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http://www.comicbookmovie.com/images/uploads/THOR-The-Destroyer-02.jpg

vs

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/10/104362/1986867-movie_juggs.jpg

Takes place out in the middle of that small dessert town in the 1st Thor movie.

WHO WINS?

The destroyer

Destroyer was pimp slapping asgardians left and right. Juggy has no feats against such powerful opponents.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Destroyer was pimp slapping asgardians left and right. Juggy has no feats against such powerful opponents.

Agreed, the Destroyer wins.

The Asgardians he was pimp slapping have no strength/durability feats like Juggernaut aside from Thor.

For example, I can't see Lady Sif surviving Kitty's concrete bath, or Volstagg stepping on an APC and crushing it.

I see more of a stalemate. Juggernaut can't harm Destroyer since he's just a mutant in the movie with no extra powers, and Destroyer can't really put Juggernaut down.

At which point it would be a matter of who can last the longest and my money would be on the enchanted armor and not the mutated human that would still need to eat/drink/sleep etc.

I would argue that Cain doesn't need to breathe/eat/sleep, etc... since he never ever has. Buuuuuuuut FOX tends to f*ck everything up so I concede that point.

Oh man if Juggernaut could have showed up in a Marvel movie.

Originally posted by KingD19
The Asgardians he was pimp slapping have no strength/durability feats like Juggernaut aside from Thor.

For example, I can't see Lady Sif surviving Kitty's concrete bath, or Volstagg stepping on an APC and crushing it.

I see more of a stalemate. Juggernaut can't harm Destroyer since he's just a mutant in the movie with no extra powers, and Destroyer can't really put Juggernaut down.

Asgardians have been shown to easily push around cars. Even an average Asgardian farmer... who has also shown to be strong enough to easily bend a tactical knife. The Warriors 3 and Sif are top tier asgardians. Sif also proved to be bullet proof (at least against a shotgun) in AoS.

There's also a deleted scene of Volstagg easily lifting/tilting a car with one hand.

As for surviving the concrete bath, what do you mean "surviving"? Sif probably might not have been able to get out of it, but it certainly won't harm her anymore than it did Juggy. It didn't look like an offensive move.

Volstagg won't crush the APC because he's not as heavy as Juggs.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Asgardians have been shown to easily push around cars. Even an average Asgardian farmer... who has also shown to be strong enough to easily bend a tactical knife. The Warriors 3 and Sif are top tier asgardians. Sif also proved to be bullet proof (at least against a shotgun) in AoS.

There's also a deleted scene of Volstagg easily lifting/tilting a car with one hand.

As for surviving the concrete bath, what do you mean "surviving"? Sif probably might not have been able to get out of it, but it certainly won't harm her anymore than it did Juggy. It didn't look like an offensive move.

Volstagg won't crush the APC because he's not as heavy as Juggs.

So aside from Thor and Odin, even top tier Asgardians are still below Juggernaut going by feats.

Sif wasn't bulletproof as the blast clearly hit her armor. It made a loud "CLANG" noise and you could see the sparks from impact. Also she was blocking pistol fire with her shield. Why would she do that if she was bulletproof?

Do we count deleted scenes?

And by surviving, I mean it would have more than likely killed her as she doesn't have either the massive durability or insane healing Cain had to either not have concrete fused with his body while being phased into it, or just healed as soon as he broke free.

You realize to crush an APC simply by being heavy Cain would have to weigh in the multiple dozens of tons right? The first result for APC weight I found was roughly 12 tons. So he had to weigh considerably more than that going by your logic to simply step on it and crumple it due to his weight.

Juggs couldn't even beat Juno.

Originally posted by KingD19
So aside from Thor and Odin, even top tier Asgardians are still below Juggernaut going by feats.

Sif wasn't bulletproof as the blast clearly hit her armor. It made a loud "CLANG" noise and you could see the sparks from impact. Also she was blocking pistol fire with her shield. Why would she do that if she was bulletproof?

Do we count deleted scenes?

And by surviving, I mean it would have more than likely killed her as she doesn't have either the massive durability or insane healing Cain had to either not have concrete fused with his body while being phased into it, or just healed as soon as he broke free.

You realize to crush an APC simply by being heavy Cain would have to weigh in the multiple dozens of tons right? The first result for APC weight I found was roughly 12 tons. So he had to weigh considerably more than that going by your logic to simply step on it and crumple it due to his weight.

Still below Juggernaut by feats? Has Juggernaut survived explosions the like of which Destroyer's eye beams were creating? Has he proven bullet proof? I'm honestly asking, because I don't remember that much of X3. But I don't think he had that many feats, which makes me wonder how you can consider him automatically as superior to Asgardians.

Shotgun rounds spread out. Sif doesn't have armor all over her body. Sure some hit her armor, near her waist to be exact... but if that was the case then some shots should have still hit her leg where she doesn't have armor on. Besides, Loki proved himself bulletproof as well. And although he's technically not an Asgardian, it would be silly to think that he could have survived that long under Asgardian society without discovering he was different if his durability was that much different than theirs.

You're still neglecting the fact that Asgardians are strong enough to push cars around. Maybe it's not as impressive as Jugs flattening an APC, but remember that Destroyer took on 4 Asgardians and did so very easily. Juggernaut has no such feats going up against such powerful opponents let alone 4 of them. Sif also stabbed Destroyer through and through. Juggs again has no feats to compare.

As for that concrete phasing thing, this has been debated before. If your theory is correct and Juggernaut healed/pushed the particles out of his body then his clothes should have been shredded and the concrete around him should have had cracks all over the place due to the force of the expulsion. Since neither of that happened, the more realistic explanation is that the concrete simply formed around him.

Unless you can show proof of Kitty's abilities killing/crushing someone that's half-phased through a wall or something.

IIRC, While the APC was damaged, it was nowhere near being flattened and the damage was from the Juggernaut using it as a springboard to jump into the building so it's more his leg strength and not his weight that did it. remember he jumped out of his cage when Magneto freed him, which did no damage to the truck; if he really weighed dozens of tons how to you explain that scene?

Originally posted by FrothByte
Still below Juggernaut by feats? Has Juggernaut survived explosions the like of which Destroyer's eye beams were creating? Has he proven bullet proof? I'm honestly asking, because I don't remember that much of X3. But I don't think he had that many feats, which makes me wonder how you can consider him automatically as superior to Asgardians.

Shotgun rounds spread out. Sif doesn't have armor all over her body. Sure some hit her armor, near her waist to be exact... but if that was the case then some shots should have still hit her leg where she doesn't have armor on. Besides, Loki proved himself bulletproof as well. And although he's technically not an Asgardian, it would be silly to think that he could have survived that long under Asgardian society without discovering he was different if his durability was that much different than theirs.

You're still neglecting the fact that Asgardians are strong enough to push cars around. Maybe it's not as impressive as Jugs flattening an APC, but remember that Destroyer took on 4 Asgardians and did so very easily. Juggernaut has no such feats going up against such powerful opponents let alone 4 of them. Sif also stabbed Destroyer through and through. Juggs again has no feats to compare.

As for that concrete phasing thing, this has been debated before. If your theory is correct and Juggernaut healed/pushed the particles out of his body then his clothes should have been shredded and the concrete around him should have had cracks all over the place due to the force of the expulsion. Since neither of that happened, the more realistic explanation is that the concrete simply formed around him.

Unless you can show proof of Kitty's abilities killing/crushing someone that's half-phased through a wall or something.

If I recall, none of them were hit directly with his face beam. Merely splash damage. He never got shot, so there's no way to tell if he's bulletproof, but he's the Juggernaut. He might be a cheap knockoff of the real Juggernaut, but there's no reason why he shouldn't be.

I know how shotgun shells spread. But the distance he was when he fired wouldn't leave any room for spread. It was literally point blank. Or he could have been using slugs. Either way all we see if the round(s) impact her hip/leg armor with a CLANG and a spark and shake her a bit.

Again, if she was bulletproof, why was she blocking pistol rounds with her shield when she could just tank them? Her armors clearly bulletproof, though Sif doesn't seem to think she is going by her actions

. When did Loki show he was bulletproof? I don't remember that scene. And Thor certainly thought bullets could hurt him as he ran for cover when that jet opened fire on Hulk.

I'm not neglecting that fact. I'm saying that pushing around cars with some effort is < than stepping on an APC and crushing it due to the sheer strength he possesses. He doesn't have many feats, but the APC crush, and going through those very thick concrete walls with no problem as well as tossing Logan around like a rag doll makes me think he could do the same to them if he could hit them.

As for Sif stabbing the Destroyer...so? Her blade seemed to go through the segments in it's armor as Destroyer could easily change/heal itself, and it's been shown multiple times that Asgardian weaponry is very powerful. So that would be more a feat for her sword than her.

Yes, things like that should have been taken into account, but it's FOX and instead of getting an actual huge guy like Nathan Jones or the guy who played the Mountain, they put Vinnie Jones in a muscle suit. So they f*cked up quite a few things and didn't pay attention to others clearly.

And a majority of the characters in the movies powers mirror those in the comic, if not to a lesser or greater degree in some cases(Magneto for the former, Shaw for the latter for example). You have some FOX divergents like Havok. But their powers all for the most part work the same. That's shown in pretty much every movie.

And that is how Kitty's powers work in the comics. Read them if you don't believe me. She actually once threatened to phase half of Emma Frost's head into solid stone and told her just how painful it would be before she died.

Originally posted by Mindset
Juggs couldn't even beat Juno.

Well considering A) He literally can't touch her unless she wants him to, and B) His powers got cancelled out right before he got to her, I'd say the deck was kinda stacked against him.

I know how Kitty's powers work in comics. But as we all know, their movie versions don't exactly work the same way.

Loki completely tanked machine gun fire in the beginning of the Avengers when he was in the SHIELD base.

I'm of the opinion that high caliber bullets hurt Asgardians but doesn't exactly injure them. Thus Thor diving for cover and Sif blocking with her shield... even if they never really get pierced by bullets from what we've seen.

I'm not trying to prove Asgardians are stronger than Juggernaut (though an argument could be made for that). I am simply stating that Juggernaut has never taken on any opponent as powerful as Asgardians before. And Destroyer completely walked over 4 of them.

Originally posted by KingD19
Well considering A) He literally can't touch her unless she wants him to, and B) His powers got cancelled out right before he got to her, I'd say the deck was kinda stacked against him. That wouldn't have stopped The Destroyer. babby

Originally posted by Mindset
That wouldn't have stopped The Destroyer. babby

Lol well he's A) Not a mutant and B) in the same boat as Cain because he can't touch her.

Originally posted by FrothByte
I know how Kitty's powers work in comics. But as we all know, their movie versions don't exactly work the same way.

Loki completely tanked machine gun fire in the beginning of the Avengers when he was in the SHIELD base.

I'm of the opinion that high caliber bullets hurt Asgardians but doesn't exactly injure them. Thus Thor diving for cover and Sif blocking with her shield... even if they never really get pierced by bullets from what we've seen.

I'm not trying to prove Asgardians are stronger than Juggernaut (though an argument could be made for that). I am simply stating that Juggernaut has never taken on any opponent as powerful as Asgardians before. And Destroyer completely walked over 4 of them.

I pointed out that several characters had differences(Like Callisto), but a vast majority were exactly the same(if at differing levels). Colossus, Rogue, Wolverine, Sabretooth, Professor X, Quicksilver, Magneto, Cyclops, Iceman, Pyro, Multiple Man, Storm, Arclight, Mystique, Bishop, Warpath, etc... Far more people had their exact powers than didn't. So a case could be made that yes, her powers worked like in comics because we've seen nothing to say different. And her phasing someone wouldn't cause a solid substance like concrete to mold around them.

I just watched the scene. Loki didn't tank anything. His armor did. You can see it sparking up when they shot him in the chest, where he's shown to have armor. It even clanked from the impact of metal on metal. Every time they shot him, it was his armor. If he got shot in the face and it did nothing, I'd go with it. But it hit armor every time.

And a 9mm pistol round is not high caliber at all. Sif was blocking pistol rounds. Her armor took a shotgun round, her shield took pistol rounds. Loki's armor took assault rifle rounds. Thor ran from Vulcan rounds despite trading punches with Hulk and Hulk tanking said Vulcan rounds. So we can say Asgardian armor seems to be bulletproof to an extent, but Asgardians themselves haven't shown to be.

Originally posted by KingD19
I pointed out that several characters had differences(Like Callisto), but a vast majority were exactly the same(if at differing levels). Colossus, Rogue, Wolverine, Sabretooth, Professor X, Quicksilver, Magneto, Cyclops, Iceman, Pyro, Multiple Man, Storm, Arclight, Mystique, Bishop, Warpath, etc... Far more people had their exact powers than didn't. So a case could be made that yes, her powers worked like in comics because we've seen nothing to say different. And her phasing someone wouldn't cause a solid substance like concrete to mold around them.

I just watched the scene. Loki didn't tank anything. His armor did. You can see it sparking up when they shot him in the chest, where he's shown to have armor. It even clanked from the impact of metal on metal. Every time they shot him, it was his armor. If he got shot in the face and it did nothing, I'd go with it. But it hit armor every time.

And a 9mm pistol round is not high caliber at all. Sif was blocking pistol rounds. Her armor took a shotgun round, her shield took pistol rounds. Loki's armor took assault rifle rounds. Thor ran from Vulcan rounds despite trading punches with Hulk and Hulk tanking said Vulcan rounds. So we can say Asgardian armor seems to be bulletproof to an extent, but Asgardians themselves haven't shown to be.

Fact still remains that no Asgardian has ever been hurt by bullets before. Loki took an exploding arrow to the face. That's worth more than a bullet. Thor took a repulsor shot to the face, didn't even leave a mark.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Fact still remains that no Asgardian has ever been hurt by bullets before. Loki took an exploding arrow to the face. That's worth more than a bullet. Thor took a repulsor shot to the face, didn't even leave a mark.

That fact would be relevant if not for the other fact that no Asgardian has been shot directly before. Sif had her shield and her armor. Loki had armor. They didn't get shot in their flesh. Thor ran from Vulcan bullets. Asgardian Armor is bulletproof to a point. Asgardians as far as we know are not.

I don't see what the exploding arrow has to do with being bulletproof, but people survive explosions like jumping on grenades or landmines or IED's far more than you'd think. But the guy that survived that explosion more than likely wouldn't survive having half an M4 clip emptied into his chest.

Thor took one full strength blast to the chest plate. Another blast when Tony was boosted to 400%, and then the one where he got "shot in the face" seemed to be a much weaker beam probably due to Thor crushing the shit out of the gauntlet. It was more like a flare than anything. But I don't see what that has to do with anything as Thor is the most powerful Asgardian save Odin. It's clear he's levels above everyone else in every way.

Originally posted by KingD19
That fact would be relevant if not for the other fact that no Asgardian has been shot directly before. Sif had her shield and her armor. Loki had armor. They didn't get shot in their flesh. Thor ran from Vulcan bullets. Asgardian Armor is bulletproof to a point. Asgardians as far as we know are not.

I don't see what the exploding arrow has to do with being bulletproof, but people survive explosions like jumping on grenades or landmines or IED's far more than you'd think. But the guy that survived that explosion more than likely wouldn't survive having half an M4 clip emptied into his chest.

Thor took one full strength blast to the chest plate. Another blast when Tony was boosted to 400%, and then the one where he got "shot in the face" seemed to be a much weaker beam probably due to Thor crushing the shit out of the gauntlet. It was more like a flare than anything. But I don't see what that has to do with anything as Thor is the most powerful Asgardian save Odin. It's clear he's levels above everyone else in every way.

You are straw-manning here. There is far more evidence of Asgardians tanking earthly artillery unscathed than there is of them getting hurt by them. You have zero proof of them being hurt by bullets whereas they have survived bullets before. You claim it's their armor but you have no proof that ONLY the armor was hit. IE, shotgun round made a clang against Sif's armor but you have no proof that she wasn't hit elsewhere. Rapid fire made a clang against Loki's chest but it would be dumb to think that out of all of those shots none hit him in other parts without armor.

A grenade will tear up a person regardless of whether he survives or not. To claim that Loki can survive an exploding arrow to the face without a scratch yet be vulnerable to gunshot is baseless.

And if you keep going this direction, then we can also simply say that Juggernaut is also susceptible to gunfire because, you know, he has never shown he can tank gunshots.

We never actually see any Asgardians get hit elsewhere than the armor though. So you can't claim there's evidence of them being unscathed when they all wear bulletproof armor and never actually are shown getting shot in their flesh.

You're assuming they got hit somewhere else, but going by what was shown on screen, they were always hit directly on an armored surface.

You say I have no proof only the armor was hit. But I actually do. On screen we only see the armor get hit. Proof right there. You have no proof that they got hit anywhere else. If you do, I'll gladly look at it.

And again, there's a chance the guy was using slugs. Even if he wasn't, at that distance there's literally no room for bullet spread. The barrel of that shotgun was inches away from Sif when he fired. Have you ever fired a shotgun at something up close? I have. It just looks like a huge caliber bullet instead of the peppering you get from further distances.

I see some are using deleted scenes.

For Juggs, since not many feats and scenes we should use all we have access too.

In one of the deleted scene from X3, Storm KO juggernaut with lightning.

That energy beam of the destroyer would easily do the same thing.

In that same scene he instantly healed from getting Wolverine'd. And it actually makes no sense that the electricity ko'd Cain, but not Logan who has been knocked out by far less. Also, last time I checked, stone is a horrible conductor for electricity.

Originally posted by KingD19
In that same scene he instantly healed from getting Wolverine'd. And it actually makes no sense that the electricity ko'd Cain, but not Logan who has been knocked out by far less. Also, last time I checked, stone is a horrible conductor for electricity.

Ok so how does the fight go down in you eyes.

Destroyer is easily on par with him in strength.

He has him on ranged attack.

Juggs will charge? Lets say he somehow shruggs off that beam, and then gets in close, how does he put destroyer down?

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Ok so how does the fight go down in you eyes.

Destroyer is easily on par with him in strength.

He has him on ranged attack.

Juggs will charge? Lets say he somehow shruggs off that beam, and then gets in close, how does he put destroyer down?

Read back. I never said Juggernaut would win. I said he couldn't put down the Destroyer due to it being able to heal itself. And Destroyer couldn't put him down due to his durability/healing.

I called stalemate, then told Silent I conceded that Cain would need food/water/sleep, etc.. and would eventually get worn down if it went that long since he wasn't magic and probably wasn't as powerful as his Ultimate version which while still a mutant, was basically the same.

Originally posted by KingD19
Read back. I never said Juggernaut would win. I said he couldn't put down the Destroyer due to it being able to heal itself. And Destroyer couldn't put him down due to his durability/healing.

I called stalemate, then told Silent I conceded that Cain would need food/water/sleep, etc.. and would eventually get worn down if it went that long since he wasn't magic and probably wasn't as powerful as his Ultimate version which while still a mutant, was basically the same.

All good, stupid thread anyways. Both have retard showings

It's pretty unfair considering the only way shown to destroy the Destroyer is to make a feedback loop into his face hole when he shots his face laser.

And Cain has no way to do that really.

Originally posted by KingD19
It's pretty unfair considering the only way shown to destroy the Destroyer is to make a feedback loop into his face hole when he shots his face laser.

And Cain has no way to do that really.

I agree, its pretty much spite, you made a good argument for jug though, its commendable.