How powerful is Cosmic Armor Superman?

Text-only Version: Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.



CatL18

CatL18
Do you think that power of the Story is ridiculous and useless?

Prof. T.C McAbe
As you said it was made to be invincible, to adapt on the fly against any threat. It is Supermans story which is indeed bigger than the writers and artist, because it is more famous, because Superman is an icon and will be remembered by more people than those who write about him.
I would put it on the top level where Morrison meant it to be, with concepts like TOAA and Presence and the Overmonitor.

quanchi112
Hyperbolic statements IMO do not make definitive evidence in the least.

CatL18
Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
As you said it was made to be invincible, to adapt on the fly against any threat. It is Supermans story which is indeed bigger than the writers and artist, because it is more famous, because Superman is an icon and will be remembered by more people than those who write about him.
I would put it on the top level where Morrison meant it to be, with concepts like TOAA and Presence and the Overmonitor.
Thanks.
Now, Why is CAS's concept treated as ridiculous?
Do they ignore statement?

Prof. T.C McAbe
Originally posted by CatL18
Thanks.
Now, Why is CAS's concept treated as ridiculous?
Do they ignore statement?

You are welcome.
First, you need to know who treats it as ridiculous. Mostly people who didn't read the story or people who don't understand it (it was rather complex and required some comic book knowledge) or people who simply hate DC or Superman in general.
They ignore statements and they don't understand what Morrison wanted to achieve. It is a story, don't take it too serious, simply enjoy it and don't care about those who don't, to each his own. ^^

Time Immemorial
Equals TOAA and such.

CatL18
This page insists that CAS and Mandrakk is only multi universal and weaker than Anti Monitor.

ttp://www.comicvine.com/profile/van_cere/lists/dc-tiers-list-finished/53871/

What do you think?

quanchi112
Originally posted by CatL18
This page insists that CAS and Mandrakk is only multi universal and weaker than Anti Monitor.

ttp://www.comicvine.com/profile/van_cere/lists/dc-tiers-list-finished/53871/

What do you think? Far weaker than that IMO. Hyperbole isn't proof.

CatL18
Originally posted by quanchi112
Far weaker than that IMO. Hyperbole isn't proof.
You seem to hate CAS, even Superman.

Bentley
Originally posted by quanchi112
Hyperbolic statements IMO do not make definitive evidence in the least.

The fact is that your hate just makes the CA stronger ahah

Prof. T.C McAbe
Originally posted by CatL18
You seem to hate CAS, even Superman.

He does, he stated numerous times that he hates Superman.

Anyway, in FC it was clear that the CA and Mandrakk are the very definition of good vs evil and the top of this kind of story. Good wins in the end, Supermans story is too big. They were both more than Multiversal, they were as big as you can be in the DC-Verse.

Sj_Sharp
Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
As you said it was made to be invincible, to adapt on the fly against any threat. It is Supermans story which is indeed bigger than the writers and artist, because it is more famous, because Superman is an icon and will be remembered by more people than those who write about him.
I would put it on the top level where Morrison meant it to be, with concepts like TOAA and Presence and the Overmonitor.

thumb up

CatL18
I know that strength of Cosmic Armor depends on how you would interpret Morrison's metafictional concept of Plot and Heroism.
So Some deny it, Other limitedly acccept it but treat him below Near Supreme Being like Lucifer, I can understand that. But it is not what I want to know.
If We accept and appriciate Morrison's interpretation of Plot and Heroism, How powerful does CAS become?

Mindship
How powerful? CAS is effectively an avatar, the unfettered will of the writer incarnated into the story, and able to dominate any and all fictional elements, including other characters. He loses a fight only if the writer chooses to lose.

At least, this is how I interpret CAS.

CatL18
Originally posted by Mindship
How powerful? CAS is effectively an avatar, the unfettered will of the writer incarnated into the story, and able to dominate any and all fictional elements, including other characters. He loses a fight only if the writer chooses to lose.

At least, this is how I interpret CAS.
Agree.
It is Deus Ex Machina which is incarnated to Plot and Concept of "Heroism"
So I think that no one related to Super Hero gene can stand up to CAS.

Astner
http://i.imgur.com/qGhXNyMm.jpg

I don't know man. The heat of ten billion suns messed him up pretty bad. http://i.imgur.com/wLOCL3c.png

Sj_Sharp
Originally posted by Astner
http://i.imgur.com/qGhXNyMm.jpg

I don't know man. The heat of ten billion suns messed him up pretty bad. http://i.imgur.com/wLOCL3c.png

No, the blood of the DC multiverse didn't do jack shit to the CA.

Prof. T.C McAbe
Originally posted by Mindship
How powerful? CAS is effectively an avatar, the unfettered will of the writer incarnated into the story, and able to dominate any and all fictional elements, including other characters. He loses a fight only if the writer chooses to lose.

At least, this is how I interpret CAS.

But even so the concept of Superman, his story which is the power source of the CA, without it it's just powerless, is bigger than the humans in our world. We are here and die one day, if we have children they will remember us, their chrildren maybe but after it we are forgotten, even if we write a book or two, we are insignificant. The Story of Superman will prevail and I think that this is what morrison wanted to tell us. Superman will always save the day, his story will always be there, even if insignificant humans like him or us are forgotten. It can't get bigger than a concept, an idea and this is what the CA represents, or better said Supermans story. Everything comes from Superman, as already said by Alexander Luthor. Without his appearance we might even have no Superheroes or if, they might have been differen't ones, no Hulk, no Spiderman, no Captain Marvel etc.

Galan007
Originally posted by Sj_Sharp
No, the blood of the DC multiverse didn't do jack shit to the CA. Meh, it's splitting hairs. The blood of the multiverse=the heat of 10 billion suns, and vice versa.

Regardless which verbiage you opt for, you're correct when you say that particular attack didn't cause any visible/lasting damage.

Mindship
Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
Superman will always save the day, his story will always be there... As the modern incarnation of the Hero archetype, this ^ pretty much sums it up.



http://25.media.tumblr.com/ac7e10e0dc42fdbe2b66a4ca87585e78/tumblr_mgef8zZuJi1rki2zmo1_400.gif

BeyonderGod
http://i19.servimg.com/u/f19/19/00/38/35/c_dat121.jpg
I wouldn't but him to
TOAA
The Presence
Mother of Existence
Pre-Retcon Beyonder level

But he does kinda beat LT unless anyone wanna give a reason because I like Superman but i ain't a fan of his but come on stating he is Multi-Universe is beyond slow level and Comicvine,Moviescodec, and or spacebattles down play because they wont admit who would honestly win.......
Thought Robot can beat Elder God Demonbane,Kami Tenchi,Lord of nightmares and Featherine

Thought Robot can beat Image Comics (-Mother of existence)
Thought Robot can probably beat The Living Tribunal
Thought Robot surely beats Lucifer+Michael,Mr.Mxyzptlk,Spectre (Probably beats The Word also.

But yeah it was pure plot which defeated TR.

cdtm
He's "beyond" all of those things, in the sense they all branch off out from him as a concept. No Superman potentially = no Pre Retcon Beyonder, Living Tribunal, or for that matter no Marvel comics (Without which there'd be no One Above All. They'd have to become common magazine writers/editors, or get another line of work. stick out tongue )

BeyonderGod
Originally posted by cdtm
He's "beyond" all of those things, in the sense they all branch off out from him as a concept. No Superman potentially = no Pre Retcon Beyonder, Living Tribunal, or for that matter no Marvel comics (Without which there'd be no One Above All. They'd have to become common magazine writers/editors, or get another line of work. stick out tongue )
Should explain more to what you mean.

CatL18
If Cosmic Armor is "metafictionaly" even above Presence or TOAA as people in here said, why do people put hiw below even Lucifer or Mxy?

CatL18
Sorry for double post.

But, i only want to know why there is huge interpretation gap about power level of Cosmic Armor Superman.
And,i want to know what made this huge interpretation gap.

cdtm
Really, CAS was a metaphor for the "idea" of comics. The whole "Superman Beyond 4d" story was all meta stuff.

In that context, Superman was probably the most powerful being in fiction. It's like the Greatest Fan Film Ever Made where Superman defeats Darkseid, Galactus, and some other guy I forget... He didn't do that because "power levels", he did that because he's to root of all super hero adventures.

SSJGGogeta
CAS is a plot device. He's essentially on par with beings like TOAA, The Presence, Lucifer Morningstar, Mr. Myx, etc.

CatL18
Thank you very much for your response.
I can apperciate that. I have been reading Morrison's works and his interviews.
So, i can understandreald metatextual importance of Superman in Morrison's stories and even comic culture and beyond.
And, without considering them, CAS is far bigger than Limbo which hold library holding a tiny book holding DC omniverse.
So,even if CAS's exact power depends on how we interpret metatextual things in Morrison's work, i can understand that CAS is super uber powerful as people here said.


What i still wonder is why most people discusssing CAS in all over the internet hardly refer to that.
I can't understand why anyone doesn't even refer to what is apparent in the story.
Do they ignore it? or Do they discuss without reading Superman Beyond 3D?

qwertyuiop1998
because some people can't or ignore that fact.CA superman in grant morrison's interview(even in story have mentioened)he and mandrakk is literally a plot device(or some sort),and this make all argument about CA superman power/versus some people been pointless,i mean how could anyway a story characters beating a plot device?or more deeply,argument CAS power this essentailly is meaningless

BrolyBlack
Yea

Astner
Originally posted by qwertyuiop1998
because some people can't or ignore that fact.CA superman in grant morrison's interview(even in story have mentioened)he and mandrakk is literally a plot device(or some sort),and this make all argument about CA superman power/versus some people been pointless,i mean how could anyway a story characters beating a plot device?or more deeply,argument CAS power this essentailly is meaningless
Since when did meta-textual inferences by writers become an acceptable substitute for feats? She-Hulk beating up her writer or Morrison drawing parallels between one of his villains and online piracy never made any of the events any more real.

qwertyuiop1998
Originally posted by Astner
Since when did meta-textual inferences by writers become an acceptable substitute for feats? She-Hulk beating up her writer or Morrison drawing parallels between one of his villains and online piracy never made any of the events any more real. well,because she-hulk is actually comics story character with some meta factors,and cosmic superman on the other hand,his purpose is a meta-character,from morrison's interview to even in comics said he is better story than mandrakk,your she-hulk expamle actually was similar to superman,because superman also know himself is a story character,even carving his epigraph "to be continued",but no one will take this feat to battle.
but cosmic armor superman was like morrison or yellow aliens those characters,these characters purpose from beginning is meta.not give this characters story to interactes with.
and i didn't say cosmic armor superman is invincible in forum battle,i just say use it is meaningless and pointless,this basically is depend on how do you think "meta"

Astner
Morrison taking inspiration from a blank page to come up with the Overvoid doesn't change the fact that the page itself isn't talking. It's still a fictional character, and no more real than any other fictional character.

Or in the case of Trano and Zaarn, or better yet: Mr. Mxyztplk being depicted to blow the ink and colors off the page in World's Funnest. It isn't a literal occurrence of the ink getting blown off the page. It's an impressive feat because he blows up the multiverse, but that's all we take away from it.

qwertyuiop1998
Originally posted by Astner
Morrison taking inspiration from a blank page to come up with the Overvoid doesn't change the fact that the page itself isn't talking. It's still a fictional character, and no more real than any other fictional character.

Or in the case of Trano and Zaarn, or better yet: Mr. Mxyztplk being depicted to blow the ink and colors off the page in World's Funnest. It isn't a literal occurrence of the ink getting blown off the page. It's an impressive feat because he blows up the multiverse, but that's all we take away from it. yeah,i agree them all just fictional characters,we shouldn't really take like mxy blows up pages or omniverse was including our reality in some marvel version,or like dr.manhattan observed our universe seriously.but we neither shouldn't separating characters meaning and writer's purpose.all in all,our so-called forum battle just us personally thought about characters,or more pricisely,just our understanding and imagination toward a writer's fiction,and some people forming a group,uses they rule to make this forum battle game could continuing(but different groups had different rules,like KMC uses like trans-tier,herald-tier,etc).so there shouldn't be an absolute codex about how to legit a feat.i mean,those just fiction to providing spiritual entertainment(so i always refuse to call characters like planet-buster,galaxy-buster those name,i thought it's really haven't entertainment spirit,we discussing characters i personally perspective it's kind of entertainment)
just don't twisting comics' original text and said myself rules and imagination was absolute correct.
and back to cosmic armor superman case,considering superman beyond and morrison's interview,we could see that character from beginning was to eulogizing superman's story,essentialy from beginning he was a meta-character,so i personally think that bring it to a forum battle were really meaningless and pointless

Text-only Version: Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.