Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

They completely changed all the databanks again:
http://www.starwars.com/databank

Disney Management have finally taken charge of the official website, changes implemented to the official website are representative of the vision of Disney Management.

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From Palpatine's profile:-

Scheming, powerful, and evil to the core, Darth Sidious restored the Sith and destroyed the Jedi Order.

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Strong with the dark side, Sidous felt a disturbance in the Force as Luke Skywalker's Jedi powers developed.

From Anakin Skywalker's profile:-

Discovered as a slave on Tatooine by Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan Kenobi, Anakin Skywalker had the potential to become one of the most powerful Jedi ever, and was believed by some to be the prophesized Chosen One who would bring balance to the Force.

http://static.gamespot.com/uploads/scale_super/1290/12904714/2489297-jordan.gif

From Yoda's profile:-

Yoda was a legendary Jedi Master and stronger then most in his connection with the Force. Small in size but wise and powerful, he trained Jedi for over 800 years, playing integral roles in the Clone Wars, the instruction of Luke Skywalker, and unlocking the path of immortality.

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Yoda felt a great disturbance in the Force as countless Jedi were killed by clone troopers, and managed to escape before he himself could be destroyed.

http://static.gamespot.com/uploads/scale_super/1290/12904714/2489297-jordan.gif

From Dooku's profile:-

Count Dooku was a menacing Sith Lord and central figure in the Clone Wars.

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Good to note that Disney is using balanced approach to market the characters, no more stupendous wanking.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Good to note that Disney is using balanced approach to market the characters, no more stupendous wanking.
Right... cause it would suck if one of them was labeled supremely powerful or the most dominating force user or something along those lines.

Only if it's a PT character. excellent

I'm don't care much for the whole "era superiority" thing.

I'm just annoyed they deleted the Darth Bane entry.

I'm pissed that it takes time and clicking to get to the entry for anyone whose name doesn't start with an A

Theres a search bar.

"He Force-pushed Obi-Wan like a ragdoll against the wall of the quarters, knocking him unconscious.
Poor Kenobi. Even Disney shits on him.

Force Push: "Force ability employed by Sith but more commonly by Jedi, allowing the wielder to shove people or objects from a distance."

In the mysterious realm of Mortis there exists a trio of beings able to wield the Force in ways no known mortals of the galaxy can.

Much better now.

I much prefer the Ones' other accolade:
"More powerful with the force than any the Jedi have seen before."

Originally posted by Nephthys
You're far more guilty of that than most members here.
You would be surprised to learn that there used to be a time when I really liked PT/OT era characters, not just because of them being formidable but because they had flaws and limits.

However, many fan-atics ruined that kind of sentiment in the forums with their delusional beliefs and projections of invincibility of the most prominent characters of PT/OT era. Happened again and again and again and I began to feel pissed.

I tend to balance things out, most of my debates are focused on merits of TOR era characters because they are heavily underestimated and lowballed in discussions. I have seen such absurd arguments that they will even baffle you. One gem is that Anakin would blitz Emperor Vitiate/end battle.

So you cannot fault me for being defensive about capabilities of TOR era characters. In-fact, I don't believe that any TOR era character is invincible including Emperor Vitiate. However, the greatest of the TOR era characters are a match for greatest of the PT/OT/Legacy era characters. A valid and balanced viewpoint.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
I much prefer the Ones' other accolade:
"More powerful with the force than any the Jedi have seen before."
Of-course you will...

I would give importance to the latest revelation which is also compatible with the revelation in Star Wars: Darth Plagueis novel.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Yet your "cannot be beaten by any mortal" rant for Vitiate and Thanton hasn't been a problem?
I never claimed that Thanaton cannot be beaten by any other mortal.

Emperor Vitiate have been touted as the most powerful Force-user ever, never lost in a fair battle. His fall is circumstantial. I am not sure what would take to defeat him in a fair scenario but I don't think he is invincible or something, that he is a match for any Force-user. Interestingly for all his might, a lightsaber can be sufficient to stop him for a while provided that he is struck by it, would be forced to switch an avatar if it is destroyed.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
However, many fan-atics ruined that kind of sentiment in the forums with their delusional beliefs and projections of invincibility of the most prominent characters of PT/OT era. Happened again and again and again and I began to feel pissed.

I tend to balance things out, most of my debates are focused on merits of TOR era characters because they are heavily underestimated and lowballed in discussions. I have seen such absurd arguments that they will even baffle you. One gem is that Anakin would blitz Emperor Vitiate/end battle.
I know that feeling. There was this one jackass on this forum I used to be on, and here's some of the bullshit he liked to say:
"Kolar>Malgus>Bane as duelists."
"Kit Fisto is just better than Darth Krayt."
"Obi-Wan is just better than Darth Malgus."
"Darth Maul is just better than Exar Kun"
"Saying that Malgus would beat Fisto because he is more powerful is lolworthy."
"How is Bane beating Ventress?"
"Vos>Bane."
"Admit Bane's limitations, restrictions, failure, weakness, and inferiority."
"Top Ten Most Powerful Sith Lords... 10. Savage Opress."

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
So you cannot fault me for being defensive about capabilities of TOR era characters. In-fact, I don't believe that any TOR era character is invincible including Emperor Vitiate. However, the greatest of the TOR era characters are a match for greatest of the PT/OT/Legacy era characters. A valid and balanced viewpoint.
I wouldn't exactly call saying Vitiate is One level, or Sidious and Bane aren't close to Thanaton's power a balanced viewpoint.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Of-course you will...

I would give importance to the latest revelation which is also compatible with the revelation in Star Wars: Darth Plagueis novel.
And do tell, what is this great discovery?

People are forgetting the Picture Biography all articles have.
There are a great collection of accolades in those.

Also, new accolades for Mortis family: "unspeakably powerful Force-wielders. "

From General Grievous's profile:

General Grievous was a brilliant Separatist military strategist and a feared Jedi hunter, known for his ruthlessness and hacking cough. His body itself was a weapon, allowing him lightning quick strikes and devastating blows. But he was also quick to run from a fight, a tactic that until one final meeting with Obi-Wan Kenobi.

"Meanwhile, Sidious duels the Sith Brothers, never wavering from his position of superiority. Fueled by the dark side, Sidious is transformed into in agile, whirlwind of destruction. He strikes down Savage, killing the monstrous Nightbrother....Maul attempts to avenge his brother's death, but he simply cannot defeat Sidious' power. Sidious disarms his former apprentice, batters him with Force pushes, and inundates him with Sith Lightning. Sidious cackles with glee as he tortures Maul. He cryptically notes that he does not intend to kill Maul. No, Sidious has other uses for the defeated Sith Lord."

Originally posted by Nephthys
You're far more guilty of that than mostany members here.

You are still so ****ing butthurt dude.

Also, SWL has almost undoubtedly met Intrepid.

Originally posted by The_Tempest

Butt-hurt is strong with this one.

Yeah, SWL has been on my ignore list for many moons, but the snippets I've seen as quoted by other people have left little doubt that he's the silliest debater here. Neph is about as close as it gets to someone who defends SWL, and even he routinely calls him out on his BS. He's just not a good debater.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Caedus>Vitiate is not that far fetched relatively speaking.
Reasons?

Originally posted by Emperordmb
By... deleting everything not made by Lucas?
No, by reducing the hype levels of PT/OT characters to reasonable levels. This leaves room for creative liberties.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Based on Thanaton one shotting his past self in a dream.
Even the younger-self of Thanaton have demonstrated the capability to tolerate one of the most formidable bursts of lightning. So Thanaton (prime) managing to one-shot a person of such a strength is something to behold.

In addition, Nox used unnatural methods to tank Thanaton's powers.

It baffles me that Thanaton would cause so much butt-hurt to some.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Yes... those few paragraphs pretty much confirmed that Vitiate is not One level
No, they represent POV of Plagueis. He doesn't knows much about Emperor Vitiate.

However, notable point is that it is believed that 'The Ones' can manipulate the Force better then mortals in general, not necessarily everybody.

Their feats blow Vitiate away in seconds.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Their feats blow Vitiate away in seconds.
Hmm, like what?

Lightning that can shatter mountains.
Able to deflect/deactivate lightsabers with their bare-hands.
Ability to transform into any shape at will.
Defeated the Kenobi/Anakin/Ahsoka team in seconds.
Confirmed to be more powerful then the likes of Abeloth.
Can only be killed by the Dagger of Mortis.

I can continue, if you wish.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Yoda felt a great disturbance in the Force as countless Jedi were killed by clone troopers, and managed to escape before he himself could be destroyed.

http://static.gamespot.com/uploads/scale_super/1290/12904714/2489297-jordan.gif

And?

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Reasons?
Caedus has excellent TK feats, is a boss physically, is a master duelist, and managed to slug it out with Luke for a bit.

I'm not saying Caedus would win per se, but it would be a decent fight. Caedus is easily in the top 5 Sith.


Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Even the younger-self of Thanaton have demonstrated the capability to tolerate one of the most formidable bursts of lightning. So Thanaton (prime) managing to one-shot a person of such a strength is something to behold.
Didn't Teneb Kel go out like a ***** to Exal's lightning?

"Dream sequences" are also hardly the most accurate displays of power.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
In addition, Nox used unnatural methods to tank Thanaton's powers.
That doesn't mean that that's the limit of what it would take to tank his powers. Nox casually tanked it, that hardly demonstrates a limit.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
No, they represent POV of Plagueis. He doesn't knows much about Emperor Vitiate.
Yet he knows more about the Ones' limits than Vitiate's?

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
The notable point of sharing that information is that it is believed that The Ones can manipulate the Force better then mortals in general, not necessarily everybody.
Plagueis said that Vitiate wasn't even on Celestial level, mush less the Ones who are essentially evolved Celestials.

They also already have a G canon quote saying that they are more powerful than any Jedi have seen before so...

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Of-course you will...

I would give importance to the latest revelation which is also compatible with the revelation in Star Wars: Darth Plagueis novel.

You mean the non-canon one?

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Right... cause it would suck if one of them was labeled supremely powerful or the most dominating force user or something along those lines.

Like Darth Bane

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Lightning that can shatter mountains.
Evidence?

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Able to deflect/deactivate lightsabers with their bare-hands.
Yes, a feat that even highly talented Jedi and Sith can pull off.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Ability to transform into any shape at will.
Yes, a feat that Dread Masters can pull off.

Dread Masters can do more actually:

- Alter reality
- Bring dead back to life
- Telepathically turn large number of sentient beings simultaneously in to mindless slaves (unwitting pawns).
- Summon monstrosities out of nowhere

Most importantly:-

In his relentless pursuit of immortality, the Emperor explored the most sinister, uncharted depths of the dark side.

What does this revelation tells you?

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Defeated the Kenobi/Anakin/Ahsoka team in seconds.
Emperor Vitiate defeated 4 great Jedi in seconds.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Confirmed to be more powerful then the likes of Abeloth.
Where?

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Can only be killed by the Dagger of Mortis.
No, Father was dying

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
I can continue, if you wish.
Sure do.

Originally posted by ares834
And?
Yoda is not invincible and unstoppable, right?

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Caedus has excellent TK feats, is a boss physically, is a master duelist, and managed to slug it out with Luke for a bit.

I'm not saying Caedus would win per se, but it would be a decent fight. Caedus is easily in the top 5 Sith.
Caedus being among the finest is not an issue, the suggestion that he is equal to and/or stronger then Emperor Vitiate is baseless.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Didn't Teneb Kel go out like a ***** to Exal's lightning?
He didn't die from it.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
"Dream sequences" are also hardly the most accurate displays of power.
Visions are always correct. Point is that they represent possibilities and may or may not come true.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
That doesn't mean that that's the limit of what it would take to tank his powers. Nox casually tanked it, that hardly demonstrates a limit.
Once again, Nox would not have casually tanked it or tanked it all without drawing strength from several Force spirits. Try to understand the ground reality instead of portraying Nox like a regular.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Yet he knows more about the Ones' limits than Vitiate's?
Emperor Vitiate had mostly been shrouded in mystery, apparent from journals of Jedi historians. He didn't share much of his knowledge with others either.

In-fact, much of the ancient treasures about Sith had been lost by the time of Plagueis, some records have been destroyed by one of the Bannite Sith as well. Plagueis also didn't make much effort in trying to uncover ancient treasures.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Plagueis said that Vitiate wasn't even on Celestial level, mush less the Ones who are essentially evolved Celestials.
First of all, Plagueis labeled The Ones as Celestials; confirmed by author James Luceno himself and also apparent from the revelation itself since The Ones lasted thousands of generations.

Secondly, Plagueis do have much idea about ground realities of Emperor Vitiate. Plagueis thought that Emperor Vitiate lasted 1000 years but in reality the latter Sith lasted over 1300 years and would have continued to exist if Jedi and Sith had not stopped him.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
They also already have a G canon quote saying that they are more powerful than any Jedi have seen before so...
Which is contradicted by BioWare.

So we are dealing with contradiction in this matter or lets say multiple possibilities.

Originally posted by ares834
You mean the non-canon one?
The official databank is non-canon?

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Yoda is not invincible and unstoppable, right?

Whoever said he was? I'm just not so sure what you are laughing about. You act as if this is some big "revelation" that somehoe belittles Yoda. It isn't. We've know that Yoda was almost killed since RotS.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
The official databank is non-canon?

Hmm, I wonder... Could I be talking about the databank or the now non-canon novel... Seriously, lets use a modicum of common sense here.

Originally posted by ares834
Seriously, lets use a modicum of common sense here.



Did you genuinely just make that request of him?

Darth Maul Databank: "The Sith fought with blinding speed and impressive agility, and stabbed Jinn through with his red double-bladed lightsaber"

Originally posted by ares834
Whoever said he was? I'm just not so sure what you are laughing about. You act as if this is some big "revelation" that somehoe belittles Yoda. It isn't. We've know that Yoda was almost killed since RotS.
Oh really?

Put Yoda in a versus thread and he never looses unless the names are Sidious and Luke.

Also, Clone troopers could have killed Yoda.

Originally posted by ares834
Hmm, I wonder... Could I be talking about the databank or the now non-canon novel... Seriously, lets use a modicum of common sense here.
I am not sure what your point is.

I just pointed out that the latest canon revelation about power of The Ones is compatible with the revelation of the same in Star Wars: Darth Plaguies.

Don't lecture me about common sense when you are acting devoid of it yourself.

You mean the entire army stationed on Coruscant?
They would have done the same to Vitiate.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
You mean the entire army stationed on Coruscant?
They would have done the same to Vitiate.
Yoda wasn't on Coruscant, he was on Kashyyyk where a battle between Separatists and Republic clone armies was taking place. Yoda had to flee from there or else would have been targeted for assassination after Order 66.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Also, Clone troopers could have killed Yoda.

Where does it say that? The Clones have space ships and the like as well you know. Not that it matter, throw enough Clones at Yoda and of course he would die.


Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
I am not sure what your point is?

That you are attempting to use a quote from one continuity in some feeble attempt to discredit a being in another.

Not that it matters. The Ones are still "beings more powerful with the Force than any Jedi have seen before" in both continuities.

And narration from the Clone Wars TV series, due to its canon standing, outweighs any statement from the SWTOR Encyclopedia... let alone a mere implication from it.

The Ones > any and all Sith, which includes Vitiate. Deal with it.

Originally posted by ares834
Where does it say that? Not that it matter, throw enough Clones at Yoda and of course he would die.
This wasn't the sentiment back then when Yoda was regularly touted as the most powerful Jedi in history.

Now, suddenly, people have started to see his limits? Give me a break.

Originally posted by ares834
That you are attempting to use a quote from one continuity in some feeble attempt to discredit a being in another.

Not that it matters. The Ones are still "beings more powerful with the Force than any Jedi have seen before" in both continuities.
Two sources have pointed out that The Ones can manipulate the Force in ways unlike any mortal.

The revelation that you are pointing out is older, not that I suggest you don't consider it but it is contradicted by BioWare. Interestingly, Disney is not promoting The Ones as the most powerful Force-users the Jedi have ever seen, in its official databank.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Yoda wasn't on Coruscant, he was on Kashyyyk where a battle between Separatists and Republic clone armies was taking place. Yoda had to flee from there or else would have been targeted for assassination after Order 66.
I thought you were referring to when Palpatine orders the clones to execute Yoda after their battle.
However, the entire forces on Kashyyk could also overcome probably all. There were thousands upon thousands present.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
This wasn't the sentiment back then when Yoda was regularly touted as the most powerful Jedi in history.

Now, suddenly, people have started to see his limits? Give me a break.

What? Just because he is the most powerful Jedi in history doesn't mean he doesn't have limits.


Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Two sources have pointed out The Ones can manipulate the Force in ways unlike any mortal.

The revelation that you are pointing out is older, not that I suggest you don't consider it but it is contradicted by BioWare.

T-canon > C-canon (or N-canon if you prefer ).... So no, Bioware does not overwrite it.

Yeah, check on Wookieepedia.
There were an *insane* amount of clones on Kashyyk.
Without a doubt "thousands upon thousands."

Originally posted by ares834
What? Just because he is the most powerful Jedi in history doesn't mean he doesn't have limits.
I am not interested in your perceptions about this.

Focus on those who always vouch for Yoda in a versus thread.

Originally posted by ares834
T-canon > C-canon (or N-canon if you prefer ).... So no, Bioware does not overwrite it.
If SWTOR gets canonized, I will have the last laugh.

No, I will not dismiss Legends data. Disney management have not disregarded it either.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Yeah, check on Wookieepedia.
There were an *insane* amount of clones on Kashyyk.
Without a doubt "thousands upon thousands."
And the entire army would try to kill Yoda while preoccupied with Separatist forces?

It is not dismissing.
It is rather that T-Canon holds more weight.

I shouldn't have taken you off ignore...

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
If SWTOR gets canonized, I will have the last laugh.

No, I will not dismiss Legends data.

Well, the CW is canon so the Others are the most powerful force users...

Basically, I'm laughing right now.

http://myreactiongifs.com/gifs/nicolascageconfusedemotions.gif

Originally posted by The_Tempest


I shouldn't have taken you off ignore...
That being said, I don't imagine EA will send off its cashcow while it still has the rights to produce SW games. Right now, it looks like the quiet period, where EA is just waiting for approval or rejection, since to my knowledge, they don't speak on TOR's canonicity.

starwars.com still lists TOR as one of their official games.
It seems like it is still in production. Then again, probably due to money.
http://www.starwars.com/games-apps/star-wars-the-old-republic

Yoda being (supposedly) the most powerful Jedi would have never made him untouchable. Theres more to combat than power. Certain individuals, such as in my opinion Orbalisk Bane, have the tools to beat him regardless of his legendary power. Statements like "the most powerful blah" don't give you an automatic win.

I do agree though that the common belief is that Yoda would only ever lose to Sidious and Luke, though. And people write off the possibility of anyone else beating him.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
That being said, I don't imagine EA will send off its cashcow while it still has the rights to produce SW games. Right now, it looks like the quiet period, where EA is just waiting for approval or rejection, since to my knowledge, they don't speak on TOR's canonicity.

Nah, it has nothing to do with whether or not TOR should be canon. It has everything to do with LeGenD (like Neph and Moose) claiming to not be overtly partial to Vitiate, but all three admit to eagerly seeking scenarios and outcomes that will enhance his reputation.

He's lying about being impartial.

I find it hilarious that he is relying on quotes from a new continuity in an attempt to prove Vitiate's supposed superiority. A continuity, mind you, where Vitiate doesn't even exist.

Originally posted by ares834
I find it hilarious that he is relying on quotes from a new continuity in an attempt to prove Vitiate's supposed superiority. A continuity, mind you, where Vitiate doesn't even exist.



It's a good continuity, isn't it?

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Caedus being among the finest is not an issue, the suggestion that he is equal to and/or stronger then Emperor Vitiate is baseless.
regardless, the point that I was making was that it's not far fetched or unreasonable.


Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
He didn't die from it.
Wasn't she toying with him?


Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Visions are always correct. Point is that they represent possibilities and may or may not come true.
That's a contradicting statement in and of itself. Visions cannot always be correct if they may or may not come true.

Regardless this wasn't even a vision of the future. There is no chance of Thanaton fighting his past self outside of his vision because that is not possible.

And as we saw from TCW, visions/dream sequences are not accurate representations of power. Anakin beat Dooku in that vision easier than he did in ROTS, and he's not even at that level yet. Yoda somehow deflected Sidious's lightning at one point, and was tanking a barrage of Sidious's lightning, but in ROTS he got knocked out by a short burst of Sidious's lightning and failed to deflect it.

Visions are not always correct, this wasn't even a vision of the future, this vision had no chance of happening outside of the vision, and visions as unrealistic as these don't display power very well.


Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Once again, Nox would not have casually tanked it or tanked it all without drawing strength from several Force spirits. Try to understand the ground reality instead of portraying Nox like a regular.
You are assuming that nobody below Nox's level could hope to defend against Thanaton's power, however Nox did it casually, so that doesn't demonstrate a limit. Try and understand that this does not demonstrate a limit.


Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Emperor Vitiate had mostly been shrouded in mystery, apparent from journals of Jedi historians. He didn't share much of his knowledge with others either.

In-fact, much of the ancient treasures about Sith had been lost by the time of Plagueis, some records have been destroyed by one of the Bannite Sith as well. Plagueis also didn't make much effort in trying to uncover ancient treasures.

First of all, Plagueis labeled The Ones as Celestials; confirmed by author James Luceno himself and also apparent from the revelation itself since The Ones lasted thousands of generations.

Secondly, Plagueis do have much idea about ground realities of Emperor Vitiate. Plagueis thought that Emperor Vitiate lasted 1000 years but in reality the latter Sith lasted over 1300 years and would have continued to exist if Jedi and Sith had not stopped him.
You are saying Plagueis's musings demonstrate a limit for the Ones, but don't demonstrate a limit for Vitiate because Plagueis doesn't know very much about Vitiate.

I'm pretty sure Plagueis wasn't exactly swimming in celestial knowledge either. Hell most likely even less was known about the Ones and the Celestials then about Vitiate, so don't play a double standard to try and claim Vitiate is on their level.


Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Which is contradicted by BioWare.
TCW constitutes a higher level of canon than Bioware so no, there is no impasse between canon. TCW trumps SWTOR in terms of canon.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
So we are dealing with contradiction in this matter or lets say multiple possibilities.
No. There is a canon hierarchy, and the One's have the accolade of being more powerful than any the Jedi have seen before. This accolade is not contradicted by a higher level of canon, nor is it contradicted by something on the same level of canon.

The Ones of Mortis>Vitiate... deal with it.

@ S_W_LeGenD

While i agree with you on your debates against some people who think even the likes of Tenebrous(lol) or Anakin could kill Vitiate, I have to stop you when you say Vitiate is same level with the ones.

You cannot ignore mountain shattering lightning just because it is not demonstrated in the story.

Also their immunity to lightsaber attacks is not the same thing with the jedi/sith blocking sabers with bare hands. Those Jedi/Sith simply survive the encounter and have a really hard time pulling off the feat where the Son was able to withstand the impact as if he was caressing the saber.

You compare their feats to the Dread Masters' but the DMs were able to do those things through preps, rituals and certain tools of the dark side. The Ones could casually do what they did in Mortis trilogy and Im pretty sure that with prep, they were capable of doing things that no sith/jedi would even be able to think of. (Even Darth Nihilus would shit his pants)

Vitiate's force powers in combat are insane and his force feats with prep are unmatched by any sith/jedi but if he were to face the son or daughter 1on1, he would be destroyed within a short period of time. Even Vitiate prepped vs the son/daughter wouldn't change the result.

They are definitely not same tier. Father>Son=Daughter>Celestials>World Razer>Soa>Vitiate

About Thanaton, it absolutely doesn't make any sense to assume his lightning is superior to Sidious' or even Bane's. Its not even close.

To be perfectly honest here, Carthage's rants makes me respect Vitiate a lot more than Legend's rants do.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
To be perfectly honest here, Carthage's rants makes me respect Vitiate a lot more than Legend's rants do.

Only because your favorite characters best feats all occur on nexuses as well.

Originally posted by carthage
Only because your favorite characters best feats all occur on nexuses as well.

I curse the person who thought you the word nexus.

I curse the fanboys who favor characters that have tons of boosts over characters who are naturally powerful

You're a troll who cannot understand what he reads. Vitiate is possibly the most prodigious sith ever.

hahaahahahaa

You keep on proving that you know nothing about the character.

Originally posted by ares834
Well, the CW is canon so the Others are the most powerful force users...

Basically, I'm laughing right now.

http://myreactiongifs.com/gifs/nicolascageconfusedemotions.gif
Well, according to the legends, Emperor Vitiate is the most powerful Force-user to have ever existed.



Originally posted by Nephthys
Yoda being (supposedly) the most powerful Jedi would have never made him untouchable. Theres more to combat than power. Certain individuals, such as in my opinion Orbalisk Bane, have the tools to beat him regardless of his legendary power. Statements like "the most powerful blah" don't give you an automatic win.

I do agree though that the common belief is that Yoda would only ever lose to Sidious and Luke, though. And people write off the possibility of anyone else beating him.

Lol at anyone being superior to The Ones.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
regardless, the point that I was making was that it's not far fetched or unreasonable.
So you are suggesting that Caedus > Vitiate? Seriously?

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Wasn't she toying with him?
No.

Thanaton was sent to assassinate her and you think that she would toy with him?

Originally posted by Emperordmb
That's a contradicting statement in and of itself. Visions cannot always be correct if they may or may not come true.
Visions are not misleading in the context of accuracy of depiction of actions. Visions do not necessarily represent future events either, they can simply carry a message that a Force-user may understand or not.

Vision experienced by Thanaton represents that he would become a supremely powerful Force-user one day and that he may join Exal Kressh which implies that he may defect the Empire just like Exal Kressh. However, vision then takes a twist and Thanaton notices his future-self utterly destroying his current-self, and Thanaton jolts back to reality. Message was that Thanaton would be destroyed if he joins Exal Kressh.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Regardless this wasn't even a vision of the future. There is no chance of Thanaton fighting his past self outside of his vision because that is not possible.
See above

Originally posted by Emperordmb
And as we saw from TCW, visions/dream sequences are not accurate representations of power. Anakin beat Dooku in that vision easier than he did in ROTS, and he's not even at that level yet. Yoda somehow deflected Sidious's lightning at one point, and was tanking a barrage of Sidious's lightning, but in ROTS he got knocked out by a short burst of Sidious's lightning and failed to deflect it.
Anakin's vision represents that he can become that much powerful one day.

Yoda was being manipulated, not a vision.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Visions are not always correct, this wasn't even a vision of the future, this vision had no chance of happening outside of the vision, and visions as unrealistic as these don't display power very well.
Covered above.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
You are assuming that nobody below Nox's level could hope to defend against Thanaton's power, however Nox did it casually, so that doesn't demonstrate a limit. Try and understand that this does not demonstrate a limit.
You need to understand how powerful Force ghosts are. Palpatine also encountered some and ended up in a bacta-tank to recover. If Palpatine had not been rescued on time, he would have perished.

You cannot fault Thanaton for loosing to Nox after the latter utilized combined might of several Force spirits against him. Its simply too much power to contend with for any mortal.

I do understand your position but you are underestimating Thanaton's power. Keep in mind that Thanaton was also a master of sorcery, he was deadly in the use of the Force. Masters of sorcery are dangerous to contend with because they can unleash powers of such nature against which standard defensive methods do not necessarily work. Look no further then example of Bane versus Zannah to understand my position.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
You are saying Plagueis's musings demonstrate a limit for the Ones, but don't demonstrate a limit for Vitiate because Plagueis doesn't know very much about Vitiate.

I'm pretty sure Plagueis wasn't exactly swimming in celestial knowledge either. Hell most likely even less was known about the Ones and the Celestials then about Vitiate, so don't play a double standard to try and claim Vitiate is on their level.
I am pointing out that Plagueis was not in the position to accurately evaluate Emperor Vitiate in comparison to The Ones. He did note that Sith also have endless possibilities for growth in power, something which he also craved.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
TCW constitutes a higher level of canon than Bioware so no, there is no impasse between canon. TCW trumps SWTOR in terms of canon.


No. There is a canon hierarchy, and the One's have the accolade of being more powerful than any the Jedi have seen before. This accolade is not contradicted by a higher level of canon, nor is it contradicted by something on the same level of canon.

The Ones of Mortis>Vitiate... deal with it.
Covered this part in another thread.

Imagine of the legends canon became its own Universe and cross-overed with the main one. I bet the villain would be Vitiate and Sidious fusing and become Super Sith God 9000 and Anakin will channel the Force and one shot hi,.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Well, according to the legends, Emperor Vitiate is the most powerful Force-user to have ever existed.


If you're referring to the TOR Encyclopedia, he's the most powerful Force-user up to that point in galactic history. You like to point out the encyclopedic nature of that source, but it's written in present tense, as if the events are all currently happening. If it was a true all-encompassing source, it would include the events before and after the game's era, and it would be written in past tense (especially since everything happened a long time ago in a galaxy far far away...).

I do think the TOR Encyclopedia should be the major source for the events of that era, though.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
You would be surprised to learn that there used to be a time when I really liked PT/OT era characters, not just because of them being formidable but because they had flaws and limits.

However, many fan-atics ruined that kind of sentiment in the forums with their delusional beliefs and projections of invincibility of the most prominent characters of PT/OT era. Happened again and again and again and I began to feel pissed.

I tend to balance things out, most of my debates are focused on merits of TOR era characters because they are heavily underestimated and lowballed in discussions. I have seen such absurd arguments that they will even baffle you. One gem is that Anakin would blitz Emperor Vitiate/end battle.

So you cannot fault me for being defensive about capabilities of TOR era characters. In-fact, I don't believe that any TOR era character is invincible including Emperor Vitiate. However, the greatest of the TOR era characters are a match for greatest of the PT/OT/Legacy era characters. A valid and balanced viewpoint.

Even though I think S_W_Legend wanks Vitiate a bit too much, I'm going to have to vouch for him and say that he does in fact balance things out on this forum.

Back when TCW cartoons had a buzz going on and S_W_Legend hadn't posted in a while, people were overrating the PT era characters and lowballing TOR characters.

Legend's bias has little to do with Vitiate, many people rate him (ridiculously) high. It's understandable considering the character's development and hype.

SWL putting the mid-tiers of the SWTOR era above the top tiers of every other era is what's questionable.