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Match 1: The Phantom Meance Darth Maul
Match 2: The Clone Wars Darth Maul

Morals are on; both are bloodthirsty, Battle on Dromaund Kaas.

Nyriss' saber skills are pretty much unknown, but I bet her lightning would give him fits.

Originally posted by Stealth Moose
Nyriss' saber skills are pretty much unknown, but I bet her lightning would give him fits.

Ehhh she did rather easily tool the Exile an Scourge at the same time.

Yeah, but who is going to believe that argument when Maul has live action sequences?

Nyriss. Yeah, he tooled the Exile and Scourge at the same time. And she even did it while they were on either side of her, so she was just so much better than them that she could kick their asses while completely flanked. And she also pwned them both with a single Force attack each. She was pretty badass.

1. Round 1 50/50 IDK really.

2nd. Maul slaughterhouse

Maul could most likely take her in a duel... the question is how well he'd be able to handle her force powers... this is a challenging match to call.

Depends if Maul can get in close quick enough.

Besides that whole Exile vs Nyriss fight was cringeworthy to begin with.

Darth Maul is outgunned, IMO.

I'd lean to Nyriss too, Exile is no joke.

Maul can probably match/exceed Nyriss purely in a saber duel, but Nyriss's lightning would most likely be too much. I'd vote Nyriss by a 5.5-4.5 margin.

Lightning can be stopped with a lightsaber, broski.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Maul can probably match/exceed Nyriss purely in a saber duel, but Nyriss's lightning would most likely be too much. I'd vote Nyriss by a 5.5-4.5 margin.

I highly doubt Maul can exceed Nyriss. The Exile alone would give Maul mucho trouble.

Maul has a good shot at beating Nyriss in a duel. You don't last thirty seconds in a duel with Sidious for being a sad sack of shit.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
I highly doubt Maul can exceed Nyriss. The Exile alone would give Maul mucho trouble.

The Exile who was nearly beaten by two Imperial Guards?

Originally posted by NewGuy01
The Exile who was nearly beaten by two Imperial Guards?

Uhh you mean Kenobi who failed to take down Cad Bane with another Jedi Master's help? Yes the Exile is on the same level as Kenobi.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
The Exile who was nearly beaten by two Imperial Guards?

You continue to forget Dromaund Kaas alone would be slowly down the Exile's reflexes and abilities in terms of the Force, and add in Vitiate, she would have to beat them with pure skill, which is quite a hard feat (look a Ulic after he was stripped). And besides, these guards are monsters, even without Vitiate's amp:

The Empire's ultimate non-Force sensitive warriors, the Imperial Guard is a selfless army devoted to the Emperor and the Emperor alone. Clad in blood-red armor and wielding deadly weaponry designed to exterminate Force users, the Imperial Guard sweep across the galaxy at the Emperor's command, destroying his enemies both outside and within the Empire. When confronted by the Imperial Guard, the mightiest of Sith have laid down their lightsabers and surrendered to the inevitable death offered by a guardsman's electrostaff. Even members of the Dark Council fear the Imperial Guard, though many would die before confessing such a weakness.
Source: The Old Republic Encyclopedia

I don't get all the buzz about Nyriss', I mean sure she defeated Scourge and Meetra simultaneously, impressive? Sure, but like DarthAnt said she clearly had an advantage - being on drumound kass and all - and then there's her Force lightning, all she did was fry to guards to a crisp, big whoop, Dooku was able to do that, does that mean she's as strong as him? Hell no, not to mention she barely made a dent in T3-M4 and got her ass kicked by drugged Revan. Darth Maul TPM might lose, but TCW Maul win this

But Malachor is also a dark side nexus and the Exile still solo'd a temple of Sith, kicked Sions tush 5 times in a row and beat Kreia. And Scourge is also a Sith so no advantage there.

Also Dooku's never fried people to a crisp with his lightning.

TBH I'm starting to think nexus's are a bit overrated. Unless you are actively drawing on a nexus, I don't think it'll affect your power by anything greater than a factor of two at most.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
Lightning can be stopped with a lightsaber, broski.

Sure, but a lightning storm? Less likely.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
TBH I'm starting to think nexus's are a bit overrated. Unless you are actively drawing on a nexus, I don't think it'll affect your power by anything greater than a factor of two at most.

I'd agree with that sentiment if we're talking about Dromund Kaas, but Malachor is probably a different story.

Its barely an issue imo, but people just love to use them to throw out feats saying that they can't do certain feats without them.

Do authors ever want to make it seem that a certain character is drawing on a nexus? Unless they explicitly state it of course.

Nope. Take the Darth Bane Trilogy for example. Bane wasn't stated to be drawing from the nexus of Lehon when he destroyed the Temple of the Ancients, but Drew explicitly states him to drawing on the power of Anddedu's keep on Prakith, and Drew also explicitly states Zannah to be drawing on the Nexus of Ambria for her tendrils.

I actually have a nexus speculation thread that Ima post

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ


Do authors ever want to make it seem that a certain character is drawing on a nexus? Unless they explicitly state it of course.

Actually, Drew purposely made it so it's up for speculation:

"I appreciate your passion, but I don't like analyzing my work like this: I prefer to let it stand on its own. Also, many of these things are open to interpretation, so I don't want to shut the reader down by saying "This is the way I intended it" - I'd rather leave some ambiguity in that.

Sorry if it seems like I'm ducking the questions, but once I've finished writing something I prefer to move on. However, I'm sure you could find some message boards or forums of Star Wars fans where there are plenty of people who would love to discuss/debate these kinds of things with you.

Drew"

Originally posted by Emperordmb
TBH I'm starting to think nexus's are a bit overrated. Unless you are actively drawing on a nexus, I don't think it'll affect your power by anything greater than a factor of two at most.

I mean were that the case you'd have to accept Dooku being able to pwn Ventress with a finger.

when and where did this happen?

Originally posted by Emperordmb
when and where did this happen?

On Vjun circa 20 BBY.

Its not like it was in combat. Plus she's a dark sider too, so she'd being getting amped by Vjun as well assuming she was tapping into it.

Plus Dooku has done this before on Rattatak

Originally posted by Nephthys
Its not like it was in combat. Plus she's a dark sider too, so she'd being getting amped by Vjun as well assuming she was tapping into it.

The amp would not be equal. Greater mastery would give a far greater amp.

And you know this how?

I reiterate there is a precedent for Dooku tooling Ventress.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
I mean were that the case you'd have to accept Dooku being able to pwn Ventress with a finger.

I'd easily be able to accept that. Undermining your opponent with the force is different than holding them against their will with the force. Unless the latter was the case in this situation

Originally posted by Nephthys
And you know this how?

You think a 10 year old Sith apprentice will have the same increase in power as an 80 year old Sith Master?
Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
I'd easily be able to accept that. Undermining your opponent with the force is different than holding them against their will with the force. Unless the latter was the case in this situation
"Don't patronize me," Asajj said coldly.

Dooku looked around. "Or what?"

Her face went pale. Dooku lifted that one finger, and this time he tapped it in the air, as if pushing a needle into a pincushion. Ventress crumpled to her knees. Her voice came out clotted with pain.

"Please," she said. "Don't."

"It doesn't feel very good, does it? Like sharp stones in your throat and chest."

Dooku made another little patting motion, and Ventress slammed to the tile floor.

"It's the blood vessels I hate," Dooku said. "The way they stretch inside, like balloons about to pop."

"P-p-p-please..."

"But worse than anything is the memories," he said, more softly still. "They crowd around, like flies on meat. Every despicable thing, every petty vice, every little act of spite."

A cruel, strange quiet stretched out as Ventress panted on the stone floor. Rain ticked against the window glass, and the Count's soft voice went dark and far away.

"All the things you should have stopped, but didn't, and nothing will ever be right again. And the things you've done," he whispered. "By the pitiless stars, the things you've done..."

The comm on Dooku's desk beeped. He shook his head, like a man waking from a dream.

"The Troxan delegation is at the door."

Ventress crawled to her feet. Her face was bruised and her cheeks were wet with tears. Both pretended not to notice.

"Tell them I'll be right down," Count Dooku said.

Ah. That's a really good feat by Dooku, but it's not something i dont think he's capable of doing, especially against an inferior force user like ventress.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Ah. That's a really good feat by Dooku, but it's not something i dont think he's capable of doing, especially against an inferior force user like ventress.

If Dooku was capable of this on neutral ground why not do that when Savage and her confronted him on the Separatist Dreadnaught?

That feat does prove that Ventress would definitely fall to Zannah's illusions, a debate I was engaged in a while ago.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
That feat does prove that Ventress would definitely fall to Zannah's illusions, a debate I was engaged in a while ago.

That's not a negative feat for Ventress, its a positive feat for Dooku.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
If Dooku was capable of this on neutral ground why not do that when Savage and her confronted him on the Separatist Dreadnaught?

Same reason Sidious didn't destroy windu and company with the force and choosing not to kill yoda after he bursted him with lightning.

It's obvious it took him a lot of concentration to pull off, based on the whole "as if he was being awakened from a dream" thing.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
If Dooku was capable of this on neutral ground why not do that when Savage and her confronted him on the Separatist Dreadnaught?

Yeah, there is no real evidence that Dooku is capable of such power normally.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
You think a 10 year old Sith apprentice will have the same increase in power as an 80 year old Sith Master?

I'm not sure a 10 year old apprentice would know how to tap into a nexus, but if they could I see no reason why not.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
I'd easily be able to accept that. Undermining your opponent with the force is different than holding them against their will with the force. Unless the latter was the case in this situation

Pretty much this. Dooku attacked Ventress outside of a combat situation in such a manner as to render her unable to fight back because she was in so much pain. He can't do the same in a fight.

Originally posted by Nephthys
I'm not sure a 10 year old apprentice would know how to tap into a nexus, but if they could I see no reason why not.

Lol because mastery allows you to have a greater command of the force. This is amplified by a nexus. Dooku is logically going to be able to appropriate the power way better than a ****ing ten year old.




Yeah no this is the exact same situation as the Sidious choking Dooku one. She is always tortured by Dooku and would logically always be on guard.

Venress isn't ten!!! WTF are you talkin bout?

It also took Dooku a lot of focus

There is a precedent for him tooling her with TK.

I don't get why this is considered to be something he isn't normally capable of.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Lol because mastery allows you to have a greater command of the force. This is amplified by a nexus. Dooku is logically going to be able to appropriate the power way better than a ****ing ten year old.

Its not a question of your command of the Force, its just tapping into a concentrated wellspring of power. Theres no reason why Dooku would be amped more than a normal Sith.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Yeah no this is the exact same situation as the Sidious choking Dooku one. She is always tortured by Dooku and would logically always be on guard.

No, since Dooku was merely choked and not whimpering on the floor in agony. You can fight back with the Force while being choked out, but if you're in too much pain obviously you can't concentrate enough to defend yourself. And I don't think its common practice to walk around with a Force Shield constantly up when they're just talking.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Venress isn't ten!!! WTF are you talkin bout?

Dude I am exaggerating.



No it didn't he tapped his finger while sitting down. He might as well have been sipping a glass of Tarisian Ale while he did it.


Not with a finger, and not popping her blood vessels.



Lol because if he could do that when Savage and Ventress rose their blades against him he'd have just murdered them with a tap of the finger.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Its not a question of your command of the Force, its just tapping into a concentrated wellspring of power. Theres no reason why Dooku would be amped more than a normal Sith.

Dooku will be able to tap into it more than a normal Sith, just as Dooku is able to tap into the force more than a normal Sith on neutral ground.




Just because Dooku wasn't crying out in agony doesn't mean he wasn't in pain. The man only grunted when Anakin sawed off his hands.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Lol because if he could do that when Savage and Ventress rose their blades against him he'd have just murdered them with a tap of the finger.

With this logic Luke should tool most, if not all of his opponents not named Abeloth, correct? Inconsistencies can be found everywhere.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
With this logic Luke should tool most, if not all of his opponents not named Abeloth, correct? Inconsistencies can be found everywhere.

Lol no because Luke is a Jedi, its not the Jedi way to just force pwn anything that stands in your way.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Same reason Sidious didn't destroy windu and company with the force and choosing not to kill yoda after he bursted him with lightning.

"The comm on Dooku's desk beeped. He shook his head, like a man waking from a dream."

Kinda seems like it was taking a good deal of his focus. Also Dooku is quite good at masking his emotions and usually doesn't really visibly show the amount of effort he is putting into combat.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
With this logic Luke should tool most, if not all of his opponents not named Abeloth, correct? Inconsistencies can be found everywhere.

Except, that's not how Jedi like Luke fight. "A Jedi uses the Force for knowledge and defense, never for attack."

This is a huge plot point in many of the post-RotJ novels.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Dooku will be able to tap into it more than a normal Sith, just as Dooku is able to tap into the force more than a normal Sith on neutral ground.

"Let me just restate my opinion as fact, without any proof. That'll be compelling."

He can't tap into it more because theres no more or less Force to tap into depending on his Force Mastery. A Force Nexus is a concentration of Force power and the strength of that concentration isn't dependent on Force Mastery. Opening yourself up to it would have the same effect on anyone.

Either way, you have no proof for your opinion so whatever.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Just because Dooku wasn't crying out in agony doesn't mean he wasn't in pain. The man only grunted when Anakin sawed off his hands.

Being choked isn't very painful. Not to a debilitating degree at least.

Originally posted by Nephthys
A Force Nexus is a concentration of Force power and the strength of that concentration isn't dependent on Force Mastery. Opening yourself up to it would have the same effect on anyone.

Based on?

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ


Red herrings, red herrings everywhere. Also Luke is by far the most overrated person on these boards.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
"The comm on Dooku's desk beeped. He shook his head, like a man waking from a dream."

Kinda seems like it was taking a good deal of his focus. Also Dooku is quite good at masking his emotions and usually doesn't really visibly show the amount of effort he is putting into combat.

Yeah he had to focus to make sure he didn't kill her.
"It's the blood vessels I hate," Dooku said. "The way they stretch inside, like balloons about to pop."

Originally posted by ares834
Based on?

Just my opinion and how I logically perceive it.

Neat.

I respect that you're changing it up a bit. Thanks.

Lol

I loled.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
You think a 10 year old Sith apprentice will have the same increase in power as an 80 year old Sith Master?
I know that you're exaggerating, Lord Stark, but isn't Vitiate a exception to this? considering he killed his father, tortured his mother and killed some other Sith master at precisely 10 years old and up

Originally posted by Fated Xtasy
I know that you're exaggerating, Lord Stark, but isn't Vitiate a exception to this? considering he killed his father, tortured his mother and killed some other Sith master at precisely 10 years old and up

Lol accurate, but that wasn't on a nexus + Vitiate is unreal. But let's not forget that 1 year old Galen Marek disarmed Darth Vader. (Lol they made it so Kento Marek died 18BBY and Galen was born 19BBY)

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Red herrings, red herrings everywhere. Also Luke is by far the most overrated person on these boards.
Luke is overrated everywhere.

Even SWTOR official forum have been virtually hijacked by fans of Luke and Sidious and they project these two characters as untouchables in the mythos. Heck, they assume that Caedus > Sith Emperor and Plagueis. Do the math.

I have seen more objectivity in this forum then in SWTOR official forum.

I have had lengthy debates with those delusional fans of Luke and Sidious in SWTOR official forum but those debates led to nowhere even with overwhelming evidence on my end. It surprises me that how those fans have so much time to debate Star Wars and come up with absurd ways to rank their favorites, they don't seem to have anything better to do in life then pretend to be agents of GL himself. Heck, GL himself wouldn't bother as much about status of Luke and Sidious in the mythos as those fans would.

As do I.
Without a nexus and preparation, Vitiate is honestly, not all that special.

Without a nexus or preperation Vitiate pwned 4 of the most powerful Jedi of the Swtor era at the same time.

Is the Emperor's space station not a nexus?

Originally posted by Nephthys
Without a nexus or preperation Vitiate pwned 4 of the most powerful Jedi of the Swtor era at the same time.

I have come to the conclusion that the Emperor's fortress is likely a DS nexus. Vitiate has the longest rule of any Dark Lord in history, and specifically made Dromund Kaas a DS nexus because it was meant to be his HQs. Considering that the reactor to the station is made with Rakatan tech (which like the Star Forge is powered by the Dark Side) its likely it is a DS nexus.

Furthermore there is a spot in orbit of Endor that is tainted by the death of DS users and was transformed into a Nexus, I think similarly the nexus of Dromund Kaas may also extend to the fortress (and if not the fortress itself is likely a nexus).

And those 4 most powerful Jedi are featless mooks sans Tol Braga (and kind of the HoT). I also highly doubt they are superior to the likes of Jaric Kaedan, the Barsen'thor, and Satele Shan. The Jedi likely didn't want to throw all their chips into one round.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Is the Emperor's space station not a nexus?

No, its not.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
I have come to the conclusion that the Emperor's fortress is likely a DS nexus. Vitiate has the longest rule of any Dark Lord in history, and specifically made Dromund Kaas a DS nexus because it was meant to be his HQs. Considering that the reactor to the station is made with Rakatan tech (which like the Star Forge is powered by the Dark Side) its likely it is a DS nexus.

Furthermore there is a spot in orbit of Endor that is tainted by the death of DS users and was transformed into a Nexus, I think similarly the nexus of Dromund Kaas may also extend to the fortress (and if not the fortress itself is likely a nexus).

And those 4 most powerful Jedi are featless mooks sans Tol Braga (and kind of the HoT). I also highly doubt they are superior to the likes of Jaric Kaedan, the Barsen'thor, and Satele Shan. The Jedi likely didn't want to throw all their chips into one round.

Theres Rakatan tech on Dantooine, Belsavis, Nar Shaddaa, Manaan and Kashyyyk and I don't think any of those are DS nexuses. Likewise theres nothing pointing to the fortress as a nexus.

That spot was from the death of Sidious as I recall. Nothing has occurred on the fortress like that which would create a nexus. Theres no reason to believe that the nexus of Dromund Kaas (provided there is one) extends into space.

Warren Sedoru used to be the greatest Jedi Warrior of the Order and is their best infiltration expert. Even weakened its not a stretch to say he's a badass. Leeha is the only 'featless' one and even then Braga speaks highly of her and shes noted to have never known defeat. I'd agree that those two are likely not as powerful as the Consular, Shan or Kaedan, but they are canonically among the best in the order. The feat is hardly unimpressive. Its still an incredible feat beyond all but the very, very top of the tiers imo.

The Star Forge was a Nexus ^

I know.

Cool.

Just because the Emperor's Space Station has some Rakatan tech doesn't make it a nexus.

Yah, but assuming Vitiate hangs out their often, it most likely is.

You mean like how Sidious' Chancellor office was a nexus?

Perhaps, but is that a confirmed Nexus? Palpatine was merely in it for what? Ten years tops? Vitiate's probably been in that space station for hundreds maybe.

No, it isn't a nexus. That was my point. Also I don't know how old the space station is. Its made from Gree tech which I believe was only recently available though.

"Available" can mean in the last 100 years, not the 13 years from Palpatine. Also, Palpatine would of course not intentionally make it a Nexus, the Jedi like Yoda go in and out through their. If they would realize it was a dark side nexus, shit would go down. Vitiate however, can do as he frees, and has more time to do it. Think logically here.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
As do I.
Without a nexus and preparation, Vitiate is honestly, not all that special.
This BS is getting old.

1. What do you mean by preparation?

2. Nexus argument makes no sense either; Sith Emperor have destroyed/pwned opponents in all kinds of settings.

Sith Emperor have easily defeated some of greatest warriors of the mythos, tanked planetary scale devastation, empowered/controlled thousands of Force-users on galactic scale with his powers, lasted over a century as a rule of a highly competent Sith Empire and you think that he isn't all that special?

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11112/111126460/3499981-2994117453-vitia.png

Not really, unless your counting the Emperor's Space Station....which is most likely a Nexus. And no opponents impressed me their but Hero.

With Prep/Nexus.

What?

In the comfort of his Nexus.

By hiding in his Nexus, and the hype he has generated throughout the ranks which leads to fear.

Excuse you, but I have him fourth most powerful Sith. That is indeed special.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
"Available" can mean in the last 100 years, not the 13 years from Palpatine. Also, Palpatine would of course not intentionally make it a Nexus, the Jedi like Yoda go in and out through their. If they would realize it was a dark side nexus, shit would go down. Vitiate however, can do as he frees, and has more time to do it. Think logically here.

You should think logically here. It would be in Vitiates best interest not to make it a nexus. The Fortress is supposed to be a secret and is constantly cloaked. If it were a nexus, it would be possible for a Force User to sense it, perhaps while flying close to it and find Vitiates secret base.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
By hiding in his Nexus, and the hype he has generated throughout the ranks which leads to fear.

It isn't mere hype. SWTORE and the codex say that Vitiates mere presence creates fear and obedience in his subjects and turns the greatest of Sith into trembling sycophants.

Interesting. I'll concede here, but it won't do you any do, for this is literally Vitiate's only feat without a Nexus. And the feat he performed is not that impressive, considering the feats the other top tier Sith like Sidious, Bane, Caedus, etc have. Do the three Jedi besides Hero even have feats that put him above like Ahsoka level? I don't believe they even do.


You act as if this feature isn't unique among the high Sith tiers.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11112/111126460/3499981-2994117453-vitia.png
Here:



Focus on canon information.

Priority list:-

1. Canon information
2. Official opinion of authors
3. Unofficial opinion of authors

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Not really, unless your counting the Emperor's Space Station....which is most likely a Nexus. And no opponents impressed me their but Hero.
Can you prove that Emperor's Space Station is a nexus? I bet you can't.

In addition, I am not interested in your opinion about the Jedi who attempted to subdue Sith Emperor. Canonically, those Jedi are among the Jedi finest and this matters.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
With Prep/Nexus.
BS

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
What?
What do you think happened on Nathema?

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
In the comfort of his Nexus.
This nexus nonsense should be dropped.

Analogy: Malgus kicked some serious Jedi ass inside Jedi Temple, a place massively strong in the light side.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
By hiding in his Nexus, and the hype he has generated throughout the ranks which leads to fear.
Do me a favor; read Star Wars: The Old Republic: Encyclopedia. This book adequately addresses your BS.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Excuse you, but I have him fourth most powerful Sith. That is indeed special.
Do I care about your personal rankings? I don't.

Yes! Exactly! He was able to do this with the Nexus (Dromaund Kaas) and the preparation from Yuri (I believe that was her name), who informed Vitiate about it all and that she was leading them to his throne.

I concede here...but leads me to my next point:

Do they have anything that puts them above Ahsoka? lol

I accept your concession

The destruction was designed so Vitiate could harness the power, not that he would have to fight to survive it. Nothing was damaged but the life he was draining...I don't see how this means he "tanked" it. lol

Yes? Malgus is pretty badass.

I own the book. I have read it numerous times in hope for Revan accolades.

Y u mad. This only Star Wars.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Theres Rakatan tech on Dantooine, Belsavis, Nar Shaddaa, Manaan and Kashyyyk and I don't think any of those are DS nexuses. Likewise theres nothing pointing to the fortress as a nexus.

You are wrong. Its stated that area is shrouded in the DS on Dantooine. IDK about Nar Shaddaa or Belsavis, but Manaan it is theorized that the giant queen monster shark was so massive because of the presence of the Dark Side. Jolee theorized the beasts in the underforest were so powerful and volatile because of the presence of the Star Map, and the Krayt Dragon is believed to have been attracted to the Star Map by its dark side energy.



Why would the most powerful DS user in the galaxy not make his stronghold a nexus of his power though?



Its stated Warren's connection to the force diminished after the first Great War. I also have a hard time believing he was the greatest warrior in the order. I mean not knowing defeat isn't all that impressive in a time of war when defeat most of the times means death.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Yes! Exactly! He was able to do this with the Nexus (Dromaund Kaas) and the preparation from Yuri (I believe that was her name), who informed Vitiate about it all and that she was leading them to his throne.
1. Dromund Kaas is not a nexus on the whole, some parts of it are.

2. Sith Emperor was aware of the presence of the Jedi, Yuri just did her job to ensure that the Jedi would meet Sith Emperor.

3. Sith Emperor broke the mighty Jedi duo with a fraction of his power. I don't see why such minimum effort would require any special preparation beforehand; preparation is made for stuff which cannot be handled without it (common sense).

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
I concede here...but leads me to my next point:

Do they have anything that puts them above Ahsoka? lol
Is Ahsoka regarded as among the Jedi finest in canon?

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
I accept your concession


Ignorance is bliss (for you).

Most of the known confrontations of Sith Emperor took place in regions that are not canonically identified as nexus.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
The destruction was designed so Vitiate could harness the power, not that he would have to fight to survive it. Nothing was damaged but the life he was draining...I don't see how this means he "tanked" it. lol
That ritual would have been lethal to any Force-user that would come in to contact with its power upon its conclusion; same as Thought Bomb based experiments. Difference is that Sith Emperor was supremely powerful in the ways of the dark side and an absolute master of Sith Sorcery; with such credentials, Sith Emperor was able to bend the outcome to his will and achieve the seemingly impossible.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Yes? Malgus is pretty badass.
Sith Emperor is even greater badass. Get the memo?

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
I own the book. I have read it numerous times in hope for Revan accolades.
And it flew above your head or something?

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Y u mad. This only Star Wars.
No, your ignorance is the concern.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Interesting. I'll concede here, but it won't do you any do, for this is literally Vitiate's only feat without a Nexus.

What about when he defeated his Sith Lord father and stripped him of his mind when he was 10?

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
And the feat he performed is not that impressive, considering the feats the other top tier Sith like Sidious, Bane, Caedus, etc have.

Yes, it is. Bane failed to overpower 8 Umbaran Assassins at once in RoT, who are stated to be middling with the Force. By contrast Vitiate overpowered 4 of the most powerful Jedi of the era. Overpowering multiple Force Users at once is always a great feat, like Sidious doing so to the Zabrak brothers.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Do the three Jedi besides Hero even have feats that put him above like Ahsoka level? I don't believe they even do.



Um, yes? Tol Braga fought a Dark Council member for days, overcomes Vitiates mental domination by himself, something not even Revan could do and at the end of the game visibly presses the Hero in a fight possibly hours before the Hero would defeat Vitiate. Warren Sedoru was the Jedi's finest warrior in his prime and is the greatest infiltration expert they have. Leeha Narez was a Jedi who had never been defeated before the assault on the space station. All of them are stated to be 'the strongest', 'the most powerful and most resolute Jedi in the Order' by the loadings screens in the game and the encyclopedia.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
You act as if this feature isn't unique among the high Sith tiers.

It isn't. Other Sith inspire fear in others out of respect for their power and abilities, Vitiate instils fear in others through his Force powers.

"The Sith Emperor has mastered the dark side's power to become the most dominating Force-user the galaxy has ever seen. His corrupting influence is so complete that none can stand in his presence without succumbing to fear, anger and hatred. The Emperor can wither and ruin even the strongest Jedi's connection to the light side."

"Those who speak with the Voice are overwhelmed by dread and unshakable obedience. To speak with the Voice is to speak with the Emperor himself."

Originally posted by Nephthys
overcomes Vitiates mental domination by himself, something not even Revan could do

Both Revan and Malak actually did so.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
You are wrong. Its stated that area is shrouded in the DS on Dantooine. IDK about Nar Shaddaa or Belsavis, but Manaan it is theorized that the giant queen monster shark was so massive because of the presence of the Dark Side. Jolee theorized the beasts in the underforest were so powerful and volatile because of the presence of the Star Map, and the Krayt Dragon is believed to have been attracted to the Star Map by its dark side energy.

IDC.

Nar Shadaa had a seed of a similar technology to the Star Forge on it. One that didn't require a Force User to operate it and supported a population with food, clothes, air and battle droids defenses. Belsavis has a metric ****ton of Rakatan technology on it. Looooooooads. And I don't recall anyone saying anything about a nexus at all.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Why would the most powerful DS user in the galaxy not make his stronghold a nexus of his power though?

As I said above, the fortress is a secret. A nexus can be sensed by Force Users.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Its stated Warren's connection to the force diminished after the first Great War. I also have a hard time believing he was the greatest warrior in the order. I mean not knowing defeat isn't all that impressive in a time of war when defeat most of the times means death.

I'm aware of that, but is it not possible that it diminished from 'Greatest Jedi at the time' to merely 'Very powerful Jedi Master?' Tol Braga tells you that Warren used to be the greatest warrior in the Order after his mission on Balmorra, a title which the Hero now possesses. Leeha never fought during the war, as far as I know Hoth was the first time she'd fought Imperial forces. It still implies shes never lost during, like, training or something.

Originally posted by ares834
Both Revan and Malak actually did so.

Only partially. Thats why both still attacked the Republic. Tol Braga completely overthrew Vitiates control.

No, Revan/Malak attacked the Republic in hopes to establish a new empire capable of defeating Vitiates.

No, I'm pretty sure they were still partially dominated. Revan himself says so iirc.

Originally posted by Nephthys
IDC.

Nar Shadaa had a seed of a similar technology to the Star Forge on it. One that didn't require a Force User to operate it and supported a population with food, clothes, air and battle droids defenses. Belsavis has a metric ****ton of Rakatan technology on it. Looooooooads. And I don't recall anyone saying anything about a nexus at all.

Nar Shadaa masks the presence of the force though so you wouldn't be able to sense the DS nexus. Don't know about Belsavis. Also the theories are based on the **** ton of Dark Side energy your Jedi companions sense from the artifact. Oh right and lets not even talk about Korriban.




So can other powerful force users.



Wait HoT was the strongest even as of mid-game? Eh, not really that impressive.

Originally posted by Nephthys
No, I'm pretty sure they were still partially dominated. Revan himself says so iirc.

Where does Revan say so? All I can recall is this:

"With Malak by his side and the Star Forge supplying his fleet, Revan formed a new Sith Empire and prepared to conqueror the Republic. Only by uniting the galaxy under his rule could Revan hope to defeat the threat posed by the Emperor."

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
No, Revan/Malak attacked the Republic in hopes to establish a new empire capable of defeating Vitiates.
well yes and no, Vitiate did influence Revan and Malak to go to war with the republic, but he underestimated their willpower and they broke free and set out to - like you said - establish a new - stronger empire. But Vitiate did make them pawns in his game of dejjarrik.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Nar Shadaa masks the presence of the force though so you wouldn't be able to sense the DS nexus. Don't know about Belsavis. Also the theories are based on the **** ton of Dark Side energy your Jedi companions sense from the artifact. Oh right and lets not even talk about Korriban.

As I said, I don't care. Nar Shaddaa doesn't mask it that much. Your character can't feel anything two feet from the thing. Belsavis is a Rakatan prison planet. Literally the entire thing is infested with Rakatan tech. Korriban is a given though.

Tatooine also has Rakatan artifacts on it in TOR.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
So can other powerful force users.

Are you suggesting Vitiates doesn't know how to mask his Force presence?

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Wait HoT was the strongest even as of mid-game? Eh, not really that impressive.

The Hero is stated to be the strongest as of Tython. excellent

I'd say its impressive. I dunno wtf you're smoking.

Originally posted by Nephthys
The Hero is stated to be the strongest as of Tython. excellent

Yikes. That really puts into perspective how lame the TOR Jedi really are.

biscuits

Revan broke free from Emperor's control after unwittingly undergoing the mindwipe performed on him by the Jedi Council.

Malak remained under control of Emperor, this explains his stubbornness and lack of wisdom.

No. Everything you said in that statement was wrong.
They both canonically broke free from his hold shortly after the mind domination.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
No. Everything you said in that statement was wrong.
They both canonically broke free from his hold shortly after the mind domination.
I am not in the habit of making baseless claims.

If you have read the sources that I consult, you wouldn't be questioning my statement.

Revan himself revealed to Meetra and Scourge that he (himself) and Malak were able to reduce Emperor's influence on them at maximum.

Revan completely broke free from Emperor's control while undergoing mindwipe from the Jedi Council. This implies that Malak wasn't able to broke free from Emperor's control properly.

This is different from the Old Republic Encyclopedia, so it's conflicting sources. Since one is a character opinion, TORE out rules it. Also, do not forget the different circumstances. The mind control against Revan/Malak was of no doubt more hard-pressed then against the Jedi. Vitiate was on a stronger nexus, had more time to prepare, and NEEDED the mind control to stay strong enough for them to attack the Republic.


What I said above ^

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
This is different from the Old Republic Encyclopedia, so it's conflicting sources. Since one is a character opinion, TORE out rules it. Also, do not forget the different circumstances. The mind control against Revan/Malak was of no doubt more hard-pressed then against the Jedi. Vitiate was on a stronger nexus, had more time to prepare, and NEEDED the mind control to stay strong enough for them to attack the Republic.

Nah bro, I think we can trust Revan the most out of anything. He was kind of slightly actually there when it happened.

Also, no to the second thing. Recall that Vitiate had seen a vision of the HoT defeating him. You don't think he would overclock that shit to the MAX???? Also Vitiate had all the time in the world after they'd been defeated to take his time and fully dominate them.

http://www.comicvine.com/profile/blog/darth-malak-respect-thread/97104/

I have never received this message before. I lol'd.

Considering Revan and Malak were actively opposing Vitiate I don't really see how one could say they were even partially under his control.

Probably they knew they were preparing the galaxy for something but couldn't remember what. Or they were just doing it subconsciously.

Huh, from what the Encyclopedia and KotOR II show it appears Revan was preparing the galaxy to fight off the True Sith. Even if he was doing so subconsciously, I still fail to see how that means Revan and Malak were still partially under Vitate's control

I mean, I guess they were trying to conquer the galaxy but that's kinda what Sith do.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
http://www.comicvine.com/profile/blog/darth-malak-respect-thread/97104/

I have never received this message before. I lol'd.

What?

Originally posted by ares834
Huh, from what the Encyclopedia and KotOR II show it appears Revan was preparing the galaxy to fight off the True Sith. Even if he was doing so subconsciously, I still fail to see how that means Revan and Malak were still partially under Vitate's control

I mean, I guess they were trying to conquer the galaxy but that's kinda what Sith do.

As Revan said, they only twisted his instructions in their minds so they thought they were acting freely, while they were still compelled to conquer the galaxy. They were still doing what he'd told them too in the end.

Originally posted by Nephthys
As Revan said, they only twisted his instructions in their minds so they thought they were acting freely, while they were still compelled to conquer the galaxy. They were still doing what he'd told them too in the end.

Originally posted by Nephthys
As Revan said, they only twisted his instructions in their minds so they thought they were acting freely, while they were still compelled to conquer the galaxy. They were still doing what he'd told them too in the end.

Not really. He sent them there to conquer the galaxy for him and finally report to him. Revan and Malak, however, sought to create their own empire and ultimately oppose Vitiate. That's a pretty big difference.

Vitate did complete Revan and Malak's fall to the dark side. But that really seems to be the extent of his influence over them by the time of the Jedi Civil War.

Originally posted by Nephthys
As Revan said, they only twisted his instructions in their minds so they thought they were acting freely, while they were still compelled to conquer the galaxy. They were still doing what he'd told them too in the end.
But the entire reason they were doing it was to impose him. They were basically doing the exact parallel in the same plane.

Not according to Drew Karpyshan!

Originally posted by ares834
Not really.

Somehow, I think Revan would know better than you would.

What?

The guy who wrote the book.

*gasp*
Lol but no, I mean, what are you referring to when you say not according to him?

Both Revan and Malak were subconsciously doing what Sith Emperor had intended them to do:

1. Find the Star Forge
2. Build a Sith Empire or military might
3. Destroy the Republic

Revan and Malak managed to reduce the influence of Sith Emperor on them with their own strength(s) and this is why they ended up as not being Emperor's mere puppets in the long run. However, both of them were subconsciously doing what Sith Emperor intended them to do; this implies control of Emperor on them.

LOL

Originally posted by Nephthys
Somehow, I think Revan would know better than you would.

Perhaps. Just like the KotOR campaign guide knows more than you about the "prime of the Jedi".

I like you. We are now friends.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
*gasp*
Lol but no, I mean, what are you referring to when you say not according to him?

He wrote Revan saying that he only partially threw off Vitiates control, forgot all knowledge of him and twisted his mental commands so he thought he was acting by himself. The exact opposite of what previous evidence suggested, that Revan had always been preparing for the True Sith. He's basically retconning that whole thing.

Hmmm...you can be my anti-friend. Not an enemy, but an anti-friend....I don't know what it means, but I like how it sounds.


The "partiality threw off Vitiate's control" is a conflicting source with a higher canon, TORE, which, like I will say once again, out rules Revan's sexy opinion.