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Force, sabers, all out

Sabers, Bane. Orbalisks are more of an advantage than P's speed.

Sabers - Bane

Force - Plagueis has the TK advantage, Bane has the lightning advantage.

All out - Baaane?

I don't think Bane could match Plagueis's speed, even amped Plagueis's speed far exceeds Banes and sabers while Plagueis is an unknown his speed and his ability to go out of his body so to speak may prove some degree of equilibrium to Bane's all out rampage.

How does Plagueis' speed exceed Banes, let along by a large margin? They're pretty much even from the feats I recall about Plagueis.

Apparently Luceno said that Plagueis could top Palpatine if the latter formally challenged him in TPM. That on its own speaks for his capabilities, his skill as a duelist was likely very high.

That being said, his fight with Venamis showed one of his greatest dueling abilities was the capability to experience the fight in a third person viewpoint, controlling his body with the Force and creating an almost impenetrable defense, parrying the strikes of a Darth Venamis, a Banite Sith who gave everything to his lightsaber capabilities, with apparent ease.

Against RoT Bane, who for all of hiss strengths was little more than a charging berserker at this point, this type of counter would be perfect. With the basic (Though undoubtedly effective) techniques Bane fought with during this period, I don't think he'd be able to break Plagueis's defenses when someone with a fighting style so complex and fierce as Venamis's was unable to land a blow on him when he entered this battle mind state.

The reason Bane's style was so effective in RoT was for two reasons. One, his immense speed and strength that is backed by his raw and unrefined style would overwhelm almost any opponent regardless of his lack if complex swordplay. Against someone who is faster, and arguably stronger than he, this advantage will be void. The second is that his body is encrusted with Orbalisks, so he wouldn't have to worry as much about defense, an advantage he still has.

However, Plagueis is an extremely calculative and mathematical fighter, one of the most so in the mythos. Especially when in his out of body experience, he would likely notice the weaknesses and flaws in Bane's armor, and hold him off until an opening arises.

Now, this is not to say that Plagueis is definitively the winner in this contest. Bane while in his Orbalisk encrusted state was a highly effective duelist who was able to outmatch two of the best Jedi Warriors of their day while they were heavily amplified by BM. His offensive is savage and unrelenting, even a Soresu user like Zannah could barely handle him even for short amounts of time. However, I do think Plagueis will win this duel for a majority, the fact that he could defeat TPM Sidious in a one on one confrontation speaks heavily for his skill, and his strengths match perfectly with the flaws in Bane's methods. At best Bane will be dueling him to a stalemate, and the victor will be decided through mastery of the Force.

On that subject, I also think Plagueis is the more potent Force Wielder. We've probably all been through discussions in comparison between Bane's disintegration feat and Plagueis's atomization feat. The general consensus seems to be that that Plagueis's feat is superior, as the techno beasts were withered into scraps of metal and decayed tissue with time, and he accomplished the feat on a Nexus. I am inclined to agree.

The other main Force Power that will come to play in this fight is lightning. This is the part where this gets trickier. Bane has proven his abilities with lightning from the very start, unleashing storms that charred a Drexel beast and incinerated its riders seems to be his best feat to date. Likewise, Plagueis has used his lightning not only to turn a soldier's bones to dust, but also unleash a storm that would ravage an entire plain. Their abilities with the ability seem to be very alike--However, it must be considered that lightning of this level is extremely dangerous to Bane specifically. While Plagueis is in trouble if he gets hit, his Force defenses are good enough that they would absorb most of the impact of the assault--Likewise to how Yoda could take Palpatine's lightning while most could not. However, as we all know, Bane is extremely endangered by powerful lightning, as it would fry his Orbalisks, who then would release poison and down him immediately. For this reason, I'd also be inclined to give Plagueis the lightning edge as well, as his opponent is endangered to it specifically while he is not.

On a final note for Force powers, healing capabilities. Bane demonstrated some sort of regenerative ability when his hand was cut in the RoT battle and it simply disappeared. This makes the small window to harm him even smaller, and while minor it can make a large difference. However, let's not forget that Plagueis is capable of healing himself via Midichlorian Manipulation, his specialty. This is stated both in the novel and in the Book of Sith, and I would wager it's effect to be similar to Darth Krayt's Dark Transfer ability. This would allow Plagueis also to have room to take injury without losing the competition. On top if this ability, he can also stun and regulate his hearts, and as a Muun has a very durable physiology--Even after sustaining intense injuries he was able to fight off his Maladian Assasins, after all.

The big "but" to my bite here though is that like Bane and his Orbalisks, Plagueis has a weakness too. Very similarly to Plo Koon, Plagueis wears a mask that if severely damaged or removed can provide more than enough of an advantage for Bane to take the fight back in his favor.m considering his brutality in RoT, I would not put it last him to pull a Savage--The question is if he can gain the opening required to do it for a majority--Seeing how Savage could only do it to a distracted and distraught Koon, I would say no.

Ultimately, the synopsis here is that Plagueis is more technically skilled, calculative in battle, and overall has slightly greater mastery of the Force. Not only that, but his strengths do match up well with Bane's weaknesses. Plagueis wins, but FAR from easily.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
The other main Force Power that will come to play in this fight is lightning. This is the part where this gets trickier. Bane has proven his abilities with lightning from the very start, unleashing storms that charred a Drexel beast and incinerated its riders seems to be his best feat to date. Likewise, Plagueis has used his lightning not only to turn a soldier's bones to dust, but also unleash a storm that would ravage an entire plain. Their abilities with the ability seem to be very alike--However, it must be considered that lightning of this level is extremely dangerous to Bane specifically. While Plagueis is in trouble if he gets hit, his Force defenses are good enough that they would absorb most of the impact of the assault--Likewise to how Yoda could take Palpatine's lightning while most could not. However, as we all know, Bane is extremely endangered by powerful lightning, as it would fry his Orbalisks, who then would release poison and down him immediately. For this reason, I'd also be inclined to give Plagueis the lightning edge as well, as his opponent is endangered to it specifically while he is not.

How is turning someone bones to dust comparable with turning multiple peoples entire body to dust?

Ravaging a plain only shows that he can generate a lot of lightning, not that its more potent than Banes. And Bane unleashed a large storm hours after learning the technique. As of RoT, I highly doubt Bane couldn't equal or exceed the scale of Plagueis attack.

Also, Bane has Force defenses as well. Its not as if Plagueis is alone in that regard. Bane is actually more protected than he is against lightning, since the orbalisks can absorb a million volts with only a momentary effect on Bane himself. If Bane gets through Plagueis' force defenses, he's going to get seriously effed up by Banes attacks even if the attack is weakened by getting through. Whereas if Plagueis gets through Banes defenses, he could blunt the attack enough that the orbalisks will probably be capable of dealing with the attack.

I am aware that Bane has Force Defenses. What, did you think that they simply "turned off" when his own lightning was turned back on him? No, despite how much of the brunt was shrugged off by his defenses, Bane's Orbalisks still couldn't handle it.

He was taken by surprise and had no opportunity to seriously defend himself. He would have only had his standard automatic shield up, if that, which isn't the same as a concentrated defense with a lightsaber and Force barriers etc.

Originally posted by Nephthys
He was taken by surprise and had no opportunity to seriously defend himself. He would have only had his standard automatic shield up, if that, which isn't the same as a concentrated defense with a lightsaber and Force barriers etc.

That's the entire point! The entire point here is "if one of the opponents catches the other off guard with lightning", if one party is prepared for the lightning it's obviously not going to be game-changing.

Well since Banes lightning is more powerful than Plagueis'*, maybe not so much.


*And it was more powerful when he only had 2 orbalisks, 10 years before actual Orbalisk Bane.

Your evidence for that is lacking. You act like Plagueis turning bones to dust with a direct lightning bolt means his Force Storms must be weaker because they're spread out or something. In every media we've seen a character's Force Storm has actually been *more* powerful than their direct lightning despite it being an AoE power.




Don't really care, it's still his best feat and it was done on a Nexus. Be thankful that I'm ignoring that fact.

No its not. We can only take his best feat, instead of speculating that he can perform better with a less concentrated attack. Also nope, not every media. Vitiates concentrated burst of lightning was more powerful than his storm.

It wasn't done of a nexus. It was done on Onderon. And you should care because Orbalisk Bane is obviously a lot more powerful than he was when he did that feat.

No, it wasn't. Revan could block Vitiate's streamed lightning, he didn't even try to block it when Vitiate released a storm.



You mean, Onderon the Dark Side Nexus that holds the tomb of Freedon Nadd?

The nexus argument definitely doesn't hold here because Nadd's tomb is on Dxun.

Wasn't the feat performed right after leaving the tomb though?

Even if it wasn't, it wasn't actually part of my argument, I was just pointing it out.

It was performed after leaving the planetary object (moon) his tomb was on.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
No, it wasn't. Revan could block Vitiate's streamed lightning, he didn't even try to block it when Vitiate released a storm.



You mean, Onderon the Dark Side Nexus that holds the tomb of Freedon Nadd?

Actually no, Revan only blocked a some weak shit bolts. Vitiate didn't try streamed lightning against him.

That's Dxun, Onderons moon. Bane was nowhere near the tomb.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Actually no, Revan only blocked a some weak shit bolts. Vitiate didn't try streamed lightning against him.

You have no evidence to support that there is a difference. Revan blocked all of the lightning Vitiate shot at him. He got screwed when Vitiate released his Force Storm.

James Luceno says Plagueis could have topped Sidious at TPM. That is kind of end of argument right ? Bane is awesome, but Plagueis is chilling awesome. In Naboo, when Plagueis arrived, "Theed froze" was one of the best moments in the book!!

Technically speaking, Plagueis has increased his midichlorian count to god knows how much, as told in the book. So his force skills must be brilliant. Hell, he even choked Sidious while talking to him. That was like, jesus, how did he manage that ??

Originally posted by NewGuy01
You have no evidence to support that there is a difference. Revan blocked all of the lightning Vitiate shot at him. He got screwed when Vitiate released his Force Storm.

I would think its apparently obvious that a continual stream of lightning would be more powerful than a few quick single bolts.

kek