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digi vs leo!!!1!

he-man vs godzilla, generic city setting, no prep, standard gear, composite characters.

____________________________________

so, he-man vs godzilla, eh? L. O. f'n L. let's have some fun.....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zhJljblPcY

first thing that needs to be made clear as crystal? THIS IS A COMPOSITE VERSION OF GODZILLA. that is extremely important. there is a whole godzilla continuity clusterfek, but none of that matters for this battle. i'll be using feats interchangeably from all movies, periods, and comics so whether it's showa, heisei, millennium or even the legendary series, it is ALL godzilla, and so available for this battle. in this bz, i'll be using comic scans as well as video clips to support positions, so that should be fun. now then, let's have at it shall we?

location: city
prep time: zero

ok, let's start with a couple facts to establish what he-man is dealing with here. first off, i'm hoping everyone knows godzilla is not just some 'giant lizard'. lol he's a little more than that. but he IS, indeed, giant. just how large IS godzilla? really, REALLY large.... here's the tale-of-the-tape from the official legendary website:

http://legendary.tumblr.com/post/85942673421/godzilla-facts

http://www.themoviebit.com/2014/04/godzilla-ultimate-trivia.html



355ft tall

90 000 tons

there MIGHT be one building in the city i live in (windsor, ON, pop. 220 000) that is that tall. that is more than 35 stories. that is hard to imagine tbh, so here are a couple of scans that help make the comparison:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/size.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/size2.jpg.html

note the cars stuck between his toes. lol and please, bear in mind--THAT godzilla is NOT as large as the legendary godzilla (MY godzilla), which is the biggest godzilla ever.

so, yeah, he's really big.

with that established, let's get to the battle.

battle:

well, first thing godzilla will do is look around to see if he can see he-man. if so, he targets he-man specifically with his breath first (see below). if not, godzilla is in a city, so, godzilla does what he always does in this type of situation--he destroys everything in sight. literally. lol i think everyone can picture godzilla's atomic breath in their minds, but, i do NOT think most are fully acquainted with the full scope of its power. i'm going to show a number of scans and scenes that will.... educate everyone. heh

first, the sheer breadth of the blast itself:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/blast.jpg.html

it nearly engulfs KING GHIDORA. for those who don't know, ghidora is likely godzilla's most powerful 'regular' sparring partner. here is a chart that shows just how big king ghidora really is:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/sizechart.jpg.html

so.........yeah, good luck parrying or absorbing THAT! ha!

but just how POWERFUL can said blast be....?

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/breathisnuke.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/breathisnuke2.jpg.html

and that's just his REGULAR breath. later in the series, godzilla became MORE powerful through a series of different events. that's why he continued to get larger and larger. eventually, one power up too many, and his body was unable to contain his energies any longer and he melted down, passing along his power to godzilla junior. that's a whole other thing though. what's important to know? godzilla's atomic breath is beastly.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X7erLu1YfJg

also, not a bad durability feat. lol and:

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xf6iva_godzilla-s-red-atomic-breath_shortfilms

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H0qhL13rpIY

yep, this ain't your daddy's godzilla! RED SPIRAL BREATH=BAD A$$!!! his breath weapon ALSO has some uber kinetic abilities:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCUTNT0wMH8#action=share

bear in mind the SIZE of the monsters (same size as godzilla) his breath (normal old BLUE breath) is pushing--not to mention the skyscraper! seriously--LO f'n L. if you don't love godzilla, you're not human. anyway, have fun making a case for parrying THAT!

so, using his breath, godzilla utterly vaporizes the city we're in. there is no possible way for he-man to dodge or avoid being buried, crushed, obliterated, vaporized or what have you. that's also leaving out the RADIOACTIVE nature of the breath itself, and the fallout from the breath. to my knowledge, he-man has no special immunity to massive doses of radiation..... after nuke-breathing everyone and everything in and out of sight, godzilla proceeds to stomp with his feet and tail amid the rubble, fire and explosions. just how strong IS godzilla?

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/strength.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/strength-1.jpg.html

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1YX9McPBpI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQxK4ffn2G0

godzilla is not just "strong because he is so big". godzilla is LUDICROUSLY strong AND big. so, while he-man is strong--i've no doubt digi will show that he-man may even be STRONGER, godzilla is easily lifting and tossing monsters in the 200 000 ton range. and here, a more...pragmatic comparison where this far weaker version of godzilla stalemates THOR in a test of strength:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/strength1.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/strength2.jpg.html

hell, even SHRUNK he was a match for ben grim and the ff, able to break sue's ff at a fraction of his normal power:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/vsff1.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/vsff2.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/vsff3.jpg.html

so, you can see, at ANY size godzilla is a force to be reckoned with.

lastly for this opening, i also think it is vital to point out the fact that just being in the AREA of godzilla can prove fatal as he is HIGHLY radioactive and constantly gives off radiation:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/radioactive.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/radioactive.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/radioactive2.jpg.html

note in the first scan the climber is dressed in protective gear to keep him safe from the radiation godzilla gives off. it didn't help, and he dies of cancer later on.... after the second set of scans, the spilling of godzilla's blood was declared an ENVIRONMENTAL DISASTER. (note--the marvel version was NOT radioactive, he breathed regular old fire. disgusting, i know....) so, should he-man successfully attempt to cut godzilla (NOT something i'm willing to just take as a given, of course, but should it prove possible), the blood itself could be a HUGE issue with which he must contend, not to mention just getting close enough to actually battle godzilla through the radiation he gives off. digi will have other matters with which to contend (as he perhaps targets godzilla's eyes somehow....), should he somehow survive my opening salvo, but i'll save those for subsequent posts. in the next posts, i'll also show why instead of KING OF THE MONSTERS, godzilla should really be called KING OF SUPER HARD TO KILLNESS!! just kinda rolls off the tongue, don't it.....


to recap:

using his vast strength and nuke-like breath, godzilla unleashes total and utter hell on the city and on he-man, wherever he is. his sword and vest won't be enough to keep him from being buried and crushed by toppled skyscrapers and thousands of tons of debris, random, massive explosions and my own breath and feet and tail.

THIS IS AN ISSUE OF SCALE. THERE IS SIMPLY TOO MUCH LARGE SCALE SH!T HAPPENING FOR HE-MAN TO EFFECTIVELY COUNTER.

the smoke and toxic flames alone would be hard for him to overcome on the ground (he-man DOES need to breathe after all...), and he wouldn't be able to see anything through the maelstrom of collapsing streets and skyscrapers. the ground would be erupting and shattering all around him and he would be battered and smashed by shockwave after shockwave until there wasn't anything left. in the next posts, i'll show that he-man's strength is NOT his durability.... (heh, see what i did there....?) on top of that, there is also godzilla's naturally emitted radiation for him to deal with as i don't think he has any special immunity to radiation. the radiation would serve to weaken him and make him sick the longer he was in godzilla's immediate area.

and THAT, ladies and gentlemen, is how you open a match.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GMxrXMjPMcc

all righty, so i'll take the first swing.

methinks someone MAY have underestimated the king of monsters just a little bit.....heh let's review digi's opening.

1. open a crevice

2. pound the ground

3. throw various objects at godzilla including.....buildings?

well, THAT approach was a bad idea for a number of reasons, and digi is gonna need to work really REALLY hard, and do some back-tracking, to recover i'm thinking...

recall the first thing i said godzilla did: he LOOKS for he-man. i figured digi might try and go with a little stealth, use he-man's speed to avoid immediate detection. but.....he did the EXACT opposite!! in fact, he painted a great big bullseye on he-man! it's going to be hard to ignore a crevice opening in the road way and a heavily muscled man pounding the ground to create shockwaves.

of course, the crevice isn't even as wide as the vehicle beside it. it isn't even wide enough for godzilla to stub his toe on. and the shockwaves? well, causing a cave-in is a far cry from bringing down a 40-story skyscraper.... the shockwaves would likely just be enough to give godzilla an even more obvious target, if he noticed them at all.

looking again at the scene where he suggested he could lift part of the city. that...didn't look easy to me. he was going to be putting in a LOT of effort to pull that off--if he could have done so, which we don't know.... regardless. as soon as he opens the crevice and starts to punch the ground, big g knows where he is and UNLOADS on him, tracking the breath along the ground, destroying everything in its path. including he-man. as for how fast the breath can travel? you saw this, but take a look at how quickly it makes contact with the meteor which is still a good distance from the earth:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SR02VjC8aLQ#action=share

here is a fun little medley of godzilla breath attacks. you'll see some red and blue attacks in there and you can see how he can sustain it for prolonged lengths of time and the sheer destruction it leaves in its wake:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIOHfGhpXq4

all of the noise he-man makes ENSURES digi gets what he wants-- CHAOS. though why he'd want it is beyond me.... it seems he and i BOTH want the same thing, so... lol

how he-man plans to survive the barrage HE called down, is a mystery. as i said earlier, he has no way of avoiding the debris field, and amid the chaos he wanted so badly, i don't understand at all how he could even SEE, let alone dodge or parry. black smoke, toxic gases, explosions, fire, not to mention ATOMIC BREATH and radiation? how he plans on parrying or absorbing with buildings falling on his head.....? shrug

once i've nuked a huge area of the city around where he tried to open the crevice, i can start some pounding of my own. it's doubtful he-man could survive the initial breath weapon, let alone ensuing destruction. if he somehow did, it would CERTAINLY take him time to climb out of the rubble, and more time to find me, buried amid smoke and fire like he would be. in the meantime, i just forcefully stomp with all 90 000 tons of myself all over the area.

he-man pancake.

i mentioned earlier that durability is NOT he-man's forte. proven by the fact that digi felt the need to break out a very old piece of equipment, namely his vest. i have several examples to show this fact. this is NOT an effort to lowball. digi himself, the most knowledgeable guy in the forum with regards to he-man, knows it himself--in every incarnation of he-man, his durability is ALWAYS questionable at best. proof:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/kod1.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/kod2.jpg.html

^in that instance, he was ko'd for most of an issue.

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/weakened.jpg.html

^here, a simple blast ko'd him after a brief encounter with a lowly rock monster weakened him.

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/m_clouds06.jpg.html

ko'd by a simple fall.

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/m_vengeance07.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/m_vengeance08.jpg.html

^again, note how SMALL the blast weapon is that ko'd he-man. those are the types of beam weapons he typically battles and seeks to avoid or parry.

he also doesn't seem to like heat in the form of fire or lava:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/lava.jpg.html

i have other scans to show as necessary, but the undeniable fact is he-man has questionable durability at best. the combo of breath weapon/building collapse/stompage would very much exceed the limits of his dubious durability. and again, it bears repeating--smoke, fire, gases, explosions--all of these things would be constantly hampering him. he DOES need to breathe, he has no super senses. he would be blind and choking, unable to see beyond the chaos he was hoping to create. careful what you wish for.... heh it might look something like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTFx-KYsZUY

now, something that is NOT a question--godzilla's durability! big g can take a beating! lol some simple examples vs blunt force first:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/durable1.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/durable2.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/durable13.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/durable14.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/durable15.jpg.html

those last couple are ridiculous. he was so high the buildings looked small when he was dropped THEN ghidora (recall, about 200 000 tons!) LANDED ON HIM and he was STILL up! (rodan stepped in to lend a brief hand and give the big guy a breather, but godzilla was still standing!)

here he is against energy:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/durable3.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/durable4.jpg.html

notice the narration above--new city was DESTROYED by that combo blast.....

against a NUKE:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/nuke1.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/nuke2.jpg.html

here he is vs the absolute zero canon:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpRNnsmEWZA

and lastly a couple scans showing just how durable his scales are:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/diamondscales.jpg.html

^armor piercing shells useless against scales as hard as DIAMOND. and another:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/hide1.jpg.html

"the pinnacle of anti-monster weaponry. they'll shoot a hole through half a mile of granite if you want them to. that being said, it SHOULD work on godzilla. i mean, his armor is like NOTHING ELSE ON THIS WORLD. it should hurt him at the very least...."

lol A HALF MILE OF GRANITE and they don't know if it will do more than HURT him, make him change direction.... great stuff....

so, as you can see, hurting godzilla is NO easy task. and, i have more. much more, though for the moment that should suffice to make clear how tough this is going to be for he-man.

as for grabbing my tail and 'chucking me'? you'll need a LOT more than that scan of him grabbing that little snake to prove that. and if he does try and go with that idea ......

as far as stopping my foot in mid-air? well, there is the famous scan of herc doing that and tipping godzilla over, (herc ROCKS!) but..... for one thing, that godzilla was smaller and it did absolutely no damage at all. for another, herc wasn't half choked, blinded, and fighting to survive an atomic breath while buildings fell down on him either.... so, can't see how that could possibly be an option given that he-man is atomically fried and buried under 1000s of tons of rubble..... in essence, digi has done everything i could POSSIBLY have hoped for in this match to make things easy for me to completely wipe him out.

recap

he-man tries to cause 'chaos' by opening a crevice and shockwaving. unfortunately for him, he succeeds, and announces his location more clearly than i could ever have hoped. i unload a breath weapon his way that devastates everything along the path to striking he-man. it's far too large in breadth (see first post) for him to parry or absorb the whole thing, and as he is being struck, buildings are toppling all around him and fire and smoke are suffocating him. he would be fried then buried. even if he somehow managed to absorb or parry some of it, the chaos around him would prove too much for his suspect durability, DESPITE his force field. followed by some ground stomping of my own, he-man is quickly overwhelmed and like that, it's over.

digi made a very bad tactical error--he NEVER should have drawn attention to himself. he gave up the only tiny advantage he may have had in regards to stealth. as it stands, i know EXACTLY where he is and can destroy enormous amounts of area too quickly for him to escape at all. there is also the issue of radioactivity for him to contend with. like all of godzilla's foes, he-man too, falls....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLyiHHEHylw

Digi Post #1

Alright, cool; we're off and running. But it's time I ramped it up quite a bit.

Opening Parries

Ironically, yes, we employed much the same strategy at the outset. The city will be utterly destroyed after we're done with it. That said, Leo's making a gross underestimation of what I'm doing.

First, Godzilla will be lucky not to be swallowed by the fissure I create.

Two, the earthquake will be nebulous enough that pinpointing me won't be easy. Godzilla is used to fighting gigantic monsters, not men.

Three, I threw a city block at him. Yes, I suppose it announces my presence to Godzilla (though I can jump away in an instant if needed). But, as a trade-off, I threw a city block at him. Buildings, cars, roads, skyscrapers, etc. Hurtling toward him. This isn't static buildings for Godzilla to topple. These are being hurled towards him by a being with at least High Herald level strength (he's low herald for other reasons, but strength isn't one of them). As we'll see over the course of this fight, throwing a city block is nothing to He-Man. Here his is throwing Castle Greyskull - a massive structure - much further than I need for the purposes of this fight:
http://youtu.be/a2-wzGYBXvk?t=2m27s

So if Leo thinks that's advantage him, ok, sure, he can think that. But while Godzilla is performing the master plan of "looking for me," he'll be dealing with entire buildings coming at his face.

Roll For Initiative

Let me highlight something quickly:
Originally posted by leonidas
he gave up the only tiny advantage he may have had in regards to stealth.

These matches being what they are, of course leo will refute my attack initiative. However, this is about as close as you'll find to him admitting an advantage to me.

Speed is a huge advantage here. Massive. Why? Because Godzilla, in nearly every fight ever, stands around and tanks everything. It's excellent for his durability feats (we'll get to that later), but abysmal for his speed. He-Man can leap miles away. What's stopping him from seeing a radioactive breath attack coming and just getting out of the way? Even the biggest AoE scans Leo's posted are not so wide that they'd pose much threat to me.

Then I'm back in hiding. Unless you think Godzilla OHKs Prince Adam in the opening moments of the fight, every attack sequence will be dictated by me.

I'm also fast as hell, but more on that shortly.

Defense Wins Championships

Godzilla's atomic breath attack isn't going to kill He-Man. Point blank, it's not. And that's if he hits me with it. It's a great attack, granted. But it's really the only offense he has. But let's look at some evidence:

First, He-Man is more durable than people give him credit for. Leo's attempting to lowball Adam's durability above. I'll be doing some of the same for Godzilla later on. It's a game we both can play, but we all know every character has bad showings. But there is an excellent counter-argument for me. Or rather, counter arguments, plural.

He was at ground zero of this explosion:
http://i.imgur.com/CFXXCrz.jpg
That took out THIS gargantuan fortress:
http://i.imgur.com/njENZ1l.jpg
And here was the page immediately after it:
http://i.imgur.com/CiTAjtt.jpg

And that was all after battling Skeletor and others, and having Skeletor cheap shot him when he was briefly in chains. Point is, dude can do more than dish it out.

Now let's add the power vest, which adds a formidable force field. It can protect against energies:
http://i.imgur.com/J1rF1YT.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/5qchYEf.jpg
Or physical damage:
http://i.imgur.com/DMz9kS8.jpg

Lastly, The Sword of Power has some powerful absorption capabilities:
http://i.imgur.com/FxAJ6dJ.jpg
or here, where he absorbs solar energy:
http://youtu.be/O3JHkxebXDU?t=7m1s
I'm not asserting that he could absorb an entire AoE blast. It's not Mjolnir. However, all I care about is the energy directly at me, and on that, I'm well-prepared.

Now, combine those together, and what do you get? I could tank it raw if needed, but I've got two additional layers of protection. And, again, all of that is IF he tags me with it. When it's all said and done, the breath attacks - Godzilla's only meaningful offense - are horribly blunted.

Avoidance and Speed

But you know what, **** that. I don't even need to convince you that He-Man can tank Godzilla's blasts. Why?

http://youtu.be/O3JHkxebXDU?t=2m50s

Wrap your mind around this feat. He runs so fast around a body of water that he creates a water tornado. He wasn't even in the damn water.

Godzilla is a beast, literally and figuratively. He's also slower than mud. I don't have a mph for that running feat, but He-Man could literally run circles around Godzilla.

This is the biggest discrepancy in a single area in the entire fight. And it means nothing will hit me unless I allow it.

Offense Wins Battlezones

Originally posted by leonidas
as for grabbing my tail and 'chucking me'? you'll need a LOT more than that scan of him grabbing that little snake to prove that.

If you insist.

First off, I don't need to throw you into orbit. I'm quite sure you'd survive re-entry and BFR isn't going to count as a win. But can I fling you around, whipping you back and forth against buildings and the ground, until I've created a crater with your corpse? Absolutely. Let's keep pushing the dials up with feats, though. You aren't going to match me on strength feats.

http://i.imgur.com/2DWFEQK.jpg
I did the math for everyone. It's 79,200 mph. Or 127460 km/hr. Or 104x the speed of sound. You don't think I have the strength to have my way with you? Keep pushing me. I have so much more.

And here's He-Man casually chucking another lizard miles away:
http://i.imgur.com/X2tLnWX.jpg

No, they aren't Godzilla's size. But I'm well within my range here, and I don't need to send you miles.

So basically, I see it like a larger version of this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30lGrarz3MQ

That's not my only means of offense, but the rest will have to wait, as I have to wrap this post up.

Miscellaneous Thoughts

- The "radiation just exists around Godzilla and can harm a person" argument is ridiculous in this context. Leo isn't winning the fight by giving He-Man cancer. I mean, come on.

- Let's also ignore the "smoke and fire" arguments. Let's respect these characters like they deserve. He-Man could walk through that sh*t and be none the worse for wear.

- And saying He-Man doesn't have super-senses is a laughably irrelevant argument. Leo spent the better part of his writeup talking about how gigantic and destructive Godzilla is. I could be blind or deaf and still find him easily in this fight.

- This feat that leo posted:
http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/nuke1.jpg.html
http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/nuke2.jpg.html
...is dumb. It's a nuclear blast. It's Godzilla's source of power. It would be like showing a feat of Superman tanking a Solar Bomb and calling it a durability feat. Context, friends. Godzilla has good durability, but Leo was selling this as one of his best feats, if not THE best. I had to keep him honest on it.

Leo's keeping me busy, so I didn't get to post everything I wanted to here. I've got more on the sword and more on Godzilla himself yet to come before I'm in full counter-point mode. But that's ok. I got to cover a lot of necessary stuff in this post.

post the second

so, i'll give digi some credit--he's not backing down from his initial thrust. lol let's see how that plays out for him, shall we?

he starts with this:



to which i say: ima trust that anyone who looks at that scan, followed by that statement, will feel the same. to reiterate: godzilla is the size of a 40 story BUILDING and over 550ft long! that's almost 2 FOOTBALL FIELDS! that 'crevice' is the equivalent of a crack in the sidewalk. lol

and this:



well, again, i'm gonna have to disagree. the big man, jamming a sword into the ground to make a crevice would CERTAINLY, 100%, draw godzilla's attention. THEN the man starts to pound the ground making shockwaves?? yeah, hard to miss, even for godzilla. and once godzilla knows he's there, things get really REALLY bad for he-man....

the other thing is--godzilla doesn't need to know EXACTLY where he-man is. the aoe of his breath can be enormous, as i showed in the ghidora scan. we've also seen how FAST the blast can strike. by strafing a huge area, i'm bound to strike he-man. but it's the collateral damage that would be just as devastating. there is some irony--digi showed these scans to SUPPORT he-man's durability:

http://i.imgur.com/CFXXCrz.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/njENZ1l.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/CiTAjtt.jpg

it's ironic because i was going to use that feat to again show he-man's LACK of durability. lol firstly, that explosion did not do anything at all to the fortress itself. here it is later on, whole and fine:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/fortress.jpg.html

so, the force of that explosion was nothing like what digi wants you to think it was. but more importantly, while it's true he-man wasn't killed by it, he may as well have been. this is how weak he was afterwards:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/stagger3.jpg.html

stunned to the point of stammering and weak enough for man-at-arms to inject him with a drug to incapacitate him completely. and....isn't it a little telling when digi is digging for durability feats that the best one he finds has he-man stunned to the point of being defenceless? heh here again we see him ko'd by a pretty basic aoe attack from skeletor:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/blastko2.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/blastko3.jpg.html

and here, again, simple blunt force takes him out for an extended time:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/stun-1.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/stun2.jpg.html

^in the above scans, we can also see the effects of a simple laser-like weapon on he-man. it actually causes him to collapse. digi claims i'm lowballing. in these types of matches, often SOME lowballing is expected and warranted. however, lowballing, by its very nature, is lowballing because someone is IGNORING HIGH to CONSISTENT portrayals. again, i submit this is NOT lowballing, rather it is highlighting a definite and pervasive aspect of he-man's character. digi knows it, and i know it. he would need to show a half dozen VERY GOOD durability feats just to counter SOME of what i've shown. and there is even MORE! but i think i've shown enough to make my case--he-man's durability IS an achille's heel, and against a 40 story, ultra durable engine of destruction, it's gonna get him killed.

as far as his force field protection?

those scans were lacking..... conviction. i mean, really? it shielded him from some random, nameless 'magic energy field' which, funny enough, he admits would DESTROY him without the vest! lol and as for the scan protecting him from 'physical harm'? that looks more like some kind of gas attack. i certainly don't see the field blocking a physical strike anywhere.....

know what else i DON'T see? i don't see him being able to attack THROUGH the force field. in the one scan, i see it surrounds his axe as well as him, so.....the field won't be up at the start since he is using the sword to open his crevice. and if he DID, the sword would likely cut through that little force field like butter. THAT would be funny. that's the kind of error looking up and seeing a 40 story atomic monster can goad you into.

sword

digi tried to show a couple scans of the sword absorbing some energy. not very convincing, to say the least. he even ACKNOWLEDGED that it wouldn't absorb all of the breath. there is CERTAINLY the issue of the sword absorbing ANYTHING through the force field. i'm thinking he'd need to lower the force field to even TRY and absorb something, so his "double layer protection" idea is shot. based on the scans he showed, he would definitely be struck by the overwhelming brunt of the attack, assuming he could even absorb ANY of that type of blast. and again, the collateral damage around him would be devastating. we saw him tossed bodily from a fortress by a MUCH smaller blast than this:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/breathisnuke.jpg.html

and THAT was just the blue breath weapon! digi hasn't come CLOSE to showing anything at all that would suggest he-man could survive even a PORTION of something like that, let alone the thousands of tons of falling debris, fire and explosions.

there is no way to avoid the fact that as soon as he draws attention to himself he is fried and buried then stomped. despite his showing he-man's running feat (lol, i remember that, it was classic....) he-man is obviously NOT the flash. lol he has some decent reaction feats that i'm sure digi will show, but he's not about to dodge something as large and all-consuming as godzilla's breath. the ground would be smashed, chaos everywhere and nothing solid for him to run on anyway, even if he tried to avoid it, not to mention being unable to see anything! sight is a HUGE issue for him. don't let him convince you otherwise.

and let's say for a second he DID somehow 'run away' from the blast. it makes no real sense, but let's give him the benefit of the doubt for a second. godzilla would just get fed up with the insect and do this:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/chargedblast.jpg.html

nuclear pulse vaporizes everything in the area. like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YR9I8bIpHq0

his nuclear pulse attack is devastating and would hit he-man regardless of his running around.

also, i'll throw this out there: godzilla is actually pretty fast for something so big. he WALKS at 200mph:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/radioactive.jpg.html

he also has some decent reaction feats, given the nature of the movie limitations (advance to about the 1:23 mark to see him duck a charging megaguirus and slice off his claw with his spines--NOTE--you will have to sit through some replaying commercials i'm afraid.....):

http://www.crackle.com/c/godzilla-vs.-megaguirus

there is also this utterly CLASSIC scene that shows a little bit of godzilla's speed, agility and fighting smarts. this is brilliant stuff....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dn-kEOXFAO4

it also highlights just how strong his tail is as it casually bats aside the 60 000 ton anguirus.

THIS scene may even be better! a TRUE lol ***note the somersault near the end!!***

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E5k3vBndNf0#action=share

slow as mud? pfft. graceful as a dancer more like.....

post numero trois

strength

lol at that loki scene. instant classic! but....that most certainly isn't happening to godzilla. lol first, digi has shown nothing at all to suggest he could even LIFT godzilla. he MIGHT have been able to lift a part of the city in his scan. never did. and the classic greyskull throw had him amped, because he couldn't lift it on his own! sorceress isn't going to help him here. not to mention--is godzilla just gonna stand there while he tries and lifts me?? nuclear pulse would fry him if he tried it. my tail is strong enough to easily resist! you saw it bat away a charging anguirus, but it's also strong enough to hold godzilla himself:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gkzSEhndXaA

my gawd, i can't get enough of this sh!t.....

and of course lifting something that is NOT fighting back is a LOT easier than lifting something that IS fighting back. and worst case--even if he DID lift and throw me, i survived being dropped from 10s of 1000s of feet and had the 200 000 TON GHIDORA land on me and i was STILL up! lol blunt force? NOT the way to try and take godzilla down.

digi also tried stating the nuke feat was his best durability feat. i certainly never claimed that. withstanding the explosion here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X7erLu1YfJg

and here:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/durable4.jpg.html

are both at least as good. but his best durability feat is a combo of his best breath weapon feat (imo) AND his best durability feat. how about destroying a black hole fired from the mighty DIMENSION TIDE and surviving its destruction!? lol (advance to about the 1:37 mark in the movie...)

http://www.crackle.com/c/godzilla-vs.-megaguirus

now THAT is some crazy sh!t. you have to watch til the end of the credits to hear godzilla roar and confirm that he did indeed survive. to reiterate--his breath DESTROYED A BLACK HOLE--and he survived it! l o f'n l! now THAT is some POWA!!1! godzilla is the greatest....

here is a similar storyline in the comics. first, here is what the DIMENSION TIDE DOES:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/vsblackhole4.jpg.html

here is its effect on 2 of godzilla's most powerful enemies, gigan and rodan:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/vsblackhole5.jpg.html

and HERE is what happens when godzilla faces it:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/vsblackhole1.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/vsblackhole2.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/vsblackhole3.jpg.html

he is not the KING OF MONSTERS for nothing. nwoot

digi is funny stating that defense wins championships and offense wins battlezones. he's right. only godzilla has FAR more in the way of offense and has a dramatic, LOP-SIDED, superiority in durability.

lastly, an issue digi tried to pooh-pooh in the closing comments of his post:



it isn't a question of 'respect' at all. he can hide his concern and lack of defence by trying to make you believe that if he wants. the fact of the matter is there WILL be explosions like the one that left him defenceless going on ALL AROUND HIM. over and over. we're what, just suppose to assume he-man can magically 'see' through all of that somehow, and ignore effects when LESSER effects have ko'd him?? lol leo thinks not.

the chaos he WANTED to create is a major part of his undoing here. a 20 STORY BUILDING collapsing on he-man WOULD ko him. multiple explosions WOULD impact him enormously, outright ko'ing him or, at the least, make it hard for him to run or dodge. and an appalling amount of smoke WOULD make it hard for him to breathe! AND see. despite my size he can't just SEE THROUGH black smoke and fire. seriously? if he were battling storm and she summoned fog to blind him, it would be LESS of a hindrance as it isn't poisonous at least! if he had the durability showings to ignore the surrounding chaos, i wouldn't press the issue so hard. he doesn't, so battling the collapsing surroundings is part of his effort to survive this encounter i'm afraid..... please don't let him convince you otherwise.

recap

--digi has done nothing at all to show he-man has the durability required to handle even a portion of my breath weapon, let alone the collapse of buildings and surrounding explosions. that leaves out my stomping the entire area flat.

--his best strength showing was amped so useless. it was also slow and the castle doesn't fight back. nor can it fire off a nuclear pulse to fry him.

--his force field can't be used in conjunction with his other powers AND the strength of it was....questionable to say the very least.

--his speed is countered by his own opening, as well as the aoe of my breath and my nuclear pulse.

--the power of my atomic breath is undeniable, and my durability is such that i can easily handle anything he wants to toss my way.

i said it before--this is an issue of scale. there is simply too much large scale sh!t happening for he-man to successfully counter. he is fried, buried and stomped. end scene.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lxyW963syOo#action=share

Digi Post #2

In an attempt to keep the post count roughly even, I'll be making two responses here today, even if neither hits the character limit. The first will be scan-heavy. The second will be responses to leo's points.

Godzilla & The Sword of Power

First, and probably most importantly, he's not indestructible, nor impenetrable:
http://i.imgur.com/g8XablE.jpg

Or this:
http://i.imgur.com/Tgmu9Np.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/DNe2HQh.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/8RcTJ7b.jpg

Did you catch that last one? A common spear pierced his hide.

Leo's tried to dodge a couple times using a variation of "that wasn't him at his peak" as if such a thing exists. These are composite characters, and it works both ways. And I just showed two different incarnations with the same problem.

Now let's remind everyone what the Sword of Power is:
http://i.imgur.com/7SUtQA4.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/7NZyWve.jpg

This isn't just any weapon. This is the most powerful, versatile melee weapon in comics this side of Mjolnir. Those scans are also a reminder that it can project energy blasts capable of felling someone of He-Man's caliber. Here's a repeat performance:
http://i.imgur.com/qMfrlsS.jpg

It has a paralysis ray, in case I want to slow down Godzilla before an attack:
http://i.imgur.com/zAfYTS5.jpg

It can produce sonic attacks:
http://i.imgur.com/jEcFczr.jpg
Which, when targeted correctly, could be devastating to Godzilla:
http://i.imgur.com/CI7kdU0.jpg
And in that that first sonic scan wasn't enough for you, let's make it on Godzilla's scale:
http://i.imgur.com/Q7xf7RD.jpg

And in case we need a reminder that it can handle energy:
http://i.imgur.com/bRdtkXa.jpg
And that was Prince Adam wielding the blade, not transformed into He-Man. You or I could turn back energy blasts with the blade, such is its power.

Here's Prince Adam again, NOT transformed into He-Man, and the blade is able to fell a demon that was threatening several powerful beings:
http://i.imgur.com/pf0ZCrx.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/equ8kAO.jpg

Need some more recent evidence?
http://i.imgur.com/UnVWLop.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/LsN4NVm.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/SI0EGuv.png
I'm not going to wait to get called out on it: that is canon for He-Man but not Superman. However, it is He-Man, and it's also an accurate representation of what would happen if the son of Jor-El got sloppy against Adam. Also, note the durability against a potent energy attack.

Moral of the story? I can carve him up. The sword alone is enough, and He-Man's strength backing it only makes it overkill. Remember my writeup, where I said a leaping sword-first strike would put me through Godzilla? I believe that entirely, and the worst case scenario for me is an impalement after a few well-placed strikes.

Puny Godzilla

Originally posted by leonidas
lol at that loki scene. instant classic! but....that most certainly isn't happening to godzilla. lol first, digi has shown nothing at all to suggest he could even LIFT godzilla. he MIGHT have been able to lift a part of the city in his scan. never did. and the classic greyskull throw had him amped, because he couldn't lift it on his own! sorceress isn't going to help him here.

Oh boy, I didn't expect to be able to school you on this. Time for some learning! He-Man derives his strength and powers from Castle Greyskull, a multiversal nexus of power that contains a solidified remnant of the Big Bang. The power is channeled through the Sword of Power and into him. The Sorceress is the keeper of that power. He-Man's strength is variable based upon need, and it's not a constant level because he's not always channeling the full power of Greyskull.

So what he's asking for here isn't a special amp. It's literally his power set. They just made it more explicit in the clip I played for dramatic effect.

Sorry. I'm not going to egg you on this too much. But it's a perfectly valid strength feat, and an example of how his strength scales to the task.

So yeah, everything I say I can do, I can do. I haven't even pulled out my biggest strength guns yet. I warned you about continually challenging me on it.

Speaking of, let's keep adding to the pile. First, a reminder that sending enemies flying for miles is just another day at the office for He-Man:
http://i.imgur.com/9YN9E5U.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Kes9Opi.jpg

Or, hey, how about him moving a mountain?
http://youtu.be/Twpnb-SJRrg?t=5m49s

Still want to say I can't do a "fastball special" with a building right at Godzilla's face? Or throw him around like a ragdoll? Or just pummel him into submission?

Your Daily Speed Advantage Reminder

I'm going to pound this home until you're all sick of hearing it. But it's by far my biggest advantage in this fight, and makes everything else moot.

Remember the last ridiculous speed feat, the one that puts He-Man as a blur to Godzilla? Here's another:
http://youtu.be/UHarj9tGgxk?t=7m59s
That's Adam going pre-crisis Barry Allen on a vortex.

But speed is only one half of the equation (though probably the more important one). The other is reflexes:
http://i.imgur.com/rLROsu1.jpg
Or (as Prince Adam in this next one):
http://i.imgur.com/aWmcxP8.jpg
Or:
http://i.imgur.com/oq7oVGh.jpg

Those somersault leaps from Adam would be city long jumps as He-Man, and I could perform them at any time necessary.

I think leo tried to throw out a couple pity scans to make the speed gap seem less daunting. If they managed to broker any sympathy from the judges (they shouldn't), these should re-open the gap, and make it even wider.

Digi Post #3

Originally posted by leonidas
to which i say: ima trust that anyone who looks at that scan, followed by that statement, will feel the same. to reiterate: godzilla is the size of a 40 story BUILDING and over 550ft long! that's almost 2 FOOTBALL FIELDS! that 'crevice' is the equivalent of a crack in the sidewalk. lol

I'm not going to plant my flag in the ground too hard on this one. This was a diversionary tactic. Something to throw you off balance. A fissure swallowing you isn't determining this matchup, nor will you win by pointing out that fact. BUT...It's enough that you're not going to just stand there and do whatever you want. You'll need to react. And that's the whole point. My ludicrous speed advantage will mean that if I need to be gone, I will, and if not, this will swiftly be followed

Originally posted by leonidas
well, again, i'm gonna have to disagree. the big man, jamming a sword into the ground to make a crevice would CERTAINLY, 100%, draw godzilla's attention. THEN the man starts to pound the ground making shockwaves?? yeah, hard to miss, even for godzilla. and once godzilla knows he's there, things get really REALLY bad for he-man....

This isn't just for show. The earth around you would be falling apart, along with buildings and skyscrapers. Your response leads me to believe you just think Godzilla is chilling while this is going on. I'm not stupid enough to let it continue if there's a better plan, and will adjust as necessary.

Originally posted by leonidas
there is some irony--digi showed these scans to SUPPORT he-man's durability:

*sigh*

Am I going to need to post the whole issue(s)?

- First he has to fight Evil-Lyn, Trapjaw, and another big-name henchmen whose name is escaping me. In doing so he takes several attacks, including a stab wound to the leg.
- THEN he ends up in chains and Skeletor softens him up with repeated energy blasts.
- THEN he breaks free and fights Skeletor, taking more blows in the process.
- THEN he has to fight an evil version of himself and a demon beast.
- THEN he tanks the explosion I posted.

It's a goddamn great durability feat.

Originally posted by leonidas
and as for the scan protecting him from 'physical harm'? that looks more like some kind of gas attack. i certainly don't see the field blocking a physical strike anywhere.....

Decent point. Here's a less nebulous feat:
http://i.imgur.com/UK5CW5D.jpg

And I can't help the era they appeared in. Art was different back then. If the forcefield makes him impervious to energies that would destroy him otherwise, it's a friggin' powerful forcefield. I'll ask Liefeld to draw his next book, though. Maybe that will be more convincing.

Originally posted by leonidas
know what else i DON'T see? i don't see him being able to attack THROUGH the force field.

So? I'm not attacking when it's up, and if your attacks get through the forcefield, then I'll employ the absorption to aid me. It's not rocket science, not a tactical mistake on my part.

Originally posted by leonidas
digi hasn't come CLOSE to showing anything at all that would suggest he-man could survive even a PORTION of something like that, let alone the thousands of tons of falling debris, fire and explosions.

I trust I've corrected that error. If I punch with the force to move a mountain, your petty debris is going to vaporize.

Originally posted by leonidas
despite his showing he-man's running feat (lol, i remember that, it was classic....) he-man is obviously NOT the flash.

*ahem*

Originally posted by Digi
Remember the last ridiculous speed feat, the one that puts He-Man as a blur to Godzilla? Here's another:
http://youtu.be/UHarj9tGgxk?t=7m59s
That's Adam going pre-crisis Barry Allen on a vortex.

So yeah, lol.

No, he's not the Flash. But he doesn't need to be. Godzilla is slow as sh*t. I'm effectively a blur to you. You've got an AoE attack. That is your single possible answer to what is a death sentence for you. If it takes me one punch or 1,000 pricks from the Sword of Power, it doesn't matter. I can do it with ease.

Originally posted by Digi
there is also this utterly CLASSIC scene that shows a little bit of godzilla's speed, agility and fighting smarts.

...contradicted by the 100s of fights where he just stands around and eats every single attack thrown at him. There's no getting around this. He's a statue to He-Man for all practical purposes.

Originally posted by leonidas
digi also tried stating the nuke feat was his best durability feat. i certainly never claimed that.

I did say among his best feats, and possibly the best. It was still misleading.

Originally posted by leonidas
lastly, an issue digi tried to pooh-pooh in the closing comments of his post:

the chaos he WANTED to create is a major part of his undoing here. a 20 STORY BUILDING collapsing on he-man WOULD ko him. multiple explosions WOULD impact him enormously, outright ko'ing him or, at the least, make it hard for him to run or dodge. and an appalling amount of smoke WOULD make it hard for him to breathe! AND see. despite my size he can't just SEE THROUGH black smoke and fire. seriously? if he were battling storm and she summoned fog to blind him, it would be LESS of a hindrance as it isn't poisonous at least! if he had the durability showings to ignore the surrounding chaos, i wouldn't press the issue so hard. he doesn't, so battling the collapsing surroundings is part of his effort to survive this encounter i'm afraid..... please don't let him convince you otherwise.

He-Man laughs at your fire and debris, and punches them both:
http://i.imgur.com/0NaDanS.jpg

Yeah, it's a weird-ass feat. But my guy can punch fire.

Originally posted by leonidas
--digi has done nothing at all to show he-man has the durability required to handle even a portion of my breath weapon, let alone the collapse of buildings and surrounding explosions. that leaves out my stomping the entire area flat.

Leo has done nothing to suggest he'll ever hit me.

Originally posted by leonidas
--his best strength showing was amped so useless. it was also slow and the castle doesn't fight back. nor can it fire off a nuclear pulse to fry him.

Debunked.

Originally posted by leonidas
--his speed is countered by his own opening.

He-Man isn't going to tank a blast just to continue with what was laid out in the writeup. That's the plan, yes, but it's a fluid fight.

You also ignore the fact that my opening is directed at you and will therefore disrupt you. And, most likely, hurt you in one or more ways. I'm pretty sure a building hurled at Mach 104 will affect Godzilla. And, ok, let's scale it down due to the size of the building and say ONLY Mach 50. That's still more than enough to harm you, if not outright KO you.

Originally posted by leonidas
i said it before--this is an issue of scale. there is simply too much large scale sh!t happening for he-man to successfully counter. he is fried, buried and stomped. end scene.

This match isn't being decided by debris. This is a distraction.

----------------

My speed is my trump card, my strength another advantage, The Sword of Power another.

Let your inner child out, and admit what you know is true. Believe!

4zIoElk3r2c

QUATTRO

let's clear up some of the misconceptions, yes?

DURABILITY:

his durability sucks. it's a MASSIVE achille's heel. digi has shown NOTHING to suggest he-man could come CLOSE to surviving what godzilla can dish out. 2 more posts gone and not a SINGLE DURABILITY FEAT OF NOTE!! that in itself says more than i EVER could regarding this weakness. i have more on this, later, should digi be saving a trump. one other observation: digi has said he-man's strength can be as high as he needs and that his weapon is the MOST versatile in comics beside mjolnir. i wonder then? what IS it that keeps digi from pushing for he-man to be in a higher tier...?

MY durability: vs BLUNT and ENERGY, amply proven. he's not invulnerable. his PIERCING durability can change at times, but his overall durability always sees him through. that and REGENERATOR G-1.

http://godzilla.monstrous.com/regeneration_powers.htm

it's the genetic material responsible for g's ability to heal or withstand almost any wound. in godzilla 2000 ORGA gains g's DNA so has THE SAME regenerative abilities as godzilla. here is what he can do (3:00-3:30):

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xf3jfc_godzilla-vs-orga-american_shortfilms

that happens twice in the movie. because godzilla's hide is so tough, he never sustains that level of damage, but we DO see his healing abilities throughout. wounds just vanish, blood stops gushing, holes that should be there aren't, burns disappear. here are some examples from movies and comics:

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b199/Seer235/cap003.jpg

seconds later:

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b199/Seer235/cap001.jpg

vs MONSTER X, go to 2:10. you see g get blasted and can see white scorch marks when he goes down. but when he gets back up? gone:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZqFzsPht6bY

a TRUE classic:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxaSR0OLy0o

you see how quickly the neck wound heals as well as the dart wounds. AND, as a special bonus, we see godzilla's MAGNETIC POWA!! THAT should answer the speed issue digi is trying to sell to everyone! if g can pull the 100 000 ton mechgodzilla (who can achieve supersonic speeds) i don't see he-man being able to resist having his vest either pulled off, or his sword ripped from his grasp!! it will AT LEAST slow him down. once i have him drawn close to me, all i need to do is nuclear pulse/breath and it's over, eezy-peezy.

but, in answer to his 'carve me up' (should you believe it) stance: his sword does not always have the best cutting feats:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/sword0.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/sword.jpg.html

lol

so, there is DEFINITELY a question whether it would cut me at all. if it did...?

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/destoroya1.jpg.html

destroyah very nearly cuts godzilla IN HALF, but godzilla remains standing, gets PO'D and keeps on truckin! here battra's tail spike is driven straight through godzilla's neck--and it's CHARGED! all it does is pi$$ godzilla off:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/manga1.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/battra.jpg.html

(the scan SHOULD be a single scan, the first is the right side, the second the left). here is the next HALF scan (^%$#@!!) but it's enough to see NO WOUND and a po'd godzilla:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/healed.jpg.html

MORE dramatic healing (pologies for the half pages):

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/impaled1.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/impaled2.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/impaled3.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/impaled4.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/impaled5.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/impaled6.jpg.html

those are consecutive--you can see by the last scan--those huge gaping holes? GONE!

more? rips mechakong and mechagodzilla apart after this:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/stabbed1-1.jpg.html

or how about this--BOTH A REACTION SPEED FEAT and A DURABILITY FEAT! spacegodzilla is even MORE powerful than godzilla while his shoulder crystals are in place. here he tries to skewer gojira, but g is too fast and destroys the crystal before it hits him:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/parry1.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/parry2.jpg.html

but, when he gets distracted by a stupid human firing rockets at him, spacegodzilla scores a hit. so what?? lol

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/parry3.jpg.html

believe it or not, there are more examples to show if needed.

ULTRA-DENSE HIDE + REGENERATOR G-1 + DURABILITY + SHEER WILLPOWER =GOD F'N ZILLA!! so, even IF you want to believe he can cut me...GODZILLA HAS NO PHUCKS TO GIVE! lolol

as i said--durability LOP-SIDED. now let's look at what he thinks is a game changer: speed. first, PLEASE note the irony of these 2 statements:

he says about godzilla:

he says about he-man:

ha! godzilla has at least as many speed/agility feats as he-man does 'flash-esque' speed feats! judges, PLEASE look at BOTH those feats. in BOTH cases it took him TIME to build up speed. more notably: HE WAS NOT BLINDLY RUNNING OVER SHATTERED, BURNING, EXPLODING GROUND! lol those feats are WHOLLY irrelevant here. also, funnily enough, NO superspeed COMBAT FEATS, aside from some decent reaction feats. let's face it: his speed advantage is USELESS on this battlefield and negated by AOE blasts. the only thing he COULD try and do is jump for safety. but godzilla can do THIS to military jets (mach 3 speeds in RL!):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bScaNuKW0J8#t=51

and this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-PEmYXxaNiQ#t=68

here we see how smart godzilla can be as well as highlighting the uselessness of he-man's speed. kamacuras has great speed AND can turn invisible. what does g do? strafes the area (sound familiar?) until he forces kamacuras to come out. result? heh:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cACc2XJkCYI#t=1m0s

we've also seen g bat a crystal thrown at him by someone STRONGER than him (spacegodzilla). FACT: GODZILLA HAS THE NECESSARY REACTION AND OFFENSIVE SPEEDS TO COUNTER HE-MAN'S ATTACK SPEED. we all know how fast his breath can travel, and the damage it can output.

other random points: paralysis? :wft: on godzilla's scale? don't think so...

sonics? tried, in the form of the HEADACHE CANNON, a sonic weapon meant to annoy giant monsters and drive them off:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/immunetosonics.jpg.html

his sword's absorption feats are cute. but deflecting random magic lightning (remnants of a cage btw)? whew, needs to be WAY better. godzilla's breath can do THIS to a mutha f'n BLACK HOLE:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jswS7c1hXWk

(incidentally, official movie company explanation? g was hit by the blast and driven underground by it. the earthquake at the end of the movie was him digging to reach the sea. fyi )

ain't NO WAY the sword absorbs any of that--if it does, no WAY it absorbs enough to allow adam to live and his force field is nearly a non-factor at this point. and recall it's kinetic properties.

impalement via sword?

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/chargedblast.jpg.html

as soon as he does ANYTHING of note on my body, he gets nuked. if you believe he goes STRAIGHT THROUGH me somehow? who cares? durability+regenerator g-1=TANKED. though my body (as told in godzilla vs destroyah) IS a massive NUCLEAR REACTOR! lol maybe not the best idea?



frankly, not buying the myth. comic showings belie the fact. building tossing (if you somehow buy that)? i blast it, AND you, as he-man 'gathers' strength, or as it approaches, and it falls on your head. and good luck finding buildings still standing....

crevice? not worth the characters it takes to comment. look again at the size. shockwaves? less than useless though both combined pinpoint him so i can fry him.

force field? no feat worth commenting on. random blast taken on shield+force field?

punching fire? i HAD a flying fists he-man! lol it tired him out though AND the fires here never end!

lift and throw me? ha! nuke-pulse or...i just fight back.

recap

this has been bad for him since the start. his backtracking isn't working. he still doesn't appreciate the level or impact of the surrounding chaos. the crevice and shockwaves tell me where he is. my breath fries him, or falling buildings crush him. he's blind and buried. IF you believe he can run i strafe the area (no ground, can't see--for which he has no defence)). and i routinely hit military jets. he jumps, i blast him. if you believe he can STILL run, i pulse-nuke the place. AOE FTW. blunt damage or piercing i tank it or heal.

durability: UTTERLY lop-sided.

offensive/range output: lop-sided.

speed: negated by AOE + battlefield.

result: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUbU1QsITYE

Digi Post #4

Leo's posts have gone a touch over the limit, so technically his posts will number one more than mine by the end. But it's been discussed via PM, so we're kosher.

Like my last two posts, this one will focus more on my strategies and scans, while #5 will mostly be responses to leo.

Also, leo's said more than I have, and posted more scans. Don't mistake quantity for quality. Leo's a great debater, but there's a lot of overlap in his arguments and the types of feats that his scans show. It's a common debating tactic to demand more of a type of scan and invalidate the others until such scans are produced. I'm endeavoring to do so when needed, but nothing I've shown is invalid for any reason, and I dislike scan-dumping once a point is already made.

Why He-Man is Stupid (aka, Why I Win)

He-Man's power set, and most of his best feats, come from an era when writers didn't give a **** about continuity and/or logic. It's at once ridiculous, awesome, and depressing. But it's what we have.

I started with really good strength feats, then I pushed my way up to amazing ones. I'm about to post one that makes no rational sense, but it buries all the others combined, several times over.

Here's He-Man casually pushing a moon out of sight. Again, it's not just a push. It shrinks from view faster than you or I can finish a sentence. Given the rate at which it's leaving the screen, we can probably safely say the moon was pushed out of the damn solar system, or could have been if he wanted to.

http://youtu.be/_AIHoq2bjvQ?t=6m19s

Make sure you watch until about 7:20. It happens twice. This wasn't a small rock; it was affecting the tides on the planet below. It was an honest to goodness full-sized moon that He-Man pushed away like he was PC Superman high on Popeye's spinach.

So, remember when Leo questioned whether or not I could lift a city block and throw it at Godzilla? He casually got rid of a moon. Remember when leo questioned if I could hurl Godzilla around like a rag doll? He casually got rid of a moon. Remember when...actually, just scan through the thread briefly for me, and see if you need to reconceptualize any aspects of the fight based on this information.

This feat is beyond stupid. But it's entirely consistent with He-Man, the writing, and his power set. It counts. And not only can Godzilla not match it, he can't even come close. The idea that He-Man's as powerful as he need to be to complete the task is the laziest writing possible. But that's what He-Man is: a walking adolescent wish fulfillment machine.

So, He-Man's strength varies based upon need. And what's the need here? To rock Godzilla like the cocky, one-note lizard that he is. So to borrow a line from He-Man himself: "I HAVE THE POWERRRRR!"

Under The Skin

Originally posted by leonidas
MY durability: vs BLUNT and ENERGY, amply proven. he's not invulnerable. his PIERCING durability can change at times, but his overall durability always sees him through.

Oh, awesome. I can work with this. Why?

First, I showed some energy attacks, but mostly in the hope that it would occupy some of Leo's time.

Second, I have blunt force power that dwarfs anything Godzilla has ever known. If He-Man gets a clean shot on the lizard's face, I'm going to cave his skull in.

Third, you opened up a nice little hole for me - pun intended - in regards to your piercing durability. First, let's remind the home viewers just how magnificent a weapon the Sword of Power is:
http://i.imgur.com/Qqq6Q1J.jpg

That's an ancestor of He-Man talking about how he forged the blade in the Fires of Eternity with The Magic of Creation. This is as close to an all-powerful Macguffin you'll find in the He-Man-verse, aside from Castle Greyskull and itself and the power it harbors (which itself is channeled by the sword).

Now, I want to call your attention to the fact that He-Man's transformation is very much like Cpt. Marvel (Shazam), in that a gigantic amount of energy transforms him. Here's one among dozens of scans I could show showing this:
http://i.imgur.com/DuNqISe.jpg

Except the transformative energy focuses on the sword, not He-Man per se. And He-Man can do this:
http://i.imgur.com/RqUUcM4.jpg
For reference, that was a being that was taking it to the Justice League, Masters of the Universe, and random other DCers. No one else was able to deliver the death blow. Not Superman (the real one this time), not Wonder Woman, not GL, not f---ing John Constantine.

I can cut Godzilla up anyway, but this is another option. Stick him good, and yell "BY THE POWER OF GRAYSKULL" to my heart's content. Good durability or not, what do you think will happen when The Fires of Eternity and The Magic of Creation do their work on Godzilla's insides? We can't know for sure, but I'm guessing it's not pretty.

Gojira's Decimation

All of these next scans come from a very recent Godzilla comic. If anything, they represent a "current" view of the lizard, amidst all the confusing eras and iterations.

First, piercing damage, let's touch on that again:
http://i.imgur.com/Xg11LKk.jpg
Negative points for our cold-blooded champion. What do you want to bet the Sword of Power is about 100x better than those things at piercing?

Second, let's take a look at some regular damage:
http://i.imgur.com/x47sy0k.jpg

Or actually, even better:
http://i.imgur.com/VbF8xDU.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/OmY8j2y.jpg
...which is about what I see happening if He-Man gets a "I HAVE THE POWER" lightning shot to Godzilla's face, or even a strong punch.

Leo's going to point out the odds Godzilla was facing in that fight, and it's a fair point. But here's mine: I'm not Godzilla's rogues gallery. I can recreate or top everything you see there, and sometimes top it ridiculously. And those lesser attacks do hurt Godzilla. Significantly.

Your Daily Ridiculous Speed Advantage Reminder

Here it is. Considered yourselves reminded.

I'm going to respond to leo directly a bit more in my final post, but briefly, he mentions the speed feats I posted. In the 2nd, his building up speed was clearly from the gigantic, city-spanning machine he was pushing. A ridiculous counter from leo, in the face of a feat that is terrifyingly match-ending for him.

Let's take this "feat" that Leo used as counter-evidence:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bScaNuKW0J8#t=51

Watch the whole video if needed. This is a farce. Godzilla waddles around like a constipated penguin, and shows nothing - AT ALL - to suggest he could avoid any one of the dozens of attacks that he lumbers into like a big, dumb beast. This is my entire point. Guys, we don't know Godzilla's speed in the comics, and the movie versions are unarguably more well-known. So...this is his speed. All of it, in its molasses-tempo glory. If you don't believe I can run circles around him after a feat like that as a speed feat, I don't know what else to say.

He-Man PC-Flashed a city-sized vortex out of existence. Godzilla waddles around like a out-of-shape Asian guy in a bulky, awkward costume (oh wait... ).

The larger point, though, is that I've shown multiple instances of a massive, ludicrous speed edge, and a massive reactions edge. They're repeated, canonical feats that trash Godzilla's slow-ass meandering.

Digi's Fan Fiction

Ok, not quite. But here's how I see the fight going:

Fight begins. Godzilla is looking around, He-Man sees the gigantic monster instantly. Creates massive tremors and fissures directly at Godzilla, jostling him around and likely sending him toppling to the ground. If there's time, he hurls a building or buildings, plural, at him at a speed of at least Mach 10+ (and that's being incredibly conservative). These strike Godzilla as building-sized fastballs, thrown by the strongest muscle this side of the Trans. tier. They will hurt him and lay him low.

If this doesn't seal it, at some point Godzilla will get off an AoE energy attack. Remember, this is leo's entire offense...the only viable attack he has. I can't block (shield), absorb (sword), and thus tank at least one, but I don't ever plan on being hit by one. As needed, I'll leap away (meters? miles? whatever's needed), and pick my spots. Also remember, if the opening script doesn't play out exactly like this, I'll move on to speed strikes ASAP.

At this point, my speed edge is everything that is needed. I have the strength, the cutting power, the lightning strike attacks, or any combination of these. Godzilla will be on the defensive, and I'll make sure every attack cripples him. I can throw him to the next county or create a crater with his face. I can punch holes in his skull. I can rend him in two or cut my way to his insides. I can rip off his vaunted spine spikes and beat him to death with himself.

Godzilla dies. He-Man lives. Long Live Eternia!

I HAVE THE P...Oh, you get the idea

http://i.imgur.com/anw061S.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/IJRogZF.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Wro001T.jpg

THE HOMESTRETCH

this reply, and a consolidating post and that should wrap this up. let's get to it:

consistency , NOT a battle of highest feats

so, he pushed a moon, eh? that IS pretty ridiculous. what's even funnier is the ship he is standing on stays in place as he pushes. while i can't deny it happening, i CAN say this: i am not fighting he-man just "from the moon pushing episode". i'm fighting a composite version of he-man and in 99.99% of his showings he is NOT pushing moons. not even CLOSE in fact. to quote digi:



actually though, i've tried dodging nothing. godzilla's showings have been remarkably consistent over time. while he did get more powerful, he remained essentially the same throughout all his incarnations. he-man? digi says pushing moons and 'strength based on need' are consistent with he-man's character. i gotta go ahead and call BS on that. since those early ridiculous cartoons, his power HAS been pretty consistent--he is strong, no doubt, but nowhere even CLOSE to those toonish levels. the proof is in the utter lack of corroborating scans (across a HOST of versions) SHOWING this cartoon-level of strength. since digi seems fond of using recent showings, look at this scan of him kicking fake-superman:

http://i.imgur.com/UnVWLop.jpg

fake supes didn't even MOVE! lol so, yeah. while this is indeed a battle of composite characters, that does NOT make it a battle of "only the highest feats". as judges, you still need to try and determine a consistent portrayal for these characters, and based on that, godzilla has dwarfed he-man (seewutididthere... ) digi claims he-man can hurl buildings at mach 10, ragdoll me, etc... if you remove those cartoonish examples and look at he-man as a whole, it is unlikely IN THE EXTREME he can do either. and of course, if he tries, i have very simple counters. he, otoh, has NO counter for my nuclear pulse. as soon as he gets close to me, he's done for. i already showed what the pulse did to biollante. i also showed this scan:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/chargedblast.jpg.html

but i never showed the durability of the creatures he vaporized:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/critters1.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/critters2.jpg.html

and those are NOT just normal weapons, but the advanced weapons of the COUNTER KAIJU REACTIONARY TEAM. they couldn't stop even ONE of the little guys until they later used a variation of mechagodzilla's ABSOLUTE ZERO CANON. godzilla's pulse disintegrated the swarm like they were nothing. simply put: he-man has shown no possible way of surviving such an all-encompassing blast. if he DOES try and throw a building, i just blast it. no durability feats show he could handle having a full skyscraper exploded on him, forget withstanding a blast of breath on top of it. and of course, my durability is such that i would just tank it anyway.

his sword

there really isn't much to say here. he likes to use his toon feats as proof, but as he alluded to, that can be slippery slope (advance to about 6:00):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0C6khPhV-w

if you wanna use highs, gotta accept the lows....like his durability, and force field, there are really no feats here over which to debate--anyone else detecting a pattern?

flowery descriptions aside, there is no proof it could do any significant harm to something as large and durable as godzilla. he could try and throw it to impale me, i guess, in an effort to expend some unquantifiable energy release, but we've seen godzilla's durability to energy. but in case we need reminding: here's more of his fight against mechagodzilla 2. it's an unbelievable battle and FULL of durability feats. go to about 2:30 to see what happens when mecha stabs gojira and sends energy at him THROUGH the blade....go ahead. i'll wait. heh

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x17a4hg_godzilla-against-mechagodzilla-fight-clips_shortfilms

godzilla just doesn't care. lol

something as nebulous as the skull feat digi showed isn't enough. that does raise another issue i've yet to bring up though: ENERGY ABSORPTION. it's yet another option. here gojira absorbs ghidora's breath weapon and kills him with the charged blast (go to about 1:15):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7geHT1rTomE

he has also absorbed lightning and, obviously, the energy from nuclear reactors and bombs on which he feeds. there is at least a chance i could absorb his energy attack, if i don't outright tank it. regardless, if he DOES throw it, he gives up his sword's ability to block at least tiny amounts of my answering breath weapon. that's...not good.

and lol at showing that it took 4 MECHAGODZILLA's to take gojira down. heh i sound like a broken record, but it's the most significant part of this match--we have another distinct lack of feats: the sword lacks the feats to show it being able to do anything significant even if it CAN pierce me. healing + nuke-pulse=fried he-man.

speed

dealt with last post and nothing new here--again, given consistent portrayals (cartoonish feats aside), he is obviously NOT flash. he has no superspeed combat feats and only a couple solid reaction speed feats. i have shown repeatedly that i have the AOE attacks and offensive speed to counter his grossly inconsistent speed. flash speed is even LESS consistently shown then moon strength.

digi's fan fic

lol i suspect that deep down, even digi isn't buying that. he's been trying to overcome his opening since this started but he hasn't given a realistic counter to my first post yet.

he opens a crevice. as soon as he does i know where he is and i blast him. his displayed shockwaves and crevice would in no way AT ALL even hinder me--i'd barely notice them, tbh. it really is that simple. he likely wouldn't even get a chance to shockwave. if he runs, i strafe the area. buildings fall all around him. this random scan shows the level of devastation and chaos he would need to fight through:

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x21jan8_godzilla-vs-mecha-king-ghidorah_webcam

dust clouds/smoke, crushing weight, fire, explosions. his speed is nullified but the environment (IF you somehow believe he can act as flash) and by my blasting and nuke-pulsing. if he is jumping away, i can always blast him or go electromagnet on him. magnetics would also serve to slow him down.

tale of the match

his grossly lacking feats for his force field, sword and durability, spell his end in this match. he underestimated godzilla and made a couple irreparable errors in his opening and tactics. my own durability and damage output have been proven over and over across a variety of incarnations. there is no way to counter the fact that he is blind from nearly the outset, no way to avoid having building after building dumped on him, no way to avoid having me literally, STOMP him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-u6hV3uT7PM

go green.

FINAL POST

this has been an awful lot of fun for me. i've shown a LOT in my posts, and i hope you've had a laugh at some of the stuff, like i have. in spite of the fun i've had though, this IS a BZ, so i want to make sure i highlight and review some of what i feel are the most important things godzilla brings to the table.

size MATTERS

355ft tall, 550ft long, 90 000 tons. how big is that?

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/size2.jpg.html?sort=3&o=61

again, note the jeep stuck between his toes! lol (technically those are his opponent's toes, but godzilla is actually BIGGER than his opponent!) to say he's huge is a GROSS understatement...

strength

removing cartoonish strength feats which are nowhere near consistent with his overall character, godzilla is as strong as he-man.

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/strength-1.jpg.html?sort=3&o=57

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQxK4ffn2G0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1YX9McPBpI

and something i haven't shown before: he breaks out of a cage composed of 'unbreakable BLACK HOLE ENERGY'. lol he-man's not the only one with cartoonish feats!

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/blackholeenergy1.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/blackholeenergy2.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/blackholeenergy3.jpg.html

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/blackholeenergy4.jpg.html

whatever strength advantage he-man MAY have is negligible. and that really is the ONLY thing he-man had to hang his hat on....

blasting power

here again is a medley of classic breath attacks. as you watch this time, note the collateral damage done from the breath:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iIOHfGhpXq4

it's lacking the destruction of the black hole (his best feat, imo), but i've shown that twice already, just keep it in mind. and don't forget he can alter the width and breadth of the attack:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/blast.jpg.html?sort=3&o=64

that is enormous.... and i've already showed the nuclear pulse enough for you to know its power. also, don't forget the kinetic properties of his breath weapon:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCUTNT0wMH8#action=share

in case he-man DID try parrying some of it. here is another reminder of the power of the WEAKER blue breath weapon:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/breathisnuke.jpg.html

the RED breath (used against mechagodzilla, keizer ghidorah and orga) is even MORE powerful! lol here again is something new. just in case he tries jumping away.....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aOhlfnnX1po

yeah, godzilla can fly if needed. it also shows the power of his breath weapon....

durability/healing

my offensive advantage is big, but my durability advantage is even bigger--lopsidedly so. just a couple reminders. from this:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/impaled2.jpg.html?sort=3&o=15

to this:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/impaled6.jpg.html?sort=3&o=11

in literally seconds. (consecutive pages above.) he also fought on after this and this:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/stabbed1-1.jpg.html?sort=3&o=10

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/parry3.jpg.html?sort=3&o=7

wasn't ko'd from this:

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/durable13.jpg.html?sort=3&o=43

http://s1151.photobucket.com/user/sclements1/media/durable14.jpg.html?sort=3&o=42

withstood the black hole explosion and this explosion (also shows range and power of his blast):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZqFzsPht6bY

crazy stuff. lol

scale of destruction

he-man hasn't had an answer for this the whole match. the sheer volume of destruction and chaos around him would make it impossible for him to do almost anything--and at the start he ASKED for chaos! blinded by smoke/fire/explosions/1000s of tons of falling concrete/shattered battlefield. i just keep blowing things up and smashing them and i almost can't HELP but ko him, even if you think he avoids the first breath weapon. he has, literally, NO durability feats to suggest he could withstand a single breath weapon, or the constant barrage i would unleash if needed. it would be a miracle if his sword wasn't knocked out of his hand amid the chaos.

his lack of feats

i've beat this horse enough but it is sooo important. he needs to prove his claim of 'need based strength'. in order for that to be true, it needs to be true across his incarnations. on the whole, the claim simply falls flat. i'm not battling 80's cartoon he-man only. the rest of his incarnations need to be taken into account and they just don't support his supposition. his sword, force field and durability are all grossly lacking significant feats. you can't win one of these things without proof of claims. he has next to none, i have almost too many! he opens his crevice and gets fried for his trouble. if he somehow avoids the first breath, i get him via collateral damage or perpetual barrage, or nuke pulse or i draw him to me with my magnetic powers THEN blast him. there really is no defense for him and his speed is negated by the sheer destruction falling down all around him.

in the end size, battlefield and sheer destructive power are just too much for he-man to overcome.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7CDU21yKliM

Digi Post #5

This post went over the character limits for me, which is just as well since I have a full post and a more brief closing post to work with. But it's been fun, and I want to thank leo for being an excellent opponent, as ever, and also thank the judges who agreed to read this gloriously hot mess of a match.

Answering Some Questions

I'm the first guy to say it's a bit of a non-fight between He-Man and PC Superman. But he did tank an attack from one of the more haxx guys in comic history:
http://i.imgur.com/MSnQ8uo.jpg

Here's a feat I absolutely need you to look at. It's not only a response to leo's posts, but a specific answer to some of his tactics:
http://i.imgur.com/II7kVrm.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/ixSBtTm.jpg
How many times in the last 9 posts have we heard that f---ing debris is going to kill He-Man? How many times have we heard that Godzilla can just stomp He-Man to death? It's all sh*t. This was thousands of tons of stone falling directly on He-Man. He lifted it, chucked it to the side, and walked away unscathed. Weak durability my ass.

I've been utilizing He-Man's leaping in my strategies, and it occurred to me that I was asking judges to infer the leaps based on his strength. That's fine, and honestly should be enough, but for completionist sake:
http://i.imgur.com/HGexJRa.jpg

Here's a minor durability feat, tanking a blast from Skeletor - who is himself a formidable low-to-mid herald. There have been legit vs. battles of him vs. Loki.
http://i.imgur.com/OaZvFCg.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/idZTPL1.jpg
It also shows the sword dealing with energy, for about the 4th time in this thread. It's clear leo's scans outnumber mine, but if volume was all that mattered, we'd just awards battles to the guy with more appearances. I've backed my opinion amply on this point.

Responses

Originally posted by leonidas
his durability sucks. it's a MASSIVE achille's heel. digi has shown NOTHING to suggest he-man could come CLOSE to surviving what godzilla can dish out. 2 more posts gone and not a SINGLE DURABILITY FEAT OF NOTE!! that in itself says more than i EVER could regarding this weakness. i have more on this, later, should digi be saving a trump.

I do have a few scans to post in a bit. Not as a trump card necessarily; it just took me a little while to compile them. He's not defenseless, is the point, and his other advantages speak for themselves.

Originally posted by leonidas
one other observation: digi has said he-man's strength can be as high as he needs and that his weapon is the MOST versatile in comics beside mjolnir. i wonder then? what IS it that keeps digi from pushing for he-man to be in a higher tier...?

His mobility, clearly. But that's not a problem because you're slow as smell.

fdog

Originally posted by leonidas
that happens twice in the movie. because godzilla's hide is so tough, he never sustains that level of damage, but we DO see his healing abilities throughout. wounds just vanish, blood stops gushing, holes that should be there aren't, burns disappear.

But we've seen him hurt with lesser attacks. And the speed of these fights is far from what you're assuming. If I hurt Godzilla, I'm not letting up. Any advantage is going to be a deadly one here.

Originally posted by leonidas
but, in answer to his 'carve me up' (should you believe it) stance: his sword does not always have the best cutting feats:

And yet, it's clear he can impale Superman. And we've seen Godzilla pierced by common weapons wielding with FAR less strength, including a wooden spear.

Originally posted by leonidas
so, he pushed a moon, eh? that IS pretty ridiculous. what's even funnier is the ship he is standing on stays in place as he pushes. while i can't deny it happening, i CAN say this: i am not fighting he-man just "from the moon pushing episode". i'm fighting a composite version of he-man and in 99.99% of his showings he is NOT pushing moons.

We dug our own graves with this one, because we tried to start telling judges which feats do and don't count. It all counts. That's the agreement. Now, will it make some judging tricky because incarnations differ? Yeah, absolutely. But that's for the judges to determine (sorry guys!).

But here's what I know: He-Man's power set has never, ever changed. The writing, art, and details change, but the core is intact. Castle Grayskull harbors universal energy, and that energy was used to forge the Sword of Power. The power is channeled through the sword into its wielder, in this case He-Man. And the keeper of this power is the Sorceress.

Hell, I showed an instance that spelled this out, and he specifically asked the Sorceress for more of Grayskull's power.

Go Google "He-Man Power Source" and look at any of the entries. Heck, here's a copy/paste from ComicVine:
Powers and Abilities

He-man is powered by the magical power of Castle Grayskull, and when tapping into that power he is given these following powers:

Strength: He-Man's main power is immense super-human strength. While the upper limit of He-man's strength is unknown, he is at least a class 100 (meaning he is at least able to lift a 100 tons). Using only strength He-man has lifted Castle Grey Skull, prevented Hordak's ship from achieving escape velocity and leaving Eternia's orbit and, when it was out of it's normal orbit, he pushed the Eternia's moon back in its rightful place orbiting Eternia. He-Man has easily moved mountains crushed diamond, thrown objects out of orbit and made a little crack in Eternia meters wide.

Super Speed: He-man has proven to be extremely fast and acrobatic, he has made whirl winds with his speed while running in a circle (proving he can run at least 400 MPH). He has also rubbed sand in his hands so fast he turned it into glass, spun his sword so fast in a circle he was able to generate lift and, thus, fly.

Nigh invulnerable: He-man is very durable and is nigh-invulnerable. He has been able to withstand intense laser blasts and has also survived massively heavy rocks falling on him without injury.

Wisdom: When Adam is He-Man he possesses uncanny wisdom and is almost always able to outsmart his foes rather than resorting to fighting them.

H2H: Prince Adam is a master of hand-to-hand combat and swordsmanship thanks to his close friend, mentor and weapons master Man-At-Arms and his daughter Teela.

Sword of Power
The Sword of Power is He-Man's main weapon, it is a mystical item that grants Adam his powers. The Sword of Power is virtually indestructible, and is often used to reflect laser and magical bolts. It can also shoot out energy beams and absorb energy.

Key points: "At least 400mph" (a gross understatement, given my feats), "Nigh-invulnerable", "absorb energy", etc. I've shown you all of this and more, but apparently it's not enough when I'm invoking the literal description of the guy's power set to accomplish a feat. So there's some redundant explanation.

Final Post

Responses Cont.

Originally posted by leonidas
actually though, i've tried dodging nothing.

Just want this emphasized.

Originally posted by leonidas
.

This is a placeholder quote because I can't find the video Leo posted of Godzilla "flying." But...

Please please please believe that he can do this, because it's as laughably slow as anything else he does. And he seems capable of only traveling in a straight line. He might as well serve himself up on a silver platter for me.

Originally posted by leonidas
digi claims he-man can hurl buildings at mach 10, ragdoll me, etc... if you remove those cartoonish examples and look at he-man as a whole, it is unlikely IN THE EXTREME he can do either

There's a problem with this, and it has nothing to do with what feats judges accept. The problem is that everything I've used as a tactic in this fight is possible with just a fraction of the power I've shown in my feats. For example, throwing Godzilla around like a rag doll is nothing. If I have moon-pushing strength, I'm going to vaporize Godzilla with my blows. My tactics, by and large, have been enormously conservative compared to what I'm actually capable of.

Originally posted by leonidas
dealt with last post and nothing new here--again, given consistent portrayals (cartoonish feats aside), he is obviously NOT flash.

And here's Leo getting caught up on an analogy. I flatly said he's not Flash, so this is a strawman. The one feat is reminiscent of a feat from PC Flash. Thus the comparison. The speed, however, is not.

That was never the point, so this is a worthless counter. The point is that he's leagues faster than Godizlla. That point remains entirely solidified. One is an outlier, two is a trend, especially when backed with ancillary feats that suggest the same.

Originally posted by leonidas
i suspect that deep down, even digi isn't buying that. he's been trying to overcome his opening since this started but he hasn't given a realistic counter to my first post yet.

Excuse me! I believe ALL my He-Man fan fics. Especially the erotic Battlezone ones. biscuits Kidding, kidding, I don't like Adam that much. Teela, on the other hand... drool

Silliness aside, this is just Leo projecting his thoughts onto my words; nothing more. Of course we have different versions of the match in our heads. But I feel that Leo's is laughably dismissive of what I've repeatedly shown through my words, logic, scans, and counter-points.

Originally posted by leonidas
tale of the match

I'm disappointed in you. This was a prime opportunity to write "Tail of the match." Shame on you.

Originally posted by leonidas
his grossly lacking feats for his force field,

It's insurance, not a breaking point unto itself. As you've done a few times, you're latching onto minor points and acting like I'm basing an entire strategy on them.

Originally posted by leonidas
there is no way to counter the fact that he is blind from nearly the outset, no way to avoid having building after building dumped on him, no way to avoid having me literally, STOMP him.

Didn't I already show that scan of him crumbling an attempted stomping with a one-handed push, in my writeup no less? And the other great feat above, the one that nukes a lot of your durability concerns?

In Closing

I feel like Leo has tried to needle me on posting, say, 3-4 feats instead of 15-20. But, as always, we don't awards titles to whoever can scan-dump the most. That's not what either of us has done, though I could have called him out for that once or twice, as he himself said he was guilty of it. But a lot of it was redundant.

But if you take my scans as a whole, they're not lacking in any area. I made sure to back each point with at least two feats, and usually 5-6. My best is better than his best. My offense is staggering. My speed edge is overwhelming. My defensive capabilities are enough to get the job done. I was never going match Godzilla feat for feat in durability, but I didn't need to, because he couldn't match me in pretty much any other area.

But this has been fun. So, in closing:

Lizards are dumb. He-Man is awesome. Vote for me.

http://i.imgur.com/QzIl6EX.gif

http://i.imgur.com/CxTjhBU.gif

ZZ5LpwO-An4

Judging

Judges are Beatboks, Delph, God Cloth, Galan, and Krisblaze. They've all been PMd.

Judges, if you see this before you read your PM, don't post your ruling here. PM it to Newjak. He's collecting them and posting once we have all five, or until we have a majority for one of us if there's a delay and/or holdout from one of the judges.

Thanks to all of you for agreeing to judge. Enjoy!

My judgement may take a little longer than I'd hoped guys.
I had read through to post 2 from each of you a few days ago.
Right now I'm having trouble opening the images. My speed has obviously been sowed (which figures I usually get slowed with 8 days to go and I've been laid up on line a lot more the last couple of weeks, 11 days now to my monthly plan date).

I'll be as quick as I can.

Originally posted by Digi
Final Post
http://i.imgur.com/QzIl6EX.gif

http://i.imgur.com/CxTjhBU.gif

ZZ5LpwO-An4



kong would beat he-man down too.....

The only people who should be posting in this thread are Digi, Leo, judges with questions, and mods if necessary. And this thread is definitely not for posting who you think won. Everyone else should post comment or questions in another thread or via PMs.

i sent this to newjak, but i wanted you guys to hear it from me firsthand...

i don't think i'll be able to vote. my work schedule has been crazy this past week, so i haven't had any real time to sit down and read the match. to give you a bearing: i worked tuesday-thursday, was off friday, am working today, off sunday, then working monday-tuesday. i don't want to do a disservice to leo/digi by quickly skimming through their posts just to get a vote in, so i think it's best for me to withdraw as a judge.

very sorry about this--didn't foresee working such a hectic schedule when i offered to participate.

we have 4 others, so it's POSSIBLE your vote won't be needed anyway. if it's tied, i guess we'll have to find another judge. it would be great to get all votes in this weekend if possible....

That's a shame, Galan, but thanks for letting us know. We'll probably try to find a 5th. If anyone's interested, and doesn't have any biases for/against these two (looking at you, Bada!), shoot us a PM.

So there you have it with a tally of 3 -1 the winner is

Digi!!!!!

Congrats to both contestants.

ZZ5LpwO-An4


....

I'm actually surprised. I expected to lose. Leo did a great job with Godzilla, and I didn't realize just how beastly GZ was until we were about two posts each into the match. So I thought I did a good job repping He-Man, but it was a much tougher matchup than anticipated.

But thanks to the judges, Newjak, and Leo for being a good opponent, as ever. We picked these characters because they're both awesome and ridiculous, and we were excited to rep them, so hopefully it was entertaining for all.

Digi, you should have used this video for support!

ep5oh_6D4yY

I may have to overrule this travesty of justice. mmm










Congratulations Digi.

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
Digi, you should have used this video for support!

ep5oh_6D4yY

Sure, probably; it's a good feat. But you do have to be careful of posting such things before rulings are in. I had to request your last post be deleted.

Originally posted by Badabing
I may have to overrule this travesty of justice. mmm
Congratulations Digi.

Great battle, I didn't know that godzilla was such a beast. And seeing he-man made me smile about the 80s animation.

Great match guys.

Congratulations to both of you.

Digi won, but Leo lost more to an unfortunate matchup than to a superior foe (biscuits), so it's something of a win for both I suppose

Originally posted by krisblaze
Great match guys.

Congratulations to both of you.

Digi won, but Leo lost more to an unfortunate matchup than to a superior foe (biscuits), so it's something of a win for both I suppose

I wouldn't even say that. Leo had my vote right up until about post 4. Like I said I didn't buy He-man taking it in strength and he certainly lacked the durability. If leo hadn't so summarily dismissed the various sword of Grayskull attacks without really addressing them, he probably would have kept it (my vote that is).

Originally posted by Digi
Sure, probably; it's a good feat.

It's also a highly-relevant feat. It demonstrates how the Power of Grayskull adapts to defeat the Godzilla-like god of the Snakemen, Serpos.

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
It's also a highly-relevant feat. It demonstrates how the Power of Grayskull adapts to defeat the Godzilla-like god of the Snakemen, Serpos.

Yup.

oops wrong thread.