Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

Stats equalized

H2H

Who wins?

Goku wins via his techniques/abilities.

ehh..... what ?

Goku ki blasts Batman to oblivion

@ TripKawkens

1. Need clarification on what "equalized stats" means - Is Goku weakened, or is Batman brought up to his level.

OP doesn't say no ki.

If Goku is being weakened to Batman's level, then I would reconsider.

2. Batman cannot physically beat a significantly stronger opponent (e.g. Colossus) without prep/using environment/tools/PIS/CIS. He cannot win simply via skill in a H2H.

Raditz had a power level of 1500. Goku was 600 when they fought. In DBZ Universe, that level of difference means there is absolutely no chance.

3. Everyone one who beats Goku is both stronger and considerably skilled and well accomplished fighters as well. No one has ever outskilled Goku.

And if Goku is stronger, he often holds back when fighting to use skill alone and fight his opponents on their level.

For example, when he fought:

- Majin Vegeta
- Majin Buu
- Kid Buu
- Many other fights where he doesn't go FPSSJ/SSJ2/SSJ3

And some of these were battles that decided the fate of the Earth.

Originally posted by TripKawkens
Except that Batman already has beaten characters massively stronger than he is. New 52 Forever Evil had Batman beating Bane in hand to hand combat and Bane is now a class 20 character with a healing factor.


I used Colossus as an example to illustrate a significant and hopeless stat disparity. Bane while stronger is slower, and far less skilled.

If you want to refute my example, refute my example.

When someone's power level is 2x higher, basically they can stand there and tank all the free hits you can give. Bane doesn't even come close.

I don't think this is a Batman vs Goku "skill" thread. That would be interesting, but a different topic. Again, need OP to clarify.

No ki blast.

Its H2H.

Batman gets punched by a holding back Goku and gets blown to pieces. A better fight would be Batman vs Hercule and Hercule was class 50+. The guy was pulling buses with his mouth. How about this...Goku as a Kid would stomp. General Tao was strong enough to throw boulders around the world casually (high class 100 ft), kill humans with his tongue, this doesn't include him casually slapping bullets out of the air with his hair and hands. Tien was able to treat him like fodder (a class 100 with unmatched speed)...

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=iFEwJMrVtTk

Kid Goku stomps. Anything after this destroys with him a fart. DBZ is underrated. Goku was pushing around boulders bigger than Master Roshi house when he was a kid and Iron axes was breaking over his head. Had bullet proof skin and showed FTL reflexes and again, this was when he was a child. Kid Krillin stomps.

Originally posted by carver9
Batman gets punched by a holding back Goku and gets blown to pieces. A better fight would be Batman vs Hercule and Hercule was class 50+. The guy was pulling buses with his mouth. How about this...Goku as a Kid would stomp. General Tao was strong enough to throw boulders around the world casually (high class 100 ft), kill humans with his tongue, this doesn't include him casually slapping bullets out of the air with his hair and hands. Tien was able to treat him like fodder (a class 100 with unmatched speed)...

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=iFEwJMrVtTk

Kid Goku stomps. Anything after this destroys with him a fart. DBZ is underrated. Goku was pushing around boulders bigger than Master Roshi house when he was a kid and Iron axes was breaking over his head. Had bullet proof skin and showed FTL reflexes and again, this was when he was a child. Kid Krillin stomps. you didn't read the OP.

Originally posted by God Cloth Seiya
you didn't read the OP.

Stats are equal?

Originally posted by carver9
Stats are equal?

Strength, speed, durability, etc.

You all are literally dumber than dirt.

This is Goku and Batman with equal stats an hand to hand, so no ki attacks.

Batman knocks Goku out without much trouble in all likelihood.

Originally posted by carver9
A better fight would be Batman vs Hercule and Hercule was class 50+. The guy was pulling buses with his mouth. People have done feats like that IRL.

Goku wins. Pretty simple.

Originally posted by NemeBro
You all are literally dumber than dirt.


Me or Carver?

Originally posted by carver9
A better fight would be Batman vs Hercule and Hercule was class 50+. The guy was pulling buses with his mouth.
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=iFEwJMrVtTk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tls-Jli6eQE
Class 50 humans IRL, you heard it here first.

WHEELS: Better than Super Strength!

Originally posted by AuraAngel
Goku wins. Pretty simple. How does he manage that when Batman is a much better fighter than Goku is by showings?

Originally posted by NemeBro
How does he manage that when Batman is a much better fighter than Goku is by showings?

By Goku being much stronger and faster.

So no one read the OP except me and Nemebro? haermm

I read the OP. Stats equalized and H2H.

Does not change Goku winning by being faster and stronger.

Originally posted by AuraAngel
I read the OP. Stats equalized and H2H.

Does not change Goku winning by being faster and stronger. How is Goku stronger and faster despite their stats being equalized?

Originally posted by NemeBro
How is Goku stronger and faster despite their stats being equalized?

Goku can at a whim multiply his physical stats. Batman, as far as I know, cannot.

"Stats are equalized, fight is hand to hand"
"Goku is faster and stronger"
http://masonprof.x10.mx/chan/m/src/130389261124.jpg

nvm

Originally posted by NemeBro
nvm

The OP does not exclude transformations and typically the characters start in their base form. Based solely on the OP Goku would win.

English Majors care not for intent, only what is written. If the thread maker were to exclude the forms, thereby further gimping a character, then Batman would win.

Originally posted by AuraAngel
The OP does not exclude transformations and typically the characters start in their base form. Based solely on the OP Goku would win.

English Majors care not for intent, only what is written. If the thread maker were to exclude the forms, thereby further gimping a character, then Batman would win. In what way is turning Super Saiyan a hand to hand maneuver?

Because that is all that's seemingly allowed, per the actual text.

Originally posted by NemeBro
In what way is turning Super Saiyan a hand to hand maneuver?

Because that is all that's seemingly allowed, per the actual text.

In the same way that tightening your muscles is a hand to hand maneuver.

Originally posted by AuraAngel
In the same way that tightening your muscles is a hand to hand maneuver. By that rationale using Ki blasts to vaporize continents would also be allowed.

Originally posted by NemeBro
By that rationale using Ki blasts to vaporize continents would also be allowed.

Unless Goku was weakened to Batman's level. Regardless, the update called for no ki.

Aura might have a point with SSJ increase, because it would effectively imbalance their stats, but I guess it's just whatever.

Originally posted by NemeBro
By that rationale using Ki blasts to vaporize continents would also be allowed.

Well the thread maker later prohibited Ki blasts so one would figure those would naturally be disqualified.

If the OP or thread maker had said "no Ki usage of any kind" then I could see the argument. But I find it hard to believe that the thread maker wants us to exclude Ki manipulation as that is the basis for Goku's H2H combat.

Originally posted by God Cloth Seiya
Stats equalized

H2H

Who wins?

Why you nerfing Batman so much?

In a world where speed and strength are not stats.

Originally posted by AuraAngel
Well the thread maker later prohibited Ki blasts so one would figure those would naturally be disqualified.



H2H would already tell you that thier is no ki blast.

Originally posted by ares834
Why you nerfing Batman so much? What do you mean?

Had it just said hand to hand super Saiyan would be worth bringing up.

But a fight where the stips are equal stats obviously means nothing that goes against the stips and makes them not have equal stats as it defeats the whole point.

Originally posted by ScreamPaste
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tls-Jli6eQE
Class 50 humans IRL, you heard it here first.

WHEELS: Better than Super Strength!

That is completely different than what Hercule did. Just stop.

By the way, Goku stomps even with the stats being the same.

Who has he beaten with just hand to hand skill?

Originally posted by NemeBro
Who has he beaten with just hand to hand skill?

General Tao.

Originally posted by TripKawkens
He beat General Tao after getting a stat increase, not by out skilling him.


Come back when Goku beats someone who's faster and stronger than he is, until then he gets his shit pushed in.
Originally posted by God Cloth Seiya
Stats equalized

Originally posted by carver9
General Tao. Goku had a higher power level than Tao. He didn't beat him by being a better fighter.

Try again.

Originally posted by Sacred 117
You don't get it.

Batman has consistently beaten and taken on characters physically superior than him with his hand to hand skill.

Goku's track record in this regard is much less impressive. Maybe even nonexistent.

Originally posted by NemeBro
You don't get it.

Batman has consistently beaten and taken on characters physically superior than him with his hand to hand skill.

Goku's track record in this regard is much less impressive. Maybe even nonexistent.

No, I get it.

You already know why I'm really doing this. (Hint, hint)

Originally posted by TripKawkens
Batman wins a majority of his fights because he's more skilled than his opponents.

And because he has plenty of time to plan for them, but that's beside the point.

Batman just had a long fight against Nightwing that ended in a draw and he nearly got killed by Bane (Goku fighting skills poops on his) until Flash saved him. Hercule is one of the best martial artist on the planet (minus the DBZ characters of course and Goku called his skills basic and let's not pretend like Hercule doesn't fight Super humans. Goku stomps.

Let's switch this up. Batman had access to Superman entire powerset for months. He ended up fighting Bane would did well against him (who Goku would stomp in a millisecond) and Nightwing gave him a fight. Hell, Nightwing hurt him twice and with all the speed/powers Batman had, he was still unable to take Nightwing out easily without Nightwing gaining a couple of advantages. Kid Goku would stomp Nightwing with his eyes close. Batman still retained his skills along with a huge amp during all of this.

Originally posted by TripKawkens
99% of the fights are random, the only martial arts fight he ever prepped for was against Bronze Tiger and that was like 20+ years ago.

Like his fights with individual members of the Justice League? Riiiiiight...

wtf does stats is equalized mean? Anyone bother explaining? Because if they are equalized to the point of street level heroes then Batman probably has an edge. On the other hand if these guys have the strength to lift buildings and has the speed faster than sound then Batman's 3 bajillion and six mastered martial art forms aren't going to mean jack shit.

I'm going to assume it's typical human H2H. Probably Batman but Goku does have the best teachers he can get.

Batman was also weakening himself by staying in the shadows 24/7 and not giving his cells time to charge a fact he commented on after he noticed Nightwing hurt him.

Can OP clarify:

- Is Batman upgraded to Goku's stats, or is Goku weakened to Batman's stats?

Or are you intentionally avoiding answering this?

Originally posted by Placidity
Can OP clarify:

- Is Batman upgraded to Goku's stats, or is Goku weakened to Batman's stats?

Or are you intentionally avoiding answering this?

Goku's.

Originally posted by Lek Kuen
Batman was also weakening himself by staying in the shadows 24/7 and not giving his cells time to charge a fact he commented on after he noticed Nightwing hurt him.

He was still amped.

Originally posted by carver9
He was still amped.

Yeah but I'm saying he was clearly weak enough for nightwing to hurt him, not he got hurt because he sucks. since you brought up Goku fighting nightwing, difference is Goku would be too tough for nightwing to hurt.

Originally posted by carver9
What does that have to do with his fighting ability vs him being amped? Him being more ruthless doesn't have a thing to do with him being hindered in any kind of way.

They're saying that his actions proves that he was mentally unstable and out of his mind.

Batman stomps Goku per the Op

Originally posted by God Cloth Seiya
Goku's.

lol oh it's a troll. Regardless of troll, the topic idea was a good one.

Originally posted by Gennam
The funny thing is almost all of Goku's teachers taught him the same thing.

Roshi, Popo, Kami, King Kai, all of them trained Goku to become faster and stronger and not a single thing on technical prowess.

On panel sure but Goku's technical prowess is perhaps the best in the series. MSSJ Goku is stated to be weaker than MSSJ Gohan yet Goku put up a much better fight. Didn't look like MSSJ Goku was going all out either.

Originally posted by pym-ftw
Batman stomps Goku per the Op

Sure with writers jacking off to Batman. Logically with stats equalized Batman should never stomp.

Why? Most of Goku's techniques are unable to be used per the op.

"stats equalized" it mean this battle is "draw'' ? because batman and goku have same speed, strength, and power ?

Skill?

Derp

Originally posted by God Cloth Seiya
Goku's.

Goku wins then.

Originally posted by Utrigita
Goku wins then.

Exactly why I asked. Goku is far more experienced at that level than Batman.

If it was the other way round I probably give it to Batman.

Originally posted by Placidity
Exactly why I asked. Goku is far more experienced at that level than Batman.

If it was the other way round I probably give it to Batman.



The guy has learned Martial arts across the universe and his skills allowed him to keep pace with Frieza who was a million times more powerful than Goku when he was black hair.

Well yeah, compared to ki enhanced combat, human arts are considered basic.

Though I am curious to who Goku defeated with greater physical stats then himself?

Originally posted by BloodRain
Well yeah, compared to ki enhanced combat, human arts are considered basic.

Though I am curious to who Goku defeated with greater physical stats then himself?

Stalemate against Frieza.

Who has Batman defeated without his utility belt that's super human? I'm curious.

At which level?

Originally posted by NemeBro
You all are literally dumber than dirt.

This is Goku and Batman with equal stats an hand to hand, so no ki attacks.

Batman knocks Goku out without much trouble in all likelihood.

Because Goku wasn't trained by the greatest martial artist on Earth and then God himself.

Originally posted by Dramatic Gecko
Because Goku wasn't trained by the greatest martial artist on Earth and then God himself.



That, and this is equalized to Goku.

Originally posted by Placidity
Exactly why I asked. Goku is far more experienced at that level than Batman.

If it was the other way round I probably give it to Batman.



Completely agreed.

Originally posted by carver9
Stalemate against Frieza.

Who has Batman defeated without his utility belt that's super human? I'm curious.

Guy Gardner

Would anyone care if I bring up 'The Dark Knight Returns'? I figure it might be relevant information, but I'd like to hear from the thread starter about that.

Originally posted by Dramatic Gecko
So all that time he spent training in Other World, he decided to get stronger and faster only? You're fighting a loosing battle, Goku's a fighting genius, in fact he's the greatest martial artist in his universe and a master of Kung Fu. It will be an awesome battle.... but Goku wins in the end.



I'm trying to figure out where he thinks Goku received training since per his admission, Goku only honed his physical stats. So when did he receive Martial arts training?

Originally posted by carver9


I'm trying to figure out where he thinks Goku received training since per his admission, Goku only honed his physical stats. So when did he receive Martial arts training?

Well Kid Goku was already a Kung Fu master trained by his Grandpa.

Originally posted by Based
Do you even Dragon Ball?

And did someone use Batman's confrontation with Darkseid as a feat?

Batman used a super powerful gun that killed Orion and tried to use it but Batman died instead. When Batman brings down super powered people its because he's a genius. He brings them down because he has plans. Batman has no prep to speak of and its hand to hand. Which Goku is a genius at. As stated by Vegeta.

He was prepared for Superman for years, is unquestionably more skilled (he even trained Supes IIRC), fought him while he was weakened (meaning Batman was essentially at his level), and he still had moderate difficulty.

Granted, he's beaten Superman (and others) in more than one arc, he usually has contingency on his side. Here, in a spontaneous encounter, he doesn't, and he's in Goku's weight class.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not taking away from Batman (or Goku, so take a f**king hint, if you will), but he's not going to just seamlessly beat Goku.

Guys, please stop replying to socks. And I don't want to hear that people didn't know. It's obvious that when a junior member posts on end in a particular thread or forum that it's a sock.

And if some of you were wondering what happened to your posts, I deleted all posts from the socks and posts which quoted socks.

Originally posted by Badabing
Guys, please stop replying to socks. And I don't want to hear that people didn't know. It's obvious that when a junior member posts on end in a particular thread or forum that it's a sock.

And if some of you were wondering what happened to your posts, I deleted all posts from the socks and posts which quoted socks.

Oh... sorry...

Originally posted by Badabing
Guys, please stop replying to socks. And I don't want to hear that people didn't know. It's obvious that when a junior member posts on end in a particular thread or forum that it's a sock.

And if some of you were wondering what happened to your posts, I deleted all posts from the socks and posts which quoted socks.

Apologies, Bada.

Admittedly, yes, I knew obvious sock was obvious.

If it pleases the court, I'll be more than happy to point it out next time.

We have never seen Goku fight without powers, however Batman without powers has fought people much stronger then him, by default he wins.

Batman was beaten by Shiva. Shiva was weaker than Batman but out skilled him. Show evidence of Goku being out skilled by someone of similar strength.

Its hard to debate based of Goku feats being amplified by Ki.

I guess Goku vs Vegeta first fight would be the closest thing I can think of of being equals.

Batman would beat him 7-8/10.

In what world Goku is even on the level of Batman in skills?

Every world. Goku is superior in every way in martial arts than Batman.

And why exactly is that?

Originally posted by carver9
showed FTL reflexes lies

The problem we have here is that the only time Goku fights an equal is against a small genie that can mimic everyone of your techniques and learn Kung Fu instantly from experience. So he was Goku's skill level within five minutes. And they started biting each other... what was my point?

Originally posted by abhilegend
In what world Goku is even on the level of Batman in skills?

In the world of those who never read a Batman comic. I read both the DBZ series, and watched the animes in the 90 and read comics. With equal human stats, Goku get's his ass beaten. He is a skilled Chi martial arts guy and his training is about learning new ways to unleash energy attacks mostly, h2h is also good but no way on the level of guys like Batman or KK.

PC KK would take Goku 9/10 times btw even if they would have their own bodies.

goku is pretty good at adapting to knew fighting styles. Drunken fist vs crazy monkey...anyone?

Batman.

I'm assuming no ki blast means his other ki abilities such as instant transmission, Solar flare, afterimages, air dance are available?