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Pictures and so much words, pointless, team 1 wins EASILY

Hmm.

Korr has better feats than Darach, and Satele doesn't have the power or skill to take out Katarn at least not without high difficulty.

If Katarn can kill Darach fast enough (which is probable considering he's better than apprentice Malgus) and Korr can last against Satele, I can see team 1 pulling a victory.

Carthage my niqqa

I aint no Mekhi Phifer

Jaden has no feats that put him anywhere near Satele to make me believe he can hold out against her.

I'm leaning toward Team 1.

Originally posted by realslimshady25
Pictures and so much words, pointless, team 1 wins EASILY

Your attempts of goading me into a angry fit are the "pointless" ones. I'm not easily angered, you'd have a better chance getting a pacifist to fight than get me angry.

Conversely, Darach doesn't have any feats to suggest he can hold out on someone of Katarn's skill level. Katarn at his peak is better than apprentice Malgus in terms of skill. Satele doesn't have a good track record in dueling IMO, she stalemated Baras, defeated a featless Sith lord, and repeatedly got her ass kicked by Malgus. I don't see any evidence for her one shotting and or beating Korr rapidly at least.

This fight intrigues me. Satele vs Kyle should be a good fight, but I'm not sure who would win between Jaden and Kao.

You guys are racist

FatedXtasy, I thought we where friends

Originally posted by realslimshady25
You guys are racist
Not sure how anything anyone said was racist, but okay...

Originally posted by Emperordmb
This fight intrigues me. Satele vs Kyle should be a good fight, but I'm not sure who would win between Jaden and Kao.

Jaden seems much more skilled to me than Kao Cen imo, He has much more experience dueling with Dark Jedi, defeated Alora a master practitioner of the fast variation of Jar'kai, Tavion a master of the fast style and Marka ragnos's swordsmanship which is more impressive than what Kao Cen did imo

EDIT the fact that Wryylock considers him to be dangerous does is pretty kewl imo

Originally posted by Fated Xtasy
He has much more experience dueling with Dark Jedi,

No.

No.

No. Though she did have that hax. Still, she was never that impressive to begin with.

Yes.

Debateable.

I'm not getting what Darach did that is impressive. He beat Vindican which is fine, but he got utterly annihilated by a young and upcoming Malgus. While it can be argued that Darach had no chance against Malgus, Katarn is still more skilled than a young Malgus by a bit. He'd lose to him, and based on what was posted about Korr it's only a 50/50 chance for him in that scenario

Darach has quite a bit of implied proficiency through his title as a battlemaster, and his demonstrated proficiency through being able to expertly wield a saberstaff alongside his own weapon.

Thats a great picture of Satele.

Also she wins.

Based on what? She's lost/done terribly against every fight she's ever had. She couldn't even beat Baras.

Baras is more powerful than Jaden, so why does that matter? And since Baras didn't defeat her, it wouldn't matter even if he wasn't.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
No.

No.

No. Though she did have that hax. Still, she was never that impressive to begin with.

Yes.

Debateable.

You know, im sorry but I am getting really tired of you trying to downplay Jaden's feats. you get your facts then you completely disregard them, you continue to undermine and downplay everything that I say when it comes to Jaden, even after I've pointed out several things that make Jaden much more impressive than Orgus Din Or Quinlan Vos and Saesee Tiin and even Darach, he is a powerful user of TK defeated Tavion with a calm cool head while Kyle didn't while drawing on his anger, his TK surpasses his own master's

He managed to Defeat Rosh and the Kathos twins while on Vjun which had Dark-side energie which Luke considered "oppressive"

He moved an entire ****ing Pillar, Opened a large door with the force, sent a boulder flying, moved three statues twice his size by himself, even in the dark side his immense power of TK was able to send two jedi flying, one made a ****ing hole in the wall the other broke the tip of a large pillar. He was much more experienced than Darach in lightsaber combat, He's taken on various sith during the attack on Korriban and he soled the ****ing Taspir III base and soled various other missions.

Those are all comparable feats to what Satele has done imo. See, she isn't taking him out at least not instantly. If she can't even break Baras's defense and her best dueling feat is defeating a featless Sith lord, then team one has this.

Originally posted by Fated Xtasy
You know, im sorry but I am getting really tired of you trying to downplay Jaden's feats. you get your facts then you completely disregard them, you continue to undermine and downplay everything that I say when it comes to Jaden, even after I've pointed out several things that make Jaden much more impressive than Orgus Din Or Quinlan Vos and Saesee Tiin and even Darach, he is a powerful user of TK defeated Tavion with a calm cool head while Kyle didn't while drawing on his anger, his TK surpasses his own master's

Alora is not a master of anything. Tavion is not stated to be a master of anything. The Disciples of Ragnos are not Dark Jedi. These are facts that are irrefutable.

Rosh is the definition of featless. He isn't even implied to be on Jaden's level early in the story. The fact that he is on a nexus with no knowledge of how to use the Dark Side efficiently is pointless.

It was already broken, the only thing he did is control the fall, while that is impressive Satele's TK is has actually been used in a combat situation.

In the way the door was meant to be open. It takes strength, but nowhere near as much as it does to actually break anything.

That's not impressive.

Also not impressive.

TKing two mooks is not worth mentioning, especially when it's N-canon.


The Disciples of Ragnos aren't even Force-Sensitive let alone Sith. Does it take a lot of endurance to do such things? Yes. Is it the sign of mastery? No. Finally, if you think that a 13 year old who just recently joined the Jedi is more experienced in lightsaber combat than a Jedi Battlemaster, well....that's your opinion.

And none of that is comparable to Satele.

Tbh the featless people Satele has beaten are just as relevant as that featless people Jaden beat.

Satele's force abilities withstanding, she's never beaten anyone of even semi-renown.

She beat your momma and she's world famous.

Even Darth Bandon could beat my mother.

But your momma beats so well. Whenever I go up against her she beats me handily. I guess you could say that I'm beaten regularly by your momma.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
No.
You seem to be very misinformed on that one.

Jaden has far more experience combating other force wielders than Darach does. Darach died in the first lightsaber duel of the war, and Jaden fought several Dark Jedi.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
You seem to be very misinformed on that one.

Jaden has far more experience combating other force wielders than Darach does. Darach died in the first lightsaber duel of the war, and Jaden fought several Dark Jedi.
Most of the Dark Jedi Jaden fought were clones, which he could barely handle.

But as for this instance, I believed we were speaking of Jedi Academy which had a total of three Dark Jedi in it, two featless and the other's biggest feat losing to Kyle.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Alora is not a master of anything. Tavion is not stated to be a master of anything. The Disciples of Ragnos are not Dark Jedi. These are facts that are irrefutable.

Rosh is the definition of featless. He isn't even implied to be on Jaden's level early in the story. The fact that he is on a nexus with no knowledge of how to use the Dark Side efficiently is pointless.

It was already broken, the only thing he did is control the fall, while that is impressive Satele's TK is has actually been used in a combat situation.

In the way the door was meant to be open. It takes strength, but nowhere near as much as it does to actually break anything.

That's not impressive.

Also not impressive.

TKing two mooks is not worth mentioning, especially when it's N-canon.


The Disciples of Ragnos aren't even Force-Sensitive let alone Sith. Does it take a lot of endurance to do such things? Yes. Is it the sign of mastery? No. Finally, if you think that a 13 year old who just recently joined the Jedi is more experienced in lightsaber combat than a Jedi Battlemaster, well....that's your opinion.

And none of that is comparable to Satele.

expect a response sometime tonight. I'm not giving up just yet

Here's your ****ing response Freshestslice lets hope you learn something.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Alora is not a master of anything. Tavion is not stated to be a master of anything. The Disciples of Ragnos are not Dark Jedi. These are facts that are irrefutable.


If Jaden Got better by the time he faced Alora and Tavion don't you think Alora would've gotten better as well? especially considering she's somewhat on Jaden's level? and Tavion would've also gotten better considering its been a few years since she faced Katarn and she's no longer Desann's apprentice.
While the disciples of Ragnos are not Sith they ARE dark Jedi, their ideals are to serve themselves and their goal is to revive a dark lord to lead them that makes them Dark Jedi Here's the wookieepedia discreption of dark jedi

"Despite the fact that both groups called upon the dark side of the Force, Dark Jedi were not the same as the Sith, though the first group of the Dark Jedi were the predecessors of the Dark Lords in the ancient Sith Empire.

The term Dark Jedi was a collective and vague name of dark side practitioners (be they fallen or rogue Jedi) that used Force powers and a lightsaber, but were not always members of a certain organization; whereas the term Sith refers to a definite heritage or ideology. Some Dark Jedi were allied to the Sith or other organizations, while others were loners. Because they were notoriously dangerous, unstable, and treacherous, Dark Jedi seldom formed well-organized groups on their own in order to expand their following or reinforce their strength. One notable exception to this was the Miraluka Dark Jedi Jerec and his retinue of minions. Dark Jedi could also use their power for personal gain, becoming mercenaries or assassins"

and Wookieepedia supports me on this by includeing Tavion and her sect in their Dark Jedi Page which Includes Jerec and Desann.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Rosh is the definition of featless. He isn't even implied to be on Jaden's level early in the story. The fact that he is on a nexus with no knowledge of how to use the Dark Side efficiently is pointless.

Yet he had Two of Tavions Top men amp him and provide him with "supporting fire" with their lighting and drain, not to mention he survived getting his entire arm cut off and used the force to lift three large cylinders, his training under katarn allowed him to duel with Jaden for a while before losing, The definition of featless is not Rosh its Cin Drallig read up on that hun. and while he may still lost he still didn't get killed like a chump like Drallig

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
That's not impressive.
http://collegecandy.files.wordpress.com/2013/09/tumblr_mmwzphdio71s7mgylo1_400.gif

Here's the video starts at 1:37
watch?v=oo9y1PH63I4

How the **** is that not impressive?

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Also not impressive.

Half his ****ing size, not impressive, but it takes strength and focus.


Originally posted by FreshestSlice
TKing two mooks is not worth mentioning, especially when it's N-canon.

and taking on a featless Dark Lord like Vindican is? saying that the choice you made in the TOR game is?I know it's N-canon but it shows how powerful he could become.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
The Disciples of Ragnos aren't even Force-Sensitive let alone Sith. Does it take a lot of endurance to do such things? Yes. Is it the sign of mastery?.

Its a sign of great Versatility on the field of battle, the fact that at such a young he defeated Dark Jedi Cultist, Dark Jedi Knights and Master all whom utilized various lightsaber forms and types, The fact that you down play the cultist is pure bullshit on your part, you and a lot of other idiots tend to forget that they were infused with strong dark side energies from Byss, Vjun, Dagobah, Hoth, Yavin and various other planets, they may not be force sensitives but they are not mooks either. so yeah it does take a certain level of ****ing mastery.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Finally, if you think that a 13 year old who just recently joined the Jedi is more experienced in lightsaber combat than a Jedi Battlemaster, well....that's your opinion.

http://media.giphy.com/media/5J1e3rExCNK8w/giphy.gif

Jaden has done so much ****ing more in his first few months in the academy than ****ing Kao Cen Darach did in years!! He has way more battlefield experience than Darach, he has taken on MANY ****ing opponents, Sand people, Stormtroopers, Mercenaries, Dark Jedi, a Sith Lord who was Nearly unrivaled in his time. what the hell has Kao Cen Darach done to put him above Jaden! Its like saying Cin Drallig is better than Vos just because he's a battlemaster.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Most of the Dark Jedi Jaden fought were clones, which he could barely handle.
http://confessionsofafemalegrenadier.files.wordpress.com/2013/06/disappointed_gordon-ramsay.gif
There is literally nothing that says "He could barely handle" anyone he soled the second half of the Vjun castle and literally devastated the entire ****ing Taspir III base, Taking on powerful Hazard troopers, Dark Jedi Master, Apprentices, Knights, acolytes etc and Alora After he took on the ENTIRE ****ING BASE ALONE!

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
But as for this instance, I believed we were speaking of Jedi Academy which had a total of three Dark Jedi in it, two featless and the other's biggest feat losing to Kyle.
You mean like the featless mook known as Orgus din you put above Jaden Korr? or how about the featless whelp that lost to the HoT during the ****ing prologue? Your bias and love towards the TOR era blinds you Slice and to think I actually kinda respected your opinions before, now I only respect Neph.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Finally, if you think that a 13 year old who just recently joined the Jedi is more experienced in lightsaber combat than a Jedi Battlemaster, well....that's your opinion.

http://media.giphy.com/media/3Iqc656lCuzzG/giphy.gif

Yeah, it is my opinion and unlike your opinion evidence, facts and quotes support mine.

And none of that is comparable to Satele.

http://images.christianpost.com/full/71332/gordon-ramsay.gif

When .The .**** .Did .I . Even bloody imply that it was comparable to what Satale Has ****ing done!

Originally posted by Fated Xtasy
Here's your ****ing response Freshestslice lets hope you learn something.


I probably won't.

She's no longer Desann's apprentice because Desann's dead. :I While she may have gotten better, she was never good to begin with. When you face Alora, Jaden remarks on how she was no match for him before and he's even stronger now. Considering that Alora is below Tavion, who again has never been shown to be powerful on her on, that matters little.


They.
Aren't.
Even.
Force.
Sensitive.

They aren't anything. They are people being powered by the Scepter of Ragnos. Just like the Reborn aren't Dark Jedi, neither are the Disciples of Ragnos. They are people Tavion recruited, along with some Reborn, and amped them. That's it. To call them Dark Jedi or to compare them to Sith is an insult to both.


He is featless in a combat situation. His training didn't allow him to duel with Jaden, you even admit he was being amped by two people, and when he met Jaden alone, he was no match for him. Not that he was a match for him with two people amping him, they themselves never been shown to be powerful. He didn't even fight him. Surviving getting your arm cutoff is not a showing of power, especially when the wound is cauterized.

So no, a bunch of feats of losing and saying that he trained under Kyle makes him just as featless as Drallig.

Because these are things that almost named Jedi can accomplish. You are comparing him to Satele Shan and a well renowned Jedi Battlemaster.


I don't think defeating Vindican is that great of a feat, but theirs a difference between taking on a featless Apprentice and taking on a featless Sith Lord or Jedi Knight/Master. One has gone through all the trials, shown competence, and gained prestige enough to be promoted to a rank that allows them to teach others. The other is a Jedi apprentice. Finally, it doesn't matter how, "powerful he could become," even though I'm sure we've seen Jaden's peak in Riptide, this is about how powerful he is.


Most of the energies are still in the staff and are needed to raise Ragnos. There's no implied mastery anywhere for any of them, Tavion included. That's a trait you gave them.


No it's not. It's like saying that Jaden going through a few untrained people, and a diminished Sith Lord, somehow makes him as competent as a master. Ragnos, having been a spectre for thousands and thousands of years, is nowhere near as powerful as he once was. His strength before is irrelevant.

They cutoff body parts, they stomped him, they damn near killed him. Jaden would have died if not for finding his old lightsaber. It doesn't matter how many enemies he kills in gameplay, Jaden has never been shown to be a Jedi killing machine.

Icrie. Your approval meant so much to me.

Orgus Din was called one of the most battle hardened Jedi of his day. And has comparable TK to most of the accolades you are giving to Jaden in TK. The fact that he was able to become a Force Ghost also shows a certain level of power. Not that he is an exceptional fighter by any means, compared to the big leagues of his day, but Jaden has been shown to be above average at best in the feats you have shown. And to be fair, Orgus' just as featless so I really don't care if he's bellow Jaden or not. We aren't talking about Din here, however, and my opinion from weeks ago does not pertain to now, nor does it pertain to her defeating either of the people in this thread. And losing to the HoT is a sign of weakness in the samevein as losing to Revan made Malak weak. Or Luke losing to Palpatine, or Yoda fleeing from Sidious. Finally, these people aren't weak because they lost to Jaden, the point is the feat isn't as impressive because they don't even have the in universe recognition, let alone the feats to back up that they are powerful.

Not really. Quotes support you as much as they support Darach.

I'm talking to carthage.

I'm going with team 1.

Team 1

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
I probably won't.

That is to be expected.



No shit Sherlock, but Tavion did get better over the years after Desann's death, Katarn only beat her because he was drawing on his anger after she was using Dun Moch on him and it backfired on her. Alora was Jaden equal for a time and before lost, Her lighting sent him flying back before he could even react and when they dueled on Taspir she was pushing him back, not to mention she's the one that snuck into the Yavin temple - literally behind lukes back despite him having powerful senses.



Desann's Reborn were force sensitives empowered by the Valley Of The Jedi and They were later part of Tavions Cult, The Reborn ARE force Sensitives the cultist aren't. Jaden fought both. learn your facts before you spew your ignorance.

Oh and while the Reborn may not have been force sensitives here's something you should take a look even though you'll probably dismiss it. They Are considered Dark Jedi deal with it.


Hethrir had entrusted Desann with training a number of his loyal Empire Youths that were "purified" by a trans-dimensional being called Waru. The Dark Jedi used the Force nexus in the Valley of the Jedi, whose location Desann had tricked Kyle Katarn into revealing, quadrupling their powers with the residue of the ancient Jedi and Sith spirits. Wielding their own lightsabers, and wearing cloaked uniforms, they were a military organization that would support Hethrir's Empire Reborn and posed a serious threat to both the New Republic and Skywalker's newly established Jedi Order."

Unlike the Cultists that lost their powers when the scepter was destroyed, when Desann was defeated The Reborn KEPT their quadrupled powers and as such these Dark Jedi present a much bigger threat to Jaden



You do realize how universally idiotic you sound right now right?
I've never said Rosh was Jaden's equal - far from it, he's not on his level at all, but He dueled Jaden when he was being amped by two of Tavion's Top two men and AFTER Jaden Killed them, while he still may have lost he survived were COUNTLESS did not and that is impressive.



And all of them are great and powerful Jedi masters and/or Sith Lords. or are you gonna bring up Rivi Anu and say something very foolish?



Alora is literally the Dark Jedi version of Jaden, they are made up to be equals until he finally defeats her, Again she was so fast in her use of lightning that Jaden Had barely enough time to react and it sent him flying backwards! Alora is the dark equivalent of Jaden by the time he faces her on Taspir III!



It implies mastery of battle from JADEN!! The fact that He took on COUNTLESS of powerful Reborn and Their artificially infused counter-parts implies great mastery of the lightsaber and Versatility. Though Kao Cen's duel with Vindican is impressive this is a weaker version of Malgus and a featless sith lord and he lost, Jaden has taken on a much more powerful version of Tavion who managed to rally former reborn, the empire, Mercenaries and Cultist to her cause and they followed her! No dark jedi or empire follows someone without fearing them and the fact that she lead her cult without question is a show of her power, Ragnos may have had something to with it, but how many people did you think she had to "Convince" so that they would join her cause?



These ****ing Reborn - which are the main enemies of Jaden for the 2nd and 3rd acts of the games, Are not "untrained" Even Luke regarded as powerful during the Outcast game, The reborn are powerful swordsmen and force users, Utilizing force abilities like Force Rage, Force Lighting and Force Drain along with their Core abilities - The cultist where infused with powerful energies that allowed them to use the deadly and power force lightning, Drain and Choke, they were trained to kill jedi and support Tavion. You honestly think Tavion Would send untrained peons to face Jedi? come on!



You mean like Exar Kun's spirit's strength is "irrelevant?" despite not even being on Ragnos' level in terms of Dark Side mastery?



Wasn't he facing the clone of a ****ing NJO council member! and didn't he get distracted when he lost three of his fingers! he in no way got "stomped" he was distracted and much like how Starkiller dealt with Shaak Ti, Alpha got a lucky shot. He nearly died, but he won in the end



Funny, don't you and Nephthys(sorry Neph) Make the HoT, Emperor's Wrath, Nox, The Barsen'thor and the rest of their Ilk up to be gods because of Gameplay mechanics?



Aw your hurt my feelings fan boy.



because defeating countless amounts of powerful Reborn/Dark Jedi and Artificially infused warriors can't totally be done by this featless shmuck? the same shmuck that supposedly lost against some one he had already beaten? and what has Orgus done to make his TK comparable? take down a few of the cave's supports and the rest just falls down THAT! that is ****ing comparable to moving a Large ****ing pillar, sending a boulder flying, Opening a Large ****ing door! ****ING THAT!



So Morgan Katarn becoming a force ghost shows a certain level of power too? Jaden was praised as one of the most promising Young jedi of the entire academy, Luke himself thought that his defeating Rosh and The Kathos twins was impressive enough for him to be quickly elevated to apprentice and later Jedi Knight. His feats are not "Above average" they are things only powerful jedi could ever reenact, don't bring you TOR mook and compare him to someone whose obviously above him.



Jaden? Featless! LOL okay, yeah sure, why not. Yeah because your opinion from weeks ago isn't relevant at all despite it showing how you quickly disregard anything I say. okay sure/



So the same could be said about Orgus din for losing to some one he had already beaten? or are we going for a double-standard here?



So unless they have recognition...they will never seem impressive. Okay, Yeah, Flawed Logic seems Legit



Don't kid yourself Fan boy, You've yet to make a single argument that puts Darach on the same level as Jaden. Keep trying

Originally posted by Emperor Vos
You know, calling the opposition a fanboy and throwing around laughing smileys probably isn't the best idea when you possess debating ability and objectivity on a similar level to Emperordmb.

Which means that your debating ability and objectivity does not exist.
I seem to remember that being a large part of what you did on SWF.

The majority of your responses were "lol"

And some other things you said quite frequently were "you're MAD bias lol." "I'm the least bias person here." "Everyone else is mad bias." "Let's make a topic where we rate people's bias."

Originally posted by Emperor Vos
You really thought I didn't do it to troll people?
admitting to being a troll shouldn't really help anybody's opinion of you in the slightest.

Originally posted by Emperor Vos
You know, calling the opposition a fanboy and throwing around laughing smileys probably isn't the best idea when you possess debating ability and objectivity on a similar level to Emperordmb.

Which means that your debating ability and objectivity does not exist.

This coming from the guy that calls Emperordmb and Darthant fanboys and can't debate anything without resorting to insults and blind stupidity.

Still you make a good point and unlike you i'll actually apologize to him when he responds, just because he has a different opinion than me doesn't mean I should be a "Jack"Ass like you

Originally posted by Fated Xtasy
This coming from the guy that calls Emperordmb and Darthant fanboys and can't debate anything without resorting to insults and blind stupidity.

Still you make a good point and unlike you i'll actually apologize to him when he responds, just because he has a different opinion than me doesn't mean I should be a "Jack"Ass like you

Originally posted by Fated Xtasy

*snip for length*

No one ever said that Kyle needed to draw on his anger to defeat Tavion. And considering that Kyle didn't need to draw on his anger to defeat an amped Desaan, I'm going to assume you just made that up. Alora has never been shown to be Jaden's equal, her lightning only pushes him back in the N-canon ending, and even then it was a surprise hit. And she snuck into the temple while everyone else was distracted and disturbing the Force at the temple.


No, neither groups were made out of Force Sensitives. Both were being amped by outside means to compete with Jedi. This is why everyone remarks on why there are so many of them.

No they aren't. You have to be Force Sensitive to be a Dark Jedi. Even by Wookiepedia's standard, which seems to be your go to source.

Again, if they weren't Force Sensitive without the Valley, they aren't Dark Jedi. Either way, they would still need to be trained to be on level with a Jedi. Finally, Kyle fought most of these, not Jaden. Considering that at the end of Jedi Academy it's stated the cult lost their powers, most of them weren't Force Sensitive.

That's because the Valley of the Jedi is still there.


That's a game mechanic. Game mechanics are N-canon. You cannot judge how the duel went by what happens in gameplay.

Nope, the point is that it doesn't give him the edge in this fight. Most of them have also done far more with TK then moving statues back into their proper place and moving lose rocks. Jaden's best TK feat is the obelisk.

No they aren't. Jaden said she was no match for him before and even she didn't deny it.


I wonder how many of them were powerful Jedi or Dark Jedi before. None of this is a showing of her power, none of it is a showing of her skill. None of this makes Jaden look any better than he was before. All this shows is that Jaden has endurance .


Most Reborn can't actually duel properly trained Jedi and no, they aren't Jaden's primary enemy. And you're literally just naming powers they used in gameplay, none of which has been called deadly anywhere.


It's been well longer for Ragnos than it has been for Kun. A lot longer.

No. He fought and lost, then he grabbed his ld lightsaber, which just happened to be there, and got a lucky shot.


No. That's definitely not me. I like three characters from TOR, and only one of them is on this list. In fact, I actually like Jaden more than most of the characters from the TOR era. Either way, nobody's been using game mechanics in their arguments except for you. The only feats I've ever named are in cutscene. So has Neph to my knowledge, though it's cool that you took a quick jab at him while debating with me. Please take several seats.

My favorite characters come from the PT. But please, do go on. If anyone's showed fanboyism, it's you, blowing game mechanics way out of proportion and using charged words.


"Countless" First of all, Orgus didn't take down cave supports, I suggest you actually play the game before you comment on what's said in the forum. If you have, play it again. Jaden didn't move a large pillar, he broke an already broken obelisk. And no, going through mooks is not a showing of mastery. Especially when this is again, a showing of gameplay. This is like saying Starkiller is amazing just because he slashes through "countless Dark Jedi" instead of using his actual feats.


Uh, yes, actually.

In a time when Jedi Knights are few and far between, sure. However, it has absolutely nothing to do with power level and more with showing a level of maturity by passing the trials.

Obvious by what? People have actually called the people faced in TOR powerful, the "Dark Jedi" are trusted to be dueled by the average trainee.


I actually called Orgus featless, but continue to go on.


I. Was. Talking. About. Orgus.


Nope, but when nothing shows they are powerful and they have no recognition for being powerful, I'm not going to assume that they are for an internet debate.


You haven't made an argument to but Jaden on the level of anyone but Jaden.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
snip for length

first off I apologize for insulting you and Nephthys
Look its obvious we see Jaden's prowess and skill very differently, I see him as a powerful TK user, an expert duelist and a deadly combatant, you see him otherwise or maybe even the same but with A few differences. The fact of the matter is we put him on very different levels, I think he IS capable of taking on people like Kao Cen Darach, you don't and that's fine, but lets not draw this out, I'm tired of trying to make you see things my way, You have your opinion, I have mine. If you want to take this as me conceding, fine, whatever, Have at if hoss. I'm still a firm believer that Jaden is a much better warrior and combatant than Kao Cen, but that's just my opinion. I'm done dealing with you.

How is that not impressive? That at least classifies Korr on Vos level in terms of telekinesis.


And? Telekentic feats are now not eligible if they are not demonstrated in combat? Total bullshit.
It is still ultimately a display of the user's telekinetic power.

Originally posted by Fated Xtasy
*snip

On second thought, No **** it I'm not backing down, You constantly bring down Jaden and every single attempt I make on truthfully providing people with knowledge of his strength and prowess. I wont let your ignorance keep misleading people about His power.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
No one ever said that Kyle needed to draw on his anger to defeat Tavion. And considering that Kyle didn't need to draw on his anger to defeat an amped Desaan

watch?v=N4g_Of8Fpbk

No one said otherwise either, does this Man not sound angry to you Slice! he was clearly drawing on his anger, this proves it.
And I never did I say that his anger helped him against Desann, that would've been foolish of me, considering Kyle even tries to sway Desann back into the light during their final confrontation. Don't put words in my mouth.



You are correct on the Alora only using her lightning in the N-canon ending, I completely forgot, My apologies. But regardless, even with the disturbing force No one sensed her?, not even the grandmaster of the order? or the other masters?



Go to wookieepedia look up Dark Jedi that says Tavion/Desann's reborn are Dark jedi.

But regardless of that, the Reborn's powers Quadrupled with the Valley of the Jedi and they made up the bulk of the cult and they retained they're power, now imagine if they were infused with the dark side energies of the cultist as well wouldn't that make it all the more impressive that Jaden defeated them?



Look up battle of Vjun jedi knight academy. and TRY to prove me wrong. this is what they say

Luke "So, now we know who is leading this cult; but it doesn't explain why there are some many dark force users"
Kyle says "Some of Desann's left over Reborn were with her, as for the cultist Jaden has a theory"

The giant boulder was stuck in place, the large ass pillar had a weak point but he still had to make it form a bridge other wise it would've fallen. This can transition to a combat situation.



Alora pushed Jaden back during the start of their duel on Taspir, though no one got the edge, she still shows herself to be very aggressive. Though Jaden was the superior of the two she was somewhat on his level she wouldn't have survived their first encounter if she wasn't(I said survive not win)



More endurance than any other ****ing 13yr old youngling has ever shown, more endurance than Kao Cen Darach, Orgus Din, Quinlan Vos. He has more dueling prowess and feats than Saesee Tiin. he accomplished more as a thirteen year old than Darach did in his life time, that's not me bragging that's a fact!



Imma bring in gameplay mechanics and say that The Jedi NPC tend to die quite a lot when facing The New Reborn, though like I said it is gameplay mechanic and randomized they often die if left alone and even when you are fighting along side them they die. but is where's your source of this info? how could they not properly duel a jedi?


True enough I suppose.



some game mechanics are scripted to happen - like Rage, will always be used when the Reborn's health is reaches 75, Drain is usually used when they are below 5o health I believe, though choke and lightning are random.



http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lh7qs2RDRA1qa2iqs.gif

All of the things I said regarding Jaden's TK are a REQUIREMENT you are required to push the large ass boulder flying you are required to push the giant pillar down. You are required to open the large door with the force.


If you say so...



Luke acknowledges his power countless of time, he told Wedge Antilles that one day Jaden would a make a great jedi, Luke says. quote. "Jaden, you did more than we ever could've ever hoped, you have become a true jedi" and at the end of the game he says. "Jaden, you have fought bravely, resisted the dark side, and saved another jedi from certain death. You will be a valuable member of the jedi order" Jaden maturity, skill and power are all what made him a powerful member of the order. don't keep downplaying him



Yet Jaden's power and skill is recognized by Kyle katarn and the grandmaster, Luke skywalker himself and that doesn't make him at all powerful? really?



I honest to god don't understand what your trying to say with this

Originally posted by Fated Xtasy
On second thought, No **** it I'm not backing down, You constantly bring down Jaden and every single attempt I make on truthfully providing people with knowledge of his strength and prowess. I wont let your ignorance keep misleading people about His power.
That is how I feel about Intrepid and Carthage

You dare talk about Carthage that way

Originally posted by realslimshady25
You dare talk about Carthage that way
I can totally tolerate you TBH.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
snip

though i know you probably wont respond i feel the need to mention this, I keep forgetting to mention, that Jaden beat Boba Fett, the same boba fett that nearly killed Kyle.

Originally posted by Fated Xtasy
though i know you probably wont respond i feel the need to mention this, I keep forgetting to mention, that Jaden beat Boba Fett, the same boba fett that nearly killed Kyle.
True enough. I didn't see your response, but if I had, I'd just disagree with you back and forth over the validity of said things. If you're trying convince me that Jaden is impressive, you're wasting your time. I already know he's impressive. The point is, Jaden, as shown, isn't as fleshed out as I would like him to be to compete with the others in this thread. Neither is Kao Cen Doroch. I've dismissed both of these two and have brought it up to if Satele or Kyle could beat the other and then help their teammate, but if you really want me to go through them all again and give my opinion, I could.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
True enough. I didn't see your response, but if I had, I'd just disagree with you back and forth over the validity of said things. If you're trying convince me that Jaden is impressive, you're wasting your time. I already know he's impressive. The point is, Jaden, as shown, isn't as fleshed out as I would like him to be to compete with the others in this thread. Neither is Kao Cen Doroch. I've dismissed both of these two and have brought it up to if Satele or Kyle could beat the other and then help their teammate, but if you really want me to go through them all again and give my opinion, I could.

What I want from you is an answer, Jaden obviously has great - not godly TK feats like Vader or Yoda, He has quotes from the man himself, Luke skywalker who praises him as a warrior, Kyle Katarn calls him the greatest student he's ever trained, he was the most active member in the Ragnos crisis, defeated Boba fett(correct me if I am wrong but didn't Boba nearly kill Jaina?) he's regarded as dangerous by Wrylock. again has done some TK feats and other powers - Like force protection, which is he used during Vjun, the fact that he had to keep focus whilst running cover to cover and fighting off Hazard troopers is impressive. But you have all of that yet you don't think he - at his peak, could take on Kao Cen Darach, obviously there's the fact that he nearly died at the hands of Kam Salusar? clone but he still has a great deal of experience in terms of real combat prowess. I see him as much more fleshed out than Darach, but I really want to get your perspective of this please, I deserve it you made me develop a twitch lol

Originally posted by Fated Xtasy
What I want from you is an answer, Jaden obviously has great - not godly TK feats like Vader or Yoda, He has quotes from the man himself, Luke skywalker who praises him as a warrior, Kyle Katarn calls him the greatest student he's ever trained, he was the most active member in the Ragnos crisis, defeated Boba fett(correct me if I am wrong but didn't Boba nearly kill Jaina?) he's regarded as dangerous by Wrylock. again has done some TK feats and other powers - Like force protection, which is he used during Vjun, the fact that he had to keep focus whilst running cover to cover and fighting off Hazard troopers is impressive. But you have all of that yet you don't think he - at his peak, could take on Kao Cen Darach, obviously there's the fact that he nearly died at the hands of Kam Salusar? clone but he still has a great deal of experience in terms of real combat prowess. I see him as much more fleshed out than Darach, but I really want to get your perspective of this please, I deserve it you made me develop a twitch lol
Based on feats, sure Kam would lose; Kam is featless. But Kam has the usual wanking that every well known Jedi master has, and has shown relative proficiency to most of Jaden's combat feats. Neither have shown Force feats above any other strong Jedi, Jaden just more of them and obviously the obelisk, but I doubt control will come into play in this situation. I can see Jaden beating Kao, I could see Kao beating Jaden, though admittedly Jaden being flashed out more gives him more evidence for said victories. So in the end, I seem them both as irrelevant and want to focus more on if Satele can beat Kyle or Kyle could beat Satele.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Based on feats, sure Kam would lose; Kam is featless. But Kam has the usual wanking that every well known Jedi master has, and has shown relative proficiency to most of Jaden's combat feats. Neither have shown Force feats above any other strong Jedi, Jaden just more of them and obviously the obelisk, but I doubt control will come into play in this situation. I can see Jaden beating Kao, I could see Kao beating Jaden, though admittedly Jaden being flashed out more gives him more evidence for said victories. So in the end, I seem them both as irrelevant and want to focus more on if Satele can beat Kyle or Kyle could beat Satele.

I see but, how can you see Kao Cen winning? i mean his only feats are using the unorthodox Jar'kai, uaing TK to hurl debris(large debris) at Malgus and getting himself beaten by this weaker version of Malgus, I mean Tavion nor Alora are not anywhere near Malgus, but Ragnos(his power comes into question, but his skill with the blade would not have become useless) does come near malgus considering his Hype(though that is just hype) i just don't see Darach as a guy who could hold his own against some one like Quinlan Vos or Jaden both of whom i consider pretty equal. Also i keep forgetting that Jaden also survived a shot from The scepter of Ragnos which has been able to bring down a rooftop and break through walls as seen in the N-canon Dark side ending.

Eh, Jaden unlike walls has Force shields.

I see beating Tavion's dead body as up in the air. Yes Ragnos has his sword, but Tavion's body was wrecked even before he destroyed it. And as Darach was able to hold off Malgus and his master, I don't see why he wouldn't be able to hold off Jaden long enough for the others to finish their duel.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Eh, Jaden unlike walls has Force shields.

I see beating Tavion's dead body as up in the air. Yes Ragnos has his sword, but Tavion's body was wrecked even before he destroyed it. And as Darach was able to hold off Malgus and his master, I don't see why he wouldn't be able to hold off Jaden long enough for the others to finish their duel.

Well actually he was only able to hold off vindican with one saber and had to resort to Jar'Kai against both of them, but when Malgus used his variation of Jar'kai he completely demolished him afterwards, now I don't think Jaden is near Malgus' level, but like I said before this is a weak version of Malgus. and Jaden has trained under the NJO's foremost expert and master of lightsaber combat.

"Hold off" loosely meaning not dying. From someone of even Apprentice Malak's caliber, that's saying a lot. It's more about the weapon proficiency. I also don't think Apprentice Malak is too far below the one seen in Deceived or Hope. I can see Kao holding Jaden off simply because Jaden doesn't fight as aggressively as Malgus and Kao is one of the foremost expert and master of lightsaber combat of his time.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
"Hold off" loosely meaning not dying. From someone of even Apprentice Malak's caliber, that's saying a lot. It's more about the weapon proficiency. I also don't think Apprentice Malak is too far below the one seen in Deceived or Hope. I can see Kao holding Jaden off simply because Jaden doesn't fight as aggressively as Malgus and Kao is one of the foremost expert and master of lightsaber combat of his time.

But Kyle has more feats to back him up, defeating Jerec and his seven Dark Jedi, Desann while he was amped, Tavion, and has some pretty good TK and other force powers. Plus he's second only to the most strongest of NJO masters apparently.

Like I said Kyle is Jaden's master and Jaden as a 13 year old he accomplished quite a lot. Still not fighting as aggressively is not a bad thing and you of all people should know that. we need only look at Dooku for that.