ichigo and co ran for hours or longer and it didn't look any closer

http://www.mangastream.to/bleach-chapter-248-page-6.html

The three days statement pertains to traveling an unspecified amount of Las Noche's circumference, not its diameter. Which as we all know is Pi times more than the diameter.

The "three days to cross" claim is looking hokier by the moment. It's also relying on the word of a ****ing little girl to be accurate.

Originally posted by AuraAngel
Learn2English mate and try to keep up.

1. The height does not matter in terms of destruction capacity unless you're comparing it to real life things like the Atom bomb. What is most important is seeing the aftermath of the explosion.

2. We never see the aftermath of the explosion. No giant crater, nothing ruined, and nothing really noteworthy. We see the characters above the dome react but frankly they don't matter. If someone like, say, Rukia(being below the dome when it hit) were to say something like "wow that could've taken out a mountain!" or some such then we'd have an argument. As is, you have no real aftermath to the lanza's impact.

3. Which leaves us looking before the explosion. What did the Lanza actually bust that makes it worthy of the term "country busting"? Not a lot. I saw some pillars in the distance and...that is literally all. This isn't a country busting attack. We know Roshi can destroy the moon because he did so. We know Freeza and those above him can destroy planets because he did so. We can't call the attack country busting because there was nothing busted except a few pillars.

4. Height in Naruto is also less important. Observe how most of the scaling is done by width and comparisons of the aftermath, rather than the height of the explosions. In Naruto the damage is clearly done and that is what matters for feats.

5. If I were a lesser, ruder man I could say that the insistence of the Lanza being a country buster implies a Napoleon complex over the power levels of something you like. But I shan't say such a rude thing and acknowledge my own errors. Namely that I was forgetting the difference between Las Noches and Hueco Mundo as most of the story takes place in the former. Hueco Mundo is the size of a country. Las Noches not so much.

6. You are the person who dismissed the Sage's creation of the moon as something one "cant use to scale how much the Sage can bust" which is a frankly hypocritical statement since the creation of the moon does in fact show the Sage as plenty capable of busting a country(because we know how Chibaku Tensei works). Yet Ulquiorra's lanza, which hasn't busted anything short of a couple pillars, gets contorted into country busting.


Only reason why I said that about the Sage making the moon, is because we don't know how large it is, and how large the landmass's used were, don't twist what I say.

Err what? The battle wasn't meant to focus on a technique. Anyway, Lanza forced a shit ton of sand to blow everywhere, key word is sand, Hueco Mundo is a sandy world, certainly you cant have craters made from sand can you?
Also, Lanza's shock waves busted those pillars, not the technique itself. There was nothing out there for it to bust.

I've noticed plenty of debaters brag about a Naruto techniques height before, it might be an assumption, but I'm pretty sure height does have some relevance, after all, the scaling of the first from Juubi's TBB almost always has its height mentioned.

Hueco Mundo is far far larger then a country dude.

What are you trying to say about my English?
Because I'm quite certain I write fairly better then a bunch of other people.

Originally posted by NemeBro
http://www.mangastream.to/bleach-chapter-248-page-6.html

The three days statement pertains to traveling an unspecified amount of Las Noche's circumference, not its diameter. Which as we all know is Pi times more than the diameter.

The "three days to cross" claim is looking hokier by the moment. It's also relying on the word of a ****ing little girl to be accurate.


That girl was a former Espada, and basically everything else she said was accurate.
Even without her memories she clearly held a lot of information about Hueco Mundo.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Don't we see Ulq and Ichigo fighting around those roof pillars? There are scans of LN in which the pillars are not even visible

Originally posted by NemeBro
http://www.mangastream.to/bleach-chapter-248-page-6.html

The three days statement pertains to traveling an unspecified amount of Las Noche's circumference, not its diameter. Which as we all know is Pi times more than the diameter.
Las Noches is a square/rectangle, not a circle. There's got to be a gate along each of its 4 sides, or she would have told them to take a turn at the side (not walk continuously for 3 days)

None of them objected to the statement after seeing Las Noches' size, so its accurate.

And finally:

http://i40.mangapanda.com/bleach/245/bleach-1589675.jpg

Country sized Las Noches confirmed!

Originally posted by Kaldin
Only reason why I said that about the Sage making the moon, is because we don't know how large it is, and how large the landmass's used were, don't twist what I say.

Err what? The battle wasn't meant to focus on a technique. Anyway, Lanza forced a shit ton of sand to blow everywhere, key word is sand, Hueco Mundo is a sandy world, certainly you cant have craters made from sand can you?
Also, Lanza's shock waves busted those pillars, not the technique itself. There was nothing out there for it to bust.

I've noticed plenty of debaters brag about a Naruto techniques height before, it might be an assumption, but I'm pretty sure height does have some relevance, after all, the scaling of the first from Juubi's TBB almost always has its height mentioned.

Hueco Mundo is far far larger then a country dude.

What are you trying to say about my English?
Because I'm quite certain I write fairly better then a bunch of other people.

Yet we know how much mass is in our moon and thus can make a reasonable assumption as to how much mass is in Naruto moons. Better than building is the size of Texas.

Goku vs Roshi wasn't really about the moon either. Didn't stop the characters from noticing that the moon was gone. Or Kakashi commenting that Bijuu Bomb level mountains in passing.

And are you implying that the attack you suggest is country busting can't leave so much as a single crater(or any noteworthy change) in the desert?

And that is probably because the explosion is hundred of miles away.

Not really.

Originally posted by AuraAngel
Yet we know how much mass is in our moon and thus can make a reasonable assumption as to how much mass is in Naruto moons. Better than building is the size of Texas.

Goku vs Roshi wasn't really about the moon either. Didn't stop the characters from noticing that the moon was gone. Or Kakashi commenting that Bijuu Bomb level mountains in passing.

And are you implying that the attack you suggest is country busting can't leave so much as a single crater(or any noteworthy change) in the desert?

And that is probably because the explosion is hundred of miles away.

Not really.

First of, we can't use our moon for Naruto, since the moon in Naruto is a lot closer to their worlds orbit.
No change in the dessert? What are you talking about? http://img.mangastream.to/manga/bleach/351/M7_Bleach_Ch351_08.png
Notice the massive amount of sand blasting in the air?
Anyway, the Manga wasn't focused on the Lanza, it was focused on the battle, even still, it was made out to be a big deal that Lanza can be spammed.

Originally posted by Kaldin
First of, we can't use our moon for Naruto, since the moon in Naruto is a lot closer to their worlds orbit. Is it?

Originally posted by Kaldin
First of, we can't use our moon for Naruto, since the moon in Naruto is a lot closer to their worlds orbit.
No change in the dessert? What are you talking about? http://img.mangastream.to/manga/bleach/351/M7_Bleach_Ch351_08.png
Notice the massive amount of sand blasting in the air?
Anyway, the Manga wasn't focused on the Lanza, it was focused on the battle, even still, it was made out to be a big deal that Lanza can be spammed.

Proof of this?
And no change as in no one comments on any sort of change in the environment.

Blasting sand into the air? Dude, a country busting explosion would completely vaporize the sand lol.

Saying the manga doesn't focus on the lanza is not an argument. It is a pitiful excuse for why this showing doesn't have the feats you want for some reason.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Is it?

In almost all of the pictures and scans depicting the moon in Naruto, it is depicted very close to their worlds orbit, but note it was an assumption.
I could be wrong.

Originally posted by AuraAngel
Proof of this?
And no change as in no one comments on any sort of change in the environment.

Blasting sand into the air? Dude, a country busting explosion would completely vaporize the sand lol.

Saying the manga doesn't focus on the lanza is not an argument. It is a pitiful excuse for why this showing doesn't have the feats you want for some reason.

I already posted my reasons to Neme, read that if you want.
The sand that was blasted was not inside the blast radius, all that says is that its strong enough to blast sand into the air that is higher then Las Noches itself, sand that is not in its actual blast radius.
There clearly would have been a sand crater or a hole in the sand, but it wasn't shown.

Choose a better argument.
Saying that Lanza had no focus is an argument, since it didn't. It wasn't meant to have any focus.
Kubo doesn't focus on those sorts of things.
When he does its kinda stupid.

Originally posted by Kaldin
I already posted my reasons to Neme, read that if you want.
The sand that was blasted was not inside the blast radius, all that says is that its strong enough to blast sand into the air that is higher then Las Noches itself, sand that is not in its actual blast radius.
There clearly would have been a sand crater or a hole in the sand, but it wasn't shown.

Choose a better argument.
Saying that Lanza had no focus is an argument, since it didn't. It wasn't meant to have any focus.
Kubo doesn't focus on those sorts of things.
When he does its kinda stupid.

Not good reasons then.
You don't understand. A country busting explosion would destroy all the sand. The three hills of sand in between the explosion and Las Noches would no longer be there.

Then why should we care about it at all? If we should not care about it then we shouldn't talk about it. But people are insisting that it is a country buster, we have to look at it. And what we see is that it isn't destroying anything to make it remotely close to country busting.

Originally posted by AuraAngel
Not good reasons then.
You don't understand. A country busting explosion would destroy all the sand. The three hills of sand in between the explosion and Las Noches would no longer be there.

Then why should we care about it at all? If we should not care about it then we shouldn't talk about it. But people are insisting that it is a country buster, we have to look at it. And what we see is that it isn't destroying anything to make it remotely close to country busting.

I've actually never outright stated that Lanza is country level. I think of a country level Lanza as high end.
I lean more towards island level actually, which I said not so long ago. I don't even know why we are debating something like this lol.

Originally posted by Kaldin
I've actually never outright stated that Lanza is country level. I think of a country level Lanza as high end.
I lean more towards island level actually, which I said not so long ago. I don't even know why we are debating something like this lol.

Exactly. This entire argument is stupid.

You, and especially Blazing storm, are basing this entire "country level Lanza" rubbish, on the SOLE fact that the view from their perspectives didn't change in an unknown time-frame.

As per the scan, there are three hills of sand that are roughly... I guess about a sixth of LN itself. That means that LN is NO bigger than a large mountain, or high-balled two. Not country sized. Not continent sized. Not planet sized.

For christ sake, when are you people NOT sniffing Jenkem?

Dude they're really ****ing big hills. Each one is the size of a very large city.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Dude they're really ****ing big hills. Each one is the size of a very large city.

No, they're at least continent sized.

Get it right, Nemebro.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Dude they're really ****ing big hills. Each one is the size of a very large city.

I'm surprised, but I'm actually going to have to agree with you on this one.

Originally posted by SSJGGogeta


As per the scan, there are three hills of sand that are roughly... I guess about a sixth of LN itself. That means that LN is NO bigger than a large mountain, or high-balled two. Those "hills" are actually sand dunes of an unknown size. So it doesn't restrict their size to that of a mountain

And finally, stop pixel scaling

Wouldnt that put everybody above ulquiorra country level plus?

Didn't Inoue and Ishida fly up from the ground to the top of Le Nachos to meet Ulq and Ichi at their battle?


Anyhow the size has been calc'd to small Town size based on scaling Bawabawa to its walls. Not a childs quote or the trio running, which makes less sense as their little run where they didn't even get closer is contradicted by them riding Bawa and swiftly getting there while moving at their running speed. Didn't take 3 days either.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
Those "hills" are actually sand dunes of an unknown size. So it doesn't restrict their size to that of a mountain

And finally, stop pixel scaling

Yes, and you of all logic-tards, should know that sand dunes cannot physically grow past 300 or so meters tall. The conditions of a desert are too windy to support a structure of sand taller than that.

And finally, that is exactly what you're doing by judging the size of Ulquiorra's attack compared to LN in the first place.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Didn't Inoue and Ishida fly up from the ground to the top of Le Nachos to meet Ulq and Ichi at their battle?


Anyhow the size has been calc'd to small Town size based on scaling Bawabawa to its walls. Not a childs quote or the trio running, which makes less sense as their little run where they didn't even get closer is contradicted by them riding Bawa and swiftly getting there while moving at their running speed. Didn't take 3 days either.

Not exactly from the ground, but you could calc it to be roughly half the size, in the same respect. That alone should account for how small it actually is.

Exactly, not to mention the supporting sand dune scaling, and several other hill-mountain sized indicators.

BS just can't stop spouting... well, bs.

Fair enough but even so, unless they were at the very, very tip it would at least take hours to rise up there right? Knock all this up to inconsistancy and a very unreliable source.

Town sized Lanza it is Town level. A million times below Island, billion below Country.

Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
Yes, and you of all logic-tards, should know that sand dunes cannot physically grow past 300 or so meters tall. The conditions of a desert are too windy to support a structure of sand taller than that.

And finally, that is exactly what you're doing by judging the size of Ulquiorra's attack compared to LN in the first place.





Idk there could be a 300 meter sand dune out there in Egypt or Australia

Playin devils advocate 😎

Originally posted by BloodRain
Fair enough but even so, unless they were at the very, very tip it would at least take hours to rise up there right? Knock all this up to inconsistancy and a very unreliable source.

Town sized Lanza it is Town level. A million times below Island, billion below Country. > Town sized
> Doesn't change in size despite them running for hours.

U wot m8??


Originally posted by BloodRain
Didn't Inoue and Ishida fly up from the ground to the top of Le Nachos to meet Ulq and Ichi at their battle?And no one knows their speed or how much time they took


It was calced to be city level+ and thats assuming that author's draw everything to scale, WHICH THEY DON'T!

Hey wait, let me scale the planet's in DBZ in a similar way...http://lounge.moviecodec.com/vs-general/planet-namek-size-calc-legit-333524/

> Town level Frieza confirmed!

Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
Yes, and you of all logic-tards, should know that sand dunes cannot physically grow past 300 or so meters tall. The conditions of a desert are too windy to support a structure of sand taller than that.

And finally, that is exactly what you're doing by judging the size of Ulquiorra's attack compared to LN in the first place.



Except that Las Noches isn't your ordinary desert and was never shown to have extremely windy conditions

Running is directly contradicted by them riding Bawabawa at their running speed right up to the walls, in a short time. This either means that old Bawa there can slither dozens of times faster than Ichigo can run, or you think they were riding for around a day.

We see them in motion.


Newer calc has it as Town, unless you can share the link. Iirc everyone there agrees on Town+. Not to be judgy but just seeing where it came from.. anyhow, that was initially and soundly refused as complete bs. Even taking a quarter second to look at it shows he's not using the actual spehere. Most of all its easily contradicted by..... Everything :l.

Now, why is that different? First this size makes sense with what happens inside. Second is that nothing contradicts it. All you have is a child's word and that running seen, both washed away by the fact that later we see them swidftly get there on Bawabawa :/

Originally posted by BloodRain
Running is directly contradicted by them riding Bawabawa at their running speed right up to the walls, in a short time. This either means that old Bawa there can slither dozens of times faster than Ichigo can run, or you think they were riding for around a day.

We see them in motion.Yes, Bawabawa may be many times faster than a peak human, and they may have taken a few hours to reach it.

If Bawabawa can slither at 50 or 100 miles/hr, he can cross a large Island or a small country in the given time. So better not bring up Bawabawa since his speed is unknown and so is the timeframe.

The initial calc: http://www.narutoforums.com/blog.php?bt=69327 (5.6 km is small city sized)

The latest calc: http://www.narutoforums.com/blog.php?b=20129 (39-40 Megatons is city+)



There are many things that contradict Lanza being only town level:

1. Neither Ichigo or Renji or Uryu objected to Nel's statement after they had reached Las Noches. This means they couldn't even see the farthest end.

2. Even if you use peak human speeds for Ichigo and co. (20 km/hr) and consider they ran towards it for 3-4 hours, its over 50 km.

3. Las Noches has a sky and a climate of its own, and its roof was so high that everyone thought it was a real sky and not an artificial roof. So its height can't just be 500m



As for the scaling calc, the mistake he made is that Bawabawa was closer to the observer than Las Noches in the scan he used: http://i35.mangapanda.com/bleach/247/bleach-1589767.jpg

They hadn't reached Las Noches yet and were still riding. So once Bawabawa reaches the wall, he may appear much smaller than he did in the scan.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
Yes, Bawabawa may be many times faster than a peak human, and they may have taken a few hours to reach it.

If Bawabawa can slither at 50 or 100 miles/hr, he can cross a large Island or a small country in the given time. So better not bring up Bawabawa since his speed is unknown and so is the timeframe.

The initial calc: http://www.narutoforums.com/blog.php?bt=69327 (5.6 km is small city sized)

The latest calc: http://www.narutoforums.com/blog.php?b=20129 (39-40 Megatons is city+)



There are many things that contradict Lanza being only town level:

1. Neither Ichigo or Renji or Uryu objected to Nel's statement after they had reached Las Noches. This means they couldn't even see the farthest end.

2. Even if you use peak human speeds for Ichigo and co. (20 km/hr) and consider they ran towards it for 3-4 hours, its over 50 km.

3. Las Noches has a sky and a climate of its own, and its roof was so high that everyone thought it was a real sky and not an artificial roof. So its height can't just be 500m



As for the scaling calc, the mistake he made is that Bawabawa was closer to the observer than Las Noches in the scan he used: http://i35.mangapanda.com/bleach/247/bleach-1589767.jpg

They hadn't reached Las Noches yet and were still riding. So once Bawabawa reaches the wall, he may appear much smaller than he did in the scan.

Renji ran ahead of Bawabawa to fight the sand guy. That alone makes the entire statement, and therefor your argument, bull shit.

Again, LN is about as big as three sand dunes. Even massively highballing as much as possible, that's only town level. I can repost if you like.

1. Yes, that's because LN is filled with other smaller buildings, obstructing their view. Genius.

2. Why does that matter again? The distance TO LN has NOTHING to do with how big LN itself is. Try again.

3. Yes, there is such a thing as air conditioning. And in Harry Potter, the great hall's ceiling was bewitched to show the sky outside. I guess that's also continent level, huh?

This, again, doesn't matter. The distance to it doesn't make the actual structure any larger or smaller. Retard.

Except no, we see it moving at the same speed it was chasing Nel. Not incredibly fast. Lol the given time of few hours? Does it look like hours passed in the manga? Besides, the fact that Bawa admittesl does this just throws out the previous running as a clear inconsistency, as it would have to be far, far faster and for so much longer in odes for them not to get any closer.

Cha to read. If accepted then cool, City level. It'd still be a fraction of the OPs listing. But this calc is based off a Town sized Noches right?

1. They've never been there before.
2. No timeframe given, plus inconsistent to later showing.
3. The sky that had a liter hole blown out showing the outside? That's not how a sky works.

Yes, being a second away is a real issue.

Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
Renji ran ahead of Bawabawa to fight the sand guy. That alone makes the entire statement, and therefor your argument, bull shit.Because Renji is superhuman.

The size of the sand dunes and the buildings is unknown. this is a spiritual world and unlike any desert in the real world, so the physics doesn't apply here

No it does. LN appeared huge even from that distance.

Apart from it not changing in size.

Because they use magic, duh.

that's not the case here. the roof itself looks like the sky

Originally posted by BloodRain
Except no, we see it moving at the same speed it was chasing Nel. Not incredibly fast. Lol the given time of few hours? Does it look like hours passed in the manga? Besides, the fact that Bawa admittesl does this just throws out the previous running as a clear inconsistency, as it would have to be far, far faster and for so much longer in odes for them not to get any closer.No, we don't know what speed it was travelling at. Could be either faster or slower..aka. unknown.
The timeframe is unknown as well. It could have taken minutes to hours...once again making it unquantifiable.

This is the

5.6 km is small city sized


1. Even if they've never been there before, they will easily be able to see the end of LN if it was just town or city sized.

Besides, they also have an idea of how large it is after they've travelled all the way towards it.


2. Ichigo could run for almost a day on a treadmill without collapsing: http://oi39.tinypic.com/k4ufys.jpg.

Here he got tired and was sweating a lot after running that distance: http://i40.mangapanda.com/bleach/245/bleach-1589675.jpg

Meaning he had been atleast running for a few hours, to get tired


3. If the artificial sky was so low, they would have easily realised it was just the artificial roof and not the real sky.


How do you know it was a second away?

The time it took to reach the wall still unknown, and it could have been a significant distance from the wall






Further reasons why Nel's statement should be considered:
1. She is well aware when she is in trouble so she is not dumb in any way

She is even smarter than any kid her age for knowing she is in trouble and figuring out aizen and espada's personalities

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-QzYZU90CbcI/TlVLp3sBYOI/AAAAAAAAFPo/s4q4UKg5E3A/006.jpg?imgmax=2000

2. She is very knowledgable when it comes to heuco mondo and LN

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-iIbMHVVkhMA/TlVKEpX3GtI/AAAAAAAAE6s/o-CivPEFlac/008.jpg?imgmax=2000

3. She didnt know about the preverion espada so she doesn't bullshit ichigo

If she doesnt know she doesnt say anything

This means that her 3 days statement is not a lie.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-RCQagegUq-E/TlVND3DBGBI/AAAAAAAAAJM/HK7Tl6x2WNQ/011.jpg?imgmax=2000


4. Ichigo and his friends never objected to her statement, and this includes a genius like Ishida, who is generally very observant.

Even he knew that LN being 3 days long isn't a stretch at all.

Except based on what we know and not a random guess, yeah. Not that fast. So what's to suggest they took a day riding?

5km is half of small City size.

Because lets take the random child seriously.

Not necessarily. Point is it wasn't like our sky, if it was real.

Because they go from A to B while Ulq is discussing what they're doing.

None of that disputes that she just says things, like the days thing which is evidently wrong.


Now, let's mash your views together:
Ichigo can run for nearly a day, so running for nearly a day.
Bawa is slower than Renji, who wasn't blitzing. So he's slower than Ichigo.
Meaning they'd have to be traveling for over a day to be in the same 'not getting closer' position.
Which means Bawa would need to travel several times that to get there, which points to nearly a week.
(Even though Ichigo literally treats Nel like someone he's shared a cab with, because it was not that long)

Ignoring the whole Ichigo Ulq fight where the outer dome is shown.




But okay. Benefit of the doubt. Tell me how big it is, an actual size down to the km. Use all the sources put together and gather an answer for your argument. Just avoid those obviously inconsistent points.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
Because Renji is superhuman.

The size of the sand dunes and the buildings is unknown. this is a spiritual world and unlike any desert in the real world, so the physics doesn't apply here

No it does. LN appeared huge even from that distance.

Apart from it not changing in size.

Because they use magic, duh.

that's not the case here. the roof itself looks like the sky

So you're saying Renji is faster than Ichigo, who was by association, slower than Bawabawa?

So physics only apply when they determine things like a meteor being on fire, the space it takes for souls to reside, and how high clouds are, right? So in other words, you only use "real" physics when you think they benefit you. Way to discredit your entire argument at once. clapping

You just said it yourself, the size didn't change. That clearly points to some kind of desert mirage or something, discrediting the entire argument. Not to mention that IT DOESN'T MATTER. THE DISTANCE FROM WHERE THEY STARTED TO THE STRUCTURE ITSELF MEANS LESS THAN NOTHING. YOU'RE ENTIRE ARGUMENT IS BASELESS, AND NON-EXISTENT.

Duh.

Why does it matter what the ceiling looks like? That was the reason for pointing out Harry Potter, retard.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
> Town sized
> Doesn't change in size despite them running for hours.

U wot m8??


And no one knows their speed or how much time they took


It was calced to be city level+ and thats assuming that author's draw everything to scale, WHICH THEY DON'T!

Hey wait, let me scale the planet's in DBZ in a similar way...http://lounge.moviecodec.com/vs-general/planet-namek-size-calc-legit-333524/

> Town level Frieza confirmed!

Except that Las Noches isn't your ordinary desert and was never shown to have extremely windy conditions

And if they watched the anime there is actually a vast cavern of almost as much space under the sand to. As they fight their way up from the bottom of the sand caves where the lost Shinigami was fighting in the filler anime episodes. The sand itself is immensely old and deep.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Except based on what we know and not a random guess, yeah. Not that fast. So what's to suggest they took a day riding? Based on what? Absolutely nothing. Bawa could be travelling at 50 km/hr for all we know.

Not saying its a day, but it could be 2-3 hours. Nothing says it isn't, as no timeframe was stated.

City level starts from 10 km. 3 km to 10km comes under small city.

They aren't fools. If it was just town sized, they can easily see the gate and they would know at once that they can walk it in a few minutes

You're also ignoring that they have a good idea of its size since they've travelled all the way towards it from when they arrived


Then prove that she was just BSing them.

Pixel-scaling isn't an evidence because authors don't draw to scale, especially Kubo who's terrible with his drawings.


> Renji was using Shunpo while Ichigo was normally running, and shunpo speed >>> peak human speed.

Not to mention, bawa was stationary at that time when Renji got past him.

The speeds could be something like this:
Ichigo's running speed: 15-20 km/hr
Bawabawa's travel speed: 50 km/hr
Renji's shunpo speed: faster than sound, (so everything is consistent)


Finally, I don't get why you;re bringing Bawa into this. Everything regarding him is unknown.

Just use Ichigo, whos running speed is atleast peak human and you'll get atleast an Island sized LN


At the bare minimum its 90 km (30km walk/day x 3 days). And this is the lowest end you can get.

Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
So you're saying Renji is faster than Ichigo, who was by association, slower than Bawabawa? No. Renji was using shunpo while Ichigo was just running.

Ichigo's shunpo speed >> Renji's shunpo speed >>> Ichigo's normal running speed


Except that Las Noches isn't your normal desert, and has a completely different atmosphere and wind conditions....things that are unknown.

Unlike Seireitei and Naruto world.


Lmao. Las Noches being a mirage was already debunked in the manga itself.


It means a lot because Las Noches appears huge from that distance. If Las Noches was just town or city sized, it would appear extremely small from hundreds of kilometers away.

Calm down.

Are you dense? If the ceiling was that close, they would have immediately realised it was a false ceiling

Originally posted by RaventheOnly
And if they watched the anime there is actually a vast cavern of almost as much space under the sand to. As they fight their way up from the bottom of the sand caves where the lost Shinigami was fighting in the filler anime episodes. The sand itself is immensely old and deep. Yeah. I generally prefer not to use fillers as they are non canon, unless supervised by kubo himself.

Btw if we go by the Fade to Black movie, which was supervised by Kubo, it was stated that Seireitei is 200 spirit miles (800 km) long. And I believe Las Noches should be comparable to it in size

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
Yeah. I generally prefer not to use fillers as they are non canon, unless supervised by kubo himself.

Btw if we go by the Fade to Black movie, which was supervised by Kubo, it was stated that Seireitei is 200 spirit miles (800 km) long. And I believe Las Noches should be comparable to it in size

Why do you believe it should be comparable in size?

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
No. Renji was using shunpo while Ichigo was just running.

Ichigo's shunpo speed >> Renji's shunpo speed >>> Ichigo's normal running speed


Except that Las Noches isn't your normal desert, and has a completely different atmosphere and wind conditions....things that are unknown.

Unlike Seireitei and Naruto world.


Lmao. Las Noches being a mirage was already debunked in the manga itself.


It means a lot because Las Noches appears huge from that distance. If Las Noches was just town or city sized, it would appear extremely small from hundreds of kilometers away.

Calm down.

Are you dense? If the ceiling was that close, they would have immediately realised it was a false ceiling

http://i16.mangapanda.com/bleach/247/bleach-1589797.jpg

No he wasn't. Renji was running, just as they were. There's nothing to suggest otherwise.

Show me a scan that says that.

Yes, but it's possible that there was an illusion covering it, or something. Even if there wasn't, they weren't running hundreds of kilometers. They ran for an undefined time at human running speed. Then Bawabawa carried them much faster the rest of the way in a few minutes. That makes the most accurate calc of the distance about 15-16 miles, and that's high-balled. Bawabawa was just much faster. Not to mention the fact that LN looked the same size until they were right next to it.

How stupid can a human be?

They DID know that it was a fake sky, they were in a building for christ sake. Either way, what does it matter if they 1. Don't care enough to check, or 2. Can't see that the clouds were just painted on? The roof was just painted to look like that, idiot.

Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
http://i16.mangapanda.com/bleach/247/bleach-1589797.jpg

No he wasn't. Renji was running, just as they were. There's nothing to suggest otherwise. LMAOOOOOOO!!!!!

They had already reached Las noches in the scan you provided, moron. The sand guy was long gone, and Bawabawa was stationary at that time.


Its common knowledge that Las Noches has trees made of quartz, and has a heavy reishi density, making it completely different from our world.


You are making baseless assumptions. No mirage was stated to be covering it.

They ran for several hours considering Ichigo got tired and started sweating...the same Ichigo who can go on a treadmill for almost a day.

At the very least 3 hours at peak human speeds, so 3 hours x 15 mph = 45 miles. Las Noches is larger than it since this distance was insignificant to change its size.



Btw since you yourself feel its 15-16 miles, it makes Lanza a city+ buster. So your claims of town level Gremmy and Kenpachi on the other thread are contradicted right there.

Originally posted by Rikudo sennin
Why do you believe it should be comparable in size? Because of Las noches was stated to be 3-days long, and Seireitei was stated to be 10-days long.

@BS:
Ah so it makes sense that Bawa could travel for 3 hours and get there when Ichigo was apparently running for nearly a day making no progress? Just how fast do you think Bawa is? If the superhuman Ichigo only runs at 10m/s and was on the treadmill for 10 hours for the day. That's 360km traveling while making no progress. That must mean that Bawa had to travel far more than that to reach it. So yes. Either Bawa moves as fast as Ichigo, as our only evidence suggests, and took days to reach, or Bawa is dozens of times faster than Ichigo. Which is unsupported. Basically, you have no way to use this for scale.

More like hill.

Oh no, not fools at all. Just a foolish child. Let us no forget we have a reliable character stating that it takes a 10 day walk to get the next Seireitei gate. Know what that means? Let's take a 1.4m/s average walking speed and assuming they sleep for 8 hours, even though being in a rush would change that drastically. That's 160 hours which would make the distance to the next gate 806.4km away. That's also a quarter of the circumference. That'd mean the diameter of Seireitei would be just over a thousand km :l That would make it larger than Madagascar and many European countries. We know the size of Seireitei from all given facts, one of them by merely from having eyes, to know that statement is complete bs. Use that to compare to your 3 day statement.


Now let's stack up the evidence. We have a majorly inconsistent running scene which makes either Bawabawa massively faster than Ichigo, massively, or they were traveling for days on end, assuming no sleep.
-Anyone can see the bs from these obviously inconsistencies.

And Nel's statement directly in line with Yoruichi's days one, the latter already proven to be absolutely wrong.
-A clear call into question to any of these days/distance lines.



So there we go. Two pieces of evidence that have been defeated by the manga itself.

Ummmm you guys know that the Soul Society and Huecho Mundo houses an equal number of souls as the modern Earth as the premise of the entire series. Why would the Seireti or Los Noches not be humongous? This arguement is just plain stupid. The places are huge. It takes a quarter of the arcannar arc to just REACH Los Noches. The worm travels without them having to walk for a clearly undefined amount of time and their battle with the sand guy makes them have to hoof it underground and finally reach a tower that leads to huecho Mundo from the underground. Why is it so hard to admit that the places would be very large. There are countless skyscrapper like towers reaching into the atmosphere that is so high that the sky is actually a structure which they did not even know about until near the end of the arc. Why would the place NOT be extraordinarily large?

The perspective of art versus size is totally unreliable. Perspective is always skewed by distance in a 2-dimensional plane and the artists tools to be detailed. Perspective is an actual topic if you read or watch the series when they are travelling to Los Noches. They complain about the distance never changing after traveling for hours-days both on foot and by Bawa. Its so long that they lose track of time itself which is a topic mentioned in both sources.

Just stop with the squalling about the size of the clearly defined very very large cities and get a real argument.

Look at Seireitei. A hundred years would send 5 trillion souls there. Even excluding those that die there or get resurrected it would still need to contain welll over a hundred times what all of Earth has. Does it look like it's that large? Hell, does it even look like it can contain the population of Earth?

Anyhow Seireitei is only the capital of Soul Society. There's still the massive Rukongai district outside of the gates. There's likely more around that.



And that sky is meaningless as there was a large chunk in it showing its not the same as a real sky. Being large isn't what gives a blue sky.


The time/distance is contradicted by the manga.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Look at Seireitei. A hundred years would send 5 trillion souls there. Even excluding those that die there or get resurrected it would still need to contain welll over a hundred times what all of Earth has. Does it look like it's that large? Hell, does it even look like it can contain the population of Earth?

Anyhow Seireitei is only the capital of Soul Society. There's still the massive Rukongai district outside of the gates. There's likely more around that.



And that sky is meaningless as there was a large chunk in it showing its not the same as a real sky. Being large isn't what gives a blue sky.


The time/distance is contradicted by the manga.

/wrists People who die in the SS are reborn through reincarnation in the world of the living (Earth world). Or if they are evil go to Huecho Mundo. There are 320 districts in just the Rukongai which is the outlying district where it is not protected by the law very well. Remember the souls in the SS do not need to eat so there are no farm lands unless they are soul reapers who do eat.

"The Human World and Soul Society are parallel to each other and are two sides of the same coin. Families separated by death are rarely reunited in the Soul Society unless they arrive in Soul Society together. People live nestled together like a family of strangers. One never gets hungry (if she or he doesn't have spiritual powers) and aging is slowed to a great extent, with lifespans of 2000 or more years not being unheard of, though such ages are limited to Shinigami or other Soul Society dwellers with high spiritual power. Children can be born as they are in the Human World. People can also be killed as regular Humans are, though they are capable of surviving wounds that would normally be considered fatal. A soul that dies in Soul Society is reincarnated on Earth as a new Human with no past memories."

http://bleach.wikia.com/wiki/Soul_Society


The ceiling reaches so high into the sky it appears as a sky. When they smash through the ceiling of Los Noches to fight Ulqiuarra they see the true sky for the first time. It just shows how MASSIVE los noches is.

Arguing a difference between the manga and the anime is like extraordinarily common. Just take it for granted that the city is extremely huge.

Cool, that still leaves more people than Earth. If 5 trillion souls died in 100 years, how many would have been reincarnated given souls can live for over a thousand years and the risk of starvation is gone? No matter how you look at it, there is no way that Seireitei, or even the outer district could house that amount. Leading to the idea that theres more in soul society.

But the walled capital itself is not that large.

The sky is only blue because of the sunlight. There is none inside, so no matter how high it is a blue sky wouldn't form.

What are you talking about? I'm comparing the manga quotes to the manga itself which contradict both the tri running towards it and the 3 days comment.

Pro-tip BR: Focus on the damage done to the top of the dome.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Cool, that still leaves more people than Earth. If 5 trillion souls died in 100 years, how many would have been reincarnated given souls can live for over a thousand years and the risk of starvation is gone? No matter how you look at it, there is no way that Seireitei, or even the outer district could house that amount. Leading to the idea that theres more in soul society.

But the walled capital itself is not that large.

The sky is only blue because of the sunlight. There is none inside, so no matter how high it is a blue sky wouldn't form.

What are you talking about? I'm comparing the manga quotes to the manga itself which contradict both the tri running towards it and the 3 days comment.

Why would 5 trillion people die in 100 year span? That is an absurd number considering the average nominal population doubling rate occurs every 20 years and there are 6.5 billion on the planet. If a massive number of humans died that is a problem that is talked about actually in the series. The quincy were wiping out hollows from existence which threatened to destroy the balance and the world which is an ongoing conflict addressed. When a hollow dies it is reborn in the real world or sent to hell if they are super evil so the supply of human souls is at balance, when the quincy kill hollows they are removed from the cycle and provide no reincarnated living human souls. If a bunch of living people died then SS and Huecho Mundo would be overflowed with dead and that would mess up the balance.

By only your notations of size versus drawings. The only reason you doubt its size is from your own interpretations of size of a far away picture in 2 dimensions. Los Noches is only a fortress within Huecho Mundo and does not house every soul; just a crap ton of them on the surface and underground in caverns. The Soul Society is the world where the living souls end up, we don't know how large the whole place they exist is. Apparently it goes up very high to because there is a soul palace. All we know is about the Sieretei which houses the military of the SS that governs the overall center of the civilized portion of the SS and it seems to be the center of the country size city that we cannot see the edge of from many of the pictures.

You obviously did not see or read the part where they break through the ceiling and are above Los Noches

Start it at 27 Min 53 seconds if it doesn't
euqpuA9ojr8?t=27m53s

Originally posted by BloodRain
@BS:
Ah so it makes sense that Bawa could travel for 3 hours and get there when Ichigo was apparently running for nearly a day making no progress? Just how fast do you think Bawa is? If the superhuman Ichigo only runs at 10m/s and was on the treadmill for 10 hours for the day. That's 360km traveling while making no progress. That must mean that Bawa had to travel far more than that to reach it. So yes. Either Bawa moves as fast as Ichigo, as our only evidence suggests, and took days to reach, or Bawa is dozens of times faster than Ichigo. Which is unsupported. Basically, you have no way to use this for scale.Its quite possible that Bawa is dozens of times faster than Ichigo's running speed.

We don't know Bawa's speed, and that's an unquantifiable parameter. So I see no reason why you're bringing him up just for the sake of downlaying

Wut?

Its not a BS statement just because pixel-scaling doesn't agree with you. Kubo doesn't draw to scale. Since when did we become the authors to accept or throw out a statement from credible characters?

And there's quite a lot of proof that Seireitei is atleast large Island sized, possibly country.

Fact 1: Seireitei has over 12 districts and over 12000 regions: http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb...ach-3353131.jpg

Fact 2: The movie Fade to Black was supervised by Kubo. In that, Seireitei is stated to be over 200 spirit miles long.

Fact 3: Seireitei has mountain ranges inside it, which are not even visible in its full view, thereby meaning Seireitei is huge: http://i15.mangapanda.com/bleach/479/bleach-2972259.jpg


There's nothing wrong about Bawabawa being faster than Ichigo, who wasn't using shunpo at that time and probably just running at peak human speed with Chad and Uryu.

And you still haven't given me an answer as to why they didn't object to Nel's statement if it was BS. They had a good idea of its size after travelling towards it.

Nothing wrong with Yoruichi's statement. It stacks up quite perfectly with other manga evidence we have for Seireitei's size

Nah, nothing points to Las Noches being any smaller than a city apart from weird pixel-scaling, when its common knowledge that author's don't draw to scale

Those are the "mountain ranges"? lol

yes they are. Infact much bigger than the mountains in Naruto

@BS:
Based on? The /only/ evodexd to its speed was when it was chasing Nel, showing peak human running speed. If you'd like to assume more you'll need proof. Until then, this is the only speed we can give. So either find actual evidence to support them riding Bawa at supersonic speeds, or accept the only known evidence.


Is that really your argument style? Find a single point to talk about then ignore the rest?
http://toxicmuffin.files.wordpress.com/2013/07/bleach10-11.png

According to Yoruichi the diameter which we see in this picture is 1,000km long. Your official, 'cant deny no matter what' statements say this. Y'know, Even though we know the hill in the centre isn't that tall.. and even if the 4 gate giants are a quarter of the height of the walls.. but no, its officially a thousand km right?

Can you honestly look at every single image of Seireitei and say its as large as her word says? Keeping in mind that we can see two of these 'ten days apart' gates in that very picture.

Don't let the next response simply be "No he has /never/ drawn Seireitei to this size. Ever" because you're just asking for us to call into question his scale reliability.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
yes they are. Infact much bigger than the mountains in Naruto

Why does it matter if they're bigger than Naruto's?

Those buildings are the size of cities.

Originally posted by BloodRain
@BS:
Based on? The /only/ evodexd to its speed was when it was chasing Nel, showing peak human running speed. If you'd like to assume more you'll need proof. Until then, this is the only speed we can give. So either find actual evidence to support them riding Bawa at supersonic speeds, or accept the only known evidence.They were just playing at that time, duh. It was a gag scene. If DBZ has a gag scene showing Goku or Gohan playing tag with kids for fun, it doesn't restrict their speed to that level.

Just because that's the only scan we have doesn't limit Bawa's speed from being as fast as a car. And no one said he's supersonic.

That scan doesn't even show the mountain ranges that Ukitake was looking at here: http://i15.mangapanda.com/bleach/479/bleach-2972259.jpg

So another example of bad art by Kubo, which is nothing surprising as it happens quite often in manga.


Kubo's sense of scale is not reliable as I said.

I have listed 4 different points above that point to Seireitei being many times larger than a city, and all you give me for an argument is some inconsistent pixel scaling? C'mon, give me a break...


Originally posted by AuraAngel
Why does it matter if they're bigger than Naruto's? Because Naruto fans like the guy above me keep using double standards (ie. using pixel scaling to downplay Bleach, while not using it for their own verse when it goes against them)

Those are hills.

Originally posted by Blazing Storm
Because Naruto fans like the guy above me keep using double standards (ie. using pixel scaling to downplay Bleach, while not using it for their own verse when it goes against them)

NemeBro likes Bleach more than Naruto at the moment and probably overall in general.

Right?

I hate Naruto.