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The Dark Lord who banks himself almost entirely on his force abilities against the Vong without the power they are most susceptible to. Can the Dark Lord pull through?

Fight takes place on the plains of Naboo. Twenty Vong warriors and one slayer.

Vong, pretty easily.

Can't really TK them anywhere, they're durable enough that they'd survive, or it would barely affect them. No lightning means he'd have to go into sabers, and they'd easily swarm him on that front.

He could still pull up chunks of the ground and hurl it at them. And I'm not quite sure how much damage it would take to actually kill Vitiate.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
He could still pull up chunks of the ground and hurl it at them. And I'm not quite sure how much damage it would take to actually kill Vitiate.

Yuuzhan Vong are fast, the levels of TK required to actually manage that, is beyond anything Vitiate has ever done.

Really? Pulling up chunks of the ground and hurling it at a great velocity is beyond Vitiate?

Vitiate gets humiliated

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Really? Pulling up chunks of the ground and hurling it at a great velocity is beyond Vitiate?

Yep.

Fast enough to kill Vong is hard bro. Vitiates best feat TK wise was collapsing the temple, and there wasn't really anything fast about that.

We're talking needing to throw massive, 10 meter wide rocks at 50 mph here.... Doing 20 at once if he actually wants to live.

I really think scores of Vong are overkill

Off nexus B1 Droids could likely stomp Vitiate

Putting him on a flat plain with nothing to hurl except the ground was pretty dumb.

Vitiate gets destroyed and fails to kill even one Vong

A lack of ability to defend against thrown bugs is a big problem. He's likely to be overcome in a simple volley of thud bugs.

Lmao @ Vitiate getting killed by bugs, thats almost as hilarious as Old man Bane getting stomped by mercenaries

Or Elderly Dooku and Rabid Maul getting trashed by pirates...

Either of those guys would kill Bane in combat

Originally posted by carthage
Lmao @ Vitiate getting killed by bugs, thats almost as hilarious as Old man Bane getting stomped by mercenaries

Thud bugs/razor bugs/etc. are real dangerous weapons, especially in quantity. Having them threaten strong Jedi is normal, since one can't sense them coming in the force properly, you have to rely more on pure reflexes and skill.


Jacen Solo was KOed by a volley of blast bugs.

A'Sharad Hett was taken down by a volley of thud bugs stunning him enough that an amphistaff bit him.


Jariah Syn hit a Jedi in the back with a thud bug (not as impressive, but illustrating the hard-to-sense-ness).

Do you think those bugs would kill Vitiate?

Originally posted by carthage
Do you think those bugs would kill Vitiate?

Either that or help give the warriors an opportunity to do so, yes.

Vitiate can TK away any ranged attacks the Vong use against him, and unless I'm forgetting something, can just TP the lot of them.

Let's not be silly.

He isnt on a nexus

Originally posted by NewGuy01
Vitiate can TK away any ranged attacks the Vong use against him, and unless I'm forgetting something, can just TP the lot of them.

Let's not be silly.

They're Vong, meaning force resistence. Telepathy isn't going to work at all. Even TK is going to be reduced, and there's enough that he's going to get attacks from different sides, staggered a bit.

Sith are force resistant too. He still dominates them.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
Sith are force resistant too. He still dominates them.

Sith have force barriers that can be battered down. Vong have a void in the force, the force goes around them.

For example, a good force user can hide their intentions from a weaker one when attacking, but a better force user can sense through it, but it doesn't matter how good your sensing is, you will-not sense Vong attacks coming unless you train to pick up an absence rather than a presence.

I see. If he put up a Cade-style Force Bubble, though, I'm not sure how they'd get past that. Of course, that would only grant him a stalemate, as he can't attack either.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
I see. If he put up a Cade-style Force Bubble, though, I'm not sure how they'd get past that. Of course, that would only grant him a stalemate, as he can't attack either.

I think the key here is whether to take his accolades seriously or not and use common sense. Vitiate's main ability onscreen is lightning but considering that he spent 1400 years mastering the dark side of the force, he undoubtedly knows/has a lot of force powers.

However, if we are to assume he is only capable of what he displayed onscreen, taking the lighting away is a big deal especially since he won't be able to use TK much in this setting.

Vitiate is a loser who can't do shit off nexus. He's just an old grampa.

#Carthage

Originally posted by NewGuy01
I see. If he put up a Cade-style Force Bubble, though, I'm not sure how they'd get past that. Of course, that would only grant him a stalemate, as he can't attack either.


Yea, a force bubble would be the right defensive move, if he makes the right call. Since it doesn't seem to be one of his go-to moves, there's a good chance he won't use one.

He's used one against T3 and HoT.

VONG SLAUGHTERHOUSE

Yelling about it won't make it happen. You're like 10 now you should know this.

I wasn't yelling I was typing you dimwit

We're gonna work on your manners when I adopt you.

You have absolutely no argument other than your usual trolling and yapping about nexus.

There is no nexus here tard, and there are more Vong who are force resistant in an environment where Vitiate is open and prone to attack

Unless Vitiate is a master duelist he is ****ed and would require time to charge, which a squad of bloodthirsty Vong wont grant him. The vong stuff a bug up his ass and he dies

I was referring to how you ignore all his feats with nexus argument, little one.

He can duplicate himself, giving his original body the opportunity to charge for a deadly attack. Also, he can summon other force attacks without charging as he did with his FLS against the strike team. He backed off the jedi with it and simultaneously charged for a following attack.

BTW, I never said Vitiate wins but believing that he would go down easily is stupid.

Those replicas can be taken out by an astromech....just saying. And Vong might not actually be phased by his "deadly attack." That Lightning actually did need to be charged. Twice.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Those replicas can be taken out by an astromech....just saying.

One of them was stunned by it. Thats it. Their entire purpose is to create that distraction for him.



He can keep going as long as it takes. Not sure if 20 of them would be too much to handle though. I don't really remember how many vong warriors were there to face powerful force users in NJO.




No it actually did not. He instantly summoned it the first time.

And assuming they all have their weaponry the clones get cut down. He is out of his element here and has no cover, once the replicas are down he'd have to charge his attack and then they'd down him. He has no recourse given he has to charge to do anything

Originally posted by carthage
once the replicas are down he'd have to charge his attack and then they'd down him.

And you think he would just sit there and wait while the replicas are getting cut down?

Originally posted by Sinious
One of them was stunned by it. Thats it. Their entire purpose is to create that distraction for him.

Except they all dissipate when hit.


You're acting like those illusions have actually lasted longer than a second each. Against the Vong who might not even see them or react to them, for all we know, they won't be helping Vitiate much. The fact that T3 can see them shows they might be detectable, but even then the HoT could have just pointed them out.

Not really. It actually took him time to concentrate it. He didn't instantly attack anyone.

Lmao those clones were killed by an astromech droid. Real powerful stuff.

And Vitiate was made to back off by one too. When it fired on him by surprise because he hadn't given two shits about it until that point. Just like the clone was stunned by T7 because it had run passed him without paying him any attention, letting him shoot it in the back by surprise.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Except they all dissipate when hit.


Again, that's the whole point.

Besides, he doesn't necessarily need them.



I thought we were talking about his force attacks? Not his duplications.






No, he quickly got his one hand up and forks of lightning occurred on top of the jedi which kept them all busy trying to defend against it and gave him the time to charge for another attack.

He is specifically gifted with aoe attacks and could do the same here. Again though, 20 of them might be too much especially since lightning is banned.

Originally posted by Sinious
Again, that's the whole point.

Besides, he doesn't necessarily need them.

Against, Vong? Yeah he will. He's got nothing else on his side here except Lightning, which he'll need time to charge. The Vong can phase through the illusions with ease, they have no use to Vitiate here anymore than they did with the HoT.

Hardly any of his Force attacks will affect the Vong. He'll need the illusions to use the one he actually has.

Actually it doesn't happen that way in the scene. It arcs around the corners of the platform, and he slowly moves it in towards the Jedi.

His only AOE is Lightning. The only single one actually shown sans ritual. Vitiate's done without it.

On a side note, why are we talking about Lightning then?

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Against, Vong? Yeah he will. He's got nothing else on his side here except Lightning, which he'll need time to charge. The Vong can phase through the illusions with ease, they have no use to Vitiate here anymore than they did with the HoT.


What? If they are no use to him, why does he need them?



Are you saying that the only actual force power he has is lightning?



Yes, his lightning surrounds them. Fast enough to lock them down before they can even get closer to him. And then he adds up even more lightning to the soup as he concentrates on HoT and Braga this time. There is no charging/prep here as much as you want to have it.

Oh and also, he did all this trying not to kill them. If he went all out, he could've done it even more casually.



As I said before:

Originally posted by Sinious
I think the key here is whether to take his accolades seriously or not and use common sense. Vitiate's main ability onscreen is lightning but considering that he spent 1400 years mastering the dark side of the force, he undoubtedly knows/has a lot of force powers.

However, if we are to assume he is only capable of what he displayed onscreen, taking the lighting away is a big deal especially since he won't be able to use TK much in this setting.

Originally posted by Sinious
What? If they are no use to him, why does he need them?


lol, I don't see how this semantics nitpicking is supposed to help your case; freshestslice is obviously saying that Vitiate would need his lightning to work to take out the Vong, but he won't get a chance to do so, because there are simply too many of them.



No, but even Kyp Durron, experienced with fighting the Vong and an infinitely superior swordsman to Vitiate, struggled against a single infected Slayer. Here we have one at full health, and twenty warriors. Vitiate is no Skywalker; he holds much raw power, but strip away his key fallbacks, and his combative ability goes to crap.



OK, let's say he could win with lightning; without it, there isn't really much he can do to pull himself out of a mess with 21 warriors that can kill himself at close range really, really quickly, given Vitiate's forgettable lightsaber skillset. He is not used to the Vong's force immunity; the time needed to recognize this and come up with adaptations alone might be too much for him to survive. He will have to improvise using the earth as projectiles, or something of that nature, and it just isn't going to be something he can do on the fly against 21 YV without warning or prep time.

As for offensive Force abilities outside of lightning the Vong would be immune to the vast majority of them. And I'm pretty sure the spirit of the OP is to ban any physical manifestations of the Force, whether you call it "force lightning", "force storm" or "blue flash of powerful energy".

Originally posted by Skybreaker
lol, I don't see how this semantics nitpicking is supposed to help your case; freshestslice is obviously saying that Vitiate would need his lightning to work to take out the Vong, but he won't get a chance to do so, because there are simply too many of them.

No, but even Kyp Durron, experienced with fighting the Vong and an infinitely superior swordsman to Vitiate, struggled against a single infected Slayer. Here we have one at full health, and twenty warriors. Vitiate is no Skywalker; he holds much raw power, but strip away his key fallbacks, and his combative ability goes to crap.



No, I actually didnt understand what his point was.

As I said earlier, I don't remember how many Vong were there to face them in NJO so I'm not sure what 20 Vong stands for.



I never said he wins. He won't go down easily though. His force defenses are quite strong and he can always leap around to avoid getting surrounded. Due to what you said here, I think Vong has a really good chance here but not as easily as you think.



I think he means FL and FLS. Not really sure though.

Didn't Krayt slaughter a ton of Vong warriors with just lightning when he escaped? If Vitiate had that ability then he'd take this comfortably.

Yeah... no lightning here... talking about it does not help determine a victor.

I have to agree with Nephthys on this one.
Spot on man!
Originally posted by Nephthys
And Vitiate was made to back off by one too. When it fired on him by surprise because he hadn't given two shits about it until that point.
Vitiate will go down hard, seeing as he was pushed back by a droid. His combat awareness is also negligible, given that "he never learned to mind his surroundings" batman

Vong win this.

Originally posted by Stigma


Vitiate will go down hard, seeing as he was pushed back by a droid. His combat awareness is also negligible, given that "he never learned to mind his surroundings" batman



At least Carthage can manage to be funny sometimes. Just saying...

Originally posted by Stigma
The fact that you thought I was joking only showcases your ignorance. Vitiate is no joke, man.

But Neph makes a strong case supporting Vong. If a droid can surprise and make Vitiate back off, imagine what Vong will do to him. He displayed lack of proper battle awareness that will be his undoing.

Because he was focused on the much more dangerous Revan. And he easily dealt with T3 anyway. In this fight, he'll need to pay attention to all these dudes.

Originally posted by Sinious
You overvalue yourself boy.

I don't ever remember taking Carthage seriously. His trolling only bothers me cause he spams threads with constant, stupid posts. Also what a lot of people are doing here is not allowing others to think his BS is what the majority thinks.

You embarrass yourself with this since I still haven't said Vitiate wins. Just disagreeing with your ignorant opinion which is Vitiate would get stomped here.

I wasn't even speaking with you. I was talking to Stigma who things the Vong will stomp Vitiate which is completely untrue?!

Originally posted by Nephthys
Didn't Krayt slaughter a ton of Vong warriors with just lightning when he escaped? If Vitiate had that ability then he'd take this comfortably.


Yes, he killed all the ones on the ship he was on, thought that would be going corridors and rooms and such, and after he'd had some good experience with them and knew their weapons and such.


I sincerely doubt that he'd run into a situation where he'd take on 20 without cover at once.

But Vitiate is vastly superior as a Force User to that version of Hett.

Bacteria?! Wtf is wrong with you, if I'm "bacteria" you're sub atomic particles. Vitiate is a vastly superior force user to Krayt, he has plenty of showings of his own power. He can kill these Vong with the power of suggestion, The TOR posters are right that his implied power is enough to kill the Vong. You need to get with the program here, you always run your mouth about Vitiate and you need to accept the fact he's the supreme god of prep

Look, you really need to stop trolling. Vitiate's showings with Lightning on a nexus show how powerful his other force abilities are. Vitiate is also supremely powerful. That means he is very good with a lightsaber and is incredibly fast, even though this has never held true enough anywhere else. I wouldn't be surprised if Vitiates TK actually worked on the Vong. Even if it has never been shown to be effective anywhere else at the speed needed to kill them.

I can't argue with TOR accolades, being supremely powerful already puts Vitiate (The supreme God of prep) well above other Sith. His ability to summon FLS storms of his own power, and kill entire dark councils and fight valiantly with a saber against HoT are all feats beyond anything accomplished by Sidious. Vitiate's prep and nexus feats mean he can take the Vong, and Sinious's conjectural postings are all supported by sound evidence

I created this thread with the intent of hosting legitimate discussion and debate, not trolling.

So, Stigma and Carthage, stop trolling or leave.

Vitiates lightning feat continues to disappoint IMO.

Just playing the Knight story, I'm reminded that Kira feels him waiting and gathering strength from the moment they set foot on the damn station, seriously, the guy had about half an hour to prepare an attack, why is it so special?

No one considers Xedrix super powerful because he nearly one shot scourge because we know that it was all a gathered attack. Why does no one seem to acknowledge that without lengthy time Vitiate couldn't pull that off either?

Originally posted by Selenial
Vitiates lightning feat continues to disappoint IMO.

Just playing the Knight story, I'm reminded that Kira feels him waiting and gathering strength from the moment they set foot on the damn station, seriously, the guy had about half an hour to prepare an attack, why is it so special?
Wait... really? Quote?

She says the Emperor knows they're there and she can sense it's a trap.

Kreia was expecting the Exile, Sidious was expecting Windu, Vader was expecting Luke. Dooku was expecting Anakin and Kenobi. The Son of Mortis was expecting the same duo and Ahsoka. None of their accomplishments count then right?

If it isnt clearly stated that the character boosted their powers with some kind of ritual or meditation, I don't see how it should matter. After all, half of the major fights include prep in it with your way of thinking. So do you have a quote like that?

Those were fair comparisons, considering they have hardly ever used prep and Vitiate always has.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Those were fair comparisons, considering they have hardly ever used prep and Vitiate always has.

To annihilate a planet or an entire dark council.

Oh and thanks for admitting that this is %100 your opinion and its worthless as it is based on pure assumptions.

Vitiate has literally always used prep. That's not an opinion. In fact, the entire point of the JK end game is that this will be the only time Vitiate doesn't have prep.

Ignore it all you want, but it's plain for anyone who actually wants to see it, instead of defending a character just because most people shit on him.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Vitiate has literally always used prep. That's not an opinion. In fact, the entire point of the JK end game is that this will be the only time Vitiate doesn't have prep.

Ignore it all you want, but it's plain for anyone who actually wants to see it, instead of defending a character just because most people shit on him.

He is uber prodigious. Surpassed every sith prior to him with Natemha and became immortal. He spent another 1300 years experimenting and draining for more power while he suppressed insanely powerful force users and groups including the dread masters. Also stomped Revan with no prep. You're right, its pretty obvious that he is a weakling who gets defeated by HoT when absent prep.

And I love how you ignore the fact that he was weakened when he faced HoT.

I like how that had nothing to do with my response.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
I like how that had nothing to do with my response.

You imply that there are things that suggest Vitiate isnt actually strong enough to defeat the strike team or HoT without prep while there are a lot of things that suggest the opposite.

Originally posted by Sinious
To annihilate a planet or an entire dark council.

Oh and thanks for admitting that this is %100 your opinion and its worthless as it is based on pure assumptions.

Scourge walks away without even looking because he knows it's coming...

Originally posted by Selenial
Scourge walks away without even looking because he knows it's coming...

And this is your proof?

Nope, you implied that prep didn't matter when all of his major feats involve prep. Then you compared to situations in which the possibly prepped parties failed, as if that was an indication that prep didn't matter, when prep was not even involved in those situations, many of which involved sabers, something Vitiate has never been shown using effectively. It's akin to saying prep doesn't matter because Revan beat Malak, ignoring that Kun could wipe out an entire species when actually using prep. It's nonsensical.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Nope, you implied that prep didn't matter when all of his major feats involve prep. Then you compared to situations in which the possibly prepped parties failed, as if that was an indication that prep didn't matter, when prep was not even involved in those situations, many of which involved sabers, something Vitiate has never been shown using effectively. It's akin to saying prep doesn't matter because Revan beat Malak, ignoring that Kun could wipe out an entire species when actually using prep. It's nonsensical.

When possibly prepped parties failed? Not sure what you're referring to.

I've never stated any of those things. You openly said Vitiate used prep every time he fought someone except for HoT. Back it up, prove it.

Originally posted by Sinious
To annihilate a planet or an entire dark council.

Oh and thanks for admitting that this is %100 your opinion and its worthless as it is based on pure assumptions.

Can't this be said for about half the things you say about Vitiate?

Originally posted by Selenial
Scourge walks away without even looking because he knows it's coming...

The most boss moment of the scene, IMO.

Originally posted by Selenial
Scourge walks away without even looking because he knows it's coming...

A child would have known what was coming. Theres no indication of prep at all in the scene and prep would be inconsistent with his actions anyway.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
Can't this be said for about half the things you say about Vitiate?

No.

I mean, you're taking a guy who's well known for being utterly helpless without his considerable Force abilities and pitting him against warriors who are immune to said Force abilities, and wondering who would win?

Originally posted by Skybreaker
I mean, you're taking a guy who's well known for being utterly helpless without his considerable Force abilities and pitting him against warriors who are immune to said Force abilities, and wondering who would win?



You left out the part where he needs a potent darkside nexus and prep