Exar Kun vs. General Grievous.

DARTH POWER

Originally posted by Emperordmb
A lot of people try to lowball Grievous by saying that he got beaten by Fisto, Koth (which he didn't), Gungans, and Ventress.

You're saying Koth didn't have the advantage over him until the Magnaguards joined in?

The magnaguards were clearly ordered to join in if Koth gains any kind of advantage and he did via Tk.

Even in Sabers Koth was fending off Grievous with a wounded arm. So yes Koth did very well in that fight given all of the advantages in Grievous's favor.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
These fights were all before his peak though. At his peak Grievous was throwing down with Windu, Maul, and peak Obi-wan, so I'm leaning Grievous.

Yes Grievous does do very well against all these high caliber Jedi/Sith in Pure Sabers. But they all defeated him with Tk.

ILS

What advantage did Eeth Koth have over Grievous aside from TKing him? And why would it detriment Grievous even if Koth was able to defeat him? Koth has no dueling showings outside of fighting Grievous - therefore Grievous' skill level would remain unchanged upon losing to Koth. It would be Koth who would be considered impressive.

And the point of Grievous using MagnaGuards on Koth was to capture him so he could send a message to the Jedi with Koth tied up. If he wanted to kill him he probably would have done so.

DarthAnt66

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
You're saying Koth didn't have the advantage over him until the Magnaguards joined in?

The magnaguards were clearly ordered to join in if Koth gains any kind of advantage and he did via Tk.

Even in Sabers Koth was fending off Grievous with a wounded arm. So yes Koth did very well in that fight given all of the advantages in Grievous's favor.

Yes Grievous does do very well against all these high caliber Jedi/Sith in Pure Sabers. But they all defeated him with Tk.
I feel your only goal and contribution on this forum is to try to hammer down on Luke and Grievous because of childhood tragedy experiences.

Arhael

Grievous solidly. Kun never faced such opponents. Grievous has too many dirty tricks in his baggage that Kun would simply be unaware of.

DARTH POWER

Originally posted by ILS
What advantage did Eeth Koth have over Grievous aside from TKing him?

Is that not enough? He had him floored with weapons de-ignited.

What exactly did Grievous manage to do to Koth who had the disadvantage of a wounded arm, and being intimidated by knowing he can't possibly win with all these Magnaguards surrounding him.

Edit- And LOL I just re-checked the fight. The magnaguards ONLY interferred when Koth was about to strike Grievous down:

@1:51-1:53
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1VHkNU8whzc

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
I feel your only goal and contribution on this forum is to try to hammer down on Luke and Grievous because of childhood tragedy experiences.

Nice rebuttal.

Unlike you I don't debate solely based on bias. If I did I'd say Maul stomps Windu and ROTJ Luke + ROTS Anakin stomp everyone except Yoda.

But unlike you I don't hide away from The Truth, in favor of my preferred truth.

ILS

If you're trying to argue that Grievous lacks lightsaber skill, then no, it's not enough. Otherwise it's kind of pointless to mention because Grievous isn't even a Force User.

Why does he need to do anything to him? It was a short, even fight, and Koth has no dueling showings to suggest that defeating Grievous would be a bad thing for the latter. And honestly, between Koth's inherent Force Shields, Zabrak resiliency, and his use of Crucitron, the blaster bolt would have had far less effect on him than most beings. Like I said, it's just impressive for Koth, and Grievous was trying to capture him anyway.

What do you actually hope to assert when debating Grievous? Because literally all you do is try to act like anyone doing well against him is an example of Grievous being brain damaged, and any example of Grievous doing well is BS or non-canon. You obviously just don't like the character.

DARTH POWER

Originally posted by ILS
If you're trying to argue that Grievous lacks lightsaber skill, then no, it's not enough. Otherwise it's kind of pointless to mention because Grievous isn't even a Force User.

When did I say Grievous lacks Lightsaber skill?

Originally posted by ILS
Why does he need to do anything to him? It was a short, even fight, and Koth has no dueling showings to suggest that defeating Grievous would be a bad thing for the latter. And honestly, between Koth's inherent Force Shields, Zabrak resiliency, and his use of Crucitron, the blaster bolt would have had far less effect on him than most beings. Like I said, it's just impressive for Koth, and Grievous was trying to capture him anyway.

Yes it was a short and even "duel" when Koth's dueling arm was clearly effected.

He takes hold of his arm a few times, showing it clearly was effected by the shot in the arm.

I'd take trying to "capture" an opponent over a wounded arm any day. Capturing doesn't prevent one from aiming for arms or legs. It only makes on weary of hitting their head. Not that there's any proof Koth was going to Murder Grievous himself anyway.

Originally posted by ILS
What do you actually hope to assert when debating Grievous? Because literally all you do is try to act like anyone doing well against him is an example of Grievous being brain damaged, and any example of Grievous doing well is BS or non-canon. You obviously just don't like the character.

What?

Koth was winning that fight with a wounded Arm before the Magnaguards interfered. I've never once suggested Grievous isn't a threat to anyone in Pure Sabers. He is and always will be a threat in Pure Sabers. But since he tends to get every advantage of Fear, Surprise and Intimidation on his side (like Dooku taught him to) it's difficult to appropriately rank him in that regard.

On this particular thread, I'd probably go with Arhael's opinion, that Kun has never faced anyone like him and has the disadvanatge (since it is Pure Sabers).

It's you who try to ignore or be blind sided or make up excuses for fights where Grievous loses. But try to make his high showings as his norm.

ILS

I didn't, but either you were going for that, or you were pointlessly pointing out that a non-Force User can be targeted by telekinesis.
Where did I say it wasn't affecting him?
Koth said later in the episode that he would gladly sacrifice his life to see Grievous dead. And you still haven't refuted my point that even if Koth was better than Grievous, it would be of no detriment to Grievous. The fight was inconclusive, anyway, as Grievous chose to capture Koth.
Again, pointing out that a Non-Force User can be targeted by TK is beyond pointless. The sabers portion of the duel was even.

Feel free to cite a few examples, we're all eager to hear about how biased I am.

DARTH POWER

Originally posted by ILS
I didn't, but either you were going for that, or you were pointlessly pointing out that a non-Force User can be targeted by telekinesis.

No, I was pointing out that Koth had him beat until the Magnaguards interfered.

Originally posted by ILS
Where did I say it wasn't affecting him?.

You seemed to be undermining how much a wounded arm could effect his performance.

Originally posted by ILS
Koth said later in the episode that he would gladly sacrifice his life to see Grievous dead.

He meant in terms of blowing up the ship they were on. That doesn't mean he wouldn't capture him if he had the chance, and would only be out for the kill when he engaged him 1 on 1. That's not usually the Jedi way.

Originally posted by ILS
And you still haven't refuted my point that even if Koth was better than Grievous, it would be of no detriment to Grievous. The fight was inconclusive, anyway, as Grievous chose to capture Koth.

Like I've said, the advantages mostly were all on Grievous's side given he had his magnaguards surrounding Koth the whole time.

Aiming to "capture" an opponent really isn't that detrimental for someone who would still be willing to chop off arms and legs. Wrists and arms are generally the easiest targets in a sword fight.

Originally posted by ILS
Again, pointing out that a Non-Force User can be targeted by TK is beyond pointless. The sabers portion of the duel was even.

Again, maybe you should learn to read the context of a post before you jump in on it.

I was purely responding to DarthAnt saying Koth never had Grievous beat. He did.

If you want to add context in to that defeat like Grievous wanting to capture him, that's fine. But like I've pointed out numerous times, the majority of that context was against Koth, not Grievous.

Originally posted by ILS
Feel free to cite a few examples, we're all eager to hear about how biased I am.

Oh, you made your Grievous bias very clear when you outright stated that you pretty much completely ignore his TCW depiction and anything Lucas says about him.

DarthAnt66

Your Grievous and Luke bias is stronger then Gideon's Palpatine wank.

DARTH POWER

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Your Grievous and Luke bias is stronger then Gideon's Palpatine wank.

You mean my anti-bias.

Yeah you're nuts. If anything I'm actually bias towards Luke.

Where did all you Grievous fanatics come to this forum from in the last year or 2, after TCW, George Lucas and Dave Filoni already made it clear Grievous isn't someone who eats most Council Members for breakfast the way say Savage Opress does.

Originally posted by I Am Not Done X
DP dies.

Bring it weirdo.

DarthAnt66

Bias can refer to positive or negative outlooks. And yes, I was referring to anti-wank.

ILS

Well he didn't really have him beat, he just TK'd him once, but I'll digress before you start talking about how Grievous was unconscious from the impact or something similarly retarded.
Not really. I listed three factors which would have aided Koth in fighting through the injury. So either counter and prove that those three factors are irrelevant or stop whining.
It shows that he has no qualms about killing Grievous out-of-combat, never mind in combat. Not to mention Jedi have no issue killing in self-defence, and with Grievous you can target any of his non-living frame without threatening his life. So there goes your nonsense about Koth not intending to kill Grievous.
Nobody is disputing this.
I wasn't even saying it was detrimental, but it does take longer because you have less options for striking, and Grievous' strategy had always been to have his MagnaGuards shock him into submission, which is logically a safer approach than capturing him in a lightsaber duel. Not that any of this really matters because you aren't even asserting any kind of point of debate...
He didn't.
And again, nobody is disputing any of this, but you're failing to really make a point.
I differentiate between TCW and EU/ROTS Grievous in terms of their physical abilities, but in terms of his skill he hasn't really changed.

I'm still waiting for an example of this, though:

ILS

Lol I have like two unanswered posts addressing this. You basically conceded that it was their opinion and not fact.

The_Tempest

fyi

It wasn't that long ago that DP wanked Grievous moderately in an attempt to lowball Fisto and the B-Team next to Obi-Wan.

But eventually he conformed to my view of things, as he always does.

Dance, my puppet. Dance.

ILS

Lawl.

He must be like Marco in that he has a hierarchy which determines how much he wanks characters.

The_Tempest

DP's a good guy, he just really hates that Sidious is a zillion times better than Maul and Obi-Wan. He tries to live in this artificial reality where Obi-Wan and Maul are like totes close to Sidious in "Pure Sabers" and Sidious is like totes threatened by the likes of Obi-Wan and Maul. Like, DP's pants erupt at the thought of a Maul/Obi-Wan vs. Sidious scenario where the duo don't die in less than ten seconds.

He's jealous. Jealous that Sidious is a lot smarter, stronger, faster, more powerful, more successful, and better looking than Obi-Wan and Maul combined.

But I'll break him eventually. I always do.

ILS

Holy shit he's going to burst a blood vessel at that.

DARTH POWER

Originally posted by ILS
Well he didn't really have him beat, he just TK'd him once, but I'll digress before you start talking about how Grievous was unconscious from the impact or something similarly retarded.

Koth was about to strike him, which is why the Magnaguards interfered.

Originally posted by ILS
Not really. I listed three factors which would have aided Koth in fighting through the injury. So either counter and prove that those three factors are irrelevant or stop whining.

No your making excuses to undermine his disadvantage.

I've pointed out more than once now that Koth kept rubbing his arm. His dueling arm at that. But your obviously ignoring that in favor of your usual Grievous wank.

Originally posted by ILS
It shows that he has no qualms about killing Grievous out-of-combat, never mind in combat. Not to mention Jedi have no issue killing in self-defence, and with Grievous you can target any of his non-living frame without threatening his life. So there goes your nonsense about Koth not intending to kill Grievous.

His comments had nothing to do with 1 vs 1 combat. Quit grasping at straws.

Originally posted by ILS
I wasn't even saying it was detrimental, but it does take longer because you have less options for striking, and Grievous' strategy had always been to have his MagnaGuards shock him into submission, which is logically a safer approach than capturing him in a lightsaber duel.

The fact that the Magnaguards never once interfered until Grievous was about to lose, PROVES that your grasping at straws here once again.

Originally posted by ILS
Not that any of this really matters because you aren't even asserting any kind of point of debate...

Actually it's you who seems to like arguing for the sake of it. Especially when it concerns Grievous.

I've said Koth had Grievous despite all the disadvantages he was facing.

You're just having a hard time dealing with the truth of that.

Originally posted by ILS
He didn't.

Yes he did. That's why the Magnaguards never entered the fight before then.

This is really common sense and quite clear from the scene. But as usual your pointless arguments are driven by your Grievous bias.

Originally posted by ILS
And again, nobody is disputing any of this, but you're failing to really make a point.

Well that is a result of debating with someone whose butt hurt and just looking to argue for the sake of it.

Originally posted by ILS
I differentiate between TCW and EU/ROTS Grievous in terms of their physical abilities, but in terms of his skill he hasn't really changed.

Lol at making ROTS Grievous and LEgends EU Grievous one and the same. Yet try to differentiate TCW Grievous from ROTS Grievous.

Your bias and denial of the truth is in pretty much every line you speak laughing out loud

Originally posted by ILS

It's all over your post laughing

DARTH POWER

Originally posted by The_Tempest
Correct. Arhael's been DP's silent mentor for some time. DP's just a little stubborn, he'll come around eventually. He'll concede that Sidious makes Obi-Wan and Maul look like week feebs.

You! Shut it mad

ILS

Would it be considered poor form to stop replying to DP? I seriously can't be bothered talking to him.....

DarthAnt66

Nah, I wouldn't hold it against you.

DARTH POWER

Originally posted by ILS
Would it be considered poor form to stop replying to DP? I seriously can't be bothered talking to him.....

I actually can't be bothered responding to your BS most the time, which you don't stop b****ing about:

Originally posted by ILS
Lol I have like two unanswered posts addressing this.

But nice attaempt in making me out to be the Troll here.

I'm sure DarthAnt will stand besides you. As will all the other Grievous fanatics who have still refused to accept his Canon power level.

ILS

The difference being you actually conceded that Filoni's opinion was not fact, by referencing that it as an opinion. You undermined your own argument before discontinuing the debate. At least in this thread it's clear to see you don't actually have a point to make so there's not much point in replying to you.

Arhael

Originally posted by The_Tempest
DP's a good guy, he just really hates that Sidious is a zillion times better than Maul and Obi-Wan. He tries to live in this artificial reality where Obi-Wan and Maul are like totes close to Sidious in "Pure Sabers" and Sidious is like totes threatened by the likes of Obi-Wan and Maul. Like, DP's pants erupt at the thought of a Maul/Obi-Wan vs. Sidious scenario where the duo don't die in less than ten seconds.

He's jealous. Jealous that Sidious is a lot smarter, stronger, faster, more powerful, more successful, and better looking than Obi-Wan and Maul combined.

But I'll break him eventually. I always do.
Yet another thread turned into Sidious wankery...

DARTH POWER

Originally posted by ILS
The difference being you actually conceded that Filoni's opinion was not fact, by referencing that it as an opinion.

So what? Your opinion is now greater/= Filoni's

LMAO.

Originally posted by ILS
You undermined your own argument before discontinuing the debate. At least in this thread it's clear to see you don't actually have a point to make so there's not much point in replying to you.

Yes because it's so difficult to grasp my point here isn't it:

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
You're saying Koth didn't have the advantage over him until the Magnaguards joined in?

The magnaguards were clearly ordered to join in if Koth gains any kind of advantage and he did via Tk.

Even in Sabers Koth was fending off Grievous with a wounded arm. So yes Koth did very well in that fight given all of the advantages in Grievous's favor.

Yes Grievous does do very well against all these high caliber Jedi/Sith in Pure Sabers. But they all defeated him with Tk.

How about you stop trolling me now please. Either continue to debate or don't. I know I'd prefer you didn't waste my time.

But enough of this:

"LOL DP TALKS NONESENSE, SO I DON'T NEED TO REPSOND TO HIM AM I RITE???!!"
bullcrap please.

NewGuy01

Another thread claimed for the truthbringers, you mean.

Marco1907

Originally posted by Arhael
Yet another thread turned into Sidious wankery...

ILS

Originally posted by Arhael
Yet another thread turned into Sidious wankery... thumb up

Nephthys

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
On this particular thread, I'd probably go with Arhael's opinion, that Kun has never faced anyone like him and has the disadvanatge (since it is Pure Sabers).

To be fair, GG hasn't ever faced a double-bladed lightsaber either that I know of, although I do believe he does possess Zannah's lightsaber in his collection. Still, Kun's lightsaber and fighting style is extremely unique.

DARTH POWER

Originally posted by The_Tempest
fyi

It wasn't that long ago that DP wanked Grievous moderately in an attempt to lowball Fisto and the B-Team next to Obi-Wan.

Wait... How would wanking Grievous lowball Fisto when Fisto had him beat? I was arguing at that time that Fisto beating Grievous isn't all that, because Grievous isn't all that. So I think you're misplacing me in a debate you've had with Arhael Iirc.

Me though, I've never had a particularly high opinion of Grievous since like ROTS.

Funny thing is my opinion of him is actually higher now than it's ever been. Filoni's comments on him defeating Jedi/Sith only through fear and intimidation, added to him actually defeating Kenobi in the unaired S6 arc makes me believe Grievous can actually be a threat to any Jedi/Sith (Edit -except Yoda and Sidious before you have a heart attack).

All he has to do is have those weapons of Fear, Intimidation (and possibly Surprise) on his side, like we know Dooku taught him all those years ago in the OCW and in LOE, and he will be a threat.

Originally posted by Nephthys
To be fair, GG hasn't ever faced a double-bladed lightsaber either that I know of, although I do believe he does possess Zannah's lightsaber in his collection. Still, Kun's lightsaber and fighting style is extremely unique.

You might be right. Kun was quite unorthodox, and the only ones using a Double Bladed Saber in Clone Wars era were Opress and Krell. But neither of them faced Grievous.

carthage

Tempest is desperate, if there isnt one thread mentioning Sidious he suffers from withdrawals and posts something about him anyway

Zenwolf

Ya know I just gotta question this....but people bring up this Unorthodox thing for Kun regarding saber skill.

But....the only thing I can note that would be Unorthodox is him wielding his double bladed saber one handed.

That is what people are bringing up right? Because....the guys he has fought against, I didn't see anything really unorthodox from him and those he fought were able to do well still despite this advantage.

DARTH POWER

Originally posted by carthage
Tempest is desperate, if there isnt one thread mentioning Sidious he suffers from withdrawals and posts something about him anyway

He's just seen someone is arguing with me so is taking the opportunity to jump in and try to get under my skin. I know as a fact he doesn't rate Grievous anywhere near as highly as ILS does (not since TCW at least). But he'd prefer to jump at me because I dared suggest Sidious can't speed blitz Maul.

Yep that right Sidious CAN NOT Speed Blitz Darth Maul. He's Not Capable of such a thing. He can only do such things to The B-Team level and below.

But the B-Team are complete amateurs next to "The Great Sith Lord Darth Maul" - as Count Dooku would put it.

The_Tempest

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Wait... How would wanking Grievous lowball Fisto when Fisto had him beat? I was arguing at that time that Fisto beating Grievous isn't all that, because Grievous isn't all that. So I think you're misplacing me in a debate you've had with Arhael Iirc.

Nah, you were talking about how Fisto had to cheat and had Grievous been using four lightsabers or whatever it would have been a different matter. Some such nonsense.

But you've learned. You please me. Your inevitable conversion to Sheevism will please me even more. excellent

DARTH POWER

Originally posted by The_Tempest
Nah, you were talking about how Fisto had to cheat and had Grievous been using four lightsabers or whatever it would have been a different matter. Some such nonsense.

Ah yes I remember what you're talking about now. Not quite my wording, but I was just compering the context of that fight next to Kenobi's in ROTS. Doesn't matter now that Grievous has beaten Kenobi once.

In any case I've never had a particularly high opinion of Grievous. Making excuses for his losses is the job of ILS and DarhAnt.

The_Tempest

You mean like how Maul is a complete amateur next to Sidious? 313

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Ah yes I remember what you're talking about now. Not quite my wording, but I was just compering the context of that fight next to Kenobi's in ROTS. Doesn't matter now that Grievous has beaten Kenobi once.

In any case I've never had a particularly high opinion of Grievous. Making excuses for his losses is the job of ILS and DarhAnt.

Indeed, as I said you almost always eventually come around to mythe proper way of thinking. It's just a lengthy process of gradually breaking you down and reconstructing you in mythe image of Truthiness. uhuh

DARTH POWER

Originally posted by The_Tempest

But you've learned. You please me. Your inevitable conversion to Sheevism will please me even more. excellent

Will Never convert. Will always root for Yoda over Sheev anyday, anytime.

The best thing Sheev ever did was train Maul. For that I give him some respect. For the rest of it, can't take him seriously enough with that Clear Pedophile look he has.

carthage

Like it or not the skill disparity between them is smaller than you think, the difference between them is Sidious has titanic force reserves. Lmao @ him being a complete amateur.

Indeed that rosy-tinted world of "Truthiness" where you can randomly pop into threads, berate users and then disappear.

Arhael

At least at beginning of TCW Ventress connected her lightsabers together sometimes.
Every personal guard of Grievous uses equivalent of double blade, so it is nothing new to him.

The_Tempest

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Will Never convert. Will always root for Yoda over Sheev anyday, anytime.

You will convert. It is unavoidable. It is your destiny.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
The best thing Sheev ever did was train Maul. For that I give him some respect. For the rest of it, can't take him seriously enough with that Clear Pedophile look he has.

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m1i5m6z2yY1qf78gi.gif

carthage

Kun's form was unorthodox for his time, it wouldn't be all that unique during the PT era. Maul would've been well familiar with Kun's form imo.

carthage

Ignore him Darth Power he only wants to troll in spite of losing the argument as well as lowballing Maul.

He is desperate like I said before.

ILS

Originally posted by carthage
Kun's form was unorthodox for his time, it wouldn't be all that unique during the PT era. Maul would've been well familiar with Kun's form imo. It's an aggressive variant of Niman, right? That's what I've come to understand anyway. Maul would be well equipped to deal with that.

Nephthys

His lightaber has also got a short hilt, causing him to primarily wield his double-bladed lightsaber in one hand, plus he constantly changes it's length and frequency.

Zenwolf

Originally posted by Nephthys
His lightaber has also got a short hilt, causing him to primarily wield his double-bladed lightsaber in one hand, plus he constantly changes it's length and frequency.

That didn't seem to trouble Vodo too much during their duel. He did hold his own rather well, despite facing a new weapon and supposedly unorthodox tactics.

At any rate, I see Grevious taking this, he has more advantages going for him than Kun does.

Nephthys

I found the info on Kun's saber again:

https://html2-f.scribdassets.com/78rip9go743d0leq/images/44-83c13b7560.jpg

And Vodo lost decisively, so I don't know what you're talking about.

Also I found that quote saying Kun is "the most powerful and dangerous of all Sith Lords." So thats cool.

ILS

That's actually pretty legit.

carthage

Yeah, a quote outright confirms Vodo had no chance

In the process he once more faced his former master, Vodo Siosk Baas, this time armed with a double-bladed lightsaber of his own construction. Master Vodo did not have a chance, and fell to his former student.
- The Dark Side Sourcebook

Zenwolf

Originally posted by carthage
Yeah, a quote outright confirms Vodo had no chance

In the process he once more faced his former master, Vodo Siosk Baas, this time armed with a double-bladed lightsaber of his own construction. Master Vodo did not have a chance, and fell to his former student.
- The Dark Side Sourcebook

Right, I didn't say that Vodo was going to win or anything. Just that he was able to hold against Kun for briefly.

Grevious though is a better duelist and has his own unorthodox methods to fighting.

Nephthys

Reading through some of these old Advent debates is pretty cool. She was a swell lady.

DARTH POWER

Originally posted by carthage
Like it or not the skill disparity between them is smaller than you think, the difference between them is Sidious has titanic force reserves.

That's true. All sources on Maul hint that in terms of Saber skill Maul's were unparalleled.

Nephthys

Except by Obi-Wan.

DARTH POWER

Originally posted by Nephthys
Except by Obi-Wan.

Says who?

Revanchiste

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7oGf-a1Dqlc

XD General grievous strengh is insanly augmented... Look grievous ships.. It made with impervium !!! And look the impact !!
But Kenobi where able to doge him at close combat.. Grievous always use his size to unleasg devastating attacks at long range....

The_Tempest

Originally posted by Nephthys
Reading through some of these old Advent debates is pretty cool. She was a swell lady.

And smoking hot too. Seriously.

The Merchant

Originally posted by The_Tempest
And smoking hot too. Seriously.

Pi-pics?

carthage

He'll just post a picture of Palpatine, and he isn't interested in women that comment is a trap

Arhael

Imho double-blade wielded in one hand is dangerous and infective. Weakness of double blade is that mobility is restricted because otherwise practitioner will cut himself with the other side of the blade. Also, speed and range of attacks is decreased due to restriction of movement. Wielding it in a single hand would be like Makashi practitioner without benefit of superior mobility with disadvantages of double blade on top of that. Maul's double blade offers wider grip than regular lightsaber, which gives much better leverage than regular lightsaber making attacks much stronger and giving advantage during saber locks.

Nephthys

And making him very vulnerable to having it cut in half.

carthage

IIRC he only adjusted his blade length once or twice, and Maul is faster than either Vodo or Ood Bnar so I doubt that would prove any advantage in a duel against Maul. Kun smashing through an entire wall of Beskar is a feat of strength rivaling Maul, so they should be fairly even in terms of strength. Maul is still faster and his integration of Teras Kasi and physical strikes (that have gone through wampas/broken durasteel droids) would do damage to Kun.

I think Kun could take TPM Maul, but I don't see him taking out TCW Maul or SOD Maul due to better dueling feats, superior speed, better physical showings etc

Sinious

Sidious solos this thread.

NewGuy01

If you check the KOTOR comics, Exar Kun's lightsaber has a two-handed grip (And seems much longer than in TOTJ)--Kun simply chooses to wield it as if it were a quarterstaff. If needbe he can adopt a two-handed hold as well.

The_Tempest

Originally posted by The Merchant
Pi-pics?

They used to be on her profile, not sure if they still are. But anyone from that era can verify. Lucien, Beefy, Janus, etc.

Arhael

Originally posted by carthage
Kun smashing through an entire wall of Beskar
What? How???

The Merchant

Happened in TOTJ apparently. Only read the SITH WAR so i can't say but I won't be surprised (sexually) if that turned out to be true.

NewGuy01

It is true, happens on Korriban, though Beskar back then really wasn't what it is today.

Sinious

Originally posted by NewGuy01
Beskar back then really wasn't what it is today.

Really?

carthage

Originally posted by NewGuy01
It is true, happens on Korriban, though Beskar back then really wasn't what it is today.

Is there any proof it got harder?

IDK. It's still a lesser known feat of strength for him, and it makes him stronger than Jinn, Bruu Jun fan, and nearly on par with Savage at least in strength.

NewGuy01

Originally posted by Sinious
Really?

As in, no sources to my knowledge introduced Mandalorian Iron as something that lightsabers couldn't destroy until years later. Multiple people in TOTJ dice that sh*t.

Not that it really matters, as it has been established as such now, but...

carthage

Yeah, iirc Nomi cut through a solid block of it somewhat in Ant's thread. Kun smashing through an entire wall of it is still impressive. I asked Ancient for the scan, but he never posted it.

The Merchant

Same. Although it makes sense Beskar is weaker during this time, gorgeous evaluation Newguy.

Sinious

Originally posted by The Merchant
gorgeous evaluation Newguy.

thumb up

though not as gorgeous as you.

NewGuy01

Just took another look, apparently I was wrong. The very page it happens on distinguishes Mandalorian Iron as lightsaber-proof. I'll grab you the scan.

carthage

post it.

The Merchant

Oh yeah that's right, Kun says "My Lightsaber barely leaves a scratch on them, it MUST BE MANDALORIAN IRON!"

NewGuy01

Sorry it took a minute, had to personally upload it. Here:

http://i59.servimg.com/u/f59/18/88/65/60/photo-11.jpg

I don't think this was the case with Nomi though, btw. It's an earlier comic and makes no distinction as what Nomi sliced through as something that is lightsaber-resistant. Moreover, she hasn't even learned to use the Force at this point.

Revanchiste

Originally posted by The_Tempest
And smoking hot too. Seriously.
That's because he has been damaged by windu (Does I need to recall 2003 = canon ! for this it was before the moovie !!!)

ILS

Originally posted by carthage
I think Kun could take TPM Maul, but I don't see him taking out TCW Maul or SOD Maul due to better dueling feats, superior speed, better physical showings etc I don't see any difference in skill between the two, to be honest, and TCW Maul doesn't really have better physical showings. Well, he has similar strength showings but his durability and speed was best shown during TPM.

The Merchant

While it's a good strength feat we need to know how much Bes'kar can endure physically. Being resistant to a Light-saber is being resistant to heat. Dunno the biggest Kinetic force that hit Bes'kar though.

ILS

Eh... a good point of reference would be Boba Fett's armor I would think, although I mostly have feats for him from his pre-Beskar days. He was still tanking missiles and having debris dropped on him, surviving head-first drops into wells, survived jetpacking through a Gorog head-on, and even tanked a strike from Vader head-on, without significant damage to his armor. He can also nonchalantly absorb blaster fire which has a fair bit of kinetic force behind it IIRC. And these are all pre-Beskar feats.

Kun would have to be pretty strong to bust through a wall of the stuff, I would imagine. He seems cool, I'm going to start reading up on him.

The Merchant

You're cool.

ILS

You're cool too.

carthage

I would hope Bobba's armor is of better consistency than the Death watch Mandos armor. I rewatched that clip of TCW Maul's fight with Pre, and right after that random female Mando dropped one of the other guys with a single blaster shot lol. Its supposed to withstand lightsaber blows, but a single shot from a small blaster dropped the guy? That's funny.

ILS

Yeah I know. And they had access to Beskar - their prison cells were made out of the stuff. Just TCW shitting on continuity as per usual.

Marco1907

Originally posted by ILS
I don't see any difference in skill between the two, to be honest, and TCW Maul doesn't really have better physical showings. Well, he has similar strength showings but his durability and speed was best shown during TPM.

I don't see TPM Maul stomping Savage Opress, beating Season 4-5 TCW Obi-Wan that ease (which was very close to RotS Obi-Wan), holding his own against Sidious, fighting against Mace Windu while Aayla was helping, stomping Grievous (physically as well), speedblitzing MagnaGuards.

TPM Maul should be at the same level with Savage Opress & (or Asajj Ventress) tbh, still TPM Maul would win against them in a good fight though.

ILS

Le sigh
I don't see TPM Maul doing some of that either, partly because it's fan-fiction.

Marco1907

Originally posted by ILS
Le sigh
I don't see TPM Maul doing some of that either, partly because it's fan-fiction.

Nah, partly because you like TPM Maul for some specific reasons.

Still denying his power up is kind of stupid tbh, we already confirmed this ;

http://i1273.photobucket.com/albums/y418/karasakal_teach/EkranAl1310nt1310s1310_zpse61685e0.png

And this ;

''Maul had grown more powerful since the last time he’d been in Sidious’s presence, but strong as he had become, Maul found himself in awe of Sidious.''
- Shadow Conspiracy Novel

Revanchiste

Originally posted by ILS
I don't see any difference in skill between the two, to be honest, and TCW Maul doesn't really have better physical showings. Well, he has similar strength showings but his durability and speed was best shown during TPM.

Skill level O.K But their is skill diference. Maul his great to make good an agressiv combos, like the ancient tiger method (pre-kung-fu one made by Kalarypayatt masters...) Exept that's this technic as been created to over power the ennemy and also use feints to place deadly punch in critical weak points.

Exar kuun is more opporutunist disturbing is foe and the strike hard.

He change light saberparametters more often than master chief found a new weapon on the battle field....

And where maul get the best pgysical abilities he got the light saber edge his weapon is perfect !!!!

The only way to escape Grievous in light saber combat is keeping in mind than he is not a force sensitive where Maul or kun can counter/block you even if you are behind.. That's more difficult for grievous..... The problem is than Dooku learn him how to focus on his opponent and don't lost him.. Keep him in his sight.

Not personal power? Sidious is gaining power from senator while allowing him to carry more power !! He gain power that's not skill strengh or etc.. And what does he did in the show? He gain the power to rule on mandalore !!! And before he gained influence !!! That's an othe rkind of power.

Revanchiste

Original moovie dooku win over TPM maul, just by a slighltly advantage :
Makashi against lighk saber staff. Maul light saber staff is a goo target for one who learn the technic base on disarming or cuting the opponent light saber. It was one the primary goal of a makashi duelist !!!

It's like you give to somone a massif arsenal of force pwoer and give to the opponenent the ability to private his opponement from this arsenal !!!

DARTH POWER

Originally posted by Marco1907
Nah, partly because you like TPM Maul for some specific reasons.

Still denying his power up is kind of stupid tbh, we already confirmed this ;

http://i1273.photobucket.com/albums/y418/karasakal_teach/EkranAl1310nt1310s1310_zpse61685e0.png

And this ;

''Maul had grown more powerful since the last time he’d been in Sidious’s presence, but strong as he had become, Maul found himself in awe of Sidious.''
- Shadow Conspiracy Novel

I actually agree a little with ILS on this (not his hate and butthurt of real canon though).

I don't see any significant difference in his physical stats. And his skill set in TPM era still seems better (probably because he's utilizing his full Saber skill with the Saber Staff).

It's like when the ROTS novel says Dooku is an even more powerful Sith Lord than he was a Jedi. I never took that to mean Sith Dooku is in a different league to Jedi Dooku. Just a modest all around improvement. Same with TCW/SOD Maul next to TPM Maul Imho. There's obviously a big difference in Tk, but everything else if say is a modest improvement tbh.

The only time his Physical stats seemed far superior was with his Monster legs. He stomped Opress with the aid of those legs which clearly would have given him much greater strength Imho.

ILS

I didn't realize that differentiating between two sources means you automatically hate one and love the other.....

DARTH POWER

You're going to honestly pretend you don't hate TCW after regular and recurring comments like this:

Originally posted by ILS
Just TCW shitting on continuity as per usual.

erm

ILS

So I automatically hate something because it's inconsistent?

DARTH POWER

And this:

Originally posted by ILS
Le sigh
I don't see TPM Maul doing some of that either, partly because it's fan-fiction.

^ Yeah clearly you're just differentiating between different mediums erm

ILS

I don't actually hate TCW that much, although it's obviously not my favourite source for SW. I just dislike when people act like it's an accurate representation of EU characters.

ILS

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
And this:

^ Yeah clearly you're just differentiating between different mediums erm

Dude, I was saying that Marco's interpretation of events was fan-fic, i.e Maul contending with Sidious, not TCW.

DARTH POWER

Originally posted by ILS
I don't actually hate TCW that much, although it's obviously not my favourite source for SW. I just dislike when people act like it's an accurate representation of EU characters.

It's actually TCW Creators who constantly questioned whether the Legends EU accurately represented Film characters. And the answer to that was often - "No."

DarthAnt66

TOR is higher then TCW is canon.

DARTH POWER

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
TOR is higher then TCW is canon.

Whatever helps you sleep at night.

DarthAnt66

Movies>TOR=Comics>OCW>TCW>TFU according to Ilsen Opern.

Emperordmb

LOL, that sounds like something LeGenD would say...

DARTH POWER

Originally posted by ILS
Dude, I was saying that Marco's interpretation of events was fan-fic, i.e Maul contending with Sidious, not TCW.

Oh.. embarrasment

DarthAnt66

Originally posted by Emperordmb
LOL, that sounds like something LeGenD would say...
It's Lucas approved. It can't get published without him. roll eyes (sarcastic)

DARTH POWER

Originally posted by Emperordmb
LOL, that sounds like something LeGenD would say...

Funny they named all non canon Eu after him.

DarthAnt66

ROTJ Luke vs Thor?

ILS

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Funny they named all non canon Eu after him. Why do you even frequent the "Literature and Expanded Universe" board if all you actually post is "Yeah well hurr that didn't happen in canon" or "*snip* let me counter your wall of text with this official canon statement from my almighty saviour George Lucas durrhurrudjicwn"

DarthAnt66

Lucas gave him anal last night.

The Merchant

lol

DARTH POWER

Originally posted by ILS
Why do you even frequent the "Literature and Expanded Universe" board if all you actually post is "Yeah well hurr that didn't happen in canon" or "*snip* let me counter your wall of text with this official canon statement from my almighty saviour George Lucas durrhurrudjicwn"

I'm sorry I must have missed the part where this whole board was named the "Legends" board.

Firstly I've been "frequenting" here for years so don't need lectures from retarded newbies like you.

Second TCW, SOD and even Rebels plus any new Novels and comics under the New Canon are still EU. But clearly you have a hard time grasping the meaning of EU even though you keep spouting out the words.

Thirdly like I said I've been here for years and the announcement that Legends is all Non-Canon only came early THIS YEAR. So it's not my fault you don't give a rat's ass what's actually Canon and just want to follow your preferred fan-fiction.

I can see your butt hurt up and down that Legends is all Non-Canon, that Grievous is not some bad ass Jedi killer like you could pretend once upon a time and that George Lucas, the creator of Star Wars, contradicts all your SW "knowledge" front and backwards and sideways. But what I suggest is if people who point out what's actually canon and what's not gets to you, then you should probably leave these boards and go back to where you came from (comicvine is it). There you can live in your own fanfic world and Pretend all you like that Legends is real canon, and that Grievous is still a Bad Ass Jedi killer, Darth Maul nothing but an assassin and that George Lucas's words have no meaning.

Oh and take DarthAnt back to your little fan-fic fantasy world with you.