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Not too long ago, I came across an article, conveyed in video or text form, which said the modern day mainstream view of Satan (i.e. some giant, cloven-footed, muscular, Pan-faced Colossus of a demon) exists primarily due to a work entitled Dante's Inferno, and is not actually based much on anything found in the Judeo-Christian Bible at all.

In fact, in many passages, Satan is described as Angelic, perhaps even Christ-Like, though, after a period of time which may in fact be extremely lengthy, and not particularly easy to determine except for the most devoted and regular Bible readers, he eventually reveals himself as a Dragon, in many ways as, if not more, terrible than the creature Dante described.



I'm interested in how people here would respond to that assertion, as well, of course, to the main title question.


For even many that now call themselves agnostic or atheist say they once were Christian, and so are presumably familiar with what the Bible says regarding Satan, his qualities, his actions, appearances, etcetera,

and the rest, especially those I've seen refer to themselves as "Gnostic" philosophers, well, any of those that know the Bible should have very interesting opinions to offer, too.

I'll start with 2 passages widely accredited as descriptions of Bible Satan that are nearly opposite of the Dante Inferno Satan to illustrate the contrast to modern mainstream view that I mentioned above:






-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ezekiel 28

12 Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus, and say unto him, Thus saith the Lord God;

Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty.
13 Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God;
every precious stone was thy covering,
the sardius, topaz, and the diamond,
the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper,
the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold:
the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes
was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created.
14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so:
thou wast upon the holy mountain of God;
thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created,
till iniquity was found in thee.
16 By the multitude of thy merchandise
they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned:
therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God:
and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub,
from the midst of the stones of fire.
17 Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty,
thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness:
I will cast thee to the ground,
I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee.
18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities,
by the iniquity of thy traffick;
therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee,
it shall devour thee,
and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth
in the sight of all them that behold thee.
19 All they that know thee among the people shall be astonished at thee:
thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Ezekiel+28-30
------------------------------------------------------------------------------





13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.

14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.

15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=2%20Corinthians%2011&version=KJV
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

He'd probably appear as Justin Bieber hur hur hur hur hur hur hur hur

Satan, using the term as normally applied today, is nearly synonymous with Lucifer who was, IIRC, a seraphim. Lucifer has to do with being the 'morning star/fallen star', while seraphim means 'burning' or 'ember' and Satan is often associated with 'fire/dragon', so there's a strong connection there. Therefore, you have the 'enemy', Satan, likely appearing as something associated with fire/stars/dragon.

Therefore, Satan will likely appear like a beast wreathed in flame, or Sauron. Take your pick.

Social disparity.

The Koch brothers.

Satan would appear as the destruction of the family and the giving into all of our base pleasures.

Seekers of pleasures rather than spiritual perfection.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Seekers of pleasures rather than spiritual perfection. P4vpBw3pf58

Perhaps a falling star... or maybe the Sun.

My guess would be something like this...

http://themoderatevoice.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/obama-bush-e1370880535927.jpg

Originally posted by Mindship
The Koch brothers.

I lol'd.

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
Not too long ago, I came across an article, conveyed in video or text form, which said the modern day mainstream view of Satan (i.e. some giant, cloven-footed, muscular, Pan-faced Colossus of a demon) exists primarily due to a work entitled Dante's Inferno, and is not actually based much on anything found in the Judeo-Christian Bible at all.

In fact, in many passages, Satan is described as Angelic, perhaps even Christ-Like, though, after a period of time which may in fact be extremely lengthy, and not particularly easy to determine except for the most devoted and regular Bible readers, he eventually reveals himself as a Dragon, in many ways as, if not more, terrible than the creature Dante described.



I'm interested in how people here would respond to that assertion, as well, of course, to the main title question.


For even many that now call themselves agnostic or atheist say they once were Christian, and so are presumably familiar with what the Bible says regarding Satan, his qualities, his actions, appearances, etcetera,

and the rest, especially those I've seen refer to themselves as "Gnostic" philosophers, well, any of those that know the Bible should have very interesting opinions to offer, too.


He wouldn't appear as anything more than fiction, because according to the Bible, he will attempt to pull the wool over everyone's eyes. He will become more myth than truth, and many will see him in this light. His goal is for people to believe that he does not exist, and thus he will be able to roam freely without fear of being known. The great deceiver of nations, and defiler of faith. Not sure if this was what you were looking for in an answer, but it was the very first thing that came to mind.

Originally posted by Stoic
He wouldn't appear as anything more than fiction, because according to the Bible, he will attempt to pull the wool over everyone's eyes. He will become more myth than truth, and many will see him in this light. His goal is for people to believe that he does not exist, and thus he will be able to roam freely without fear of being known. The great deceiver of nations, and defiler of faith. Not sure if this was what you were looking for in an answer, but it was the very first thing that came to mind.

Are you saying that the god of the bible is satan?

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Are you saying that the god of the bible is satan?

When did I say that? What I understand is that you are a tree that has fruit, but refuses to feed the hungry. That makes you a very dangerous person spiritually (not sure if that's what you're aiming at?). I can understand the trees that have no fruit to bring forth due to a lack of knowledge, but you... Well you do. You are on bad ground with God according to the Bible, but I guess that you already knew that. And if God does exist, what will you be told on the day of judgement if you continue to follow the path that you are on? You ask questions feigning ignorance, when we both know full well that you know exactly my meaning. My faith is not up for debate nor am I a fundy, or religious. I hate religion, it's the relationship that I'm after.

Ask another question like the one that you did, and I will likely not respond. That would be like throwing pearls to swine, only to have them trampled under their feet. Like I said, if you indeed have studied the bible, you are a very dangerous person spiritually.

So if you don't believe in God, why in the world do you bother hanging around topics that would not concern someone claiming as much? What are you after? Who are you after? Put on your armor, and pick up your sword or don't. The choice is yours.

Some people just can't handle the truth.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
My guess would be something like this...

http://themoderatevoice.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/obama-bush-e1370880535927.jpg

That is the prime evil without a doubt.

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
That is the prime evil without a doubt.

Scary isn't it?

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Scary isn't it?

Yes, very.

Originally posted by Oneness
Social disparity.


Stoic's answer has more resonance than any of the other responses I've heard in this thread. Assuming the Bible IS true, it seems intuitively correct.

On the other hand, I want to honor the time people spent on replying here with a response that acknowledges their view each in his or her own turn.

I'll do this at random, likely until I've responded to all, in no particular order.


For instance ...

Oneness' response above, and perhaps in some small measure his screenname, reminded me of the following.

I no longer remember where I first came upon this; think one of the websites that features this actually says there is a set of tablets in Georgia or Washington DC where the entirety of this creed is carved in stone.

The bolded portion is most relevant to Oneness' reply:


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
An illusion it will be, so large, so vast it will escape their perception.

Those who will see it will be thought of as insane.

We will create separate fronts to prevent them from seeing the connection between us.

We will behave as if we are not connected to keep the illusion alive. Our goal will be accomplished one drop at a time so as to never bring suspicion upon ourselves. This will also prevent them from seeing the changes as they occur.

We will always stand above the relative field of their experience for we know the secrets of the absolute.

We will work together always and will remain bound by blood and secrecy. Death will come to he who speaks.

We will keep their lifespan short and their minds weak while pretending to do the opposite.

We will use our knowledge of science and technology in subtle ways so they will never see what is happening.

We will use soft metals, aging accelerators and sedatives in food and water, also in the air.

They will be blanketed by poisons everywhere they turn.

The soft metals will cause them to lose their minds. We will promise to find a cure from our many fronts, yet we will feed them more poison.

The poisons will be absorbed trough their skin and mouths, they will destroy their minds and reproductive systems.

From all this, their children will be born dead, and we will conceal this information.

The poisons will be hidden in everything that surrounds them, in what they drink, eat, breathe and wear.

We must be ingenious in dispensing the poisons for they can see far.

We will teach them that the poisons are good, with fun images and musical tones.

Those they look up to will help. We will enlist them to push our poisons.

They will see our products being used in film and will grow accustomed to them and will never know their true effect.

When they give birth we will inject poisons into the blood of their children and convince them its for their help.

We will start early on, when their minds are young, we will target their children with what children love most, sweet things.

When their teeth decay we will fill them with metals that will kill their mind and steal their future.

When their ability to learn has been affected, we will create medicine that will make them sicker and cause other diseases for which we will create yet more medicine.

We will render them docile and weak before us by our power.

They will grow depressed, slow and obese, and when they come to us for help, we will give them more poison.

We will focus their attention toward money and material goods so they many never connect with their inner self. We will distract them with fornication, external pleasures and games so they may never be one with the oneness of it all.

Their minds will belong to us and they will do as we say. If they refuse we shall find ways to implement mind-altering technology into their lives. We will use fear as our weapon.

We will establish their governments and establish opposites within. We will own both sides.

We will always hide our objective but carry out our plan.

They will perform the labor for us and we shall prosper from their toil.

Our families will never mix with theirs. Our blood must be pure always, for it is the way.

We will make them kill each other when it suits us.

We will keep them separated from the oneness by dogma and religion.

We will control all aspects of their lives and tell them what to think and how.

We will guide them kindly and gently letting them think they are guiding themselves.

We will foment animosity between them through our factions.

When a light shall shine among them, we shall extinguish it by ridicule, or death, whichever suits us best.

We will make them rip each other's hearts apart and kill their own children.

We will accomplish this by using hate as our ally, anger as our friend.

The hate will blind them totally, and never shall they see that from their conflicts we emerge as their rulers. They will be busy killing each other.

They will bathe in their own blood and kill their neighbors for as long as we see fit.

We will benefit greatly from this, for they will not see us, for they cannot see us.

We will continue to prosper from their wars and their deaths.

We shall repeat this over and over until our ultimate goal is accomplished.

We will continue to make them live in fear and anger though images and sounds.

We will use all the tools we have to accomplish this.

The tools will be provided by their labor.


We will make them hate themselves and their neighbors.

We will always hide the divine truth from them, that we are all one. This they must never know!

They must never know that color is an illusion, they must always think they are not equal.


Drop by drop, drop by drop we will advance our goal.

We will take over their land, resources and wealth to exercise total control over them.

We will deceive them into accepting laws that will steal the little freedom they will have.

We will establish a money system that will imprison them forever, keeping them and their children in debt.

When they shall ban together, we shall accuse them of crimes and present a
different story to the world for we shall own all the media.

We will use our media to control the flow of information and their sentiment
in our favor.

When they shall rise up against us we will crush them like insects, for they are less than that.

They will be helpless to do anything for they will have no weapons.

We will recruit some of their own to carry out our plans, we will promise them
eternal life, but eternal life they will never have for they are not of us.

The recruits will be called "initiates" and will be indoctrinated to believe false rites of passage to higher realms. Members of these groups will think they are one with us never knowing the truth. They must never learn this truth for they will turn against us.

For their work they will be rewarded with earthly things and great titles, but never will they become immortal and join us, never will they receive the light and travel the stars.

They will never reach the higher realms, for the killing of their own kind will prevent passage to the realm of enlightenment. This they will never know.

The truth will be hidden in their face, so close they will not be able to focus
on it until its too late.

Oh yes, so grand the illusion of freedom will be, that they will never know they
are our slaves.

When all is in place, the reality we will have created for them will own them.
This reality will be their prison. They will live in self-delusion.

When our goal is accomplished a new era of domination will begin.

Their minds will be bound by their beliefs, the beliefs we have established from time immemorial.

But if they ever find out they are our equal, we shall perish then. THIS THEY
MUST NEVER KNOW.

If they ever find out that together they can vanquish us, they will take action.

They must never, ever find out what we have done, for if they do, we shall have no place to run, for it will be easy to see who we are once the veil has fallen. Our actions will have revealed who we are and they will hunt us down and no person shall give us shelter.

This is the secret covenant by which we shall live the rest of our present and future lives, for this reality will transcend many generations and life spans.

This covenant is sealed by blood, our blood. We, the ones who from heaven to earth came.

This covenant must NEVER, EVER be known to exist. It must NEVER, EVER be written or spoken of for if it is, the consciousness it will spawn will release the fury of the PRIME CREATOR upon us and we shall be cast to the depths from whence we came and remain there until the end time of infinity itself.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The problem I see with this thread is that if the bible is true, then the Earth is flat, and the sun goes around this flat Earth.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
The problem I see with this thread is that if the bible is true, then the Earth is flat, and the sun goes around this flat Earth.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
The problem I see with this thread is that if the bible is true, then the Earth is flat, and the sun goes around this flat Earth.



1. You need not vie for my attention, Shake.
Bush/Obama as Satan has been a popular meme since 2008.

Truthfully, I'm only debating which review of "I, Pet Goat" would best exemplify what you, and/or several scores of others, fully allude to with that reference.



2. The flatness or roundness of the Earth has little to do with my title question, but I have little problem discussing that if you wish.

I presume you're getting this from some verse covered in the following, though.

You can save us some time by confirming or denying as much and/or simply stating what verse you're going off of to claim "flat Earth".

https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20091021121500AAv7oFl


3. I'm really not sure where you're deriving "Sun goes 'round the Earth" from.
Please provide the verse you're referring to if you want me to discuss that with you.

^ Wow! So BWR must have never read the OT.

Stoic's answer is a very good one, in a way Satan is a lie, and his agenda is an entire failure, but I'll nitpick the statement a bit for argument's sake.

If we go by the interpretation that Lucifer is Satan, he has no physical form, or his form is unknown to us. Angels are freedomless, eternal and spiritual beings, hence their physical appearence isn't at thing. But we know that Angels used to have a physical representation, when the Arc of the Alliance is described, some "angels with wings" are crafted on it. So the thing we know about angels is that they do not have wings, that's a start.

If an Angel is timeless and freedomless, he cannot really lie, he can just "be wrong". In a way, he cannot be something he's not, he can just appear to be different. So I don't think Lucifer would shapeshift by the sheer virtue of conveniance. Of course, there is also the possibility that the fall, broke Lucifer in his angelic nature, tainting his spiritual form by being exorcised from heaven in the same way our spirits would suffer from being passively on hell. But that's speculation.

Angels probably have a similar form to that of primitive animals, it'd have been hard to describe an animal different to any other, but the hebrews probably had an idea of how they were supposed to look. In Islam Lucifer was not actually an angel, but a fire spirit, a djinn. While this was an obvious way of mixing arabian tradition into the Islam, we can actually justify the view of Luficer as a star coming from this djinn idea. For the muslim, djinn are not without freedom like angels, which is why they can sin. I wonder if this can be seen as a condition of the primitive values in muslim faith, obedience and blind faith being a central part of their religion, making it so freedom is ultimately the weakness of Lucifer and his acolytes.

Originally posted by Bentley

Angels probably have a similar form to that of primitive animals, it'd have been hard to describe an animal different to any other, but the Hebrews probably had an idea of how they were supposed to look. In Islam Lucifer was not actually an angel, but a fire spirit, a djinn. While this was an obvious way of mixing Arabian tradition into the Islam, we can actually justify the view of Luficer as a star coming from this djinn idea. For the Muslim, djinn are not without freedom like angels, which is why they can sin. I wonder if this can be seen as a condition of the primitive values in Muslim faith, obedience and blind faith being a central part of their religion, making it so freedom is ultimately the weakness of Lucifer and his acolytes.



Many, many issues to cover here.

For now, though, relating to what you wrote above, and keeping my promise,
"I, Pet Goat", a remarkable CGI work from a group entitled "Heliophant", which has its own website and still (at least earlier today it did) has the original film available for view.

It is a strange work, and so layered and laden with imagery and symbolism that even the creator of the film, a man named Louise Lefebvre, says he does not fully glean all its meaning.
It'd be interesting to hear Digi's take on such an admission; from everything I can gather, Digi believes even the most complex work can be explained very simply and related to anyone comprehensibly.
I don't think Digi realizes what a unique category his background with graphic arts, design, and programming, actually places him in.
Certainly Lefebvre doesn't agree with Digi.

Lefebvre describes the "I, Pet Goat" script almost as if it came to him as a dream, and Lefebvre is not only open to viewer interpretation but actively solicits it on the Heliophant website.


Perhaps the most well thought-out analysis I've come across is contained in the following two clips. I cannot recommend the first of these enough; it is useless to try to understand "I, Pet Goat" without the first video.

However, a few cautions are in order:

PARENTAL GUIDANCE SUGGESTED.
PLEASE DO NOT VIEW THESE CLIPS IF YOU ARE 13 or UNDER.

Note that "I, Pet Goat" does not go out of its way to be graphic.
Nevertheless, the film and the analyses of it are frank in ALL aspects of life and spirituality and may be offensive to some.

1. Parental Guidance HEAVILY suggested for the 16 minute 16 second mark to 17 minute 23 second mark section of the first video.

2. Parental Guidance equally heavily suggested for the 16 minute 8 second mark to 16 minute 53 second mark of the second video, a revisitation of the same scene of "I, Pet Goat" with different details.

3. You WON'T like the interpretation of 1 & 2 if you're Catholic. Adult or not.
You just won't. Apologies in advance; I had no input into the creation of the "I, Pet Goat" film or these reviews.

Of note:

Reviewer fails at a prediction slated for February of last year.
All but meaningless to me; has 99% of nothing to do with 99% of the rest of the analysis. A bad extrapolation made because reviewer resorted to guessing and date-setting.

Reviewer thinks the "Mark of the Beast" is literal and is, in fact, the RFID chip widely discussed and actually put on market a few years ago.
Not sure how much I agree with that line of thinking.

Nevertheless, it made me think of a commercial I saw a few years ago.
So creepy even to a friend inured to such things could only marvel a company would use said commercial, thinking that it would PROMOTE their product as opposed to turning people away from it.

That commercial was a much longer version of the following, which unfortunately only HINTS at the eerieness of the original:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D5Sukiv26FY
(RFID Verichip shortened commercial clip, 1 minute 2 seconds)


Other than that, though, I think the reviewer is largely correct about what LeFebvre depicts. Please note that whether what LeFebvre depicts is reality or not is another matter entirely.



Now, though, cue parental advisory.



"I, Pet Goat" ...


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
PARENTAL GUIDANCE SUGGESTED.
PLEASE DO NOT VIEW THESE CLIPS IF YOU ARE 13 or UNDER.

Note that "I, Pet Goat" does not go out of its way to be graphic.
Nevertheless, the film and the analyses of it are frank in ALL aspects of life and spirituality and may be offensive to some.

1. Parental Guidance HEAVILY suggested for the 16 minute 16 second mark to 17 minute 23 second mark section of the first video.

2. Parental Guidance equally heavily suggested for the 16 minute 8 second mark to 16 minute 53 second mark of the second video, a revisitation of the same scene of "I, Pet Goat" with different details.

2. **I, Pet Goat. best initial explanation** (by F321Christine)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C8eSdAlz2qU
(28 minutes 45 seconds, 1st 23 minutes especially)

3. I, Pet Goat. revisited
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dVEFlej_ha0
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------





https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZUPrCEoH8U
(Katharine Albrecht on RFIDs, 1st 6 minutes)

Originally posted by Bentley

Angels probably have a similar form to that of primitive animals, it'd have been hard to describe an animal different to any other,
but the Hebrews probably had an idea of how they were supposed to look.


Not quite sure what you're trying to say here.

Is this a riff on Satan being the Serpent in the Garden?

Or saying the weird beasts found in books like Isaiah and Revelation are angels?




Originally posted by Bentley

In Islam Lucifer was not actually an angel, but a fire spirit, a djinn. While this was an obvious way of mixing Arabian tradition into the Islam, we can actually justify the view of Luficer as a star coming from this djinn idea. For the Muslim, djinn are not without freedom like angels, which is why they can sin.



"I, Pet Goat" features "Drako" (The Dragon) as a TV-ied serpent, Blue/Purple Djinn and interposes Celestial Fire from "Jesus" to birth the False Christ or Anti-Christ of the film.

Interestingly, "I, Pet Goat" also features Osama Bin Laden as a dark angelic figure.



Originally posted by Bentley
I wonder if this can be seen as a condition of the primitive values in Muslim faith, obedience and blind faith being a central part of their religion, making it so freedom is ultimately the weakness of Lucifer and his acolytes.



You'll probably need somebody not only versed in the Koran but also fluent in both Arabic and English to properly answer a question like that.

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
Not quite sure what you're trying to say here.

Is this a riff on Satan being the Serpent in the Garden?

Or saying the weird beasts found in books like Isaiah and Revelation are angels?

I thought about the latter. My idea is that there could've been a cultural representation of an angel back when the hebrews made the arc and such representation wasn't necessarily that of a man. I assumed that it could've been some sort of providential animal, but not necessarily one that would be recognizable by us. The leviathan is assumed to be a hippopotamus.


Originally posted by bluewaterrider
You'll probably need somebody not only versed in the Koran but also fluent in both Arabic and English to properly answer a question like that.

Yeah, it's sort of a serious a complex answer, I was mostly wondering about it for aesthetical proposes.

I'll try to check the dreamish videos you brought later today, sadly I'm at work and cannot reply otherwise than with short phrases.

Originally posted by Bentley
I assumed that it could've been some sort of providential animal, but not necessarily one that would be recognizable by us.



Like Jonah's fish, I presume.


Originally posted by Bentley

The leviathan is assumed to be a hippopotamus.


Gotta challenge you on this one.

Once, I would have thought similarly.
Now ... I'm not so sure.

Maybe listened to one too many radio programs, maybe watched one too many YouTube videos, maybe visited one too many websites, but ...

The closest match for something with a "tail like a cedar tree" in our biological history record ...

(Well, it wouldn't have been a hippo.)

http://www.gotquestions.org/dinosaurs-Bible.html

Originally posted by Bentley
I'll try to check the dreamish videos you brought later today, sadly I'm at work and cannot reply otherwise than with short phrases.

If you have questions on "I, Pet Goat", be sure to ask them.
Objections, complaints, etcetera.

Besides everything else, I'm interested in knowing how much background the average person needs before the symbolism used in that sort of esoteric work makes relatively complete sense.

Originally posted by Bentley
I assumed that it could've been some sort of providential animal, but not necessarily one that would be recognizable by us. The leviathan is assumed to be a hippopotamus.




I'm curious now what your response to the following would be, too much so not to include this here:



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eYlYsibZ81o

"I, Pet Goat".

Originally posted by Mindship
"I, Pet Goat".



No! Have you gone to the dark side?!

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
No! Have you gone to the dark side?! I love the animation. I may not agree with any messages, but it's cool to watch. Besides, it's all part of the Dream anyway.

Originally posted by Mindship
I love the animation. I may not agree with any messages, but it's cool to watch. Besides, it's all part of the Dream anyway.

Okay! Just as long as you don't start quoting the bible.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Okay! Just as long as you don't start quoting the bible.

"I, Pet Goat" has so much lotus imagery I think even you might like it.

Seriously.

At this moment, I'm actually thinking, that, if I had a means of guaranteeing receipt of your honest insight on that clip for a charge of $3 ...

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
"I, Pet Goat" has so much lotus imagery I think even you might like it.

Seriously.

At this moment, I'm actually thinking, that, if I had a means of guaranteeing receipt of your honest insight on that clip for a charge of $3 ...

Okay I watched the video. Really nice animation. To me it was a mix of new age and new light Christianity.

There are two meaning to the Lotus; the first represents the traditions of eastern thought. You find this a lot in gift shops; the second is the profound simultaneity of the mystic law. I was pleased to see an attempt to use both in the video, or am I just projecting, I don't know.

It seemed that the lotus at the end was guiding the Jesus figure while the sand castle was being destroyed in the background.

I wanna change my answer.

Assuming the Bible to be correct, how would Satan initially appear today?

A: As bacon.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
The problem I see with this thread is that if the bible is true, then the Earth is flat, and the sun goes around this flat Earth.

how about this?

"It is he who sits above the circle of the earth, and its inhabitants are like grasshoppers; who stretches out the heavens like a curtain, and spreads them like a tent to dwell in;"
Isaiah 40:22

the "circle" there is chuwg (H2329) in Hebrew which means circle, circuit, compass, sphere...

so... no, the earth is a sphere according to the Bible...

He would appear as threads like these all over the internet.

#onlykindajoking #kerneloftruth #420blazeit #sockswithcrocs #creatinewillgetyaassbig

Originally posted by Digi
He would appear as threads like these all over the internet.

#onlykindajoking #kerneloftruth #420blazeit #sockswithcrocs #creatinewillgetyaassbig

Didn't know threads were male. If satan existed, it would have to be female.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
A circles is a two dimensional slice of a sphere. It is not a sphere.

The word compass is referring to something two dimensional. It is also not a sphere.

uhm... the word also means "sphere"...

http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=H2329&t=NKJV

Originally posted by dyajeep
uhm... the word also means "sphere"...

http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=H2329&t=NKJV

I don't trust your source. A sphere is not a circle. Mathematically a circle is an intersection of a sphere. They cannot be the same thing.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
I don't trust your source. A sphere is not a circle. Mathematically a circle is an intersection of a sphere. They cannot be the same thing.

well, you can just say you don't trust the source if it does not suit you... but that's the meaning of the Hebrew word...

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Are you saying that the god of the bible is satan? Did this comment make sense in your head?

Originally posted by dyajeep
well, you can just say you don't trust the source if it does not suit you... but that's the meaning of the Hebrew word...

Okay, then the people who wrote the bible didn't know the difference between a circle and a sphere, because they only had one word for it. How could they know that the Earth was a sphere and not a circle if they didn't have a word that described the difference? I think the people who wrote the bible thought the Earth was flat, and the people who put the web site up wants you to think that the bible says the Earth was a sphere.

Just find a neutral source.

That's an interesting retroactive interpretation of the scripture regarding being "above a circle". Reminds me of the argument about the scripture which states "The things that are seen are made of things unseen" (paraphrasing, of course) somehow meaning that the writers of the Bible were already aware of Quantum Physics and the Atomic and Sub-Atomic Structure of Matter. Or another point of Biblical Cosmology where it talks about God creating "the firmament" and separating the waters of the Earth from the waters above the Earth so they wouldn't flood the Earth, and calling the firmament "Heaven" and some Rabbi/Preachers's will interpret that as the Earth being a geometric plane with a dome over (like a snowglobe), some will say it represents a sphere, some will say it's symbolic, and some will say something else. Same thing with the "waters above". Some say it's literal, with the 'waters' being a poetic description of the vacuum of space and arguing that the writers of the Bible were aware of the different layers of our atmosphere and properties of outer space. Others will acknowledge it just being a metaphor. Some will say it's simply poetic license regarding their perspective from the planets surface, etc.

Simply put, all the interpretations lack validity without some concrete evidence to support them. And to say that an arbitrary use of the phrase 'above the circle' means that Biblical Authors had the same knowledge of celestial bodies which we have now and were 'ahead of their time' is an incredible reach. Unless you also think that our atmosphere is Heaven and space is full of water.

Though you likely don't agree with that interpretation either.

Originally posted by MF DELPH
That's an interesting retroactive interpretation of the scripture regarding being "above a circle". Reminds me of the argument about the scripture which states "The things that are seen are made of things unseen" (paraphrasing, of course) somehow meaning that the writers of the Bible were already aware of Quantum Physics and the Atomic and Sub-Atomic Structure of Matter. Or another point of Biblical Cosmology where it talks about God creating "the firmament" and separating the waters of the Earth from the waters above the Earth so they wouldn't flood the Earth, and calling the firmament "Heaven" and some Rabbi/Preachers's will interpret that as the Earth being a geometric plane with a dome over (like a snowglobe), some will say it represents a sphere, some will say it's symbolic, and some will say something else. Same thing with the "waters above". Some say it's literal, with the 'waters' being a poetic description of the vacuum of space and arguing that the writers of the Bible were aware of the different layers of our atmosphere and properties of outer space. Others will acknowledge it just being a metaphor. Some will say it's simply poetic license regarding their perspective from the planets surface, etc.

Simply put, all the interpretations lack validity without some concrete evidence to support them. And to say that an arbitrary use of the phrase 'above the circle' means that Biblical Authors had the same knowledge of celestial bodies which we have now and were 'ahead of their time' is an incredible reach. Unless you also think that our atmosphere is Heaven and space is full of water.

Though you likely don't agree with that interpretation either.