Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

During TOR era Satele Shan was the grandmaster of the Jedi order and she lead the order through a great war. Satele as a grandmaster sacrificed everything in order to be the ultimate figure head for the Jedi order. She was a symbol for the entire republic and an effective wartime leader.

Yoda was also looked up to and was far more powerful than Satele but he became obsessed with finding Sidious and even willingly let the Jedi order get destroyed. Were he to face an enamy that wasn't hiding I believe he would have been more effective.

So how would history have played out if Yoda was the Grandmaster during Sateles time and Satele was the Grandmaster during Yoda's time?

The difference between their respective situations is a bit substantial, In her time, Satele had a target to rally the other Jedi against, the war was between The Order and the Emperor. In Yoda's time, the sith were a shadow, The enemy that the Jedi faced was cover - a plot, someone with whom they could direct their attentions to, while the true plot was hatched by Sheev. Though, seeing as how she hid her son from the order, I don't think Satele would be that much better as the leader of the Jedi Order as she herself has broken the code and lied to the order. Though, she'd be a better military leader imo

Hiding ones son and saying "Jedi win because we can become ghosts" are two entirely different situations

Originally posted by WildBantha88
Hiding ones son and saying "Jedi win because we can become ghosts" are two entirely different situations

A decent point, but it doesn't change the fact that Satele was willing to lie to the order in order(hewhewhew) to cover her tracks. Though who knows, if she'll become/is like yoda. Like i said, she is a nice Military leader and her foresight would be a huge factor in the war as well.

She'd be deceived as Yoda was and would have died against Sidious.

She lied to the order in order ( hewhewhew) to keep the image that the entire republic looked up to clear. If her image got corrupted that by something like a son, the order and republic might suffer. She lied for the orders sake and she didn't do it lightly.

She would have been killed by Dooku on Geonosis.

http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/736x/02/22/9c/02229c6a6ad0223983ac51ed4c5fc367.jpg

She would die against Sidious and Luke would have an even worse teacher.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
She would have been killed by Dooku on Geonosis.

*snip
Actually that's much better.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
She would have been killed by Dooku on Geonosis.

She would've been stomped by a B1 droid.

Malgus would have died on Alderaan and then Vitiate would have gotten his ass kicked much sooner. Sidious would stomp Satele, though.

Holy fallacy of a predetermined outcome Batman.

The only certain outcome to them switching would be that yoda has malcoms child in shans place, and raises it out in the open as a divine beacon of light that unites jedi and sith in a glorious union.

Its really the only logical outcome to the scenerio, anything else would just be wild assumptions.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
She would have been killed by Dooku on Geonosis.

http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/736x/02/22/9c/02229c6a6ad0223983ac51ed4c5fc367.jpg

Pretty much, lol.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
She would have been killed by Dooku on Geonosis.

http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/736x/02/22/9c/02229c6a6ad0223983ac51ed4c5fc367.jpg honestly the fight could go either way by I would be backing satele

I'm sure Satele couldn't have been as stupid as Yoda was during the Clone Wars. She may have put the pieces together better than him.

Satele would be dead, so I'm sure she wouldn't even have the chance.

Satele Shan is really underrated it seems.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Satele would be dead, so I'm sure she wouldn't even have the chance.

I think Satele could take a Dooku who was already tired from fighting Anakin and Obi-Wan, personally. Of course, she's not Yoda level, but she is Dooku level.

Originally posted by Nephthys
I think Satele could take a Dooku who was already tired from fighting Anakin and Obi-Wan, personally. Of course, she's not Yoda level, but she is Dooku level.
No she really isn't. No fight with AotC Anakin and Obi-Wan would make Dooku tired enough to lose to Satele.

Crushing and blowing apart Hex droids, shattering blast doors, palming a lightsaber and hadoukening Malgus into a cliff-face, matching Malgus' strength and blitzing Sith Warriors are all Dooku level feats in my book.

Not saying she's 100% equal to him or would win straight up, just that she's on his level.

Originally posted by Nephthys
I'm sure Satele couldn't have been as stupid as Yoda was during the Clone Wars. She may have put the pieces together better than him.

Yoda wasn't really that dumb during the Clone Wars. As was blatantly stated in the ROTS novel 'The reason why Palpatine wasn't a suspect is because he already controls the Republic'. And 'Without Palpatine the Republic would fall'.

Removing Palpatine from office would have been perceived by the Senate as a Coup de at, hell they even say that they need to take control of the Senate after they arrest him.

Satele also didn't notice the First Son of the Emperor sitting on her goddamned Council with the Force unclouded. Yoda would have been able to detect him imo.
As for this thread:
If Yoda were GM during TOR he'd likely have gone to face Vitiate instead of Tol Braga, then would have STOMPED him. War over.

Also his Battle Mediation would have likely turned the tide of the war earlier. Darth Malgus would be dead, as would Angral, and probably Baras.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Crushing and blowing apart Hex droids, shattering blast doors, palming a lightsaber and hadoukening Malgus into a cliff-face, matching Malgus' strength and blitzing Sith Warriors are all Dooku level feats in my book.

Not saying she's 100% equal to him or would win straight up, just that she's on his level.
You are giving too much concession here.

Satele Shan certainly have the power and talents to handle Count Dooku.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Satele also didn't notice the First Son of the Emperor sitting on her goddamned Council with the Force unclouded. Yoda would have been able to detect him imo.
Based on?

Originally posted by Lord Stark
As for this thread:
If Yoda were GM during TOR he'd likely have gone to face Vitiate instead of Tol Braga, then would have STOMPED him. War over.
You think that Emperor is a joke?

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Also his Battle Mediation would have likely turned the tide of the war earlier. Darth Malgus would be dead, as would Angral, and probably Baras.
So Yoda would just solo the entire Sith Empire? Nice.

Originally posted by Lord Stark
Yoda wasn't really that dumb during the Clone Wars. As was blatantly stated in the ROTS novel 'The reason why Palpatine wasn't a suspect is because he already controls the Republic'. And 'Without Palpatine the Republic would fall'.

Yes. That's stupid. Especially when Dooku explicitly told them that Sidious controlled the Republic and the Senate in AotC. They're just sticking they're fingers in their ears and ignoring the obvious and correct suspect.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Yes. That's stupid. Especially when Dooku explicitly told them that Sidious controlled the Republic and the Senate in AotC. They're just sticking they're fingers in their ears and ignoring the obvious and correct suspect.

http://mrwgifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/Chris-Rock-Huh-Expression-At-a-Restaurant.gif

It's... stupid to distrust the word of a known liar?

The smart thing to do would be to doubt them but explore the possibility, not completely write them off. Dismissing the option out of hand was lunacy, especially for the exact reason Dooku had mentioned.

Originally posted by Nephthys
The smart thing to do would be to doubt them but explore the possibility, not completely write them off. Dismissing the option out of hand was lunacy, especially for the exact reason Dooku had mentioned.

...Except that's not what you said. You're very wisely backpedaling now because the Jedi have every reason to distrust Dooku and absolutely no reason whatsoever to believe him.

But regardless, this is discussed at the end of AOTC. Obi-Wan asks if Dooku was telling the truth even though the idea doesn't feel right. Yoda says Dooku's a dark sider and naturally full of shit and has every reason to spread such gossip. Mace concurs but says they'll keep an eye on the Senate just in case. Yoda agrees.

And boom, there you go. The Jedi doing the cautious, smart thing despite Dooku's obvious agenda and his total lack of credibility.

Lucas > you. excellent

I said it was dumb and then said it was dumb especially for that reason. Not that it was dumb just because of that reason. I didn't say they should suspect him just because of that.

Which is then contradicted by them dismissing Sidious as a suspect because he controls everything. Which is stupid for the reasons stated.

Originally posted by Nephthys
I said it was dumb and then said it was dumb especially for that reason. Not that it was dumb just because of that reason. I didn't say they should suspect him just because of that.

But it's not dumb (at all) and it certainly can't be dumb especially for a perfectly understandable reason: Dooku = known liar, known liars = not trustworthy.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Which is then contradicted by them dismissing Sidious as a suspect because he controls everything. Which is stupid for the reasons stated.

They dismiss Palpatine as Sidious because he already rules the galaxy and the Republic is still standing and the Jedi are still alive and the status quo has endured. But even then, they're superparanoid and distrustful of Palpatine. It's perfectly understandable.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Crushing and blowing apart Hex droids,

Nah.

Nah.

Yeah

She stored up energy from his lightsaber, so nah.

She didn't match his strength

Fodder, but sure it's close.

Not all of them.

She's firmly in the tier below him, albeit in the upper part. Of course I don't rate the HoT as high as you do, so that probably impacts my thoughts of her.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Nah.
The Grand Master possessed prodigious Force powers. A gesture crushed hexes into balls or blew them apart from the inside.

From (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Fatal Alliance)

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Nah.
http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20111023052411/starwars/images/6/6f/Shannerpoint.jpg

Satele Shan disintegrated a Blast Door with just a touch.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Not all of them.
Two more feats come to mind:

Satele Shan, at one point, held Darth Malgus at bay with one hand and used the other to pull down a gigantic tree. Those trees, based on sheer size, would weigh a 100 tons or more.

In addition, Satele Shan unleashed an esoteric power on the ground which killed 3 Sith Warriors simultaneously.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
She's firmly in the tier below him, albeit in the upper part. Of course I don't rate the HoT as high as you do, so that probably impacts my thoughts of her.
Satele Shan is more then a match for Count Dooku.

HoT could be easily Yoda-tier, if not better.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Nah.

Nah.

Yeah

She stored up energy from his lightsaber, so nah.

She didn't match his strength

Fodder, but sure it's close.

Not all of them.

She's firmly in the tier below him, albeit in the upper part. Of course I don't rate the HoT as high as you do, so that probably impacts my thoughts of her.

Yeah. Those were tough droids, crushing them like that is equal to Dooku lifting some obelisks or pulling down that support structure.

I was including her tutaminis and her using the energy from the lightsaber to pwn Malgus in the same example.

She held off Malgus with one hand while TKing that tree and later when she grabbed his saber he couldn't overpower her physically, she's pretty stronk.

Blitzing Sith Warriors is as good a feat as blitzing say, Magnaguards imo.

*double-standards intensify*

I've changed my mind on some points.

I still remember when you said Shan is stronger then Malak.

She is.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xc6eDFobJXg&t=0m14s
Sometimes I am embarrassed to even be on the same forum as you.

Since Malak has no strength feats beyond overpowering a random Mandalorian , it's a pretty easy conclusion to draw. Him being a big strong man and her being a frail women doesn't trump her actual evidence suggesting she could wrestle him to the ground and take him like an animal.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
*double-standards intensify*
Nephthys, stop contradicting you contradicting yourself over contradicting yourself.

I edited my post to make it more insulting to Malak.

Originally posted by Nephthys
She is.

Originally posted by Nephthys
I edited my post to make it more insulting to Malak. create more double-standards.
:mmm: I wonder if there is any debater left on KMC who takes you seriously.

Newguy seems to agree with me.

Of course, we've both forgotten the incontestable evidence that Malak has a 20 (Holy SHIT!) strength score in the RPG. Clearly he is the strongest of the strong evar. Max points baby.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Newguy seems to agree with me.
NewGuy is allowed to agree because he judges character strengths heavily on feat-to-feat comparisons. Meanwhile, you judge yours mainly on hype. However your double-standards are shown when compare Malak with only feat-to-feat comparisons.

Malak doesn't even have hype for his strength though. And I use feats, hype and accolades bro.

He has like... a ton of hype. And no, you don't use feats. You put Tol on Anakin level, and Bane on Yoda level.

I put Tol on Anakin level and Bane on Yoda level because of feats.

Feat-wise, Tol isn't even above like Ventress bro.

Lol, ok.

Anyway I'm reading your Force Enhancement essay. Gotta say, so far it's not as funny as some of your past essays. Not as many insane leaps of logic. So nice job? BUt then I've only just got past the cat door bit.

It's... no where near complete... like, it's in ultra rough draft stage (I might totally rewrite everything) and I haven't even finished. So... cool?

That explains it then. I just looked through your Malak thread and can see no hype for his strength. So that is cool.

lawl

Got anything else to add to that? I'm open to anything suggesting Malak is stronger than Satele that you can offer. I mean, you're the one who started this discussion so if you really do have nothing to actually add then you end up just looking like a complete tool.

Also yeah your Force Enhancement essay is shit. You just state that its effectiveness is soley dictated by your number of midichlorians and command of the Force and offer nothing to support that conclusion or deny the idea that it depends upon your ability to use the technique, as suggested in other parts of the mythos that state that "every Jedi is naturally stronger is different areas of the Force".

Originally posted by Nephthys
She is.
Because that's hard.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Got anything else to add to that? I'm open to anything suggesting Malak is stronger than Satele that you can offer. I mean, you're the one who started this discussion so if you really do have nothing to actually add then you end up just looking like a complete tool.

Also yeah your Force Enhancement essay is shit. You just state that its effectiveness is soley dictated by your number of midichlorians and command of the Force and offer nothing to support that conclusion or deny the idea that it depends upon your ability to use the technique, as suggested in other parts of the mythos that state that "every Jedi is naturally stronger is different areas of the Force".
Lmfao, you are mad as ****!! LOL. I'm trying to figure out if I should add this to my profile bio or not. :mmm:

I know right? It's not hard being stronger than a weak featless feeb like Malak.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Lmfao, you are mad as ****!! LOL.

Idk I might make a Nephthys Disresepect Thread just to see how mad you will get. This is funny af.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Lmfao, you are mad as ****!! LOL. I'm trying to figure out if I should add this to my profile bio or not. :mmm:

I'm not mad bro, just coming at you a little hard ya know? If you can't take the heat maybe you shouldn't start the fire.

Don't say you aren't mad when people from Africa can feel the fury building inside of you.
Rather funny though every member on KMC accuses you of double-standards, don't you think? You used to be thought of as such a good debater.

Says the guy who brings up Malak's strength and then can't offer anything to substantiate it.

We had that debate like 37 times, bro. Do we really need for 38th?

http://gifsec.com/wp-content/uploads/GIF/2014/03/Bring-it-gif.gif

If you had anything it would be in your respect thread. Except all you have is his DnD stats, him tackling a non-force sensitive and two guys restraining him. Just admit that Malak has no strength feats.

He can admit that if you have proof Bane has beaten someone more skillfull than Revan

Originally posted by Nephthys
http://gifsec.com/wp-content/uploads/GIF/2014/03/Bring-it-gif.gif

If you had anything it would be in your respect thread. Except all you have is his DnD stats, him tackling a non-force sensitive and two guys restraining him. Just admit that Malak has no strength feats.
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
We had that debate like 37 times, bro. Do we really need for 38th?

Make a Satele vs Malak thread if you want. I'm gonna go play some Saint's Row. So we'll see if you can back yourself up when I get back.

I'm not going to have the same debate I had with you 37 times because it always ends with you denying the canonical value of the same quotes, and the debate ends.

No, I'm going old school with the 2nd game. Might continue through the rest of the series afterwards, it's really fun so far.

PC. Got it in the Steam sales.

Neph once again feels the need to prove how unmad he is by taking everything personally and raging.

Luke would have sex in EST!

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Neph once again feels the need to prove how unmad he is by taking everything personally and raging.

I'm not mad, just disappointed.

Originally posted by Nephthys
The smart thing to do would be to doubt them but explore the possibility, not completely write them off. Dismissing the option out of hand was lunacy, especially for the exact reason Dooku had mentioned.

They did...did you miss the entire Oba-Dia plot line?

Originally posted by Nephthys
I'm not mad, just disappointed.
In yourself? So am I.

A better question would be what if Yoda and Reva (3.0) swapped places.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
In yourself? So am I.

What is your problem with me?

Who said I had a problem with you? I said you take everything way too personally, and just like above, you do.

You've been ragging on me for a while now. It's only natural I start to suspect I've offended you in some way.

>sees someone talk to everyone a certain way for no reason
>again takes it personal
>lulz

You're just proving the point, tbh.

Your local approval rating has plummeted significantly in recent times, Neph. What are you doing to combat Ant's smear campaign?

Nephthys's theme song is:
https://youtube.com/watch?v=UXTlczyWJ-Y

Originally posted by The_Tempest
My local approval rating has plummeted significantly in recent times

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
>sees someone talk to everyone a certain way for no reason
>again takes it personal
>lulz

You're just proving the point, tbh.

I don't pay attention to how you talk to others, so I dunno if you're just a douche in general or just to me :shrug:. (this is not me raging, I use worse words than douche when I'm mad)

Shucks though, I'm sorry for taking things personally. Such a massive fault of mine, just unforgivable really. I'm such trash. (this is a joke, I seriously don't know why you care about this so much)

It's kind of annoying to have to constantly clarify that I'm not taking these internet slap-fights seriously.

Originally posted by The_Tempest
Your local approval rating has plummeted significantly in recent times, Neph. What are you doing to combat Ant's smear campaign?

People hate Ant way more than me, so I'm not bothered.

As I said, why do you have to say you aren't mad? It just shows how mad you really are.

Because people always say I am mad and laughing about how mad I am. And I'm not. So I say that I'm not mad, but they keep saying that I am. If I started accusing you of being high all the time I'm sure you'd be like "but... I'm not high". But I keep saying that you are, and you keep saying that you're really not, so it gets kind of irritating after a while.

Originally posted by Nephthys
People hate Ant way more than me, so I'm not bothered.
The people who hate me I specifically want them to hate me. The people who like me I specifically want them to like me.
Normally, I like when the people who I hate want to hate me back so I have a justifiable excuse for being an ultra dick.

Rethinking this. :I

Seriously, stop being evil.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Nephthys's theme song is:
https://youtube.com/watch?v=UXTlczyWJ-Y
Damn, I kinda like the song.

Who?

Who's Freshest a sock of?

Originally posted by Nephthys
Rethinking this. :I

Seriously, stop being evil.
I can be like scary nice sometimes, just haven't been recently.
That being said, I know you love me deep down. I'm too adorable. :3

Love you too, man.
Originally posted by Nephthys
If I started accusing you of being high all the time.
And my response would be about how high I am, because honestly it does mean anything.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
I can be like scary nice sometimes, just haven't been recently.
That being said, I know you love me deep down. I'm too adorable. :3

He'll never love you as much as me.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
And my response would be about how high I am, because honestly it does mean anything.

I guess that's you then.