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Both at their peak. Arena is the White House.

Jaina goes down hard

Thats what he said?

LOL. Zing.

Plagueis kicks her ass, yeah.

Honestly, do people just think its "cool" to contradict the results of expert Vs. videos? Here's a tip, it's not.

Jaina wins this one easy. Plagueis' duelling skills are below feeble. In a straight up duel Johun Othone could probably beat him. He's always relied upon his Force powers to win. That won't help him here as she can withstand everything he can dish out and her lightsabre skills are light years ahead.

Remember she beat Caedus (there were a lot of outside factors true) and he made Plagueis look like a chump by comparison.

Seriously? I don't think I rate Plagueis as high as some, but he was described as having very high speed, he trained Sidious to fight, and he dueled a dueling focused warrior specifically trained to beat him.

That's not my image of feeble, even if he does use the force to clinch the contests versus *strong* foes!

The question is whether or not we'd be able to recognize Jaina's corpse after this.

This is a very close fight but Plagueis would win.

I'm not seeing the very close here.

Jaina wont even be able to follow his movements

He outclasses her physically, technically, in the force, she'd get stomped

Originally posted by chilled monkey
Honestly, do people just think its "cool" to contradict the results of expert Vs. videos? Here's a tip, it's not.

"Expert"? Jesus Christ... facepalm

Anyway, I think it's a decent fight with Jaina holding a slight advantage in sabers. But Plageuis more than makes up the difference with his force powers. He takes this one IMO.

Originally posted by carthage
Jaina wont even be able to follow his movements

She followed Caedus's movements... So yeah, calling bull shit on that one.

Originally posted by ares834
She followed Caedus's movements... So yeah, calling bull shit on that one.

I couldve sworn she was amped when she fought Caedus (who is likely in the same speed tier)

Originally posted by carthage
I couldve sworn she was amped when she fought Caedus (who is likely in the same speed tier)

I think an argument could be made in the first fight, but certainly not in the second.

Are you talking about Jensaarai?

You do know he thinks Obi-Wan Kenobi can take Yoda, right?



Vat




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Originally posted by ares834
I think an argument could be made in the first fight, but certainly not in the second.
Wasn't he sort of not in the best condition when she dueled him last?

I'm pretty sure chilled monkey wasn't being sincere with that post...

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Wasn't he sort of not in the best condition when she dueled him last?

He wasn't. Which is why I never said she was a superior duelist to him only that she could keep up with him. Caedus, after all, amps himself with his pain so I'm doubtful he was slower than normal.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
I'm pretty sure chilled monkey wasn't being sincere with that post...

I'm pretty sure he was. He, after all, is a massive supporter of the NJO women.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
Are you talking about Jensaarai?

You do know he thinks Obi-Wan Kenobi can take Yoda, right?


What? I knew that he put Vader above Yoda but Kenobi as well?

Originally posted by ares834
He wasn't. Which is why I never said she was a superior duelist to him only that she could keep up with him. Caedus, after all, amps himself with his pain so I'm doubtful he was slower than normal.
That's fair enough, I suppose. Though I'm not sure where the limit on that lies.

Holy christ I just saw the video its ****ing awful.

He said that they're "Even" in the force lmao.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
Are you talking about Jensaarai?

Nope. EvanNova. Behold the inspiration for my thread:

3VnCShLHhCA

"They're pretty evenly matched as combative force wielders. Plagueis MAY have a slightly broader skill set."

Plagueis solidly. His force powers are too much for her.

Plagueis doesn't have any good TK feats. Jaina doesn't either but she tanked TK of Caedus who has TK feats rivaling Luke. So I don't see how Plagueis can take her out with Force.

In sabers again Plagueis has literally no good feats. Jaina fought 12 Slayers together with Luke and Caedus. One ill Slayer easily defeated Kyp Durron in comparison. And since then she improved farther by incorporating mandalorian training into her style.

Jaina takes this solidly unless someone can bring up anything even remotely comparable.

Not sure if serious...

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Not sure if serious...
Seriously. Give me at least one impressive thing about him apart from the ability to survive sever blood loss. He fought a featless Bith apprentice. He killed with TK a few non-sensitive mooks. Anything else?

I'll respond later when I have time if somebody doesn't beat me to it.

Get 'em, Emperor.

Originally posted by Arhael
Give me at least one impressive thing about him.

He can move imperceptibly fast to a droid that tracks blaster bolts.

Also, disintegrating armored Maladians.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
He can move imperceptibly fast to a droid that tracks blaster bolts.

Also, disintegrating armored Maladians.
Where does it say that that droid tracks blaster bolts? Regardless, that doesn't tell us anything, only that Plagueis is fast. Jaina is in the same speed league as Luke, so pointless bringing up speed topic.

As of disintegration, it is a common misconception.
"He stopped once to conjure a Force wave that all but atomized the bodies of six Maladians" - all but. It means you can imagine anything but atomization, thus no disintegration happened.

Even if there was disintegration, that doesn't tell much and in no way it puts him above Jaina. Argument like her TK did not disintegrate anyone doesn't hold, Yoda and Windu did not disintegrate anyone either.

Anything else?

Originally posted by Arhael
Give me at least one impressive thing about him apart from the ability to survive sever blood loss.

He's strong enough to punch through armored torso's.

Originally posted by Nephthys
He's strong enough to punch through armored torso's.
And Jaina can break even Mandalorian Beskar armor.

With?

Originally posted by Nephthys
With?
Shatterpoint.

Since you choose to attribute punching through armor to his strength, how does that put him above Jaina in combat or Force? It is another feat that hardly amounts to anything. When he fought Bith, he did not seem to enjoy any strength advantage, so how is it relevant at all?

Originally posted by Arhael
Shatterpoint.

Since you choose to attribute punching through armor to his strength, how does that put him above Jaina in combat or Force? It is another feat that hardly amounts to anything. When he fought Bith, he did not seem to enjoy any strength advantage, so how is it relevant at all?

Makes sense.

Its a significant advantage over her. She has no strength feats comparable. That Venamis could take his strength only indicates he was retard stronk too.

Originally posted by Arhael

As of disintegration, it is a common misconception.
"He stopped once to conjure a Force wave that all but atomized the bodies of six Maladians" - all but. It means you can imagine anything but atomization, thus no disintegration happened.

You're acting like almost atomizing someone with TK is not a big deal. It doesn't mean that you can imagine anything but disintegration. It means that it was just short of it.

Nearly atomising someone someone counts as disintegration.

He's lifted massive boulders to stack to escape a way to get out of the cavern on Baldemnic. He's forced Sidious to the ground, force choked Darth Sidious, and caused an earthquake when fighting the Maladian assassins, as well as disintegrated the assassins, had lightning that disintegrated the pirates on the Woebegone, and also spread over an entire landscape. What force feats does Jaina have to compare?



Too bad none of those Slayers moved fast enough to be perceived as a red bolt of lightning, knew Plagueis's style perfectly, and challenged Plagueis to the point where he had to use Battle mind to beat him. Has Jaina ever fought through hundreds of droids and dodged their blaster fire, gone through hundreds of Kursid warriors and emerged unscathed, or smashed through armored torso, snapped necks with her bare hands, or moved as fast as Plagueis?

Her duels with Caedus all had circumstances against him, she isn't fighting a near half dead fighter who is heavily injured and she doesn't have an amp.



People have listed feats here, and you have shown nothing that shows Jaina is superior to Hego.

Atomizing people with TK blast ? Shaking the ground with enough force to knock out highly trained assassins ? Force choking young Palpatine ? Collapsing a cave very quickly that even Tenebrous didn't noticed ? Using dual heart stun ?

Plagueis has very very good TK feats, he can even move microscopic beings with his TK as well, some people are forgetting that TK feats are not only about collapsing caves or moving spaceships, sometimes controlling tiny things requires great mastery of the force as well.

For example ; Dooku using TK on small knife from a significant distance, it is a good TK feat ;

qLgXoaEXlVM

Plagueis stomps.

Originally posted by Marco1907
Plagueis has very very good TK feats, he can even move microscopic beings with his TK as well, some people are forgetting that TK feats are not only about collapsing caves or moving spaceships, sometimes controlling tiny things requires great mastery of the force as well.


Its a standard Jedi practising technique to manipulate air particles. And Bane was manipulating sub-atomic particles in RoT. Hell, iirc Jaina herself was capable of creating light by manipulating atomic particles or whatever, as a child.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
I'm pretty sure chilled monkey wasn't being sincere with that post...

I assure you I was being totally sincere.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
I'm pretty sure he was. He, after all, is a massive supporter of the NJO women.

I was, and I am, very proudly so. Thank you.

Originally posted by Q99
Seriously? I don't think I rate Plagueis as high as some, but he was described as having very high speed, he trained Sidious to fight, and he dueled a dueling focused warrior specifically trained to beat him.

That's not my image of feeble, even if he does use the force to clinch the contests versus *strong* foes!

To be honest I was greatly exaggerating. Its undisputable though that Plagueis duelling skills are nothing outstanding.

Yes he's fast, but speed and skill are two different things. Training Palpatine doesn't really mean much by itself. Yeah, he gave him a foundation to build on and taught him the techniques but any fighter will tell you that just knowing the moves isn't enough.

Would you claim that whoever taught Michael Jordan must be as good as him?

Also he only beat that " dueling focused warrior" because of his strength in the Force. Same way he wins all his fights.

Originally posted by Q99
even if he does use the force to clinch the contests versus *strong* foes!

More like versus any foes. When has Plagueis beaten anyone primarily through swordsmanship?

And considering it's your area of expertise, what notable duelists (other than Caedus) has Jaina defeated? Also, does she have any good TK feats?

Originally posted by Arhael
It means you can imagine anything but atomization

lol'd. That doesn't even make sense.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
And considering it's your area of expertise, what notable duelists (other than Caedus) has Jaina defeated?

We could ask the same thing of Plageuis.

That wasn't an argument, I'm genuinely curious.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Nope. EvanNova. Behold the inspiration for my thread:

3VnCShLHhCA
Still beats Zannah vs Tholme by a longshot.

Yeah that video was awful too.

Originally posted by Arhael
Jaina fought 12 Slayers together with Luke and Caedus. One ill Slayer easily defeated Kyp Durron in comparison.

Have you actually read both of those fights and understand the context?

Please don't take this as a serious measure of their relative abilities.

If Jaina were still canon: Plagueis's (Windu's style-esque) fast-paced style and build would have some difficulty in overcoming her allusive acrobatics, as with Yoda.

Jaina is a Skywalker, so her power-level would be comparable enough with Plageuis to win.

So I do agree with his surmise, although Plageuis' omni-ranged telekinetic capabilties is what would give him a win if anything.

In fact, Jaina never showed the ability Vitiate and Plagueis had to disintegrate opponents, indicating his overall power level was more extreme. Plagueis could make more calculations to better utilize his TK than the video would indicate. Plagueis had greater Force speed as well. Honestly, considering their combat applicable Force powers, probably Plagueis more than not.

Originally posted by carthage
He's lifted massive boulders to stack to escape a way to get out of the cavern on Baldemnic. He's forced Sidious to the ground, force choked Darth Sidious, and caused an earthquake when fighting the Maladian assassins, as well as disintegrated the assassins, had lightning that disintegrated the pirates on the Woebegone, and also spread over an entire landscape. What force feats does Jaina have to compare?

Lifting boulders is nothing knew.
Flooring apprentice Sidious with TK? Nothing impressive. When did that even happen? Sidious was caught off-guard with Force choke by his own admittance, so nothing impressive. I can with same success give example of FotJ Luke helplessly getting pinned by FS of a random Sith but who cares.


Slayers were fast enough to be challenging even for Luke. I will point out that single Slayer defeated Kyp Durron. Jaina fought through countless Vongs, dodged and blocked their projectiles, which unlike blaster bolts cannot be perceived in the Force.
Perceived as a red bolt of lightning? Need I point out that it is just a hyperbole? Speaking of which Jaina dodged lighting, does it make her faster than lightning?


In final fight with Caedus she wasn't amped. While Caedus had only one hand, one-handed style can be as good as two handed style. Circumstances or not Caedus actually has impressive quantifiable feats. Plagueis did not fight any impressive opponents with good feats.


Useless feats.
Even if Plagueis did disintegrate those guards, that does not prove anything. As I pointed out Yoda and Windu did not disintegrate anything either, doesn't make them any less impressive. Apparently it's not a hard task to disintegrate considering that Zannah could do that even as 6 year old child.

Indeed, he showed himself well against non-sensitive assassins. Jaina defeated mutiple beskar covered mandalorians in comparison.

Also, killed half dozen Sith together with Luke on darkside nexus. Also, fought simultaneously and killed multiple Sith in Apocalypse.

What? Zannah's feat only disintegrated a child's hand, and she was like 12, not 6. Days earlier Zannah also defended herself from a storm that ravaged the planet's surface.

Plagueis conversely disintegrated 6 armored maladians. It's on a completely different scale.

Zannah also has one of the highest force potentials in history. Saying that somethings easily because she did it is like saying it's easy to levitate or block the Force Storm because she did it.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
What? Zannah's feat only disintegrated a child's hand, and she was like 12, not 6. Days earlier Zannah also defended herself from a storm that ravaged the planet's surface.

Plagueis conversely disintegrated 6 armored maladians. It's on a completely different scale.
Whatever scale. Again, how does it prove his TK is superior to her? It's unfair to compare TK of Jedi and Sith in such manner because Jedi do not disintegrate things.