Ultra Boy Vs

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riv6672
1. Thor
2. Hulk
3. Blue Marvel
4. Hyperion
5. Gladiator

1. Where would you rate PreDCnu Ultra Boy on the above list of MU characters? Does he nock anyone out of this particular top 5? Would he come in at 6?

2. Who could he beat in a no prep no BFR battle from same list?

krisblaze
tbh any of these would wreck him.

riv6672
Really?
He's supposed to have a Superman level power set, from what i was reading.
Guess you dont put him in this top 5 then.

krisblaze
He only has access to one power at a time, unfortunately.

riv6672
Well yes, thats his thing.
So, you arent disputing the power level, just the efficiency of his access to same. Thats cool.

krisblaze
Originally posted by riv6672
Well yes, thats his thing.
So, you arent disputing the power level, just the efficiency of his access to same. Thats cool.

Well I mean, he could certainly do some damage, but all it takes is one stray thunderclap or lightningbolt and he'd be dead, unless he just happened to be channeling speed or durability.

But even when he has super-strength he'd be way slower than all of these, Hulk included.

riv6672
Those are certainly valid points, just seems he'd have a lot experience fighting one power at a time.
He's usually shown to do really well unless PIS is needed.

I'm about out for the day, an appreciate the input. Hopefully some more people will chime in. This isnt a character we see a lot here.

krisblaze
Originally posted by riv6672
Those are certainly valid points, just seems he'd have a lot experience fighting one power at a time.
He's usually shown to do really well unless PIS is needed.

I'm about out for the day, an appreciate the input. Hopefully some more people will chime in. This isnt a character we see a lot here.

He's very powerful, but these matchup require him to fight so well and his opponents to fight so poorly.

I'd give him a chance against Masterson Thor or Savage Hulk in the comics (not KMC Hulk).

riv6672
Ah, given we're still dealing with a Kryptonian level character, experienced in the use of his powers, i call Huuuuge low balling on your part.
stick out tongue
Like i said, hopefully others will chime in, if nothing else, to say you're right!

DarkSaint85
Kris is so wrong.

beatboks
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Kris is so wrong. I don't think so. Huge fan of LoSH by really the fact that he can only use strength or speed or invulnerablity at a time is a weakness. Hr literally for example has to be aware or everything around him to endure an attack from a different quarter. Plus he almost NEVER fights solo , so experience CERTAINLY isn't helping him, he has none

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by beatboks
I don't think so. Huge fan of LoSH by really the fact that he can only use strength or speed or invulnerablity at a time is a weakness. Hr literally for example has to be aware or everything around him to endure an attack from a different quarter. Plus he almost NEVER fights solo , so experience CERTAINLY isn't helping him, he has none

Was kidding, I do actually agree with him.

carver9
Kris just doesn't like the Hulk. He needs to get over it. Savage Hulk would wreck Ultraboy, even in the comics.

cdtm
The way I see it:

Anyone who's faster then his base speed "should" win.

In comics of course, he never has that problem fighting Superboy, or switching to invulnerability after Karate Kid shows he's faster then his super speed mode.

But against someone on his base speed level or close enough to it, the pendulum swings the other way because he could keep using his super speed to dart around them and pick his shots.

Plus, there's the Kryptonian level heat vision. Even bricks like Wonder Man would be hurting at max power.

riv6672
Sifting through the now apparent bias and kidding around, i still personally think UB should be in that top 5.
Not fighting alone doesnt negste experience in using his Kryptonian level (a level considered nigh unbeatable at KMC) powers. Powers he can switch back snd forth very quickly.
While i dont know if that quickness has ever been timed, i know its faster than i can infer from the negative opinions here.

krisblaze
UB should be in a group of people who can consistently beat those who have access to all of his powers all the time? It's just not realistic.

Unless he has access to super-speed at all times (which he doesn't), then he won't be able to switch fast enough.

To put it this way, this guy can't trade a single punch. If he hits someone at the same time that they hit him, he dies.

Golgo13
Abhi posted some pics of Ultraboy taking on Wonder Woman.

krisblaze
Originally posted by Golgo13
Abhi posted some pics of Ultraboy taking on Wonder Woman.
Just the fact that you say "take on Wonder Woman" and not "anally humiliate Wonder Woman" is proof that he doesn't belong in this "top 5" smile

Golgo13
Sorry, it was a Martian and he has taken on Mon-El as well.

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/16400726/The_Legion_027-22.JPG.html
http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/16401493/The_Legion_027-23.JPG.html

krisblaze
Originally posted by Golgo13
Sorry, it was a Martian and he has taken on Mon-El as well.

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/16400726/The_Legion_027-22.JPG.html
http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/16401493/The_Legion_027-23.JPG.html
Yes, I'm well aware of the people he has fought smile

It doesn't matter though.

The fights are always very short, he's almost always the underdog who's surviving and he doesn't have the feats to put him in their league.

Kryptonian-strong is nowhere near Superman-strong.

Golgo13
Yeah, I'm not saying he's above those on the list, but he's not getting destroyed, other than Thor, IMO.

riv6672
@Krisblaze

Well, you saying feats dont matter snd low balling Kryptonians aside, i'm sticking by what i said.
Actuslly, you nade me think, his switching power must really be instantanious. Othereise, when HE hit someone, he'd dhatter himself.
And, this being KMC, he's fighting at yop form of course.

That said, i'm thinking he at LEAST boots Gladiator off the list.

krisblaze
Originally posted by Golgo13
Yeah, I'm not saying he's above those on the list, but he's not getting destroyed, other than Thor, IMO.
Isn't he?

He can't trade a punch here.

And the problem is that when he's channeling his super-strength he won't be fast enough to change to durability if they hit back.

Golgo13
Originally posted by krisblaze
Isn't he?

He can't trade a punch here.

And the problem is that when he's channeling his super-strength he won't be fast enough to change to durability if they hit back.

Why wouldn't he be fast enough? He's skilled enough to use multiple powers in a fight.

krisblaze
Riv, seriously

The feats I referred to do not matter because they're not something that would give him wins against anyone here.

If you actually READ the fights, as opposed to just saying "he's fought wonder woman", then you would see.

Originally posted by Golgo13
Why wouldn't he be fast enough? He's skilled enough to use multiple powers in a fight.

He doesn't have access to more than one power at a time.

So he has human reaction-time.

If he hits someone at the same time then his hand either shatters or he dies smile

riv6672
Originally posted by krisblaze
He can't trade a punch here.

Thats absolutely rificulous snd untrue, considering he's traded punches with super strong opponents since...always.

But i love it, opinions like yours beget good ones in turn! thumb up

Golgo13
He can switch between powers. Like he's done with Mon-El. smile

krisblaze
Golgo, are you slow or something?

Respond to the specific scenario that I posted.

What would happen if he punches Gladiator as Gladiator punched him?

Originally posted by riv6672
Thats absolutely rificulous snd untrue, considering he's traded punches with super strong opponents since...always.

But i love it, opinions like yours beget good ones in turn! thumb up

I'm saying LITERALLY trade a punch. Like hit someone at the same time they hit him.

riv6672
Originally posted by krisblaze
He doesn't have access to more than one power at a time.

So he has human reaction-time.

If he hits someone at the same time then his hand either shatters or he dies smile

So. Dumb.

Golgo13
Originally posted by krisblaze
Golgo, are you slow or something?

Respond to the specific scenario that I posted.

What would happen if he punches Gladiator as Gladiator punched him?



I'm saying LITERALLY trade a punch. Like hit someone at the same time they hit him.

He switches fast to speed, so Gladiator won't hit him

krisblaze
Originally posted by Golgo13
He switches fast to speed, so Gladiator won't hit him
As Gladiator's fist is hitting him? He'll switch to speed?

He switches from super-strength to super-speed at he's hit him, then to super-durability as Gladiator's fist connects?

All of this when Gladiator is faaaaaaaar faster than UB's base super-speed/his flight ring/base reflexes?

Golgo13
Yup. Gladiator won't know what him him.

krisblaze
Originally posted by Golgo13
Yup. Gladiator won't know what him him.

Even though Gladiator is much, much, much faster than him?

Golgo13
I'm just messing with ya, Kris!

krisblaze
Originally posted by Golgo13
I'm just messing with ya, Kris!

I haven't even had breakfast yet mad

Golgo13
Not my fault. shifty

riv6672
Originally posted by Golgo13
I'm just messing with ya, Kris!

I'm not.

Just to be clear i'm not calling Krisblaze dumb, just his reasoning/opinion.
He's actively ignoring how Ultra Boy actually fights.
If he were half as useless in a fight as Krisblaze is making him out to be, he wouldnt be one of the LoSH's mainstay heavy hitters.

He'd be in the Substitute Heroes.

abhilegend
Originally posted by krisblaze
Just the fact that you say "take on Wonder Woman" and not "anally humiliate Wonder Woman" is proof that he doesn't belong in this "top 5" smile
Really? You think this isn't humiliating wonder woman?

http://i.imgur.com/G63r00y.jpg

BTW that's Warworld's duplicate of her with all her powers. The duplicate of Superman overpowered Mon-El too so its not like they were weaker than originals.

krisblaze
So not the real Wonder Woman then? smile

Any of these 5 would destroy him.

abhilegend
Originally posted by krisblaze
So not the real Wonder Woman then? smile

Any of these 5 would destroy him.
Warworld constructs are likely as powerful as the original. Its Validus construct overpowered Superman with one hand, sinestro construct was said to be as powerful as original by Kyle and in the very same comic Superman construct overpowered Mon-El.

erm

And he overpowered a martian in Foundations pretty easily. And I am not commenting on this thread.

riv6672
Interesting scan.
Looks like trading blows to me.
Also looks like using powers in such fast combination as to give him the strength, speed, and invulnerability to catch a super strength punch without being pulped. Then hit back.

beatboks
Originally posted by riv6672
Thats absolutely rificulous snd untrue, considering he's traded punches with super strong opponents since...always.

But i love it, opinions like yours beget good ones in turn! thumb up

Please show a single feat of UB actually trading blows with anyone on this level.
That is a single feat of him striking someone while he's also dodging them. I can show several where he's been put down by people far below anyone here because he is focused on his super strength. I've seen KK put him down my timing his strike to hit when UB was using speed or strength rather than durability (something he can't do to either Superboy or mon-el all he's ever done to them is divert their attack).

An even more important thing is showing a scan of him facing anyone when other legionaries who have speed are t around. The reason is that a legion flight ring allows the wearer to fly at the speed of the fastest flight ring wearer near them. In every single fight UB has ever been in courtesy of the flight ring and fast team mates he can move faster than he will ever move in a solo battle here. The feats simply aren't transferable so please stop debating on an issue that it null and void. There was a reason I mentioned his team mates help, it's the fact that their presence gives him speed he would otherwise not have.

riv6672
Actually, you said he never fights solo, so experience in doing so was lacking.
Be that as it may, you're post is at least viable. The posts i've been disagreeing with have had UB low ended unfairly and unrealistically.
So, even though you asked nicely, no, i wont stop debating.

beatboks
I should have been clearer. The reason for stating it was for the speed the flight ring gives him (at least in flight) when he's near other legionares also wearing one who have speed. For example if wildfire is near who flies at speed without a ring then UB's flight ring allows him to fly as fast as him. When he's Ina team That includes Mon-el where flight is concerned he can move at Mon-el's speed even without using his speed power.

He quite simply operates at a vastly higher base speed when fighting along side his team mates then he would without them. His feats prior to the flight rings are virtually pitiful, many low end LoSH enemies could take him out. It doesn't increase his reaction but it does allow him to move faster by an immense margin than he would here in any solo fight without using his super speed.

riv6672
Originally posted by beatboks
I should have been clearer. The reason for stating it was for the speed the flight ring gives him (at least in flight) when he's near other legionares also wearing one who have speed. For example if wildfire is near who flies at speed without a ring then UB's flight ring allows him to fly as fast as him. When he's Ina team That includes Mon-el where flight is concerned he can move at Mon-el's speed even without using his speed power.

He quite simply operates at a vastly higher base speed when fighting along side his team mates then he would without them. His feats prior to the flight rings are virtually pitiful, many low end LoSH enemies could take him out. It doesn't increase his reaction but it does allow him to move faster by an immense margin than he would here in any solo fight without using his super speed.

Please dont take my rebuttal the wrong way, you're the only one really debating rather than low balling for lulz...
With no Legionnaires around, do you see it as possible under KMC "fight at best" rules that he'd augment his ring with his own ability to fly and move at speed?

Also, i've seen the KK sparring match. That was more a case if KK's usual high showings against Superboy level opponents, with some PIS thrown in (i did mention PIS earlier).
In no way am i discounting the match, though. Especially as UB did get one up on KK (something his equal level teammates have been hard pressed to do) by NOT switching powers. Turning his weakness into a strength.
UB is smarter than given credit for.

Prof. T.C McAbe
1. Thor, UB takes 3/10
2. Hulk, UB 6/10
3. Blue Marvel, UB 5/10
4. Hyperion, UB 3/10
5. Gladiator, UB 3/10

carver9
Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
1. Thor, UB takes 3/10
2. Hulk, UB 6/10
3. Blue Marvel, UB 5/10
4. Hyperion, UB 3/10
5. Gladiator, UB 3/10
6. HP Doomsday UB 7/10


thumb up

riv6672
Who let the Hulk clone in here?

Seriously, not a bad list from the Prof, though.

Prof. T.C McAbe
Originally posted by riv6672
Who let the Hulk clone in here?

Seriously, not a bad list from the Prof, though.

Thanks, even Carver agrees with it, even if he fails at a joke big grin.

beatboks
Originally posted by riv6672
Please dont take my rebuttal the wrong way, you're the only one really debating rather than low balling for lulz...
With no Legionnaires around, do you see it as possible under KMC "fight at best" rules that he'd augment his ring with his own ability to fly and move at speed?

Also, i've seen the KK sparring match. That was more a case if KK's usual high showings against Superboy level opponents, with some PIS thrown in (i did mention PIS earlier).
In no way am i discounting the match, though. Especially as UB did get one up on KK (something his equal level teammates have been hard pressed to do) by NOT switching powers. Turning his weakness into a strength.
UB is smarter than given credit for.
Not really, no. He should only get speed with the ring when he's using speed solo.
The best Legionare user of a flight ring by far was/is Dream girl. Believing her power to see the future was pretty useless she became quite the Martial artist and learned to use the ring offensively. Where most only used it to fly or as a comms device she used it's mentally controlled anti grav properties to emulate TK and used it with her will to create a hi grav fields around objects or people she wanted to move (like adversaries). UB and. Brinn (Timberwolf) used it most after her (in brims case to make his acrobatics even more impressive)

carver9
Can someone explain to me what Ultraboy has done to pull a single win against anyone here?

Prof. T.C McAbe
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/2/25838/490183-ultra_boy1.pnghttp://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20050408033733/marveldatabase/images/3/32/Vril-Rokk_%28Earth-616%29.gif
http://comiccoverage.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/09_adven368.jpg

carver9
Aaaahhhhhhh, so it's the outfit? Makes sense.

DarkSaint85
Why does Atom Smasher have a dong on his chest?

Prof. T.C McAbe
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Why does Atom Smasher have a dong on his chest?

Because Marvel and because he is gaaaaay

riv6672
Originally posted by beatboks
Not really, no. He should only get speed with the ring when he's using speed solo.
The best Legionare user of a flight ring by far was/is Dream girl. Believing her power to see the future was pretty useless she became quite the Martial artist and learned to use the ring offensively. Where most only used it to fly or as a comms device she used it's mentally controlled anti grav properties to emulate TK and used it with her will to create a hi grav fields around objects or people she wanted to move (like adversaries). UB and. Brinn (Timberwolf) used it most after her (in brims case to make his acrobatics even more impressive)

Firstly, i'm pretty happy with the list(s) that were posted earlier. At least a few people see my side, and this isnt worth ranting and raving over.
Second, i really appreciate your posts.
Third, on a different subject, i wanted to ask last night but you'd logged off: are you sure the rings work the way you say?
I'd never heard of this speed borrowing till you brought it up, which is no big deal. But last night i saw a scan of UB, Mon-El and two femsle members, one was Dream Girl i think, rushing somewhere.
The ladies were struggling to keep up, as the guys were in a tush. Shouldnt they all have been going the same speed?
I'll try and find it shsin, but it made me wonder.

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