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Lets say Mace killed palpatine and order 66 was never accomplished, the Sepratists get defeated and there is peace up until the yuzzhan vong invasion, who would win the war? The republic still uses clones.

Republic

Yeah the Republic. They've got a full Jedi Order and a massive army.

But would the Republic keep the army? There wasn't one before the Clone War, and that was only because Dooku manipulated Syfo-Dyas into having one created on Kamino.

Originally posted by Kalen Sykes
But would the Republic keep the army? There wasn't one before the Clone War, and that was only because Dooku manipulated Syfo-Dyas into having one created on Kamino. no in this the republic still has the clone army and still uses the fett template.

Originally posted by PTforthewin
no in this the republic still has the clone army and still uses the fett template.



Ahh, ok. In that case, The Republic wins.

They take a heck of a lot of damage, the Vong likely even take Coruscant again, but yes, the Republic wins.

Republic take this. I doubt the Vong take Coruscant. Luke often wished that he hadn't scrapped the superweapons of the Empire, and the Republic still has many many Star Dreadnoughts from KDY's home fleet.

The jedi would still have Koon Fisto Mace Kenobi Yoda Anakin ect all people who either died or were force into exile because of the war. These war heros would serve the republic well in the war against the Vong

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Republic take this. I doubt the Vong take Coruscant. Luke often wished that he hadn't scrapped the superweapons of the Empire, and the Republic still has many many Star Dreadnoughts from KDY's home fleet.

SDs smaller than the New Republic's Mon Cals or ISDs, though. Less good fighters too.



Also, the Vong still had plenty of forces as-of when they took Coruscant. It's only the massive cost of grabbing that planet that made them begin to suffer logistically.

Stopping them before Coruscant will be really hard.

Some random mook Vong comes up with a plan he calls order 66, the announcer says "FINISH HIM"

he sais "execute order 66"

http://cdn3.whatculture.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/Mileena-Fatality-4-300x160.jpg

Yea I don't think the Republic wins. Wasn't that one of the reasons Palpatine created the empire? He didn't think the Republic as currently constituted, was prepared for the outside threat?

Originally posted by psmith81992
Yea I don't think the Republic wins. Wasn't that one of the reasons Palpatine created the empire? He didn't think the Republic as currently constituted, was prepared for the outside threat?


I think that's just a popular fan theory. If I'm not mistaken, when the Vong attacked Zonoma Sekot, Vergere arrived and convinced them to withdraw, provided she went with them. Thrawn did come across them later, but I don't think there is any evidence that Palpatine was planning for a potential invasion 25 years down the road.

No I'm fairly certain I read it in a book.

He'd already had things in the works. If anything, he heard vague rumblings of unknown scope and used it as an excuse that convinced Thrawn.

As Han Solo pointed out, things like the Death Star are less useful against a galactic invasion than a large fleet, especially if a hotshot Coralskipper pilot blows them up.

Originally posted by Q99
SDs smaller than the New Republic's Mon Cals or ISDs, though. Less good fighters too.

Nope. The Imperator and the Tector were still around as of the Clone Wars. Venators main batteries were comparable to that of an ISD anyway.

Furthermore even at the height of the Empire there were only about 20,000 ISDs, the rest of the Empire's millions of warships were made up of the varying escort classes. And trust me the Empire has millions of warships considering that in ICS it states the CIS had millions of capital ships engaged in the outer rim seiges.



The CIS was a far larger threat than the Vong, had over a quadrillion battledroids, millions of warships, started with worlds loyal to them in the Core Worlds and still got their invasion of Coruscant repelled.



Why? The only reason the CIS ever struck Coruscant was because Sidious leaked secret hyperspace routes to the core worlds.

Originally posted by WildBantha88
The jedi would still have Koon Fisto Mace Kenobi Yoda Anakin ect all people who either died or were force into exile because of the war. These war heros would serve the republic well in the war against the Vong they would not have yoda, yoda died in 4 ABY due to old age, mace may be the grandmaster.

Originally posted by PTforthewin
they would not have yoda, yoda died in 4 ABY due to old age, mace may be the grandmaster.


They would still have a, by that time, full potential Anakin, Luke, and quite possibly a very different Leia. If Anakin was there for his children's birth, it seems likely he would want them both trained. I could see either Obi-Wan or Anakin possibly in charge of the Order, to be honest. By the time of the Vong Invasion, Mace would've been 97 and Obi-Wan would've been 82. Dooku is an example that a jedi can function into his twilight years, but 97 might be pushing it just a bit.

Originally posted by psmith81992
No I'm fairly certain I read it in a book.

Outbound Flight by Timothy Zahn. But, to be fair, that was still when the Republic had no standing army.

Originally posted by The_Tempest
Outbound Flight by Timothy Zahn. But, to be fair, that was still when the Republic had no standing army.


I liked that book, I can't believe I didn't recall that. My mistake, psmith.

Zahn sucked Thrawn's dick so hard in that book that it stopped being fascinating and just became self/fan service.

Originally posted by Kalen Sykes
I think that's just a popular fan theory.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Nope. The Imperator and the Tector were still around as of the Clone Wars. Venators main batteries were comparable to that of an ISD anyway.

And Venators are smaller and have fewer guns to make up for it.

Sure, proper ISDs were introduced around the time of the very end of the Clone Wars, but they're few in number for some time. Against the Vong, this means their ships of the line will outmatch the Republic ships of the line for a good while.

And the Vong has more big ships. They had a significant number of Super Star Destroyer equivalents, plus of course one fully combat capable World Ship which has *no* equivalent or easy way to take out. It took an Executor-class converted into a giant suicide bomb to defeat... and the Old Republic has no Executor-class sized ships, or even near it.




And you think the NR after gearing up for several years doesn't? Because the New Republic was building fleets for several years. The war lasted longer than the Clone Wars.




Because the Vong are a bigger threat than the CIS with bigger, badder ships and they managed to not just attack Coruscant in a raid like the CIS did but take it, and hold it for two years, half the war.


The Vong fought pitched battles for 4 years, including taking the most fortified planet in the galaxy. The CIS fought a more evasive war for 3. The Yuuzhan Vong don't need a sneaky route to it, they'll get their eventually, the problem is actually take it takes enough resources that it'll stall them out again and give the Republic time to mass more forces.

Originally posted by Q99
And Venators are smaller and have fewer guns to make up for it.

Sure, proper ISDs were introduced around the time of the very end of the Clone Wars, but they're few in number for some time. Against the Vong, this means their ships of the line will outmatch the Republic ships of the line for a good while.

And the Vong has more big ships. They had a significant number of Super Star Destroyer equivalents, plus of course one fully combat capable World Ship which has *no* equivalent or easy way to take out. It took an Executor-class converted into a giant suicide bomb to defeat... and the Old Republic has no Executor-class sized ships, or even near it.




And you think the NR after gearing up for several years doesn't? Because the New Republic was building fleets for several years. The war lasted longer than the Clone Wars.




Because the Vong are a bigger threat than the CIS with bigger, badder ships and they managed to not just attack Coruscant in a raid like the CIS did but take it, and hold it for two years, half the war.


The Vong fought pitched battles for 4 years, including taking the most fortified planet in the galaxy. The CIS fought a more evasive war for 3. The Yuuzhan Vong don't need a sneaky route to it, they'll get their eventually, the problem is actually take it takes enough resources that it'll stall them out again and give the Republic time to mass more forces.


You make good points, regarding the Vong compared to the CIS, but a Republic, fresh from the Clone War, would have the edge, imo. Especially with a full Jedi order, possibly led by Obi-Wan, but including a full potential Anakin. Luke and Leia would probably be trained, as well.

Originally posted by Kalen Sykes
You make good points, regarding the Vong compared to the CIS, but a Republic, fresh from the Clone War, would have the edge, imo. Especially with a full Jedi order, possibly led by Obi-Wan, but including a full potential Anakin. Luke and Leia would probably be trained, as well.

Oh, I'm not saying they won't win, I believe they will (and probably while Like and Leia are still little kids!). I'm just saying the Vong have enough resources to get that far.

The Republic's larger fleet and army at the start will make up for their smaller ships, and new, bigger ships will continue to roll out. It'll be bloody for them early on, but at *some point* they're going to stall the Vong offensive.



The Vong and CIS are somewhat opposites in strategy, really- the CIS has great endurance due to how cheap it's forces are, but it loses bad in a stand-up fight, so once a quick win is out of the picture, they want to drag things out to try and get the Republic to give up via raids on the leadership and war werriness.

The Vong, on the flip side, has a massively powerful fleet out the gate, but are less good at replacing losses (small stuff like fighters can be replaced fast, but the big ships take longer to grow), so what they need to do is win the day as quickly as possible and should continue to try and land hammerblow after hammerblow. Go after Kuat, Kamino, worlds like that.

Really, it was a bad move of them to go for Coruscant. They'd have been better off trying to bypass it and go after more ship yards and such to lesson the galaxy's resource edge.

And they're going to make the same mistake here, Coruscant simply costs too much to take.

Q99 more or less summed up the advantages pretty well. The Vong probably have an advantage in firepower and fanaticism, but the Republic fields greater numbers, has a titanic industrial base, and is bolstered by the massed ranks of the Jedi order.

On the other hand, the Vong would be coming out of the gate fresh whereas the Republic and Jedi have exhausted themselves fighting a Pyrrhic battle with the CIS.

I forgot to mention the republic has more advanced technology by this point

More advanced than what? The Vong?

Not more advanced then the vong, but just more advanced since the clone wars

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Zahn sucked Thrawn's dick so hard in that book that it stopped being fascinating and just became self/fan service.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Zahn sucked Thrawn's dick so hard in that book that it stopped being fascinating and just became self/fan service.



What did you think of Allegiance?

Originally posted by Q99
And Venators are smaller and have fewer guns to make up for it.

The main battery are the ISDs primary weapons though. Also the Venator has over four times the fighter compliment to make up for it.



Considering the Republic won't be wasting time and resources on building a Death Star all of their industrial capacity can be shifted to pumping out ISDs and larger vessels. Also the KDY sector fleets still had warships that outgunned ISDs.



How many? Because they still had several 8km Mandators, and the 12 km Mandator-III was likely close to production.




And how many ships do they have?





The CIS most certainly could have taken Coruscant. That's what the Malevolence was designed for.




Against a Galaxy divided. The New Republic didn't have millions of warships and trillions of soldiers.

Also Mace Windu foresaw the fall of Coruscant by the Vong and they wouldn't make the mistake of diverting the Home Fleet to the Outer Rim as they did in the Clone Wars.

Also the CIS did have the capacity to take Coruscant, they simply did not. The Battle also lasted far longer than the Vong siege considering Fleets from the Outer Rim had time to arrive, meanwhile the Vong invasion Fleets from Kuat and other Core Sectors didn't have time to arrive.

Also when has the New Republic ever been cited at having millions of warships?

Originally posted by Lord Stark
The main battery are the ISDs primary weapons though. Also the Venator has over four times the fighter compliment to make up for it.



Considering the Republic won't be wasting time and resources on building a Death Star all of their industrial capacity can be shifted to pumping out ISDs and larger vessels. Also the KDY sector fleets still had warships that outgunned ISDs.



How many? Because they still had several 8km Mandators, and the 12 km Mandator-III was likely close to production.




And how many ships do they have?





The CIS most certainly could have taken Coruscant. That's what the Malevolence was designed for.




Against a Galaxy divided. The New Republic didn't have millions of warships and trillions of soldiers.

Also Mace Windu foresaw the fall of Coruscant by the Vong and they wouldn't make the mistake of diverting the Home Fleet to the Outer Rim as they did in the Clone Wars.

Also the CIS did have the capacity to take Coruscant, they simply did not. The Battle also lasted far longer than the Vong siege considering Fleets from the Outer Rim had time to arrive, meanwhile the Vong invasion Fleets from Kuat and other Core Sectors didn't have time to arrive.

Also when has the New Republic ever been cited at having millions of warships? the CIS was losing the land battle on coruscant.

And the fighter complement takes away from other systems more. You do need a couple Venators to match up to one ISD.



They had at least two classes in service- the 'Dreadnaught Analogs' and the Kor Chokk Grand Cruiser. Exact numbers unknown, but both were seen on multiple occasions.

There were also the Worldships, of which there was 12. One of them was fully combat capable, Domain Hul, but the others were still used as giant fighter bases or sometimes landed and used as stationary fortresses.

Now, considering there were only 7 Mandators in service...



They really weren't all that divided, and even the other divisions (small next to the Republic) contributed to the fighting, and then the Galactic Alliance united everything. And what makes you think they didn't, over 4 years of war and recruitment from across the very same galaxy and with the same industry the OR had?

The republic only had several million clones, that's what lama Su or taun we said to Obi Wan in AOTC

Originally posted by PTforthewin
The republic only had several million clones, that's what lama Su or taun we said to Obi Wan in AOTC
Maybe this was the strength during the battle of Geonosis.

Entire strength would have been considerably expanded during The Clone Wars.

Originally posted by Q99
And the fighter complement takes away from other systems more. You do need a couple Venators to match up to one ISD.



They had at least two classes in service- the 'Dreadnaught Analogs' and the Kor Chokk Grand Cruiser. Exact numbers unknown, but both were seen on multiple occasions.

There were also the Worldships, of which there was 12. One of them was fully combat capable, Domain Hul, but the others were still used as giant fighter bases or sometimes landed and used as stationary fortresses.

Now, considering there were only 7 Mandators in service...


There were 7 Mandator-Is because they were designed for regional defence. The Mandator-II which was for long range missions would have been deployed at a larger rate. Not to mention the other massive battlecruisers the Republic employed.



Didn't Coruscant get hit because of the incompetence of their Chief of Staff? The Jedi will not make such a mistake, especially considering Windu's vision.

Originally posted by PTforthewin
The republic only had several million clones, that's what lama Su or taun we said to Obi Wan in AOTC

Dooku's "We outnumber the Republic 100 to 1" contradicts this. Also he says 200,000 units which was never confirmed to be troopers.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Maybe this was the strength during the battle of Geonosis.

Entire strength would have been considerably expanded during The Clone Wars. yea but the second gen clones are not as battlehardened as the first gen.