Understanding Ritual of Nathema and Emperor's capability to perform Force Drain

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S_W_LeGenD

S_W_LeGenD

S_W_LeGenD
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
It is important to understand that Emperor Vitiate continuously increased in power throughout his life, even after the ritual of Nathema. How? Because he single-handedly and simultaneously continued to steal life-forces of many individuals to fuel his power:

Servants of the Hand share their Master's longevity, living untouched by age for centuries under his command. Color=Red]In return, the Emperor draws on his servant's strength in the Force and body to feed his ever-increasing power, leaving the servants withered and frail. (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Encyclopedia)
Their was an error in high-lighting part here, and I ran out of editing time, so I am re-posting this statement correctly:

Servants of the Hand share their Master's longevity, living untouched by age for centuries under his command. In return, the Emperor draws on his servant's strength in the Force and body to feed his ever-increasing power, leaving the servants withered and frail. (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Encyclopedia)

ares834
So if I'm reading this correctly, Vitiate can't use giga-drain.

Gotcha.

S_W_LeGenD
Originally posted by ares834
So if I'm reading this correctly, Vitiate can't use giga-drain.

Gotcha.
What is giga-drain?

Emperordmb
Based on my predictions, this is going to be another thread where LeGenD acts as if he's made some monumentous breakthrough that will prove Vitiate is the best, but in reality he will just be shit down and proven wrong.

S_W_LeGenD
Originally posted by Emperordmb
Based on my predictions, this is going to be another thread where LeGenD acts as if he's made some monument pis breakthrough that will prove Vitiate is the best, but in reality he will just be shit down and proven wrong.
This thread have nothing to do with Emperor being best or not, I simply presented ground realities of some of his capabilities and actions. It is true that Emperor is better then most.

Emperordmb
If that was not your intent, then I apologize.

You can see how one could jump to that conclusion when your threads like this have either been you trying to discredit the Ones (the accepted best) and/or you trying to increase the public's view on Vitiate, and calling the view that the Ones to be the best "propaganda."

Again if that is not your intent, then I apologize, but this does call into question whether or not you have ulterior motives with this/these threads.

Selenial
Still not equal to Nihilus.

The Book of Sith proves that much at least.

S_W_LeGenD
Originally posted by Emperordmb
If that was not your intent, then I apologize.

You can see how one could jump to that conclusion when your threads like this have either been you trying to discredit the Ones (the accepted best) and/or you trying to increase the public's view on Vitiate, and calling the view that the Ones to be the best "propaganda."

Again if that is not your intent, then I apologize, but this does call into question whether or not you have ulterior motives with this/these threads.
Based on what you revealed, I find The Ones to be a match for Emperor, better in some aspects as well. But this is not the appropriate thread for this debate.

This thread was intended to address some misconceptions about Emperor's actions and capabilities. I understand that BioWare did a shitty job at explaining some aspects of Emperor's actions and performances. It is their responsibility to provide detailed and comprehensive information about this matter instead of providing hints and details in various statements and leave the matter to the readers to figure out the ground realities by connecting the dots.

It still puzzles me that why Star Wars: The Old Republic: Revan was such a half-hearted piece of work. It is like as if Mr. Drew was not willing to write this novel but was forced to. Utter waste of a golden opportunity. Mr. Drew should release an "updated and expanded" edition of the novel. laughing out loud

S_W_LeGenD
Originally posted by Selenial
Still not equal to Nihilus.

The Book of Sith proves that much at least.
Closer to him though then anybody else.

Emperordmb
It's still my understanding that he drains everything through the ritual.

S_W_LeGenD
Originally posted by Emperordmb
It's still my understanding that he drains everything through the ritual.
Power gathered from ritual? Yes, he tapped in to that power.

Nephthys
Is that you finally conceding that Vitiate used the ritual to drain everything and that he couldn't accomplish that feat on his own power?

Emperordmb
The ritual itself was what consumed the planet. Vitiate consumed everything as a direct result of the ritual. But if you don't believe me LeGenD, believe the quotes you have posted yourself:
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
He executes the Sith Council and consumes the life force of thousands of Sith Lords in a terrifying ritual that extends his life and vastly increases his capacity as a practitioner of the Force.

There they conducted a ritual that extended the Emperor's life at the cost of the lives of more than eight thousand Sith Lords.

performed a ritual of incredible scope to consume the life energy of every being on his homeworld.

When the ritual ended, Lord Vitiate emerged as the only survivor.

But the ritual was not confined to the doomed Sith Lords. They were but the eye of the storm; the center of a vortex that spread across the entire planet. Every man, woman, and child on Nathema died that day. Every beast, bird, and fish; all the insects and plants; every living being touched by the Force was consumed. When the ritual ended, Nathema was no longer a world. It was a husk sucked dry.

S_W_LeGenD
@Emperordmb

I have provided full information, I don't need to focus on specific quotes only. Three statements reveal that Emperor Vitiate performed the act of Force Drain on his own accord, he may have tapped in to the nexus of the dark side created over his homeworld to augment his performance and consume all biota on planetary scale. This is the only valid explanation. More importantly, Emperor got better afterwards so his capability should not be in doubt.

S_W_LeGenD
Originally posted by Nephthys
Is that you finally conceding that Vitiate used the ritual to drain everything and that he couldn't accomplish that feat on his own power?
Check my response right above.

Emperor augmented his performance by tapping in to the nexus of the dark side created over his homeworld. He improved afterwards so case is closed.

Emperordmb
All the evidence suggests Vitiate used the ritual directly to drain Nathema.

DarthAnt66
Interesting.

Nephthys
He doesn't like you anymore.

DarthAnt66
Who?

S_W_LeGenD
Originally posted by Emperordmb
All the evidence suggests Vitiate used the ritual directly to drain Nathema.
Ritual was performed to create the largest nexus of the dark side ever. Once this happened, Emperor turned on his allies to unleash Force Drain on them and tapped in to this nexus of the dark side to augment the performance of his Force Drain. Other Sith Lords were performing the ritual when Emperor turned on them and drained them, ending the ritual. This is what I gather from the collective information.

Try to understand that ritual was performed to create the largest nexus of the dark side ever (revealed in Star Wars: The Old Republic: Encyclopedia), it was not performed to unleash Force Drain. Emperor unleashed Force Drain by tapping in to the nexus to augment his coverage of consumption to planetary scale, he turned on his allies and consumed them instead.

Nephthys
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Who?

Read the end of his second post.

Emperordmb
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
@DarthAnt66
Whether you apologize or quote me 100 times, you are not going to get any response from me from now onwards. And if you bother me too much, I will put you on ignore and this would be really unfortunate since I do not believe at putting someone on ignore. I am sorry, it is over between us.
There was never anything between you and Ant. Ant's heart and genitals always belonged to Neph. <3

DarthAnt66
Oh.

Nephthys
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Ritual was performed to create the largest nexus of the dark side ever.

No it wasn't.

Sinious
lmao @ Vitiate Rocks

You don't really have a life do you?

Emperordmb
The text clearly states that the ritual drained the planet and extended Vitiate's life.

psmith81992
Originally posted by Nephthys
No it wasn't.

Actually yes, it was stated as the largest Dark side Nexus in history, including all future sites.

Selenial
This was a great read, but a little rich legend, you've quoted year old threads in an attempt to discredit people.

Take your own advice.

Nephthys
While Legend didn't directly insult people in every post, his condescending tone as extremely rude and insulting.

Originally posted by psmith81992
Actually yes, it was stated as the largest Dark side Nexus in history, including all future sites.

I meant that creating the nexus wasn't the purpose of the ritual.

S_W_LeGenD
Originally posted by Emperordmb
The text clearly states that the ritual drained the planet and extended Vitiate's life.
Event of Nathema is not described in one text, it is described in multiple texts and each text brings a new detail to light.

If you will exclusively focus on following two texts:

The pain, energy, and suffering of every living entity on the planet fueled his power and would prolong his life for centuries. (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Encyclopedia)

&

Every man, woman, and child on Nathema died that day. Every beast, bird, and fish; all the insects and plants; every living being touched by the Force was consumed. When the ritual ended, Nathema was no longer a world. It was a husk sucked dry. (Darth Nyriss, Star Wars: The Old Republic: Revan)

- You will get the impression that the Force Drain part was somehow ritual's doing. Ritual is not a sentient being, a ritual is simply a method to perform an act or unleash a Force power. Sith Lords were not performing the act to unleash Force Drain on each other, they were performing the ritual to create a powerful nexus of the dark side as apparent from this text:

The ritual lasted ten days. Lord Vitiate orchestrated the sorcery and the planet Mediraas was consumed by the largest dark side nexus the galaxy would ever see. (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Encyclopedia)

Now, if you will factor-in following texts as well:

Lord Vitiate sacrificed millions, stealing their life force to make himself immortal. Their deaths also made him stronger than any Sith who had come before, and he ceased to be known as Lord Vitiate. On that day, the Emperor was truly born. (Darth Nyriss, Star Wars: The Old Republic: Encyclopedia)

&

Calling on the dark side, Lord Vitiate devoured them. He fed on their power, absorbing it into himself, utterly obliterating all traces of his victims. (Darth Nyriss, Star Wars: The Old Republic: Encyclopedia)

&

He executes the Sith Council and consumes the life force of thousands of Sith Lords in a terrifying ritual that extends his life and vastly increases his capacity as a practitioner of the Force. (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Encyclopedia)

- You may realize that Emperor performed the act of Force Drain on his own accord. As the ritual was ongoing, Emperor turned on his allies and betrayed them. He may have tapped in to the nexus of the dark side created over his homeworld to augment his performance with Force Drain.

This is the gist of this matter. I cannot clarify this further.

S_W_LeGenD
Originally posted by Selenial
This was a great read, but a little rich legend, you've quoted year old threads in an attempt to discredit people.

Take your own advice.
You don't understand. OP falsely accused me of insulting others in every post of mine and imposed restriction on me to not partake in the ongoing debate in his thread concerning the matter of Nathema. OP doesn't gets to decide what I should post or not, I was having a debate, not trolling or something. This is the cause of the rift. I don't appreciate those who try to restrict my rights to contribute and partake in a debate as I deem fit. OP singled me out for insults, not warned others as well who had actually insulted me.

B/W My beef is with OP, not you. You stay out of this.

Selenial
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
You don't understand. OP falsely accused me of insulting others in every post of mine and imposed restriction on me to not partake in the ongoing debate in his thread concerning the matter of Nathema. OP doesn't gets to decide what I should post or not, I was having a debate, not trolling or something. This is the cause of the rift. I don't appreciate those who try to restrict my rights to contribute and partake in a debate as I deem fit.

B/W My beef is with OP, not you. You stay out of this.

Fine, I'll stay out of it, but I have to ask.

Do you know what OP means? Seems like you're using it in sort of the wrong context.

Nephthys
Ant just wanted the argument to cease since it was going nowhere and getting heated. He was acting in his rights as the thread-maker in stopping a pointless argument that was clogging up his thread, it wasn't anything personal Legend.

DarthAnt66
Well can anyone else point out besides me that his description of a "ritual" might not be accurate in Star Wars lore?

DarthAnt66
Originally posted by Vitiate Rocks
LOL Ant you rage quitted the chat.
I have better things to do then to here from you of all people that I troll.

Nephthys
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Well can anyone else point out besides me that his description of a "ritual" might not be accurate in Star Wars lore?

Selenial already did and pointed out the source that proves it. Legend ignored her.

DarthAnt66
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Oh.

Unbowed
Originally posted by Selenial
Still not equal to Nihilus.

The Book of Sith proves that much at least.
What do you mean? As far as I know Nihilus is not referenced in the Book of Sith.

Selenial
Originally posted by Unbowed
What do you mean? As far as I know Nihilus is not referenced in the Book of Sith.

It's explained in there that using a ritual amps your powers to levels far higher than they could ever reach without it, that you could do in a ritual what you could never even dream of doing with your own power.

Kalen Sykes
I am honestly shocked that this debate is still going on, but whatever. Ignoring the Nihilus comparisons, here are a few things:


1) The purpose of the ritual was not to create a dark side nexus, but to help Vitiate achieve corporeal immortality, as you have mentioned a number of times.

2) The darkside nexus was created as a result of the ritual. Again, I thought this had been decided, by now.

3) The desolation of the planet was a byproduct of the ritual and not something Vitiate actively did. You can't tap into that much darkside energy and expect some kind of massive fallout.


Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Based on what you revealed, I find The Ones to be a match for Emperor, better in some aspects as well. But this is not the appropriate thread for this debate.

You're right, this isn't the appropriate thread, but since you made the statement, I'm going to answer it. Vitiate is powerful, very powerful. He is easily in the top 3 Sith of all time, but the Ones are in a higher tier than anyone else. That's just how it is.


And btw, regarding your "dismissal" of Ant, I read what he posted and at no point was he insulting, rude, or condescending. He simply asked you to stop pushing the Nathema ritual discussion in that particular thread, because the argument was becoming circular and nothing was being achieved from it. He even pointed out that he accepted the fact you wouldn't change your mind, based on the information we provided, but other posters were complaining to him about it. At no point did he ban you from the thread, insult you, or even dismiss your opinion as irrelevant. In fact, he suggested you continue the discussion in a different thread, something you've suggested if a thread has gone off topic.

Instead, you make a point to publicly criticize him in your thread, something I personally felt was unneeded and unwarranted, culminating in you ignoring him. What you do is your business, but in the past, you've called other posters children, which implies you've been acting like the adult of the debate. Perhaps, on this, you should act like an adult and just let it go?

*Oh, and LeGenD, this isn't an attack on you, just some constructive criticism.*

FreshestSlice
thumb up

Fated Xtasy
LeGend, you continue to push with making Vitiate out to be a highly strong individual which I admire and respect you for doing that and trying very hard to do what you can to make a Vitiate a powerful being, however most of the Forum has already acknowledged Vitiate's power and most place him in the top 5 In their list. I admire your determination and perseverance. However at times you tend to over exaggerate some of the feats and ignore what most users, like Nephthys, Selenial, DarthAnt, freshestslice and many more. You recognize things that only help you in your quest for making Vitiate the strongest sith lord ever and ignore what is canon and makes him look bad, something that should never be ignored in a debate/

And at times, you effectively make Vitiate seem all the more overrated. No offense, but do try open up your mind and not be as - I mean no offense by this, Narrow minded as you tend to be. There are things that make a lot of characters looks bad, most of which include our favorites. There is no shame in admitting/ Acknowledging them. And Do try to refrain from insults, they're not the best way to get your opinion across, trust me I should know. just some friendly advice.

NewGuy01
Originally posted by Emperordmb
You can see how one could jump to that conclusion when your threads like this have either been you trying to discredit Sidious (the accepted best) and/or you trying to increase the public's view on Bane, and calling the view that the PT is the best "propaganda."


confused

S_W_LeGenD
Originally posted by Nephthys
Selenial already did and pointed out the source that proves it. Legend ignored her.
I actually responded, check carefully.

S_W_LeGenD
Originally posted by Kalen Sykes
I am honestly shocked that this debate is still going on, but whatever.
I felt that this debate is important, to address misconceptions and confusion about the subject event. If I am missing something, of-course, I can be notified as well. Purpose of a debate is to reach an understanding on a matter based on available information, if possible. People are interpreting the ground realities of subject event in their own ways due to lack of clear explanation of the event at official capacity. I will try to contact authors of BioWare to provide full picture of the subject event for the readers, if it becomes necessary.

Originally posted by Kalen Sykes
1) The purpose of the ritual was not to create a dark side nexus, but to help Vitiate achieve corporeal immortality, as you have mentioned a number of times.
This is a matter of interpretation.

You may check this:

"He invited them to participate in a ritual to unlock the full potential of the dark side; he promised they would unleash power beyond anything they had ever witnessed or imagined."

"Didn't they suspect a trap?"

"Perhaps." Nyriss shrugged. "Some refused to answer his call. But many more came. After all, what could one man do against a hundred Sith Lords? Remember, he was not the Emperor back then. He was merely Lord Vitiate, ruler of a single planet of no particular importance. He hadn't fought in any battles of note or achieved any great victories or conquests beyond his homeworld. He had the reputation of a scholar, not a warrior. And the Sith Lords were driven by fear. Many thought the Jedi would soon wipe them all out. They were desperate for anything they could use as a weapon against the servants of the light side. Lord Vitiate played upon these fears, convincing those who answered his call to set aside their suspicions of him and of one another to join in a single glorious cause." (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Revan)

As you may notice, the purpose of the ritual was to achieve something that could be used against the Jedi or so the visiting Sith Lords were led to believe. It is no where stated that they performed the ritual to grant Emperor Vitiate corporeal immortality (only), they would like to benefit from it as well. Interestingly, some suspected that this was nonsense or a trap and did not participate, 8000 didn't.

Originally posted by Kalen Sykes
2) The darkside nexus was created as a result of the ritual. Again, I thought this had been decided, by now.
Once again, a matter of interpretation.

The ritual led to creation of the largest nexus of the dark side ever, so it is possible that this was the objective or part of the objective. Keep in mind that Force-users decide what they intend to perform and achieve with a ritual. There is not a single example which suggests that performing a ritual leads to creation of a nexus of the dark side or light side as a byproduct like it happened in the Nathema event. The participants most likely willingly created the largest nexus of the dark side ever during this ritual.

Originally posted by Kalen Sykes
3) The desolation of the planet was a byproduct of the ritual and not something Vitiate actively did. You can't tap into that much darkside energy and expect some kind of massive fallout.
3 statements reveal that Emperor Vitiate performed this deed on his own accord, ignoring them makes your interpretation credible? I don't think so.

No where it has been stated that the participating Sith Lords intended to drain each other to death or that they wanted to fuel the power of Emperor Vitiate (only). If this was the case, telepathic subjugation would not have been performed by Emperor Vitiate initially before pulling the Force Drain card.

If we are to assume that participating Sith Lords willingly allowed Emperor Vitiate to fuel his power by draining them, then should we also assume that they were all willing to die for the greater glory of Emperor Vitiate, really? This is really stupid assumption. Sith Lords are not suicidal and neither 8000 would gather somewhere to commit suicide so that one individual would benefit from it.

Think.

Originally posted by Kalen Sykes
You're right, this isn't the appropriate thread, but since you made the statement, I'm going to answer it. Vitiate is powerful, very powerful. He is easily in the top 3 Sith of all time, but the Ones are in a higher tier than anyone else. That's just how it is.
I am not responding to this, I have opened an appropriate thread for this. Use it.

Originally posted by Kalen Sykes
And btw, regarding your "dismissal" of Ant, I read what he posted and at no point was he insulting, rude, or condescending. He simply asked you to stop pushing the Nathema ritual discussion in that particular thread, because the argument was becoming circular and nothing was being achieved from it. He even pointed out that he accepted the fact you wouldn't change your mind, based on the information we provided, but other posters were complaining to him about it. At no point did he ban you from the thread, insult you, or even dismiss your opinion as irrelevant. In fact, he suggested you continue the discussion in a different thread, something you've suggested if a thread has gone off topic.
That thread involved Sith Emperor, his actions and accomplishments would be expected to be discussed. He didn't like this, some others didn't like either. He should have just pointed out to be me to discuss Nathema event separately so that a meaningful understanding could be achieved from it in another thread. But he singled me out from others for insulting matter (even though some insulted me outright) and restricted my right to have a debate on that thread.

When you announce something, you do not single someone out for ridicule and impose restrictions on him among all in a "debating" forum with exception to trolls. This sends the wrong signal to the singled-out person. You make an announcement impartially like "Alright people, shift the discussion of Nathema to a different thread and reach an understanding on this matter over there. Once that happens, provide me details." When Moderators make an announcement, they do it impartially and for everybody. They do not make a habit of singling people out, unless they are not good Moderators. This is a matter of common sense. Even if his intentions were good, he handled the matter very poorly.

You know? He have been among those members whom I have personally respected. It is not like that I had something personal against him. He made the matter personal in his own thread and I also believe that others are to share the blame for motivating him to target me.

Originally posted by Kalen Sykes
Instead, you make a point to publicly criticize him in your thread, something I personally felt was unneeded and unwarranted, culminating in you ignoring him. What you do is your business, but in the past, you've called other posters children, which implies you've been acting like the adult of the debate. Perhaps, on this, you should act like an adult and just let it go?

*Oh, and LeGenD, this isn't an attack on you, just some constructive criticism.*
Ok, look, I admit that I often get carried away but I still remain sensible or not try to escalate things too much. I know that some have insulted me first many times and I responded in kind. I do not have an habit to start spoiling discussions by insulting others out of nowhere. So instead of pointing fingers at me only, try to understand my position as well.

Emperordmb
LeGenD, a few statements you have posted say that the planet's devastation and Vitiate's immortality was part of the ritual.

DarthAnt66
Once again, it was not personal. I didn't "target" you, it was you against everyone else. Must I remind you that in the past, you have made/supported topics with the *only* purpose to mock my views and humiliate me (Most notably, Canderous Ordo)? erm I won't lie when I say you are taking this matter too far, considering I can read everything you say.

Sinious
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

This is a matter of interpretation.


Not really. Vitiate promised them power to use against the jedi but he cared only for immortality so he deceived them and while the official goal of the ritual was to create a great dark side energy, the real purpose of Vitiate was to consume them and reach immortality.

Emperordmb
I have seen nothing that suggests that Vitiate can wield drain to great extent in combat.

Sinious
Originally posted by Emperordmb
I have seen nothing that suggests that Vitiate can wield drain to great extent in combat.

True. I think he is capable of it but his combat drain probably isn't as strong as his other feats so he doesn't even bother using it. Nihilus' combat drain seems superior to Vitiate's by a margin.

Selenial
Originally posted by Emperordmb
I have seen nothing that suggests that Vitiate can wield drain to great extent in combat.

Again, there's no proof that he can even use it without rituals, given the Book of Sith quote.

DarthAnt66
He uses it against captive Revan. erm

Selenial
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
He uses it against captive Revan. erm

From across the Galaxy.

Ritual, IMO.

Sinious
Originally posted by Selenial
From across the Galaxy.

Ritual, IMO.

While I get your point, I also doubt that he would constantly bother with rituals for 300 years. I think slowly draining a single and defenseless person shouldn't be that hard for Vitiate.

Beniboybling
Just going to leave this here:

Beniboybling
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

@DarthAnt66

Your attitude was shocking in the referred thread, you are among those members that I have personally respected in this forum. You accused me of insulting others in 'every' post during the discussion in the referenced thread which is simply not true, others have explicitly insulted me as well but you didn't warn them. You singled me out in the thread to take away the liberty from me to have a debate in that thread because some members didn't like the points that I raised. My friend, this type of behavior have consequences. Never in my life I have shied away from a debate or ignored any member just because of disagreements, but you have gone a bit too far. I have decided to ignore you at full capacity from no-onwards. What you did is worse then insulting. Whether you apologize or quote me 100 times, you are not going to get any response from me from now onwards. And if you bother me too much, I will put you on ignore and this would be really unfortunate since I do not believe at putting someone on ignore. I am sorry, it is over between us, thanks to actions of some members who motivated you to act against me and your lack of judgment. Let this be a lesson for you, next time you do injustice to someone, think about the consequences of your actions. I can cope with insults but I will not compromise on my rights and dignity.

And if any other member ever tries to repeat the aforementioned mistake, I will have a serious discussion with the entire Administration of KMC about the tendency of fellow members to impose unjustified restrictions on other members in debates in their threads. I understand imposing restrictions on trolling, I understand having rules for topic, but I don't understand imposing restriction on the right to participate in the debate.

...

4. DarthAnt66, don't expect any response from me to you from now onwards.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ISQg6yzWJ2s

Good to see this particular alliance of evil has been broken. stick out tongue

DarthAnt66
You act like people like you here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1XlVFP94o8c&t=2m59s

Sinious
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
You act like people like you here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1XlVFP94o8c&t=1m10s

lmao

S_W_LeGenD
Originally posted by Emperordmb
LeGenD, a few statements you have posted say that the planet's devastation and Vitiate's immortality was part of the ritual.
All of these events are connected with the ritual directly or indirectly, hence the reference. But no single statement covers the entire development properly. This is like pieces of a puzzle that have to be put together to figure out what happened. I blame BioWare for this inadequacy.

I pointed it out that Emperor Vitiate may have tapped in to the nexus of the dark side created on his homeworld to enhance his performance with Force Drain. Keep in mind that he was far more powerful then any Sith Lord in the galaxy even during this time.

Originally posted by Sinious
Not really. Vitiate promised them power to use against the jedi but he cared only for immortality so he deceived them and while the official goal of the ritual was to create a great dark side energy, the real purpose of Vitiate was to consume them and reach immortality.
I am asserting the same thing, my friend.

The Sith Lords did create the largest nexus of the dark side ever during the ritual but Emperor Vitiate used this development to his own advantage and unleashed Force Drain on others to consume then accomplish his agenda. It is possible that he tapped in to the nexus of the dark side to enhance his performance.

Originally posted by Selenial
Again, there's no proof that he can even use it without rituals, given the Book of Sith quote.
Excuse me?

Book of Sith: Secrets of the Dark Side asserts nothing about Emperor Vitiate's proficiency in Force Drain.

Also, Emperor Vitiate continued to steal life-forces of many individuals after the event of Nathema and this is why he continued to grow in power throughout his span of existence. While performing this act, Emperor Vitiate performed many other actions so he does not needs to perform a ritual to drain others.

Selenial
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD Excuse me?

Book of Sith: Secrets of the Dark Side asserts nothing about Emperor Vitiate's proficiency in Force Drain.

Also, Emperor Vitiate continued to steal life-forces of many individuals after the event of Nathema and this is why he continued to grow in power throughout his span of existence. While performing this act, Emperor Vitiate performed many other actions so he does not needs to perform a ritual to drain others.

No, it says you can do things You'd never normally be able to do with rituals, so that's applicable.

It doesn't matter, it could be a ritual given how many he did (Yes, it's stated his dark RitualS created Dark Storms on Dromund Kaas. But yeh, could easily be a ritual. It doesn't specifically state that making people Immortal was a ritual but we know it was.

Selenial
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
You act like people like you here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1XlVFP94o8c&t=2m59s

I think someone's a little jealous that in a Recent Sock thread everybody put Beni well above you in terms of debating.

DarthAnt66
Originally posted by Selenial
I think someone's a little jealous that in a Recent Sock thread everybody put Beni well above you in terms of debating.
I didn't even see this, lol. Link? laughing out loud
And does it look like I give a damn who you and Sasukedc vote for?

S_W_LeGenD
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Just going to leave this here:
1. Nobody claimed that Emperor Vitiate acquired combined might of 8000 Sith Lords from the ritual he orchestrated on Nathema. I am not sure why you even needed to assert this.

2. Nothing can obliterate Revan with mere sight other then direct contact with most lethal of energies in the galaxy.

3. Sith Lords formulated the largest nexus of the dark side in history from the ritual but this nexus eventually dispersed from the planet after the ritual ended.

4. Darth Bane's limitations do no apply to Emperor Vitiate. Yes, it is possible that Emperor Vitiate used the nexus of the dark side created over his homeworld from the ritual to enhance his performance with Force Drain.

5. Emperor Vitiate achieved corporeal immortality from the act of consumption of all biota in his homeworld, this was permanent increase in his power and capability to use the Force. Also, no one have achieved corporeal immortality from performing Force Drain related acts so Emperor Vitiate's accomplishment is very impressive or unparalleled in its own way.

6. Ritual performed was not Force Drain on planetary scale, it produced the largest nexus of the dark side in history. However, Emperor utilized this nexus to consume all biota of the planet after betraying his allies.

7. Emperor Vitiate's most ambitious ritual was far greater in scope in comparison to what he orchestrated on Nathema. This particular ritual was intended to consume entire galaxy. You cannot even compare these two events. Fact is that Emperor Vitiate continued to grow in power throughout his span of existence and he eventually reached a point when he could pull off Nathema on his own. However, his most ambitious ritual was of much greater scope so sacrifice of lives were needed once again to fuel a ritual of such a scope.

S_W_LeGenD
Originally posted by Selenial
No, it says you can do things You'd never normally be able to do with rituals, so that's applicable.

It doesn't matter, it could be a ritual given how many he did (Yes, it's stated his dark RitualS created Dark Storms on Dromund Kaas. But yeh, could easily be a ritual. It doesn't specifically state that making people Immortal was a ritual but we know it was.
As per your logic, every action Emperor Vitiate performs is a ritual, right?

Corrupting the environment of Dromund Kaas is a major development, this planet dwarves Mortis, Katarr and many other planets in size. It is much larger then Earth as well, if you consider real life comparisons.

Stealing life-forces of others is not the same thing as altering the environment of an entire (gigantic) planet. Once again, Emperor Vitiate surpassed every Sith Lord, who have co-existed with him and before, in power so his capability to manipulate the Force in superior ways should not be in doubt.

Sinious
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD


I am asserting the same thing, my friend.

The Sith Lords did create the largest nexus of the dark side ever during the ritual but Emperor Vitiate used this development to his own advantage and unleashed Force Drain on others to consume then accomplish his agenda. It is possible that he tapped in to the nexus of the dark side to enhance his performance.



Well, f he hadn't needed the sith lords, he would do it all the time to multiply his powers. Instead he choose to drain his servants. Doesn't this prove that without the presence of so many sith lords, he can't pull of that kind of a drain? Also the key point here is that he needed prep for this so its kinda useless in combat which is what matters in this thread.

S_W_LeGenD
Originally posted by Sinious
Well, f he hadn't needed the sith lords, he would do it all the time to multiply his powers. Instead he choose to drain his servants. Doesn't this prove that without the presence of so many sith lords, he can't pull of that kind of a drain? Also the key point here is that he needed prep for this so its kinda useless in combat which is what matters in this thread.
It is possible that he could not consume others on planetary scale without tapping in to the nexus of the dark side created over his homeworld from the ritual being performed. The other Sith Lords served as his food supply to achieved immortality, sounds like sorcery was involved to accomplish immortality.

As far as combat is concerned, I am not sure why Emperor Vitiate did not make extensive use of Force Drain talents in such events but he continued to steal life-forces of many individuals after the Nathema event to continue to grow in power. He was dangerous with Force Drain since he converted some of his servants to immortal beings so he could drain them non-stop without killing them. Even with immortality, those servants felt weak and their capability to use the Force also diminished.

Sinious
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD


As far as combat is concerned, I am not sure why Emperor Vitiate did not make extensive use of Force Drain talents in such events but he continued to steal life-forces of many individuals after the Nathema event to continue to grow in power. He was dangerous with Force Drain since he converted some of his servants to immortal beings so he could drain them non-stop without killing them. Even with immortality, those servants felt weak and their capability to use the Force also diminished.

Yes but again, these are sorcery-prep based drains and it doesn't prove that he had a powerful combat drain skill. It definitely doesn't prove that his combat drain is as strong as Nihilus.

Selenial
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
I didn't even see this, lol. Link? laughing out loud
And does it look like I give a damn who you and Sasukedc vote for?

It got deleted, but it wasn't even polls, seeing as Beni wasn't on the list.

It was people actually saying in a thread "I'd vote for Neph, but Beni's certainly better than the rest"

When you were on the list.

sad

DarthAnt66
Oh, lmfao. The only voters for him were you and Sasukedc though. laughing out loud

Emperordmb
LeGenD, there are a few statements saying the devastation of Nathema was a direct result of the ritual. You choose to deny this with quotes saying Vitiate drained everyone. Well I have news for you, the two are not mutually exclusive. Just because Vitiate drained everything does not mean he didn't accomplish this directly through the ritual. You are trying to disprove something already established through quotes, with other quotes that are not mutually exclusive. This is not proper evidence to contradict canon quotes, and your theory thus falls flat.

Emperordmb
The only times Vitiate has ever drained are through rituals, or people he has bonded/linked to for lack of a better word.

Freedon Nadd
A ritual is executed through the use of (Sith) magic.
Definition of magic
magic/ˈmadʒɪk/
noun
the power of apparently influencing events by using mysterious or supernatural forces

Geistalt
So, in other words, he did perform the ritual on Ziost all on his own; he just couldn't do it to the galaxy.

btw, why Ziost instead of Dromund Kaas?

S_W_LeGenD
Originally posted by Geistalt
So, in other words, he did perform the ritual on Ziost all on his own; he just couldn't do it to the galaxy.

btw, why Ziost instead of Dromund Kaas?
This discussion is about Nathema.

Vitiate smoked Ziost with his dark powers - not through a ritual.

Dromund Kaas was the seat of power of the ancient Sith Empire and its destruction would have facilitated efforts of the Republic.

Consuming the galaxy was a gargantuan objective but Vitiate's effort towards this end was thwarted by his enemies (see Chapter 3 of Jedi Knight story arc). A Sith Lord experienced a vision of Vitiate succeeding in this endeavor and scenery was truly terrifying.

Geistalt
The ritual is performed through a fvck-ton of death.

As seen through Belsavis' hyperspace explosion weapon. And Voss' planet-wide plague.

In the case of Ziost, this was initialized through Force Insanity.

AncientPower
Nothing implies that Ziost was a ritual besides the wishful misinterpretations of that cvnt Az, and given that Vitiate was a disembodied entity, he's physically incapable of performing one in the first place. erm

Freedon Nadd
Let's say the Byss drain was also a ritual.

NewGuy01
Yeah, how the **** would Vitiate even go about conducting a large-scale ritual? All he has is an entire planetary population of possessed slaves.

Freedon Nadd
Neh. It was stated that he needed only deaths to blast Ziost. However, Nathema and Ziost aren't comparable. The Force was never stripped away from Ziost, only on Medriaas.

AncientPower
Originally posted by NewGuy01
Yeah, how the **** would Vitiate even go about conducting a large-scale ritual? All he has is an entire planetary population of possessed slaves.

You do realise that they used a mass stunning weapon to knock out all of his hosts, prior to Ziost being death wave'd?

The Ellimist
Originally posted by DarthAnt66

Once again, it was not personal. I didn't "target" you, it was you against everyone else. Must I remind you that in the past, you have made/supported topics with the *only* purpose to mock my views and humiliate me (Most notably, Canderous Ordo)? erm I won't lie when I say you are taking this matter too far, considering I can read everything you say.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
I didn't even see this, lol. Link? laughing out loud
And does it look like I give a damn who you and Sasukedc vote for?

holy sh*t this is so cringe lmao

DarthAnt66
By far the most cringe part is finding, quoting, and mocking a post when I was 13.

laughing out loud

Azronger
Bane can do this without rituals. Bane lives, Failkorion dies.

The Ellimist

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